Does Hyperscale Data Centers = Hyperscale Workforce?

[00:00:00] Speaker 1: They laugh, you know, fly over country, well, welcome to the most gorgeous, beautiful state that you've ever experienced. You better stop and look. Really understanding what a closed loop [00:00:09] Speaker 2: system is versus evaporative. We don't need a thousand people on site to operate a data center, even if we needed a thousand people on site every day to construct one of those things. Let's really [00:00:19] Speaker 1: look at what are the skills that you're looking for. What is your training program? If you don't [00:00:23] Speaker 3: have one, let's build it. When they go to eat dinner, when they go to do all their stuff in the [00:00:28] Speaker 1: city, that is helping that community. And those are six-figure jobs. [00:00:38] Speaker 3: Welcome to the Beyond For Aker podcast. [00:00:41] Speaker 1: Excited to be here to talk about data centers, to talk about workforce development, to talk about community impact. I want to just do a shout out. You said guys and gals, thank you so much for that. That is huge because we're increasing this workforce with anybody and everybody. Yeah. So CEO of the Gore Group, it stands for Grit Over Resume. And it is a workforce development company specifically in the mission critical industry here in the US. A little dibble dabble in the UK and Canada from time to time. Mexico just popped up recently, so we'll see. And then I'm also the AFCOM chair, the president here in Minnesota. I just took that over a few months ago. What is AFCOM? AFCOM is the largest nonprofit data center membership organization in Minnesota. It is an international membership. There's chapters all over the US. And we are here to ensure that we have community impact, community development, community development. And currently the chain of events right now is really becoming quite controversial. And so we're having to step back and say, "Fair. You don't know what we don't know." And so we're having those conversations every single day and really challenging everyone to have those conversations over and over and over. Because sometimes it might feel like in our world that we're saying this. Why aren't you understanding this? And it's like, well, we have to talk to every single community. So one of the first things that I asked for when I became president was to have a tribal liaison. That was super important to me in my previous work. I had worked at DOD for five years. And understanding that you need to have all of the sovereign nations with you if you're doing anything is extremely important. And so sitting down with each of the tribal leaders one by one here has been a great start. But it's just a start. And yeah. So that's a little bit about AFCOM. And we have a huge hill to work up and to talk about in a very fair and human centric way. [00:03:08] Speaker 3: Sure. I think fair place to start then. Seeing that, you know, let's talk about the data center landscape in Minnesota, talk about AFCOM is doing, and then we can get to the Gore group. And really, if this is something that as what we're going to talk about in data centers that interest you, here's your avenue to maybe get into that workforce. So from an AFCOM standpoint, when you talk about the challenges that, you know, recently facing, um, what does that entail? What, what is, what are you seeing from AFCOM and people reaching out to AFCOM that's making it challenging for data centers to be built, um, in the state of Minnesota or elsewhere that you're representing? But I think [00:03:51] Speaker 1: AFCOM Minnesota chapter. Yeah. Correct. Yes. Um, so speaking specifically for Minnesota, and then we can go outside of that, but AFCOM Minnesota is all Minnesota constituents. So I love that. There's a lot of different groups that are coming here that are saying like, oh, we're, we're data center experts. That's great. But you're not our neighbors. You're not our coworkers. Um, in fact, uh, one of my coworkers or colleagues is Bob Grill. He's with Hunt Electric. I got to do a shout out. Of course, I'm going to say something to Bob to my Papa Smurf, my husband over at ECSI and his homeboy, Kyle, shout out. Um, so there's many different members on our board that come from GCs, ECs. Uh, we have Colleen Addy from the state of Minnesota. She was on your podcast. I absolutely loved that podcast. Uh, who else? We've got OEMs. Uh, we have owner operators. We have all different types of people within the data center [00:04:56] Speaker 2: industry. And now you said you've gotten a tribal liaison as well. So now you've got input from native, uh, native tribes here in the state of Minnesota as well. Working towards that. Oh, [00:05:07] Speaker 1: apologies. So, um, I just don't want to misquote that at all. Uh, what I've learned is that working, uh, in junction with the, um, indigenous workforce initiative that's going on right now in Minnesota in collaboration of that with this, when I went out and I found, uh, her name's Farron. She's going to be our tribal liaison. Uh, that's a lot of work. She has a job. She's a mother as well. She's going to school and to ask her to be that liaison for the 10 tribes here in Minnesota, not to include Western Wisconsin. That's going to take a significant amount of time, energy and effort, and she needs to be compensated for that. Sure. And so now working backwards and realizing that this is more than a part-time job of what we're asking for her. Uh, we're now actively looking at grants and different opportunities that we can raise because we're a nonprofit, but we also raise funds. A majority of our money from AFCOM goes into, um, school scholarships. Sure. Okay. And from that standpoint, [00:06:20] Speaker 3: right, you're, you're talking about bringing in more groups of people and you, you mentioned it. You have people who come in and