Prosecution Questions Raul Valle on Deadly Stabbing — Full Cross-Examination

[00:00:00] Speaker 1: May 14th of 2022, you go to Lazy Brook Road for a party at Madigan Lighthouse, correct? [00:00:22] Speaker 2: Yes. [00:00:23] Speaker 1: That's you to the right there in the Ole Miss football shirt. Yes. A light blue shirt. [00:00:28] Jack: Yes. [00:00:28] Speaker 1: Black pants with the helmet on, right? [00:00:31] Jack: Yes. [00:00:31] Speaker ?: That's you. [00:00:37] Speaker 1: You said that you got there around what time? [00:00:43] Jack: I want to say around 9 or 10. [00:00:45] Speaker 1: 9 or 10. You were there for, you testified on direct examination, you were there for about an hour and a half, correct? [00:00:51] Jack: Yeah. [00:00:51] Speaker 1: People arrived at some point after an hour and a half, correct? [00:00:57] Jack: Yeah. [00:00:58] Speaker 1: Ryan Hines and Griffin Marcinzik. You didn't know them, right? No. But those are the two that showed up at Lazy Brook Road at that point, right? Yeah. And when they got to Lazy Brook Road, Jack, Tyler, and yourself confronted those two, right? [00:01:13] Jack: When I first got there now. [00:01:15] Speaker 1: Because Madigan Lazy Brook Road, you were under the assumption that if they left, you guys could stay, right? [00:01:27] Jack: No. She asked everybody by the door. [00:01:29] Speaker 1: I'm going to move to strike as not responsible as to what Madigan Lazy Brook Road said. [00:01:33] Speaker 4: The court is going to sustain the objection. I am going to go ahead and strike everything after the response to no as I'm unresponsive. And yes, sir. Thank you. [00:01:44] Speaker 1: So at some point in time, let me ask you this. How long was Ryan and Griffin at Lazy Brook before you, Jack, and Tyler got involved with them? [00:01:56] Jack: I want to say a couple of minutes. [00:01:58] Speaker 1: A couple of minutes, right? So they show up. Ryan walks down with his beer in his hand, right? And at some point, you talk to Ryan and Griffin with Jack and Tyler, right? Yes. And at some point in time, you say to them, you can come in if you give me some beer, right? [00:02:16] Jack: I was the only one who said that. [00:02:18] Speaker 1: You're the only one that said that. Yes. And Ryan gave you a beer, right? [00:02:22] Jack: He did not. [00:02:23] Speaker 1: And at some point in time, it got heated between the three of you and Griffin and Ryan, right? [00:02:29] Jack: Just between Jack and Ryan. [00:02:30] Speaker 1: And at some point in time, that went outside, right? [00:02:33] Jack: Yes. [00:02:33] Speaker 1: So within a span of a few minutes, it went from give me a beer to going outside into the driveway, right? [00:02:42] Speaker 2: Yes. [00:02:43] Speaker ?: Okay. [00:02:43] Speaker 1: And out in the driveway, there was a group of people surrounding the area, right, from the party? [00:02:49] Jack: Scattered, yes. [00:02:49] Speaker 1: Right? And you said, I think you said on direct examination, there were about 30 people at this party? You remember saying that? [00:02:56] Jack: Inside, I think there was more. [00:02:58] Speaker 1: Okay. So there was 30 people inside, and then there was maybe 20 outside? [00:03:02] Jack: No, there was probably like 10 people outside. [00:03:04] Speaker 1: There was only 10 people outside. 10 people including you, or 10 people excluding you? Including me. Okay. And who was outside? [00:03:13] Jack: At the time, I didn't really look at faces. [00:03:16] Speaker 1: You weren't paying attention, right? Yeah. You just kind of scanned the area, and you said, oh, there's about 10 people here, right? [00:03:24] Jack: No, I didn't really look around to see how many people were. [00:03:26] Speaker 1: So you have no clue who was outside then at that point? That's what you're telling us? [00:03:29] Jack: Yeah. [00:03:29] Speaker ?: Okay. [00:03:30] Speaker 1: And you don't know if there were girls outside or boys outside at that point, right? [00:03:36] Speaker ?: No. [00:03:36] Speaker 1: You just know that there were bodies. You weren't paying attention. [00:03:39] Jack: Yeah. [00:03:41] Speaker 1: And when you go outside, at some point, there's an argument going on between Ryan and Jack, right? [00:03:49] Jack: Yeah. [00:03:49] Speaker 1: And you're witnessing it. Yeah. And you're outside, in fact, with this helmet on at the time, are you not? [00:03:55] Jack: Yes. [00:03:55] Speaker 1: And when you're outside, and you're looking at this argument that is going on between Jack and Ryan, at some point in time, they square up, right? Yes. And they square up because they're going to fight for the beer, right? Jack had taken the beer from him at that point? [00:04:10] Jack: Yeah. [00:04:11] Speaker 1: Right? And he wanted his beer back. Ryan wanted his beer back. [00:04:13] Jack: Yes. [00:04:14] Speaker 1: And when they square up, Ryan's standing squared up to Jack. Jack's across from Ryan, right? [00:04:23] Speaker 2: Yes. [00:04:24] Speaker 1: And to Jack's back left is Tyler Da Silva, correct? [00:04:30] Jack: Yes. [00:04:31] Speaker 1: And behind Ryan is you, right? [00:04:36] Jack: Off to the side, yeah. [00:04:37] Speaker 1: Right? And you're wearing that helmet at that point, right? [00:04:39] Jack: Yes. [00:04:40] Speaker 1: And you testified on direct examination. They squared off. Hines stepped on my foot, and I pushed him. Do you remember saying that? Yes. You pushed him. Yes. I want to show you State's Exhibit 58. [00:04:59] Speaker ?: I want to show you State's Exhibit 58. [00:05:17] Speaker 1: So this is, this is, this person right here to the left in the blue shirt. Who's that? [00:05:24] Jack: Tyler Da Silva. [00:05:25] Speaker 1: Can I get this? So this person right here is who? [00:05:33] Jack: Tyler Da Silva. [00:05:34] Speaker 1: And this person in the red is who? Jack Snyder. So right now you're behind, we can't see you, but you're right behind Ryan Hines, right? Yes. All right. Okay. Can you play it, please? Stop. Is that you pushing Ryan Hines in the head? [00:05:54] Jack: That's me pushing Ryan Hines, yes. [00:05:56] Speaker 1: So that right there, that's a push, not a punch. That's what you're, that's what you want, what you want these ladies and gentlemen to believe, that that was a push, not a punch. [00:06:04] Jack: Yes, I remember pushing him. [00:06:06] Speaker 1: Can you play the fast, fast break room, please? So right there, what you want these ladies and gentlemen to believe is that you just pushed Ryan in his head, not punched him. That's what you're telling him. [00:06:43] Jack: I'm saying that I remember pushing him. [00:06:46] Speaker 1: But the video would, would contradict what you want these ladies and gentlemen to believe at this point, correct? [00:06:51] Jack: I remember pushing him. [00:06:53] Speaker 1: But the video, that's not responsive to my question. The video does not corroborate what you just told these ladies and gentlemen of the jury, correct? [00:07:01] Jack: I just remember pushing him. [00:07:02] Speaker 1: Non-responsive. Did you push him in the head or did you punch him in the head? You remember pushing him, but does the video show you pushing or punching him? That's my question. [00:07:10] Jack: I pushed him. [00:07:12] Speaker 1: What does the video show? [00:07:13] Jack: Me pushing him. [00:07:15] Speaker 1: So you want these ladies and gentlemen to believe that what just happened there is a push, not a punch, correct? [00:07:20] Speaker 5: Yes. Okay. [00:07:28] Speaker 1: And you also told these ladies and gentlemen of the jury, at some point during this fight, you go over and you try to get Ryan off of Jack, right? Is it Jack? Because at that point, the fight was on and Ryan tackles Jack, right? Yes. And your testimony was that at some point, Tyler Da Silva gets in and does the same thing, right? Yes. That's what you remember, right? [00:07:58] Jack: Yes. [00:07:58] Speaker 1: But isn't it true that Tyler jumps in and also punches Ryan when he's on the ground? [00:08:04] Jack: I think so. I don't remember that happening. [00:08:06] Speaker 1: Is it also true that at some point in time, towards the end of this fight, you use the helmet that's on your head and you slam it into Ryan's head? [00:08:15] Jack: That's not true, no. [00:08:15] Speaker 1: That's not true. Is that not what you remember? Or is that what you're saying is that the video is false? [00:08:20] Jack: I never did that. [00:08:21] Speaker 1: You never did that. Okay. So let's play the rest of this video and then we'll go to the slow-mo. That's you right there in the helmet back there, right? Do you want to wind it a tick? Keep going. Keep going. Stop. That's you right there, right? Yes. And you have a helmet on, right? [00:08:53] Jack: I had the helmet on a lot at the time. [00:08:56] Speaker 1: Play it. Okay. Now we'll play the slow-mo. Now you just saw the helmet slam down on Ryan, right? And you heard the crack of the helmet on Ryan's head? [00:09:13] Jack: I didn't slam the helmet down on him at all. [00:09:15] Speaker 1: So you want these ladies and gentlemen to believe that you did not slam the helmet into Ryan's head when he said when he was on the ground? [00:09:21] Jack: Yes. [00:09:22] Speaker 1: Is that what you remember? Or are you saying the video is false? [00:09:27] Jack: I don't really see that in the video. [00:09:28] Speaker 1: Let's play the slow-mo version. So here's the punch or what you're saying is push. [00:09:43] Speaker 6: There you are here with the helmet, right? [00:09:56] Speaker 1: Here's the punch or what you're saying. [00:09:57] Speaker ?: Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. [00:10:08] Speaker 1: Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. [00:10:15] Speaker ?: Here's the punch or what you're saying. [00:10:16] Jack: Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. [00:10:18] Speaker 1: Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. [00:10:20] Speaker ?: Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. [00:10:25] Speaker 1: Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. [00:10:37] Jack: Here's the punch or what you're saying. [00:10:38] Speaker ?: Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. [00:10:44] Speaker 1: Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. [00:10:47] Speaker ?: Here's the punch or what you're saying. [00:10:48] Speaker 1: Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. [00:10:54] Jack: Here's the punch or what you're saying. [00:10:55] Speaker 1: Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Here's the punch or what you're saying. Yes. And you had no idea what you were going to do. So you guys were driving over to Trumbull High School, right? Yes. And when you were driving over to Trumbull High School, isn't it true that during that ride you were laughing and joking about how you just got into a fight and hurt Ryan Hines? No. You never said that? And as you're going over to Trumbull High School, it's you in the back, back seat behind Jack, right? Yeah. Jack's driving. [00:11:34] Speaker 2: Yes. [00:11:35] Speaker 1: Tyler's in the front seat. Yes. And the middle seat is who? Will Sinjewald, correct? Yes. And to the right of him is Keenan Frasik. Yes. Mackenzie's on your lap. Yes. And Dimitri's in the back. [00:11:46] Jack: Yes. [00:11:50] Speaker 1: And when you're driving over there, you indicated on direct examination, you had your phone on you at that point, right? As a matter of fact, you