Lindsey Graham says the U.S. has ‘hit a wall’ on Iran negotiations: Full interview

[0:00] And joining me now is Republican Senator Lindsey Graham of South Carolina. [0:04] Senator Graham, welcome back to Meet the Press. [0:06] Thank you very much. [0:06] Thank you for being here after an historic week. [0:09] Let's start right there with the President's Summit in China. [0:13] One of the biggest issues discussed was Taiwan, just for our viewers. [0:17] It's a self-ruling democracy that China has vowed to control. [0:22] Now, Congress voted to approve billions of dollars in arms sales to defend the island. [0:27] But in an interview after the summit, President Trump would not commit to supporting Taiwan. [0:33] I want to play you a little bit of what he had to say. [0:36] You're waiting on approving billions of dollars of weapons for Taiwan. [0:41] Is that moving forward? [0:42] Well, I haven't approved it yet. [0:43] We're going to see what happens. [0:45] What are you looking for? [0:46] I may do it. [0:46] I may not do it. [0:47] Yeah, what's your hinge point? [0:49] Well, I'm not going to say that, but I may do it. [0:51] I may not do it. [0:52] Senator, can Taiwan be secure without U.S. support? [0:56] Well, I think it's in our interest to make sure they can be secure. [1:01] The country, for a long time, has a one-China policy. [1:05] Now, what does that mean? [1:06] We don't recognize two Chinas. [1:08] We recognize one China with two systems. [1:11] It's been the policy of the United States to help provide military aid to Taiwan. [1:16] We have economic integration with Taiwan. [1:19] So I want to continue that policy. [1:22] Strategic ambiguity. [1:23] What would we do if China invaded Taiwan? [1:26] Well, we have strategic ambiguity. [1:29] Trump said, President Trump, it would be up to me and me alone. [1:32] And he's right about that. [1:33] What can I do as a member of Congress? [1:35] We'll be introducing with Senator Sullivan from Alaska [1:38] hard-hitting pre-invasion sanctions [1:41] that would put tariffs and sanctions on China [1:44] if they did invade Taiwan. [1:47] I want China to know, if you invade Taiwan, [1:50] try to take Taiwan by force. [1:52] Here's what happens to your economy. [1:54] The full weight and measure of sanctions and tariffs from the United States [2:00] will kick in on day one. [2:02] That's what I want to do to deter an invasion. [2:05] As to the weapons sales, [2:06] if the president decides not to approve the package, [2:10] I'll leave that up to him. [2:11] But I hope he will be able to tell the country [2:13] by saying no to the weapons package, [2:16] I got an agreement with China [2:18] that makes Taiwan more secure. [2:20] We'll see what happens. [2:21] You want him to send the weapons, though, [2:23] and does he support the sanctions package you just talked about? [2:26] I haven't talked to him about it, [2:28] but I think there'll be overwhelming support in Congress [2:31] to let China... [2:32] If we'd done this with Russia, [2:34] if you invade Ukraine, [2:35] here's what happens to you on day one, [2:37] I don't think they would invade it. [2:39] So let's make it clear to China. [2:40] If you try to take Taiwan by force, [2:42] here's what happens to your economy on day one. [2:45] I'm hoping that the administration would support that. [2:49] In terms of weapons sales, it's up to the president. [2:51] I would encourage him to make Taiwan strong [2:54] so we can deter aggression. [2:57] If you give an inch on China, [2:58] they'll take... [2:59] On Taiwan, I think they'll take a mile. [3:01] But we're not looking for war. [3:02] We're not looking for conflict. [3:04] I want to keep the status quo. [3:05] Just to follow up on that point, [3:07] President Trump warned other countries last year [3:10] that when it comes to Iranian oil, [3:13] quote, [3:13] if you buy it, [3:14] you're not doing any business with the United States. [3:18] As you know, [3:19] China buys 90% of Iran's oil. [3:22] Are you disappointed that President Trump [3:25] wasn't able to get China [3:27] to stop buying Iranian oil during this summit? [3:30] Well, President Trump said, [3:32] we don't need China. [3:34] I'm not looking for a favor from China [3:36] to help to end the Iranian conflict. [3:38] But