Face the Nation: Salvanto, Rabb, political panel

[0:00] for more from our new poll we're joined by our executive director of elections and surveys [0:03] anthony salvato anthony great to see you good morning it's a really interesting survey so give [0:07] us the big picture these recent democratic primaries they were close especially out in [0:11] the midwest are democrats really split over socialism so let me start with the big picture [0:17] among all americans because most americans say they think the free market is a good thing they [0:23] have a more positive view of capitalism than they do of socialism and they're net negative on [0:27] socialism but yeah by comparison there is relatively more support or favorability of socialism [0:34] among democrats not all democrats but it is a majority and higher than compared to capitalism [0:40] you ask people what that means because these are just labels right and democrats tend to describe [0:45] socialism in terms of outcomes well it's fairness well there's more equality and they're concerned [0:52] about income inequality other people other americans describe it as government control and that's in a [0:57] more negative context so you can look at polling going back to the 30s going to the 60s there's [1:04] always been these discussions of socialism but they do tend to come out in tougher economic times and [1:09] even in this poll we find especially young people saying like they feel opportunities are lesser now than [1:15] they were for previous generations that it's harder to get ahead that the system doesn't work in a fair [1:20] way all that's the bigger context so as you rightly point out this is a resurgence or re-emergence [1:26] of socialism certainly we've seen that this summer how is it then splitting the democratic party [1:31] specifically so one interesting thing is that it is college educated democrats who are relatively more [1:37] favorable for socialism and yes they have even slightly higher incomes we've seen some of that too [1:43] in the votes that you mentioned or the vote patterns in these states what could be happening there [1:47] is a sort of relative way relative expectations maybe they've got a little more money but it doesn't buy [1:53] them as much as they thought and the other part of it is you ask people is the democratic party as [1:59] progressive as you'd like it to be and that is also pretty even even as they have this argument [2:04] amongst themselves ultimately they've got to go find swing voters maybe even republican voters to vote [2:09] for at least some of these democrats if they have any hope of retaking control of congress so [2:12] when you ask americans overall about socialism and how the democratic party is sorting itself what do they [2:19] say so the big question here i think is what are the democrats offering that's in contrast to the trump [2:25] economy and of course they want this to be a referendum on the trump economy but democrats say [2:30] they'd like to have bigger ideas from their candidates than smaller or incremental ones they'd like to see [2:36] people who they think are fighting for them almost more affect than anything else the way that plays [2:42] going forward is that when you ask people to look back on other times democrats have been in power [2:47] it's not necessarily seen as being successful remember the last time inflation started under [2:51] democrats so do they need to offer something new in contrast this is ultimately a fight about what [2:58] that is all right anthony we'll talk a little bit more about this later thank you for now thanks [3:02] we'll be right back welcome back to face the nation we turn now to pennsylvania state representative [3:12] chris rad he's the democratic party's nominee in the third district of pennsylvania that includes [3:17] parts of philadelphia he is also a member of the democratic socialists of america uh representative [3:23] you're not congressman yet representative thank you for being here this morning we appreciate it nope [3:27] um so i'm curious and part of the reason why we wanted to have someone like you here [3:31] given that you are the democratic nominee but also a member of the dsa what is a voter getting from [3:38] a democrat and a member of the dsa like you that they aren't necessarily getting from a democrat like [3:44] kentucky governor andy beshear who we had on earlier that's a great question um i listened [3:51] to that segment and it seems like we have a lot in common um we're against uh corruption we want to [3:57] fight for working people we want we believe that health care is a human right um these are things [4:02] that we want increased wages i support a living wage for all so i think we have a lot more in common [4:07] than people uh would think but when he says that socialism is a failed experiment what's your response [4:13] to that well um i imagine he supports social security uh in a purely capitalistic free market [4:23] system we would have no social security we would have no medicare we would have no medicaid we would [4:29] have no public education we would have no interstate highway system we would not have firefighters [4:36] these things are things that are brought to us by uh different different views that have molded us [4:43] into the nation we are today it's not one thing this is not a purely capitalistic society there is [4:49] capitalism in china in finland everywhere like this is