had your phone all night, right? [00:12:02] Jack: Yes. [00:12:03] Speaker 1: And at some point in time, you're added to a group chat, right? [00:12:09] Speaker ?: Yes. [00:12:10] Speaker 1: When you go over to Trumbull High School, had the group chat already started before you get to Trumbull High School? I believe so, yes. Right. So you knew that because you were already added, right? [00:12:21] Jack: I can't remember if I got added when we got to Trumbull or on the way there. [00:12:28] Speaker 1: Isn't it true that Anthony Greco added you at 11:10 p.m. on Saturday, May 14, 2022 to the group chat? [00:12:39] Jack: I can't remember, but yeah. Well, who's Anthony Greco? [00:12:41] Speaker 1: You know Anthony Greco, right? Football team. Play football. You went to St. Joe's with you, right? Yes. He was at Lazy Brook that night at some point? Did you see him at Lazy Brook? [00:12:50] Jack: No, I don't remember seeing him. [00:12:52] Speaker 1: But he added you to this chat nevertheless, right? Yes. And that was at about 11:10 p.m.? I guess so, yeah. And you indicated on direct examination, you were on your phone, checking the text group messages. You're talking to Will Singewald next to you and you're talking to Mackenzie, right? Yes. And while you were doing all those things, you also had an opportunity to see that Jack was on his phone also, right? Yes. And you saw that Tyler was on his phone, right? Yeah. And when you get to Trumbull High School, how long are you there for? About 20 minutes? [00:13:24] Jack: I can't remember exactly how long we were there for. [00:13:28] Speaker 1: When you get to Trumbull High School, you have a conversation with Jack and Tyler about fighting these kids at Trumbull High School, correct? No, never. Isn't it true that you were in the group chat telling kids to show up to Trumbull High School to fight? Yes. [00:13:45] Jack: I remember telling them to come to Trumbull High School. Right. [00:13:48] Speaker 1: Because you, in this group chat, you're saying Trumbull High, slide, right? RN, right now, Trumbull High, slide, right? Yes. Because at that point, you wanted to meet those kids to fight, right? No. [00:14:00] Jack: We were about to be leaving Trumbull and at the time I thought it would be funny. [00:14:05] Speaker 1: So you wanted to meet those kids at Trumbull High School to fight, right? [00:14:09] Jack: No. [00:14:10] Speaker 1: So at some point in time, you leave Trumbull High School? Yes. And before you leave Trumbull High School, you're again asking them, Trumbull High, slide, right? Slide means come here? [00:14:24] Speaker ?: Yeah. [00:14:25] Speaker 1: And at some point in time, you're in the group chat and you realize that the other kids are talking about an address, right? They say we're going to drop the Addie, right? Does that mean address? [00:14:38] Jack: You're saying the other kids were saying that? Yeah. [00:14:44] Speaker 1: People were talking about giving you an address. Someone was saying we'll drop the Addie, right? You remember seeing that in the group chat? [00:14:50] Jack: No, I remember just seeing the address. [00:14:52] Speaker 1: Okay. Do you recall when someone indicated that we dropped the Addie, you said send it in the group chat? No, I don't remember that. May approach the witness, Your Honor. Looking at the document help to refresh your recollection? Yeah. That's you, right? Do you remember to refresh? [00:15:14] Jack: It says my name, but I don't see the number. [00:15:16] Speaker 1: Did somebody else have your phone that night? [00:15:18] Jack: I don't remember. [00:15:20] Speaker 1: Did somebody else you know named Lito? [00:15:22] Jack: I don't remember, no. [00:15:24] Speaker 1: No. So do you recall asking for the address in the group chat that says send it? [00:15:29] Jack: No. [00:15:30] Speaker 1: You don't recall that? [00:15:31] Speaker ?: No. [00:15:31] Speaker 1: Are you saying that this is not you in the group chat? [00:15:33] Jack: I can't. It says my name, but there's no number. [00:15:36] Speaker 1: Okay. Again, at some point in time later in the group chat, you say Laurel Glenn, correct? [00:15:42] Speaker 2: No. [00:15:43] Speaker 1: You don't? May approach the witness. Would looking at a document help to refresh your recollection? [00:15:47] Speaker 2: Sure, yeah. [00:15:53] Speaker 1: Me though? Does that refresh your recollection? [00:15:56] Jack: Again, it says my name, but not my number. [00:16:00] Speaker 1: So let me ask you this, Mr. Did it refresh your recollection? [00:16:03] Speaker 4: Yes or no? No. No. [00:16:06] Speaker ?: So let me ask you this. [00:16:06] Speaker 1: You recall being added to the group chat by Anthony Greco at 11:10 PM on May 14th of 2022, correct? Yes. You recall that? Yes. Okay. And you also recall telling the kids to slide to Trumbull High School, right? Yes. [00:16:27] Speaker 2: Okay. [00:16:28] Speaker 1: Now, do you recall whether or not your name was Lito in the group chat? [00:16:34] Jack: When you join a group chat, it's just your number. [00:16:38] Speaker 1: It's just your number. But if somebody has your number, your name in their phone, it would say your name, correct? [00:16:43] Jack: Pretty sure it would still be just a number. [00:16:47] Speaker 1: Would looking at a document help to refresh your recollection as to whether or not you told people to slide over to Trumbull? [00:16:52] Jack: No. I knew I said that. [00:16:54] Speaker 1: You knew you said that, right? So if we had a group chat with your name on it and that is corroborated in here that you told them to slide, wouldn't it also be true that if your name is in this group chat subsequent and you told them to drop the address, send it, that would also be you? Or is there two Litos that you know of? [00:17:14] Jack: I can't see the number. It just says my name. [00:17:16] Speaker 1: Right. So wouldn't it stand to reason that Lito is you in the group chat? [00:17:21] Jack: I guess so, yeah. [00:17:26] Speaker 1: You just don't recall saying these things, right? That's your testimony today? [00:17:31] Jack: I only ever remember saying the Trumbull High thing. Right. [00:17:35] Speaker 1: You don't recall asking them to send their address at Laurel Glen. That's what your testimony is, right? Yeah. Yeah. And you don't recall reiterating the address that was sent, Laurel Glen. You say Laurel Glen, right? You actually say it twice in the group chat, but you don't recall that, right? No. That's your testimony today? [00:17:53] Speaker 6: Yes. [00:17:54] Speaker 1: And then at some point in time, you make your way from Trumbull High School over to 43 Laurel Glen, which is Tyler Rich's house, right? Yes. You didn't know it at the time, but that's Tyler Rich's house. You've met Tyler Rich before? Yes. Where have you met him before? Parties. What kind of parties? [00:18:11] Speaker 2: High school parties. [00:18:14] Speaker 1: Have you ever been to high school parties in the Berries? You know where the Berries are in Shelton? [00:18:20] Speaker ?: No. [00:18:21] Speaker 1: No, you don't? You ever recall going to a party on Mulberry, Strawberry, Edelberry, any type of street with a berry last name in Shelton? Ever recall seeing Ricky Fiola at those parties? [00:18:34] Jack: No, I've been to parties in Shelton. Right. [00:18:37] Speaker 1: And you ever recall seeing Matt Lockovich at those parties? Yes. Yeah, you've met him before, right? As a matter of fact, you've had a fight with Matt Lockovich a week before this incident, correct? At one of those parties? [00:18:46] Jack: No, never. [00:18:54] Speaker 1: So you drive over from Trumbull High School, and you indicate a couple cars were there when you got to 43 Laurel Glen, right? [00:19:05] Jack: Can you repeat that? [00:19:07] Speaker 1: When you drove over from Trumbull High School, and you got to 43 Laurel Glen, you indicated on direct examination there were a couple of cars there, right? [00:19:14] Jack: Yeah. [00:19:15] Speaker 1: We pulled up and saw girls from St. Joe's High School. Oh, I'm sorry. Withdrawing. You indicated that when you got there, you saw other cars parked in the street, right? Yes. And there wasn't that many people outside at first, right? I noticed a few kids, right? Isn't that what you said on direct examination? [00:19:40] Jack: Yeah, not that I could see at first. [00:19:42] Speaker 1: And at some point, people came out of the house, right? [00:19:45] Jack: Like everyone came out of the house. Right. [00:19:47] Speaker 1: And people came out of the house because you texted them in the group chat, "We here," right? No. Do you recall doing that? No. Would looking at a document help to refresh your recollection? Sure. And approach the witness you're on. Do you remember it refreshed? [00:20:06] Speaker ?: Yeah. [00:20:07] Jack: I never said that. [00:20:08] Speaker 1: So somebody else had your phone at that point? [00:20:11] Jack: No. Again, it says my name, but not my number. [00:20:13] Speaker 1: So there's another person named Lido in the group chat. [00:20:16] Jack: Anybody can name anybody they want in the group chat. [00:20:21] Speaker 1: But you would agree with me that in the group chat it says, "From Lido, we here," right? [00:20:26] Jack: It just says Lido. [00:20:27] Speaker 1: And then it says, "We here," right? [00:20:29] Jack: Yes. [00:20:30] Speaker 1: So at that point in time, people come out of the house, right? [00:20:35] Jack: Yes. [00:20:36] Speaker 1: And when the people come out of the house, what time of night would you say it was when people came out of the house when you were in front of 43 Lower Glen? [00:20:44] Speaker 2: I can't remember. [00:20:45] Speaker 1: You don't remember? But it was dark out. Yeah. It was late. Yes. Clearly after 11:00, right? Yes. Probably sometime before 11:30-ish. [00:20:54] Jack: I don't know. [00:20:55] Speaker 1: You don't recall? No. And you indicated that you saw people come out and there were about 30 people that came out at that point, right? [00:21:03] Jack: That I could see, yeah, but I know there was more. [00:21:06] Speaker 1: You knew there were more? How did you know there were more? [00:21:08] Jack: Because there was people behind those 30 people. [00:21:10] Speaker 1: There was people behind the 30 people. So you counted each and every one of those people that came outside? [00:21:14] Jack: No, it's just an estimate. [00:21:15] Speaker 1: It's just an estimate, right? So there could have been 20, right? [00:21:18] Jack: It looked like way more than 20 people. [00:21:23] Speaker 1: Right. But it could have been 20, right? [00:21:25] Jack: Yeah. [00:21:26] Speaker 1: So at some point in time, you indicate that Snyder stopped his car, saw a yard and kids coming out to the car, right? Yes. And by the way, at some point in time, you leave the chat at like 11:32 PM. Do you recall doing that? Yes. [00:21:45] Jack: That was before we arrived at the house. [00:21:47] Speaker 1: Before you arrived at the house. So you left the chat. According to the chat, Lito left the conversation. You recall that happened? Yes. Okay. So you recall getting in the conversation. You recall getting out of the conversation. You only recall a few things that you said, but do you think the other person named Lito in the conversation could be somebody else? [00:22:04] Jack: I remember why I left. [00:22:06] Speaker 7: That mischaracterizes the testimony. He has not said he believes there's another person named Lito in the group