Kristi Noem, Minneapolis Mayor Jacob Frey, more

[0:01] I'm Margaret Brennan in Washington, and this week on Face the Nation, tensions continue [0:06] to boil over in the ice-laden city of Minneapolis, while the president's pursuit of Greenland [0:12] prompts backlash from allies here and in Europe. [0:17] Despite temperatures in the low teens, protesters in support of and in opposition to ICE, as [0:24] well as agents themselves, took to the streets of Minneapolis again Saturday, as the divide [0:29] between local officials and federal ones got even wider, and America's views of President [0:34] Trump's immigration policies erode as he hits the one-year-in-office mark. [0:40] We'll talk exclusively with Homeland Security Secretary Kristi Noem and the mayor of Minneapolis, [0:46] Jacob Frey. [0:48] Then, with the volatile situation in Iran diffused for the moment, President Trump turns [0:53] to his next international target, Greenland. [0:56] As U.S. officials try to calm... [0:59] ...European allies about his plans, Mr. Trump announced new tariffs on imports from [1:04] Denmark and six other NATO members if they don't support a deal for the, quote, complete [1:10] and total purchase of Greenland. [1:12] The top Democrat on the Senate Intelligence Committee, Mark Warner, and the head of a [1:16] bipartisan congressional group supporting NATO, Republican Mike Turner, will both be [1:21] here. [1:23] It's all just ahead on Face the Nation. [1:25] Good morning, and welcome to Face the Nation. [1:44] Ten days... [1:44] ...after an ICE agent shot and killed Rene Good, the Minnesota National Guard has been [1:49] mobilized and is standing by through the weekend to potentially support local authorities in [1:53] Minneapolis. [1:54] We've also learned that 1,500 active-duty Army soldiers stationed in Fairbanks, Alaska, [1:59] are on standby for possible deployment to Minnesota in order to assist in the federal [2:05] operation. [2:06] This standoff continues as our new CBS poll shows that more than half of Americans, 53%, [2:13] say the recent events in Minneapolis... [2:14] ...make them think ICE operations in the U.S. should be decreased. [2:19] Overall, a growing number of Americans think ICE agents are being too tough when they detain [2:24] people. [2:25] Now, 6 in 10 believe that, up from 56% in November. [2:29] At the same time, 42% of Americans overall say that protests against ICE have gone too [2:36] far. [2:37] That number is sharply divided along party lines, with those who identify as independent [2:42] split just about evenly. [2:44] We go now to Castlewood, South Dakota, and Homeland Security Secretary Kristi Noem. [2:51] Good morning to you, Madam Secretary. [2:54] Good morning. [2:56] DHS calls this the largest operation in its history, nearly 3,000 federal agents out there. [3:03] Is this an open-ended deployment, or is there a metric for success that ends it? [3:10] Well, I think every day we get a murderer off the streets of Minneapolis, the public is safer. [3:14] And President Trump is keeping his promise to the American people. [3:17] And we literally have arrests. [3:19] We've arrested and detained thousands of illegal criminals in Minnesota since President [3:24] Trump came back into the White House. [3:26] And I've never met a family that ever said, oh, I wish you would have left that rapist [3:29] free. [3:30] I wish you would have left that murderer on the streets. [3:32] So we're just so thankful that we have a president that's upholding the law and is [3:36] determined to make sure that the laws are applied equally to everyone. [3:40] According to Pew, Minnesota's population of immigrants here illegally stands at 2.2%. [3:45] So how do you judge when you've gotten everyone? [3:49] Off the streets that you say is, you know, requiring your federal agents be there? [3:54] How do you say we've had mission accomplished? [3:58] Well, we won't stop until we are sure that all the dangerous people are picked up, brought to [4:04] justice, and then deported back to their home countries. [4:06] You don't have a number or a date? [4:07] We wouldn't be in this situation. [4:09] We wouldn't be in this situation if Joe Biden hadn't allowed our open border policies to be [4:14] in place and allowed up to 20 million people unvetted into this country. [4:18] We have no idea how many dangerous people are. [4:21] When you have millions of people coming in that are terrorists, suspected terrorists, [4:25] criminals, come from countries in the mass migration that the Biden administration facilitated, [4:31] I can't tell the people of Minnesota exactly how many dangerous criminals they have. [4:36] I do know that they're extremely grateful every time we get a pedophile off the street. [4:40] We arrested an individual this week that was raping children. [4:44] I think those parents in Minnesota can sleep better at night knowing that that person isn't free. [4:49] Sure. [4:49] But you just said millions. [4:51] What's the breakdown of the percentage of those who you have in custody who have actually [4:55] committed a criminal offense versus just the civil infraction? [5:00] Every single individual has committed a crime, but 70 percent of them have committed or have [5:06] charges against them on violent crimes and crimes that they are charged with or have [5:11] been convicted of that have come from other countries that are here illegally, first of all, [5:15] and then they have committed a criminal act while they've been here or in their home countries as well. [5:20] It's not 70 percent. [5:23] Yes, it is. [5:24] It absolutely is. [5:25] Seventy percent of everyone you guys keep changing your percentage. [5:29] You pick and choose what numbers you think work. [5:31] But that is the facts, is that 70 percent of the people that we have detained have charges against them or have been convicted of charges and they need to be brought to justice. [5:41] And we're going to keep doing that no matter how much you guys keep lying and don't tell the public the truth. [5:45] It absolutely is that these law enforcement officers are out there every day doing the work to protect the American people. [5:52] And they will keep doing that because they believe in enforcing. [5:54] The law, which is exactly what President Trump has charged them