Full Interview: World Food Programme Executive Director Cindy McCain

[0:00] we turn now to the executive director of the united nations world food program cindy mccain [0:05] who joins us from rome welcome back to face the nation thank you well executive director [0:13] you have so much work on your plate given the data shows a record high number of people seeking [0:20] urgent food and livelihood assistance we're just five months in to 2026 what's the trajectory we're [0:28] on right now it's not very good clearly because of the the large amount of people number one that are [0:37] are food insecure our ability to feed and feed at scale is not too good because we right this year [0:44] have only received half of the money that we need to be able to feed the amount of people we [0:49] we are looking at right now half of the money you need is that because of the u.s cuts or a global [0:55] pullback in helping feed the hungry it's both it's u.s and the global pullback it's not one country [1:03] by any stretch but it's collectively everybody how do you explain that well some of the countries have [1:11] begun looking internally and and their constituents are asking for less money for foreign aid and more [1:19] money for for domestic uses and i certainly understand that but what but with what we are [1:26] have looked at and what we are looking at now with regards to not just hunger but but we're looking [1:31] at several more famines by the way so that would be we've already had two which is unprecedented we [1:37] had two more you see what we've got uh so we really need countries and private sector as well as [1:44] private uh not just private sector but also corporations etc uh to to step up and to some degree [1:51] they are we've had a great deal more involvement with our private sector and our corporations but [1:56] we have it's going to collectively take all of us to be able to fix this i want to come back to this in [2:01] the moment but let's talk about where the need is right now there is this emergency response to ebola in [2:08] the congo that's a country that's already struggling as i understand it with about 27 million food insecure [2:15] people um i know the u.s state department is pledging some help here but but what are you hearing about [2:22] the situation on the ground for emergency responders like yours well clearly we are a large part of the [2:29] emergency response there and it is a group as you know the who's in there we're in there uh several [2:36] several other ngos etc it's not good and this is it's it's uh hitting people in a mass way and there's [2:46] really no no way to know right now how many people have been affected by this we know that it's it's [2:52] a rampage now with it so what what we need to do is not only be able to get in we we run logistics we [2:59] bring in supplies we bring in people um and we and we do much more than that as well just in the region [3:05] uh but this is going to take a real world effort this is very deadly you said there's a rampage of [3:12] ebola i mean are you are you able to keep your workers on the ground our workers are on the ground [3:20] but my one of my big projects my the reason a large reason of what we planned today was taking care of [3:27] our own people the duty of care and that comes into play because right now there's no adequate facility [3:33] set up to handle that and so we're looking uh you obviously putting together a task force and a team [3:40] that will do just that to make sure that we're protected as well as of course anyone that is from [3:45] wfp there was also the conflict in sudan that broke out while you were in this role as executive [3:52] director and i know it's required a lot of your attention the u.n says it's the world's worst [3:58] humanitarian crisis is there any movement forward is there any progress well we're seeing a little bit [4:09] of progress and mind you little means really little but a little bit of progress uh towards darfur [4:15] we're able to set up uh kind of moving more of our people on into the sudan side rather than staging [4:22] out of chad but it's still extremely difficult because on any given day one of the factions may get [4:29] involved and stop us from moving at all and getting any food in uh at at any time but i am also a big [4:37] believer that uh that eventually this will be solved and more importantly i believe in the good [4:43] faith of of the people that that we serve and that they will will somehow survive this but also [4:51] uh remember that people do care about them and that's kind of where when i saw them i've been in [4:58] sudan what i what i witnessed were people that thought had no hope and people do care and i i always [5:04] reiterate that when i go well you have been in this role at a time when there are so many hot spots so [5:12] many conflicts and of course the mid east continues to be a big challenge i understand that you still [5:20] do have some operations inside of iran as you know there isn't a free press on the ground able to [5:26] document what's happening what can you tell us about how civilians there are doing well we have a very [5:35] small team as you just mentioned and we are getting some intel out of there obviously because we do have [5:41] a team not only to listen to but to protect as well things aren't good i mean let's face it when you shut [5:48] the straits of war moves and you've got bombings on both sides all the way up and down uh people are [5:53] going to kind of not only become food insecure they're going to starve it's time to end this and make sure [6:00] that we can open the straits of war moves because it's affecting