Karen Read Trial (Pt 37) — Allie McCabe

[00:00:00] Speaker 1: Thank you. Good afternoon. [00:00:02] Speaker ?: Good afternoon. [00:00:03] Speaker 2: Could you please state your name and spell your last name? Allie McCabe, M-C-C-A-B-E. [00:00:06] Speaker 1: And where do you live, ma'am? Canton. [00:00:09] Speaker 3: And how long have you lived in Canton? Basically my whole life except first few months I lived in Stoughton. [00:00:28] Speaker 1: And do you work, do you go to school? [00:00:31] Speaker 3: I'm a student. [00:00:32] Speaker 1: In college, is that correct? Yes. And what year are you in college? [00:00:37] Speaker 3: I just finished my sophomore year. [00:00:39] Speaker 1: And when living in Canton, who, if anyone, do you live in Canton? [00:00:45] Speaker 3: My two parents and my three sisters. [00:00:48] Speaker 1: So you're one of four girls, is that correct? [00:00:51] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:00:52] Speaker 1: And are you the oldest? [00:00:54] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:00:55] Speaker 1: And your parents, what are their names? [00:00:58] Speaker 3: Matt and Jen. [00:01:00] Speaker 1: If I could turn your attention to January 28th into January 29th, 2022, do you recall those days? [00:01:10] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:01:11] Speaker 1: And do you recall what days of the week those were? [00:01:13] Speaker 3: Friday and Saturday, I believe. [00:01:16] Speaker 1: And so on that Friday evening, starting with there, let me ask you this first. At that time, you were a high school student, is that correct? [00:01:24] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:01:25] Speaker 1: And where did you go to high school? [00:01:26] Speaker 3: Canton High School. [00:01:27] Speaker 1: All four years? Yes. [00:01:29] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:01:30] Speaker 1: And did you play any sports when you were at Canton High School? Yes. And what sports did you play? [00:01:34] Speaker 3: Soccer, hockey, and lacrosse. [00:01:37] Speaker 1: And so January, that would have been which sports season? [00:01:42] Speaker 3: Hockey season. [00:01:43] Speaker 1: Now, with respect to the hockey, as far as that evening of the 28th, how did your evening start out? Or what, if anything, were you doing first that evening? [00:01:53] Speaker 3: It started with a team dinner at my house. The hockey team came over. We had dinner. Then I went to my sister's basketball game at the Canton High School. Then I was hanging out with two of my friends. We were driving around. Then the night ended with me driving Colin Albert home. [00:02:15] Speaker 1: And so let me start sort of back at the beginning before we go all the way through. So as far as the team dinner, is that something that was like a weekly thing? [00:02:25] Speaker 3: Yeah, it was usually like the night before a game. [00:02:28] Speaker 1: And sort of rotated between different players' houses? [00:02:31] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:02:32] Speaker 1: So where was it on that particular? [00:02:34] Speaker 3: That night, it was at my house. [00:02:36] Speaker 1: And about what time did the team dinner get done? And what time did that wind down and you went to the basketball game? [00:02:43] Speaker 3: I'm not exactly sure. The basketball games typically start around 6:30, so I assume around then. [00:02:49] Speaker 1: And who, if anyone, from your family was involved in the basketball? [00:02:54] Speaker 3: My younger sister. [00:02:56] Speaker 1: And was she JV, varsity? What was she playing on at that time? [00:02:59] Speaker 3: Varsity. [00:03:00] Speaker 1: And who, if anyone, else from your family was at the basketball? [00:03:05] Speaker 3: My parents. I'm not sure about my sisters. [00:03:08] Speaker 1: And did you go with your parents or separately or how did you get? [00:03:11] Speaker 3: I believe I drove and I arrived later than my parents. [00:03:15] Speaker 1: And as far as at that time, did you have your own car? Yes. And what kind of car did you have? [00:03:23] Speaker 3: Yes. A little Ford Fusion blue. [00:03:26] Speaker 1: And when you arrived there, you're a high school senior, correct? [00:03:31] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:03:32] Speaker 1: Did you sit with your parents during the game? No. There's sort of like a student section, is that correct? Correct. So you sat there with your friends? Yes. And when the game gets over, where was it that you went? [00:03:45] Speaker 3: I believe I was just driving around with two of my friends. And then we, as we were driving, we came across a dog on the side of the street. We knew a snowstorm was coming. So we picked the dog up and then brought it to the police station. And then drove the dog back to where? It's owner's house. [00:04:05] Speaker 1: And so as far as the friends that you were driving around with, what are their names? [00:04:09] Speaker 3: Avery Panadosi and Danielle Seaman. Can you do us a favor and spell those last names for our court reporter, please? Yes. P-I-A-N-T-E-D-O-S-I. In the second name. S, Danielle Seaman, S-E-A-M-A-N. Thank you. Thank you. [00:04:32] Speaker 1: And those were friends of yours from school, from Kent High School as well? [00:04:37] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:04:38] Speaker 1: And had they been with you at the game previously? [00:04:40] Speaker 3: Yes, I believe so. [00:04:41] Speaker 1: So when you say drove around, whereabouts were you driving around? [00:04:47] Speaker 3: Through Canton, pretty aimlessly, just driving. [00:04:51] Speaker 1: And at some point you come upon a dog, is that correct? [00:04:54] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:04:55] Speaker 1: And where was that? [00:04:56] Speaker 3: On Elm Street. [00:04:58] Speaker 1: And this was a dog obviously unfamiliar to you, is that correct? [00:05:05] Speaker 3: Yes. What did you do with the dog? The dog ran over to the car when we stopped and picked the dog up. And we didn't really know what to do with it, so we brought it to the police station. [00:05:14] Speaker 1: Do you recall at all what kind of dog it was? [00:05:18] Speaker 3: No. White. Small dog? It was small. It was white and brown. Not sure what type. [00:05:24] Speaker 1: And so while you're at the police station, what if anything did you learn about that dog that you brought to the police station? [00:05:29] Speaker 3: I brought the, or I went in the police station, the dog stayed in the car with one of my friends. And as I was walking in and telling the officer that I found a dog, he got a call from the owner and she asked if she was like, oh, can you return my dog, please? [00:05:48] Speaker 1: And so you brought the dog back to the owner? [00:05:50] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:05:51] Speaker 1: Do you know about what time all of that was going on? [00:05:53] Speaker 3: I'm not, I'm not sure. [00:05:56] Speaker 1: Okay. Now, you mentioned that you had picked up a person by the name of Colin Albert, is that right? [00:06:04] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:06:05] Speaker 1: And who was Colin Albert to you or can you describe to the jury sort of your relationship with Colin? [00:06:11] Speaker 3: I've known Colin since I've been born. Our families are very close. We went to high school together, school together growing up in the same friend group. So, yeah, we're very close. [00:06:24] Speaker 1: So, he was in the same grade as you, is that right? Correct. So, he was a senior at this time as well? [00:06:29] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:06:30] Speaker 1: And you have friends, mutual friends together? Yes. Now, the two of you are not actually sort of blood related, is that correct? Correct. But you have sort of relatives in common, is that correct? Yes. [00:06:43] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:06:44] Speaker 1: And to that point, as far as when he reached out to you, let me ask you this. How is it that you came to come by and sort of pick him up on that meeting? [00:06:53] Speaker 3: Yes. Yes. Yes. He texted me and was asking for a ride. And then I responded, drove and got him, texted him when I arrived. [00:07:02] Speaker 1: Now, as far as that sort of, I don't know what exactly to call it, but as far as you picking him up at certain places, like on weekend nights, was that out of the realm of normalcy or was that something that happens on occasion? No, that's common. [00:07:22] Speaker 3: He knew I was driving that night, so it's pretty common. Our friends, we always drive each other around and stuff. [00:07:29] Speaker 1: And without getting too much into it, as far as high school was concerned, particularly when someone was drinking, would they call and ask for a ride? Correct, yes. Rather than driving their own car? [00:07:39] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:07:40] Speaker 1: And as far as you knew, was Colin drinking at least at some point during that? Yes. Is that why he needed a ride? Yes. [00:07:48] Speaker 3: Okay. [00:07:49] Speaker 1: And with respect to your parents, did you, around this time that you're driving around and you're going to pick up Colin, did you have any idea where your parents were or what they were doing? [00:08:01] Speaker 3: I knew they were going out after the basketball game, but no, I didn't. No, I have their Life 