Meet the Press Full Episode — May 24

[0:00] This Sunday, dealing with Iran. [0:03] President Trump says a deal with Iran has been largely negotiated, [0:07] with final terms still being worked out. [0:10] Is the war over plus primary payback? [0:15] President Trump tightens his grip on the Republican Party [0:18] as his critics inside Congress are pushed out of the race [0:22] and punished for breaking ranks. [0:24] There is a yearning in this country [0:26] for somebody who will vote for principles over party. [0:29] We knocked out Massey. [0:32] What does it mean for the future of the party [0:34] and the midterm fight ahead? [0:36] I'll talk exclusively to Republican Congressman Thomas Massey of Kentucky [0:41] and funding backlash, [0:44] a growing revolt on Capitol Hill over President Trump's spending priorities, [0:49] including a White House ballroom [0:50] and a $1.8 billion so-called weaponization fund. [0:55] This is corruption that has never been more blatant. [0:58] I mean, this is just stupid on stilts. [1:00] I'll talk to Democratic Congressman Ro Khanna of California [1:03] and Gender Gap, [1:06] our meet-the-moment conversation with Reshma Sujani, [1:09] the founder of Girls Who Code [1:11] and CEO of Moms First [1:13] on the fight to empower women and girls. [1:17] American motherhood is broken by design. [1:20] It's a feature, not a bug. [1:21] Joining me for insight and analysis are [1:24] NBC News Chief Foreign Affairs Correspondent Andrea Mitchell, [1:28] Amy Walter, Editor-in-Chief of the Cook Political Report, [1:32] former Homeland Security Secretary Jay Johnson, [1:35] and Mark Short, [1:37] former Director of Legislative Affairs for President Trump. [1:40] Welcome to Sunday. [1:42] It's Meet the Press. [1:43] From NBC News in Washington, [1:47] the longest-running show in television history, [1:49] this is Meet the Press with Kristen Welker. [1:54] Good Sunday morning. [1:56] President Trump is facing a number of pressure points this morning on the world stage [2:01] and at home, [2:02] including trying to find a way to end the conflict with Iran. [2:06] As his Director of National Intelligence, Tulsi Gabbard, resigned Friday, [2:10] the fourth Cabinet Secretary to leave her post in less than three months. [2:14] Meanwhile, on Capitol Hill, [2:16] fallout is growing over the president's so-called anti-weaponization fund, [2:21] with Republicans canceling votes on DHS funding and leaving Washington early. [2:27] The controversial plan, launched through the Justice Department, [2:31] would open nearly $1.8 billion in taxpayer money to claims of government weaponization, [2:37] including from some January 6th defendants who were pardoned by the president. [2:42] Under what circumstances would it ever make sense to provide restitution [2:47] for people who were either pled guilty or were found guilty in a court of law? [2:51] These people don't deserve restitution. [2:53] Many of them deserve to be in prison. [2:55] I think that there are and will continue to be a lot of questions around that [3:01] that the administration is going to have to answer. [3:04] I got to tell you, the Republican senators were pissed. [3:07] People were, the entire meeting, they were screaming at the acting attorney general. [3:13] And he was trying to lay out the legal basis. [3:15] The president reacting to senators who pushed back on his plans. [3:21] But are you losing control of the Senate, sir? [3:24] Are you losing control of the Senate, the Senate Republicans? [3:27] I don't know. I really don't know. [3:29] The tensions on Capitol Hill building among Senate Republicans [3:33] after the president's decision to endorse Texas Attorney General Ken Paxton [3:38] over longtime Senator John Cornyn in the Republican Senate runoff in Texas. [3:43] Still, Mr. Trump feels emboldened politically, [3:46] tightening his grip on the party and celebrating the downfall of one of his Republican targets, [3:52] Congressman Thomas Massey, [3:54] who he saw as disloyal for breaking ranks over the Epstein files. [3:58] Massey lost his primary race to a