something that we have to understand is a mixture [4:56] and it is an evolution pure capitalism has never worked um communism is not something that we've seen [5:04] effectively work um what are we doing to make sure that we are moving in the right direction though [5:09] that we are uh transforming this nation so that it can take care of everyone how is it that we have [5:15] our first trillionaire and we still have veterans who are unhoused you know our news poll out this [5:21] morning shows that most democrats have a positive view of socialism but among all americans overall [5:28] just 35 percent do you've you've you've made the argument here so far but i'm curious what do you do [5:33] to try to win over skeptics uh the two-thirds of the country who doesn't think this is a good idea well i [5:42] wasn't running for socialism i was running for the people of the third congressional district who [5:47] won a fighter and that's something that is more important than the labels that are used in polls [5:52] because the poll didn't um define socialism the poll didn't define capitalism the poll didn't define [5:59] free market system or free enterprise it didn't do those it polled on how people responded to labels [6:06] that have been put into the ether without any context historical any analysis and i think [6:12] once you define these things people can make more informed decisions you are running in what is the [6:18] most democratic district in america like 40 plus 40 percent democratic advantage uh so it's it's [6:26] perhaps understandable or that it helps explain how a socialist-backed candidate can emerge but there [6:32] are others in the democratic party writ large no i have to push back ed why is that i got to push back [6:39] this you can't conflate democratic performance index with people who support a democratic socialist i ran [6:48] four months long before anyone mentioned that i was a member of the democratic socialists of america [6:55] i didn't run for socialism i ran for the people just because people are more likely to vote for democrats [7:01] does not mean that they are inherently more inclined to support this idea ideology or the other it just [7:08] showed that in my district in my race for the democratic primary that i came out 14 points ahead [7:15] in a four-person race because i was a fighter and i talked about issues that mattered and socialism did [7:22] not come up okay and actually our poll this morning shows that democratic voters overall are looking for [7:28] fighters or people who are certainly promising to do so i do want to play however something that former [7:35] ambassador former chicago mayor ram emmanuel said this morning on sunday morning in conversation with [7:39] our colleague robert costa regarding the progressive versus rest of the party sort of split or discussion [7:46] that y'all are having take a listen to what he said this again i'm about flipping red districts to blue [7:53] i'm not about taking blue districts and making a midnight blue you want to see a raise in the minimum [7:58] wage winning over democratic districts is not the way to get it there you got to win republican districts [8:05] what's your response to the mayor's strategic argument there um i think listening to folks who have [8:14] been uh institutionalists and corporate dems is probably um the wrong thing to do when what your own [8:21] poll shows is that there's an exhaustion there is anger at centrists and institutionalists and this [8:29] anti-establishment moment means that we want bold things that are not left or right but what are the [8:35] things that are going to move people forward and hey take me to kentucky i think i can uh make that [8:41] case pretty strongly and as someone who is five generations in kentucky um i think this is something [8:47] that transcends blue districts okay uh on the on the issue of institutionalists in the party i'm curious [8:55] are you someone who would vote for hakeem jeffries to be speaker should democrats take majority next [9:00] january sorry about that um he he hasn't asked me but um i can tell you this he's not going to run [9:09] unless we secure the uh uh the new majority which is what i'm focusing on i'm focusing on making sure [9:15] we have good progressive candidates who are winning in these primaries and who will win on november 3rd [9:21] and when we get a new democratic majority i would love to have that conversation with them [9:26] uh person to person we have not yet met okay now look i know you're a democratic candidate [9:31] for congress you are however a member of the dsa and there are opponents of that movement [9:36] who point to the failed socialist governments in latin america as proof that socialism don't always [9:40] work and the dsa just in the last few days put out a statement commemorating the 100th birthday [9:45] of fidel castro which says in part he was an organizer a fighter and endures as a stalwart symbol [9:50] of anti-imperialist struggle and self-determination for the global south do you agree with that sentiment [9:56] and and does it concern you that this type of celebration of fidel castro [10:01] is what might validate people's concerns with the dsa i am not concerned with how people construe [10:12] this organization i'm interested in finding what we have in common so we can move this country [10:18] forward based on bold policies which that poll suggests people are wanting irrespective