with. [5:59] OK, well, our reporting is that 47 percent based on your agency's own numbers, 47 percent have criminal convictions against them. [6:07] But let's talk about the other wrong again. [6:09] Absolutely. [6:09] We'll get you the correct numbers so you can use them in the future. [6:12] Well, that's from your agency. [6:13] Let's talk about our numbers here at CBS. [6:16] Fifty four percent of Americans think the ICE agent shooting of Renee Goode was not justified. [6:21] Sixty percent say the Trump administration responded to the ICE agent's actions. [6:25] And that's unfairly these numbers show you do not have the American public on your side. [6:32] Does that concern you? [6:35] Well, the facts are that this individual weaponized her car and threatened the life of the law enforcement officer and those around him. [6:43] And that is what the media needs to cover. [6:46] People understand is the truth when they have the chance to hear the facts around the case. [6:50] And this individual was impeding law enforcement operations for quite some time before this incident. [6:57] It's a tragedy that this situation has happened in this country. [7:02] And we hope there's never another situation like this before. [7:05] But this officer relied on his training to defend his life and to defend those around him. [7:11] And we're we're grateful that we're in a situation where we hope that more people don't weaponize their vehicles like this. [7:18] We're seeing it happen over and over again. [7:20] We've seen over 100 different vehicle weaponized and attacking law enforcement officers. [7:25] I would hope that Mayor Frye, when he. [7:27] He's on here, that he'll announce that he's going to start working with us to bring safety to the streets. [7:32] If he would set up a peaceful protest zone so that these individuals can exercise their First Amendment rights and do so peacefully, we would love that. [7:40] Because then we could work together to make sure we're getting criminals to justice and letting people still express their First Amendment rights. [7:47] Well, you know that it is in dispute about weaponizing a car versus driving forward. [7:52] But I'll put that aside. [7:53] It's really not. [7:54] Everybody can watch the videos and see that. [7:56] Well, let me. [7:57] Talk to you about the officer, Jonathan Ross. [7:59] He was struck. [8:00] He was hospitalized. [8:01] Don't say his name. [8:02] I mean, for heaven's sakes, we we don't we shouldn't have people continue to dox law enforcement when they have an eight thousand percent increase in death threats against them. [8:11] I know, but that doesn't mean it should continue to be said his life. [8:14] He got attacked with a car that was trying to take his life. [8:18] And then people have attacked him and his family and they are in jeopardy. [8:22] And we have law enforcement officers every day who are getting death threats and getting attacked at their homes. [8:27] And we have law enforcement officers every day who are getting death threats and getting attacked at their homes. [8:27] Well, can you tell me about his status right now? [8:29] I was thrown at them and. [8:31] Well, of course, no one condones violence against anyone. [8:34] But here, CBS reported that he did have internal bleeding in the torso, but he was released that same day. [8:40] So is he back at work? [8:41] Did you give him the required three days of suspension? [8:46] We followed the exact same protocols that we always have for years as to investigations into these situations. [8:52] Three days of administrative leave. [8:52] I'm not going to talk about his medical records. [8:54] I know that, you know, that in itself is his prerogative to discuss. [8:59] His health. [8:59] But we're we're hopeful that all of our law enforcement officers know that they can go out and do their job. [9:04] Yeah. [9:05] Apply the law equally to everyone and that they can do so safely and that the media and people aren't going to attack them for standing up for what's right. [9:13] I'm asking you about your policies. [9:15] I asked you if you had put him on administrative leave. [9:18] This is in question because the governor of Minnesota said the only person not being investigated for the shooting of Renee Good is the federal agent who shot her. [9:27] Is he correct? [9:28] That the federal agent is not being investigated in any way. [9:32] Is there any review of protocol here? [9:34] We are following the exact same investigative and review process that we always have under ICE and under the Department of Homeland Security and within the administration. [9:46] The exact same policy that the Biden administration used. [9:49] So his actions are being reviewed? [9:50] We haven't changed any of that. [9:52] I would not I would not listen to Governor Walz. [9:54] He has a very bad track record. [9:56] All this billions of dollars of fraud was stolen from people. [9:59] under his watch. He allowed it to happen. And he also ignored the law and allowed the city [10:04] of Minneapolis to burn down in 2020. He certainly isn't to have good judgment in these types of [10:10] situations. And I'm not going to be taking any advice from him and how we implement the law [10:14] and protect people. Do I understand you saying that the Office of Professional Responsibility [10:19] is doing its own probe to determine that the ICE agent violated protocol and that he was on three [10:24] days of administrative leave because that is what is in the handbook? The protocol and the advice [10:30] and the guidance within that handbook and within our policies is being followed exactly like it [10:36] has been for years. Okay. So there is some review of his actions is what I understand you saying [10:41] there. Remember, there always is. Every law enforcement officer knows that when they take [10:46] the oath to step up and to protect the public and put their lives on the line, they absolutely know [10:51] that everything that they do will be analyzed and investigated. But also what they don't, [10:57] I don't think they realized until just recently, [11:00] is how the law is being used. [11:00] In Minneapolis, there was an unprecedented fraud story going on by the liberals and the [11:04] Democrats and the media would attack them and try to ruin their lives for