About this transcript: This is a full AI-generated transcript of Long Game: The Bernie Sanders Effect — MS NOW SPECIAL from MS NOW, published October 18, 2026. The transcript contains 13,849 words with timestamps and was generated using Whisper AI.
"One of the phenomenon of American and Vermont and Burlington political, the political process which concerns me very much, somebody gets up, I'm for this, I'm against this, rather than an understanding and debate on the broad philosophical issues which separate the American people. The basic issue..."
[0:02] One of the phenomenon of American and Vermont and Burlington political, the political process
[0:09] which concerns me very much, somebody gets up, I'm for this, I'm against this, rather
[0:14] than an understanding and debate on the broad philosophical issues which separate the American
[0:21] people. The basic issue facing the United States of America is whether or not this country
[0:25] has the resources to provide decently for all of its people, whether we're going to
[0:29] give gigantic tax breaks to the rich.
[0:31] Is this going to be the theme for your gubernatorialism?
[0:33] This is going to be a theme that I intend to be speaking on so long as I am involved in
[0:38] political life.
[0:52] Hello, hello and welcome. I'm Michelle Norris. Just weeks ahead of the critical midterm election,
[0:58] we are here in Vermont. Not because Vermont is a battleground to watch, but because in
[1:03] many ways the outcome of the election depends on the movement and the candidates inspired
[1:08] by the independent senator who got his start right here, as a socialist mayor on the shores
[1:14] of Lake Champlain. Welcome to Long Game, the Bernie Sanders effect.
[1:19] Real change does not come from the top on down, it comes from the bottom on up.
[1:27] With the future of democracy on the line and voters hungry for change.
[1:31] In the heat of the midterms, a champion for working people everywhere, Senator Bernie Sanders.
[1:44] A longtime outsider is in the heart of the fight.
[1:47] How we respond to this moment will impact the lives of our kids and future generations.
[1:53] Across the country, voters are about to deliver a report card to the president and his party,
[1:59] deciding whether to send a Republican majority back to Congress or instead put the Democrats
[2:05] in charge as a check on President Trump's power.
[2:08] But there's another tension at work. Have the Democrats picked the right candidates to win?
[2:13] You can trace that tension all the way back to 2016, when Vermont Senator Bernie Sanders ran
[2:19] for the Democratic nomination for president.
[2:21] The day we stand here and say loudly and clearly, enough is enough.
[2:29] Senator Sanders is not a Democrat himself. He never has been.
[2:33] But he took his electrifying, relentless, renegade campaign all the way to the Democratic National
[2:40] Convention as an independent. It was a bitter and bruising campaign.
[2:46] Interesting comment, but you didn't answer the question.
[2:49] I did. If that's the way.
[2:50] No, you didn't.
[2:50] Yes, I did.
[2:51] Can I answer?
[2:52] I did answer the question.
[2:53] May I, please?
[2:53] Well, don't put words into my mouth.
[2:56] And in the end, Senator Sanders himself did the honors of asking the convention to nominate
[3:01] Hillary Clinton.
[3:02] And I move that Hillary Clinton be selected as the nominee of the Democratic Party for
[3:09] President of the United States.
[3:11] Even though he lost the primary, Bernie Sanders built something during the campaign that endured.
[3:17] He created a grassroots movement for a new kind of progressive politics, a roadmap for Democrats
[3:23] who want to do what Bernie did.
[3:25] My MSNOW colleague Steve Benin, a longtime Vermonter and historian of Washington, has been
[3:31] following Senator Sanders for years.
[3:32] Bernie Sanders became a prominent voice leading a movement of sorts, which cleared the way for
[3:39] others.
[3:40] People like AOC, Mayor Mamdani, Abdullah El-Sayed in Michigan.
[3:43] All of a sudden, you see other candidates who are singing from the same hymnal.
[3:47] All of a sudden, they're starting to win primaries and they're starting to win campaigns.
[3:51] This year, candidates across the country are running on progressive platforms in the mold
[3:55] of the 2016 Sanders campaign, all direct, I guess you could call them descendants of the movement
[4:02] created by Bernie Sanders.
[4:04] In Colorado, a Democratic Socialist named Milat Kiros, who was endorsed by Bernie Sanders,
[4:09] defeated a 15-term incumbent in the Democratic primary.
[4:13] In Michigan, a Sanders-backed House candidate ousted another incumbent Democrat.
[4:18] In Montana, Sam Forstag debuted on the national stage at a Sanders rally last year.
[4:24] Selected by Sanders, Forstag jumped into the primary for Congress and won.
[4:28] And then, of course, there are the marquee Senate races.
[4:31] Abdu El-Sayed in Michigan.
[4:33] Shouldn't be this hard to afford a second bag of groceries.
[4:37] Shouldn't be this hard to pay your rent.
[4:40] Angie Nixon in Florida.
[4:42] If wanting your neighbor to afford their insulin is radical, then call me a radical.
[4:47] And Peggy Flanagan in Minnesota.
[4:51] This campaign was about the many versus the money.
[4:56] And in Maine, where Democrats see a real opportunity to unseat Republican Senator Susan Collins,
[5:03] a display of both the promise and the pitfalls of the Sanders movement.
[5:08] Sanders was key to the rise of Maine Senate candidate Graham Plattner.
[5:12] Remember him?
[5:13] The senator endorsed Plattner early on, then called on him to drop out after an allegation
[5:19] of sexual assault.
[5:20] The candidate denied it, but did drop out.
[5:23] Sanders then endorsed the replacement candidate, Troy Jackson, who is now trying to flip the
[5:29] seat.
[5:30] They're showing up because they know, deep, deep down in their soul, that something is
[5:35] not right with our government right now.
[5:37] There are Sanders-aligned, Sanders-inspired, and Sanders-endorsed candidates running all over
[5:41] the country, up and down the ballot in this midterm election.
[5:45] But even at a time where the president's approval is in the basement, victory is not guaranteed.
[5:51] And it has a lot of Democrats nervous about whether this is the right moment, when the
[5:56] stakes are so, so high, to test whether a Bernie Sanders playbook can win general elections.
[6:03] Electability is not a word into Bernie Sanders' vocabulary.
[6:05] He does not believe in electability because as far as he's concerned, whether you're running
[6:08] in Burlington, Vermont, or Billings, Montana, people want the same thing.
[6:12] They want health care.
[6:13] They want a working wage.
[6:14] They want to be able to send their kid to college.
[6:16] The test of Bernie Sanders right now in 2026, we're about a month out from the election,
[6:19] is can his candidates succeed?
[6:21] Can they win these general elections in tough battleground states?
[6:25] If those candidates succeed, then he is a kingmaker, and his support will be sought after in
[6:30] 2028 and beyond.
[6:31] If those candidates fall short, it's a very different story.
[6:34] Bernie Sanders starts to be seen as a villain among Democratic leaders, and so we'll see
[6:40] soon enough.
[6:41] If he is successful, if many of his candidates do win, will it change the party?
[6:45] I think it will.
[6:46] I think that it has already changed the party, and I think it's already changed politics.
[6:49] Tonight, when Democratic hopes are high and the stakes, if anything, higher, we'll hear
[6:54] from the congresswoman who has been barnstorming the country with Senator Sanders, Alexandria
[6:59] Ocasio-Cortez.
[7:01] And we'll hear from Mayor Zoran Mamdani, elected last fall as the mayor of New York with
[7:05] a Sanders endorsement.
[7:07] But first, let's hear from Senator Sanders himself.
[7:10] We sat down with him on a campaign visit to California.
[7:15] I have wanted to talk to you for a long time, and I'm so glad we have a chance to sit down.
[7:19] Thank you very much.
[7:20] So if you're ready, let's go.
[7:22] Let's do it.
[7:23] Democrats right now are desperately trying to win control of the House and perhaps the
[7:28] Senate.
[7:29] They're locked in several consequential races, some races that people didn't think were going
[7:33] to be competitive, and it turns out that they are, and in some cases, to the surprise
[7:39] and perhaps the anxiety of some establishment Democrats.
[7:43] If they're able to pull this off, and if the Democrats are able to win control of one or
[7:47] both houses, what do you want to do with that power?
[7:52] I think at this particular moment in history, when people are so frustrated with the direction
[8:01] in which this country is going, and it's not just Trump who, to my mind, is the most dangerous
[8:05] president in the history of the country, it goes beyond that.
[8:09] It goes to the fact that people are looking around them.
[8:14] They're working hard, they're going nowhere in a hurry, they get sick, they can't afford
[8:20] to go to the doctor, they can't afford housing in many cases.
[8:25] We want young people to have babies, have good families, cost of fortune to have a baby,
[8:30] childcare is terribly expensive, the cost of college is kind of off the charts, people
[8:35] are worried about climate change, they're worried about AI, they're worried about all
[8:38] of these things.
[8:39] They look at the Democrats, they say, eh, look at the Republicans, they say, eh, they
[8:43] look at Trump, they say, people are giving up in many ways.
[8:46] So, what do you do then, if you actually take power?
[8:49] I will tell you what we do, I will tell you, the time for old-fashioned status quo policies
[8:58] and status quo politics has got to end.
[9:02] People are in trouble, they want bold action.
[9:05] Some examples, you tell me, I know I'm being interviewed here, but why are we the only major
[9:11] country on earth not to guarantee healthcare to all people?
[9:14] Canada does it, Europe does it, Australia, New Zealand, every bloody country on earth
[9:19] can do it, and we spend twice as much per capita on healthcare as other countries, and
[9:24] we've got 85 million uninsured.
[9:26] You know what we do?
[9:27] We pass Medicare for all single payer, we guarantee healthcare to every man, woman and child.
[9:32] You know what else we do?
[9:34] At a time when we have more income and wealth inequality in America today than at any time
[9:40] in the history of this country, remember the Gilded Age?