Trump-backed opponent Tuesday night. [4:02] The president taking a victory lap on Friday. [4:06] Well, I had a good night the other night, right? [4:08] We knocked out a bad senator from Louisiana. [4:12] We knocked out Massey, a horrible, one of the worst Republican congressmen ever. [4:20] We knocked out somebody in Georgia, Rathensperger. [4:25] We knocked him out. We knocked out everybody. [4:27] And joining me now is Republican Congressman Thomas Massey of Kentucky. [4:33] Congressman Massey, welcome back to Meet the Press. [4:37] Thanks, Kristen. [4:38] Thank you so much for being here. [4:40] I do want to get to your race in just a moment. [4:43] But I have to start with that developing news on Iran. [4:47] President Trump posting on Saturday that an agreement with Iran has, quote, [4:52] largely been negotiated. [4:54] It's unclear what exactly has been agreed to, [4:58] whether any deal would directly address the issue of the nuclear program, [5:03] which, of course, is at the center of the war with Iran. [5:06] So far, no final deal has been announced. [5:09] But, Congressman, would you support a short-term deal with Iran? [5:13] Well, I was the author of the first war powers resolution to get us out of Iran. [5:20] My constituents are hurting. [5:22] Gas is almost $5 a gallon. [5:25] Diesel is almost $6 a gallon. [5:26] And the farmers here in Kentucky can't afford the fertilizer to put on their field. [5:31] So, heck, yes, I would support it. [5:33] We don't know what the terms of it are. [5:35] But if Lindsey Graham and Ted Cruz are crashing out last night, [5:38] I'd say it's probably a pretty good deal. [5:40] All right. [5:41] Well, let's turn to the big news, the reason why you're here. [5:45] You did lose your bid for re-election this past Tuesday after serving seven terms in Congress. [5:53] Why do you think you lost this race, Congressman? [5:58] Well, listen, since the day I got to Washington, D.C., [6:01] I've been doing this job like I thought people wanted you to do it. [6:05] I read the bills. [6:06] I didn't give my voting card to the speaker. [6:08] I've never given it to a president. [6:10] I don't even give my voting card to the Freedom Caucus. [6:13] I vote for people over party. [6:16] And, you know, that means 10% of the time I vote against the party. [6:19] I've exposed a lot of things in Washington, D.C., the cronyism. [6:24] I would say, you know, and also bankrupting our country, [6:28] whether it's Republicans or Democrats, [6:30] I point out how they're bankrupting our country [6:32] and how these are all fake fights. [6:34] They love to divide us. [6:36] I think the biggest crime I committed against the swamp, Kristen, [6:40] was showing the American people that somebody on the right [6:43] could join somebody on the left and get something done, [6:47] which is releasing the Epstein files [6:49] that everybody knew needed to be done. [6:51] That's probably the only bill that's passed Washington, D.C. [6:54] in the last 10 years that lobbyists haven't written. [6:58] It was written by me and Ro Khanna, [7:00] and we used the pressure of the American people [7:02] to cross the aisle and get things done. [7:05] That's when they decided I had to be taken out, [7:08] that I was becoming effective. [7:10] So they wanted to eliminate me. [7:12] And, by the way, they couldn't buy my vote in 14 years, [7:15] so they bought this seat. [7:16] This was the most expensive race [7:18] in congressional primary history. [7:20] And at the end of this race, [7:22] we were spending more per day, [7:24] my side and the opposing side, [7:26] we were spending more per day [7:28] than most entire congressional races [7:30] are spent for the entire cycle. [7:32] Wow, it's just extraordinary to put it into that context. [7:36] You reference the Epstein files, [7:38] the fact that you and Congressman Khanna, [7:40] who I'll be speaking to next, [7:42] pushed to have those files released. [7:44] You also broke with President Trump [7:46] on other key issues, [7:47] voting against the so-called big, beautiful bill. [7:50] You're opposed to