say, we're data center experts, right? And it's like, that doesn't, that just doesn't play here. Right. We, we, and Colleen talked about it in her episode as well. Somebody comes with an idea and they bring it to the state. It's like, well, okay, thank you, um, for not cutting us out. Cause yeah, we have to go through all these steps. And so when, what is, does AFCOM focus more on some of the smaller data centers, larger hyperscale, everything, what's the, where the majority of the advocacy's spent? [00:06:56] Speaker 1: Just for your viewers, in case they don't know. Okay. Thank you. [00:06:59] Speaker 3: And you have to include me in that because I am not the data center guy. Yeah, loosely. [00:07:03] Speaker 1: I just want to do like a quick little knowledge check. Sure. So data centers encompass your hyperscalers. I call them the big girls. You got your, you know, your Google, your AWS, your meta, those types. And then you have your enterprise. So think about like your banking institutions. Um, we've got like 3M here, Wells Fargo, those types of data centers, which have been around for a very, very long time. And then you have your co-location. Uh, so you have the, um, building downtown. I don't know if I should even name it or not, but I'm just going to leave that out. One of the buildings downtown. One of the buildings downtown. Um, that hub is for like your zoos, your 911 dispatch, your, everyone is going into that. And that hub there actually connects to the entire Midwest. So it's a super important data center. There's many data centers downtown Minnesota, but a lot of colos, um, not a lot of colos, I guess I should take that back, but there are colos all around. And then we have edge data centers. And so that's, what's the closest to you as the user. So if you're thinking about like, I'm going to go, it's Friday night and I'm going to watch some Netflix and it says now streaming, that's, that's that easy one. That's going to be the closest to you. But when I want to watch movie that brings back my childhood, it's going to spin for a little bit longer. That's the further that you have to go into more of those kind of cloud or AI providers. So I just want to break that up because as we start to demystify and debunk some of these data centers that people are, um, saying like the nimbyism or the not in my backyard, we have to really qualify and quantify what each one is and what they're doing and who's sitting at the table with us with that. [00:08:52] Speaker 3: So sorry, not sorry. No, I think that was very good. I made an assumption that everybody knew what we were talking about. [00:08:58] Speaker ?: No, that's okay. [00:08:58] Speaker 3: Thank you. [00:08:59] Speaker 1: So can you repeat what you said? [00:09:01] Speaker 3: Yeah. So I guess what, what of those, um, different types of data centers, what is AFCOM focused the most on? And it, and if it's not just one of them, it's all of them because I think that's what F comes there for. Um, that's a totally fine answer too, I guess. What is, where do you focus the most time on? What do you see the biggest challenge? Um, or maybe resentment towards data centers? [00:09:23] Speaker 1: What type of them. Great question. Um, we focus in on the entire data center ecosystem and up until now, primarily in Minnesota, we have only had all types of data centers with the exception of the large AI mega campuses, the big girls, as you called them, the big girls. Um, so right now we have, um, you know, a project in Rosemount and we have a couple of others that are coming. So those are definitely the hot topics. And those are the ones that we're being pulled into on both sides as a neutral entity. [00:10:05] Speaker 2: So we aren't there. And what do you mean by both sides? Pardon the interruption. Yeah, no. Um, so [00:10:10] Speaker 1: the, the data centers themselves, it's a good thing for, you know, us to be helping them in any way because we are locals or Minnesotans, uh, no one's going to fly in, you know, they, they laugh, you know, fly over country. Well, welcome to the most gorgeous, beautiful state that you've ever experienced. You better stop and look. Uh, you better stop. Uh, no, but you know, it's also really family orientated. I mean, I live 30 minutes from my mother. My, my children are gonna, you know, live 30 minutes from me when they have children, the list goes on and on. And so we're very connected here and multi-generationally. And I think that's important to just state because when you come here, you have to understand who we are as people and what our land and our dedication to mother earth. I mean, we use outside all four seasons. Everyone's like, don't you hate the winter? No. [00:11:07] Speaker 2: Yeah. You just got to have different hobbies. That's it. Yeah. [00:11:10] Speaker 1: Uh, you have to know how to dress accordingly. So circling back to what you're saying, we are helping the data centers on, on one side and helping educate them on who we are as Minnesotans. And on the opposite side, we are Minnesotans. So I just recently, um, put a video out that was bold, potentially controversial, uh, where I said, not in my backyard, so long as I understand what's coming. And I really do feel like this is what we have to do as an industry to step up and to say, say, we understand that there are some really potentially scary things that you don't understand. I didn't understand them. I thought the cloud was just the cloud. Right. And for some reason, I was okay with that. Sure. And I thought it was funny, but little did I know that it was a data center. So we're really just educating our fellow constituents on what they are, what each type of them are. You're not necessarily probably against all data centers because they help you with your child portals from, uh, preschool to college. They help you. I had listed some other things, but