[9:43] Much worse today.
[9:44] You know what you say to the billionaire class and all of their greed?
[9:48] They're getting richer and richer.
[9:49] In some cases, these billionaires pay an effective tax rate lower than a nurse or a truck driver.
[9:56] You're going to start paying your fair share of taxes so we can provide for the needs of
[10:00] working families.
[10:02] At a time when families can't afford to send their kids to college, you know what we say?
[10:06] Radical idea.
[10:07] We go back to where we were 50 or 60 years ago.
[10:10] We make public colleges and universities tuition free.
[10:12] You think that's radical?
[10:13] It ain't radical.
[10:15] It's exactly-
[10:16] California.
[10:17] It used to be-
[10:18] Exactly.
[10:19] City College in New York City, state colleges in Vermont.
[10:20] So what the hell is going on with all of the so-called progress?
[10:23] The question that people are asking is, got all this new technology, all this AI and computers
[10:30] and space age stuff, why is it that 60% of our people are living paycheck, struggling
[10:38] to pay for the basic necessities of life?
[10:40] That is the issue that Democrats have got to tackle now.
[10:42] But you said something interesting.
[10:44] You said people look at the Democrats and they're not so sure that they like what they
[10:46] see and they look at the Republicans and right now polls show that they're not happy there
[10:49] either.
[10:50] So why should they believe that you and the candidates, large number of candidates that
[10:54] you've endorsed, can actually push that ball forward?
[10:56] Well, that's what we've got to do.
[10:57] So let me be clear.
[10:59] I think it is absolutely imperative that in the next month we do everything we can to elect
[11:04] Democrats to the House and Senate and take control of both bodies so that we can finally
[11:10] put a check on the most dangerous president in the history of the United States.
[11:15] That's issue number one.
[11:16] All right.
[11:16] But that's not good enough.
[11:18] Some of my colleagues, I'm an independent, you know, caucusing with the Democrats.
[11:21] But you're caucused with the Democrats.
[11:22] Right.
[11:23] And some of my Democratic colleagues, they go around and they say, Trump is terrible.
[11:26] Trump is awful.
[11:27] And they do it in all kinds of creative and intelligent ways.
[11:29] They're right.
[11:30] It ain't good enough.
[11:32] We got to take Trump on, but we have to do more.
[11:35] You have to implement.
[11:36] You have to do more.
[11:37] What's more?
[11:37] To implement an agenda that works for the working class of this country.
[11:41] So it's interesting.
[11:42] You are an independent.
[11:44] You have never officially joined the Democratic Party, but you have had tremendous influence
[11:49] over the party.
[11:50] And some would say you have been responsible for pulling the party farther to the left.
[11:57] And when I mentioned the surprise and anxiety among some establishment Democrats, I just want
[12:02] to lean into the anxiety a little bit.
[12:05] Indigestion, some might call it.
[12:06] And part of this is that the worry that with some of these candidates that have had great
[12:13] success in the primaries, that it might make it harder for the party as a whole to reach
[12:18] out to centrist voters, to moderate voters, to win back those voters who at one time may
[12:25] have voted for Democrats but have drifted into Donald Trump's camp.
[12:28] I strongly disagree with them.
[12:29] You disagree.
[12:30] Tell me why.
[12:30] Do you understand their worries, first of all?
[12:35] Do you understand why they're worried?
[12:36] And usually these guys are, you know, some of the, you know, when you talk about the
[12:40] Democratic Party, understand what we're talking about.
[12:43] Often we're talking about billionaire or very wealthy campaign contributors.
[12:47] And they have their views.
[12:49] I respect their views.
[12:50] I disagree with their views.
[12:51] My view is that millions and millions of Americans, working class Americans, voted for Donald Trump, not
[13:00] because they think that we should give a trillion dollars in tax breaks to the 1% or throw 15
[13:06] million people off of Medicaid.
[13:07] That's not what they voted for.
[13:09] What they did is for years, they heard the Democrats say, oh, we're going to do this.
[13:13] We're going to do that.
[13:13] We're going to help you.
[13:14] And they didn't.
[13:15] And it's true.
[13:16] Democrats pushed through terrible trade deals, which cost us millions of good paying
[13:20] manufacturing jobs, et cetera, et cetera.
[13:22] They lost faith in the Democratic Party and not unjustifiably.
[13:27] All right.
[13:28] My belief is that if you are prepared to fight for working families in any state in this
[13:36] country, people will come over and support you.
[13:40] That's my view.
[13:41] And what we have seen in this particular campaign cycle, starting off with Mamdani in New York
[13:46] City, he took on the whole oligarchs, took on the Democratic establishment, the Republican
[13:50] establishment, president of the United States.
[13:52] But you know what he did?
[13:53] He had 100,000 people knocking on doors, and he won that election.
[13:57] You got 100,000 people knocking on doors, you ain't going to lose.
[13:59] And that's true all over this country.
[14:01] Our people.
[14:02] So you say that's the antidote to campaign finance is to actually hit the streets?
[14:05] Well, you got to deal with campaign finance.
[14:07] Of course you do.
[14:07] You got to get rid of this corrupt system.
[14:09] But right now, at this moment, the way to beat big money is not just another TV ad.
[14:15] It is putting people out on the streets.
[14:17] Go to the ground.
[14:18] Go to the ground.
[14:18] And observation, when I mentioned the anxiety that this may be causing Democrats, you smiled.
[14:24] You seem to, do you enjoy this role?
[14:27] One question of enjoying it.
[14:28] I believe what we're doing is absolutely right.
[14:30] They have an idea.
[14:31] This is the old establishment Democratic Party.
[14:35] We got a whole lot of money.
[14:36] We're going to have some fun.
[14:37] You want to run?
[14:38] We think you'd be a good candidate to run for U.S. Senate for Aragon.
[14:42] What do you think?
[14:43] And we got $20 million to put behind you.
[14:45] We're going to raise all kinds of, and we got really good consultants.
[14:49] They got really good TV ads.
[14:50] We got opposition research.
[14:52] Show the world how terrible your opponent is.
[14:54] That's how we do politics.
[14:55] That's how they do politics, as you're saying.
[14:57] That's how they do politics.
[14:57] We mean they, right.
[14:58] So how do you do it?
[14:59] Because you're-
[15:00] All right.
[15:00] We don't sit around selecting who the candidate is.
[15:03] What has been very interesting in this particular cycle, you've had, I don't know, I would say,
[15:09] but the significant majority of the candidates that I've never run for office before.
[15:14] Some of them have been active community organizers.
[15:17] They've been trade unionists.
[15:18] They've simply been young people who came out of nowhere, who were disgusted about U.S. foreign
[15:23] policy regarding Israel or whatever, and they ran for office.
[15:27] And they found all kinds of other young people around them saying, hey, you're right, let's
[15:30] get involved.
[15:31] Took on the establishment, and they won.
[15:33] So the difference is, the establishment is top-down politics.
[15:38] We got the money.
[15:38] We'll select the candidates.
[15:40] We'll call the consultants.
[15:41] We'll do TV ads.
[15:42] Ours is bottom-on-up politics.
[15:45] Grasp politics.
[15:46] Knock on doors.
[15:47] That's how we win elections.
[15:49] Long game.
[15:50] The Bernie Sanders effect continues right after this.
[16:03] To fully understand Bernie Sanders, to fully understand his worldview, you have to wind back
[16:09] the tape.
[16:11] Back to the 1940s childhood defined by the struggle to make ends meet.
[16:15] Not having enough money was with us 24 hours a day.
[16:19] Where nonetheless, he had a solid foundation, a place to live, safe streets, food in the
[16:24] fridge.
[16:25] When I was growing up, living in a rent-controlled apartment, my brother and I went to excellent
[16:32] public schools.
[16:33] I went to Brooklyn College for a year and transferred to the University of Chicago, where I graduated
[16:39] with virtually no student debt.
[16:42] Despite the fact that my family had very little money, we were able to survive on my dad's
[16:49] income alone.
[16:51] How many working class families do you know today where if mom wants to stay home, she's
[16:56] able to do so?
[16:57] So what the hell has happened?
[16:59] Why have we gone backwards?
[17:02] Bernie and his older brother Larry grew up in working class Brooklyn, in a small three-and-a-half
[17:08] room apartment.
[17:09] Their dad Eli was a Polish immigrant, a paint salesman.
[17:12] Their mom Dorothy stayed home to take care of the boys.
[17:15] Money was tight.
[17:16] The household was tense.
[17:18] It was something that my parents always had to deal with, something that the kids always
[17:23] knew about, and something that I've never forgotten about.
[17:24] For Dorothy Sanders, the dream was getting out of that three-room apartment, getting a
[17:29] home of their own one day.
[17:31] She did not live to realize that dream.
[17:34] She suffered from a heart condition and a lack of money to treat it.
[17:39] She died shortly after Bernie Sanders graduated from high school.
[17:42] She was just 46.
[17:44] His dad passed away two years later while trying to drive himself to the hospital during a heart
[17:49] attack.
[17:50] As biographer Dan Chasen tells it, Eli Sanders crashed his car into a bank of construction
[17:56] barriers outside the hospital entrance.
[18:01] That was Bernie Sanders' New York story.
[18:06] His Vermont chapter actually began when he was even younger, a teenager.
[18:11] His brother Larry brought a 13-year-old Bernie Sanders along on a subway ride to a new place
[18:17] in town, right next door to Radio City Music Hall, known for the famous Rockettes.
[18:23] The Vermont Information Center.
[18:28] It was new.
[18:29] And a New York City attraction that had been announced in the New York Times as a place
[18:34] to get reports on skiing conditions in winter, opportunities for sailing and swimming in summer,
[18:39] farm vacations, country inns, all of it, an escape from the teeming hubbub of New York
[18:45] City.