chat. [00:22:12] Speaker 1: So you recall saying some things in the chat. You just don't recall saying everything in the chat. Is that a fair statement of your testimony? [00:22:20] Jack: I only ever said the things about Trumbull High School. Okay. [00:22:23] Speaker 1: So the other things that are in the chat, that would be inaccurate according to you? [00:22:30] Speaker 2: Yes. [00:22:31] Speaker ?: Okay. [00:22:32] Speaker 1: So you were going over there to fight, correct? [00:22:35] Speaker 2: No. [00:22:36] Speaker 1: And when you got there, kids surrounded the car, right? [00:22:39] Jack: Yes. [00:22:40] Speaker 1: And you indicated that on direct examination, there were rows of people, 10, then maybe 30, right? [00:22:51] Jack: Yes. [00:22:52] Speaker 1: Jack was talking. Tyler was talking because kids had approached the car at that point. [00:22:56] Jack: Yes. [00:22:57] Speaker 1: You indicated kids you knew were there because you texted them in the group chat, right? [00:23:02] Jack: Never said that. [00:23:03] Speaker 1: You said that on direct examination, right? [00:23:06] Jack: No. I said my window was up when all the kids came. When I recognized a few people, I put my window down. [00:23:12] Speaker 1: And who did you recognize? [00:23:13] Jack: Ricky Fiola, Nicky DeJesus, and Aiden King. [00:23:18] Speaker 1: So you spoke to Aiden King when he came next to the car at that point, right? [00:23:22] Jack: I spoke to all three of them. [00:23:23] Speaker 1: Right. And you told Aiden King at some point when it got aggressive that tell your friends to get away from the car. I'm going to break a bottle over somebody's head. [00:23:31] Jack: No, I never said that. [00:23:33] Speaker 1: And there were a few kids shouting at Jack at some point, right? Yes. And it became aggressive according to you? Yes. But at first it was a peaceful conversation, right, according to you? Peaceful? Mine was, yes. [00:23:45] Jack: Mine got aggressive? [00:23:46] Speaker ?: Yes. [00:23:47] Speaker 1: But you didn't see anybody throw anything at that point, right? No. And then you indicated on direct examination you couldn't see anybody outside. So you only saw the three people you knew, Aiden, Ricky, and who was the third? [00:24:00] Jack: Nicky DeJesus. [00:24:02] Speaker 1: So Nicky, Aiden, and Nicky, Aiden, and Ricky you saw. That's it. [00:24:08] Jack: Yes. [00:24:09] Speaker 1: You couldn't hear any threats, right? [00:24:12] Jack: I heard them screaming, but I couldn't. But you couldn't hear any threats, right? [00:24:14] Speaker 1: I couldn't make out what they were saying. And at some point you indicated on direct examination people were hitting the car on all sides, right? Yeah. [00:24:22] Jack: Before that happened somebody punched Jack in the face. [00:24:25] Speaker 1: I'm going to move to strike as non-responsive. [00:24:28] Speaker 4: Sustained. Sustained. Court's going to strike the witness's response after. Yeah. Okay. So the rest of that response, please strike from your notebooks and your tip notes on it. It's not to be considered at all. [00:24:42] Speaker ?: Okay. [00:24:43] Speaker 1: So you indicated on direct examination people hitting the car on all sides, correct? [00:24:47] Speaker ?: Yes. [00:24:48] Speaker 1: All I heard was banging, right? Yes. Didn't hear glass shattering, right? [00:24:54] Jack: No, I don't think so. [00:24:58] Speaker 1: And the car began to rock, right? Yes. You indicated on direct examination you were panicking, right? Yes. This was never like anything you've been through before, right? This was scary, right? [00:25:13] Jack: Yes. [00:25:14] Speaker 1: And at that point you couldn't get out, right? You said that on direct. [00:25:18] Jack: There was no way to get out, no. [00:25:20] Speaker 1: Because there were so many people, right? [00:25:21] Jack: Yes. [00:25:23] Speaker 1: And at some point you thought to yourself, this is not a good idea, right, to be here? [00:25:27] Jack: I just remember being scared. My girlfriend was crying. And I remember telling Jack to drive. [00:25:38] Speaker 1: To drive, right? So Jack drove down the street, right? Yes. And when Jack drove down the street, at some point he stopped, right? Yes. At some point, was Jack driving up and down the street? Do you remember Jack driving up and down the street? I don't remember that, no. [00:25:54] Jack: You don't remember that? [00:25:55] Speaker 1: Could have happened, but you don't remember? [00:25:56] Jack: Yeah, no, I don't remember that. I don't remember that. [00:26:00] Speaker 1: You don't remember. But at some point in time he drives down the street, right? [00:26:06] Speaker ?: And I'm going to go ahead and do that. I'm going to go ahead and do that. I'm going to go ahead and do that. I'm going to go ahead and do that. I'm going to go ahead and do that. I'm going to go ahead and do that. I'm going to go ahead and do that. I'm going to go ahead and do that. I'm going to go ahead and do that. I'm going to go ahead and do that. I'm going to go ahead and do that. [00:26:17] Speaker 1: I'm going to go ahead and do that. I'm going to go ahead and do that. I'm going to go ahead and do that. I'm going to go ahead and do that. I'm going to go ahead and do that. I'm going to go ahead and do that. I'm going to go ahead and do that. I'm going to go ahead and do that. I'm going to go ahead and do that. I'm going to go ahead and do that. I'm going to go ahead and do that. I'm going to go ahead and do that. Jack? [00:26:30] Speaker ?: Yes. [00:26:31] Speaker 1: And it's at that moment that Mackenzie gets out of the car. Yes. She's walking away. Yes. And then you get out of the car at some point, right? Yes, right after. While you're getting out of the car, you're pissed off and you say, "Holy ****, they really **** up your car, Jack. Give me the knife. Where's the knife? [00:26:53] Jack: Give me the knife," right? No. Immediately after I got out or Mackenzie got out. [00:26:57] Speaker 1: Move to strike as non-responsive. Everything after no. [00:26:59] Speaker 4: Cor is going to go ahead and strike the response after the witness indicated the word no. Please to start up from your notes. Thank you. [00:27:08] Speaker 1: Now, you get out of the car with the knife, correct, at this point? [00:27:13] Speaker ?: No. [00:27:14] Speaker 1: Because according to you, on direct examination, Jack gave you the knife when you got out of the car at that point, correct? Yes. [00:27:21] Jack: All right. [00:27:22] Speaker 1: So you did get out of the car with the knife at this point, right? [00:27:25] Speaker 7: Objection, Your Honor. Objection, Your Honor. That mischaracterizes the testimony. He did not testify that he got out with the knife. [00:27:32] Speaker 4: So the witness indicated yes. I'm going to go back to the last question. I'm going to share the last question again. [00:27:42] Speaker 1: So Jack gave you the knife when you got out of the car, correct? [00:27:46] Jack: I was already outside of the car, yes. [00:27:48] Speaker 1: Yes. And he gave you the knife at that point, right? [00:27:50] Jack: Yes. [00:27:51] Speaker 1: And he gave you the knife when you got out of the car at that point when the car initially stopped, right? Car stops, you get out, you get the knife, right? Yes. So you're in possession of the knife when you initially get out of the car on May 14th of 2022, right? Objection, Your Honor. [00:28:08] Speaker ?: Objection, Your Honor. [00:28:09] Speaker 7: I think that mischaracterizes the testimony. Yes. [00:28:13] Speaker 4: It's a stand. [00:28:14] Speaker 7: When you get out of the car, the car stops in front of 36th Laurel Glen. [00:28:18] Speaker 1: You get out of the car, right? [00:28:20] Jack: After Mackenzie, yes. Mackenzie's walking down the street, right? [00:28:23] Speaker 1: Yes. And when you're out of the car, Jack gives you the knife, right? He tosses it at me, yes. [00:28:28] Jack: Right. [00:28:29] Speaker 1: And at some point after that, Tyler De Silva gets out of the car and walks around the car towards you, right? [00:28:34] Jack: No, Tyler De Silva was already next to me when that happened. Okay. [00:28:37] Speaker 1: So it's your testimony that Tyler was next to you when Jack throws you the knife? That's your testimony? [00:28:50] Jack: As I remember it, yeah. [00:28:52] Speaker 1: I'm going to show you states 44 here. Let's go. [00:28:58] Speaker ?: Play it to you. Play it to you. [00:29:08] Speaker 1: All right, Sal. This is states 44. This person right here, standing right here with the dark pants and the shirt, is that you? Can you see where I'm pointing? Is that you out of the car? Yes. So you're in front of the car, correct? Yes. Okay. And at some point we see Tyler De Silva get out of the car and walk next to you, right? Yes. So your testimony is as Jack's driving up the street, he tosses you the knife at this point? [00:29:49] Jack: Yes. And you can see at one point he stopped. [00:29:53] Speaker 1: Everything after yes. [00:29:54] Speaker 4: I'm going to strike everything after yes. Ladies and gentlemen, the majority, so please make meditation accordingly. [00:30:03] Speaker 1: And by the way, when Jack gives you the knife, did you catch it? No. Did it fall? It fell. It fell? Yes. that's when it falls stop stop so I thank you so we didn't see you bend down to pick anything up [00:30:40] Speaker 4: correct so at this point in time and states 44 you're in possession of the knife at this point correct [00:30:55] Speaker 1: yes now these are the kids from 43 low glen that just ran down towards you right yes when they came down [00:31:07] Speaker 5: the street did they have any weapons on them I didn't look to see if they had any weapons but [00:31:14] Jack: you didn't see any weapons right I didn't look to see if they had any what they didn't have any [00:31:18] Speaker 5: weapons on them right didn't look to see if they had any weapons so you didn't see any weapons on [00:31:23] Speaker 1: them that night right I didn't look how would I so at this point in time there's no fighting going on right no and after this video stops no fight occurs down that's down this end of the street right as they ran down we said no answer no fight happens after after this video stops right no physical altercation happens down this end of the street correct no so you had the knife you don't see anybody else with a weapon Jack drives off Mackenzie's in down down the other end of the street right she's at the corner of farmhouse and laurel glen yes and dimitri will and keenan are still in the car as the car drives away right yes so when jack gave you the knife they were in the vicinity of seeing that happen correct they were in the car right can you play the second one so again this is another different angle right Mackenzie's walking down the street and this is you out here just above this bush on the right side and here comes Tyler walking to your right right so car drives away you have the knife at this point right yes Tyler rich runs up to you right is that Tyler rich that ran up the street do you recall [00:33:17] Jack: i saw like two kids run past do you recall them throwing something at the car yes [00:33:24] Speaker 1: who that was no so at some point you you recall who ran down the street like in total no i'm asking first if you were familiar with anybody who ran down the street at that yes ricky fiola right yes Tyler rich yes are you familiar with ty wood yes did you run down the street i