Fiery Cross-Examination of Karina Cooper in Murder Trial — Part 1

[00:00:00] Speaker 1: Your husband, Ryan Cooper, was killed in his own house, correct? [00:00:10] Speaker 2: Correct. [00:00:11] Speaker 1: The place where he's meant to be safest? Correct. The place where he's considered his castle, correct? [00:00:26] Speaker 2: Sure. Yes. [00:00:28] Speaker 1: The place where his children slept, children that he loved dearly, children that Ryan Cooper loved dearly, who was killed while he slept, while he snored in his sleep. Yes. You state you loved Ryan Cooper? Yes. [00:01:12] Speaker ?: Yes. [00:01:13] Speaker 2: You loved him? [00:01:14] Speaker 1: Yes. [00:01:15] Speaker 2: Very much? [00:01:16] Speaker 1: Yes. [00:01:17] Speaker 2: Yes. [00:01:18] Speaker 1: You are the lover. [00:01:34] Speaker 2: That's what you call him. Yes. [00:01:38] Speaker 1: What do you call him? [00:01:40] Speaker 2: I call him an online inappropriate relationship. When I hear lover, I assume sexual partners. It's just the way I perceive it. [00:01:54] Speaker 1: Judge, let's hope this works. Judge, let's hope this works. [00:02:05] Speaker ?: Are you wanting to publish something? Yes. What is it that we're publishing? State Exhibit 194. Are you able to read that, Ms. Cooper? I am. You have a screen next to you. Okay. You have a screen next to you. Okay. Okay. I can see it. I'm afraid. I can see it. I can see it. [00:02:17] Speaker 1: I'm afraid to move it. [00:02:18] Speaker ?: Okay. [00:02:18] Speaker 1: I can see it. I'm afraid to move it. Okay. I can see it. I can see it. [00:02:23] Speaker ?: I'm afraid to move it. Okay. I can see it. I'm afraid to move it. Okay. I can see it. I can see it. I'm afraid to move it. [00:02:32] Speaker 1: Okay. I can see it. [00:02:34] Speaker 2: I'm afraid to move it. [00:02:35] Speaker ?: Okay. [00:02:36] Speaker 1: Okay. Okay. [00:02:38] Speaker 2: I can see it. [00:02:39] Speaker ?: Okay. I can see it. [00:02:41] Speaker 2: I'm afraid to move it. Okay. [00:02:45] Speaker 1: You don't deny you sent that first text on March 8th of 2021? I did not deny that. [00:02:54] Speaker 2: No. Pardon? [00:02:56] Speaker 1: I did send that. [00:02:57] Speaker ?: Yes. [00:02:58] Speaker 1: Can you read it? [00:02:59] Speaker 2: Read it. I just read this 10 times. I swear. With heart emojis. I'm sorry. What? [00:03:07] Speaker 1: You left out a love emoji. [00:03:09] Speaker 2: I just read this 10 times. Heart emoji. Okay. I swear. Heart emoji. And just felt even harder for you. Which I don't think I could have been any more crazy over you than I already was. That book. That book is everything I've ever wanted to hear. You can do anything you want with those boys. You're their daddy. Don't need mom's permission. Cable wants to get back to wrestling. He loves it. He just got his ass kicked at a tournament and is scared to compete now. Just wants to go to practice. Doesn't want to lose. And you know what the sperm donor said to him after he got his ass handed to him. Not a fucking word other than it happens. Not let's go home and I'll show you how to get out of that move. Just it happens. They need you so badly. Kate is your football and baseball kid. Kid can throw a damn ball. [00:03:56] Speaker 1: The person you just referred to as a sperm donor. That's your husband. Yes. Ryan Cooper. Who you tell this jury you loved so dearly. That's how you showed your love to Ryan Cooper. Correct? [00:04:17] Speaker 2: I think we all call the people that we love names at times. [00:04:20] Speaker 1: I asked you is it a yes or no question. [00:04:23] Speaker 2: Yes. [00:04:24] Speaker ?: Okay. [00:04:25] Speaker 1: And you are sending this to Houston Denker. The man you now call your online lover? [00:04:32] Speaker 2: Yes. [00:04:33] Speaker 1: Your husband is a sperm donor. [00:04:37] Speaker 2: That's what I referred to him as yes. [00:04:39] Speaker 1: You also told him the kids are yours. [00:04:42] Speaker 2: All part of the fantasy. [00:04:44] Speaker 1: Is that a yes or no? [00:04:46] Speaker 2: It's hard to say yes or no. I feel like that's black or white and there's a gray area. [00:04:51] Speaker 1: Ms. Cooper, did you hear my question? I did. [00:04:55] Speaker 2: Yes. If it must be yes