the Iran war, [7:52] as you just stated. [7:53] Congressman Massey, was it all worth it? [7:58] It was absolutely worth it for me. [8:01] Now, I don't think it's going to be worth it for the party. [8:04] Look, the left, [8:05] some people on the left have Trump derangement syndrome. [8:08] They call it TDS. [8:09] But there's a growing number of people on the right [8:11] who have a form of TDS called Trump disappointment syndrome. [8:15] And I think what's going to happen to the party this fall [8:18] is they've disenfranchised a large portion [8:21] of that constituency that Trump assembled [8:24] to get us in the White House, [8:26] in the Senate majority, [8:28] and in the House majority. [8:29] They've alienated Maha by kowtowing [8:32] to the pesticide manufacturers [8:34] and the pharmaceutical manufacturers. [8:36] They've alienated the fiscal hawks [8:38] by running Doge out of town. [8:40] They've alienated the people [8:41] who don't want to fight another war [8:43] for other countries. [8:45] And so I'm worried that in November, [8:47] this is going to cost the party a lot. [8:49] But for me, it was completely worth it. [8:51] And I've got seven more months [8:53] to keep going against the grain, [8:55] which means voting for principals [8:57] and for people over party. [8:59] Let me ask you, big picture, [9:01] because you have said that you vote with Republicans [9:03] more than 90% of the time. [9:05] You split when you think [9:07] it better serves your constituents. [9:09] One of your constituents [9:10] told a local reporter this, [9:12] quote, [9:12] I just got to the point [9:14] where I couldn't support him anymore. [9:16] I saw Massey as almost [9:18] what they would popularly call a rhino, [9:21] Republican in name only. [9:23] What do you say to that voter [9:25] and others of your constituents [9:27] who might agree with him? [9:28] Well, they spent at least 20 million, [9:34] maybe 25 million against me. [9:36] And what they did is they expanded [9:37] the pool of voters. [9:39] And there were a lot of misinformed, [9:41] uninformed voters. [9:42] In fact, my daughter who lives outside [9:45] of my congressional district, [9:46] she heard somebody in the voting booth [9:48] next to her trying to find my opponent's name [9:50] on the ballot because he didn't even know [9:52] I wasn't his congressman. [9:54] That's how much they've bamboozled [9:56] the people here in Kentucky. [9:58] They used artificial intelligence [10:00] to create a video, [10:01] lifelike video that showed me [10:03] checking into a hotel room [10:05] with AOC and Ilhan Omar [10:07] and holding hands with them. [10:09] It was actually very effective [10:10] on the boomers. [10:12] But here's the thing, Kristen, [10:14] that's only going to work [10:15] for a little bit longer. [10:16] The boomers are going to, you know, [10:18] leave this country to the Gen X [10:20] and the Gen Z and the Gen Y [10:22] and the millennials. [10:23] And those folks are the ones [10:24] that I won overwhelmingly. [10:26] That makes me really hopeful [10:27] for this country. [10:28] They don't get fooled by artificial intelligence [10:31] and they check the news. [10:32] They get news sources [10:33] like from podcasts and other sources. [10:36] So they won this race [10:38] by fooling my voters [10:40] and expanding the base of people [10:42] who vote to the uninformed voters. [10:44] But look, I got 45% of the vote [10:46] in spite of this tremendous headwind. [10:49] That means 45% of the party [10:51] still believe in the ideals [10:52] that I believe in [10:53] and have espoused in Washington, D.C. [10:56] Let me ask you about something [10:58] that you said in your speech [11:00] on Tuesday night. [11:01] You said, quote, [11:02] if the legislative branch [11:04] always votes with the president, [11:06] we do have a king. [11:08] Do you believe there is still room [11:11] in the Republican Party [11:12] for Republicans [11:13] who vote independently? [11:17] You know what? [11:18] Even the Freedom Caucus [11:19] has caved at this point. [11:21] They used