360. They have mine, so I wasn't sure though. [00:08:11] Speaker 1: And as far as the Life 360 goes, is that something that you sort of keep track of them or they keep track of you? [00:08:17] Speaker 3: It's more of them, keeping track of me. [00:08:20] Speaker 1: Okay. Now, do you know approximately what time it was that you first get sort of a call and reaches out via text to pick him up? [00:08:30] Speaker 3: I believe it was around midnight. Not exactly what, but around midnight. [00:08:37] Speaker 1: I think it's a very important thing. I think it's a very important thing. I think it's a very important thing. I think it's a very important thing. I think it's a very important thing. [00:08:42] Speaker 3: I think it's a very important thing. I think it's a very important thing. I think it's a very important thing. [00:08:45] Speaker 1: I think it's a very important thing. I think it's a very important thing. [00:08:47] Speaker 3: I think it's a very important thing. [00:08:48] Speaker 1: I think it's a very important thing. I think it's a very important thing. I think it's a very important thing. I think it's a very important thing. [00:08:52] Speaker 3: I think it's a very important thing. I think it's a very important thing. I think it's a very important thing. [00:08:55] Speaker 1: I think it's a very important thing. I think it's a very important thing. I think it's a very important thing. I think it's a very important thing. I think it's a very important thing. I think it's a very important thing. I think it's a very important thing. I think it's a very important thing. I think it's a very important thing. I think it's a very important thing. I think it's a very important thing. I think it's a very important thing. [00:09:18] Speaker ?: I think it's a very important thing. [00:09:19] Speaker 1: I think it's a very important thing. I think it's a very important thing. I think it's a very important thing. I think it's a very important thing. [00:09:23] Speaker 3: I think it's a very important thing. I think it's a very important thing. I think it's a very important thing. [00:09:27] Speaker 1: I think it's a very important thing. I think it's a very important thing. [00:09:37] Speaker 3: Yes, I was at another friend's house after I drove Avery and Danielle home. I went somewhere else. [00:09:45] Speaker 1: You drove the two friends that you were with earlier home and then you went somewhere else? [00:09:49] Speaker 3: Yes, I believe, yes. [00:09:50] Speaker 1: At that point, did you get a text from Colin? [00:09:52] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:09:53] Speaker 1: Now, do you recall whether or not the information that you had as to where Colin was that night, is that something that came via text as well or was that a phone call or some other type of communication? [00:10:04] Speaker 3: I knew he was there. Could have been a phone call. I'm not sure. [00:10:09] Speaker 1: So were there a variety of different ways that you would have communicated with Colin around that time? [00:10:15] Speaker 3: Yes. There's other apps as well, yes. [00:10:18] Speaker 1: I'm sorry, you said through apps as well? Yes. What kind of apps do you have? [00:10:23] Speaker 3: For example, like Snapchat. [00:10:25] Speaker 1: So you had each other sort of Snapchat information, phone number information, call, text, snap, ribbon, any of those things? [00:10:31] Speaker 2: Yes. [00:10:32] Speaker 1: Now, when you get that communication from him to come pick him up, about how long a period of time was it from the time that you get the text from Colin to the time that you arrive in the area of therapy? [00:10:51] Speaker 3: I'm not sure. [00:10:53] Speaker 1: And you're familiar with that home at 34 Fairview, right? Correct. The place you've been to countless times before. Is it related to the people that don't? [00:11:01] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:11:02] Speaker 1: And do you recall from where you were coming from as far as how did you come to Fairview? Would that have been on the Chapman side or the Cedar Crest side or how did you come from it? [00:11:12] Speaker 3: I don't remember. [00:11:14] Speaker 1: And when you get to the home, you obviously park at some point, correct? [00:11:19] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:11:20] Speaker 1: And where in relation to the house did you park? [00:11:23] Speaker 3: I believe in the driveway on the left side. Not entirely sure. I just believe that. [00:11:29] Speaker 1: And when you arrive, what, if any, communication did you send to Colin? [00:11:34] Speaker 3: I texted him saying, here. [00:11:37] Speaker 1: And after you texted that to Paul and he comes out of the house, is that correct? [00:11:40] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:11:42] Speaker 1: And when he comes out of the house, about how long a period of time was it from the time that you texted him here to the time that he comes out to the car? [00:11:48] Speaker 3: I'm not sure. A few minutes. [00:11:51] Speaker 1: And in the area around the time that you arrived on Fairview Roads, what, if anything, do you recall in regards to the weather or what was it doing at that time? [00:12:00] Speaker 3: I believe it was starting to snow, nothing crazy. [00:12:04] Speaker 1: As far as accumulation, what, if anything, did you observe at that time? [00:12:09] Speaker 3: Lights on in the house. That's it. [00:12:13] Speaker 1: As far as the snow was concerned, was it starting to sort of stick to the ground? [00:12:16] Speaker 3: I don't remember. [00:12:20] Speaker 1: So you text Colin shortly thereafter he comes out, is that right? Correct. If you recall, you're familiar, obviously, as I've asked you a couple times now with the house. There are two doors in the front of the house, is that right? [00:12:31] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:12:32] Speaker 1: And do you know which of the two doors Colin came out of? [00:12:34] Speaker 3: No, I'm not sure. [00:12:36] Speaker 1: And when he came down, he came over to the car, correct? [00:12:39] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:12:40] Speaker 1: And you're in the driveway? [00:12:41] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:12:41] Speaker 1: And gets into what part of the car? Front passenger seat? [00:12:44] Speaker 3: Yes, I believe. [00:12:46] Speaker 1: And from the time that you, so when you leave from there, where is it that you went? [00:12:53] Speaker 3: His house and then my house. [00:12:56] Speaker 1: You dropped him off at his house and then you went home? [00:12:58] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:12:59] Speaker 1: Now, Ms. McCabe, if I could take you back just to a little bit from where we had left off. When you arrived at the residence of 34 Fairview Road, you pulled into the driveway, is that correct? [00:13:14] Speaker 3: I believe so. [00:13:16] Speaker 1: And so, obviously, on that date, you were familiar with the types of vehicles that your parents drove? [00:13:22] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:13:23] Speaker 1: And did you see any of your parents' vehicles at the home when you pulled in and parked in the driveway? [00:13:28] Speaker 3: No. [00:13:29] Speaker 1: And when you got to the house at any point, did you exit the car or go inside the house? [00:13:35] Speaker 3: No. [00:13:36] Speaker 1: So you texted him that you were there and you stayed in the car and he came out? [00:13:39] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:13:41] Speaker 1: And when Colin came out to the car, what, if any, observations did you make of him in regards to his sobriety? As far as, what, if any, observations did you make him with respect to that? [00:13:55] Speaker 3: Normal. [00:13:57] Speaker 1: Didn't seem overly intoxicated to you? No. And as far as his face or features or from whatever you could see, what, if any, injuries did you observe on Colin when he came out? [00:14:09] Speaker 3: None. [00:14:10] Speaker 1: And how would you describe his demeanor when he came out and he got into the car? [00:14:15] Speaker 3: Normal. [00:14:17] Speaker 1: Now, during the course, you drove from Fairview home to Colin's house, is that right? [00:14:22] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:14:23] Speaker 1: And where was Colin living at that point? [00:14:25] Speaker 3: Um, I don't know the address, but his new house, not the old, not the one where he was neighbors with John, the newer house. [00:14:36] Speaker 1: And, uh, if you could, just generally speaking, where was that in relation to the town of Cannon? What, what was it here? [00:14:42] Speaker 3: Um, it's in the center of town, close to the library. [00:14:45] Speaker 1: And do you recall, or do you know what type of residence that is? [00:14:49] Speaker 3: Um, yes, it's like, uh, condos. I'm not sure exactly, but yeah. Townhouses. [00:14:57] Speaker 1: As far as your drive from the residence in Fairview to Colin's house, um, did you make any stops along the way? [00:15:03] Speaker 3: No. [00:15:04] Speaker 1: About how long a drive is it from Fairview to Colin's house? [00:15:08] Speaker 3: Seven minutes, five minutes. [00:15:11] Speaker 1: And when you arrived there, um, what did you observe calling the difference? [00:15:17] Speaker 3: Um, got out of the car, went, went inside, got the key, locked it, went inside. [00:15:24] Speaker 1: And is