Trump challenges Alaska Senate result over 2 'Dan Sullivans' — CUOMO Full Show

[0:00] Chris Cuomo joins me now. [0:01] Chris, you've been speaking a lot about rhetoric and political violence and threats of political violence. [0:07] And tonight you're talking to a congressman from Texas who was apparently the target of this assassination plot by a teenager in Texas. [0:18] Yeah, I mean, look, the sad thing, I've never wanted to be right about anything less, but we're going to see more of it. [0:25] As the politics gets more extreme, violence becomes more accessible. [0:29] It's not as big a stretch. [0:31] It's not as unreasonable as it used to be. [0:33] It's not as irrational as it should be, especially among young men. [0:37] Five out of six Americans say violence is never an answer in politics. [0:43] Over half of men who say they are lonely always or often, young men, are over 50 percent. [0:53] In this case, he might have been radicalized. [0:55] Is that something we're hearing? [0:57] Yeah. [0:57] Yeah. [0:58] Yeah, but these days, you know, they can self-radicalize. [1:00] You know what I mean? [1:01] And all you need is one of these. [1:03] It's like DIY. [1:04] Yeah. [1:05] To get to radicalize. [1:05] It's like DIY, you know? [1:07] So anyway, I'm going to talk to him. [1:09] All right. [1:09] We have some news of another plot as well. [1:12] Okay. [1:12] Get to it. [1:14] Thank you. [1:15] Cuomo here. [1:16] Lawmakers from both sides of the aisle were just targeted for assassination. [1:20] We just learned of another one. [1:21] In both cases, thank God, the suspects were arrested by law enforcement before anything [1:26] could happen. [1:27] In Texas, the FBI arrested a 17-year-old ISIS-inspired teen for plotting to assassinate Republican [1:33] member of Congress, Keith Self, at an event last Saturday. [1:37] Reports say that the teen was also planning to carry out a separate terror attack in North [1:42] Texas. [1:43] He was already being monitored by federal agents, and they arrested him after he acquired a gun. [1:48] Remember, it's hard to punish ideas, so they literally can monitor. [1:53] They can pick you up in different ways with social media and different tools, but they [1:57] have to wait for something that shows an affirmative step towards acting on the idea. [2:02] Now, the motive not yet confirmed, but it does appear that Congressman Self was targeted [2:07] because he co-founded something called the Sharia-Free America Caucus and was fighting the construction [2:13] of a new mosque in his district. [2:15] Also today, Florida Democratic member of Congress, Jared Moskowitz, revealed that one of his constituents [2:20] was arrested just miles from his home after threatening to assassinate him. [2:25] This is the second time this has happened to Moskowitz. [2:28] In 2024, a man was arrested near his home carrying a rifle, a suppressor, you know, like a silencer, [2:33] body armor, and an anti-Semitic manifesto with his name on a hit list. [2:38] Last year, threats against members of Congress increased nearly 60 percent, and election years [2:43] often increased that further. [2:45] There's also been a disturbing increase in ISIS-inspired plots by Americans recently. [2:51] Just this month, an 18-year-old was arrested for planning an ISIS-inspired attack at the [2:56] Mall of America. [2:56] Now, often, ISIS itself has, like, no connection to these. [3:01] Like I was just saying, it's like DIY now. [3:04] You're self-radicalized. [3:05] This summer, a woman was charged with planning to blow up the New York state capitol in an ISIS-inspired [3:11] attack. [3:12] We see increasing violence as our politics get more extreme. [3:18] And the group most likely to go this route, to make a point, are our young men. [3:24] Nearly half of men aged 18 to 29 who say they always or often feel lonely, so it's not just [3:31] any young man, but those who say they always or often feel lonely, they say political violence [3:36] is sometimes okay. [3:38] You know, a lot of us overpay for car insurance. [3:40] You may even know it. [3:42] Why? [3:42] Renewal after renewal. [3:43] The price never seems to go down. [3:45] And you tell yourself you should compare rates, but it's complicated. [3:47] And you don't want to get stuck without it. [3:49] So you just pay. [3:51] Because shopping for insurance sounds like the most annoying task that you can think of. [3:55] Then, a friend told me he switched his car insurance in just a few minutes by using this [3:59] app called Jerry, and he saved money. [4:03] You can sign up now using my link in the description or the QR code. [4:07] Once you click, you're going to be asked a few questions. 