to, [11:22] basically the Freedom Caucus [11:23] was formed [11:24] so that 30 or 40 Republicans [11:26] would have safety in numbers. [11:27] They have no safety in numbers now. [11:30] The principal ones [11:31] are running for statewide office. [11:33] They're getting out of Congress. [11:34] I think there is room, though. [11:37] You just got to go up there [11:39] and vote your conscience. [11:40] And you know what? [11:41] I've inspired a whole generation [11:42] of state representatives [11:44] and city councilmen [11:45] who are running for office. [11:47] They send me direct messages. [11:49] They send me emails. [11:50] They've been inspired. [11:51] I do believe there's room [11:52] in the party. [11:53] Maybe not in Washington right now, [11:56] but the next wave that's coming up, [11:58] they're going to vote [11:59] for people over parties. [12:01] Well, I want to ask you [12:02] about some of the issues now, [12:03] Congressman. [12:04] As you know, this week, [12:05] we did see Republicans [12:06] in Congress actually reject [12:08] some of President Trump's priorities, [12:10] refusing to vote. [12:11] on funding for both his ballroom [12:13] and that $1.8 billion [12:15] so-called anti-weaponization fund. [12:17] Some of the strongest opposition, [12:19] quite frankly, [12:20] that we have seen [12:21] from members of Congress, [12:22] Republicans to President Trump to date. [12:25] Do you think that the party [12:26] is beginning to break [12:28] with President Trump? [12:32] Well, listen, [12:32] they're worried about [12:33] their own political mortality. [12:35] It's true. [12:35] You can take out Republicans [12:36] in primaries, [12:37] but Republicans are going to be [12:39] very vulnerable this fall. [12:41] The ballroom, [12:42] I mean, [12:42] that is such an egregious [12:45] waste of money. [12:46] We were told [12:46] that it would be funded [12:47] with private money initially. [12:50] I'd like to joke [12:51] that Miriam Adelson [12:52] spent so much money [12:53] in my race, [12:54] they have to ask [12:55] for taxpayer money [12:56] for the ballroom now. [12:57] And it's, [12:59] I think it's a slap [13:00] in the face of Americans. [13:01] The president was bragging [13:02] on the Roman architecture [13:04] when, in fact, [13:05] we're operating [13:06] like a Roman empire. [13:07] We're overextended overseas [13:09] with our foreign aid, [13:11] with our foreign bases. [13:12] We're spending money [13:13] that we don't have. [13:15] And the gasoline [13:16] and rent and groceries [13:18] are so high [13:18] that people can't afford it. [13:20] I do think it's dangerous [13:21] to indulge in these things [13:23] like a gold-plated ballroom [13:25] in Washington, D.C., [13:27] while Americans are suffering. [13:28] Let me ask you [13:29] a little bit more deeply [13:30] about the anti-weaponization fund. [13:33] The president is asking [13:34] for $1.8 billion [13:35] to support people [13:37] who he says [13:38] have been unfairly treated [13:39] under the previous administration. [13:42] This would include [13:43] January 6th rioters. [13:44] Congressman, [13:45] do you support taxpayer dollars [13:47] going to those [13:48] who attacked police [13:50] at the Capitol [13:50] and attacked the Capitol [13:52] on January 6th? [13:55] Well, if you're going [13:55] to create a fund, [13:56] it has to be voted on [13:57] by Congress. [13:58] The president can't do this [14:00] by executive authority. [14:01] Our founders would say, [14:03] no, you can't do that. [14:05] Listen, though, [14:06] people have been harmed [14:07] on the left and the right. [14:09] Their First Amendment, [14:10] Second Amendment, [14:10] Fourth Amendment, [14:11] Fifth Amendment rights [14:12] have been violated. [14:13] And I do think [14:14] that they should have [14:15] some recourse. [14:16] But the solution [14:16] isn't to hand out money. [14:18] Would you rule out [14:19] giving money [14:19] to those who attacked [14:21] or assaulted police officers? [14:25] The solution isn't [14:26] to hand out money. [14:27] The solution is [14:28] to