[18:46] The Vermont Development Corporation was hoping to seduce and entice New Yorkers.
[18:50] They offered a visitor's handbook, details on touring pastoral Vermont, and scenes of
[18:56] bucolic landscapes you could buy for a bargain.
[18:59] For young Bernie Sanders, the pitch was magical, almost intoxicating.
[19:04] As Larry Sanders said, Bernard loved the countryside.
[19:07] Vermont was a fantasy, but an important fantasy.
[19:11] A few years after college, Bernie moved to Vermont, and there he would get his start in
[19:15] electoral politics.
[19:16] Today, he doesn't talk about his childhood in Brooklyn all that often, but when he does,
[19:22] especially when he is back at the old apartment, it all kind of clicks.
[19:26] Growing up here, I learned the major lesson that I've ever learned in my life about economics,
[19:33] and that there are millions of families in America today who struggle every single day
[19:40] to take care of their families.
[19:43] And our job in this campaign is to create an economy that works for all of us, not just
[19:51] the 1%.
[19:52] It seems like Vermont is where you learned how to fight for the things you believe in.
[20:02] It seems like Brooklyn is where you learned what to fight for.
[20:05] Growing up with Eli and Dorothy, is that correct?
[20:09] Yes, that's right.
[20:09] Your parents?
[20:10] My parents.
[20:10] And your brother, Larry.
[20:12] A small apartment.
[20:13] Yeah.
[20:13] You all slept in the living room.
[20:17] What did you learn there that animates every single day of your life in the battle?
[20:21] Well, it wasn't an intellectual.
[20:23] I mean, what I learned and felt as a kid is the pressure of money on my family.
[20:32] Okay?
[20:33] My parents were great parents.
[20:34] They used to fight all the time.
[20:35] My mother, my father came to this country with nothing from Poland.
[20:39] My mother wanted to own her own home.
[20:42] She wanted to own her own home.
[20:43] She died young, and she never achieved that.
[20:47] So we lived in a rent-controlled apartment.
[20:48] And there was always the tension in the house.
[20:51] We can't afford this, and they're arguing over this.
[20:54] And that is the same experience, the stress that millions and millions of people feel right
[20:58] now economically.
[21:00] That's what I learned as a kid.
[21:02] That's something I never forgot, and I hope I never will forget.
[21:05] And the other thing I learned, you know, you talk about racism.
[21:08] I'm Jewish.
[21:09] My father's family was wiped out by Hitler.
[21:11] So I learned what racism, disgusting, irrational racism can do in Europe, on the Nazism, in this
[21:19] country, all forms of racism.
[21:21] So I learned that as well.
[21:22] Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez.
[21:26] Up next, we sit down with a leading figure of the Sanders movement.
[21:30] She's known as AOC.
[21:32] You won't want to miss it.
[21:33] Stay with us.
[21:40] She found out she won at the same time as the rest of us.
[21:45] Can you put it into words?
[21:46] Nope.
[21:46] It was a lot to process.
[21:49] A David and Goliath victory for a 28-year-old bartender who, against all odds, had just
[21:55] beat a 10-term establishment Democrat.
[21:58] Cannot believe these numbers right now, but I do know that every single person here has
[22:04] worked their butt off.
[22:06] Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez was having a whirlwind moment.
[22:09] Her primary win in a deep blue district all but guaranteed she would get the big prize,
[22:15] a seat in Congress.
[22:16] To win the general, she barely needed to keep campaigning for herself.
[22:20] So she used her victory speech to announce something else.
[22:24] This is not an end.
[22:27] This is the big city.
[22:28] Yeah!
[22:29] A few weeks later, she hit the road alongside Bernie Sanders.
[22:34] They left their Democratic strongholds of New York and Vermont and instead stumped for
[22:40] like-minded progressive candidates in places like Michigan and Kansas.
[22:45] What this moment requires of us is for everyday people to do more than they have ever done
[22:51] before to reclaim the soul of this nation.
[22:54] This progressive roadshow has become a sort of model for Senator Sanders and the young
[22:59] congresswoman from New York.
[23:00] We saw it last year in the wake of Trump's second election.
[23:06] The pair crisscrossed the country again and they called it
[23:13] the fighting oligarchy tour.
[23:15] We are witnessing an oligarchy when those with the most economic, political, and technological
[23:23] power destroy the public good to enrich themselves.
[23:28] You know, there's a word for this kind of thing.
[23:31] Corruption.
[23:32] That fighting oligarchy tour was a success on several levels.
[23:37] It drew massive crowds.
[23:38] It helped frame the argument and the arsenal for pushing back against a president with
[23:43] an authoritarian agenda.
[23:45] And for Senator Sanders, it was a way to expand the reach of his pro-populist message.
[23:51] For Congresswoman Ocasio-Cortez, the tour was also indicative of her star power.
[23:56] Do you understand the conflict of interest that is before the American people right now,
[24:01] Mr. Secretary?
[24:01] In just a few short years, the youngest congresswoman ever elected to Congress has become one of
[24:07] the most influential figures on the left.
[24:10] Now she is openly considering her next steps in American politics, whether to run for the
[24:15] Senate in her home state of New York, or whether to take the big leap and test whether the country
[24:20] would ever elect a young upstart from the Bronx all the way to the White House.
[24:25] I sat down with Congresswoman Ocasio-Cortez, about an hour from her district, just after
[24:30] she visited a community that was fighting the opening of a data center.
[24:35] So you're here, you were here today with Governor Hochul.
[24:38] And it's interesting, Congressman Pat Ryan was also there with you.
[24:43] I think it's fair to say that both of them are considered to be more moderate than you
[24:48] are.
[24:48] But it's interesting that you and your mentor, Senator Sanders, have been saying for some
[24:53] time that there's a little bit more common ground than people recognize between people
[24:58] who are perhaps on the left and people who are more toward the center, and especially when
[25:03] it comes to things like these AI centers, these data centers.
[25:06] That's right.
[25:07] You know, as the gap between the rich and the working class get bigger and bigger, and as
[25:15] the middle class or our understanding of the middle class starts to really disappear in
[25:22] this country, and more and more people that had previously felt okay find themselves more
[25:29] squeezed than ever, I think that this has allowed the salience of class to really emerge in our
[25:38] politics.
[25:39] And a lot of what Bernie's been talking about forever, where I come from as well, in really
[25:49] forcefully taking on the corruption of corporate lobbying and fighting for working class issues,
[25:58] these issues have started to gain ground with more and more everyday Americans across party
[26:04] lines as well.
[26:06] Our message on healthcare, on wages, and taking on corruption and abuse of power in people's
[26:12] own communities.
[26:13] And when you mentioned the working class, you know, when you talk about working class voters,
[26:17] I think in a lot of people's minds, and for all kinds of reasons, when you think about
[26:20] a working class voter, you think of, you know, what Sarah Palin would call Joe Sixpack.
[26:25] They look a certain way, they are often a certain color, they live in a certain place.
[26:31] What don't Democrats understand about working class voters?
[26:35] The definition, the way to talk about it, the way to reach them?
[26:38] Yeah.
[26:39] Well, you know, I think to your point, there's a lot of euphemisms in politics.
[26:44] Mm-hmm.
[26:45] It's like talking in code almost.
[26:47] That's right.
[26:48] And for a very long time, working class was a euphemism for race and gender.
[26:58] And it was really about a very specific and only one slice of the working class.
[27:04] And we are talking about the actual working class in this country, which is people who
[27:10] are, they make a living from their job, from working, that they're trying to put food on
[27:17] the table, put their kids through school.
[27:19] And if you're lucky, be able to save up for a rainy day.
[27:23] But increasingly, people are not able to do that.
[27:27] And I think that there is no discussion about the working class unless you are talking about
[27:35] all of the working class in America, which is a multiracial working class.
[27:39] Do Democrats do that, though?
[27:40] You know…
[27:42] I'm sorry I'm asking you to critique the party, but this is an important conversation
[27:45] right now.
[27:46] It's a very important conversation right now because I think that the right has tried
[27:51] to scare a lot of Democrats out of speaking forcefully about our full coalition.
[27:59] When we talk about unemployment in this country, Black women are experiencing the brunt of unemployment
[28:05] statistics the most.
[28:06] They are the most laid off by doge efforts in the federal workforce.
[28:12] And when we talk about Latinas as starting some of… having some of the highest rates
[28:19] of starting small businesses in the United States, and you also are talking about white
[28:24] working class areas as well in our ability to make rent, afford their homes, we have to
[28:31] talk about these issues in a way that addresses everyone and includes everyone without leaving
[28:38] people behind.
[28:40] And I think that one of the erroneous takeaways from 2024 was that really embracing and celebrating
[28:54] the rich diversity of our country is a political liability.
[29:00] And I couldn't disagree with that more.
[29:05] I actually think that it's not about… these things are not competing interests.
[29:14] And these two things can be talked about at the same time and they have to be.
[29:17] So you're saying they're like a double helix almost.
[29:19] Right.
[29:20] You can't discuss one without the other.
[29:23] Well, there's another interesting double helix right now in American politics, and that
[29:26] is the progressive left and the democratic establishment.
[29:30] And your party is going through an interesting transition.
[29:35] If the candidates that you have endorsed are successful in the general election, and that's
[29:40] the big test because it's easier in the primary, so now the big test is the general election,
[29:44] and if they are elected in large numbers.
[29:48] What message does that send to the Democratic Party, and in particular the Democratic establishment?
[29:55] Because you know there's some debate about this right now.
[29:57] Yeah.
[29:58] Yeah.
[29:59] I think a big part of that message is how we win has changed and is changing.
[30:08] And a lot of the tropes and two-dimensional thinking that comes out of consultants in Washington
[30:19] are not only erroneous, but they are insulting to what America actually is.