doing what's right. [11:08] And we're seeing in Minneapolis an unprecedented fraud history going on by elected leaders and [11:14] individuals in that state, but also criminal activity and it's being allowed to happen. [11:18] When we did these operations in other cities across the country, we didn't see this kind of [11:22] violence. We didn't see organized, funded protesters come in to conduct acts of violence [11:27] against our law enforcement officers like we're seeing in Minneapolis. [11:30] We are seeing this kind of violence happening in Minneapolis, and elected leaders and Mayor Fry is [11:34] allowing that to happen and allowing this kind of violence to happen when we didn't see it in [11:38] Louisiana, we didn't see it in Florida, we didn't see it in other cities. [11:41] We will talk to Fry about what's happening in his city. [11:42] And we shouldn't have to be watching it here in Minneapolis. [11:45] But we have heard, and I'm asking you here about the security of your agents that [11:48] you say you are concerned about, the local police chief said your agents are being forced into [11:53] situations out in Minneapolis that they're not prepared to deal with. And we looked and the [11:59] said back in 2021 most ICE agents are not trained to handle crowd control so [12:05] are you looking at expanding the training for the agents that you are [12:08] putting in this situation that you describe as dangerous out in Minneapolis [12:13] they are absolutely trained for the situations that they're put in we would [12:18] never put an officer in a situation that they would be beyond their training and [12:23] skill set and so these are highly trained individuals that are here and in [12:27] Minneapolis doing operations they are and frankly control is not an expert [12:33] absolutely they are trained to that their specialized skill set is being [12:37] utilized for where they are located and the jobs that they are doing in [12:41] Minneapolis and across other cities across the country we we do they have an [12:45] incredible amount of training that is ongoing throughout their careers you [12:49] want to expand that role in handling enforcement operations that they have do [12:54] I want to expand it based on the Minneapolis police chiefs advice some [12:57] Republic [12:57] a [12:57] I if you remember well Republican lawmakers and Democrat lawmakers they [13:05] absolutely can continue to debate that's what they're supposed to do is work on [13:09] policy and pass laws what I know is that under the Department of Homeland [13:13] Security has always been entrusted with training our federal law enforcement [13:16] officers we do it for many different agencies we train those within the ATF [13:21] the DEA we train those that are established across the country we are [13:26] the largest law enforcement operation [13:28] department in the government beyond the Department of War and we're proud of [13:32] that and we've done it with excellence for years and are continuing put the [13:35] resources and people into our law enforcement officers they need to change [13:39] and to challenge these these situations they're facing on the ground yeah but [13:43] you've described this situation as unique you've acknowledged that I want [13:47] to talk to you about some of the instance incidents that the public has [13:50] seen there was a US citizen Aaliyah Rahman on her way to a medical [13:54] appointment out in Minneapolis she was dragged out of her car and detained and [13:58] interviewed video of her arrest was spreading on social media there were [14:02] allegations there of aggressive tactics you've seen other incidents for example [14:08] out in Minneapolis this family with six children with one as young as six months [14:13] old got kind of caught in the incident as they were driving to basketball [14:19] practice the mother Destiny Jackson told CBS ICE agents stopped the car told them [14:25] to leave but the agents were in the way and they [14:28] feared [14:28] that they would have happened to them what happened to Renee good they didn't [14:33] drive off ice released a canister of tear gas and the mother described giving [14:38] her infant CPR we're showing that video there do any of these tactics seem to you [14:44] heavy-handed the family was caught up in that situation because of violent [14:51] protesters that were impeding law enforcement operations and that family would have never [14:55] been in that situation if those protesters had been acting peacefully and law enforcement was [15:00] able to do their job without being threatened and so it's a a terrible situation that that family [15:06] had to go through and I hope it never happens again but we need to remember that because the [15:11] mayor and the governor have allowed this kind of violence to be perpetuated across Minneapolis [15:15] is why there's other innocent people that are impacted throughout the city but throughout [15:21] their state as well and it doesn't have to be this way they are their laws and if Governor Walls didn't [15:30] that that what he is doing there is poor leadership he wouldn't have put his [15:34] National Guard on standby are you in order to respond and I'm hopeful that he [15:38] does recognize that he needs to start working with us I are your agents when [15:42] you know the White House has asked him to sorry with the federal order on [15:46] Friday to not use chemical agents that federal order was a little ridiculous [15:53] because that federal judge came down and told us we couldn't do what we already [15:57] aren't doing we we are we just have not any we only use those chemical agents [16:06] when there's violence happening and perpetuating and you need to be able to [16:10] establish law in order to keep people safe that's the only situation so that [16:14] judge's order didn't change anything for how we're operating on the ground [16:18] because it's basically telling us to do what we've already been doing madam [16:21] secretary thank you for your time this morning face the nation we'll be back in [16:25] a minute stay with us we're joined now by the mayor of Minneapolis mr. Jacob [16:32] Roe [16:33] Frey good morning to you mr. mayor the secretary specifically called on you to [16:40] set up a safe zone where protests would be