we use, we all use data centers every day. And so we now have to really look at our footprint of what we're using. If we're looking at our carbon footprint, if we're looking at all of these other footprints, let's look at, do I really need to be using Facebook, Instagram, LinkedIn, X, email, Zoom, Teams. I mean, all of those things and your banking. I mean, when you pump gas, like everything goes through a data center, you couldn't actually get from your home of record to your child's school or to your place of employment without being significantly impacted without having data centers. So we're, we're helping bridge those conversations together. And then the most, I'm almost done. No, you're good. The most, um, controversial, which we can get to is AI data centers or those, those larger campuses, which we're looking at 500 megawatts to approximately one gigawatt, give or take, you can put different numbers on others. When, when you talk about some of those, [00:13:42] Speaker 2: those net benefits to the data centers, I don't think anybody listening, I'm not here to say like, oh, we should issue all technology and never turn anything. No, no, I'm not saying that at all. Um, but maybe can you unpack a little bit? What are some of the concerns that you're hearing frequently? Um, I have assumptions about what those are, but let's clarify a little bit. What are some of the challenges that local folks, constituents, uh, residents are maybe bringing up and AFCOM is [00:14:11] Speaker 1: helping kind of bridge that gap? On July 8th, we will be at HDR. So we at AFCOM have quarterly meetings. So we had our state of the union, uh, address at Hennepin technical college in April, now HDR. Um, we actually had one here at hunt back in November. So thank you for hosting. That was our first one. Um, each of these quarterly meetings, every single, you can come, you have to be civil and very respectful. But, um, for this upcoming one in July, we will be working on approximately six white papers that we will be handing out to anybody that is a part of it. We have about 400 members, give or take. Um, and it's for all of our communities. So the first one that we need to be working on is information about water. Um, not only water, but glycol, toxins, um, really understanding what a closed loop system is versus evaporative and saying it in a way that someone understands it, that doesn't do. Yeah. That's not involved. That's not involved. Yeah. Okay. So that's number one is, is our water and, and fair, right? I mean, that's, but then also, and it's not, uh, and I, I want us to be really cognitive on how we approach this because we can put comparisons out there, but at the same time, when you do, uh, do you know, it takes one gallon to manufacture an almond? So when you drink almond milk, do you know how much water goes into that? Your pair of jeans, you know how much water goes into jeans or your carwash? Do you have a, do you have a monthly carwash membership? Do you golf? Do you know how much golf courses? So when we start to get into the, yeah, but what about them? And then it kind of looks defensive. And so, you know, I'm wanting to kind of flip that narrative to a positive one, but at the same time, we have to really look at why is this immediate pushback happening all of a sudden when we've been here? And I think it's more towards the AI side of things than the actual data centers, but they're getting clumped into everything. So there's water, um, land use, um, how much land are you taking? Can we start to do some of these brownfield retrofit opportunities? Um, so we're looking at land. Uh, I myself am for sure wanting to look into, uh, landscape. So let's not, I mean, Minnesota is beautiful. So when you drive by, there's a lot of data centers. They have no idea that's a data center. Let's make sure that we are only adding to that environment and that we're not just saying like clunk, here's a giant, you know, maybe it works in other areas or, you know, um, trying to think of what else. Oh, power, power and energy is huge. So right now, you know, when we look at the grid, it's something that needs to be fixed. We, for anyone that doesn't know about how the interconnectivity of our entire country's power system is connected. I highly encourage the book tubes. Um, it's kind of a dry read, but it really explains kind of those NFL cities and how everything is connected in. So now we have to really look at how are we bringing in power, whether that's nuclear, we actually have a moratorium on our state with our sovereign nations. So that's something to consider, but it's very clean energy. Um, hydrogen, hydrogen could be absolutely huge for our state here, especially being Minnesotans. Um, fusion, of course, in the future would be absolutely epic. And so just starting to really understand how data centers are not only tapping into that grid, but of how they're providing more power back onto the grid. Because a lot of people are like, my, my electricity bill is going to go up and it's like, okay, fair, maybe, maybe one or two shady players down the road did that and they dispense that cost out. Not anymore. Nope. Mama bear is here and we're all here and we're all saying, nope, not in my backyard. So it's really cool now to see of what the data centers are bringing and they're generating those wind and that solar and the geronimo is another project. Um, they're generating it back onto the grid. And so they're not only being good stewards, [00:19:10] Speaker 2: they're, they're contributing back. And in the, in that case, you're saying that they're providing funding to add power to the grid rather than just consuming it. Correct. So like they'll pay for some portion of, or development of wind farms, solar farms, things like that. Absolutely. Cool. I just [00:19:24] Speaker 3: want to make sure I understood it. And I think the