that something as far as, did you wait for him to get inside? [00:15:26] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:15:27] Speaker 1: And why was it? [00:15:28] Speaker 3: Um, I always wait for him because it's like how he, he has to get, open the first door to get inside. So, I usually just wait for everyone to get inside. [00:15:37] Speaker 1: And during the car ride from Fairview to, uh, Colin's house, uh, do you recall anything specific about, did you have a conversation with him? [00:15:46] Speaker 3: Probably. I don't remember what we were talking about. [00:15:50] Speaker 1: And then following that, where did you go? [00:15:53] Speaker 3: Um, I believe home. [00:15:54] Speaker 1: Um, and when you got home, were either of your, your parents home at that point? [00:15:59] Speaker 3: No. [00:16:00] Speaker 1: Do you know about what time it was that you got? [00:16:03] Speaker 3: Not exactly. I would estimate a little bit before 1230, around that time. [00:16:11] Speaker 1: And at any point in time over the rest of the course of that evening, did you, um, see your parents, did you talk to your parents or anything like that? [00:16:19] Speaker 3: Um, I know I talked to my dad on the phone when we found the dog. Other than that, no. [00:16:25] Speaker 1: And so after your return home, when you went to bed or you went to sleep, were your parents home at that point? [00:16:30] Speaker 3: No. [00:16:31] Speaker 1: About how much time was it between the time when you got home, around 1230 or so, and when you went to sleep? [00:16:37] Speaker 3: Not long. I, I don't know. [00:16:41] Speaker 1: Now, turning your attention to the following day, at some point you woke up, correct? [00:16:45] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:16:46] Speaker 1: And were your parents home at that point? [00:16:48] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:16:49] Speaker 1: And were both of your parents home at that point? [00:16:51] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:16:52] Speaker 1: Do you know about what time it was that you woke up next time? [00:16:54] Speaker 3: No, I do not. [00:16:58] Speaker 1: Now, Mr. K, at some point, um, in August of 2023, did you have occasion to meet, uh, some troopers from the state police? [00:17:08] Speaker 3: Um, yes, I believe it. I'm not sure what time, but on, on a Zoom. [00:17:12] Speaker 1: And was that one trooper or more than one trooper or something? [00:17:16] Speaker 3: I believe two. I'm not sure. [00:17:18] Speaker 1: Do you recall any of the names of any of those troopers? [00:17:21] Speaker 3: Um, Yuri maybe was one of them. I'm not sure. [00:17:25] Speaker 1: And now, ma'am, following that meeting that you had with the troopers from the state police, what, if anything, did you provide, uh, to them from your phone? [00:17:34] Speaker 3: Um, text messages with Colin, maybe pictures, I don't know. Definitely, definitely the text messages. [00:17:41] Speaker 1: And before we get to that, just as far as, uh, your phone, what kind of phone did you have at that time? [00:17:47] Speaker 3: Um, I believe an iPhone, iPhone 14 Pro Max, maybe. [00:17:54] Speaker 1: And I should have been more specific as far as the time, but the iPhone you're talking about as far as the phone match, was that in January of 2020 or in September, uh, August of 2020? [00:18:03] Speaker 3: That was in August. [00:18:05] Speaker 1: And between January of 2022 and August of 2023, um, did you have the same phone throughout that time period? [00:18:13] Speaker 3: I'm not sure. I believe I upgraded. Um, yeah. [00:18:17] Speaker 1: And when you upgraded your phone, what if any, uh, data sort of carried over from the old phone to the new phone? [00:18:23] Speaker 3: Um, everything. [00:18:24] Speaker 1: Uh, so as far as chats or, or text messages or phone contacts, things like that, all of that transferred from one phone to the new phone? [00:18:33] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:18:35] Speaker 1: And, uh, your honor, may I approach? [00:18:37] Speaker 2: Yes. [00:18:41] Speaker 1: And so first thing, I'm going to show you, uh, two-page document. Actually, take a look at it and we'll go. [00:18:47] Speaker 3: Okay. [00:18:49] Speaker 1: And do you recognize that, ma'am? [00:18:50] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:18:51] Speaker 1: And what do you recognize that? [00:18:52] Speaker 3: Um, this is from my phone, my text messages. [00:18:55] Speaker 1: And the second page, what is that? [00:18:57] Speaker 3: Um, Colin's contact information. [00:18:59] Speaker 1: Now, those screenshots that you took from your phone and provided to the. The troopers in August of 20, 23. [00:19:05] Speaker 3: Mm-hmm. Yes, yes, yes. Yes. [00:19:09] Speaker 1: I'm all to see. Objection. [00:19:14] Speaker 2: Okay. Come on up and bring that. The lawyers are going to get to ask you a few questions now before we go any further in front of the jury. [00:19:25] Speaker 3: Okay. [00:19:25] Speaker ?: Okay. [00:19:26] Speaker 2: So, um, Mr. Lally, you can take the. Exhibits back and. You can question this witness and then Miss Giannetti can cross examine. [00:19:43] Speaker 1: May I approach with. Yes. All of them. So with reference to the two screenshots that we were just talking about before the jury about the room. Um, those are screenshots that you took from your own phone, correct? [00:20:04] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:20:05] Speaker 1: And, uh, as far as the communications, uh, contained therein, um, is it your memory that those are communications that you had with Colin Albers? [00:20:14] Speaker 2: Why don't you ask her what, what they are non-leading? [00:20:18] Speaker 1: Those screenshots, as far as the communications, what are they, when were they done? [00:20:26] Speaker 3: Um, at a later date? [00:20:27] Speaker ?: Um, at a later date? [00:20:27] Speaker 3: Is that what you're asking? Sorry. [00:20:29] Speaker 1: So I'm asking as far as the actual content of the conversations, when did those conversations occur? [00:20:33] Speaker ?: Um, January 28th. [00:20:33] Speaker 1: And, uh, you were a participant in those conversations? [00:20:34] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:20:35] Speaker 1: And, uh, as far as the content of those conversations, is it your memory, uh, the content reflected there is accurate as to what the content of the conversations were between yourself and Colin Albers, the evening of the 28th, the end of the plane? Yes. [00:20:42] Speaker ?: And, uh, Colin Albers was somebody that you were familiar with, correct? Yes. [00:20:42] Speaker 1: And, uh, Colin Albers was somebody that you were familiar with, correct? Yes. And, uh, Colin Albers was somebody that you were familiar with, correct? Yes. And beyond what's contained within these screenshots, uh, you would have other text communications with Colin Albers using the same contact information? [00:20:57] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:20:58] Speaker 1: Yes. And, uh, Colin Albers was somebody that you were familiar with, correct? Yes. And beyond what's contained within these screenshots, uh, you would have other text communications with Colin Albers using the same contact information? [00:21:10] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:21:11] Speaker 1: And how is it that you, uh, knew or were aware that, uh, the person or the contact that you were talking to, uh, was Colin Albers? [00:21:20] Speaker 3: Because it's his phone? [00:21:21] Speaker 1: With reference to that contact, uh, you had on your phone for Colin Albers, had you called that number before? Yes. When you called the number, who answered? [00:21:30] Speaker 3: Colin. [00:21:31] Speaker 1: And when you had texted, um, Colin on prior occasions using that contact information, uh, did you have any, did you have a text communication? Did you have any, um, subsequent conversation in relation to the content of those text communications? [00:21:48] Speaker 3: Sorry. [00:21:49] Speaker ?: Sorry. [00:21:49] Speaker 3: Can you rephrase that? [00:21:50] Speaker 1: And I'm not just asking specifically about, what I'm saying is you have contact information in your phone for Colin Albers? Yes. [00:21:56] Speaker 3: Okay. [00:21:57] Speaker 1: And on any of those prior occasions when you had texted that contact information, uh, you put in as Colin Albert into your phone? Yes. And just to be clear, you were the one who input that number as Colin Albert in your phone? [00:22:10] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:22:11] Speaker 1: And so on this or any prior occasions when you had contacted via text, that contact of Colin Albert in your phone, following those text communications, did you have any conversation with Colin Albert related to the content of those communications? [00:22:26] Speaker 2: Sorry, I'm confused. Do you understand the question? No, I'm sorry. You have to make these simpler. Let's try and get through this for our DMs. [00:22:34] Speaker 1: The, at some point during the course of your, how long had you had Colin's, uh, contact information in your phone? [00:22:48] Speaker 3: For a while, years. [00:22:51] Speaker 1: And over the course of those years, um, had you had conversations related to content in text in person? [00:23:00] Speaker 3: Oh, yes. [00:23:01] Speaker 1: And as far as the content that you had texted to that number you