of [10:24] political ideology or generation the other thing i want to mention too is and this is something that [10:29] i hear centrist and establishment players talk about is well if we want to reach these people [10:34] who are outside of you know blue districts how about we actually focus on those folks who live in [10:40] highly populated blue districts who don't show up because they're so exhausted and disaffected with the [10:46] democratic party if we reach those folks who are inclined to vote for the democrats but don't because [10:52] we're not fighting for them we have a far more likely chance of winning than reaching out to folks [10:57] who under no circumstances would consider um folks who embrace values like health care is a human right [11:05] or housing is a human right um or not having a trillionaire class there's some people we're not [11:11] going to move but many people we can and i think it's not about left or right it's about moving whole [11:17] communities forward in the most meaningful ways and as it relates to these statements about other [11:22] folks in other countries um i hope we're all anti-imperialist i hope we're all anti-fascist [11:28] i don't think these are particularly controversial um stances all right well we'll leave it there you [11:32] are a big part of the debate in your party about who it is should be focused on and how to do it and [11:37] that's why we wanted you here representative rab thank you for joining us we appreciate it and we'll be [11:43] right back with our political panel stay with us and we are back with our political panel sabrina [11:49] rodriguez covers politics at the wall street journal paul kane reports on congress and politics [11:54] for notice or news of the united states talus oloronipa is a staff writer at the atlantic and our [12:00] executive director of elections and surveys anthony salvato is back with us as well this is kind of a [12:05] washington post reunion a handful of us have worked there before we're very proud of the work they [12:09] continue to do and it's the first time for both of you but sabrina ladies first uh we look at this [12:15] ongoing struggle in the democratic party to define what it is and how to win you've been out and about [12:21] and i was struck by something someone said to you out in wisconsin in recent days they said the midwest [12:25] is not manhattan there are limits here it seems the far left may have actually hit a bit of a wall [12:31] at least in the last few days absolutely and i mean we saw in both wisconsin and michigan i think [12:37] you know coming out of the new york primary there's been so much conversation around this democratic [12:41] socialism versus establishment fight that's playing out in the party but there was the big question [12:46] okay in a state like michigan in a state like wisconsin states that voted for donald trump [12:52] these you know chronically extremely purple states is there a lane and clearly the verdict is it's very [12:58] divided it's very complicated you know seeing abdul al-sayed's win in michigan yes it's a big win for [13:04] the far left but there is the question mark he won by one percentage point so we're seeing this fight [13:09] playing out and it's clearly far from over in terms of what direction the party's going in paul who's [13:15] also making his face the nation debut you have covered congress especially in the contours of the [13:20] two conferences for this entire century so you've seen this once or twice and that's not to call you [13:25] old it's to say that you're not uh that but you've seen a figure two when it comes to congressional races [13:30] and my point is we've seen the two parties go through cycles like this and you've written recently [13:36] that the democrats have the potential to take back the majority but may not be able to do it to the [13:41] extent that they could have in other cycles if they nominate too many extremists can there there are [13:46] for people my age a lot of us look at this and think wow it's 2006 all over again uh our friend amy [13:53] walter tweeted that like she's got a sense of deja vu there's there are you know sex scandals happening [13:59] a war in the middle east the president in his second term very unpopular but at the same time [14:05] there's also some 2022 deja vu where republicans had a lot of great uh political environment that [14:13] was going on but they nominated not just in the senate where candidates like dr oz and herschel walker [14:19] got a lot of attention but they nominated a half dozen to a dozen candidates in winnable districts in [14:25] the house that were just outside of that general mainstream and they ended up not getting that sort of [14:32] big bounce and they ended up with a majority at just 222 seats with four votes to spare if everybody [14:39] shows up and so there are there are some similarities to 2022 that could be happening here where the wrong [14:47] candidates in the wrong districts in the wrong states might end up not giving the democrats the [14:53] sort of election that they could have otherwise in toulouse i know that was part of the concern of michigan [14:58] whereas sabrina said he only won by one point outside and now there's been polling that suggests [15:03] he's underwater against the republican mike rogers and he's he realizes that and that's part of the [15:07] reason he's trying to move things in in a direction of saying he wants