can't remember seeing him charlie connery are you familiar with him no you're not familiar do you know so you don't know that the person that testified for the state as our last witness you can't recall if he would if he ran down the street no i didn't see him but there were about seven kids that ran down the street right i don't know exactly how many what was there more than seven or less than seven i'm not sure you would agree with me there was more than three kids right clearly in the video there's more than three kids from the shelter party yes right and would you also agree with me that after this particular part of the video ends there's a whole interaction that happens down the end of the street that's not captured on video right yes and that interaction that's happening is you having the knife right yeah it's in my pocket you have this interaction with tyler rich right yes he's he sprays you with the wd-40 right yes and at some point in time shortly after that happens ricky fiola comes and talks to you right like right after yes right because in your words uh you indicated that he came up to me talked to me made me feel better about the situation right because you had just gotten sprayed right no and as a matter of fact between the time you were in the car when you got the 43 laurel play up until the time where you spoke to ricky fiola the people at that party indicated to you they didn't want you at the house you were supposed to leave right i guess so yeah so when you spoke to ricky not what he said but during your conversation pretty much said you should not be here you should leave right [00:35:40] Jack: no so yeah he actually said you should stay he was talking bad about tyler rich right and then he [00:35:47] Speaker 1: said you guys should probably just leave right no he never said that he never said that he said probably you should just hang out in the corner and uh you know figure it out right i can tell you what he said well i don't want to know what he said but the reality is the conversation you had with ricky fiola was hey i was really messed up that he's ready with wd-40 but look there's a lot of us and there's only a few of you guys it's not smart you probably should just leave are you saying that that conversation didn't happen that's not what he said okay so but nevertheless these three four or five kids that run down the street including tyler rich they do not engage you in a physical altercation down the street correct just sprayed me with wd-40 and walked away right yeah he walked back to his house right yes and when he walked back to his house you guys stayed down the street for a little bit right yes and so your testimony today is you were never told to leave the area i've never heard anybody say that ricky fiola 100 didn't say that and at that point you said on direct examination um you were scared and confused right terrified about the group of people that were down down the road right just everything and you were scared even when the people walked down the street right when they came when they came down the street towards farmhouse road that scared you when they [00:37:09] Speaker 5: were running at us yes you were panicked yeah you were concerned yes you had your phone on you at that [00:37:14] Speaker 1: point right most likely yes most likely right so at any point between the time you got out of the car and the time the kids ran down the street you never called for somebody to give you a ride home right no mackenzie's sister was going to give me and you never called for uh an uber right to bring you out of that situation right mc's sister was going to give me a ride home and you never called for a lift right because mackenzie's sister was coming to pick you up yes so mackenzie's sister was going to pick you up at the corner of farmhouse road in laurel glen right yes you knew that because you had a conversation with mackenzie about getting a ride home yes because on direct examination you indicated that you walked over to mackenzie and said hey listen can i get a ride home i don't want to be here [00:38:05] Jack: anymore right i don't remember my exact words but i remember asking her for a ride because you were [00:38:12] Speaker 1: concerned you wanted to get out of that situation mackenzie had her head down right yes she was on her phone safe to say she wasn't paying attention to things going on around her yes isn't it true mackenzie was mad at you at that point because she didn't want to go to tyler riche's [00:38:37] Jack: house and you didn't stick up for her no she initially started crying and got upset when they [00:38:43] Speaker 1: were hitting the car and by the way the state called 25 witnesses in this case right yes and you were here for all 25 of those witnesses right yes and the story you're telling us today is the first time [00:38:55] Jack: we've heard this story right i was never asked by anybody to tell them i'm gonna move to strike as [00:39:01] Speaker 4: non-responsive so the court's going to go ahead and strike the witnesses response to the question as being non-responsive called for yes and out so this is the first time we're hearing this story correct yes [00:39:19] Speaker 1: mackenzie knew a lot of those kids at that house right you knew that yes and she didn't want to be there right after they started hitting the car right at some point time after this video ends will gets out of the car right yes and keenan gets out of the car right yes and dimitri gets out of the car right yes and at some point in time they sit down at the corner because they're waiting for a ride right [00:39:51] Jack: um i remember them sitting around mckenzie at one point but you were not under the impression that [00:39:56] Speaker 1: were they were waiting also waiting for mckenzie's sister the only person i knew that was waiting [00:40:01] Jack: for a ride like definitely was will singemore because he was calling his girlfriend because his [00:40:05] Speaker 1: girlfriend carol carolyn tackis was coming to get him right yes right so as far as you were concerned carolyn was coming to get will and dimitri and keenan had no right home at that point is that what you're saying uh yes but nevertheless will keenan dimitri mckenzie don't get back in the car with jack at some point right can you say that again at some point in time jack you and de silva get in the car and go back down to 43 laurel glenn right yes right but when that happens will doesn't get in the car right nobody else gets in the car right mckenzie doesn't get in the car right dimitri doesn't get in the car right and neither does keenan right because they didn't want to get involved with what was going to happen right because they were asked not to i'm going to move to strike is non-responsive that's the answer in the yes or no [00:41:07] Speaker 4: so they didn't get in the car because they didn't want to be involved with what was going to happen [00:41:18] Speaker 1: correct no and at some point in time you indicate that you say tyler's your best friend right growing up you met him since eight years old yes and jack was only just an acquaintance from st joe's right you weren't really [00:41:37] Speaker 2: friends with him not as close as tyler right but you all hung out right yes and you all would go to [00:41:46] Speaker 1: parties together on the weekends right yes you guys were football buddies right yeah we all played football in fact it wasn't uncommon for jack to pick you and tyler up and go to a party right he was always the one that drove he was always the one that drove right and when you guys are in school you guys would always hang out and talk right at football practice not really at football so you didn't associate with jack in school just in football practice i didn't have any of the same classes okay so you never saw him in the hallway and said hey jack what's up so you so you associated with him right and but jack was always the one that drove you guys it wasn't tyler right not always but if we were going out with jack he was driving but you went out with them a lot is the point right whenever you would go out would be you tyler and jack right no no even though jack always drove [00:42:45] Jack: majority of the time jack always drove when we went out with him okay but you didn't go out with him [00:42:50] Speaker 1: a lot that's what you're saying now okay so at some point in time there's a conversation you say on direct examination there's a conversation between jack and tyler on uh in this area right you don't know what the conversation is about it was something i don't want to know what it was about do you know what it was about or yes or no someone you know someone was about so and based on that information you were still scared yes and you were still concerned and you were still worried about what could happen yes and at some point in time jack gets in the car yes tyler gets in the car yes and you get in the car yes and you're still concerned right and you go back down to 43 laurel glenn right yes because you're still concerned right now i'm responsive i would ask that's it be stricken [00:43:46] Speaker 4: it's going to strike the witness's response as non-responsive call for yes and thank you [00:43:54] Speaker 1: so at some point in time you get in the car with jack and tyler correct yes and you are going to go back to 43 loyal glenn right yes and you're going to go and talk to some kids that had just damaged the car right yes through stuff at the car right yes bounced on the car right yes almost uh almost uh withdrawn did these things for about a 30 to 40 second period right when you were initially in front of 43 loyal glenn i don't know how long it was was it was it fast was it fast interaction was it slow interaction i can't remember but nevertheless these are the kids that damaged the car right yes and you were going back to talk to them right yes these are the same kids right that you said you were very concerned about yes you were very worried about yes you were you were panicking when this was going on right yes but you went back to 43 laurel glenn right yes you could have stayed at the corner of farmhouse road and laurel glenn and waited for mackenzie's sister to pick you up [00:45:08] Speaker 4: right move to strike as non-responsive we'll go ahead and strike the witnesses responses and then responsive question called for yes and no answer you could have stayed at the corner of laurel glenn and [00:45:22] Speaker 1: farmhouse road correct yes but you didn't do that did you no and you got back in that car with the knife yes and you indicated on direct examination you were scared to get back in the car right yes but you did it anyway yes and you didn't have to go back to that house did you so you get back to the house right and you get out of the car right yes i may approach a little shorter jack drives the car and stops the car right about here on states 50q in front of his mountains right right in the middle of the road [00:46:30] Speaker 2: right there's a car parked here right yeah he stops right about here okay [00:46:35] Speaker 1: it's not it's really close to how close to the car did you open the door i wasn't i wasn't i wasn't on that side right but you're on that side at one point then they weren't yes so you don't go right yes right so the car was closer to the center of the road right yes and tyler gets out of my passenger seat right he walks around the car and under the grass right yes you