here's the soft underbelly of Iran. [3:41] They're a fossil fuel economy. [3:43] As to Russia, [3:45] we're very close to sanctions [3:47] being passed by the Congress [3:49] that will allow the president [3:50] to put tariffs and sanctions [3:52] on the shadow fleet. [3:53] And any country that buys cheap Russian oil [3:56] to prop up Putin [3:57] that doesn't help Ukraine [3:58] can be tariffed. [3:59] He put a 25% tariff on India, [4:01] President Trump did, [4:02] for buying Russian oil. [4:03] There'll come a moment here [4:05] where China's going to have to be held accountable [4:08] for what they're doing. [4:09] And without China buying Iranian oil, [4:12] their economy would collapse. [4:13] So where are we with Iran? [4:14] I think we've hit a wall [4:16] when it comes to negotiations. [4:19] Here's what the president said [4:20] just a couple of days ago. [4:22] Basically, I can say this with a, [4:26] I'm not going to be much more patient. [4:28] Any sane person would make a deal, [4:30] but they might be crazy. [4:32] The president's had it [4:33] with moving the goalpost. [4:36] You get a deal, [4:37] the next day they wake up [4:38] and the president's word, [4:39] it's like we never had the conversation. [4:41] So what happens next? [4:42] I think we hit a wall on dealmaking. [4:45] I would encourage the president [4:46] to look at reducing [4:48] Iran's military capability even further. [4:50] They've been dramatically weakened, [4:52] but there's still targets [4:53] that could weaken them more militarily. [4:56] And I would also keep the embargo [4:58] on to weaken their economy. [4:59] And I'd let the Iranians know [5:01] if you keep terrorizing the region, [5:03] Karg Island, [5:03] which is your source of revenue, [5:05] will be in play. [5:06] I think that's, [5:08] that would be the smart next play. [5:09] You can't pursue a deal [5:11] more than the people [5:12] on the other side want a deal. [5:13] Let me ask you, [5:14] I just want to be very explicit. [5:16] You are saying you think [5:17] these negotiations have hit a wall. [5:19] Yes, ma'am. [5:20] Are you saying, Senator, [5:21] that you think it's time [5:23] for President Trump [5:24] to resume military action against Iran? [5:27] I think you can't get [5:28] a coherent answer from Iran [5:29] because they can't be coherent. [5:31] I think they're so disheveled now. [5:33] They're so weakened. [5:34] They agree to things [5:35] and the next day they back up. [5:37] President Trump's very frustrated. [5:39] So what to do next? [5:40] I think it's going to be very difficult [5:43] to get a deal with the current regime. [5:45] Is there any evidence they've changed? [5:47] I talked to the CIA director yesterday. [5:49] Is there any evidence [5:50] that the crowd in charge now [5:52] is any less committed [5:53] to destroying Israel? [5:55] Going after us, [5:56] the great Satan, [5:57] purifying Islam? [5:58] I think the answer is no. [6:00] So weaken them further [6:01] and you may get a deal later. [6:02] But you're not going to get a deal [6:04] with this crowd [6:04] until you hurt them more. [6:06] So you're saying [6:07] it sounds like you do [6:08] support more military action [6:10] at this point. [6:11] Do you think that's something [6:12] that will happen? [6:13] Do you think it could happen [6:13] in days, weeks, months? [6:15] I think the status quo [6:16] is hurting us all. [6:18] The longer the strait is closed, [6:20] the more we try to pursue a deal [6:21] that never happens, [6:23] the stronger Iran gets. [6:24] So according, [6:26] my analysis is [6:27] there's nothing to suggest [6:29] that the people in charge now [6:30] are any different [6:32] in terms of the regime's goal [6:34] to terrorize the world, [6:35] destroy Israel, [6:36] come after us. [6:38] So what do you do next? [6:39] You weaken them further. [6:41] What President Trump has done [6:42] has been amazing militarily, [6:44] but there's still more targets [6:45] to be had [6:46] and there's things [6:47] we can do to hurt their... [6:48] The energy infrastructure [6:49] is their soft underbelly. [6:51] If you go back to the fight, [6:53] I put energy on top of the list. [6:55] So you're calling for strikes [6:56] on the energy infrastructure, Senator? [6:58] Yeah, I'm