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[5:01] But what does it mean to you that this is going on in this way? [5:05] Well, I have to tell you, it's a symptom of the times, as you said. [5:12] We have got to stand against this Islamization of Texas that's spreading across America. [5:17] As long as we're talking statistics, 43% of young Americans age 15 to 24 have a positive [5:25] view of Sharia law, which implements Islam. [5:29] That is a frightening statistic because in the UK, I'm sorry, in France, it's only 57%. [5:35] And look what's happening in France today. [5:38] The Red-Green Alliance is burning cities. [5:41] So, this is something that we've got to get a handle on. [5:45] But I will tell you also, fathers are missing in the households. [5:49] In so many households, these young men don't have a positive role model, male role model. [5:55] That's hurting our society. [5:57] That's hurting our culture as well. [5:59] We need fathers in our homes. [6:02] Look, we need everything, right? [6:04] You need parents. [6:06] You need communities. [6:07] You need siblings. [6:08] You need friends. [6:09] You need institutions. [6:10] You know, you need a lot of things. [6:12] One of the things that we control most easily is how we discuss these things. [6:17] Is it your understanding that all of Islam is a threat? [6:22] Because, you know, you know I don't accept that. [6:24] That Islamism is one thing. [6:26] And Sharia is a tool of that extreme ideology that perverts Islam. [6:32] But I don't think that, as the president said, Islam hates us. [6:36] Do you? [6:37] Look, I'm also fighting for Muslim families who would want to assimilate, who would want [6:44] to simply live under the U.S. Constitution, who would simply want to pray as we understand [6:51] the faith. [6:52] But if the jihadis take control, which they're trying to do through the school boards, city [6:56] councils, commissioners' courts, then those families who want to assimilate would be put [7:03] in a terrible position of either submitting or be considered apostates under the penalty [7:08] of death. [7:09] So if the freedom of religion is here, but we govern conduct under the law, and so many [7:15] of the things that Sharia, that the imams are preaching across America today, sedition [7:20] to the U.S. Constitution, so many of the things are illegal. [7:24] Child marriage, honor killings, beating your wife. [7:27] I could go on and on. [7:30] So that's what we are trying to govern is conduct under the law. [7:34] Right. [7:35] But all of those things are illegal. [7:37] So why is it specific to an extreme manifestation of Sharia law? [7:44] I mean, if you practice your faith, great. [7:47] If you practice your faith in a way that violates the law, it's illegal. [7:50] Why target Islam any different than anything else? [7:53] Because people are afraid of being called racist and Islamophobic. [7:57] It is spreading, Chris. [7:58] We've got to understand that. [8:00] We've got to accept that just as well, because their advertisements in the Middle East come [8:06] to Dallas, Texas. [8:08] So the preaching is working. [8:10] The radicalization is working. [8:13] That's what we've got to stop is this radicalization. [8:16] We've got to make sure that the Muslim Brotherhood and CARE are labeled terrorist organizations, because [8:22] the manifesto that they wrote, the explanatory memo dated 1991, lays out the plan to conquer [8:28] North America. [8:30] In my mind, this is one of two existential threats to our Constitution and our way of life, one [8:36] being the national debt and two being the rapid rise of Islam. [8:41] Extremism is on the rise in our rhetoric as well. [8:44] No, we're living something now that I would, you know, I keep saying this, Keith, and it's, [8:50] I've got to stop, but I never thought I would say this. [8:53] I keep saying this these days, but I never thought I would say that we would have to parse [8:58] an ad like the one that Ramaswamy just put out. [9:02] It's not about using a family member to go after an opponent. [9:05] Both sides have done that for a long time. [9:07] It can actually be pretty potent. [9:09] But you look at this situation for about 15 seconds, and you would never advise anybody [9:15] to put this woman on talking about Amy Acton the way Ramaswamy did. [9:20] And yet, the President of the United States says, it's good. [9:24] It's the best ad. [9:26] He should keep running it. [9:28] Isn't that about radical ideas also and going way too far? [9:32] Well, we're talking about Islam and Sharia here. [9:35] Look at what's happening in France. [9:37] Look at what's happening in the UK. [9:39] We've got 1,400 years of history. [9:41] We've got 55 Muslim nations who have done the same thing there. [9:45] Egypt was Christian for hundreds of years. [9:47] Lebanon was Christian for hundreds of years. [9:49] I understand, but when you erode the norms. [9:51] Syria was Christian for hundreds of years. [9:52] I understand the history. [9:54] I really do, Representative. [9:55] What I'm saying is, when you erode the norms, when you make mean okay, when you remove decency, [10:03] when you blur what we're supposed to just instinctually know is right and wrong, things get more and more extreme. [10:11] That's why I'm going after this ad. [10:14] You're talking about the foundation of our country. [10:17] We're talking about a culture who is commanded to take control and absolutely submit any culture that they enter. [10:26] We're talking two different policies here, Chris. [10:29] You don't think we're—look, I totally get it. [10:31] I have been all over this world watching extreme Islamists kill people and target the West. [10:38] I have seen it for 30 years. [10:40] I believe you. [10:41] What I'm saying is, Islam is not Islamism, first of all, and all Muslims don't want to tie up their wives and do stuff like that. [10:48] That is a radical idea. [10:50] But what I'm saying is, it's not the only threat, because the more demeaning, the more indecent our politics get, [10:58] don't you see that we're getting more and more violent also? [11:01] The same way you care about that, shouldn't you care about this? [11:06] Our culture is devolving, and I will tell you, as a Christian, I will tell you, it's the loss of faith, [11:12] the Christian foundation of