[30:27] And I can't tell you how many times I've heard things like, or heard things insinuated, like
[30:36] a Muslim man can't win in Michigan or that a candidate like Angie Nixon can't win in Florida.
[30:44] And I actually think it is largely through candidates, like their examples, that can really win back
[30:54] places, especially in places like Florida.
[30:57] That many Democrats have written off as a lost cause because there just hasn't been an investment
[31:07] and an understanding that in some states a multiracial working class coalition is actually
[31:13] the only way that you can win, and the only way that we can win these states back.
[31:17] So the question is, will that work in the general election?
[31:20] Yes.
[31:21] You know, I think we are putting a major thesis to the test, but it's about time that we do
[31:31] that because we have tried this old playbook over and over and over again, that only a certain
[31:40] kind of candidate can win in a swing seat.
[31:45] And I'm very excited that there is a class of candidates that has emerged that is speaking
[31:53] forcefully to working class issues, rejecting corporate PAC money and rejecting lobbyist money,
[32:01] and being more accountable to everyday people in mass politics as opposed to working the fundraising
[32:12] circuit in Washington.
[32:13] So you're talking a lot about assumptions, one of the assumptions at work right now in
[32:17] the Democratic Party, and in particular in the Democratic establishment, is that if some
[32:20] of these left-leaning candidates, progressive candidates, if they are elected, that they will
[32:26] tack toward the center in order to get things done.
[32:30] There is an expectation that that might happen.
[32:34] I think that…
[32:38] Is that an expectation or is it wishful thinking on that part?
[32:40] I don't know.
[32:41] I mean, I don't think that's an expectation at all.
[32:45] I think actually the expectation is erroneous in the opposite direction, is that there is
[32:53] this alarmism that I am seeing in Washington where people are seeing some of these candidates
[33:03] that have inspired movements in their own communities, win primaries, and they are saying that the sky
[33:11] is falling, these people are wreckers, they're not here to be productive, and they are going
[33:18] to be a massive net negative in the Democratic caucus and in the Democratic Party.
[33:26] And I could not disagree with that enough.
[33:30] I heard a lot of this nonsense directed at me when I first got into Congress as one of the
[33:37] first DSA-supported and endorsed candidates that got elected to Congress.
[33:44] And a lot of it is just an alarmism to serve special interests, really.
[33:52] If you can incite this panic about people and about these individuals who haven't even
[33:57] stepped one foot into Washington yet and shown themselves and proven themselves, then you
[34:04] can whip people up into a frenzy to be reactive in the opposite direction.
[34:26] I want to ask you about one particular group of people that you have had
[34:31] a harder time reaching.
[34:32] Again, your record is impressive with the number of endorsements you've made and the
[34:37] number of primaries that have been won.
[34:40] And the diversity in that group is something that we just have not seen.
[34:45] And diversity of all kinds.
[34:46] Yes.
[34:47] Geographic diversity, age, gender.
[34:48] And I'm very proud of that.
[34:49] Yeah.
[34:50] It's quite incredible.
[34:51] It really is.
[34:52] It's a beautiful thing to see.
[34:53] It's what America, frankly, despite what Mr. Trump thinks is precisely what America should
[34:57] be.
[34:58] It's impossible to actually look at the list because it really is something to see.
[35:02] And yet there is a group of a cohort within the Democratic Party that has had a rather
[35:11] sort of closed arm approach to your brand of progressive politics.
[35:14] And I'm talking about black women, repeat voters, so important to the Democratic Party.
[35:21] And as I've talked to many of them in preparation for this interview, I hear something over and
[35:25] over again, that you focus on economic equality and they understand that, but there is a concern
[35:30] that you downplay the role, the pernicious role of race in creating barriers to opportunity,
[35:36] that it is dismissed sometimes as identity politics.
[35:39] You've seen that.
[35:40] You've talked about it.
[35:41] You experienced it in both runs for presidency.
[35:44] What have you learned in that process about trying to reach out to that important group
[35:48] of voters that still need to be convinced?
[35:50] Yes.
[35:51] But you're absolutely right.
[35:52] Black women, older women are an enormously important and reliable, the most reliable
[35:59] part of the Democratic base.
[36:01] And if I have not been as clear about my views on racism as I should have been, then I apologize
[36:09] for that.
[36:10] But I have spent my life doing my best in trying to combat all forms of racism.
[36:16] You know, when I was a kid a long time ago, the University of Chicago got arrested in fighting
[36:23] against segregated housing.
[36:25] But, you know, perhaps I haven't been as clear as I should be and will try to do better.
[36:29] You learned some lessons.
[36:30] Yeah.
[36:30] Hard lessons are good lessons.
[36:31] Yes, they are.
[36:37] The success of Bernie Sanders' movement will ultimately depend on his ability to win elections,
[36:42] to govern from a truly progressive point of view, to build coalitions, and to win over
[36:48] skeptics.
[36:49] And some of those skeptics are people who have helped shape and run the Democratic Party
[36:54] for years.
[36:55] We asked Congresswoman Ocasio-Cortez about that.
[36:58] And the Democratic Socialists of America makes an easy boogeyman for people on the right.
[37:04] But also, even within the Democratic Party.
[37:06] And Democratic strategist, Donna Brazile, someone you know, someone, people who watch us know
[37:13] her well.
[37:14] She's been in politics a long time.
[37:15] She was strategist for Al Gore.
[37:17] So she's been at this game for a very long time.
[37:19] And as a traditionalist, probably by most measures, she used the word extreme in ticking through
[37:26] parts of the DSA platform recently in an editorial that ran in the Washington Post.
[37:31] And I just want to tick through some of the things that she mentioned.
[37:33] She talked about public ownership of the largest corporations and utilities, defunding the
[37:38] Defense Department, which I guess we now call the Department of War, eventually abolishing the
[37:43] police and prison system, housing for all, a federal jobs guarantee, amnesty for all
[37:48] immigrants, regardless of their status.
[37:50] In her words, she says, Trump and Republicans are trying to convince voters that most Democrats
[37:56] agree with these radical views.
[38:00] Democrats must show that they don't.
[38:03] What is your response to that?
[38:05] So, first and foremost, the issues that she is raising are not present in any of these
[38:12] candidates' platforms.
[38:14] So, certainly there are, in our great diverse country, there are people that are organizing
[38:21] around those issues.
[38:23] We need to be operating with what these candidates ran on, as opposed to what somebody somewhere
[38:32] or some organization somewhere in our country is saying.
[38:37] So I think first and foremost, we need to really reckon with the reality of the candidates
[38:42] in front of us, and that is part and parcel of giving someone a fair shake, is instead of assuming
[38:49] what they believe, asking and hearing for ourselves what they have said on the ground.
[38:57] And what they are saying on the ground is that we want universal childcare, Medicare for
[39:03] all, stronger unions, making the minimum wage a living wage in this country, protecting people's
[39:11] right to clean air and clean water, and so on.
[39:16] But secondly, I think that what we also need to understand is that we are at a very unique
[39:25] tipping point as a country and as a party.
[39:29] And what I see in someone like Donna Brazile is an individual that plays a very critical role
[39:39] in the Democratic coalition.
[39:43] And what we need to understand and figure out is how we bring together the insurgent, working-class,
[39:52] youth movement that is taking over the polls.
[39:57] So clearly the energy and the momentum is with an ascendant generational shift.
[40:04] And how we marry that with an astute political movement in the South that is suffering under the attacks
[40:18] on voting rights, on workers, federal workers that have been laid off, and how we actually
[40:28] create that intergenerational interracial coalition on a working-class axis and line.
[40:36] If we take this opportunity, and instead of seeing one another as a zero-sum competitor in the coalition,
[40:46] but we see this as an opportunity to grow a mass class politics in this country,
[40:52] the goal here is to no longer win by 51.
[40:57] The goal here is to get back to the 60-seat filibuster-proof majorities that we saw not too long ago when I was in school.
[41:11] And I know that that sounds like a fantasy to a lot of people today given the polarization that we're dealing with,
[41:19] but the way that we break through that polarization is through a class politics and is by really making the forceful case
[41:30] that we are the ones to take on corruption because we don't take these people's money.
[41:36] We are the ones to change people's material reality because we will be passing changes and raises to people's wages
[41:44] and making things more affordable, and we will also be defending people's civil rights in this country.
[41:51] But as you know, change is hard.
[41:53] And you're talking about the consultant class.
[41:55] They're going to fight to hold on to their power.
[41:57] It's their paycheck.
[41:58] It's their status.
[41:59] It's Washington, D.C.
[42:00] Those things are important.
[42:01] And so when you talk about an insurgent class, insurgency is an interesting word.
[42:05] It's not one or two people.
[42:08] You have been in that role where you've been, you know, the only person or one of a small number.
[42:13] Senator Sanders certainly has been in that position as an independent on the Senate side.
[42:18] What will you do to make sure that this, because an insurgency sounds like a freight train is a coming.
[42:23] You know, it's a large number of people, and that's what you're hoping for.
[42:26] What do you do to make sure that they have an entry that is different than yours?
[42:31] Because yours was difficult.
[42:32] Yes.
[42:33] Yeah.
[42:34] Well, my goal is that, and I think it's always been my goal, that I've always felt since my election that in many ways it was an opening of a door.
[42:48] I was one of the only working class people to get elected to Congress, period.
[42:55] I went straight from waiting tables to entering Congress.
[43:00] And that wasn't like some summer job many moons ago.
[43:03] It was a direct transit.
[43:05] How hard was that?
[43:06] And it was extremely challenging and very difficult, privately and publicly.
[43:13] Privately because Washington assumes that you're a millionaire, and there's a lot of things structurally.