calling [6:58] to hurt this regime. [7:00] If you do the same old thing, [7:01] you're going to get the same result. [7:03] Hurt them more, [7:04] maybe they'll make a deal [7:05] if you hurt them enough. [7:06] But right now, [7:07] I think they're trying [7:08] to wait us out. [7:09] I think they're playing games. [7:10] And in the words of the president, [7:11] I think they're crazy. [7:13] I think he's right. [7:14] Senator, the goal of this, [7:15] one of the key goals [7:16] from President Trump [7:17] was to get their Iran nuclear capabilities, [7:22] to wipe that out. [7:23] How does the United States [7:24] retrieve Iran's nuclear material [7:27] without sending in ground forces? [7:29] Well, hopefully you can [7:30] do it diplomatically. [7:31] But don't you need [7:32] to send in ground forces [7:33] if you want to retrieve it, [7:35] which is what we've heard [7:35] Prime Minister Netanyahu talk about. [7:36] He wants to get the nuclear dust. [7:38] There's another way to do it. [7:39] I talked to him about it yesterday. [7:40] Draw a circle around [7:42] where we know it's at. [7:43] Call it the circle of death. [7:45] Anybody that goes inside this circle [7:47] is going to die [7:48] until we can find a way [7:50] to deal with this. [7:51] The goal is to make sure [7:52] they can't retrieve it. [7:53] They can't make a dirty bomb. [7:55] They can't further enrich. [7:56] Their enrichment capability [7:57] has been obliterated [7:58] at least for a couple of years. [8:00] All right. [8:01] Let me turn to the economy [8:02] and the economic effects [8:03] of the war, [8:04] which are being felt here [8:05] at home. [8:06] Inflation has climbed [8:07] to the highest [8:08] annual rate in three years. [8:09] Gas prices are at [8:11] a four-year high. [8:12] Grocery prices are climbing. [8:13] President Trump was pressed [8:15] on how all of these factors [8:16] impact how he views [8:18] his negotiations with Iran. [8:20] Take a look. [8:20] About America's [8:25] financial situation, [8:26] I don't think about anybody. [8:27] I think about one thing. [8:29] We cannot let Iran [8:30] have a nuclear weapon. [8:32] That's all. [8:33] Do you agree [8:34] with the president [8:35] that he shouldn't be taking [8:36] Americans' financial situation [8:38] into account [8:39] when dealing with Iran? [8:40] That's his Churchill moment. [8:41] When Churchill came into power, [8:43] he promised blood, sweat, toil, [8:45] heartache, [8:46] until we deal with the Nazis [8:47] who are an existential threat [8:49] to the British way of life. [8:50] And if Hitler had taken charge [8:52] of the planet, [8:53] it would have been [8:54] the darkest hour in humanity. [8:56] I believe Iran wants [8:57] a nuclear weapon. [8:58] They would use it. [8:59] So does President Trump. [9:01] They would use it [9:01] as part of their religious agenda. [9:03] They would destroy [9:03] the Jewish state. [9:05] They would eventually [9:05] hold us hostage. [9:07] So his audience, [9:08] the Iranian regime, [9:09] do I worry about gas prices? [9:10] Yes. [9:11] But President Trump's right. [9:12] The biggest threat [9:13] to the disability in the world [9:14] is a nuclear armed Iran. [9:16] And whatever price [9:17] we have to pay, [9:18] we will pay. [9:19] What did Churchill say? [9:20] Whatever price we have to pay [9:22] to beat Hitler, [9:23] we will pay. [9:24] Same with Iran. [9:25] The good news, [9:26] we're inside the 10-yard line. [9:28] I think if we go back [9:29] to military activity, [9:30] weaken them further, [9:31] then we can end [9:32] this thing pretty soon. [9:33] Senator, you take me [9:34] to my next question [9:35] because 70% of Americans [9:37] in a new poll [9:38] say President Trump [9:39] is doing a bad job [9:40] on the economy, [9:41] the number one issue [9:42] for voters. [9:42] Sure. [9:43] As you know, [9:43] bottom line, [9:44] is it worth losing [9:45] the midterms [9:46] if the result [9:47] is a non-nuclear Iran? [9:49] It's worth losing my job. [9:52] If I had to give my job up [9:54] to make sure Iran [9:55] would never have [9:56] a nuclear weapon, [9:57] I would do it. [9:58] Would you give up [9:58] the House and the Senate? [9:59] I would give up politically. [10:03] The most important thing [10:04] I can