great thing that AFCON does in that and what you explained is right. Like you take the side of, if you're going to build that here, okay, we can, we can help you navigate that. But there's some things that some rules or some, some, some mindsets here that, that these things need to be a part of it. We understand your need. We have, there's people's needs. We're kind of in the middle here of, we're going to make sure both you kind of have those needs met. Um, but at the end of the day, we're not deteriorating what the state really is. Yeah. Minnesota does a fantastic job of that. Some other states do as well. Other states, [00:20:09] Speaker 1: maybe not so much yet. Right. I mean, we, we made a pack to be, um, clean by 2030. They just pushed that to 2040. So when you keep kicking that can and like, who's actually going to get us there. And I believe that the data center industry is going to be the ones, they are the ones that have the money and we can follow that money and we can follow that trail. And that goes into another of the white paper is community development. So we're going to give the communities, like I'm going to our local city council meeting. What questions don't I know? What should I be asking? And that, that one pager is your schools, your, your roads, your, I mean, the list goes on and on. You'll have to go to AFCOM website to, uh, to look that up. Link that then. But, um, so with that, uh, it's, I lost my train of thought honestly, but it's, we're, we're making those white papers that everyone is saying, and that's what we're here for. And it's SMEs sitting at that table with the people that are concerned about it as well. And I think to have that lived experience from everyone around the table is extremely important to truly have this collective impact make a difference. [00:21:37] Speaker 2: One of the other things that, um, I, and I'm not trying to like, Oh, well, there's actually 17 more problems for you to deal with. Um, but one of the challenges I've heard is, you know, there's this, this toll that it takes constructing. And I'm thinking of the big girls, you know, large scale data centers and frankly, um, large scale, any project, whether it's a hospital or anything else, um, that we have tons of craft workers that come in, do the work and then disappear. And so disappear. We don't need a thousand people on site to operate a data center, even if we needed a thousand people on site every day to construct one of those things. And I'm going to even say it's got beautiful landscaping and it's appealing from the road. It looks nice. Um, but then, um, one of the things that, uh, you talked about in your grid over resume was we're going to train people. We're going to help empower communities to actually bring more folks and more jobs to operate the data center when it's, when it's actually up and running. So maybe this is a decent segue to talk about one of the solutions for that challenge happens to be let's train folks locally who want to work in those environments and, [00:22:49] Speaker 1: and bring up some skills. Yeah. Can I scale up? Can we go to the very beginning and talk about construction and the trades here in Minnesota to bringing the, the big girls here and why, um, specifically workforce development. So when, when a state puts a moratorium or a memorandum or whatever it is that they, they block not in data, they're going to go somewhere else and it's going to continue to build. And so we need to be good stewards of our fellow neighbors as well that, you know, it's like, well, but they're just going to go over there. Well, that all of our people then have to go there. So I really challenge Minnesotans to really look at how we can cohesively sit at the table so that we get those projects because the economic development impact in bringing them here is night and day. So with those jobs to be able to bring our electricians, our plumbers, our carpenters, our, the whole gang, the whole gang, please. Can you bring my, my husband back at home? Like, I don't want them traveling anymore, says the partner, the wife, the husband. And when we're able to bring those, those jobs back home, everybody's happier, everybody. So we're talking about a holistic, total force fitness kind of way of life, mind, body, soul. And correction me if I'm wrong, you can do a stat here maybe, but multifamily housing is down like 90% or something. It's not what it once was. It's not what it once was. So now all of those people that were, were pulling the fiber and doing all the jobs now are working in Texas. Now they're working in other states and they're getting paid actually like twice or three times the amount union included. Shout out to IBEW. Yes. Um, by the way, how did that go? [00:25:09] Speaker 3: Really well. Yeah. Yeah. Really well. Okay. Awesome opportunity. Awesome. [00:25:13] Speaker 2: I have no idea what they're talking about. We'll tell you about it. Top secret. Top secret. So you're saying like the multifamily work went elsewhere. And so the workers went elsewhere. [00:25:24] Speaker 1: Well, the, the, the work dropped off. So now what are we building here? Yep. What are we building in Minnesota right now? I mean, sure. We can, we can build as many hospitals as we want. I mean, I, myself, I'm on the Ridgeview foundation board out in Carver County. It's super important to have our, our hospitals and our clinics at that local level to provide to our families in a time of need. That's great. What else? Like we need some more revenue generation [00:25:53] Speaker 3: of being able to have constructability. When there are right. You close to 5,000, probably IBEW members, uh, just in St. Paul, Minnesota or in Minneapolis. Yes. There are other jobs that they can go to, but for all 5,000 to go to those larger data centers and all data centers really provide additional opportunities for work