saw this right yes you got out of the rear pass machine on jackson right yes and you walk around the car and you never lost sight of the title right yes so you look at him over over the suv right that's where your testimony is you want to run around the suv you just said that you didn't lose sight so you looked over the suv to see where tyler was right so my point is you didn't see him right you just walked around the car then you made contact out again right yes okay and tyler was on the left tyler was in this area at some point to the left right you're on the right and when you initially got there there were like 10 people in the uh in the yard right [00:48:07] Speaker 2: i can't remember exactly how many we were first approached by lily lombardi [00:48:15] Speaker 1: you indicated on direct examination there were people in the yard right yes you said 10 people at first in the back correct around me they were far back right yeah close to where that little hole is in the uh where they came out of it was really dark it was really dark you couldn't see you didn't recognize anybody at that point right they were too far away and you had the knife in your pocket when you got out right yes when people started coming out of the house were there girls that came out of the house also the first person we spoke to was a girl was there more than one girl at the house do you recall well lily lombardi right taylor capella was there i didn't see her do you know taylor capella are you saying there was only one girl at the party that night [00:49:22] Speaker 2: i only i'm saying i only saw and spoke to one girl you only spoke to one girl but you don't know if [00:49:27] Speaker 1: there were other girls later on in the evening that were outside watching right there could have been you just don't know and you said at some point 30 kids come out right uh yes or no yes we were approached by rich and everybody else there were 30 people right [00:49:50] Speaker 2: no at first it was around 30 people and then everybody came out [00:50:02] Speaker 1: and how many of those people were girls i didn't see any girls you didn't see any girls so there could have been girls in the back you just don't know yeah and when they came out you recognized only tyler rich right yeah and you had your conversation with tyler rich five so you just stood there yeah and um ryan hines approached you yeah and you had a conversation with ryan hines and that was the kid that you had pushed in the head according to your testimony earlier that night at lazy brook correct yes and you were next to tyler when this was happening yes and you indicated on direct examination there were a wall of people at some point in front of you right yes right and initially it was the civil was talking about 10 people he said that on direct remember that like he was there was all of them were all together but he was directly talking it was like a line of people it was you this is tyler this is you there's a line of people in front of people right there's about 10 people and when you're talking to these people [00:51:19] Jack: you're asking where aiding king is right i asked ryan hines i was like where's aiding king that's my [00:51:24] Speaker 1: boy that's your what my boy like my friend that's your friend yeah you heard aiding king testify in this case right yes you heard him testify that you said tell the people get away from the car i'm going to smash a bottle in somebody's head right yeah he said that and you indicated on direct examination that you were speaking with four to five people right yeah you were speaking with ryan hines yeah uh ty wood remember ty wood do you know who ty wood is you know who ty was you don't recall seeing him there that night i was mainly talking with ryan hines and phase on teal was was close by at this point i believe so yes and so uh at some point uh were there other people that you recognized there at the time besides uh ty wood ryan hines and [00:52:20] Speaker 2: and tyler rich there was a giant group of people there were so many but you don't know everybody [00:52:25] Speaker 1: that was there no and the knife was in your pocket at this point yes and the people you were talking with didn't have any weapons on them right not that i saw not right and you were getting nervous yes and you recall at some point so at the end of your testimony yesterday on direct examination you indicated that um there were four to five people that you were speaking with but then today when you started testifying you indicated there was 20 to 25 people just on you do you remember that yeah so was it four to five people or 20 to 25 people they were all together it's [00:53:06] Speaker 2: not like it was only four who came up and talked to us or they were all together [00:53:12] Speaker 1: and when you're walking up to to tyler rich's house they're telling you to leave the property right no and when you're walking up to tyler rich's house you see the kids start coming out of the house right yes and at that point you could have turned around and went back to the car right yes but you didn't do that right at some point you indicated there were people everywhere right and people were saying stuff right it was aggressive people were arguing you were arguing back tyler was arguing back and you indicated you were smaller at the time right much smaller than you are today right but you you felt like you were okay at that point because you had a knife on you right so you approached kids that had just thrown stuff at the car right yes that had dented the car right yes that had jumped and bounced and rocked the car right yes and you were panicked because of it and you were worried and you approached these kids at that point at tyler's house with a knife in your pocket correct yes at some point in time you make a move towards ty wood correct you flinch like you're going to hit somebody right and when that happens you get punched by tyler tyler rich right i stuck my hand up for somebody to speak answer i would ask i would move to strike as non-responsive [00:54:51] Speaker 4: one who's going to strike the portion of the witness's response after no okay so anything after note of the question please strike from your uh notes that's not to be considered evidence [00:55:06] Speaker 1: and at some point you get hit in the head right on the left side of your head right and you don't know who punched you do you you know now who punched you right but at the time you did not know who punched you right is it true that you you thought you got hit in the head with a bottle at that point yeah but it wasn't a bottle right i don't know right and you indicated on direct examination at that point everything went black how long would you say it went black for it's impossible to tell i have no idea you have no idea how so maybe it was like two seconds or longer or longer how long how long there's no way to tell no way to tell and your face was in the ground and all you saw were people hitting and kicking you right yeah and you didn't see any weapons right no i just saw the ground and the knife was in your pocket yeah [00:56:14] Speaker 2: and at some point people were yelling right yelling yeah and uh [00:56:23] Speaker 1: people were uh you couldn't see but people were all around you that was your that was your testimony on direct right people were all around you but you couldn't see so how were you able to see if people were all [00:56:34] Jack: around you if your head was in the ground before they hit me there started like circling me but when [00:56:40] Speaker 1: you were in the ground and you were in the fetal position you couldn't see who was around you right no i just felt you couldn't tell if there was one person engaging you right it was way more than one could you tell if it was one person that was engaging you at that point it was way more than you have eyes in the back of your head do you have eyes in the back of your head objection your own argumentative mr valley you indicated on direct examination that your head was in the ground right yes and you were down on the ground looking at the ground right yes and when your head is down on the ground could you tell if there were two people engaging you could tell there was way more than two could you tell if there was one person engagement how there was way more than could you tell if there were three people until there was way more could you tell if there were four people how many people did did you see how many people did you see engage you when you were on the ground looking at the ground i just felt stuff coming from everything so you couldn't tell how many correct yes and you still had the knife on you at that point yes and you indicated under on direct examination that you lost consciousness how long would you say you lost consciousness for there's no way to there's no way to tell so you blacked out right yeah and you lost consciousness right i was at the same time that was at the same time but you don't know how long it was would you agree with me that the fight on the video doesn't capture the entire fight right no not anywhere close to the video is about 17 seconds long right and the fight in its entirety is probably about 25 to 30 seconds long right no no it's longer than that was like five minutes no how long would you say it was it's impossible to tell especially when you're like in this situation 45 seconds it felt it felt it felt like an eternity though right but it was about 45 seconds you don't know how long but you lost consciousness at some point during that in that that whole altercation right and you don't know how long you lost consciousness for now at some point when you regained consciousness you took the knife out of your pocket right now when the knife was in your pocket it was closed right so you had to take the knife out of your pocket right your right pocket you had to open the knife right my other hand was covering your head telling your state's 95 picture of the is a a replica of the knife that you had that night correct i looked at it you never looked at it but it was a it was a knife that opened in this manner correct you had to open the knife [00:59:38] Speaker 5: i can't i don't even remember opening you don't remember opening well was the knife opened in your [00:59:44] Speaker 1: right pocket when it was in your pocket i don't think so no no so if if this was the knife or if this is a copy of what the knife looked like it would have been closed in your pocket correct yeah right so when you're on the ground you stick your right hand in your pocket you take the knife out of your pocket [01:00:04] Jack: correct and then you proceed to open the knife right no i don't remember my other hand i remember was [01:00:11] Speaker 1: the whole time holding my head so you opened that knife with one hand yes you recall doing that no i don't remember opening the knife and when you take the knife out you have it in your hand your right hand right yes and you have it in your hand like this in your fist and the blade is up this way right and you say on direct examination you were flailing your arms do you remember saying that and you indicated that you were swinging the knife right yeah show you states 56 this is ryan hines you remember ryan hines from that night yeah this is the kid that you say you pushed at lazy brook and then did not slam in the head with your helmet remember that yes he's got a lot of facial injuries would you