or no, then yes. I clearly said it. Can you read the next message on March 8th at 7:03 AM? [00:05:04] Speaker ?: Your Honor. [00:05:05] Speaker 2: Just to correct the record, I do believe this is Defendant's Exhibit A, not State's Exhibit 194. [00:05:22] Speaker ?: Okay. [00:05:23] Speaker 1: Defense Exhibit A. Do you want me to read it? [00:05:25] Speaker 2: Yeah. Good morning, baby. You would have woke up to your horny wife's hand wrapped around your dick this morning, just so you know. [00:05:34] Speaker 1: And who are you sending this to? I'm sorry, what? Who are you sending this to? To Houston Denker. The man you're just telling this jury that you're terrified of. [00:05:44] Speaker 2: I wasn't terrified of him at this time, no. [00:05:47] Speaker 1: When did you start being terrified of him? [00:05:50] Speaker 2: After he killed my husband. [00:05:52] Speaker 1: Oh, so this time you're not terrified of him in March? No. And so Houston Denker would have woken up to your hand, your horny hands around his dick, correct? [00:06:12] Speaker 2: That's what I wrote. [00:06:13] Speaker 1: That's what you wrote to him? [00:06:15] Speaker 2: Correct. [00:06:16] Speaker 1: You are the one who initiates that conversation. What's that? You're the one who sends that conversation. Yes. A minute later, you write to him, expressing thoughts of death to the man that you claim you love, called Ryan Cooper. Correct? [00:06:41] Speaker 2: I wrote, "Here's hoping for a rogue semi today. Big accident. No survivors." Big accident. [00:06:48] Speaker ?: No survivors. Big accident. No survivors. [00:06:51] Speaker 1: That's what I wrote. Your mind, and you should say your mind is pretty dark and twisted, correct? [00:07:05] Speaker 2: That's what I wrote in the next message, yes. [00:07:08] Speaker 1: We can turn on the lights. [00:07:11] Speaker 3: And just to be clear for the record, again, you mentioned Ms. Watt, but this shows States Exhibit 194. There is no States Exhibit 194 that has been admitted. It's identical to what Ms. Cooper had admitted as Exhibit A. So just so everybody's clear on that. Is that correct, Ms. Watt? Yes, Senator. Mr. Kodiaga, is that correct? That is correct. All right. You can go ahead, Mr. Kodiaga. [00:07:42] Speaker ?: Mr. Kodiaga. [00:07:43] Speaker 1: On the same day that your mind is pretty fucking dark and twisted, you write to Houston Denker. Objection, Your Honor. Aston answered. I'm still asking the question. [00:07:58] Speaker ?: Not sure. [00:07:58] Speaker 1: The question isn't finished. So go ahead. On that same day when your mind is pretty fucking dark and twisted, you write to Houston [00:08:02] Speaker ?: Denker. I'm still asking the question. I'm still asking the question. [00:08:05] Speaker 1: I'm not sure. The question isn't finished. [00:08:07] Speaker ?: So go ahead. [00:08:08] Speaker 1: On that same day when your mind is pretty fucking dark and twisted, you write to Houston Denker. And you say, oh, I don't want to wait another summer. Correct? [00:08:13] Speaker 3: Yes. Your husband, Ryan Cooper, was killed. [00:08:16] Speaker 1: On that same day, when your mind is pretty fucking dark and twisted, you write to Houston Dunker and you say, "Oh, I don't want to wait another summer." [00:08:30] Speaker ?: Correct? [00:08:32] Speaker 1: Yes. Your husband, Ryan Cooper, was killed just on the eve of summer, correct? [00:08:43] Speaker 2: At the beginning of summer, in June, yes. [00:08:47] Speaker 1: In June. [00:08:49] Speaker 2: Correct? Correct. [00:08:52] Speaker 1: The same message, 10 o'clock that same morning, where you want him dead by a rogue semi-accident. No survivors. You write to him, to Houston Dunker. And you're talking about the blinds blowing, making the sheets chilly, and dreaming of sleeping and enjoying the lightning and the nights with Houston Dunker. Correct? [00:09:32] Speaker 2: That's in the message, yes. [00:09:40] Speaker 1: You tell him, the same day, that you want a partner, not another child. You're referring to Ryan Cooper as another child. [00:09:50] Speaker 2: Yes. [00:09:52] Speaker 1: That's the same man you've told this jury, who was a hard worker who worked from can't see in the morning to can't see in the night. [00:09:58] Speaker 