contained is that something you're [16:45] looking at First Amendment speech is not limited to one park or one section of [16:52] the city you are allowed to protest so long as you're doing it peacefully and [16:57] by the way we've got tens of thousands of people in Minneapolis that are [17:02] grinning down the bear that are peacefully expressing their first [17:05] amendment rights so no you can't have just one section of the city that's not [17:09] the way First Amendment works I want to ask you a number of things about what's [17:14] happening in the city but I just want to get out of the way these reports that [17:18] are have been in the press since Friday that you and governor Tim Walz are under [17:24] federal investigation CBS reporting is that this is for alleged conspiracy to [17:29] impede immigration agents the Deputy Attorney General also said early this [17:34] week he's going to stop you quote open a Costco just because these weighs are termed as pig!!! [17:36] from your terrorism. Have you received any subpoena or any official notice [17:41] that you are under investigation? And, if so, for what? [17:44] JONATHAN CAPEHART, Former U.S. Secretary of State of the United States, We have not received any [17:49] official anything at this point. And so I can't comment on what I don't know about. [17:57] That being said, this whole dynamic is deeply concerning, because, supposedly, [18:03] they would be coming for me and targeting me for something that is core and critical to [18:10] my job as mayor, and that is speaking for my residents and my constituents, [18:15] that we are at a place right now where the Department of Justice or the federal government [18:19] could be coming after senators and governors and mayors simply for speaking for their respective [18:26] constituencies and disagreeing with this federal administration. [18:29] I mean, this kind of thing happens in other countries. This cannot happen in America. [18:33] LISA DESJARDINS, Well, our reporting is, it's impeding immigration agents. [18:37] But the specifics of that, [18:39] we would love to see. [18:40] LISA DESJARDINS, We would love to see some paperwork on from the administration. [18:44] In terms of what's happening in your city, the Minnesota National Guard was mobilized [18:48] Saturday by the state, which the police chief supported as potential support for [18:53] his local law enforcement. They have not been deployed. [18:57] Do you think your city needs them? And how would you describe the protests this weekend? [19:01] JONATHAN CAPEHART, Former U.S. Secretary of State of the United States, We are doing the work [19:06] to keep people safe in our city. And, specifically, it is our local police officers. It is the state of [19:13] Minnesota and our governor. We are doing everything possible to keep the peace, [19:18] notwithstanding this occupying force that has quite literally invaded our city. [19:24] I mean, we have got 600 cops in the city of Minneapolis, and we're talking about [19:28] 3,000-plus ICE agents and border control that have come in. They're not making our city safer. [19:34] In fact, our city has been safe. Crime is down in virtually every category and virtually [19:40] every neighborhood of the city. [19:42] LISA DESJARDINS, Well, you said, oh, I'm safe. I'm safe. I'm safe. I'm safe. I'm safe. I'm safe. [19:43] You said occupying force. Don't you think that's a bit much? [19:47] JONATHAN CAPEHART, Former U.S. Secretary of State of the United States, I mean, look, [19:51] you can go through whatever rhetorical flourish you want, but when you have 3,000 ICE agents and [19:59] border control come to the city, when you have got this supposed threat of 1,500 military coming to [20:07] the city, yes, that's very much what it feels like. When you outnumber local police officers [20:13] five and six to one, that is the vibe. And so the bottom line is, if the goal were safety, [20:22] this is not how you get there. If the goal is safety, I can give you a very [20:25] antidote to some of the violence that we're seeing. It's have them leave. [20:28] LISA DESJARDINS Well, they argue, [20:30] the administration, that is, that this is a sanctuary county and a sanctuary city, [20:36] and they are enforcing federal immigration law and that, therefore, this is called for, that they're [20:43] cleaning up a mess that the last administration created. I mean, is how do you prescribe in this [20:50] unprecedented situation for local and federal officials to work together here? [20:55] JONATHAN CAPEHART We have worked together. We do work together when this is about getting [21:02] murderers and rapists and all the other bad stuff that Kristi Noem just said off the street. [21:09] We have worked with the DEA and the FBI. We have worked with the ATF and the U.S. [21:13] attorney's office to drive down crime, get violent criminals off the street. [21:17] And on the North Side, shootings are the lowest that they have ever been, [21:21] I believe, on record. And so nobody's against that. But that is not this. This is not about safety. [21:30] What this is about is coming into our city by the thousands and terrorizing people simply because [21:35] they're Latino or Somali. And, yes, people in Minneapolis are speaking up. They're speaking up [21:40] peacefully. They're standing up for their neighbors. And this is not just about resisting [21:44] Trump. This is about loving and caring for the people [21:47] that call this city home. And it's been inspiring. [21:50] LISA DESJARDINS Well, on the ICE actions themselves, your attorney general out in [21:55] Minnesota, Keith Ellison, has asked Minnesotans to gather information about federal actions and [22:00] post them on his Web site. What's the intent of those incident reports? [22:05] And I understand, in theory, what this is. But if you are saying that it is not safe for [22:14] civilians to be inserting themselves in enforcement operations or even surrounding [22:18] enforcement operations, aren't you asking them to do something that is endangering them? [22:22] KEITH ELLISON No, civilians should not be involved in enforcement operations. [22:30] Taking a cell phone out and videotaping what's going on is not enforcement. That's transparency. [22:38] Sunlight can be the best disinfectant. And, in this