would you agree no no states 53 would you agree mr valley that mr hines has contusions on his head correct i see the one on the top of his head you don't see the ones on the side of his head you don't see that his nose is broken here on the side it just looks like acne states 84. you see the contusion on his head yes that wasn't caused by your helmet did you do that at 43 laurel glenn so somebody else must have done that yeah i guess you have the knife in your hand you have it in the fist right states eight seven and you stab ryan hines in his chest and puncture his lung correct [01:02:26] Speaker 5: like this right wasn't aiming or anything and you stab him in the side he states 89 right that's not a swipe would you agree that's a stab right it's pulling my arm that was a stab right i was pulling [01:02:43] Speaker 7: my arm around so you're indicating that this is a swipe objection your honor i think that mischaracterizes this is the testimony [01:02:50] Speaker 1: sustained states 91 you were flailing your arms he stabbed it again in the left side correct yeah so he stabbed three times right yes states 54 phase on teal you remember seeing him there that night right i think so when you stabbed him state 70 once in the upper extremity in his left arm right yes while you were flailing your arms yes that's about an inch or so right and at some point they let you go right oh and when they let you go at that point tommy connery comes over right because ryan hines is now out of it because you just stabbed him three times right they never let go tommy connery comes over remember tommy connery states 55 that's tommy connery right yeah and you're down on the ground right you're bent over right no you're not bent over it's on the ground you're on the ground and you go after tommy connery states 77 and you stabbed him four times in his leg correct i didn't go after anybody and at some point in time you're chased out into the street right yeah and you fall down you said according to your direct testimonies you you fall and you skin your your hands on the ground that was after that was after that was the second time not the first time but at some point in time you go out into the street right and we see that in the video correct yeah i got thrown like towards the clock right and you run back to the car right yes and you run back to the car and you go to get in the car right no one chased you to the car correct yes i did they did okay let's play [01:05:41] Speaker 6: stop it who's this person right here running back to the car [01:05:59] Jack: who's chasing i see you back it up a little bit you see all those people right no they stopped [01:06:05] Speaker 1: back it up back it up back up right here right these kids right here yeah they're chasing you they stopped right i didn't look backwards but they stopped right the video shows that they're stopped here at this point right they're not they're not chasing you up to the car right the camera turns play it again just keep going that's you right and you're at the car by yourself stop it do you see any kids coming now from your left side if they're chasing you but in the video they're not chasing you right i didn't look that way my question to you is in the video they're not chasing you to the car right now at this point the kids are retreating back onto the property right i look i was just looking for tyler so the answer to my question is you didn't see where the kids were retreating back to that right i just looked for tyler but they didn't come after you at the car right i just looked for tyler i don't know i would move to strike his non-responsive [01:07:27] Speaker 4: portal strength that was his last response [01:07:40] Speaker 1: you indicated on direct examination that you were thrown into the car remember testifying to that i was pushed towards the car the video doesn't show you being thrown into the car does it i guess not you're going to have to make sure that you're going to have to do that right now at some point in time you say you saw tyler back on the lawn right yeah you still have the knife on you at that point right knife was still out in your hand right and you come back into the fight right yeah now tyler's being pushed into the street at this point right yes and you would agree with me that there are no shelton kids to the right of you right there's a car we can see a car right there right [01:08:47] Jack: and there's kids like right kids in front of you right yes but there's no kids right to the right [01:08:52] Speaker 1: of there's a car we could see the car if there were we wouldn't be able to see the car right that's the street right there's nobody to the right of you right there's there's a kid in front of you yeah there's a whole bunch of kids right right there's a whole bunch of kids over here we can't see but there's nobody to the right of you right there's a kid right next to him there's a kid here but i'm saying you're is this you right here yes right to the right of you do you see a kid or a car that's the street that's the street and there's a car there right yeah so there's nobody to the the right of you right there's a car there's nobody in the street and there's nobody to the left of you other than tyler da silva right yeah so when you're going back in there's a just a wall like this right looks like this right but you're not surrounded at that point right that point no no but you go back in and tyler's already pushed out to the street right [01:09:48] Speaker 5: the video i'm coming on my way back as you see but tyler is no longer engaged in the fight right [01:09:55] Speaker 1: i don't i don't remember you don't remember that so you just blacked out and ran right back into the into the fold that's that's your testimony today being on the yard and it was just like a shoe horse of people a shoe horse but not a circle you were not encircled right look was there anybody behind me right there's nobody behind you i don't know i don't think so right so you could have if you chose to you could have left you could have retreated right so you could not have left because there were people around you yes so you just said there was a semi-circle of people on the yard now you're saying that you were surrounded it's like this so semi-circle right yeah not a circle a circle [01:10:39] Jack: goes like this right yeah i wasn't going to turn my back to that many people you weren't going to [01:10:44] Speaker 1: i had moved to strike as non-responsive your honor [01:10:48] Speaker 4: all right i'm gonna allow the costumes [01:11:04] Speaker 1: you indicated when you made it back to the car you were still terrified right yeah you were still scared you came back in anyway right with the knife and you ran over to the edge of the grass right and you passed tyler right yes he passed you on your left correct yes you indicated that you saw matt lakovich yes but you also indicated on direct you couldn't see who hit you you said you were hit yes you remember saying that you couldn't see who hit you i remember getting hit but you don't know who hit you you recall um subsequent during your direct examination you said matt lakovich hit me i said it could have been him could have been but you don't know who hit you and when you were running back into the into the fight you had the knife out right and people that were in front of you were defending themselves from you weren't they oh they kept coming in they kept coming at you while you had a knife out approaching them i was like i was standing still right there you heard charlie connery yell he's got a knife he's got a knife right i just heard screaming i couldn't at the time you don't recall hearing that during during the incident right but on the video you hear hear him yell he's got a knife he's got a knife right and you're saying that people engaged you while you had a knife at this point in time nobody backed up nobody backed up but nobody attacked you they were stepping forward [01:12:54] Jack: and somebody ended up hitting me you couldn't see who hit you [01:13:00] Speaker 1: and you couldn't see if anybody had a weapon on them at that point right and at some point you indicate that you turned around well with run at some point in time you turn right to run back to the car right yeah but when you're turning to run back to the car you see jimmy mcgrath and you stab him in the chest correct no have you seen the autopsy photos sir yes did you see where his injuries happen in his upper left chest are you saying you did not stab jimmy mcgrath in the heart i didn't plan move to strike is non-responsive [01:13:54] Speaker 4: total strike everything after i'm not sure we got a response so i will strike the response [01:14:01] Speaker 1: isn't it true you just you just testify that i didn't want to turn my back on these people right yes but you turned your back on these people when you were when you were trying to get out of there right i i was facing backwards you were facing backwards so you're facing the group and what are you backing up like this no i was standing right you're not backing up right you're not backing up and as a matter of fact this is jimmy mcgrath on the left here right [01:14:28] Speaker 5: yes and he doesn't have a weapon on does he he's not engaging you is he stepping forward he's stepping [01:14:38] Speaker 1: forward they all stepped forward but he doesn't have a weapon on it does not that i saw no it would be unfair for somebody who doesn't have a weapon to be stabbed by somebody who does right i didn't try [01:14:53] Speaker 5: to stab anybody but you stabbed them didn't you yes you turned around and stabbed jimmy mcgrath in his chest oh so you didn't stab him i didn't see it happen i didn't feel me stab [01:15:05] Speaker 1: i didn't go up to him and stab him are you saying it was somebody else that stabbed jimmy mcgrath i was the only one with a knife correct you were the only one with the knife and you turned around and you stabbed jimmy mcgrath in the chest and then you left right oh you may be seated thank you [01:15:25] Speaker 4: at this time i would direct the defendant mr valley to please retake the witness stand i'll just remind you that you do your management of the obligations here i thought you took on your [01:15:42] Speaker 2: one keep it on this one thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you [01:15:48] Speaker ?: so so so welcome back ladies and gentlemen jerry council please to give to the return of our trust [01:16:24] Speaker 4: state was simply your honor defense to do a china i offered the state to continue this testimony thank [01:16:45] Speaker 1: thank you so leto um after you stabbed jimmy mcgrath on may 14th of 2022 you indicated on direct examination you dove towards the car you remember that yes and then you indicated you got into the front passenger seat of the car right yes and when you got in the front passenger seat of the car at that moment tyler da silva wasn't in the car at that moment was he no tyler got in a few moments after you right yes and before tyler da silva gets in the car you tell jack oh my god i just stabbed four [01:17:28] Jack: kids correct no when i first got into the car he tried to drive off and i said wait so you don't admit [01:17:35] Speaker 1: to jack to jack that you stabbed four kids no but you would agree with me that in hindsight you did stab four kids right i didn't know who i stabbed or where i stabbed him i'm going to ask a very