[43:20] You don't get your first paycheck until a month in.
[43:25] And so you have to figure out, as a working person, how do I move to a new city, find a place to stay, get a suit so that I'm allowed to even enter the floor of the house?
[43:42] Because you're not even allowed to go in.
[43:43] You have to have a jacket on.
[43:44] You have to have a jacket on.
[43:45] You have to have a jacket on all that.
[43:47] And you don't have a paycheck for one to two months.
[43:51] And for small details like that, to larger details of the hostility that I encountered.
[44:01] I mean, it was true hostility?
[44:03] It was true hostility.
[44:05] It was true hostility on a level that I would never wish upon another person.
[44:13] And it is one reason why I feel very protective of not just these candidates that just got elected, but whenever I see a working person.
[44:28] Thankfully, we've had a few slip in here and there over the years.
[44:32] I feel very protective because of these reasons.
[44:37] It is not easy to go there, especially if you got there by getting rid of someone's friend.
[44:44] Welcome back to Law & Game, the Bernie Sanders effect.
[45:01] This is where Senator Sanders won his first election, but barely, when he ran for mayor of Burlington, Vermont in 1981.
[45:08] He wound up working right there at City Hall.
[45:11] His journey from a winning margin of just 10 votes to crowds counted in tens of thousands is a story of persistence, ambition, and against all odds, rock star appeal.
[45:23] He had already lost two races for Vermont governor, another two for Senate, when he ran for mayor of Burlington as an independent, as a self-described socialist.
[45:35] He was taking on an establishment Democrat who had had the job for a decade.
[45:39] He was not a native Vermonter. He was not even a Democrat.
[45:43] The Burlington papers thought he would lose by more than 30 points.
[45:46] And that's why it was national news when Bernie Sanders, the guy from Brooklyn, somehow pulled it off.
[45:53] Face it, you don't find too many socialists in elective office in this country, and one is elected mayor of a sizable city.
[46:03] Well, that's news.
[46:04] His victory might have been surprising anywhere, but it was hard to fathom for 1980s Vermont.
[46:10] This is Mayor Bernard Sanders.
[46:11] Mayor Sanders got a lot of attention recently, not only with his 10-vote victory, but mostly because he is a socialist.
[46:17] My goodness, how did this happen in good old conservative Vermont?
[46:21] It is the question Bernie Sanders has been asked his entire career.
[46:25] How on earth are you pulling this off?
[46:27] And his answer has been just as consistent.
[46:31] I won the election, I think, because we effectively put together a coalition of low-income people.
[46:36] In our society, theoretically a democratic society, you have a handful of people who control our economy.
[46:41] You have maybe two percent of the population that owns one-third of the entire wealth of America,
[46:45] and these people have incredible power, and they determine the destiny of our entire country.
[46:50] As one of the nation's only socialist mayors, Sanders enacted new affordable housing policies.
[46:55] He pushed Burlington toward renewable energy.
[46:58] He expanded childcare and bolstered the city's public schools.
[47:02] He also made Burlington and its government more fun.
[47:05] He started a Little League program and held weekend sports events.
[47:09] Here he is playing tennis.
[47:11] He planted trees across the city and beautified the Lake Champlain waterfront.
[47:16] He launched a free summer concert series, a winter ski festival, poetry readings, and lectures at City Hall.
[47:23] He even hosted his own television show,
[47:26] where he talked directly to his constituents about what was on their mind, meeting them where they were, literally.
[47:37] What school do you guys go to? Who can tell me?
[47:39] Does that have a shock to be a winner, do you think?
[47:41] I can survive on a horse. Anybody can survive on a horse.
[47:46] Well, let me start off by saying it's an interesting hairdo.
[47:49] Bernie Sanders really was the people's mayor.
[47:52] And for him, part of the job was looking beyond the horizon.
[47:56] As mayor, he delved into foreign policy, occasionally traveling overseas, and regularly challenging President Ronald Reagan.
[48:04] When President Reagan signs the bill authorizing this appropriation,
[48:07] the United States government, the wealthy and most powerful nation on earth,
[48:11] will officially be at war with the government of Nicaragua.
[48:15] Somehow it worked, for Burlington and for Bernie Sanders.
[48:19] After four successful terms as mayor, he became the first independent elected to the U.S. House in decades.
[48:33] He served for more than a dozen years before being elected to the U.S. Senate in 2006.
[48:39] Thirty-five years later, still an independent and a socialist, Bernie Sanders has caucused with the Democrats
[48:45] and chaired the Senate Veterans Affairs Committee and the Budget Committee.
[48:49] When he launched his first run for president back in 2015, it was notable that this independent senator,
[48:56] who was proudly not a Democrat, was now running to be the leader of the Democratic Party.
[49:02] He would campaign in these early primary states, early caucus states, and he'd be talking to Democratic voters,
[49:06] members of the Democratic base, people who ultimately decide the presidential nominee.
[49:09] And they'd ask him, well, are you a Democrat?
[49:12] And we'd hear him say, oh, yes, for all intents and purposes, yes, I'm a Democrat.
[49:16] I caucus with Democrats.
[49:17] I'm running for the Democratic nomination.
[49:19] But for a lot of us in Vermont, hearing him say those words was an inherently jarring experience.
[49:24] It was almost amusing because here he was trying to reach out and connect with Democratic voters and saying, I am one of you.
[49:30] But at the same time, for those of us in Vermont who know that he's never been a Democrat, it was jarring because he's not.
[49:37] And he never has been.
[49:38] Did that seem at the time opportunistic or pragmatic?
[49:41] A little bit of both.
[49:42] Bernie Sanders pitched himself as something that sounded impossible on paper.
[49:47] The ultimate insider, a politician who had been in Congress for a quarter century, and the ultimate outsider, building a movement to upend the political system.
[49:57] Just like when he ran for mayor, it was not supposed to work.
[50:00] And yet, Bernie Sanders got some of the biggest, loudest, most fervent crowds of the Democratic primary that year.
[50:11] He almost beat Hillary Clinton in Iowa.
[50:13] And then he won New Hampshire.
[50:15] What we have got to do is wage a political revolution where millions of people who have given up on the political process stand up and fight back.
[50:24] The march of an independent socialist toward the Democratic nomination caused friction inside the party establishment.
[50:31] Democrats worried that Senator Sanders was dragging the party too far to the left, that if he somehow won the nomination, his policies would be too radical to win the general election.
[50:41] In the end, Senator Sanders did not get a chance to prove them wrong because, of course, he lost the Democratic primary.
[50:48] And then Bernie Sanders did run for president one more time, finally losing to Joe Biden in the 2020 primary.
[50:55] Today, Bernie Sanders is 85 years old.
[50:58] He says that he's unlikely to take another run at the presidency, but he is still out there, still drawing record crowds, as he barnstorms the country with the fighting oligarchy tour.
[51:09] Your presence here today is making Donald Trump and Elon Musk very nervous.
[51:19] You can see in these events shades of how he ran the city in Burlington.
[51:24] Live music and performances, almost a festival atmosphere.
[51:28] He invites other politicians up there with him.
[51:30] Candidates he supports and nurtures and mentors, some of them big names, some of them long shots.
[51:36] You could see it as passing the torch or as handing over the instruction manual that he spent a lifetime writing.
[51:43] Focus on the working class, healthcare as a human right.
[51:47] Challenge the establishment, blue or red.
[51:50] Then take that message directly to voters, door to door.
[51:54] The Bernie Sanders playbook will face its biggest test this November, as these candidates try to change the Democratic Party and the political system from within.
[52:04] So you have endorsed more than 70 people in Democratic primaries and 75% of them have won their primaries.
[52:13] That is, those are impressive numbers.
[52:14] Not bad.
[52:16] Not bad.
[52:17] Those are impressive numbers.
[52:18] Better batting average than most baseball players.
[52:19] The Wall Street Journal looked at your endorsement strategy and they called you a kingmaker.
[52:25] That's not a word you often hear in progressive politics.
[52:29] Are you comfortable with that?
[52:30] No, I'm not a kingmaker.
[52:31] Did they get it right?
[52:32] I'm not a kingmaker.
[52:33] I'm part of a movement of fantastic people.
[52:37] I'm one of many.
[52:39] I have a role to play and I ran for president.
[52:41] I'm better known than most that I play my role.
[52:43] But this movement does not succeed without thousands and thousands of grassroots activists who are busy knocking on doors and in fact have the courage to run for office.
[52:52] You talked about people who voted for you and then voted for Donald Trump.
[52:58] Yeah.
[52:59] Your dear friend.
[53:00] My dear friend.
[53:01] Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez did something interesting.
[53:04] She did this exercise where she used social media and said, you know, there are people who voted for Donald Trump and people who voted for me.
[53:10] And while people were scratching their head wondering about this, she just went to the source and said, help me understand how you could cast a vote for me and cast a vote for Donald Trump.
[53:18] I'm certain that there are a lot of people who supported you in your presidential elections, presidential campaigns, who also drifted into that camp.
[53:26] What needs to happen to win some of that?
[53:29] Well, Alexandria is great on social media.
[53:31] I mean, she is extraordinary.
[53:32] That was a brilliant thing to do and the right thing to do.
[53:35] Say what I did.
[53:36] I went to West Virginia, where I think Trump got 70 percent of the vote.
[53:42] I went to the to the county where he did the best.
[53:45] Just to answer that same question.
[53:47] And what did you hear?
[53:48] I mean, it was Mingo County, Mingo County, West Virginia.
[53:52] OK.
[53:53] And we went to that.
[53:54] It was a remarkable meeting.
[53:55] I loved it.
[53:56] It's a town meeting.
[53:57] People got up.
[53:59] They said, health care is a disaster.
[54:01] We're worried about our educational system, worried about the environment, all that stuff.