associated or input as Colin Albert, was Colin Albert aware of the content of those text communications? Oh, correct. [00:23:11] Speaker 3: Yeah. [00:23:12] Speaker 1: And, uh, within those specific, uh, screenshot of the text communications from that evening, as far as your recollection of, of, of, uh, that particular evening, are the times that are associated with those accurate as to, as far as your memory? [00:23:27] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:23:28] Speaker 1: And did you do anything to alter the times that are associated with those, uh, uh, text communications prior to taking the screenshot and giving it to the state police? [00:23:36] Speaker 3: No. [00:23:37] Speaker 1: Um, now turning to the other two, uh, screenshots that you took, those are photographs, correct? [00:23:42] Speaker 3: Um, did I take them? [00:23:45] Speaker 1: I'm just asking what they are. [00:23:46] Speaker 3: Oh, um, picture of, both pictures of Colin, ones with my aunt, um, the others, just him and some other people, blocked off. [00:23:55] Speaker 1: And do you know when and where those were? [00:23:57] Speaker 3: Um, yes. They were taken at the Alberts house. Um, one of their sons were coming home, um, from the Marines. So it was like a welcome home party. [00:24:06] Speaker 1: And when was that in relation to the evening of January 28th or 29th? [00:24:10] Speaker 3: A few weeks after. [00:24:12] Speaker 1: And that sort of coming home celebration for your cousin who was coming home from the Marines, were you there for that? Yes. And so as far as your, um, observation of those photographs is what's depicted of Colin Albert. Is that a fair and active portrayal of what he looked like on February 11th? I'm sure. [00:24:29] Speaker 2: Yes. All right. [00:24:31] Speaker 1: Miss T and Eddie. Thank you. [00:24:33] Speaker 4: Good afternoon. Good afternoon. Uh, how long have you had an iPhone? I'm not talking about your current iPhone. But just iPhones in general. Um, for years. Uh, more than five years. Yes. And how old are you now? I'm 20. [00:24:49] Speaker 3: And when did you get your first iPhone, if you remember? I don't remember. [00:24:51] Speaker 4: 12, 13? Yeah. [00:24:53] Speaker 3: Around middle school-ish. [00:24:54] Speaker 4: Maybe seven or eight years. [00:24:55] Speaker 3: Is that a decent estimate? [00:24:56] Speaker 4: Yes. Uh, and in those seven or eight years, you have learned how to operate an iPhone, the various features that they have and the apps that you can download and use, correct? Correct. And your current iPhone has a number of apps on it, correct? Correct. Uh, with regard to the text message app, um, you'll agree with me that that is a green, uh, icon with a white, um, sort of speech bubble in the middle of it? [00:25:36] Speaker 3: Yes, I believe. [00:25:37] Speaker 4: And you know that when you click on that, it gives you a list of the text messages, uh, that you're exchanging with people, the various threads, correct? [00:25:45] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:25:46] Speaker 4: You know that if you click on a thread, it opens up the individual text messages that you've sent and received to that particular person, correct? Correct. And you know that if you take your finger or your thumb and you hold it on one particular, uh, text that's either sent to you or from you, um, you can do things with that individual text, correct? [00:26:11] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:26:12] Speaker 4: You can forward it to somebody else, right? [00:26:15] Speaker 3: Correct, I believe. [00:26:16] Speaker 4: In the context of a conversation, you can just reply to that one particular text message, right? Correct. And if you, uh, do that, rather than hit the arrow button where you forward or reply, on the left side of the screen, there's a trash can, correct? I'm not sure. Um, you know that you can delete a text from a thread, correct? Correct. All right. Uh, and it's a trash can that you click on, right? Correct. I'm not trying to trick you. [00:26:45] Speaker 3: No, no, I was confused. Sorry. [00:26:47] Speaker 4: No, I understand. I don't mean to confuse. Um, so you know that, uh, if you click on the trash can, it gives you an option to either cancel or to delete the message, correct? Correct. And what happens if you delete the message? [00:27:00] Speaker 3: Um, it's deleted off the phone. [00:27:03] Speaker 4: Okay. So it's gone from that thread, correct? Correct. And somebody looking at a screenshot that you take after you've deleted that message, it wouldn't be evident that that message was ever there, correct? [00:27:18] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:27:19] Speaker 4: Now, uh, you testified, uh, at a hearing in Boston on August 3rd of 2022. Correct? Correct. Um, that was, uh, we're not with a jury present. That was a federal grand jury. Correct? Correct. And, uh, you had, by that point, by August of 2023, you no longer had the phone that you originally had on January 29th of 22. Correct? [00:27:45] Speaker 3: Yes, I believe so. [00:27:46] Speaker 4: Um, you had gotten a new phone in December of 2022, correct? [00:27:50] Speaker 3: Okay. Okay. I'm not sure what time, but, yeah, I got, I got a new phone. I believe I got a new phone. [00:27:55] Speaker 4: But, and, and actually the, the timing is not that important, just that it was before that grand jury appearance. Okay. [00:28:01] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:28:02] Speaker 4: Uh, and what did you do with the old phone when you got the new phone? [00:28:07] Speaker 3: Um, transfer, through iCloud, everything transfers over. Okay. But I'm actually talking about the, the hardware itself. Oh, what did I do? The iPhone. [00:28:12] Speaker 4: Sorry. Can you repeat the question? Yes, I'm sorry. Uh, not the data on the phone. I understand that you, you've testified that you transferred that to the new phone, but the actual physical phone itself, where did that go when you got the new phone? I'm not sure. Would that have been traded in? [00:28:31] Speaker 3: Possibly. [00:28:32] Speaker 4: You don't have it now, correct? [00:28:34] Speaker 3: I don't think now. [00:28:35] Speaker 4: Um, and as of August of 2023, you didn't have it either, correct? Correct. Um, is it fair to say that no investigator from this case ever asked you for that phone that you had on January 29th? [00:28:49] Speaker 2: Correct. Okay. So, Ms. Dianetti, can we just focus on the voir dire? All that you're doing, you, you can cross examine her with, but on the voir dire of this. Sure. [00:28:57] Speaker 4: Thank you. [00:28:58] Speaker 2: Sure. [00:28:59] Speaker 4: I'd just like to get the jurors back in. No, I understand your honor. I understand. I was trying to lay a foundation, but maybe it's not necessary. Uh, so, um, with regard to. Um, with, with regard to the, uh, messages that are in a given threat, right? We've talked about the fact that you are aware that you can reply to them, an individual message forward or delete one. Correct? Correct. You're also aware that it is possible to change the timestamp on any individual message. Correct? No, I'm not aware of that. You go to settings and you go to general and you go to date and time. First of all, you can change the time zone of the message. Do you have your iPhone with you right now? [00:29:58] Speaker 3: Not what, not on me. [00:29:59] Speaker 4: Not on, not on. Um, and in addition to being able to change the time zone, you actually can change the hour and minute to whatever you want it to be. Were you aware of that? No. Um, with regard to photos on your phone, um, you are aware that you can change the date and time of any photo in your photo app. Correct? Nope. There is a little, when you go to your iPhone, there's a little I for information. And all you need to do is, or I think it's for info or information. Um, all you need to do is click on that and you get a pop up from the bottom that gives you the chance, the choice to alter the date and time. [00:30:57] Speaker ?: Did you know that? [00:30:58] Speaker 4: No. Uh, next to that date and time is the word adjust. And that's all you have to click on. And you can change the time from, from 12:10 a.m. Or you can change it from 12:40 a.m. to 12:10 a.m. Or you can change it from 1:45 to 12:10 a.m. And it's that easy. [00:31:19] Speaker 3: Yep. Now I, now I know. I didn't know that. I didn't do that. [00:31:23] Speaker 4: If I may have a moment. [00:31:25] Speaker 3: Okay. [00:31:26] Speaker 2: So I'm going to allow this testimony in, um, your argument goes to the weight of the evidence, not its admissibility, but I did under Commonwealth versus Trachi want to give you your voir dire. Okay. All right. So let's bring the jurors back in. Mr. Lally, I have an instruction to give if you're going to put in that screenshot. [00:31:51] Speaker 1: Yes. [00:31:52] Speaker 2: Okay. Um, jurors before, remember, I've told you this before, before you consider any electronic communication in your deliberations, you must find first that it is more likely true than not that the person who authored or sent, um, the communication was in fact either, um, Colin Albert or, um, Ms. Allie McCabe. Um, if you do not find that it's more likely true than not that Ms. McCabe or Mr. Albert was the person who authored or created or transmitted, uh, the electronic communication, then you cannot consider that communication in your