everybody and it will take us months [6:05] to get back on track when they do open it months to get back on track why is that because the ships [6:11] with the food are stuck or because of the food prices why prices uh availability uh a movement uh good [6:20] example is that we we do work in afghanistan and before what would usually take us three weeks maybe to [6:28] get the food in from where it comes in from now it takes us almost three months and so so in the but [6:35] in the meantime women and children which are always the first to be hit uh are starving and so this is [6:41] the case with all of them and when you talk about fertilizer when you talk about seeds of course and other [6:47] things they're they're being moved around that helps stave off hunger it's a real problem uh so we're [6:53] looking for very hopeful that these peace talks will will happen and that we can open the straits [6:59] beyond iran uh israel has stepped up its campaign against hezbollah in lebanon and i know there's [7:05] a large number of refugees there in gaza there have been all these ceasefire violations hundreds of [7:11] palestinians killed since the ceasefire was announced hamas the armed groups they have not disarmed [7:17] like they were supposed to uh israeli troops are still there bigger picture when you look at the [7:25] destruction in the middle east just within the past few years how do you describe to an american [7:32] at home what the longer term impact is well the longer term impact to put it very bluntly is not [7:41] good uh you know we staved off hunger in gaza when it was finally the ceasefire held and we were able to [7:48] get trucks in at scale we're back to where we were we can't get trucks in at scale people are you know [7:54] you know as you know there's bombings there's all those things and we're looking at a not just a [7:59] serious situation we're looking at possibly losing a generation of children uh so in any of these [8:06] countries where there's an issue lebanon uh gaza syria sudan you know all the ones that i've been to [8:12] plus ukraine um it it it access and being able to get in at scale is most important and make sure [8:20] making sure that our humanitarian workers are not targets and that we respect humanitarian law and [8:28] that simply isn't happening right now it's very dangerous to be an aid worker right now what do you [8:33] mean losing a generation of children well when you when you talk about kids that are not either not [8:39] getting enough food or what they're getting is not nutritious enough and plus there's no schools [8:44] open and there's no uh you know proper housing clean water etc medicine etc uh that that spells disaster [8:52] for a child especially and so i'm a obviously a one that has as a mother first and a grandmother six [9:00] times over and so i see it through my mother's eyes i you know it you will do anything to feed your [9:07] children anything as a parent and the fact that that can't it's not happening in so many of these [9:13] areas now is really alarming and very desperate i've heard you say feed them now or fight them [9:20] later you draw a direct connection to national security and radicalization yes no you're absolutely [9:27] right uh we believe that because when folks who are hungry can't get adequate nutrition or food [9:36] they will turn to the bad guys because food's offered there so it turns you see if you see what [9:42] i'm saying it makes it very difficult for people to turn that down if they're trying to find feed their [9:47] families and then in the meantime we have a growing number of of a lot of these factions around the [9:53] world as a result of it i want to come back to something you said about aid workers according to the [9:59] u.n there have been over 1 000 aid workers killed over the past three years and i know you've been [10:04] calling on global leaders to enforce humanitarian law you've said it's never been harder to work in [10:11] this field why do you think that is is it because there are just a growing number of conflicts is there just [10:19] no regard anymore for international law i think it's a perfect storm of all of it to be honest with you [10:27] uh people aren't caring uh factions aren't caring uh they're the the inability for us to to move in [10:35] move in at scale etc all the things they're being being that we've talked about and when you when you [10:41] talk about conflict that's what's happening uh it's we we have issues with climate change we have issues [10:48] with weather etc but the biggest the biggest problem in all this are is conflict and ceasefire [10:55] uh allowing complete unfettered access and most importantly a full respect for humanitarian law [11:03] and humanitarian aid workers and that simply isn't happening at all right now we had as you know as [11:09] you may have seen we had a convoy attacked last week and then we had our our warehouse blown up and [11:16] and this these were both in ukraine i did see that um a drone hit a truck and russia hit a warehouse with [11:23] a missile right in another day in this with another a missile which you target right so it suggests [11:29] deliberateness um in another day and age the united states would have loudly condemned it i didn't hear [11:36] that happen well i'm hoping that they will uh you know i have i have to believe in the good faith of [11:43] the american people and i i'm hoping that they will stand up for what's right and for the people who [11:49] cannot help themselves uh but in the meantime we're doing the very best we can our warehouses and our [11:55] trucks are highly visible in terms of you know it's a wp