simple question it requires a yes or no answer you would agree in hindsight that you stabbed four kids correct [01:17:58] Jack: i don't know who got stabbed or where they got stabbed as you sit here today you would agree [01:18:03] Speaker 1: that you stabbed four kids correct yes so at some point jack uh tyler gets in the car right yes and the car is facing if i may approach the car and the car is facing adam's drive correct and you get in the car and jack drives straight correct yeah and he takes a left down adam's drive right um so you were not paying attention as to where you were driving but at some point in time very shortly after you getting in the car the car stops in a cul-de-sac right i don't know where it stopped and you get out of the car with the knife and throw it into the woods correct no so your testimony today is that you get out of the car you tell jack to stop right yes you get out of the car right yes and at that moment the one thing you were concerned about was looking at your ribs that was your testimony on direct yeah i had a very sharp pain you weren't concerned with the fact that you just stabbed four kids at that point right i didn't know who got stabbed or where they got you recall stabbing some kids at the party right i was just flailing my arm around so you had no idea you stabbed anybody at the house no you were just flailing back and forth like this swiping motions everything when you got in jack's car you didn't call the police at that point did you no in fact after you drove when you first got to 43 laurel glenn and you drove down the street you didn't call the police at that point right no and you didn't call the police when you got out of the car down the street at the intersection of laurel glenn and farmhouse lane correct no and you didn't call the police just slightly before you went back to 43 laurel glenn right so at some point you get back in the car after checking your ribs right you just you determined you were okay there was no nothing was going on you used the light the light from in inside of the car right that's your testimony yes you get back in the car and you drive back to where will mckenzie dimitri and keenan right there was nobody like there was nobody there they were in the car so mcken uh mckenzie's sister was already there yes but so my point is you drove back to the area where those kids were your friends right and your girlfriend yes and at that point you say to jack and tyler stop stop the car right yes and you say i love you guys i'm going with kenzie right i don't remember if i said anything i just remember going and getting in and you get out of the car yes and they take off tyler and tyler gets in the front seat do you recall tyler getting in the front seat they take off right remember seeing them take off you don't remember you just remember you getting in the car and that's it and then we drove off now you were um in mckenzie's car and you were listening to music yeah it was a quiet ride right outside of the music there was no talking right [01:21:54] Jack: keenan talked to me ken was talking [01:22:04] Speaker 1: and when you got into mckenzie's sister's car you didn't call the police at that point right because you were shocked all right you were shocked at that point you indicated that you didn't record you don't you didn't realize you stabbed anybody but you were still in a panic yeah and you indicated that um you didn't uh you dropped off kenan and dimitri right yeah mckenzie was still upset she didn't want to talk to you yes in fact when she dropped they dropped you off in milford you asked to talk to mckenzie right yes and she would not talk to you right yes and you got inside your house yes and you got inside your house after midnight right i don't remember the time it was late right would you agree that the uh the video from 36th laurel glenn has 11 40 when you initially go down the street and about 11 53 when you're taking off and leaving the area for good do you recall that i'm not sure what time that was but it was late right yeah and your your mother's packing for florida yeah and your brother's packing for florida yes because you had an early flight and you weren't going at that point right just prior to to coming home you were not going to florida yes but when you got home you decided you were going to florida at [01:23:43] Jack: that point right when my mom had asked me yes [01:23:52] Speaker 1: and you had told your mother what had happened right it's in pieces and at that point in time you didn't call the police you didn't tell [01:24:03] Jack: him your side of the story right even after the police never asked me [01:24:09] Speaker 1: how would i move to the strike is non-responsive your honor [01:24:14] Speaker 4: following the response of no ladies and gentlemen [01:24:19] Speaker 1: so you didn't call the police that night right no as a matter of fact while mackenzie is driving home she engaged engages in a text message with you right uh yes states 97 around 12 26 a.m right this is when the text messages are going on you're already home at this point right yes she's driving home at this point right i have no idea you texted her you texted with each other shortly after her dropping you off right [01:25:02] Speaker 5: i don't remember when i just know i texted with her [01:25:06] Speaker 1: within how long how long what how long were you home before you started texting you don't recall but in any event you talk to your your girlfriend and you tell her i didn't do anything i wasn't there stop texting you know that was a lie right yeah i was just panicking [01:25:26] Jack: i didn't know what to say [01:25:31] Speaker 1: states 98 again i wasn't there that was a lot right because you were there right yeah states 99 don't text me i'm going to florida right yeah so at that moment in time what you thought was important was to go to florida instead of calling the police right i didn't know what to think my question to you is at that point in time you decided to go to florida instead of calling the police right i don't know what i was i was you called the police in this moment right so at that point in time you said i'm going to florida right you told against you that right you didn't say i'm calling the police right because you told her you weren't there right i was just freaking out i didn't really know what to say states 100 i can't text anything i wasn't there you can't text anything because why because you're afraid of making an admission no and again you're saying i wasn't there that's three times you're telling your girlfriend who was with you at the scene that you weren't there right yes so you go to florida early the next day with your mother and your brother right yes and you were going to florida to see your other brother right yes and what was your other brother doing in florida living where was he living in stuart florida stuart and you were down there for a day i don't remember how long i was found out do you remember flying home with your mother uh on monday night the uh 16th of may i remember flying home i don't remember exactly what day it was you indicated on direct examination that you found out the severity of what had happened when you were in florida right yes now who did you find that out i can't remember exactly but one of my friends had texted me one of your friends had texted you and when you found out the severity of what had happened uh while you were in florida you didn't call the police at that point either did you no do you recall the day that you flew home would looking at a document help to refresh your recollection sure may approach the witness your honor remember the refreshments to when you came home yeah when did you come home uh showed me that's like 7 or 10 p.m 10 p.m on the 16th right yes and at some point in time on the 16th were you aware that there was a warrant for your arrest i think at that time no no and you indicated that the next day you slept late were you sleeping to the afternoon you were sleeping you were sleeping and at some point you found out that there was a warrant for your arrest right but you didn't turn yourself in [01:29:11] Jack: when you woke up right yes i got in the car with my dad and instantly isn't it true you didn't turn [01:29:16] Speaker 1: yourself in until four in the morning on wednesday the 18th yeah it was around that time so it wasn't the next day after you got home from florida right i don't remember when it was at some point in time after the incident on may 14th of 2022 tyler da silva texts you or calls you on the phone rather do you remember that i never called him and you had a conversation with him right and you told him you right [01:29:55] Speaker 2: i called him and he never answered [01:30:06] Speaker 1: so on the 18th of may when you turn yourself in the uh the police took pictures of you that council went went through with you right and this is a picture states 34 that's a picture of the front right side of your face right yes [01:30:31] Speaker 5: no blood no serious contusions like like ryan hines right this was days after days after your quick [01:30:39] Jack: healer yes right pictures of ryan hines for the same day i think states 35 [01:30:49] Speaker 1: no serious contusions on your face right no no no serious black and blues right this is right those were this was days this was three days later right i don't know how many days you say it's 36 and a little bit of the black and blue on your on your left eye there right but nothing nothing huge right [01:31:13] Speaker 7: right objection your honor do you speak for themselves he's asking him to give an opinion on [01:31:18] Speaker 1: the right you don't have a serious black and blue on your eye right that's not states 37 the rear of your head you can't really see any serious contusions on the back of your head in this in this picture right four days later yes i see one you see one where do you see it on the left side on the left side right so we have states 38 we can show that right here again not really that area there four days later doesn't really look like the black and blues that tommy connery had a month later right doesn't really look like the black and blues that ryan hines on the head on the side of his body [01:32:07] Speaker 7: objection your honor asking him to make a comparison between somebody else's injuries and what are in these photos it's improper [01:32:18] Speaker 1: you have a scratch mark states 40 right it's a little scratch mark on your ratio right hand right arm yes states 42 no real marks on your hands right no states 43 again no marks on your hands right so just to confirm on may 14th of 2022 you were the only one with a knife at tyler richard's house correct no idea did somebody else have a knife at tyler richard's house not that i know of you didn't see anybody else with a weapon that night [01:33:18] Speaker 2: right i didn't look for any weapons you didn't see any did you you didn't see any did you no i didn't look [01:33:28] Speaker 1: there were four people that were stabbed that night right yes and those four people had nine stab wounds correct i believe so yes and you're the one responsible for that correct [01:33:44] Jack: the time i didn't know who got stabbed or where they got stabbed or when i got stabbed [01:33:49] Speaker 1: you're the one who's responsible for those stab wounds correct [01:33:54] Speaker 2: i don't know i guess so yes [01:34:01] Speaker 1: everyone for