locally. They also, when they're being constructed, where they're being constructed, if it is a smaller town, um, or let's call it off the metropolitan area, think about the people that live there, right? They're getting an apartment, they're getting, um, hotels in that area or near that area. And when they go to eat dinner, when they go to do all their stuff in the city, that is helping that community as well. Right? If, if there's, there's foot traffic through that community. Now, granted, yeah, it might be just two to three years, but two to three years of thousands of people is, I think a lot better than a hundred people once, one time a year or something like that. So it's just opportunity for everybody in that sense. And this goes down the workforce [00:27:02] Speaker 1: path then, um, is we're so done. You have people that are here working here. Uh, and I, I think that there could be a couple of people. We could go back to it. There's pros and cons to 2,000 people coming into town. Happy to have that conversation and how to, um, have that checklist on AFCOM of what you can ask for. You can actually ask for a car wash, um, before any vehicle leaves the job site. I've seen some roads in other parts of the country. If the data center is in my backyard, there's going to be that. And it's a closed loop system that then they use that water to spray down the dust. I mean, there's solutions for everything. So, um, the, the other part of it is that we have a huge manufacturing footprint here in Minnesota. And so being able to take the carbon footprint of these jobs and to say that we're building them here locally with our local manufacturers is huge. And we're not only building just data centers, we're building substations, we're building systems, we're building, we're increasing full, full communities. Uh, I don't know. Creating new roads, [00:28:17] Speaker 3: new roads. Like everybody is affected by these, whether it's on that job or not the surrounding area. There's, there's other parts of that that need to be updated. Um, infrastructure as a whole, not just for that data center, but for the surrounding area. Yeah. I mean, Forgent out in Dayton, [00:28:34] Speaker 1: just, uh, had an MNA, they were, um, um, um, states manufacturing. They now have four companies, Forgent everything from the substation to the rack. So that's huge. It's huge for, for our states to have that here at a local level. I mean, we have multiple generator companies. We have companies all over the state of Minnesota that is increasing this production. So we're working our way down now. Now, and now all of a sudden you kind of start to wean, wean those numbers down. Um, yes and no. So for the big girls, they start retrofitting with in six months. And so it's a continuously, um, revolving door of an, if it was in my backyard, I would say, I want mom and pop. I would want my local, you know, electrical contractor to have that contract. I would want, um, a certain percentage of indigenous groups to have those contracts so that that work stays local here and that they don't have to can, you know, go back out. So you can put that into all that documentation. And actually, I believe that the PUC is making the, a requirement already. What is a PUC? Public Utilities Commission. Thank you. Yeah. Sorry. [00:29:58] Speaker 2: You guys have acronyms that you know, and sometimes I just don't. Yeah. So when you talk about that, you know, we have lots of workers coming in to build a building. Um, there's an influx of people, but also cash in local businesses, infrastructure, you know, things happen. And, uh, we even talked about how some of those data center groups are investing and growing that electrical grid. Um, and then the building's done, you know, it's, it's quote unquote complete lights are on. And then you said, we're, we're revamping things about every six months. And so there's this opportunity there for contracts to be let for maintenance and service and ongoing things there at the data center. Um, and I think what you're advocating there is that the contractors that serve that, that data center in that community should look like their community. Yeah. They should be members of it. And so what are we doing to upskill those folks and make sure that we can draw from that, that local pool of talent and actually operate some of those data centers? [00:31:00] Speaker 1: Well, I know that the IBEW is working really hard right now to make sure that they're getting in new apprentice, apprentices into their programs. Um, AFCOM has helped build a data center simulator at Hennepin Technical College in Brooklyn Park. Uh, I myself go there and help them with their resume writing and describe all the different jobs within the data center industry that they can go into. And that's another thing they need. Finance. They, they still need people to do their books. They need security people. They need landscapers. They need like anything else. So, um, those are two of those. I know, uh, Dakota community college right now is partnering with the project right now in Rosemount. Uh, and then for the Gore group, we're really looking at those transferable skill sets and you have to have something. And if you don't, then you need to put that grid in and go out and get that. Um, you know, my story is interesting. I'm community college dropout, then hairstylist, stay at home mom, philosopher, event production, department of defense, blockchain, data centers, workforce development. The common theme in that is that, um, I have ADD and I didn't realize it until my forties and so I just couldn't figure it all out. Um, but is that I love people and I love helping people and I love connecting people. And that's my, that's my superpower. And so when I looked at the data center industry and I had to reinvent myself yet again, because the government contract got