2: He was. [00:09:59] Speaker 1: And would fall asleep so tired because of his hard work. [00:10:04] Speaker 2: Yes. [00:10:05] Speaker 1: That's the man you refer to your lover as another child. [00:10:08] Speaker 2: Yes. [00:10:23] Speaker 1: On the 12th of March, you write to Houston Dunker that you might be pregnant this time next year. And he responds by saying, we'll love you to be pregnant next year for him. Correct? [00:10:46] Speaker 2: That's what's written. [00:10:47] Speaker 1: That's what you wrote? Yes. You, yourself, wrote those words. Correct? [00:10:54] Speaker 2: I assume so. I don't have it in front of me, and I can't remember precisely, but I'm going to assume you're correct. [00:11:00] Speaker 1: Do you want me to put it up? [00:11:03] Speaker 2: Not necessary. [00:11:05] Speaker 1: In fact, at that time, you talked about IVF. [00:11:12] Speaker ?: Yes. [00:11:13] Speaker 1: He doesn't know what IVF is, and you have to explain to him what IVF is. I do. Where they plant your sperm and my egg. Correct? [00:11:24] Speaker 2: Correct. [00:11:25] Speaker 1: No, the old fashioned way, but our baby. Right? That's what you're telling? [00:11:32] Speaker 2: Correct. [00:11:33] Speaker ?: Your husband, Ryan Cooper, had life insurance where you were the sole beneficiary. Correct? [00:11:45] Speaker 1: Yes, we both had policies. I asked you just about Ryan Cooper. You were the beneficiary if Ryan Cooper were to drop dead. Yes. You would stand to earn substantial amount of money. Correct? [00:12:21] Speaker 2: Yes. [00:12:22] Speaker 1: Over $500,000, correct? [00:12:25] Speaker 2: Correct. [00:12:27] Speaker ?: More than one occasion, you told Ryan Cooper that you hated him. [00:12:49] Speaker 1: Yes. Front of France, you told Ryan Cooper that you'd shoot him in the face. [00:13:09] Speaker 2: I deny ever saying that. [00:13:11] Speaker 1: Was that when you were Karen when you said I'd shoot you in the face? [00:13:19] Speaker 2: I never said that. [00:13:21] Speaker 1: Karen did? [00:13:22] Speaker 2: Karen did not say it either. It was not said. [00:13:25] Speaker 1: Cade Cooper is your eldest child with Ryan. Yes. Cade loved his dad. [00:13:44] Speaker 2: All three of them did, yes. [00:13:46] Speaker 1: Cade Cooper loved his dad. [00:13:49] Speaker 2: Yes. [00:13:50] Speaker 1: He slept on the couch next to his dad. His dad slept on the recliner. [00:13:59] Speaker 2: That's not why he slept on the couch, no. [00:14:02] Speaker 1: Just asked you a question, yes. [00:14:04] Speaker 2: So the answer is no. [00:14:06] Speaker 1: That's not why, because he didn't love his dad, or slept on the couch because he didn't love his dad? [00:14:11] Speaker 2: Well, which question? Is it why did he sleep on the couch or did he love his dad? Because, yes, he loved his dad. And, yes, he slept on the couch. [00:14:19] Speaker 1: Next to his father. [00:14:21] Speaker 2: Yes. [00:14:22] Speaker 1: On the night that Ryan Cooper's life was taken away from him, Cade was not on the couch next to his father. [00:14:36] Speaker 2: He was when I went to bed. [00:14:40] Speaker 1: When Ryan Cooper's life was taken away from him, Cade was not on the couch next to his father. [00:14:46] Speaker 2: No, he was not. [00:14:57] Speaker 1: And you know that because, as you've said before, you are up at three o'clock and you went to the living room where Ryan Cooper slept on his recliner and Ryan Cooper was the only one there. Cade was not. Correct. So at three in the morning, you are aware that Cade Cooper is not on the couch. Correct. At 3:30, that morning at 3:32, 30 minutes after you are aware that Cade Cooper is not on the couch, you send a heart emoji to Houston Denker. Yes. Yes. If you may have the screen again. Interesting. What I'm going to show you is what was marked as State 195 was not admitted, but is admitted as Defence, I believe, B. So for the record this is Defence, B. It's the same document. Can you see this, Ms. Cooper? Yes. On the 17th of June, 10:19 a.m., a day later, Ryan Cooper will be dead. You are talking to Houston Denker, correct? Correct. Can you see in that document where you are saying to him, just be prepared for your wife to constantly be tearing something apart and redoing