to be conciliatory he wants to [15:13] have a big tent he wants to reach out to people who did not vote for him he wants to reach out to some [15:17] of those working class voters some of those black voters who voted for hayley stevens he's talked about [15:21] that on the campaign trail but this broader civil war that's taking place within democratic party [15:27] it's really right underneath the surface of all of this sort of kumbaya work together there's a big [15:32] tent we're all united more than we're divided right underneath that there's a lot of opposition between [15:38] the two sides of the party and if they're able to muscle their way through to november i suspect that [15:43] a lot of those divisions will pop back up as soon as we have to figure out who the speaker is going to [15:47] be we heard from hakeem jeffries uh that he does not support the dsa agenda earlier today and so [15:52] there's going to be a lot of uh working out they're going to have to do to get together if they're [15:56] able to win the house in november signal he doesn't support the dsa agenda signal he doesn't support [16:01] medicare for all and what does chris rabbs say i haven't heard from him yet so i don't know if i'm [16:06] voting for him that's the kind of trouble that could be coming if they govern or try to govern yeah well [16:11] that was you know you look at 2022 and kevin mccarthy only has a couple votes to spare and he [16:17] ends up getting held hostage again and again uh for almost nine months until they kick him out and [16:23] then mike johnson becomes speaker and he gets held hostage when you only win a majority by a couple of [16:28] votes it gives an opportunity for mischief making among just a few members and that's what hakeem [16:36] jeffries could face if they don't win a big enough majority uh or if he doesn't win the majority it's [16:43] even bigger problem i would just add i mean i think one of the most striking things to me from the poll [16:48] this morning is the fact that the majority of voters don't the majority of voters regard the [16:53] democratic party as weak and that a majority of voters do not think that the democratic party is [16:58] effective so i know there's this ideological debate that's happening within the party but part of the [17:03] opening that democratic socialist and the progressive left have had this year is because [17:08] of the repercussions from the 2024 election from those bruising losses and this feeling like what [17:13] exactly is the party doing we lost to donald trump in 2024 we're heading into a midterm what exactly is [17:19] fighting donald trump look like what wins have actually been accomplished in the last two years [17:23] and a lot of frustration from the democratic base questioning what exactly does the democratic [17:28] party stand for and how exactly are we going to win yeah you uh found something interesting in the [17:33] poll regarding democratic and republican support when it comes to the economy over a key concept oh price [17:40] control yeah yeah and what's interesting here is for all this talk about ideology you do see that [17:46] there's a certain you might generously call it pragmatism in an economy where so many people [17:51] are complaining about inflation so you ask about price controls in general and yes you find a number [17:57] a large number of democrats in favor independence but also a slight majority of republicans and that's [18:01] part of what it tells you not everybody sits there and maps everything onto an ideological framework for [18:07] this in this kind of environment and the president has been not uh certainly not at all extreme to [18:13] the left on this but he has talked about price controls for different types of or different [18:18] elements of the economy so they they must see this or understand that that it is something that finds [18:23] general support yeah and within the republican party it's interesting too for all our talk about the [18:27] democrats there's a big gap between the way that republicans rate the president on issues like [18:32] immigration and even foreign policy and then on inflation in particular where it's lower and [18:39] hovered around 20 points lower still approving but not as high and that gap is going to be [18:43] important because when we do get to the midterms one of the key questions i think is going to be what [18:48] happens to the republicans who are a little bit dissatisfied with the president they don't dislike him [18:53] but on that issue and maybe not so much so speaking of the numbers and the way things are tracking [18:59] can you give us a sense of where at least cbs sees the house and the senate sitting right now well one [19:04] of the key things and you started to raise it is that it's different structurally from those last [19:09] couple of midterms because partisanship has kind of sorted out all of the marginal districts in fact [19:16] there aren't that many so to your point ed there's maybe under 20 depending on how you count it and we do [19:22] that are true toss-up house districts which means that if you just look at the partisan breaks on them [19:29] you know it's within maybe five or six points something you could move in a persuasion campaign [19:33] like that so that really constrains the number in the house at the outset and then at the senate side you [19:39] have this different dynamic where you don't have a whole lot of