this nation. [11:15] John Adams said it best. [11:17] Our Constitution only works for moral and religious people. [11:20] It's totally inadequate for any other, and that's what we're seeing. [11:24] If we don't have moral and religious people who are willing to self-govern, have a civic conscience, [11:31] then yes, we're going to devolve into jungle warfare. [11:37] Is it moral or ethical to target someone who was sexually abused as a child? [11:44] That is part of the devolution of culture that I'm describing here. [11:49] That is what we're seeing. [11:50] But don't you ask, what I'm saying is, don't we have to police other leaders as well? [11:57] You know, I mean, look, you're not wrong about Islamism. [11:59] I get it. [12:00] But I'm saying all of these things are different kinds of threats. [12:03] Why call out some and not others? [12:05] When the president is saying, yeah, go after the lady who was raped by her mother's boyfriend. [12:10] Yeah, it's a great idea. [12:11] Go do it. [12:13] That's not a great way to keep this nation strong either. [12:16] It is the devolution of our culture. [12:19] I agree with you. [12:21] But there is one. [12:22] We need revival in our country, Chris. [12:25] It's probably the only thing that will bring us back as a people together. [12:30] This country's history has always shown that the way up is those who choose to be better. [12:40] Right? [12:40] Every great leader is not somebody who took down a group. [12:44] It's who brought groups together. [12:46] That's what's missing right now. [12:47] We've gotten really good at saying why Keith is worse than Cuomo or why Cuomo is worse than Keith. [12:55] We're good at that. [12:56] Real good. [12:57] We're not good at making things better. [12:59] And I see that in this election season as much as I've ever seen it. [13:02] No, there's no doubt. [13:05] There are two different worldviews on display here. [13:10] The left, the liberal left, worldview is theirs. [13:14] And ours is to the right. [13:15] It's freedom. [13:16] Ronald Reagan said it. [13:17] There's no left or right. [13:19] There's up or down. [13:21] You either go up to more freedom consistent with civil society or you go down to the ash heap of history. [13:27] That's exactly right. [13:28] And we are headed down to some degree that doesn't look good to all of us, you and me included. [13:37] Keith, I don't like having to depend on our law enforcement stopping these threats for us to not have to be worried. [13:49] But thank God they did. [13:51] And it gave us the opportunity to have this conversation. [13:55] And I hope we have more. [13:56] Stay safe. [13:57] And thank you, Representative. [13:58] Thank you very much. [13:59] Four minutes and 35 seconds. [14:02] No, I don't think the Ramaswami ad is as big a threat to our national security as extreme Islamism. [14:11] That's not the point. [14:12] The point is when you debase yourselves, when you remove ethics, when you remove decency, you become more susceptible to extremism. [14:23] If you study the history of how what happened in Persia or Iran led to that malocracy, you will see a familiar devolution, to use Representative Self's word, of their decency and their culture of exchange. [14:41] That's why we have to go after these things. [14:43] That's why what the president said is as wrong as anything that he has said. [14:48] Coming up. [14:50] Got to have body cameras. [14:51] Got to. [14:53] Got to have it. [14:54] Why? [14:55] Another shooting. [14:56] Not ice. [14:57] Okay. [14:58] But again. [15:00] Oh, no, we had to. [15:01] We had to. [15:02] They shot and killed a one-year-old baby. [15:05] Why? [15:06] I want to have the conversation. [15:08] Okay. [15:08] The body cam video was released today, and it was determined from the video that it was, in fact, a justified killing. [15:16] You need to have the body cam video. [15:19] Now we can look. [15:20] Is it still, is it now clear because of this? [15:23] No. [15:24] But at least we have something to work off. [15:26] We have the lawyer for the officer who pulled the trigger here to make the case of why it was justified, [15:32] and then a top cop who did the job for decades, who went through this video and the law and has her own analysis. [15:40] Next. [15:41] You can't even have a conversation if you don't have the body cam. [16:05] Okay? [16:05] So now that we have it, we can look and we can assess at another shooting that happened that is raising very significant questions and concerns. [16:15] This one was in Mississippi. [16:16] Not ice involved. [16:18] We have enough of those. [16:20] Okay? [16:20] A one-year-old baby was shot and killed through a car window by a police officer. [16:28] Okay? [16:29] This happened last June. [16:31] Happened at a Walmart. [16:33] Police respond to the Walmart to a suspected shoplifting involving two women, one who was carrying her one-year-old son, Cohen Wiley. [16:43] Okay? [16:44] That's what you're seeing here. [16:45] An officer claiming he feared for his life as the vehicle accelerated toward him opened fire, killing the toddler in the mother's lap. [16:54] Now, new body cam and surveillance video shows the moments leading up to the deadly shooting. [17:01] Watch as the Walmart security guard confronts the woman he alleges was shoplifting. [17:06] Now, look, this is also a tough thing. [17:11] Why? [17:12] What were they stealing? [17:14] Allegedly. [17:14] Right? [17:15] Because there's also an argument that they had receipts. [17:18] They