warehouse you know it's a wp truck so you're [12:02] you're correct we believe they were targeted and we don't know the consequence yet for russia and having [12:08] done that um no i i was reading something that you said and i want to come back to it because i think it's [12:17] a pretty big statement you you recently were asked about um the conservative movement and that within [12:24] the conservative movement aid you said has become a dirty word and being a humanitarian useless um you're [12:34] a lifelong conservative um when when you describe things going this direction that has to be hard to [12:42] stomach why do you think this is happening and do you think it is temporary i i i will say this um [12:52] obviously that was uh that was frustration speaking to a great degree um i believe there are many many [12:59] many good people in the united states are more than willing to help this cause or help you know whatever [13:05] whatever they see fit to do for all of this but we need more of it and we need we need actionable items [13:12] from not just the united states but other countries around the globe that will stand up also and help [13:17] us we can't do this alone and we're we're hoping as you know the united states is our largest donor and [13:24] we're very proud of that but we need everybody involved in this but you don't see china or russia [13:30] stepping up or the european power stepping up no but but uh again i'm also a big believer in the good [13:39] good nature of people and i'm hopefully i can eventually put myself out of business [13:45] america though has changed its policy towards aid the trump administration uses that phrase phrase trade [13:53] not aid arguing they're going to be more efficient and and more effective with the support they provide [13:59] in the form of foreign assistance when you look at the places you operate do you think there has been [14:07] an impact from the dismantling of usaid i i do i really i do aid was it was an intimate part of all of [14:18] these things and and of course we relied on them on them to a degree as well i wish we still had aid [14:27] but it was the choice of this administration and so we have to work with that i do i am hoping though [14:34] that eventually we can put back some of the soft power aspects that we were able to do as well [14:40] as you know that's a very important part of at least usa but again i'm not criticizing anybody in [14:47] the administration i'm simply saying we need help the administration pushes back on any criticism of [14:54] of its choices saying that it's unfair to burden the american taxpayer and the with the full burden of [15:01] taking care of every person on earth why i don't disagree right but why aren't more countries stepping [15:10] up if if the united states is drawing this line is it just that there is a loss of faith in the united [15:17] nations in these international institutions or do they just not think it's in their interest to help [15:22] the people that you say are going to become a threat to everyone's security i think it's a little of [15:28] everything uh listen in the beginning when i first took on wfp i knew we needed to scale back i knew we [15:36] had to be slimmer i knew we had to operate within our means and that's exactly what we've done we've [15:41] managed to push that through and that's how we operate now listen every organization can can do better [15:48] and can can needs to scale down i mean that that just happens there was a time and place where money was [15:54] was flush within the un agencies and within the the entities that we work with as well it's not that [16:01] way anymore and people have a right to ask how the money is being spent i do not disagree with any of [16:06] that so it is important that that the agencies scale back that we be we become more nimble more effective [16:14] uh better use of of ai better use of technology all the things that we can do to make ourselves much [16:21] better at what we do and make us much more efficient uh at what we do so i you know the u.s government [16:27] or i mean the u.s people uh have a right to ask questions and so do other countries i understand [16:32] that and we have to do the burden of making sure that we do exactly what we should be doing and that [16:38] is getting the most food and the most access to the people we serve and those are ones who cannot help [16:44] themselves you are stepping back from this job within the next few days you have the mccain name [16:54] the power the leadership abilities when you go up on capitol hill to lobby republican lawmakers in [17:01] particular to help overcome some of the reluctance we've been talking about who can fill this role [17:09] after you what advice do you have for them to be able to make the case that it is in america's [17:15] national security to help the needy in the way that you're arguing well first of all i go to both [17:23] sides because food security in my opinion is non-partisan so i talk to everybody anybody will [17:29] talk to me about food security i talk to i think this person whoever this person is i hope will lead from [17:38] their heart because we push at wp we believe in pushing everything to the field our frontline workers [17:46] the people that we serve not keeping this at headquarters it needs to go into the field i hope [17:52] whoever takes this job leads with their heart understands the nature of what we're doing and [17:57] the importance of it and more importantly is willing to take risks because that's what this job is [18:04] ambassador mccain executive director thank you for your time today thank you and we'll be right back