New York Times drops BOMBSHELL about Trump officials filing into Situation Room over Epstein files

[0:00] Joining us to discuss more of this is MSNOW Washington reporter and The Weeknd co-host, [0:06] Jackie Alemany, former Bush and McCain advisor Mark McKinnon, and Danielle Moody, co-host of [0:11] the Democracy-ish podcast. Jackie, we should note we expect to see the president at any moment for [0:17] a bill signing, but what's the reaction to this Times reporting there so far? [0:24] Yeah, and I expect that the president is going to be asked about this report in real time by [0:29] reporters who are let into the room for that bill signing. So far, aides and people around [0:36] Donald Trump have remained pretty mum on the really blockbuster reporting done by Maggie Haberman [0:42] and Jonathan Swan and released this morning. And we know that the president has lashed out at [0:49] our fellow colleagues, Joe Scarborough, Mika Brzezinski, and the crew of Morning Joe after [0:56] they rehashed some of the allegations and some of the reporting that were made on air. And the [1:03] president then took to Truth Social to launch a series of complaints and criticisms against them. [1:11] I think an acknowledgement of some of the reporting, as Joe said himself, essentially a potential [1:17] confirmation of the reporting that The New York Times has released this morning. But there are a [1:24] series of unflattering depictions and anecdotes in here that I think really illustrate just how much [1:33] this issue has plagued this White House really since Trump took office and the lengths that aides and [1:41] people around him have gone to try to inoculate and protect the president from some of the more [1:47] disturbing and problematic claims and pieces of information that were inevitably going to come [1:57] out in some way if the Epstein files were released. That has sort of become essentially a self-fulfilling [2:03] prophecy or a vicious cycle in some ways, in that this is the new cycle that has never ended for them [2:10] because of the lack of transparency. I think it's also revealed some fractures within this White House, [2:15] which is something that they have had sort of publicly outside of the war in Iran done a good [2:21] job of preventing from leaking out there. But another issue that J.D. Vance has differed from [2:26] Donald Trump on. Right. It's so fascinating to learn from this reporting what Vance's reaction to [2:34] the Epstein files saga has been. Since dating back almost a year ago, they report the vice president [2:42] appeared panicked. Of course, we know Vance has never been fully in step with the president on [2:48] this. But how is this revelation, plus what we mentioned of him suggesting Tucker Carlson interview [2:54] Ghislaine Maxwell, how is it different than what we already knew about where the president and the [2:58] vice president don't see eye to eye? Yeah, I'm not necessarily sure that it's different, but I do think [3:06] it's illustrative and revelatory about some of the frustrations that we and myself have also been [3:13] hearing from senior White House aides about the fact that J.D. Vance lives online, that he is someone [3:20] who is too online, too wrapped up in the MAGA online ecosystem, and that he does sort of propagate and [3:30] buy into some of these conspiracy theories that, in the case of the Epstein files, has come back and [3:36] created sort of a monster of its own to bite this administration back, you know, not just politically, [3:46] but also just sort of morally, if we are taking a step back and looking at this in an apolitical [3:51] way. There, you know, this is something that initially this was a conversation that also cropped up [3:58] again during some of the the fractures that sort of to emerge during the Iran war. I was told by [4:05] some senior aides that they felt like they were brushing off the criticisms from Tucker Carlson, [4:12] Marjorie Taylor Greene, some of the MAGA online influencers, while J.D. Vance was sort of online [4:17] reading them, and it was essentially fueling some of his private consternation about the war. [4:23] So it's now, I think, certainly, again, illustrative to see yet another example of [4:32] J.D. Vance's dive into the MAGA media ecosystem online and the way that sort of impacts his everyday [4:41] job as President Trump's vice president. Danielle, I could understand the strategy of trying to utilize [4:48] MAGA media, but suggesting Tucker Carlson interview Maxwell. What's your reaction to that? [4:55] I mean, I think that it's incredibly shocking. But for me, what is most disturbing are the people [5:00] that were in in the Situation Room. And the way that Haberman and Swan started off their piece was [5:08] stating what the Situation Room is actually used for, right? Like war and discussions of strategy [5:15] around our foreign relations and domestic issues, etc. And the fact that so many of Donald Trump's top [5:23] staff cabinet members were in that Situation Room without him to discuss how to cater, right, [5:30] how to create a PR package for the Epstein files is incredibly shocking. But the idea that you would [5:37] get Tucker Carlson to sit down with Ghislaine Maxwell and Tucker Carlson, who has been at odds with this [5:44] White House on a