were wrong. [17:18] Okay? [17:20] Diapers. [17:22] Diapers. [17:23] A kid is dead over diapers. [17:26] So the Walmart security confronts them, alerts police that they fled, setting off the pursuit. [17:35] Now, watch this. [18:18] Mississippi's attorney general ruled the shooting justified, citing fears for the officer's life as the car sped toward him. [18:28] I want you to look at the moment again. [18:30] There's the officer. [18:31] The officer is directly in front of the car. [18:36] He then pivots out of the way as he's shooting into the car. [18:43] Is that a reasonable fear of serious injury or death? [18:47] One more time. [18:50] Show it again. [18:52] There he is. [18:54] The car is accelerating toward him. [18:55] That's not in question. [18:58] Can you argue that the wheels are turned? [19:00] Look at the wheel. [19:01] Watch it again. [19:02] Watch what she's doing. [19:04] Okay? [19:04] The car is turning. [19:07] All right? [19:07] Is it turning towards the officer? [19:09] Is it turning away from the officer? [19:10] It's hard to tell at this angle. [19:12] He winds up shooting next to the car. [19:15] Now, a law enforcement officer has to justify every pull of the trigger. [19:21] Okay? [19:21] How do you justify it when you are now beside the vehicle? [19:30] The family says it's not justified because of those shots coming from the side of the car. [19:36] They believe the one that killed the child came from the side. [19:40] The mother says she showed cops that they had a child in the car, hoping that they wouldn't shoot. [19:46] It didn't work. [19:47] Officers say they didn't know about the one-year-old, despite a security guard confronting the mother with the baby moments before the shooting. [19:58] So now it's out, but not everybody agrees that it was justified. [20:02] Let's talk to both. [20:03] First, counsel for the officer who fired the shot that killed the child. [20:10] Martin Zumach joins me now. [20:12] Counsel, thank you for taking the opportunity. [20:15] Thank you for having me with that introduction. [20:17] Martin, I thought you must have watched Mr. Crump's press conference today pretty closely. [20:23] You've left some facts out. [20:25] You've left some facts out. [20:26] I'm happy to have – I want the facts, but Martin, I don't even know what you're talking about. [20:31] I haven't watched any press conference about this. [20:33] Here's one. [20:34] Let me just point something out. [20:36] The officers were not at Walmart because of the shoplifting. [20:41] Okay. [20:41] Okay, so they were not called there for a shoplifting call. [20:46] Second of all, as it relates to the officers knowing there was a child present, they had no idea. [20:52] You see this loss prevention person come in and say, she's running. [20:57] All these officers know is that they have loss prevention saying someone is running. [21:02] It could be the very person that they were up there investigating. [21:05] They were up there investigating an adult in the male bathroom trying to accost a child. [21:13] That's what they were up there investigating. [21:14] Someone comes in and says, they're running. [21:17] We expect our officers to go to the parking lot. [21:21] What your video did not show – [21:23] So wait, so wait. [21:24] Hold on, hold on, hold on. [21:25] Let me help – let me understand. [21:27] First of all, thank you for correcting that they were there investigating something else. [21:30] Good to know. [21:31] Second, I agree with you that what we see, that young man that came in, I guess he's the security guy. [21:37] He didn't say anything other than they are running. [21:41] It sounds like a second reference. [21:43] It sounds like when he says they're running, why do all the cops get up and run out of the room? [21:48] Who's running? [21:49] Where are they running from? [21:50] If the cops aren't there for this, why are they so attentive to that directive? [21:55] Again, you're asking questions six months removed from when the sentence had happened. [22:01] They're law enforcement officers. [22:03] If someone from security says someone is running, we want our police officers to respond to that. [22:11] And by the way, they did not run out of the store with their weapons drawn. [22:15] Your video does not show what happened when she backed out of that parking space. [22:20] She hit the first deputy. [22:23] So you're saying that when the young man – I guess he's the security guy, right? [22:30] When he came in and said they are running, this was a first impression for the officers. [22:37] They had no idea what he was talking about, yet all immediately got up and ran right in the direction of the people who were fleeing. [22:46] These officers don't know if someone has snatched a kid or what's going on. [22:51] They have someone from Walmart saying they're running. [22:54] But let me get – if you don't mind, let me just clarify something else, which I think is more important. [22:59] When the driver of that car whipped out of that parking space, she struck the first deputy. [23:05] That is felony fleeing at that point. [23:09] When she continued to back up – no one mentions this. [23:12] Then she strikes a car so hard that it knocked the axle out from underneath that car. [23:22] If you watch closely, the officers reholster their gun because they figure she's done at that point. [23:28] She then puts it in drive and comes right out of it. [23:31] Now, you pointed out that the tire was turning left. [23:35] Where was she