[54:06] What I learned is if you go to West Virginia, just as one example, there is no Democratic Party.
[54:12] There's no alternative.
[54:13] Virtually does not exist.
[54:14] And that's true in a number of states in this country.
[54:17] Doesn't exist.
[54:18] Many of those people probably look at the Democratic Party and wonder if they represent them.
[54:22] That's right.
[54:23] Where did Democrats go wrong in losing those?
[54:24] No, that's right.
[54:25] What I think what Trump did, again, this gets back to my view, that the Democratic Party failed working class people on economic issues.
[54:35] I think they have a lot to be proud of in terms of fighting for civil rights, for women's rights, for gay rights, for environmental stuff.
[54:42] But in terms of working class issues, no, I don't think they've done a good job.
[54:46] So a lot of workers out there say, well, you know, we voted for you.
[54:49] Our fathers voted for you.
[54:50] The hell with you.
[54:51] Trump is, we don't know about Trump, but he's loud and he's, you know, he's a bold guy.
[54:55] So what does Donald Trump understand about reaching working class voters?
[54:59] About, what does he understand about fear, about anger that Democrats don't understand?
[55:04] You are asking very good questions.
[55:06] All right.
[55:07] Trump understands that the American people are angry and he has given them a way to express their anger in exactly the wrong ways.
[55:19] All right.
[55:20] In other words, in my view, Trump is there to represent his a billionaire, his fellow billionaires.
[55:25] You see them around him all the time.
[55:26] That's his job.
[55:27] That's what he does.
[55:28] But what he says to people, you can't afford health care.
[55:31] You can't afford housing.
[55:32] You can't afford prescription.
[55:33] You know what the answer is?
[55:34] It's the undocumented people.
[55:36] It's the trans people.
[55:37] It's black people.
[55:38] It's the Canadians.
[55:40] It's the Mexicans.
[55:41] Every day there's a new person that we are supposed to hate.
[55:44] And people say, ah, that's the reason why.
[55:47] Damn undocumented.
[55:48] Get rid of all of them and I'm going to have health care.
[55:50] Well, it doesn't quite work that way.
[55:52] But he's doing what demagogues have always done.
[55:54] It's what they did to the Jews in Germany, right?
[55:56] Come up with an enemy.
[55:57] But it makes people feel good in the short term.
[55:59] It doesn't necessarily solve their problems.
[56:00] That's right.
[56:01] So what do Democrats need to do to understand that anger?
[56:04] Well, we don't have to-
[56:05] And harness it in a constructive way.
[56:06] We don't lie.
[56:07] I hope we don't lie.
[56:08] We tell people the truth.
[56:09] Uh-huh.
[56:10] And that's what I try to do.
[56:11] And the truth is that the-
[56:14] It's a complicated issue, a lot of factors.
[56:16] The major reason that the working class has gone nowhere,
[56:19] in fact, declined in the last 50 years, has to do with the greed of the people on top.
[56:24] We have seen a massive transfer of wealth over the last 50 years from the bottom 90% to the top 1%.
[56:30] Today, you've got one guy, Mr. Musk, owning more wealth than the bottom 53% of American households.
[56:35] So our whole economic policy in the last 50 years, in many, many ways, has been to make the very rich richer and leave working class families behind.
[56:44] But those people in that county in West Virginia, are they reacting to that message?
[56:48] Yeah, they reacted positively.
[56:49] Did they?
[56:50] Yeah.
[56:51] Look, my experience that I've been doing this for a while is people are a lot smarter than politicians think they are.
[57:00] Politicians think, oh, we ought to come up with a slogan.
[57:03] What's the message?
[57:04] Give me five words.
[57:05] What's the tweet?
[57:06] People are looking at this world.
[57:07] It's a crazy world.
[57:08] They want to get an understanding of why the hell their kids are going to have a lower standard of living than they do while Mr. Musk owns half of the world.
[57:15] What's going on?
[57:16] Why are they pushing AI on us when it may result in millions of jobs being lost?
[57:21] Who has the power?
[57:22] That's what they want to understand.
[57:24] And Democrats, A, have got to explain, but you can't explain it if you're taking money from these guys.
[57:29] That's the problem.
[57:30] So when you're talking about explaining, you're talking about messaging, and as you noted, Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, who everybody calls AOC, I don't know what she thinks about that.
[57:38] We'll have a chance to ask her.
[57:39] I call her Alexandria.
[57:40] I wonder what she thinks about, you know, when your name is shrunk that way.
[57:43] But she is very good at communicating.
[57:45] She is great.
[57:46] And when you first ran for president in 2016, she was still tending bar in New York City.
[57:51] And she is now one of the most influential people in American politics.
[57:56] And she's your buddy.
[57:58] You two travel together.
[58:01] You hold rallies together.
[58:02] You go to concerts together.
[58:04] And you're on stage together.
[58:05] And she has a big decision to make.
[58:08] And I imagine that you're in her ear when she makes big decisions.
[58:11] And I'm not going to ask you whether you think she should run for president, because that's one of the things she's weighing.
[58:15] We know that.
[58:16] She's talked about it.
[58:17] I'm not going to ask you if she should run for Senate, because she's a grown woman.
[58:21] She can make that decision on her own.
[58:24] But I wonder if you have allowed yourself to imagine a world in which someone like AOC is the president of these United States.
[58:35] I think we are moving in that direction.
[58:40] I think if you just look at the polling that's out there, recent Wall Street Journal poll on virtually every issue that people like Alexandria or I talk about, widespread support.
[58:54] Didn't used to be the case.
[58:56] Today, I think people recognize that our health care system is broken, dysfunctional.
[59:01] 63% now support Medicare for all.
[59:04] Very strong majority of Americans support taxing billionaires.
[59:09] Tremendous number of people support raising the minimum wage to at least $20 an hour, etc.
[59:15] So the agenda of the people like Alexandria, Roe Conner, and others, and I have been pushing, I think, is now the agenda that most Americans think makes sense.
[59:28] Even if it's attached to socialism.
[59:30] Pardon me?
[59:31] Even if it's attached to democratic socialism.
[59:33] Yes.
[59:34] Even if it's sold in the person of a woman.
[59:36] Oh.
[59:37] Because Americans have had, you know, a difficult time.
[59:40] The rest of the world has no problem electing women to its highest office.
[59:44] No question about it.
[59:46] Sexism is alive and well in America.
[59:48] But if you're asking me, do I think a woman could win under a strong progressive platform?
[59:52] Yes, I do.
[59:53] What are the factors she should consider in making that decision?
[59:55] Well, you know, she is young.
[59:57] She has to make choices.
[59:59] She can stay in the house, move up the ladder there.
[1:00:01] She could run for the Senate.
[1:00:03] Which means she would, she would be challenging another one of your buddies, Charles Schumann.
[1:00:09] She would be challenging Senator Schumann.
[1:00:11] Would that put you in a difficult position?
[1:00:13] No.
[1:00:14] I would support Alexandria if that was the case.
[1:00:16] Okay.
[1:00:18] Or she could run for president.
[1:00:19] But as you said, that's the decision she will have to make and nobody can make it for her.
[1:00:24] I'm tempted to ask whether you think she should.
[1:00:27] I know I wouldn't.
[1:00:28] No, don't ask.
[1:00:29] Okay.
[1:00:30] All right.
[1:00:31] It's, you know, it's hanging out there.
[1:00:32] You know, you want to ask.
[1:00:33] That's her decision.
[1:00:35] You've been watching Long Game, The Bernie Sanders Effect.
[1:00:37] Don't go anywhere.
[1:00:38] The story of Bernie Sanders might be told best through the lens of his contradictions.
[1:00:52] Contradictions that make him hard to define on the national stage.
[1:00:56] And sometimes a frustration for the Democratic Party.
[1:00:59] The great contradictions of Bernie Sanders is that he is this incredibly powerful, important figure in Democratic politics.
[1:01:06] He has never joined the Democratic Party.
[1:01:07] He has never wanted to join the Democratic Party.
[1:01:09] And has, in fact, kept the Democratic Party at arm's length.
[1:01:11] Can we just sit with his contradictions?
[1:01:13] Sure.
[1:01:14] For a minute.
[1:01:15] Beginning with the Vermonter who sounds like the New Yorker.
[1:01:19] Yes.
[1:01:21] You know, one would think that he'd lose that Brooklyn accent.
[1:01:24] You know, you spend enough time in Vermont.
[1:01:26] No one in Vermont has a Brooklyn accent except Bernie Sanders.
[1:01:29] He is up in years.
[1:01:32] He is.
[1:01:33] He's 85 years old now.
[1:01:34] 85 in September.
[1:01:35] And yet he is associated with a very youthful progressive movement.
[1:01:39] That is an amazing contradiction.
[1:01:41] And it's something that I think a lot about.
[1:01:43] Because when you get right down to it, at 85 years old, some of these younger voters, he's older than their grandparents.
[1:01:49] He's literally older than their grandparents.
[1:01:51] Okay.
[1:01:52] I hadn't thought about that, but yes.
[1:01:53] It's only natural to wonder, well, why is that?
[1:01:55] Why aren't they connecting with someone who's closer to their age?
[1:01:58] And I think that Bernie Sanders is a unique figure and to the extent that he's authentic, he's candid, he's unapologetic in his progressive views.
[1:02:06] And I think that that ultimately helps drive that appeal with younger voters who are desperate and eager for that kind of voice.
[1:02:13] I think one of the other contradictions is that he has a prism through which all lights shines.
[1:02:18] And that is class.
[1:02:19] That for him, everything is about working class and the interests of working class.
[1:02:24] And yet, he is trying to appeal to a broader base of voters for whom class is not necessarily the defining issue, or is one of many issues.
[1:02:33] And so I think all of these contradictions create a unique political figure that is Bernie Sanders.