it? Yes. [00:17:28] Speaker 2: Yes. [00:17:29] Speaker 1: You refer to yourself as your wife? Yes. Ryan Cooper is still alive at that point, working from can't see in the morning to can't see in the night. Correct? Yes. [00:17:45] Speaker 2: Busy? [00:17:46] Speaker 1: Usually. [00:17:47] Speaker 2: Yes. Being a farmer? [00:17:49] Speaker 1: Being a farmer? [00:17:50] Speaker 2: Yes. [00:17:51] Speaker ?: Yes. [00:17:52] Speaker 1: Houston Denker replies to you. Can you read what Houston Denker replies after you talk about being his wife? [00:18:04] Speaker ?: Yes. [00:18:05] Speaker 2: He wrote, not worried about that one bit. You got to see me in my underwear this morning and I haven't gotten to see you. [00:18:11] Speaker 1: You got to see him in his underwear that morning? [00:18:16] Speaker 2: He sent a Snapchat of it. Yes. Is that a yes? [00:18:19] Speaker 1: Yes. [00:18:20] Speaker ?: You got to see? [00:18:21] Speaker 1: Yes. And you respond by saying? [00:18:25] Speaker 2: Train wreck. [00:18:27] Speaker 1: What is the next text message and who sends it? That he sends? [00:18:34] Speaker 2: Yes. Going to sleep with my hand on your pussy very soon. [00:18:40] Speaker 1: Going to sleep with my hand on your p-word very soon, correct? [00:18:47] Speaker 2: Correct. [00:18:48] Speaker 1: And what's your response? [00:18:53] Speaker 2: Soaked, just thinking of you will be downright embarrassing when I have you in person. Excuse me, when I actually have you in person? [00:19:05] Speaker 1: That's hours before your husband will be lying dead in his house. [00:19:16] Speaker 2: It's at 11:19 a.m. on June 17th. [00:19:19] Speaker 1: So in the next coming hours your husband will be killed in your house? [00:19:25] Speaker 2: He was. [00:19:27] Speaker 1: With you present in the house? Yes. You send a text message to your lover saying I will be your wife. And he tells you very soon he will have his hands when you're most private of parts. And that same night your husband is dead. [00:19:49] Speaker 2: That and many others, yes. [00:19:51] Speaker 1: Let's go back to the 3 o'clock time clock. You see Kate Cooper away from his couch in the living room. [00:20:08] Speaker 2: He was up in his bed, yes. [00:20:10] Speaker 1: And at 3:31, 31 minutes later, you send a heart emoji, correct? Correct. What does Houston respond? [00:20:22] Speaker 2: He responds seriously more than fucking life. [00:20:28] Speaker 1: What is your response? The response? [00:20:36] Speaker ?: Forever. [00:20:36] Speaker 1: 3:31, 29 seconds later, what is Houston Denker's response to you? [00:20:49] Speaker ?: Houston says more than anything. Okay, babe. The phone's going down. [00:20:50] Speaker 1: Send me something after I leave your house to then wait for me to open it. [00:20:55] Speaker ?: Deal? [00:20:56] Speaker 1: More than anything. Okay, babe. It refers to you in a time of endowment, babe. Of course, we know that by now. [00:21:00] Speaker 2: But it says, phone's going down. The phone's going down. The phone's going down. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. [00:21:12] Speaker ?: Houston Denker's response to you. [00:21:13] Speaker 1: Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. 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[00:26:03] Speaker ?: Houston Denker's response to you. [00:26:04] Speaker 1: Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. [00:26:06] Speaker ?: Houston Denker's response to you. [00:26:07] Speaker 1: Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. [00:26:11] Speaker 2: Houston Denker's response to you. [00:26:20] Speaker 1: Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. [00:26:25] Speaker ?: Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. [00:26:28] Speaker 1: Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. [00:26:33] Speaker ?: Houston Denker's response to you. 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Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. [00:27:07] Speaker 2: Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. [00:27:23] Speaker ?: Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. [00:27:32] Speaker 3: Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you. Houston Denker's response to you.