going? [23:35] That kind of thing. [23:37] There was – she was either going to run the deputy over or run Hunter Foster over, one or the other. [23:42] Your video also has not – [23:45] Wait a minute. [23:46] We don't know that. [23:47] I'm being very open to your recognition of what matters here and what doesn't. [23:53] You don't know what her intention was of what she was doing? [23:56] I don't. [23:58] But let me finish. [24:00] After she passes the two police officers, she strikes a vehicle in the handicap zone so hard it lifts it off the ground. [24:07] Now, if the officers just let that car speed out of the parking lot and run a pedestrian over, then what are we going to say? [24:16] Nobody – but hold on. [24:18] No – hold on. [24:19] That – don't assume a fact, okay? [24:21] We don't know what would have happened. [24:24] But they weren't hit. [24:25] What we do know is – the answer to your question is this, counsel. [24:28] If they hadn't done what they did, the baby would not be dead. [24:33] How about that as an assumption? [24:35] If they didn't do what they did, you don't have a dead baby, right? [24:39] If we want to ask rhetorical assumptions, if the baby had not – [24:43] You just did. [24:46] You just did. [24:47] Do I get to do it? [24:48] You did do it by saying she would have run this person over. [24:54] She would have done that. [24:55] You don't know what she would have done. [24:56] You're the one making the assumptions. [24:57] But make another one. [24:59] Was the baby in the car seat? [25:02] No, as far as we know. [25:04] And if you look at this body cam video from the shooter, he is obviously on the side of the vehicle and not in front of it, not in danger of being hit when he is unloading. [25:17] And he's got to justify every pull of the trigger. [25:21] That's not true. [25:21] His first two shots, he's directly in front of the vehicle. [25:25] Yes, and then the ones after are after. [25:29] Are you allowed to just keep shooting once you're out of danger? [25:32] Is that the standard in Mississippi? [25:33] Am I wrong? [25:34] No, that's not the standard. [25:39] Physiologically speaking, your top cop that you're going to have on after me, I'm sure we'll address it because maybe you'll let her talk. [25:47] But it takes a third of a second. [25:48] Hey, Martin, I'm letting you talk. [25:50] I'm just not giving you a free pass. [25:52] There's a difference. [25:52] Continue. [25:54] It takes a third of a second from the moment you have a visual cue to stop shooting. [26:00] It takes a minimum of a third of a second to stop shooting. [26:04] That car was going so fast, that side window moved into that lane of shooting. [26:12] Your police officer, top cop, will tell you that. [26:14] Once you pull the trigger, professional police officers, when they get the visual cue to stop shooting, okay, in scientific tests, average shoot two and a half more. [26:27] That's what I'm saying is I think the second and third shot. [26:32] I also think that's why they changed the standard through a lot of litigation to make it where you have to justify each pull was because of exactly what you just cited. [26:43] But I'll tell you what, if you believe that I'm going to be unfair and different with the next guest, I'll bring her on right now. [26:51] And you can be here and talk to her about it with me. [26:54] It's hard enough to debate you, Chris. [26:56] I'm not going to debate it. [26:57] I don't want to debate it. [26:58] I want to understand it. [26:59] We got a dead kid. [27:01] And I want people to have confidence in law enforcement because first responders matter. [27:05] That's what's really sad in this, okay? [27:08] That is a God's created child is dead. [27:13] And that is horrible. [27:15] Over diapers. [27:16] Over diapers. [27:17] If you think for one minute that Hunter Foster knew there was a child in that car or that it was only over diapers, then you're wrong. [27:27] Well, I can't be wrong about the second one. [27:30] What was it over if not diapers? [27:32] What else did she steal? [27:33] I don't even know that she stole those, but what else? [27:36] They haven't even been charged with anything. [27:39] You want me to answer? [27:40] Go ahead. [27:41] Yes, sir. [27:41] None of those officers knew why these people were running to a car and trying to flee. [27:48] They didn't know if a child had been abducted. [27:50] They didn't know. [27:51] That's what you got to get. [27:53] We know now it was over diapers. [27:55] Believe me, if Hunter Foster had known it was over diapers, he would not have gone out of Walmart. [28:00] He didn't know that. [28:01] None of those officers knew that. [28:05] They just know that someone is running. [28:09] Right. [28:09] Listen, I saw what you saw. [28:12] It was just very interesting to me that when this young man comes in and says they're running, these guys go bolting out of the room. [28:19] Nobody even asked him anything. [28:21] But we know what happened. [28:24] If they sit there and do nothing and lo and behold, that child had been abducted, then we'd be saying, why didn't the officers get up and go do something? [28:34] Well, I don't know about that, by the way. [28:36] These officers are putting their lives at risk. [28:39] Martin, you do not have to explain to me why we value our first responders. [28:45] Okay? [28:45] You do not have to tell me that. [28:47] All right? [28:47] You don't. [28:48] Well, listen. [28:49] Listen, I'm sorry. [28:50] I'm sorry that I'm being very exacting