deliberations. So with that, Mr. Lally. [00:32:30] Speaker 1: Thank you. And your honor, uh, the first two pages, uh, that's been marked AA commonwealth seek to introduce and admit as the next exhibit. Okay. [00:32:37] Speaker 2: Those may be admitted. [00:32:38] Speaker 1: Now, Ms. McCabe, with reference, uh, to, well, before we get into that, um, you had an iPhone at the time of, uh, January 20th, is that correct? [00:32:55] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:32:56] Speaker 1: And with respect to, um, your friend Colin Alberts, um, as far as his contact information within your phone, who entered that in your phone? [00:33:06] Speaker 3: Um, I did. [00:33:07] Speaker 1: And, uh, prior to that date of January 28th into the 29th of 2022, had you had, uh, phone conversations where you would sort of press the button to call that number and it ran, correct? [00:33:20] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:33:21] Speaker 1: So, um, who, if anyone answered the phone when you contacted that phone, uh, that phone number in your phone? [00:33:26] Speaker 3: Colin. [00:33:27] Speaker 1: Now, with reference, uh, to, um, Colin and, and the contact in your phone, had you had, uh, prior text communications, uh, with Colin using that contact that you put in? [00:33:38] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:33:39] Speaker 1: And outside of those, uh, text communications that you have, um, did you have sort of physical, in-person conversations with Colin in regard to content that was within text messages you have with that content? Yes. [00:33:54] Speaker 3: I assume so. [00:33:55] Speaker 1: And specifically on that date of, uh, January 28th into the 29th, when you arrived at, uh, the home on Fairview Road, you texted Colin that you were there? [00:34:05] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:34:06] Speaker 1: Um, yes. And after you texted him that, what if anything happened after that? [00:34:10] Speaker 3: Um, he responded saying okay, and then, um, he came out to the car. [00:34:15] Speaker 1: And your honor, if I may, uh, with the course of mission, just, uh, publish, uh, the text communication, uh, to the jury on the screen? Yes. Now, what's up on the screen, Mr. K, is that what you have before you as, um, as the exhibit? Yes. And looking at, there's, uh, sort of one side as text and one side as blue bubble, is that correct? Yes. And if you know, who is communicating with who as far as the, the sort of plain text outside of the bubble? Um, Colin and I? Is that what you're asking? [00:34:44] Speaker 3: Sorry. I'm asking is, who's the blue bubble? Oh, sorry. I'm the blue bubble, and he is the gray-white-ish bubble. [00:34:52] Speaker 1: And, um, from sort of top of what's depicted on the screen, um, you read the text that you received and the time that you received it. [00:35:02] Speaker 3: Yes, um, 11:54, and then I responded at 11:55. [00:35:07] Speaker 1: And what did Colin say at 11:54? [00:35:10] Speaker 3: Um, you can get me now, if easier. [00:35:13] Speaker 1: And what did you respond? [00:35:14] Speaker 3: Okay. I am driving people home now. [00:35:17] Speaker 1: And, uh, what did Colin respond to that, and what time did he respond? [00:35:20] Speaker 3: He responded, word, get me after. [00:35:23] Speaker 1: And as long as you could scroll down. And, um, following the get me after, what if any responses did you provide? [00:35:34] Speaker 3: KK. Okay. And here. [00:35:37] Speaker 1: And here that you texted, what time does that mean on the screenshot? 12:10 a.m. And, uh, what if anything, he called and respond to the bureau text. [00:35:47] Speaker 3: He responded at the same time saying, okay. I think someone, you can take that. [00:35:51] Speaker 1: May I approach this to retreat here? Yes. Did you need that? [00:35:54] Speaker ?: Thank you. [00:35:55] Speaker 1: Okay. Thank you. [00:35:57] Speaker ?: Um, so the next, uh, two pages, uh, two separate pages, uh, contain photographs. Is that correct? [00:36:00] Speaker 1: Yes. And you recognize what's, uh, depicted in those photographs that I've just placed before you. Yes. And what do you recognize those two? Um, it's Colin. Is that what you're asking? Well, let me ask you more specifically. Okay. Were these also screenshots that you provided to Troopers of the State Police in August of 2020? [00:36:30] Speaker 3: Yes. I believe so. [00:36:32] Speaker 1: What's in, in regard to those two photographs, uh, do you know when and where those photographs were taken? [00:36:39] Speaker 3: Um, they were taken February 11th, um, at the Alberts, Nicole and Brian's house. Objection. [00:36:46] Speaker 2: No, I'm going to let her testify when they were taken. [00:36:52] Speaker 1: And so February 11th of what year, ma'am? [00:36:56] Speaker 3: Um, 2022. [00:36:57] Speaker 1: So a few weeks after January 28th, 29th, correct? Yes. And were you present at the Alberts house on the evening of February 11th when they, when they were taken? [00:37:08] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:37:09] Speaker 1: And what was the purpose of yourself and your calling or anybody being over the Alberts house on that day? [00:37:15] Speaker 3: Um, one of Nicole and Brian's sons were coming home for, from their Marines. So there was, um, like a welcome home party with family and friends. [00:37:24] Speaker 1: And that is your, your cousin Jack, is that correct? [00:37:27] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:37:28] Speaker 1: Um, and as far as what's contained in those photographs, is that a fair and accurate portrayal as far as your memory of what Colin looked like, uh, on February 11th? Correct. And, uh, Your Honor, may I approach again? Yes. Yes. Come off the seat to introduce and admit as the next two exhibits? Again, separate for our discussion. Sure. [00:37:46] Speaker 2: Okay. Yes. [00:37:48] Speaker ?: Those will come in. [00:37:49] Speaker 1: And do you recognize what's, uh, now up on the screen is what you have before you as exhibit 82? Yes. And if you could just describe the jury sort of what we're looking at in this photograph, who's the biggest picture? [00:38:00] Speaker 3: Um, Colin and my Auntie Coco. [00:38:02] Speaker 1: And, uh, your Auntie Coco is also, uh, Nicole Albert, is that correct? [00:38:06] Speaker 3: Yes. Yes, Nicole. [00:38:08] Speaker 1: And if I could direct your attention to the next exhibit for you as exhibit 83? [00:38:09] Speaker ?: Yes. And, uh, again, what's up on the screen, is that what you have before you as exhibit 83? [00:38:09] Speaker 1: Yes. [00:38:10] Speaker ?: This is the same evening, is that correct? [00:38:10] Speaker 1: Correct. Do you know where in the house this photograph is taken? Um, I believe that they call it, they call it their library, maybe? It's the last, it's the room in the back. And as far as, um, what's up on the screen? Is that what you have before you as exhibit 83? Yes. This is the same evening, is that correct? Correct. Do you know where in the house this photograph is taken? [00:38:33] Speaker 3: Um, I believe that they call it, they call it their library, maybe? It's the last, it's the room in the back. [00:38:39] Speaker 1: And as far as, um, what's contained in this photograph in reference to your friend, Colin Albert, as far as his face, his arms, his hands, is that fair and accurate portrayal of what he looked like on February 11th? [00:38:53] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:38:54] Speaker 1: Thank you very much. Thank you, ma'am. I have no further questions. [00:38:59] Speaker 2: Okay. Steve and Eddie. [00:39:01] Speaker 1: Thank you. [00:39:02] Speaker ?: Good afternoon. Good afternoon. Good afternoon. [00:39:05] Speaker 4: Ms. McCabe, you have known, uh, Colin Albert your whole life, correct? [00:39:15] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:39:16] Speaker 4: Your mother is Jennifer McCabe? Correct. His mother is Julie Albert? Correct. And her maiden name was Julie Daniel? Correct. Your mother, Jennifer, grew up together with his mother, Julie, correct? Correct. Uh, you and Colin are extremely close, correct? Yes. In fact, you would consider Colin Albert to be one of your best friends in the world, correct? [00:39:48] Speaker 3: Yes, he's one of my best friends. [00:39:53] Speaker 4: Now, um, you claim that you took a screenshot of a text conversation that you had with Colin Albert on January 29th of 2022, correct? Correct. Those were the screenshots that were just shown to this jury this afternoon, correct? [00:40:15] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:40:16] Speaker 4: Uh, and you claim that that, uh, the information on that screenshot actually existed on January 29th, correct? Correct. Um, did you tell your mother, Jennifer McCabe, that you had that text conversation with Colin Albert any time after January 29th of 2022? Check action. Sustained. Did you give to your mother, Jennifer McCabe, a screenshot of that text message conversation? Objection. [00:40:52] Speaker 1: Sustained. [00:40:53] Speaker 4: Um, it's fair to say that on January 29th, 30th, 31st, you did not turn over that screenshot to any law enforcement official, correct? Of January, of, uh, 2022? No, I was never asked. No investigator from this case ever asked you for copies or a copy of that screenshot of that text message conversation on January 29th, 30th or 31st, correct? Correct. They also did not ask you for a