dropped. [00:32:44] Speaker 2: Sometimes life happens to you. You got to get up and do something about it. [00:32:48] Speaker 1: And no one else is going to do it for you. Not that I've ever seen. [00:32:51] Speaker 3: You got to have some grit. You got to have some grit. You got to have some grit. So [00:32:56] Speaker 1: I, uh, I, I realized that I could go in and, and start to work on, um, recruiting and development. And I learned a lot and I decided to start the Gore group because I was at the tables with the employers who wanted the five year data center minimum person and up to the, what we would call the unicorn, which would be that 10 to 15 years experience. Mechanical electrical plumbing, everything from green fields, building substations, all the way to now retrofitting a brownfield, you name it. [00:33:43] Speaker 2: Right. It just happens to be available for work. There's about 10 of them in the state. [00:33:48] Speaker 1: So that was my job. I was an, uh, an assassin. I would go out and I would find them and we would [00:33:53] Speaker 2: bring them to sometimes we call that recruiter or headhunter. I don't know. Assassin. Yeah. Well, [00:33:59] Speaker 1: I wasn't actually a recruiter. Um, but it was my job to build those teams and make, I mean, whether it was safety, QA, QC, construction manager, it doesn't matter. Uh, they don't exist. They're tapped out and you know what? They need to go back home. They're done because they've been working way too much and the silver tsunami is now coming and they're, you know, they're cashing in [00:34:31] Speaker 2: their bennies and they're out. The silver tsunami, meaning we're going to see a wave of retirements. [00:34:36] Speaker 1: Correct. Okay. Yes. The, the well-seasoned are tired and it's time for a tropical shirt vacation [00:34:44] Speaker 2: type of a life now. Or younger gentlemen with amazing hair who still have lots of productivity [00:34:50] Speaker 3: left in them. Correct. With that, uh, lots of productivity. I don't know. [00:34:56] Speaker 2: Everything didn't sound that bad. When, when we're going to have people leaving the industry and, or they're tired and, or they're already employed somewhere else, we've got to do something [00:35:04] Speaker 1: different. We got to grow them. And that's why I started the core group. So, um, you know, I'm just going to say it. I'm going through perimenopause. I'm ripping those band-aids off and I'm saying, and you're going to be just fine. You are. Yep. All right. Knock it off. So let's sit down. Let's talk about what you're looking for. Let's have a real conversation. Let's have real conversations about salaries. Cause these salaries are out of control right now and it's bubbled. It's bubbling. It's just, it's crazy. So let's really look at what are the skills that you're looking for, that we can get them from point A to point B. What is your training program? If you don't have one, let's build it. Maybe there's someone else that's have it. We don't need to reinvent the wheel. [00:35:49] Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. Borrow good ideas and develop them further. I mean, welcome to the department of [00:35:54] Speaker 1: defense, right? Or department of war now. Sorry. But, um, so it's, it, it was, it's just that Midwest mom conversation. That's like, oh, uh-huh. Uh-huh. You're kind of a little passive aggressive, like have fun with that. Good luck with that. That's not going to happen anymore. So it's really fun to sit at those conversations and, um, our clients, um, absolutely love them. Great people. They all have grit. They've all pulled themselves up from their bootstraps. They've all started driving as a delivery van driver or that grunt that was doing the layout work at the very beginning and the first one there and the last one there. And we are building the next generation through entry level roles. Sure. Do I got some unicorns up our sleeves? Absolutely. We'll pull some around, but it's only because that's what's working best for them. We're not poaching. We have an anti-poaching rule at the Gore group. Do not do that. Uh, and so we're looking at, um, actually, I just spoke with a gentleman this week who has two felonies, um, changed his life, but, uh, I can't put him on job a, B or C, but I can put him on these jobs over here. And he is taking his journeyman license test next week. So he's been an electrician apprentice for four and a half years. And maybe you can't do it because you have government contracts in a company. That's fine. But over here you can. So we're, we're looking at, um, really increasing females in the industry. So that's why initially I said, thank you for that. We're really trying to make sure that we're not using words like guys, he, him, I need a guy that's like this huge challenge. I think this is where I looked at them at the thing, um, call to action. If you're using the words, he, him, or guys, please start to be inclusive because words do matter. And we want females to start really seeing themselves in this industry along with anybody and everybody, um, to include age as well. So you're young, but you're not that young. Love ya. So we're looking at these, you know, 17, 18 year olds that want to start to get in. They need this all the way to, um, one of my newest hires at the Gore group is 70 years old. And she was the top pampered chef woman in the state of Texas to me as a former [00:38:30] Speaker 3: Tupperware latchkey kid. Yeah. That has got some, you know, right? Unicorn. There you go. So she didn't [00:38:39] Speaker 1: know anything about it, but she came from oil and gas and she's picking it up. I mean, she's, she's doing it, but she's also, I mean, full transparency. Um, her husband has cancer and if he passes away, she no longer has an income. And so think about that. There's a lot of people out there that, that don't