in my analysis about a dead one-year-old over diapers, where when you say, hey, if there had been an abduction, we'd be mad at them. [29:01] How could I be mad at them if they didn't know the situation? [29:04] If I accept your assumption that they had no idea what was going on and just decided to book out of the place when someone walked in and said they're running, then if you're right and they had no idea what they were dealing with, then they had no idea what they were dealing with. [29:22] If that's true, then it doesn't matter what was going on. [29:25] All we can judge is whether or not, under the circumstances of the actual interaction, whether the shooting was justified. [29:33] That's all we can do, right? [29:34] I agree with you. [29:40] All right. [29:41] Martin, I don't want to get heated. [29:43] We got enough angry people about things. [29:44] It doesn't make anything better. [29:46] I just, you know, we just got to make sure that we're as exacting as we can on these. [29:52] And I know every time there's a shooting and someone dies, lives are ruined on all sides of what happens. [29:58] So I appreciate you having the conversation. [30:02] Very good. [30:04] All right. [30:05] Counsel, take care. [30:06] Martin Zumach. [30:07] Thank you. [30:07] He represents the officer involved. [30:09] All right. [30:09] I'm going to take a break and then I'm going to come back with who he called top cop, retired Montgomery, Alabama police captain, Sonia Pruitt. [30:19] I want her take on what we saw because now we have two different pieces of video, right? [30:23] See how important it is to have the body cam? [30:25] Look, it's not going to make it dispositive. [30:27] It's not going to make it easy. [30:28] But if you don't have it, then what kind of conversation are you having right now, right? [30:33] So, because I tell you right now, it's, well, we didn't know anything. [30:37] Well, if you don't see anything, sometimes they wind up saying they knew more, right? [30:42] So now you have the body camera. [30:43] You also have the officer's POV. [30:45] So we'll go through it with someone who did the job and trained people to do the job. [30:49] Next. [31:04] Okay. [31:04] Let me bring in somebody who did the job at a very high level. [31:08] Okay. [31:09] A retired Montgomery County, Maryland police captain, Sonia Pruitt. [31:14] Captain, thank you very much. [31:15] I know you're retired, but thank you very much for joining us. [31:19] Look, tough conversation. [31:21] And I get where he's coming from about what they knew and what they didn't know. [31:24] But how does that fit in to your understanding of what we see? [31:29] And I'll have people run the initial piece of body cam, and then we'll go to the POV from the actual officer that is believed to have shot and killed the child. [31:38] So they'll be running the body cam. [31:39] This man comes in and says, they're running. [31:43] I don't know how they knew what he was talking about, but they all get up and take off out of the room. [31:47] The officer's lawyer says they had no idea who he was talking about. [31:52] They just heard, they're running. [31:54] Did they, does that seem like it right to you? [31:59] Chris, that is so ludicrous to me. [32:01] That's the first word that popped into my mind, that someone would come inside and tell me, hey, we've got someone running. [32:08] And I don't ask, well, what, what are they running for? [32:11] Why are we, why are we responding? [32:13] You got to know what you're doing, right? [32:16] It's even more ludicrous to me. [32:18] I mean, do you? [32:19] His argument is. [32:20] Yeah, absolutely. [32:20] It could have been a baby. [32:22] It could have been this. [32:22] It could have been an abduction. [32:24] You got to go. [32:25] But look at what it was. [32:27] What it was, was someone who was accused, accused, allegedly, of stealing diapers. [32:34] And so you're saying that the officers didn't know that that's why they were running outside. [32:39] I don't, I have never responded to a crime and I had not even a small amount of information, at least. [32:46] Even if I didn't have all the details. [32:48] It just seems, it's just ridiculous to me. [32:51] So then now they're on scene and you see, you've seen the video. [32:57] What does the video mean to you in terms of a justification analysis? [33:04] You know, justification does not mean necessary. [33:09] Justified does not mean necessary. [33:12] You know, there's industry standards set surrounding shooting at moving vehicles. [33:17] And the acceptable industry standard says that officers don't fire at moving vehicles unless there's like an imminent threat of death or serious injury. [33:26] And that means if you can move out of the way or if you can avoid placing yourself in front of a moving vehicle, then that is what you are expected to do. [33:35] Why is that? [33:36] Because of what happened to the baby, to baby Cohen. [33:39] Because you don't know who else is in the car perhaps. [33:43] And they've admitted or the council admitted that the officers didn't maybe know all the people in the car, including a baby. [33:50] And so now you're shooting at something and you don't know what your backdrop is. [33:56] That's one of the first rules of using your gun is knowing what your backdrop is. [34:01] What if you shoot the driver and then the vehicle goes out of control? [34:05] Now you're responsible for other people potentially being injured. [34:08] So you've created a deadly force