number of issues, is really just, it's extraordinary. But to me, the most [5:50] extraordinary part is how many people were involved in the spin, in the cover-up, and in the lie that [5:56] this White House said that Donald Trump had nothing to do with the Epstein files. And yet, these are not [6:01] the actions that are taken by innocent people. There's been just a drip, drip, drip of the Epstein [6:07] files since the start of this administration. Mark, what's your big takeaway from what this says [6:13] about the administration's apparent dysfunction and inability to handle a crisis? [6:18] Well, you drip, drip right into my metaphor that I was going to use. [6:24] Mind meld. [6:25] Yeah. Because, you know, I did comms for presidents and candidates most of my adult life. And, [6:33] you know, the maxim was always when you have bad news, the best way to deal with it is to get it [6:37] all out as quickly as possible and being transparent. And this is just the worst case possible. This is [6:43] like they had a dam or a reservoir full of bad news. And rather than just break the dam [6:49] and let it blow, they have, as you said, let it drip, drip, drip. So we've gotten news [6:55] almost every day since the beginning that's bad news. And the cumulative effect is way worse [7:01] worse than I project, than suggests, than would have happened had they just let it all out at the [7:07] beginning. But they're paying the consequences for it. And again, where will this story even end [7:14] at this point? [7:15] Among the people inside the Situation Room was Todd Blanche, then Deputy Attorney General. And I want [7:21] to read a portion about his role in these White House discussions. Quote, [7:26] As the president's former defense attorney, Blanche had a unique vantage point in the discussion. He [7:31] was better equipped than anyone else in that room to weigh the ideas being discussed against Trump's [7:37] personal and political interests. Blanche laid out what he saw as their best options. One option, [7:44] he mentioned, was to petition the courts to release grand jury transcripts. Another was to have DOJ [7:49] lawyers interview Maxwell, which, of course, we then saw Blanche do. What, you know, what ended up [7:57] happening, obviously, has come from that. How did it all work out for them, Danielle? [8:03] I mean, I don't think that it worked out well. And here's something that I find really interesting. So [8:09] in the article, right, they're discussing the fact that Todd Blanche, right, was offering up all of [8:15] these options. And in them, pardoning her was on the table, right? Everyone pushed back, apparently. [8:22] Well, some people in that room pushed back on a possible pardon because of what would happen if, [8:27] in fact, she was pardoned, what would happen with their base. But—and they said that there should be [8:32] no special treatment that is given to Ghislaine Maxwell because, apparently, they thought that she [8:37] didn't really have any damning information on Donald Trump. But then Todd Blanche goes and sits down with [8:43] her, moves her from a maximum security prison into a lesser secure—a less security prison, [8:51] right, where she now has more access to activities, to animals, to all of these different things. And so [8:58] on one hand, they said, let's not pardon her because of how that will look. But then he turned around [9:04] after that interview that he did with her and then decides to move her to a minimum security prison. [9:11] This is a woman that was involved in trafficking children, right? And so, again, I think that what [9:18] came out of this article are all of the ways, all of the options, all of the things that were being [9:22] thrown at the table, that—being thrown at the wall, but that were being led by folks inside of the [9:29] Justice Department, namely the deputy and the attorney general of the United States. And that, in and of [9:36] itself, is incredible. It does sound, according to this reporting, it sounds like Deputy Attorney [9:43] General Todd Blanche was given a huge role in deciding what to do about the Epstein issue. And now, [9:51] the president has nominated him to be the attorney general. Mark, what does it say about the power he [10:00] wields inside this administration? Well, one of the things we know about Donald Trump is that he was [10:08] very unhappy with his attorney general from the first term. And that was something that he was [10:14] going to change dramatically so that he literally—and now he literally has his own personal attorney as [10:19] the attorney general, which is what he's always wanted. So—and I think the whole—and it's so [10:27] problematic to have that person at the center of so much of what's going on with the Epstein files. [10:31] I mean, the whole issue of his interview with Ghislaine Maxwell and then the transfer to minimum [10:37] security prison, I mean, that just—you talk about quacking like a duck. That quacks like a duck. [10:43] It's a duck, folks. How could it not be more obvious what's going on there? So that just—that [10:49] just makes it more problematic for his confirmation. But at the end of the day, [10:54] I don't think Trump cares, because what he wants is the guy who's going to stand by him and protect him [10:58] through anything.