do [10:04] with the job [10:05] I've been given [10:06] is to protect [10:07] the American people. [10:07] Now, you don't have [10:08] to agree with me, [10:09] but I've been this way [10:10] for 20 years. [10:11] I believe there are [10:12] religious Nazis in Iran. [10:14] If they had a nuclear weapon, [10:16] they would use it. [10:16] They've been trying [10:17] to get one. [10:18] They've been cheating. [10:18] Obama and Biden [10:19] were jokes [10:21] when it came [10:22] to containing Iran. [10:23] Trump is doing something [10:24] people should have done [10:25] a long time ago, [10:26] but here's the good news. [10:27] Gas prices will come down [10:29] when you put Iran in a box. [10:31] Saudi-Israel peace [10:32] will become possible [10:33] when you put Iran in a box. [10:35] The upside of dealing [10:36] with Iran is enormously good, [10:38] but you've got to deal with them. [10:40] Senator, let me ask you [10:41] about the news overnight. [10:42] Senator Bill Cassidy [10:43] losing his primary [10:44] in Louisiana. [10:45] You worked closely [10:46] with Senator Bill Cassidy [10:48] on a range of different issues, [10:49] including a plan [10:50] to replace Obamacare. [10:52] He, of course, voted [10:52] to convict President Trump [10:54] back in 2021 [10:55] in the impeachment trial. [10:57] Now he's lost his seat. [10:58] Are you glad [10:59] that Senator Cassidy [11:01] is no longer going [11:02] to be your colleague, Senator? [11:03] No, I like Bill. [11:04] I thought he was [11:05] a great senator, [11:06] but he made a political decision. [11:08] He tried to, [11:09] he voted to impeach [11:10] President Trump, [11:10] which would have ruined [11:11] his political life. [11:13] He could never run [11:13] for office again. [11:15] Massey's on the ballot Tuesday. [11:17] He votes against Trump [11:18] all the time. [11:18] What's the headline? [11:19] Trump strong. [11:21] Those who try [11:22] to destroy Trump politically, [11:24] stand in the way [11:24] of his agenda, [11:25] are going to lose. [11:26] Bill made a decision. [11:27] What would LBJ do? [11:29] Is it natural [11:30] for a politician [11:31] to go after people [11:32] who try to destroy [11:33] their political life? [11:35] So Bill Cassidy's lost [11:38] because he tried [11:39] to destroy Trump. [11:41] Massey's going to lose [11:42] because he's trying [11:43] to destroy the agenda. [11:44] You can disagree [11:45] with President Trump, [11:46] but if you try [11:46] to destroy him, [11:47] you're going to lose [11:48] because this is the party [11:49] of Donald Trump. [11:50] Very quickly, [11:52] does his defeat, [11:53] send a message, [11:54] if this is the party [11:55] of Donald Trump, [11:56] that there's no room [11:57] in the party [11:58] to break with President Trump? [11:59] No, I just talked [12:00] to him a few minutes ago. [12:02] We have a difference. [12:02] President Trump, [12:03] you talked to him. [12:03] Yeah, just a few minutes ago. [12:05] There's no room [12:06] in this party [12:06] to destroy his agenda [12:08] or to destroy him [12:09] and his family [12:10] as a Republican. [12:11] Democrats do it [12:12] all the time. [12:12] If you align with Democrats [12:13] to stop his agenda [12:14] like Massey does, [12:16] you're going to lose. [12:17] If you align with Democrats [12:18] to drive him out of office [12:19] like Cassidy did, [12:20] you're going to lose. [12:21] I disagree with Trump [12:22] on President Trump [12:23] on occasion. [12:24] He endorsed me. [12:25] It's been enormously [12:26] helpful to me. [12:27] Thank you, President Trump [12:28] for endorsing me. [12:29] It's helped me in my primary. [12:30] It's just a reality [12:31] and it's a good reality. [12:33] I think President Trump [12:34] is doing a hell of a good job [12:35] and if you get, [12:36] if you try to destroy him, [12:38] you're going to get destroyed. [12:39] That's the takeaway. [12:41] All right. [12:41] Senator Lindsey Graham, [12:42] thank you so much [12:43] for being here in person [12:44] to discuss a very busy week. [12:45] We really appreciate it. [12:46] We thank you for watching [12:48] and remember, [12:48] stay updated on breaking news [12:50] and top stories on the NBC News app [12:52] or watch live on our YouTube channel.