[1:02:38] When you think about your friend and mentor, Bernie Sanders, interesting character from one of the smallest states in the country, mayor of Burlington, which is not a small town, but it's not exactly a big city either, right?
[1:02:57] Is now one of the most influential people in American politics, certainly one of the most influential people in Democratic politics, although he never officially joined the party.
[1:03:07] What does that say about him? And what does it say about the Democratic Party?
[1:03:13] One of the things that I was most astounded by when I started to experience my first few months in Congress was, you know, I immediately thought, I have no idea how he was alone for so long.
[1:03:40] I think what is so powerful about Bernie, and it's certainly something that I've also felt and felt as a young person, especially as well, is that this country is not 50% Democrat and 50% Republican.
[1:03:54] This country is, has a huge swath of independent voters, about 30%, in a lot of places, it's really a third Democrat, a third Republican, and a third Independent in many places in the United States.
[1:04:12] And he represents and is one of the only people that represents a third of an electorate in many places. And it's people who are saying, I don't feel comfortable labeling myself in one camp or another. I feel like my worldview is a little bit more nuanced than that.
[1:04:37] You and Bernie Sanders are very close. You travel together. You're all like peas and carrots, cheese and macaroni. How often do you talk to him?
[1:04:50] Very often. I just saw him on Friday. We'll often call one another. If he hears I'm sick, or if I hear that he got a cold, I'll give him a call.
[1:05:03] You know, we, we speak quite often. And I think that it is a funny, it's, I think on its surface, it's a funny thing.
[1:05:19] No one would think that this 80 year old Jewish guy and this 30 something Puerto Rican girl would have such a close friendship.
[1:05:28] But underneath all of that, we both grew up very similarly. He was born to really working class and low income parents that had emigrated here and or from a family that had emigrated here.
[1:05:49] And I grew up the same way. And there's a lot that we are able to relate to one another. We also had very similar struggles when we first got to the house.
[1:06:02] And I think our world view, of course, is very similar.
[1:06:06] He is very proud of you. We just talked to him right before we talked to you, the day before we talked to you.
[1:06:14] And he sees you as, you know, as his buddy and, and as equal. You know, that it's clear when you talk to him about that.
[1:06:24] And I have actually commended you in the way that you've talked about your own ambitions.
[1:06:30] And I don't want to get into the, well, she or won't she, you know, run for Senate or president.
[1:06:34] But it was interesting because he talked about it with a certain degree of excitement.
[1:06:39] He said, if you run for the Senate, you've got his endorsement. He did not hesitate.
[1:06:43] And, you know, he talked about the reasons why you could run for office.
[1:06:48] And so I don't want to get into that. You know, you've talked about it. You'll announce it when it's ready, when you're ready.
[1:06:54] But what is interesting is for people who have their own big decisions to make, what is interesting is what decisions in your life help us understand how you will make this one?
[1:07:03] Yeah. Yeah. You know, I think it's, it's, it is very funny because this decision can be seen as a very unique or singular one and a very rare one that not many people have to make.
[1:07:25] No, not many people have to make this decision.
[1:07:28] However, almost all of us have to make big life defining decisions in our lives in one way or another.
[1:07:39] And it really is no different.
[1:07:46] I think that we all weigh where we come from, what we want for ourselves professionally, personally, our limitations, how we want to grow.
[1:08:02] I do think that one aspect to this that doesn't always get, that probably doesn't get the focus in the weight that it plays in my life is my view about life in general.
[1:08:20] I don't see politics in its narrow, in this very kind of narrow electoral frame as the all-consuming reality of my life.
[1:08:38] And I think it's because I got elected at a young age.
[1:08:41] And so I think about the conditions of this country.
[1:08:44] I think about, I really do come at this from what is best for the country at this moment, what is best for the state and my community in this moment.
[1:08:59] And also, in the mix of all of that, is what do I think makes up a good life?
[1:09:07] You know, I think a lot of people...
[1:09:10] That's interesting because that's usually not one of the factors that people talk about.
[1:09:13] How do I have a good life when I run for president?
[1:09:15] Because the trade-off is pretty big when you take a step like that.
[1:09:18] Yes.
[1:09:19] Yeah, I think so.
[1:09:20] And I think when most people run for office, they run very often as a second act or they run after a long career in lower levels of the ballot.
[1:09:38] But I was put in a very unique position.
[1:09:42] I was the youngest woman, am, the youngest woman in American history to ever get elected to Congress.
[1:09:50] Which means that when you start your congressional career at 50, which was, and I think at that time, whether it's 53 or 63, around that average age, you've lived a lot of life.
[1:10:06] A lot of people have pursued education to the extent that they wanted to.
[1:10:11] Their first careers to the extent that they wanted to.
[1:10:14] Family to the extent that they wanted to.
[1:10:16] And I got elected at the beginning of a lot of my life.
[1:10:21] And so I've often tried to approach this as, how do I do the most good and also try to have the same experiences that everyone else has tried to have?
[1:10:35] And how do I balance that with what is best, what I think is best for the country?
[1:10:41] I was talking recently to a former Bernie Sanders staffer who said Bernie had to walk so that Mamdani could run and AOC could run and El Saeed could run.
[1:10:50] And so, and I think there's something to that.
[1:10:52] These candidates that he's helped support are often called Bernie's kids.
[1:10:55] Yes.
[1:10:56] Is that an apt word to use?
[1:11:00] Well, I think that, I don't think Bernie Sanders himself is comfortable with the phrase.
[1:11:05] And even I, I kind of had this reflexive, like, well, we shouldn't really call them that, maybe.
[1:11:11] Because, I mean, they're adults.
[1:11:13] They're having their own message.
[1:11:14] They have their own ideas.
[1:11:15] They're not necessarily saying, well, vote for me because I'm an acolyte of Bernie Sanders.
[1:11:19] But at the same time, there's no denying the fact that they're following the trail that he lays.
[1:11:25] There's no denying the fact that their ability to compete in swing states in competitive races is a direct result of the success that Bernie Sanders had.
[1:11:33] And they're following his lead and they're succeeding because he helped them succeed.
[1:11:40] Delicate question and last question.
[1:11:42] He doesn't like the word legacy.
[1:11:44] Right.
[1:11:45] You know that too.
[1:11:47] I do.
[1:11:48] What is that about?
[1:11:50] You know.
[1:11:52] Do you understand it?
[1:11:53] I do.
[1:11:55] I think, you know, you and I recently spoke and you asked me about Bernie Sanders being grumpy.
[1:11:58] And I think that there's something.
[1:12:00] So you put that on me.
[1:12:02] About the reputation that some people say he's grumpy.
[1:12:06] And, and I don't think that he's grumpy.
[1:12:10] I think that he's eager.
[1:12:12] I think that he's frustrated because of the pace at which things change.
[1:12:15] I think that he, he is impatient more so than grumpy.
[1:12:19] And with that in mind, I think that he's not thinking about legacy because he has so much work that he still wants to do.
[1:12:24] Lady Gaga saying the star spangled banner and Jennifer Lopez, she brought the house down.
[1:12:51] Pete after me.
[1:13:01] But the internet anointed a different star from Joe Biden's inauguration.
[1:13:07] They picked this guy.
[1:13:09] Yep.
[1:13:10] This guy who sauntered into all the pomp and circumstance of a presidential inauguration.
[1:13:17] Looking like it was his first errand of the day.
[1:13:20] Like maybe he was on his way to the post office.
[1:13:23] The image of a kind of grouchy looking Bernie Sanders wearing a worn gray coat and those big puffy mittens.
[1:13:31] Won the day.
[1:13:32] Funny takes on the frumpy, frozen, frowning Bernie ended up on the New York City subway.
[1:13:39] In famous photos and paintings.
[1:13:42] Gabbing with the girls on Sex and the City.
[1:13:45] They put Bernie Sanders in E.T. and Game of Thrones.
[1:13:50] And on that park bench with Forrest Gump.
[1:13:53] In Golden Girls.
[1:13:54] The Big Lebowski.
[1:13:55] Feeding pigeons in Central Park.
[1:13:58] Senator Sanders has gotten the Larry David treatment on SNL.
[1:14:03] I'm the only candidate up here who's not a billionaire.
[1:14:07] I don't have a super pack.
[1:14:09] I don't even have a backpack.
[1:14:10] The senator has inspired clothes that walk the runway at Paris Fashion Week.
[1:14:15] And has had sit downs with pop culture icons like Killer Mike and Halsey and Cardi B.
[1:14:21] Alright guys, so this is Cardi and Bernie.
[1:14:24] A memeable Bernie Sanders has been photoshopped into Valentine's Day cards, into video games,
[1:14:31] and into iconic characters like a pseudo Doc Brown from the film Back to the Future.
[1:14:37] That playbook for reaching younger people by being essentially and authentically yourself
[1:14:43] helped elect another star of pragmatic socialism.
[1:14:46] A leader who's been much more proactive in memeing himself.
[1:14:50] New York, will you accept this rose?
[1:14:53] I'm talking about the young Zoran Mamdani.
[1:14:56] And that is maybe why it made sense for Senator Sanders, again in a worn out gray coat,
[1:15:02] to be the one to swear Mayor Mamdani in.
[1:15:05] Please repeat after me.
[1:15:07] Mayor Mamdani first encountered the Bernie Sanders effect the year he turned 24.
[1:15:12] I Zoran Kwame Mamdani.
[1:15:15] What was it like to hear him articulate his ideas for the first time?
[1:15:20] What struck you?
[1:15:22] It felt like I belonged.
[1:15:25] You know, when he spoke about his vision for our country, it made me feel less alone.
[1:15:32] And I know that so many felt that way.
[1:15:37] So many felt as if they were the only ones to think these things, to dream for these things.