situation for a shoplifting of diapers that the council says they don't even know. [34:16] They didn't even know about. [34:17] They didn't even know why they were responding. [34:19] It's ridiculous to me. [34:22] When the one more question and then I want to go to what the conclusion of the state is because they say it's justified. [34:27] You are allowed to discharge the weapon when you are in reasonable fear of serious injury or death. [34:37] A car coming at you can definitely kill you. [34:40] If you are able to get out of the way of the car and you continue to shoot, does it change the justification analysis? [34:49] To me it does, absolutely. [34:50] First of all, again, at least let me repeat myself. [34:53] Why would an officer even put themselves in front of a moving vehicle? [34:58] I would be nowhere near that moving vehicle, especially since council says they didn't know why they were responding. [35:06] You don't know what you have, but you're just going to run up on a car like you're Superman and expect that you're going to stop a vehicle that weighs how much? [35:15] I don't think so. [35:17] So, no, I personally, I don't think that it was justified. [35:20] I think that the officer used bad discretion, could have gotten out of the way of the car. [35:26] How about not getting in the way of the car at all? [35:28] The state found it justified. [35:33] There are no charges right now, as far as we know, against the woman in the car. [35:37] You know, you heard counsel say this is felony escape and this is this. [35:41] There are no charges right now. [35:43] They may come. [35:44] But they said it was justified because the vehicle was being used as a deadly weapon. [35:50] So it was justified. [35:52] End of story. [35:53] Okay. [35:54] So a couple of things I want to say there. [35:56] We talk about officers responding and having to make split-second decisions, right? [36:01] And that's fair because police officers are human. [36:05] But so are the people that police officers come into contact with. [36:08] We don't know. [36:09] Like the officers didn't know why they were responding. [36:12] We don't know what was going through the minds of the women in the car, right? [36:15] So we don't, my assumption is that if somebody is running, they're trying to get away. [36:21] Not necessarily to harm an officer, but I just want to get out of this situation. [36:25] Here's something else to consider. [36:28] You're talking about justification and how the AG came to a decision. [36:33] What is Senatopia, Mississippi Police Department's policy on shooting at moving vehicles? [36:38] Has anyone told us yet? [36:40] Do they have one? [36:41] What's their use of force policy? [36:43] We don't know because their general orders are not public-facing, so we don't know what [36:47] they should or should not do, which is a contributing factor to determining whether something like [36:55] this is justified or not. [36:58] We're just sort of out here without all the information and a lack of transparency, in [37:04] my opinion. [37:04] But just on its face and on the information that we have and now the body-worn camera [37:09] video, I don't feel that it was justified. [37:12] But hey, I'm not the AG. [37:13] Gotcha. [37:15] Sonia Pruitt, thank you very much for taking us through it. [37:17] I appreciate it. [37:19] You're welcome. [37:21] All right. [37:22] Look, here's what we know. [37:24] This is just terrible. [37:26] And we got a lot of terrible going on. [37:29] The next story that I have to talk to you about is also very, very troubling. [37:34] Why two weeks or less, people are already voting. [37:38] Why do you have federal agents door-knocking now to try to find people who may not be legal [37:48] to vote but are intending to vote? [37:52] Why? [37:53] Why is this happening right now? [37:55] Why is it okay? [37:57] Let's discuss. [37:58] All right. [38:18] Let's bring in two different guys who worked in the administration. [38:23] Madison Mills. [38:24] I'm sorry. [38:24] I want to bring in Madison. [38:25] Sorry. [38:27] I'm still thinking about that. [38:29] I can't get this shooting out of my head. [38:31] I'm sorry. [38:32] It's gone now. [38:33] Former DHS chief of staff in the Trump administration, Miles Taylor, and a former 20-year vet of the [38:38] DHS, Jim Hayes. [38:40] I'm sorry, fellas. [38:41] It's just like we can't agree on anything anymore. [38:44] Like, we can't see anything clearly anymore. [38:47] I want to get two takes, both of your takes, on what's going on with the door-knocking. [38:52] All right? [38:53] I know the DOJ has its 60-day rule. [38:56] Obviously, that doesn't extend to all branches of government. [38:59] Jim, help me understand this with the benefit of the context. [39:04] There is no illegal voting problem at scale. [39:07] I mean, even this administration has like 150 people that they've accused of it, that they're [39:12] prosecuting. [39:13] I don't get this kind of action when it can have such a chilling effect. [39:17] Help me understand. [39:19] I think the agency's perspective here is a lot like what they say in respect to sanctuary [39:23] cities. [39:24] They've asked these states for the voter registration information. [39:28] The states have denied to provide it over a period, a long period of time. [39:32] And now the agency is saying, look, if they provided us the information, we'd be able to [39:36] cull it and go after or talk to a much, much narrower pool of people. [39:40] But because they