have income coming in within that well-season age. So I'm all over the place here, but I'm just saying if you have transferable skills, if you're coming from oil or gas, if you're coming from an electric background, if you're coming with nothing, then what are you going to do about it? What are you going to go to Hennepin tech? Are you going to go into the union? Are you going to take a certification? Are you going to learn everything about data centers from jumpers to generators? You call me and I'm going to be like, okay, let's go. [00:39:32] Speaker 2: So as a point of clarity there, your group can help provide and share some resources about how to make some of those steps so that if I'm ready and it's like weird and totally unplanned. Like the last episode we recorded, we talked about career transitions that at 30, 35, 40, like in no way is that too late to get out of something you don't like or to go chase something you've been thinking about and dreaming about. So like this feels like a great opportunity for folks who are considering transitions, who are looking for an industry that's growing, still needs really good motivated people. And you maybe got some resources for them. [00:40:08] Speaker 1: 100%. I mean, I found it through blockchain. I lost a contract. We were dedicating the Minnesota Medal of Honor Memorial that day. Lost my job. Terrible. Went from thriving to surviving overnight. Grandma died in my arms the next day. Talk about a bad week waking up and saying, who am I and what do I want to do? I love transparency. I think transparency is super important. So discovered blockchain. If you don't know about it, you should look into it. Let's just take crypto off of it immediately. Let's look at what it can do for agriculture and et cetera, et cetera. So find what you're passionate about and then just keep going. At the Gore Group, if you come on to our website, then you can go to the iMasons portal. We are partners over with iMasons Armed Forces. So everyone that works over at the Gore Group is military connected. And so we do a huge push for anyone that is currently serving in the Guard or the Reserve, veterans, those that are transitioning out, military spouses, of course, and whoever. So in that iMasons Armed Forces portal, and actually anyone can go on to that. You can put in your resume, you can put in your MOS, and it will spit out kind of what a resume for you, what you're good at. [00:41:38] Speaker 2: That's one great place to start. So it'll help highlight skills and things that you very likely have already based on what your job previously was. Yeah, are you good at program management, [00:41:48] Speaker 1: are you good at like it has all of these kind of tasks that we'll check off. And then us as the employers on the back end, and you can go out, I mean, I don't want to name all of them because there's a lot of huge national global data center providers. They then say we see what skill sets you have. [00:42:10] Speaker 3: Very cool. Yeah. And I'm going to ask this. I hope I don't screw myself over on it. How would somebody find the goregroup? Is it just goregroup.com? And I'm referring to a previous episode. That's an inside [00:42:24] Speaker 1: joke. So how would they find it? It is www.gritoverresume.com. Okay. We are also on all of the socials. So have our newest summer intern and she is going for international business. I'm going to do it. Shout out to my home girl, to Lula Kovaleski. She is working from the very bottom up. Nepotism is real, but at the same time, she's got to start washing dishes in the kitchen. So she's starting it and she's really putting it out there for the younger generation. I don't understand any of that. So her videos are awesome and her content is amazing because she's like, no one's going to follow you. No one cares about the data. And so I'm learning a lot through this next gen. As is she, she can't put on headphones when she's working next to the CEO and learning through osmosis. She can't come up at nine o'clock and start work when she's supposed to start at eight. So we've got some good back and forth, but thank you for that. So you can go there. We're very active on LinkedIn. And then if you're in Minnesota, come to an AFCOM meeting. I highly recommend it. And let's get a little more specific [00:43:44] Speaker 2: on that. You mentioned it earlier that there's a meeting date at HDR. And what was the date of that meeting again? July 8th from two to four. Here's hoping this episode comes out before that or it'll be a little less impactful. But even if it doesn't, folks will be aware that they quarterly, you said, you all are hosting that. Anybody can come so long as they've got a little respect and some questions [00:44:09] Speaker 1: and an opportunity to learn something. Yeah. We also have a first Wednesday of every month. We have the data center walk and talks. They are awesome. So we, if it's wintertime, we are mall walkers generally or turf like those indoor turf. So yeah, we get out and we walk for an hour and I, you gotta have, everyone's like, Oh gosh, I'm actually like first firing here. So we do those. So we do a golf [00:44:39] Speaker 2: tournament. Which is like just a very informal walk and talk discussion. Talk about stuff. Talk about the data center industry. Yeah. Right on. And, um, I don't mean it to be a trick question. Are those also open to anyone? And I can come ask you a couple of questions and hopefully hear a thoughtful response. Anyone. All right. All right. Yes. Would welcome them. So, um, I don't want to keep you all day. And we've talked about a range of different things here on, you know, data center constructability, some, you know, community concerns as well as some, um, connections there to the industry. And I'm going to say almost like a mediator between the parties and AFCOM. And we've talked about opportunities