copy of that screenshot through the whole month of February, correct? [00:41:36] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:41:37] Speaker 4: In fact, all of 2022, no investigator ever approached you to say, can I have a copy of that screenshot, correct? Correct. [00:41:48] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:41:49] Speaker 4: Uh, and in addition to that, you never called an investigator to say, hey, I have a copy of a screenshot of a text message conversation that I had with Colin Albert, correct? [00:42:02] Speaker 3: No, it wouldn't have been relevant at that time. Okay. I believe because Colin was not at the house and wasn't introduced as being there until [00:42:14] Speaker ?: later. [00:42:15] Speaker 4: So your, uh, testimony today that is that at no time in the year 2022, did you consider it relevant at all that you had this screenshot of this text conversation, correct? [00:42:30] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:42:31] Speaker 4: Uh, leaving that screenshot aside, but actually before I leave that topic, um, you didn't turn over that screenshot of the text message until sometime during the summer of 2023, correct? Correct. About a year and a half or more after January 29th of 2022, correct? Yes. [00:42:53] Speaker 3: When I was asked. [00:42:54] Speaker 4: Uh, and by that time, the summer of 2022, correct? The summer of 2023, um, you had already switched phones, correct? Yes. [00:43:08] Speaker 3: Believe it. [00:43:09] Speaker 4: In other words, the iPhone that you had on January 29th of 2022, you no longer have possession of that physical phone, correct? Correct. Correct. [00:43:16] Speaker ?: You had a new iPhone, correct? Correct. [00:43:16] Speaker 4: You had a new iPhone, correct? Correct. And you say that you transferred over the data from the old phone to the new phone, correct? [00:43:36] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:43:37] Speaker 4: Uh, correct. [00:43:38] Speaker ?: Uh, correct. [00:43:38] Speaker 4: Uh, that, uh, phone that you got in December of 2022, uh, if it was from the phone that you had back in January of 2022, correct? Uh, correct. Uh, correct. Uh, that, uh, phone that you got in December of 2022, uh, it's now May of 2024. Do you still have that same phone? The phone, my old phone, is that? No, the, the, the, the, the, my question was, and again, I'm not, I'm not trying to trick you in any way here. Um, the phone that you got in December of 2022, or if it was from the phone that you had back in January of 2022, correct? Correct. That, uh, phone that you got in December of 2022, uh, it's now May of 2024. Do you still have that same phone? The phone, my old phone? Is that? No, the, the, the, the, the, my question was, and again, I'm not, I'm not trying to trick you in any way here. The phone got in December of 2022, the, the new phone at that time, is that the phone, your current phone? [00:44:27] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:44:28] Speaker 4: Now, before you, uh, got rid of the old phone and got the new one, did any law enforcement official, you know, prior to that December of 2022 time period or investigator from this case ever ask to examine your physical phone itself? [00:44:52] Speaker 3: No. [00:44:53] Speaker 4: Uh, did they ever say to you, we would like to do what's called an extraction on your phone? [00:45:00] Speaker 3: No. No. [00:45:02] Speaker 4: And you've never, you never gave that phone at any point to any law enforcement official before you got rid of it. Correct? [00:45:10] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:45:11] Speaker 4: And the first time that you mentioned that text conversation, um, outside your family was on August 3rd of 2023. Correct? Correct. That was at a proceeding in Boston. Correct? Correct. Where neither Mr. Lally, Mr. Brockman, or we were there. [00:45:31] Speaker 3: Jackson, Your Honor. [00:45:32] Speaker 4: Yeah. Move along, Mr. Yanetti. Um, that proceeding in August of 2023 was less than a year ago. Correct? We're in May of 2024. [00:45:46] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:45:47] Speaker 4: And that was a long time after John O'Keefe was found dead on Brian Albert's lawn. Correct? [00:45:53] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:45:54] Speaker 4: And that August of 2023, when you're revealing that text exchange, that was over a year and a half after January 29th of 2022. [00:46:04] Speaker 3: Correct? Correct. [00:46:06] Speaker 4: And leaving aside the, the screenshot, um, as of August 3rd of 2023, no investigator from this case, uh, no state police trooper or anybody from the DA's office had ever interviewed you, right? Prior to August of 2023? [00:46:30] Speaker 3: Um, I talked to the troops, state troopers, but I don't know if that was before or after. [00:46:36] Speaker 4: That was on August 25th of 2023, which is about three weeks after your testimony and the other proceedings. Does that refresh your memory? Yes. [00:46:45] Speaker 3: Then after. [00:46:46] Speaker 4: Yeah. At that point in time on August 25th of 2023, you'll agree with me that you were not interviewed at a police station or a state police barracks. Correct? [00:46:57] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:46:58] Speaker 4: Or the DA's office. Correct? [00:47:00] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:47:01] Speaker 4: You were interviewed by Zoom. Correct? [00:47:03] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:47:04] Speaker 4: And you were not alone at that time in your, in your home. Correct? [00:47:08] Speaker 3: I'm not sure. [00:47:09] Speaker 4: Your mother, Jennifer McCabe was present. Correct? Okay. And she was monitoring what was going on in that interview. [00:47:18] Speaker ?: Correct? [00:47:19] Speaker 2: Jackson. [00:47:20] Speaker 3: Was that true? I don't recall. [00:47:23] Speaker 4: Okay. In any case, that too was over a year and a half after January 29th. Correct? [00:47:30] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:47:31] Speaker 4: All right. Now, I'd like to ask you some questions about, oh, by the way, you've had an iPhone since you were 12 or 13 years old? Correct. And you're now how old? [00:47:43] Speaker 3: 20. [00:47:44] Speaker 4: So seven or eight years would be a good estimate as to how long you've worked with iPhones? Correct. And obviously you know how an iPhone works, correct? Correct. You know how to reply and comment on text messages, correct? [00:47:58] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:47:59] Speaker 4: And you know that there's a lot of tools open to you to comment on text messages, correct? [00:48:08] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:48:09] Speaker 4: You can reply to a text using an icon or an emoji, right? To like or dislike something that somebody else said. [00:48:17] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:48:18] Speaker 4: You can laugh at it. You can love it. You can like it, correct? [00:48:23] Speaker 1: Objection. [00:48:24] Speaker 4: Right? Correct. And they make it pretty easy, right? All you need to do is put your finger or your thumb on a specific message and hold it down and options appear, correct? Correct. And that's where you get the thumbs up, the thumbs down, the ha-ha, exclamation points, question mark, et cetera? Correct. And you also have other options, which is down the bottom, there's a kind of a curved arrow where if you click on that you can forward the message or reply to a specific message, correct? [00:48:59] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:49:00] Speaker 4: And on the left there's a trash can, right? [00:49:02] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:49:03] Speaker 4: And what happens when you click on the trash can? [00:49:06] Speaker 3: It will delete the message from your phone. [00:49:09] Speaker 4: And it's your testimony that with regard to the screenshot that we saw, there are no deleted messages in that conversation, correct? Yes. However, you would agree as you've already testified that if a message had been deleted from a screenshot, we'd never know, right? [00:49:37] Speaker 3: True. [00:49:40] Speaker 4: You're also familiar with the apps that are on iPhones, correct? Correct. You have a number of apps on your iPhone, right? Correct. There might be 12 or 15, maybe on your home screen, right? Correct. And if you swipe to the left, you get another new population of 12 or 15? Correct. Not bad for an old guy. Yeah. And you use apps like Instagram? Correct. Snapchat is a popular app? Correct. And probably to your detriment, but Life360? Correct. All right. That's been an app in the McCabe family for a number of years, right? [00:50:23] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:50:24] Speaker 4: Yes. And it's in your family anyway, and probably a lot of families, it's mainly used for the parents to keep track of their kids, right? [00:50:32] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:50:35] Speaker 4: And in order for Life360 to work, you have to have your location services on, and somebody else has to have the app and it's in the family, correct? Connected to you? [00:50:46] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:50:47] Speaker 4: And with regard to, just going back to the messages for a minute, do you know the difference between an iMessage and a text message? [00:50:57] Speaker 3: Yes, I