case, yes, they're disinfecting some of the [22:44] really horrible things that are taking place on our street, because, to the extent that ICE agents are [22:50] doing things that are unconstitutional, and, by the way, they are, this is their opportunity to [22:55] make sure that it is seen, that it is judged, and that we get our day in court. They do. [22:59] LISA DESJARDINS Well, I think the whole country is hoping for stability and peace and security. [23:06] Mr. Mayor, thank you very much. We'll be right back. [23:16] Welcome back to Face the Nation. For more from our new CBS poll, we're joined now by our [23:21] executive director of elections and surveys, Anthony Salvato. Anthony, a lot of focus on [23:27] immigration here this morning. Anthony? [23:28] ANTHONY SAVATO Thank you for having me on here this morning. That issue, the mass deportation [23:33] election promise from President Trump, it used to really be a winning one for him. [23:38] He began the term with majority support. He's now down to 46 percent approval. What accounts [23:44] for that drop? ANTHONY SAVATO So, for the program, [23:46] it's about the who and the how that's driving views of it. And here's what I mean. The who. Who do [23:51] people think the administration is targeting for deportation? It used to be more people thought it [23:56] was just dangerous crime. ANTHONY SAVATO [23:58] Right. ANTHONY SAVATO Now it's more people who think it's expanded beyond that. That goes with [24:01] more disapproval of the program. Then the how. When I ask people, what do you think of the ICE [24:06] operations, the tactics that you see? Are they about right? No. More people now say they think [24:12] they're too tough. That goes with more disapproval. A couple of important points, though. Number one, [24:17] Republicans remain very strongly supportive of this program. And Republicans stand out by saying [24:28] they've gone too far. So there's that dynamic, too. But sum it up this way. Difference between the [24:33] perceived goals and the approach. The goals divide the country. They're more mixed. But the approach, [24:40] it gets more negative ratings. Goals versus approach. [24:43] So we've also seen the president very active abroad in this first year of his presidency, [24:49] from Iran, potentially, to Greenland. Americans seem to say Trump's policies are going to decrease [24:58] instability in the world. That's what you found. What's behind it? [25:01] So underneath that, a couple of things. Start with Greenland, right? The notion of [25:05] using military force to take Greenland gets wide and bipartisan opposition. The notion of buying [25:11] Greenland also gets opposition, gets disapproval. But it's the why here. What are the implications [25:18] of it? You follow that up. Yeah, some Americans say it might give the U.S. access to resources it [25:23] needs. But the larger implications that the U.S. might leave NATO, that there might, [25:28] as you mentioned, less peace and stability in the world, those things underpin those views. [25:33] Iran, a little bit different here. Still majority opposition to the idea of taking military action [25:39] to support the protests there. But it's the why. You do see a sizable number saying the U.S. might [25:45] have a moral responsibility to do it, certainly to have strategic interests in the region, but also a [25:51] majority saying they don't think the U.S. has effective plans for what to do about it. And [25:56] that's important. Any time people evaluate the U.S. and the U.S. and the U.S. and the U.S. and the [25:56] U.S. and the U.S. and the U.S. and the U.S. and the U.S. and the U.S. and the U.S. and the U.S. and the U.S. and [25:57] the U.S. and the U.S. and the U.S. and the U.S. and the U.S. and the U.S. and any time people [25:57] evaluate foreign policy, they want to see the plan. They want to see that laid out. And until [26:02] they get that, you might see that majority disapproval. [26:06] And when you've been here throughout the past year, you have just emphasized, [26:11] even with the last president, it's the economy, the economy, the economy. That's [26:15] what Americans are really judging performance by. [26:17] I have, because that's what Americans keep telling us is very important. Really [26:21] specifically, it's about prices. And this is not new. This has been not just this year, [26:26] but it's been going back. [26:27] Right. [26:27] TO THE PANDEMIC REALLY PEOPLE ARE STILL TRYING TO ADJUST TO A WORLD IN WHICH THEY HAVE THESE [26:33] REALLY HIGH PRICES WHAT THEY'RE REALLY CONCERNED WHEN THEY SAY THEY WANT THE ADMINISTRATION TO [26:38] FOCUS ON LOWERING PRICES MORE AND A MAJORITY HAS CONSISTENTLY SAID THAT THEY DO THEY'RE TALKING [26:44] ABOUT BUYING POWER SO I ASK THEM IS YOUR INCOME KEEPING UP WITH INFLATION AND BIG MAJORITIES SAY [26:50] NO IT'S NOT THAT'S BEEN CONSISTENT ACROSS ARE THEY LOOKING FOR PRICES TO GO DOWN YES THEY'RE [26:55] LOOKING SYSTEM YOU KNOW SYSTEMATICALLY FOR DEFLATION NOT NECESSARILY BUT IT'S THAT BUYING [27:00] POWER THAT UNDERPINS ALL THAT PRICES ARE THE WAY THAT PEOPLE EVALUATE THE ECONOMY [27:05] ALWAYS RIGHT IT IS AN ELECTION YEAR AS YOU KNOW AND IN THE MIDTERMS PEOPLE JUDGE OFTEN [27:11] THE PARTY BY ITS PRESIDENT BUT WHAT ARE YOU HEARING WHEN IT COMES TO DEMOCRATS [27:16] COUPLE THINGS FOR DEMOCRATS COUPLE OF CHALLENGES IF YOU WILL FIRST DOES THEIR PARTY CONVINCE ITS [27:20] VOTERS THAT THEY HAVE AN EFFECTIVE WAY TO CHALLENGE DONALD TRUMP WHICH THEIR VOTERS WANT THEM TO DO [27:25] RIGHT [27:25] NOW AND INCREASINGLY THOSE VOTERS SAY NO THEY DON'T THINK THEIR PARTY HAS AN EFFECTIVE WAY [27:30] THE SECOND PART OF IT IS JUST IN TERMS OF APPROACH DO THEY NEED TO ALTER OFFER A COMPELLING [27:36] ALTERNATIVE TO THE PRESIDENT RIGHT NOW YOU ASK WHO HAS A BETTER APPROACH DONALD TRUMP AND THE [27:41] REPUBLICANS STILL LEAD THE DEMOCRATS ON THE ECONOMY AND ON IMMIGRATION SO GOING THROUGH [27:48] THE CAMPAIGN IS IT GOING TO BE ENOUGH TO JUST SAY WE'RE NOT DONALD TRUMP OR DO THEY NEED THAT [27:52] ALTERNATIVE IT LOOKS LIKE PEOPLE ARE SAYING THEY'RE LOOKING FOR THAT [27:55] COMPELLING ALTERNATIVE SOMETHING WE WILL ASK OUR DEMOCRATIC GUESTS THANK YOU VERY MUCH [28:00] ANTHONY SALVANTO THANK YOU WE'LL BE RIGHT BACK WE GO NOW TO THE TOP DEMOCRAT ON THE SENATE [28:08] INTELLIGENCE COMMITTEE