the questions right thank you [01:34:05] Speaker 7: briefly your honor mr valley do you remember mr durso asking you about having an interaction with some of the shelton high kids at the intersection of laurel glenn and farmhouse lane yes and we saw a video of vehicle coming by and you testified that that's when mr snyder gave you the knife it tossed it to me yes and then you saw some of those shelton high kids come up and approach you right yes and you had the knife then right yes and you got sprayed in the face with wd-40 yes [01:34:45] Jack: why didn't you use the knife then i wasn't in fear of my life i had no reason to use it [01:34:53] Speaker 7: you went back down to 43 laurel glenn drive in jack snyder's car right yes you had the knife that jack snyder had given you at that point right yes you used it then no you used it when you got down there and you're confronted with those kids and you're on the ground as you've described for us here yes why [01:35:18] Jack: felt like the only thing that was going to save me nothing further [01:35:24] Speaker 1: mr valley you had the knife when you're down at the corner of farmhouse lane and laurel glenn right yes and you willingly got back into jack's car right yes and you went back to tyler rich's house right yes and you willingly got out of the car at tyler rich's house correct to make peace you got out of tyler rich's car with the knife correct yes and you walked onto the property at that point correct yes you had no right to be there correct i don't know you didn't have an invitation to be on the property correct [01:36:05] Jack: when we first arrived it's not like they came and threw us out or anything well you told us before [01:36:10] Speaker 1: sir that you were scared and panicked for your life when the kids were rocking and throwing things at the car right yes you didn't want to be there in that situation right yes but you went back with a knife to tyler rich's house the very same house that you were in the car and with things being thrown at where you were panicked and scared right the knife was already in my pocket right yes but you went back to that house where you said you were panicked and scared in the car minutes before when they were rocking and throwing things at the car correct and you got out of that car with the knife to go confront those kids right i didn't go and confront them because i but you got out of the car with the knife right and you walked on the property [01:36:53] Speaker 4: there's no further questions nothing further your honor does the defense intend to call any additional releases the defense does not your honor the defense [01:37:15] Speaker 1: would rest your own state has no further what does the state rest all right similar rebuttal your honor uh [01:37:43] Speaker 4: at some point may the jury be excused for legal arguments at this point in time i am actually going i should send the jury home you want me to send the jury home at this point that's fine no objection your honor all right so the court is going to release the jury for today okay so i just want to remind you that we are at the part of the trial where you have heard all of the evidence that you're going to hear in this case however you've not yet heard closing arguments you've not yet heard the instructions regarding the law that you're to apply to the facts you find in this case as such as in my prior instruction to you on your own you're not at a point where you can discuss this case with anyone including each other so you're not at that point despite the fact that you've heard all the evidence so it may seem natural that you are at the phase where you can talk about this with your fellow jurors but you cannot all right so you need to continue to abide by that instruction until such time that i tell you that you are able to go ahead and conduct your deliberations so we are going to return with respect to the jury right now for the day you are able to leave again we will not be having work on this night of tomorrow and next to you on july 3rd at which time i'm going to be closing our meetings and instructions and then after deliberation by you the jury okay so please again remember not to discuss the case with anyone do not take in any information about this case try to avoid the media as best as you can there is all media attention on this case that includes social media and news coverage so if you can please avoid those or would much appreciate it is that we don't have to deal with any conflicts when you come back also again there have been locations that have been discussed do not deal with yard lies do not look up any locations via any other type of mapping device and ask them at least please do not conduct your own independent research or investigation into this case because you are going to be instructed to decide this case based only on the evidence presented here in this panel with that have a good afternoon have a good day tomorrow and we will see you back next day thank you so much for Thank you. Attorney Smith, you wanted to present legal arguments. [01:41:05] Speaker 7: Yes, Your Honor. At this point, we would move for a motion of judgment of acquittal under Practice Book 42-42. The State's evidence says closed. We made our motion at that time. We've now heard from Mr. Valli, and I would renew my motion, and I would direct the Court to the cases of State v. Carpenter, 214, con 77, that's a 1992 case, and State v. Thomas, 210, con 199, a 1989 case. And the standard here is well known to the Court. This is to be viewed in the light most favorable to the State. But even when viewing that light, viewed in that light, this evidence is insufficient for this jury or any jury to find beyond a reasonable doubt that Mr. Valli had the specific intent to murder anyone, that Mr. Valli had the specific intent to assault Tommy Connery or to assault Ryan Hines. And more so even with regard to Mr. Faison Thiel, which is the assault in the second-degree charge. The evidence as to Mr. Thiel, candidly, is we heard the least about it. We really don't have any indication of what the mechanism was. Mr. Thiel couldn't be sure how he got cut or what exactly it was that cut him. And we haven't heard any evidence of anybody viewing that happening. And so it has to be simply an inference that a juror would draw that in the course of this brawl and this chaotic scene, that somehow Mr. Valli cut Mr. Thiel. I would submit that that is an inference that is unreasonable to draw on this evidence that we have before us. The specific intent is not simply general intent. So the fact that Mr. Valli has testified here that he was flailing around with the knife trying to defend himself is not sufficient to show the specific intent to stab Tommy Connery, the specific intent to stab Faison Thiel, or the specific intent to stab Ryan Hines, or the specific intent to stab Jimmy McGrath. As to the other elements, candidly, we have conceded those elements by raising a self-defense claim. That doesn't, however, mean that the state prevails even when you view this evidence in the light most favorable to the state, that they have shown beyond a reasonable doubt for these fact finders that Mr. Valli possessed a specific intent to murder or to assault any of the injured in this case. Consequences are tragic. But it simply doesn't tip the scales any further and allow this jury or any other jury to find, again, that the state has proven specific intent. The evidence there is equivocal at best, but in no way does it reach that highest standard and overcome it. We would ask the court to grant the motion for judgment of acquittal as to all the charges. [01:44:36] Speaker 4: Attorney General Dinsley. [01:44:37] Speaker 1: Attorney General Dinsley: Your Honor, thank you. I would just first start by saying the defendant has testified and is now subject to the same credibility instruction that every other witness is subject to when you charge the jury. The jury is free to believe all, some, or none of the defendant's testimony. And that's up to the jury. I would submit that there are a lot of inconsistencies in the defendant's testimony. And I would submit that the defendant was caught on a lie multiple times in his testimony. And I would submit that that would have an impact on this jury. Attorney General Dinsley: With regards to the defendant's specific intent, should the jury believe that the defendant went back there with a knife, his intent was purposeful, and that he took that knife out of his right pocket, opened it up, and started stabbing the people that were before him, there was evidence that Faison Thiel, Ryan Hines, and Tommy Connery were in the vicinity of where Mr. Valley was. He stabbed Ryan Hines and Faison Thiel first. Attorney General Dinsley: They were stab wounds, not slashes. Attorney General Dinsley: So the jury can infer from the circumstantial evidence from Faison Thiel that his wound was a stab wound, purposeful, not slash. Attorney General Dinsley: There was some testimony from doctors with regards to that. Attorney General Dinsley: The jury could also view Mr. Hines' evidence that he was stabbed purposefully this way, not a slash wound or flailing around. Attorney General Dinsley: The jury can infer the defendant's intent from that. Attorney General Dinsley: With regards to Tommy Connery, there was evidence that the defendant was down almost on one knee, that he purposefully went at Tommy Connery and stabbed him four times in the leg. Attorney General Dinsley: And with regards to Jimmy, after he came back from the car, when Mr. De Silva was no longer in harm's way, he turned right at Jimmy and purposefully went at him and stabbed him in the heart. Attorney General Dinsley: Didn't slash him, stabbed him. Attorney General Dinsley: I would submit that the jury's going to get an instruction that intent can be formed in an instant. Attorney General Dinsley: And they could also infer from the circumstantial evidence should they not believe the defendant's testimony. Attorney General Dinsley: That the number of wounds inflicted. Attorney General Dinsley: The area of the bodies where the wounds were inflicted all points to the specific intent of the defendant on May 14th of 2022. Attorney General Dinsley: So I think when you view all the evidence in light most favorable to the state, your honor, I think the defendant's argument fails and I would ask that you deny it at this point. [01:47:16] Speaker 4: Attorney General Dinsley: So this motion being made at the close of evidence in accordance with our rules of practice, the court is going to take the motion under consideration and for a decision until the jury returns its verdict. Attorney General Dinsley: So again, there won't be any court proceedings tomorrow on this particular matter. Attorney General Dinsley: And we will see everyone back on Thursday. Attorney General Dinsley: I would instruct counsel, please, at some point just to touch base with me for an informal charging conference. Attorney General Dinsley: I intend to be on the record on July 3rd in the morning. Attorney General Dinsley: We'll start with the formal charging conference on the record at which time thereafter we'll move to closing agreements and then the court will charge the jury. Attorney General Dinsley: Very good, Your Honor. Attorney General Dinsley: Thank you, Your Honor. Attorney General Dinsley: Thank you. Attorney General Dinsley: Thank you. All eyes, of course, adjourned.