believe one's blue and one's green. [00:51:00] Speaker 4: Okay. The screenshots that we saw of your text conversation that you say that you had with Colin Albert, you were in blue, right? Correct. That means that Colin Albert also had an iPhone at the time, correct? [00:51:15] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:51:16] Speaker 4: Correct. Now, with regard to the timestamp on those messages, the conversation about I'm here, I believe, gave the time 12:10 a.m., correct? Correct. Are you aware how easy it is to change that time? [00:51:43] Speaker 3: No. [00:51:44] Speaker 4: Are you aware that all you need to do is go from settings to general and then there's a date and time that you can alter? [00:51:52] Speaker 1: Correct. [00:51:53] Speaker ?: Correct. Correct. [00:51:54] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:51:55] Speaker 4: And you always choose the New York time zone because that's where Boston is, right? Correct. And I'm aware that if you go into settings, general, and then date and time, you can change the time zone to wherever you're going. [00:52:14] Speaker 3: I guess. I didn't. Once I set my phone up, I have no reason to change the time. [00:52:20] Speaker 4: And in addition to changing the time zone, you literally can choose any time that you want. You could make 1:45 a.m., 12:10 a.m. in about three seconds. Do you know that? Do you know that? [00:52:37] Speaker 2: Do you know that? No. [00:52:39] Speaker 4: But if, I'm not accusing you of this now, but if you had changed the time on that from a screenshot, we'd have no way of knowing, correct? I guess. Because what a screenshot ultimately becomes is like a photo, correct? [00:52:58] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:52:59] Speaker 4: It's not like you can edit it, right? I mean, the most thing you can do is what we saw on the other photo that was displayed, which is kind of crossing out with a magic marker, somebody's face or a time, right? That would be how you'd have to alter it, right? Correct. Now, I had asked you if, prior to getting rid of your old phone and getting the new one, if law enforcement ever asked, ever asked you to go through the phone themselves and you'd said no, right? [00:53:37] Speaker 3: Yes, they did not do that. [00:53:38] Speaker 4: And they never asked to do an extraction on the old phone, correct? No. What about the new phone that you now have, that you got in December? Have the state police ever asked to do, have they ever asked to look through that phone? [00:53:54] Speaker 3: They look, no, I don't think so. [00:53:57] Speaker 4: You provided the screenshot that was shown to the jury today on August 25th when you talked to the state police in this case, right, of 2023? Correct. And when you provided down that screenshot, did they say, hey, by the way, can I look at your phone to see if it's on there? Jackson. [00:54:20] Speaker 2: I'll allow that. Did they say that to you? [00:54:22] Speaker 3: I don't remember. [00:54:23] Speaker 4: But in any case, you never physically showed them your phone, right? [00:54:27] Speaker 3: No. [00:54:28] Speaker 4: You don't recall clicking on that text message app, the green app with the kind of white speech bubble. You didn't click on that and then click on the Colin Albert conversation and say, here it is, did you? [00:54:41] Speaker 3: No. [00:54:42] Speaker 4: And in addition to not asking you to see your new phone, they also did not ask you to do an extraction of your new phone, correct? Correct. And at some point in time, you realized that you'd have to be a witness in this case and have the unfortunate incident of having to talk to me, right? Jackson. [00:55:04] Speaker 1: Jackson. [00:55:05] Speaker 2: I'm going to see counsel outside by for just a minute on this. [00:55:12] Speaker 4: Okay. And just to wrap this up, to this day, no extraction has been done on your phone, correct? [00:55:18] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:55:20] Speaker 4: Now, when you had that Zoom interview on August 25th, you told the trooper that you drove Collins straight to his house. After you picked him up on January 29th and then you went straight home, correct? Yes, I believe. And you have previously testified back in August of 2023 that you, you believe you dropped Colin Albert off at his home at around 12:15, 12:20 or so. [00:55:54] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:55:55] Speaker 4: And when you left, by the way, you're very familiar with 34 Fairview, right? [00:56:00] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:56:01] Speaker 4: That's the family, correct? [00:56:02] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:56:03] Speaker 4: You've been over there many, many, many times, correct? [00:56:05] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:56:06] Speaker 4: And you're familiar with the neighborhood in terms of the streets that are around there, right? Correct. And you've lived in Canton your whole life? [00:56:12] Speaker 3: Yes. Yes. [00:56:14] Speaker 4: Yes. Yes. And can you tell the jury the route that you took home from 34 Fairview, or actually strike down, the route that you took to Colin Albert's house when you left 34 Fairview on January 29th? [00:56:30] Speaker 3: I don't remember specifically, but I would believe I drove up Fairview, then -- sorry, I don't know the streets. [00:56:42] Speaker 4: If I suggested to you that the street closest to 34 Fairview was Cedar Crest, then the one on the other side is Chapman. Does that refresh your memory? [00:56:51] Speaker 3: Yes, so Chapman, I believe. [00:56:53] Speaker 4: So you would have gone up and gone to Chapman and taken a right or a left? [00:56:57] Speaker 3: I'm really bad with directions. When I got there, I went to the center of town in his house. I don't know specifically which way I'm trying to think of it. I can't picture it. Yes. [00:57:12] Speaker 4: Are you familiar with Washington Street in Canton? Yes. Would you have wound up on Washington Street? Yes. All right. And you're aware that the Canton Library is on the corner of Washington and Sherman Street? Does that make sense? Yes. So you would have passed by the library? Yes. [00:57:31] Speaker ?: All right. [00:57:32] Speaker 4: Now, with regard to whether you went straight home, did you -- by the way, when you went home, did you stay there? Yes, I believe so. [00:57:44] Speaker 3: For in the rest of the night? [00:57:46] Speaker 4: Yes. [00:57:47] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:57:48] Speaker ?: Okay. [00:57:50] Speaker 4: And what time do you say that you arrived at home? [00:57:54] Speaker 3: I'm not sure. Before around 12:30ish. [00:58:00] Speaker 4: Okay. With regard to Life360, would you agree with me that if you go on that app and you're trying to figure out where somebody in your family is, there's like a -- and let's say you want to know if somebody's home. There's like a circle that surrounds your home, correct? Yes. So once you enter that circle, you know that Life360 gives an alert that said you arrived at home. Even though you're physically not walking in the door, you're within that circle and that's a whole new circle, right? Yes. Okay. On January 29th of 2022 at 12:04 and 53 seconds, you arrived within that home circle, correct? [00:58:55] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:58:56] Speaker 4: And then at 12:06 and 55 seconds on January 29th, you left that home circle, correct? [00:59:08] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:59:09] Speaker 4: And then on January 29th of 2022 at 12:23 and 14 seconds, you completed a seven mile drive where your top speed was 42 miles an hour. Does that make sense? [00:59:24] Speaker 3: Correct. [00:59:25] Speaker 4: And then you left home on January 29th of 2022 at 12:23 and 14 seconds as well. And what that probably means, reading between the lines, is that you entered that home circle, but then you didn't go home. You went through the home circle and completed a seven mile drive somewhere, right? [00:59:51] Speaker ?: I guess. [00:59:52] Speaker 3: I thought I went home. Yes. I thought I went home. [00:59:55] Speaker 2: I'm not. Jackson, your honor. Okay. [00:59:58] Speaker 3: I'm sorry. I didn't hear your answer. I believe I went home. Okay. [01:00:02] Speaker 4: I was completing my drive out my house. All right. But at 12:26 AM on January 29th, you left home again, right? Jackson, your honor. [01:00:10] Speaker 1: Did you? Did you leave home? [01:00:12] Speaker 3: I don't know. I don't remember. No, I don't remember. [01:00:15] Speaker 4: Okay. All right. And at 12:26 AM and 12 seconds, you arrived at the Canton High School, correct? [01:00:22] Speaker 3: No. No. [01:00:24] Speaker 4: At 12, on January 29th of 2022, at 12:26 and 55 seconds, you completed a one mile drive where your top speed was 43 miles per hour, right? I don't believe so. And then at 12:26 and 55 seconds on January 29th, you left Canton High School and arrived at home on January 29th of 2022 at 12:29 and 28 seconds, correct? [01:00:53] Speaker 3: I do not know. [01:00:55] Speaker 4: And then after arriving home again on January 29th of 2022 at 12:29 and 29 seconds, you completed a 12 mile drive on January 29th of 2022 at 12:31 and 22 seconds. Did you not? [01:01:14] Speaker 3: No. [01:01:15] Speaker 4: And then you left home on January 29th of 2022 at 1:08 and 15 seconds, right? [01:01:24] Speaker 3: I