MARK WARNER WHO JOINS US THIS MORNING FROM VIRGINIA SENATOR WE HAVE [28:15] HAD SOME EXTRAORDINARY NEWS THIS WEEK ON THE NATIONAL SECURITY FRONT TWO OF AMERICA'S [28:21] CLOSEST ALLIES NATO AND CANADA CANADA SIGNED A TRADE DEAL WITH CHINA THE PRIME MINISTER [28:29] SIGNED A TRADE DEAL WITH CHINA THE PRIME MINISTER SIGNED A TRADE DEAL WITH CHINA THE [28:29] PRESIDENT OF CANADA MARK KANE에 SAID THE U.S. IS UNDER CUT EVENING THE INTERNATIONAL [28:33] WORLD ORDER IN THE PAST 24 HOURS PRESIDENT TRUMP SEEMED TO START A TRADE WAR WITH OUR [28:40] CLOSEST TO ITS ALLY SAYING HE IS PUT TERRITORIES ON THE U.K. FRANCE DENMARK UNTIL THEY [28:44] AGREED TO HAND OVER GREENLAND WILL THERE BE NOW ANY CHECKS AND BALANCES FROM CONGRESS WHEN IT [28:51] COMES TO THE PRESIDENTS USE OF TARIFFS IN THIS WAY WELL MARGARET THAT'S THE QUESTION OF THE [28:59] HOUR I WOULD HOPE SO [29:02] We thought when the president took on the independence of the Federal Reserve, Congress [29:06] might stand up. [29:08] We thought when the president sent 20 percent of our fleet down off the coast of Venezuela, [29:13] Congress might stand up. [29:14] We would get a... [29:15] We got a vote on the War Powers Act, then the administration rolled back the Republican [29:19] votes. [29:20] Now the question is, when the president is taking on potentially a new tariff war with [29:27] our NATO partners, with threatening Greenland, will my Republican friends, beyond saying [29:34] quietly to me, Mark, this is crazy, will they say that publicly and stand up against a president [29:40] that has brought chaos to the international order and, got to tell you, is not making [29:45] Americans safer when you threaten, for example, the security of NATO, the most successful [29:52] alliance in modern history? [29:54] The only country that is, frankly, benefitting? [29:57] The most from this chaos are both Russia and China. [30:00] And I'm going to get to some of that in detail with Congressman Mike Turner shortly. [30:05] But just on this point, there is an effort by some Republicans, Lisa Murkowski is one [30:10] of them. [30:11] She and Jeanne Shaheen are working on a bipartisan bill called the NATO Unity Protection Act [30:15] to prohibit the use of federal funds to blockade, occupy, annex, conduct military operations [30:23] against or assert control over the territory of a NATO. [30:27] That is extraordinary that that is being put forward as a bill. [30:32] Would you vote for it? [30:33] Of course I would. [30:36] But remember... [30:37] But will it ever see the light of day? [30:39] ...the only security threat... [30:41] I don't know. [30:42] But let's be clear about this. [30:44] There currently, and as vice chair of the Intel Committee, I am very familiar with what's [30:48] going on. [30:49] There is no current security threat from Russia or China to Greenland. [30:53] The only security threat to Greenland right now is the United States. [30:57] I've been in touch with the bipartisan delegation. [31:00] We've met with the Danes, who are over there now. [31:03] The Danish people, frankly, are flipping out that their longest ally, America, is now threatening [31:10] to invade part of their territory. [31:12] Those other countries that Trump is now threatening with additional tariffs, remember the European [31:17] Union has already got a 15 percent tariff, the French, the Germans, the Norwegians have [31:22] all put small numbers of troops in Greenland to help protect it, but also send a signal [31:29] that... [31:30] ...they're attacking our closest allies. [31:32] And I would also point out, you know, America used to have 17 military bases in Greenland. [31:38] We decided we didn't need them all. [31:40] We're down to one military base, and on that base, there are more Danish partners on the [31:45] base than American military. [31:47] The Danes have made very clear that, if we want more military bases, if we want more [31:52] ability to extract critical minerals, they would welcome that, but it ought to be done [31:57] in partnership, and it ought to be done with the NATO allies. [31:59] And I just point out, Margaret, when we... [32:03] These are all tied together. [32:04] This craziness around NATO weakens our ability to have the world rally against the Iranian [32:10] regime right now, which has been brutal to its people. [32:14] One of the reasons the president couldn't take military action against the Iranians [32:19] was because the aircraft carrier that would normally be there to prevent, to help our [32:25] forces, was off the coast of Venezuela. [32:28] Yeah. [32:29] All of this international chaos ties itself together, making America less safe. [32:34] And when you see the Canadian prime minister, in effect, saying, you know, China may be [32:38] a more dependable partner, if that doesn't bring us all back, I'm not sure what would. [32:44] Well, the president is moving, on the Iran front, is moving an aircraft carrier [32:48] from the Pacific to CENTCOM, to that Mideast region where there hasn't been an aircraft [32:54] carrier. [32:55] He also told Politico Saturday, it's time to look for new leads. [32:59] It's time to look for new leaders. [33:00] It's time to look for new leaders. [33:01] And so, we have a new leader, a new leadership in Iran that doesn't kill people by the thousands [33:02] in order to keep it under control. [33:05] It was reported that the head of the Mossad, David Barnea, was down in Miami meeting with [33:11] Steve Witkoff. [33:12] Do you know the focus of those meetings? [33:14] Is the United States working with Israel on a plan for what happens next in Iran? [33:18] I can't talk about anything specific, but what is in the public domain is that Israel, [33:25] as well as all of our allies in that region, were concerned about a strike in terms of [33:29] Iranian... [33:31] ...reprisals, and the fact that we don't have all of our forces there, because part [33:35] of our forces are off the coast of Venezuela, make us less of a threat. [33:42] And there is a real question. [33:43] What would you bomb? [33:45] And is there a chance that that kind of kinetic action might make more support for the regime [33:50] a rally around the flag? [33:52] That doesn't mean that we couldn't be doing more cyber. [33:54] It doesn't mean... [33:55] And I say I have got