competitive races out of the whole [19:44] scope but you have democrats trying to pick up seats from the republicans in places where they've had a [19:52] tough time i'll pick out texas as one they've had a tough time historically winning very tough so that [19:58] that kind of map it's it's an interesting dynamic to say the least if we can bring back up that senate [20:02] map i want people to to sit with the idea of texas being a light shade of red this year that's kind of [20:09] the one that's sitting out there as the maybe when when when you to lose talk to democrats sabrina when [20:15] you talk to them how confident do they feel about that one happening texas is a big [20:22] challenge for democrats in part because they've been trying to win texas for the last 30 odd years [20:27] and it's always seemed like the one that gets away it's a big state there are a lot of republicans [20:31] there it's a structurally republican leaning state and so the fact that republicans have a flawed [20:37] candidate and democrats have what they feel is a candidate that can compete for some of those [20:41] moderate voters some of those evangelical voters some of the voters that are a little bit more less [20:45] ideological and and less willing to vote for a flawed republican who has issues uh both corruption [20:52] issues and issues in his own personal life they think the the the mix is right for the democrats to [20:58] win this year but it is a very big uh state it's a very big challenge and it seems like they're on an [21:02] uphill climb to try to win that state do they have a sense of what it takes i mean it's been the elusive [21:08] the elusive dream for for democrats for a while as you said i mean it's been since 1994 no democrat [21:14] has won a statewide you know a statewide race in texas however there is this opening when you look [21:19] at for example hispanic voters you and i have talked to many of them in texas that move towards [21:24] donald trump in the 2024 election they see an opening with james tallarico now it certainly doesn't help [21:29] him to get tied to the democratic socialists in a state like texas but again there's this democrats are [21:36] seeing this real opening because of who ken paxton is because of all the baggage he brings because of [21:41] the fact that he had an extremely messy primary that went into a runoff we're talking about almost [21:46] a hundred million dollars that were spent in anti-paxton ads and that sort of helps this perfect [21:51] storm but it's certainly far from guaranteed but temper the expectations because we've talked about [21:56] this at least internally there's there's a math issue for democrats not only in texas but in iowa [22:02] uh potentially in alaska and those other ones where they think they now have a shot yeah well [22:06] the math issue in texas is that you need to move a whole heck of a lot more voters just to make that [22:11] percentage a percentage in texas is not the same thing as a percentage in iowa so you may see the [22:17] democrats try to invest more in places where there just aren't as many voters that you need to swing [22:22] the other polling part of this too is you look at maybe an even poll maybe one that's in the margin of [22:28] error but historically and this is a case perhaps in maine i think historically susan collins has [22:34] turned out her voters and she's got people there who have voted for her over many many cycles you're [22:39] going against that kind of a headwind so even you see a one or two point gap in the polls that's part [22:44] of the structure so in 2006 they won six senate seats um democrats four of which had just voted [22:53] for george w bush two years earlier but in at least two of them there were third party right leaning [23:00] libertarian type of voters like in montana that gave the sort of you were talking about the soft trump [23:07] supporters who are people who are a little bit upset about inflation and the war they're just it's hard [23:13] for them to vote for a democrat and so in some of these states they might need that third party person [23:20] to give that soft trump supporter oh i'm not going to vote for talarico but i'm not going to vote for [23:26] paxton and i'll vote for the libertarian so that they can win without clearing 50 percent uh because it's [23:33] so hard to get over 50 percent for a democrat in these states like iowa ohio and texas real quick in [23:41] our remaining seconds here the south carolina republican runoff in about 10 days is darlene [23:46] graham in trouble against ralph norman look her brother spent 20 million dollars in his primary in [23:52] june just so that he would not get put into a runoff because he knew that the south carolina [23:59] primary runoff voters are not lindsey graham voters they are more bright red now you have a late august [24:07] special election primary runoff where she started with 33 percent it's not clear that she can win [24:15] unless trump really goes there and really lays down the law and says you got to vote for her well we'll [24:22] see if he does that in the next few days because to spend his political capital there would be telling [24:27] with less than 80 days to go to election day sabrina paul anthony toulouse thanks for being here we [24:31] appreciate it and we'll be back in a moment that's it for us today thank you for watching margaret [24:37] we'll be back next week i'm ed o'keefe take care