didn't, but for the states not cooperating, they feel that they have to [39:45] send the agents out to go ahead and identify people who may be voting illegally. [39:52] But Miles, help me understand this. [39:54] I mean, just in terms of just like a, is this worth the effort kind of thing? [39:59] I mean, to me, it just seems like political theater, but it could keep, you know, you have [40:03] millions and millions of people who are naturalized citizens who theoretically could get a door [40:09] knock. [40:09] And even though they're naturalized citizens and eligible to vote, they may not because [40:15] they're afraid. [40:15] I mean, is that not a reasonable risk here? [40:17] And is it outweighed by the potential benefit? [40:19] Two huge risks here, Chris. [40:23] One is the voter suppression risk. [40:25] But here's the other thing people aren't talking about. [40:29] It's a distraction from the real threats to our elections. [40:32] Right now, today, we got information that the Russians are actively working to exploit [40:38] this election. [40:39] I spoke earlier today with Representative Jim Hines, who's the ranking member on the House [40:42] Intelligence Committee. [40:43] And they're talking about an active foreign interference effort. [40:47] The White House themselves has said China is interfering. [40:49] And guess what? [40:50] They're doing very little on those threats. [40:52] Instead, they're investigating the non-problem of non-citizen voting. [40:56] This would be like prioritizing investigations into pickpockets when you know that murderers [41:02] are running around town. [41:04] This is a big national security distraction, and it could have very serious consequences in [41:08] this election in addition to the voter suppression. [41:12] Jim, would this be your priority, using these resources in this way at this time, two weeks [41:17] out from an election? [41:17] Candidly, it wouldn't be my priority right now, but I can speak for the agency in whether [41:24] it's a Democratic or a Republican administration. [41:27] They set the priorities, and they tell the agents what to do. [41:30] And whether the agents are happy about it or not, that's part of working for the federal [41:34] government, is you're going to go ahead and follow those directives. [41:37] I'm not blaming the agents. [41:39] I'm saying, I mean, look, they could always quit, but that's easy to say when everybody's [41:42] desperate to keep their jobs right now. [41:43] I'm saying, do you like the direction of the policy? [41:49] I think, again, I can understand the legitimate goal of deterrence. [41:54] But again, having served in executive positions close to an election, this is not something [42:00] that the agency has focused on in the past. [42:03] All right, guys, let me leave it there. [42:06] We'll see what they do with it. [42:08] We'll see what happens. [42:09] Miles, I appreciate you. [42:10] Jim, thank you for making the case. [42:12] We're going to go. [42:14] I'll have a final thought right after this break. [42:18] Listen, I know a lot of you are upset by that shooting, and I didn't show the baby being [42:24] shot. [42:24] We don't see it. [42:25] But yeah, we all know what happened. [42:27] It is so horrible. [42:29] And I know that everything gets looked at right, left, and it is so much more than that. [42:33] It's so much more about right and wrong. [42:35] I don't know what to do either. [42:37] Okay, final thought. [42:55] It's a terrible, it's a terrible day. [42:57] It's just, it's a terrible thing. [42:59] There are a lot of very, very troubling things going on. [43:03] Yes, I'm watching what's happening in Tennessee with the voting. [43:06] Yes, I see what they're trying to make El-Sayed about. [43:10] Yes, I see what Ramaswamy did and what the president congratulated him for. [43:15] I see it all. [43:16] This is a hard time. [43:18] But if we have the election, that is a step in the right direction. [43:22] Leland Vittert, right now. [43:23] We're having it, though, aren't we? [43:25] Record numbers of people voting early in how many states? [43:28] I remember Jim Crow 2.0 in Georgia. [43:30] Now it's record turnout. [43:32] I would love, I would love to say, yeah. [43:35] I don't even know why I said that, Leland. [43:37] It was silly. [43:38] Sorry. [43:39] But who knows? [43:40] Okay. [43:41] Oh, come on. [43:42] Really? [43:42] These guys door knocking. [43:45] Really? [43:46] Door knocking two weeks out? [43:48] Because we've got an illegal voting problem? [43:50] Really? [43:51] Guns, vests, going up to people's houses? [43:53] Do we have any video of it? [43:54] You don't think that that's going to have a chilling effect? [43:56] Yeah. [43:57] I was just playing it on the show. [43:58] Oh, I was in makeup. [43:59] Okay. [44:00] All right. [44:00] Well. [44:01] And I'm not saying it's not legal, but it's also about like right and wrong and what the [44:06] policy is. [44:07] Anyway. [44:08] Does that outweigh record voting everywhere? [44:10] I don't know. [44:10] I'm just thinking about it. [44:12] I'm loving the early voting. [44:14] I love participation. [44:15] I cannot tell you how excited I am to sit next to you on election night and be calling [44:22] returns, probably before other people, and getting it right, and that it happened, and [44:29] then we'll see the results. [44:30] I cannot tell you how much I look forward to it, my brother. [44:33] I appreciate that. [44:33] We will see you here in D.C., Chris. [44:36] Great show.