[1:15:42] And then you saw someone who didn't just have the same views but had the courage to fight for them at a scale that I had never seen.
[1:15:50] You look at the campaign that he built, you look around the world today, and you see that that is a campaign that fundamentally transformed the way that we think about politics, the way that we talk about politics, and also what we understand politics to be for, which is to fight for working people.
[1:16:06] Working people.
[1:16:07] Working people.
[1:16:08] Is that what you really heard there, or is that he was fighting for working people?
[1:16:11] For dignity.
[1:16:12] For the dignity of the working person.
[1:16:15] And, you know, it's very funny to be sitting here speaking to you about Senator Sanders, because at one point in my life, I thought the closest I was ever going to get to Bernie was when I took a selfie with a cardboard cutout of Bernie after I finished a canvassing shift in Iowa for him in the 2020 primaries.
[1:16:31] And to now be able to know him as a person, it is a gift that I'll never fully be able to appreciate as being real.
[1:16:44] When and how did you meet?
[1:16:45] I first met Bernie, I think it was when I went to DC, and we actually spoke in person.
[1:16:59] The first time we spoke on the phone, I actually remember where I was. I was in Eastern Queens at a place called Usha Foods. It's great food if you're ever looking for Indian food in Eastern Queens.
[1:17:09] Okay, on market.
[1:17:10] And I was sitting there at the table, and I was pitching him on why he should endorse our campaign. And he was both kind and also straightforward. And that's something that I think many people love about Bernie.
[1:17:23] I don't know if you recall that video of him in the New York Times editorial board.
[1:17:28] I'm not good at back slapping. I'm not good at pleasantries. If you have your birthday, I'm not going to call you up to congratulate you so you'll love me and you'll write nice things about me.
[1:17:36] He can be gruff.
[1:17:38] He's lovable in that way. Because so much of politics has just become that. And for him, politics is all about who it's for.
[1:17:49] And so in that phone call, one of the things I remember was it wasn't just enough that the vision was aligned or that it was inspired by what he had done and continues to do.
[1:18:00] He also wanted to know if we could win and how we would win. And one thing that I will never forget him asking me was, how many followers do you have?
[1:18:09] It was a reference to social media. And he was saying, if you want to be able to survive the campaign and everything that comes after it, you have to build an infrastructure that can carry your message to people.
[1:18:20] Some of his observers and also his critics say he doesn't care about electability. He cares more about ideas. But you're saying he does care about electability.
[1:18:31] I think he cares about both of them. I think he cares about what it is that you're fighting for and then that you're able to deliver it. And he has always made clear to me, it's not enough to just believe in the right thing. You have to deliver it.
[1:18:46] Bernie, Senator.
[1:18:48] I sat down with Bernie and in that conversation, this was over the summer as I was running after the primary and after we'd met in D.C.
[1:18:59] And it was in that conversation that he emphasized the importance of filling in potholes, of clearing the roads, of ensuring that your successes can be measured by working people in their day to day lives.
[1:19:13] That they are not relegated to just the land of ideas. He wants to give people a place to express themselves.
[1:19:18] And one of the things he has emphasized to me whenever we speak is how can we deliver arts and joy to people as well as material, as well as material improvements in working class people's lives.
[1:19:31] And so when we delivered $50 tickets to the World Cup, when we delivered $100 tickets to the U.S. Open, when we delivered 70,000 free tickets to the Met Opera, a lot of it is also inspired by him having said,
[1:19:43] you have to give bread and roses to people so they can not just be able to live here, but they can feel fulfilled.
[1:19:51] So this really is an echo of his mayorship. I mean, you really have looked to that for your playbook.
[1:19:57] It is a model. And I think what I so appreciate is that it's a model of success that can be measured by people.
[1:20:06] Bottom line is, which is going to fall on your shoulders if and when you win, is an enormous responsibility to show the world and people throughout this country
[1:20:17] that our value system can govern well and efficiently, that we can fight for justice, that we can create a better world for all people, not just for the 1%.
[1:20:30] We'll be right back with more of Long Game, The Bernie Sanders Effect.
[1:20:35] Some in the establishment Democratic camp are concerned that you have a big war chest also. Those numbers are impressive as well.
[1:20:52] And that you have not used enough of it to help progressive candidates.
[1:20:55] The billionaires are worried that I have not used enough of our money.
[1:20:59] But conversely, you know, on the flip side of that, I wonder if there are indications that Democrats might not be doing enough to help the progressive candidates
[1:21:08] because they're worried about what might happen if they...
[1:21:12] Well, look...
[1:21:13] I mean, everybody wants to win, but what, you know, there's a price to that.
[1:21:15] See, it's a strange moment that you're in.
[1:21:17] And I would look at it as we are in, we're in a united front right now with the Democratic establishment.
[1:21:25] Okay?
[1:21:26] They want to beat Trump.
[1:21:27] They want to take control of the Senate.
[1:21:30] They want to take control of the House.
[1:21:32] So do I.
[1:21:33] Okay?
[1:21:34] So do progressives.
[1:21:35] So we all have that same goal.
[1:21:36] And you will find the Democratic establishment, fair enough, are putting money into candidates.
[1:21:41] You know, one of the ironies of this whole thing is our candidates have to spend millions of dollars running against the establishment candidates in Michigan and Minnesota and elsewhere.
[1:21:50] Okay?
[1:21:52] But now, you know, the Democratic establishment wants to gain control over the Senate.
[1:21:56] And they are helping those candidates.
[1:21:57] Whether it's enough or not, I can't tell you exactly.
[1:21:59] Are they helping them enough?
[1:22:00] I don't know exactly, but they are helping.
[1:22:02] So I want to be...
[1:22:03] In some cases, I think, not enough.
[1:22:05] In some cases, they're doing a good job.
[1:22:07] So if the Democrats take control, there's a little bit of tension about how they should spend their time.
[1:22:11] How much time...
[1:22:12] Well, there's a lot of tension.
[1:22:13] Well, there's a lot.
[1:22:14] Okay.
[1:22:15] Let's just be real.
[1:22:16] And there always is.
[1:22:17] Following the seismic change that we've seen in our government, there's a question of how much time should you spend trying to fix what has been broken to represent, you know, working class people, to make lives better for people.
[1:22:32] And then how much time you should spend actually trying to make sure that people are held accountable.
[1:22:37] And both things are important, but there's some tension around how much time, how much energy that you...
[1:22:43] That's a very fair question.
[1:22:44] I think you posed the question quite correctly.
[1:22:46] It's not either or, it's both.
[1:22:49] Donald Trump does not believe in the Constitution or the rule of law.
[1:22:55] His administration to my mind is blatantly corrupt.
[1:22:57] The only thing you can say about him is he's blatant about it.
[1:23:00] You know, he doesn't kind of hide it.
[1:23:01] And unapologetic.
[1:23:02] And he doesn't apologize.
[1:23:03] You know, he's made billions of dollars for his family since he's been president this term.
[1:23:07] That has got to be dealt with.
[1:23:08] But it would be a tragic, tragic mistake if that is all Democrats did.
[1:23:15] As I indicated before, tens and tens of millions of people are hurting.
[1:23:21] They can't afford health care.
[1:23:22] And they're going to say, oh, you're worried about Donald Trump?
[1:23:24] That's fine.
[1:23:25] How is my kid going to get health care?
[1:23:27] But at the same time, if people aren't held accountable, that sends a message too, doesn't it?
[1:23:31] It's not either or.
[1:23:32] It is both.
[1:23:33] You're absolutely right.
[1:23:34] Trump has got to be held accountable.
[1:23:37] But, you know, we can chew bubblegum and walk at the same time.
[1:23:41] It means we have to be aggressive.
[1:23:42] It means we have to work hard.
[1:23:44] Got a lot of smart people there.
[1:23:46] Really a lot of smart people who are going to be chairing committees, who can deal with holding Trump accountable.
[1:23:51] But at the same time, you've got to improve life right now for working families.
[1:23:56] Nearly half a century after Bernie Sanders was elected mayor of Burlington, right here, his message and his movement are now at the center of the midterm elections.
[1:24:06] The playbook he's been writing his entire career, the electability of his ideas, and the candidates who share them are all facing the ultimate test on Election Day.
[1:24:16] We'll be right back.
[1:24:18] Thank you so much for joining us for Long Game, The Bernie Sanders Effect.
[1:24:30] We'll leave you with some final thoughts from Senator Sanders himself and some of the young leaders he has inspired.
[1:24:36] If I have given confidence to people to show that, hey, you know, average people can stand up, stop being so afraid.
[1:24:43] A Florida where working families can thrive.
[1:24:46] Where we have what we need like good paying jobs.
[1:24:52] Like a $25 minimum wage.
[1:24:56] Since launching this campaign forever, I have never taken a corporate PAC check and I never will.
[1:25:01] I'm tired of picking up the tab for billionaires. Are you?
[1:25:05] Working people, we are not an afterthought.
[1:25:08] We are not a backup plan.
[1:25:10] Finally meet the unmet promise of America and guarantee everybody health care through Medicare for all.
[1:25:15] I'm calling on a progressive agenda. We're saying, hey, it's common sense to push for universal childcare in our country. Common sense.
[1:25:26] Common sense.
[1:25:29] I don't take corporate PAC money or trade tax dollars for donations.
[1:25:33] And I sure as hell don't own the billionaires spending millions to try and influence this election.
[1:25:38] We are going to fight the corruption, whether it's in the White House or in the halls of Congress, because the grift has to stop.
[1:25:46] Don't be so intimidated by the establishment. That will be an important legacy.
[1:25:53] It's Rachel. I am so glad to see you at the end of that clip, because this is where I get to tell you about a new way to watch all our clips and all of our shows and everything on MSNOW on your phone or your tablet or your laptop.
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