a lot of concerns with Elon Musk, but his Starlink operations are [33:59] brilliant. [34:00] We should be able to get more Starlink. [34:01] We should be able to get more Starlink into Iran, so the Iranian people can get reconnected [34:05] to the Internet. [34:07] And our ability, for example, in a normal course, we would be rallying all of our NATO [34:13] allies to also put pressure, because they have relations with Iran. [34:17] But most of our NATO allies are concerned about Americans' potential military action [34:21] in Greenland and the threat of additional tariffs. [34:24] So the ability for America to bring a concerted worldwide confrontation to this awful Iranian [34:29] regime. [34:30] And the Iranian people are extraordinarily brave to stand up. [34:34] We need to do more. [34:36] But some of our options are limited because of the chaotic approach the president is taking [34:40] around the whole world. [34:41] JUDY WOODRUFF Well, let me ask you about Venezuela, because [34:43] you are chair or ranking member on the Intelligence Committee. [34:48] The CIA director, John Ratcliffe, was down in Caracas on Thursday to meet with the interim [34:52] president, Delcy Rodriguez. [34:54] A U.S. official described it as intending to improve the relationship between the two [34:58] countries. [34:59] JUDY WOODRUFF. [35:00] So, are you comfortable with the administration's plan and what the director has explained to [35:04] you is the intention to basically coerce them into compliance? [35:09] JOHN RATCLIFFE. [35:12] Well, let's look. [35:13] What the American military did in Venezuela was extraordinary. [35:16] Nobody else could do that. [35:19] And the president's goal, which he's made clear, was mostly about oil, not about the [35:22] Venezuelan people. [35:24] It will take years for the Venezuelan oil fields to get up, back operating, to anything [35:30] close to efficiency. [35:31] Maduro was awful on that. [35:32] JUDY WOODRUFF. [35:33] But our ability to strangle off and keep the chokehold on the Venezuelan regime [35:38] keeps that fleet blockading Venezuela. Are we going to keep that fleet, 20 percent of our fleet, [35:45] off the coast of Venezuela for the next three years? [35:48] I think it's like 14 percent now. Have you asked the administration that? [35:53] We have asked, and we have not gotten a response on how long the fleet will be there. [35:57] And one thing that I would also point out, and let me be clear, the Biden administration [36:03] screwed up in 2024 when the Venezuelan people voted overwhelmingly to throw out Maduro, [36:08] and we didn't push him out. But to suddenly say to the leader, Machado, who was leader of the [36:15] Venezuelan opposition, who got the Nobel Prize, I mean, does President Trump not realize he looks [36:20] kind of silly taking that prize from her as she tries to basically suck up to him? And the fact [36:27] is, what she has said, and again, publicly, is that, yes, you got rid of Maduro, but the same [36:32] people who killed him, who killed him, who killed him, who killed him, who killed him, [36:33] who killed him, who killed him, who killed him, who killed him, who killed him, who killed him, [36:33] tortured and imprisoned the Venezuelan opposition, are still in control of the regime. [36:39] Where does that lead the Venezuelan people? And where does that lead us to a better relationship, [36:43] frankly, a partnering relationship with Central and South America, and not a colonial relationship, [36:48] which is, again, to seem what the president seems to be intending. [36:51] All right. Senator Warner, a world of problems to talk to you on that front, [36:56] but I got to leave it there. Thank you for your time today. We'll be back in a moment. [36:59] We're joined now by Ohio Republican Congressman Mike Turner. He is the [37:07] head of the U.S. delegation to NATO's Parliamentary Assembly. Congressman Turner, [37:12] I imagine that many of those NATO partners are calling you right now and saying, [37:16] what is the president doing with this threat of escalating tariffs against us unless we hand over [37:21] Greenland? What are you saying to them? Margaret, as you know, this Greenland in [37:27] the United States and America is not a new issue. I mean, this five times United States... [37:31] Threatening to invade it is a new issue. [37:32] Right. It certainly is a new issue. You know, five times the United States has, [37:37] had a discussion about Greenland all the way back to the 1800s, four times in the 1900s. And [37:43] the president's raised it twice. We have a 1951 defense agreement with respect to a presence that [37:49] we have a military presence there. The president's not wrong if there's a national security issue with [37:55] respect to Greenland. Senator Warner said there was no direct threat other than from the United [37:59] States. But there are national security issues there. Generally in the Arctic. [38:03] In the Arctic itself and with respect to Greenland. [38:07] There certainly is no authority that the president has to use military force to seize [38:14] territory from a NATO country. And certainly this is problematic that the president has made [38:21] this statement and has caused, you know, tension among the alliance. And there certainly is going [38:27] to be, you know, continuation of a discussion among all of our allies as to what does this [38:33] mean? And, you know, certainly people need to have, you know, some understanding of what are [38:37] the basic principles. And America still is for democracy. America still is for self-determination [38:43] of people, for sovereignty of other nations. And that's certainly our basic principles and values. [38:50] And certainly I think this does put at risk. We're seeing from our allies their response. [38:55] They're very concerned about Trump's response in this. It's putting at risk, I think, Trump's peace [39:01] principles with respect to Gaza, with respect to Ukraine and Russia, his leadership among our [39:07] allies. And he needs our allies for being a base for his ability to rally. And certainly, you know, [39:14] one of his principles of trade and his ability to, you know, help our economy, it's put at risk his EU [39:21] negotiations. He had a monumental deal with the EU where he's going to go to zero tariffs with the [39:30] EU. That's at risk. So certainly, you know, people are concerned. He has prospectively said that he [39:37] is going to impose these tariffs. So there is, I think, this period of time where there will be a [39:42] dialogue and discussion. Well, there was this past week, there was a diplomatic meeting and the outcome [39:46] afterwards was the president put this tweet up saying he's putting in the tariffs. So it didn't [39:51] seem the diplomacy actually went anywhere. Well, and I think there will certainly be a discussion. [39:55] Certainly the American public are, I think, are questioning. Yeah, well, you saw our poll. He [40:01] shared it with you. 70% of Americans disapprove of using funds to buy Greenland. 