don't believe so. [01:01:29] Speaker 4: And ultimately, you went through the home bubble and the Canton High School bubble and you arrived at Canton High School on January 29th of 2022 at 1:28 in the morning in eight seconds. [01:01:42] Speaker 3: Can I see what you're referring to? [01:01:44] Speaker ?: Sure. [01:01:44] Speaker 3: May I approach you on? [01:01:45] Speaker 4: Yes. [01:01:46] Speaker ?: You probably don't read these, right? No, I'm good. [01:01:48] Speaker 4: Okay, and to make it easy, I mean, you can read the whole thing, but where it says record 16 is what I just asked you about, but feel free to read the whole thing. Thank you. And if you would read it silently to yourself and look up at me when you're done. Did that help refresh your memory on where you were that night? Do you still dispute that you went straight home and didn't leave there? Objection. [01:02:34] Speaker 2: Sustained. [01:02:36] Speaker 4: And finally, I just asked you about arriving at Canton High School on January 29th of 2022 at 1:28 in eight seconds. Correct? [01:02:52] Speaker ?: What time did it say I arrived at high school? [01:02:52] Speaker 4: 1:30 in the morning in 26 seconds. And what time did it say I arrived at high school? The high school was 1:28 in eight seconds. It wouldn't have taken me two minutes to go from the high school to my house. [01:02:59] Speaker ?: I'm confused. [01:02:59] Speaker 4: The high school was also one of the bubbles, one of the areas where you could be, right? On July 30th. [01:03:02] Speaker 3: I'm confused. It was 1:30 in the morning in 26 seconds. [01:03:04] Speaker 4: 1:30 in the morning in 26 seconds. Correct? What time did it say I arrived at high school? [01:03:07] Speaker 3: Correct? What time did it say I arrived at high school? [01:03:10] Speaker 4: Correct? What time did it say I arrived at high school? 1:30 in the morning in 26 seconds. Correct? What time did it say I arrived at high school? [01:03:15] Speaker 3: 1:30 in the morning in 26 seconds. And what time did it say I arrived at high school? And what time did it say I arrived at high school? To my house. I'm confused. [01:03:20] Speaker 4: Well, with regards to that, the high school was also one of the bubbles, one of the areas where you could be, right? On Life 360? [01:03:28] Speaker 3: No. [01:03:29] Speaker 4: One second. One minute more. Yes. Okay. Did you say that on Life 360, the Canton High School is not one of the areas that you're tracked in? [01:03:44] Speaker 3: What do you mean? [01:03:45] Speaker 4: Do you remember we were talking earlier about- [01:03:47] Speaker 3: Oh, like put in a location, like that was home, that was high school. [01:03:51] Speaker 4: There were other locations. Like, you know, if your mother's looking for you, where are you? Yes. You know, you're at D&E Pizza, you're at high school, you're at, you know, home, right? I mean, those could be categories. Correct. You've agreed that home was one of the categories. [01:04:03] Speaker 3: Correct. [01:04:04] Speaker 4: And having reviewed that, the Canton High School is also in one of the categories, correct? [01:04:08] Speaker 3: I believe so. [01:04:09] Speaker 4: All right. And on January 29th of 2022, the last entry is that you completed a 12 mile drive on January 29th of 2022 at 1:32 in the morning and 23 seconds. And that's the end of the activity. Do you agree with me that that's when you finally stopped that night? I don't recall. [01:04:30] Speaker 3: I may have a moment. Yes. [01:04:32] Speaker ?: Go for the questions. [01:04:33] Speaker 4: Thank you, Mark. All right. [01:04:35] Speaker 2: Mr. Lally. [01:04:36] Speaker ?: Thank you. [01:04:37] Speaker 1: Now, Ms. McCabe, with regard to, did you get rid of your prior iPhone or did you upgrade [01:05:02] Speaker 3: your iPhone? Upgrade. [01:05:04] Speaker 1: And that would have been in December of 2022, is that correct? Yes. [01:05:07] Speaker 3: I believe so. [01:05:08] Speaker 1: Was it sometime around Christmas? [01:05:09] Speaker 3: Yeah, probably. [01:05:10] Speaker 1: And that could have been a present as far as getting a new iPhone or upgrading your iPhone? Yes. Now, as far as any of the information that you were shown as far as a screenshot, did you in any way, shape or form, or delete any of the content within that text message from January 28th and the 29th with calling out? No. [01:05:30] Speaker 3: No. [01:05:31] Speaker 1: And with reference to changing times or time zones or anything on text messages, before Mr. Unetti asked you any of those questions, were you aware of any of those things as things that you could do with your phone? No. With regard to Light 360, what kind of knowledge do you have as far as the accuracy of sort of the time stamps that are contained within that app? [01:06:06] Speaker 3: Well, I'm not sure, but on the photo he showed me, it says, like, turn Wi-Fi on. So, like, remind Allie to turn Wi-Fi on. So, that could have affected the accuracy. [01:06:17] Speaker 1: And that was on literally every single one of the alerts that was on that page that you showed you? [01:06:23] Speaker 3: Every single one. [01:06:24] Speaker 1: Now, Canton High School, do you know what street that's on? [01:06:27] Speaker 3: Washington Street, I believe. Yeah. [01:06:30] Speaker 1: And about how far a ride is it from Canton High School to your house? [01:06:35] Speaker 3: Seven, eight minutes, ten, I'm not sure. [01:06:39] Speaker 1: You were in the bubble of Canton High School at 1:28 in the morning. Could you have possibly been in the bubble of your home at 1:30 in the morning? No. And unless you were going 90 miles an hour in a snowstorm? No. Now, you were asked some questions about that timeframe of August of 2023 when you were asked and you turned over some screenshots to troopers from the state, correct? Correct. You were asked about previous times indicating that you weren't asked and it wasn't relevant, correct? [01:07:16] Speaker 3: Correct. [01:07:17] Speaker 1: Now, do you know why you were asked in August of 2023 versus any prior time period? [01:07:22] Speaker 3: Because Colin Albert wasn't in the house and it was brought up here that he was. [01:07:28] Speaker 1: Yes. And brought up where? [01:07:30] Speaker 3: By the defense. And around that time of August 2023? I believe so. [01:07:34] Speaker 1: Yes. And with reference to relevancy, is that what you were talking about? Correct. And what, if anything else, has your close friends with Colin Albert, is that correct? Correct. What, if anything else, has either your family or Colin Albert and his family undergone over [01:08:02] Speaker 2: the course of dependency of this case? [01:08:03] Speaker 3: Objection. No, the door's been opened. I'm allowing it. Basically harassment. [01:08:07] Speaker 1: And harassment by whom? Bloggers, people online. And what, if anything, in relation to Colin Albert being in the house has occurred as far as the harassment that you're talking about? [01:08:21] Speaker 3: Um, can you rephrase? [01:08:22] Speaker 1: Um, with reference to what you were talking about as far as the relevancy of Colin Albert being in the house at that time, um, what, if any, harassment was there in relation to that and in relation to Colin? Well. Objection. [01:08:36] Speaker 2: No, go ahead. She can answer. [01:08:38] Speaker 3: Colin wasn't at the house, so he's being harassed for, he was not at the house when John was there, so I drove him home. So he's, people are harassing him, saying he was at the house when it's not true. It's not true. [01:08:51] Speaker 1: Can you speak about harassment? What, what specifically type of harassment are we talking about? [01:08:55] Speaker 3: Um, phone calls, constant phone calls, emails, awful messages. Objection. [01:09:01] Speaker 1: I'll allow it. [01:09:03] Speaker 2: Focus on this witness, not Colin Albert at this point. [01:09:08] Speaker 1: As far as, uh, you and, and your family, what, if any, type of harassment have you received? [01:09:13] Speaker 3: Um, people showing up at our house, um, people emailing my school. Um, just take a lot of harassment. Can I have a moment, please? [01:09:21] Speaker ?: Sure. Okay. I'm sorry. [01:09:24] Speaker 3: Thank you. [01:09:25] Speaker ?: And, uh, how long period of time has that persisted for? [01:09:25] Speaker 3: Very long time. Very long time. [01:09:27] Speaker ?: No. [01:09:28] Speaker 3: No. Thank you. [01:09:30] Speaker ?: Thank you. I have no questions. Thank you. I have no questions. Thank you. Thank you. And, uh, how long period of time has that persisted for? Very long time. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. I have no questions. I have no questions. I have no questions. Okay. I have no questions. [01:09:43] Speaker 3: Thank you. I have no questions. [01:09:45] Speaker ?: I have no questions. Okay. I have no questions. I have no questions. [01:09:49] Speaker 1: Thank you. And, uh, how long period of time has that persisted for? [01:09:53] Speaker 3: Very long time. Thank you. [01:09:55] Speaker ?: I have no questions. I have no questions. I have no questions. [01:09:58] Speaker 1: I have no questions. I have no questions. [01:10:00] Speaker 4: Okay. [01:10:01] Speaker ?: All right. [01:10:02] Speaker 2: Ms. McCabe, you're all set. [01:10:05] Speaker ?: Thank you. [01:10:07] Speaker 2: Your next witness, Mr. Lally. [01:10:10] Speaker 1: Yes, I'll call him off the call. Colin Albert to the stand.