for how do you get out there and get that job? If you aren't the unicorn, how can you help develop some skill sets and make some connections? Is there anything else that you [00:45:27] Speaker 1: want to leave folks with, uh, before we get out of here for today? One, because I had one piece of homework and it was a call to action for a takeaway that you can tangibly do. So I feel like I was maybe a little bit vague on those things that you can do and what is a resource that I can actually do. Like if I did this, this could show that I've got grit. So, um, and I've been working really did diligently with the team leading up to this. So this week we just announced the, um, launch of our final pillar at the Gore group. So we do direct hire staffing, training and development, and we launched the training pillar. And this is something that I will be humbly honest about here. I have failed epically over the last year, trying to put meaningful training together that can go out to a large group of people. Training is very hard. Um, you know, one-on-one training specifically with companies is a lot easier, but how do you quantify to do something like this? Yeah. Like, how do you scale that? Yeah. Totally different challenge. Oh, it was, it was brutal. So, uh, yeah, it wasn't, it wasn't, [00:46:48] Speaker 2: I laugh, not at you, but like, oh, I understand that. Yeah. Heck of a challenge. Lost a client on it for sure. So, um, [00:46:56] Speaker 1: um, but I was, I called him up and was just like that, that didn't work. Um, so look, you know, looking at what's out there and what's the best and not wanting to reinvent the wheel, the, um, nonprofit organization called Mission Critical Global Alliance had worked with the Department of Labor and all of the SMEs in the industry to write a certificate for data center operators, data center technician operators. For those that don't know what an operator is, they actually are the ones that are running those data centers at entry level to a chief engineer. And so when we're talking about those jobs, when everybody goes away, those are the jobs that exist in the communities and those are six figure jobs. So they're very well paying jobs as well. And so we wanted to really hone in on that and you can go to Nova Community College, so Northern Virginia, um, Cleveland Community College, a couple other smaller ones, but you had to go [00:48:04] Speaker 2: in person to those colleges. That's a heck of a commute here from the Twin Cities, right? And, um, a lot of them you have to get a two year degree. [00:48:13] Speaker 1: Yeah, some people don't have that. Some people don't have a car. So how do we increase that access in areas that are remote, that, you know, people work, live and recreate. So I'm proud, very proud to say that we are now authorized at the core group. Um, we have five trainers that we can now train and certify the CMCO, the Certified Mission Critical Operators certificates, the Department of Labor approved virtually or anywhere in person at our clients locations. In addition to that, that's one thing is to say, I have a certificate. Great. Now we need a little bit more, right? Like I'm, I'm, I'm full, full, like KPI here. Um, we partnered with a company called Steadfast Operations and our partners over there came from the big girls. They know what they're doing for sure. They're very, they're, they're SMEs. Uh, they have 27 point assessments that they go in and they look through the whole data center of what they're doing. They have training for the entire thing for on the job training. And so together, now we can work with our clients locally at the level, hire locally, train them virtually, bring them on the job and ensure that it's scalable. It's safe. Um, where's your spotter, Ben, right? We want to make sure that Ben, who is maybe using a ladder in a questionable. No, it always wasn't. Um, and so it's, it's scalable and it's safe and it's reliable and it hit the, the mark all the way through to get that, you know, a hundred thousand dollar job at within your community. So you can now get the CMCO virtually through the Gore group. Awesome. Well, congratulations [00:50:20] Speaker 3: to that. I mean, that's, that's big. I think it's, it's one of those that it's like, what's the right avenue for me? I know I want to be in this industry. I just don't know what the right avenue is. As you continue to build out the Gore group and with those other avenues, more and more people can get into the [00:50:37] Speaker 2: industry and jobs are continually being created by it. So yeah. Yeah. Deeply like, and I mean it very genuinely, like I deeply appreciate the like way you're connecting people and opportunity. I know that's something we talk about on the podcast pretty regularly. You have to ask it this time. No, no, not naturally at all. And you know, when I hear a story about somebody who, you know, made mistakes, they're a felon, um, things happen and you got to get back up and you got to do something. And I appreciate, you know, connecting that person with more opportunity and people who are in remote areas who can't commute to, you know, Northern North Virginia for a community college course. Um, that, that idea that we're going to meet our community where they are, we're going to get them connected to the things and opportunities about jobs locally. Um, and in this market of mission critical development and data centers, love it or hate it, um, we got to have jobs there. And I appreciate that. So thanks for coming on and talking about it and clarifying some of that stuff. Um, I don't know how, uh, your membership or attendance is going to swell for your next few, uh, you know, walk and talks or, uh, AFCOM meetings, but we got it out there. Thank you. [00:51:45] Speaker 1: - Thank you, I appreciate you very much. Thank you. [00:51:48] Speaker 2: - Awesome.