86% disapprove of [40:06] him using military force to take it. [40:07] How do you justify and explain his strategy when both our allies and Americans say no? [40:13] I think people would prefer a focus on the economy instead of a focus on Greenland itself. I think [40:19] certainly in Congress, you know, we're looking at trying to make certain we get the budget deal [40:24] through and we don't have a shutdown. And, you know, as we look to the president's proposal on [40:29] national security, we look at his proposal on, you know, increasing our defense budget. And that's [40:35] how, you know, we certainly want to. Is it legal for him to [40:37] even try to use tariffs in this way? I mean, Congress could claw back this authority if you [40:42] wanted to put a check on him. Well, Article 1, Section 8 does reserve to Congress international [40:47] trade and the International Emergency Economic Powers Act on a very limited basis delegates to [40:55] the president the ability to do some sanctions. And currently before the Supreme Court, there is [41:02] this issue as to whether or not he even has the authority to do tariffs at all. Now, depending upon [41:08] the rules, they may find he doesn't even have tariff authority. But even if he is found to have [41:13] tariff authority, I don't believe he has the ability to impose tariffs for the purposes of [41:18] compelling other nations to sell the United States land for the person for the purposes of us expanding. [41:24] Now, in this issue, Republicans are with you on that. Well, you know, [41:29] Speaker Johnson was in the United Kingdom telling everyone that the president's just playing chess [41:33] here. Well, you know, you're taking him seriously. And if you are, then what do you do? [41:38] There certainly are national security issues. The president having identified us with respect to [41:42] the fact of this is the Golden Dome and that there are locations that are going to be necessary with [41:47] respect to the operations of Golden Dome is absolutely an essential issue. And the Golden [41:51] Dome is going to be very, very important. We have other locations that are essential, [41:55] critical infrastructure overall, where that we don't own. And I think certainly Greenland and [42:03] the Greenlanders need to, you know, decide their future and their outcome. I think this is more of [42:08] an issue of asking them to join us as opposed to art of the deal. [42:12] But we already have the ability to do a lot. And what's so baffling to European allies, [42:16] and I know you've heard this from them as well, they sent those troops to Greenland to show that [42:21] they will defend Greenland against those threats. And yet the president interpreted that not as help [42:26] from our NATO allies, but as a threat from our NATO allies. Does he understand how NATO works? [42:32] And that is certainly, I think, you know, and when you look at the fact that, you know, of the allies, [42:39] that he's talking about putting a tariff on, seven of them are F-35 partners, three of them, [42:43] we have U.S. nuclear weapons on their soil, and five of them, we have permanent troops on their [42:48] soil. These are not just casual allies. These are very strong allies. And this is, if we're talking [42:55] about Greenland, you know, this is not art of the deal. This is more the dating game. I mean, [42:59] we need to be more on, you know, how we would be a partner, not more how we would be compulsory. [43:06] And this certainly isn't the type of language, [43:09] that someone should be using and trying to ask someone to join you in a partnership. [43:14] Well, so all those technical points I take, but you also look at this from the other lens, [43:23] which is Senator Murkowski said that this is creating a dynamic that benefits Vladimir Putin [43:28] by threatening the stability of the strongest coalition of democracies the world has ever seen, [43:34] even without doing anything other than a tweet. [43:37] Well, the other thing that is concerning to me is this, [43:40] we're not in Germany just to- Doesn't it benefit Russia here? [43:43] And also, we're not just in Germany to defend the NATO alliance. We're in Germany to defend Israel [43:48] and Africa and the Middle East. Our worldwide footprint is our worldwide power. I mean, [43:54] the presidency's authority, his ability to project power is our NATO alliance, [44:00] the strongest alliance in the world. To threaten the NATO alliance to say, well, we'll just pack [44:05] up and go home means that the United States doesn't have the ability to project power. The [44:11] United States president to do things to benefit anyone around the world is to be around the world. [44:18] It means to be able to have partners, means to be able to do operations. Almost every operation [44:24] that this president has done over the past year has in part been done out of and with and including [44:30] the bases that we have in Europe and in NATO. But the treasury secretary said in another [44:35] network, the president believes enhanced security is not possible without Greenland [44:38] being part of the United States. They're being very [44:41] clear. And I truly believe that the president can continue the issue of engagement, [44:49] but presidential want doesn't translate into presidential authority. [44:53] We will leave it there. Congressman Turner, thank you for your time today. We'll be right back. [44:58] That's it for us today. Thank you all for watching. Until next week, [45:06] for Face the Nation, I'm Margaret Brennan.