change the laws [14:29] of this country [14:29] where if you have been harmed, [14:31] that you go before court [14:33] and you hear both sides of this. [14:35] And you could adjudicate [14:36] those things about [14:37] whether the person [14:37] deserves the money or not. [14:39] But that's what's so hard [14:41] is it's so hard [14:41] to go against [14:42] the federal government. [14:43] Whether you're [14:43] on the left or the right, [14:45] we need to change the laws [14:46] when they infringe [14:46] on your First Amendment, [14:47] for instance, [14:48] or your freedom to travel [14:49] or freedom not to be vaccinated [14:52] that you put in laws [14:53] where there's liability [14:54] for the people [14:55] that force that, [14:56] whether it's private [14:57] or government. [14:59] Congressman, [14:59] we're almost out of time. [15:00] A couple more here. [15:01] I want to ask [15:02] about the Epstein files. [15:03] As you've noted, [15:04] the Speech and Debate Clause [15:05] actually protects you [15:06] from being prosecuted [15:07] for whatever you say [15:09] on the floor of the House. [15:10] You have named names [15:11] in the Epstein files [15:12] in the past. [15:13] Can we expect you [15:14] to name more names [15:15] in the coming weeks [15:16] and months? [15:19] Yes. [15:20] Todd Blanche [15:21] is violating the law. [15:22] There's still millions [15:23] of files they haven't released. [15:25] We know from talking [15:26] to the victim's lawyers [15:27] that their own 302 forms [15:29] haven't been released. [15:30] We know the files [15:31] have been over-redacted. [15:32] I have released [15:33] at least three names [15:34] of billionaires [15:35] who are implicated [15:36] in this. [15:37] I don't think it's possible [15:38] to get to convictions [15:39] with Todd Blanche [15:41] at the top [15:41] and with the FBI director [15:44] Kash Patel at the top [15:45] because they've effectively [15:46] both perjured themselves [15:47] by saying that there's [15:48] nobody else in the files. [15:50] Even Melania doesn't believe [15:52] that. [15:52] The first lady knows [15:53] that Jeffrey Epstein [15:54] didn't act alone. [15:55] And here's the great thing, [15:56] Kristen, whether I'm [15:58] in Congress or not, [15:59] the Epstein files [16:00] Transparency Act is a law [16:02] and it goes on for years. [16:03] So if we can't get [16:04] this attorney general [16:05] on this FBI director [16:06] to do the right thing, [16:08] the next ones [16:09] who take those seats [16:10] are obligated by law [16:11] to release the files [16:12] that these individuals [16:13] are not releasing now. [16:15] Congressman, [16:15] I want to ask [16:16] about your political future. [16:17] Some of your supporters [16:19] were chanting [16:20] President, President, [16:21] as you delivered [16:22] your speech on Tuesday night. [16:24] Are you considering [16:25] a run for president in 2028? [16:30] I will not rule out anything [16:32] and right now I'm not [16:33] going to rule in anything. [16:35] Look, I've spent the last [16:36] five days on my farm [16:37] with my grandkids [16:38] and my cattle [16:39] and my peach trees [16:40] and it's a pretty nice life. [16:42] I don't know if I want [16:43] to screw that up again. [16:44] I've been in Congress [16:45] 14 years fighting. [16:47] Every hour that passes, [16:48] I get decompressed a little [16:50] bit more. [16:51] It's like coming up [16:51] from the bottom of the ocean [16:52] and I'll take some time [16:55] and decide what's next. [16:57] But I think I will stay [16:58] engaged in some way or shape. [17:00] Maybe it's from the outside. [17:01] I've been exposing [17:03] what's going on [17:04] Washington, D.C. for years [17:05] and I'll keep doing it. [17:07] Congressman, I hear you [17:08] not ruling a potential [17:10] run for president out. [17:11] Would you run as a Republican? [17:13] I won't rule anything out. [17:17] I won't rule out [17:18] a run for county commissioner. [17:19] I used to be the county [17:20] judge executive here. [17:21] That was probably [17:22] the best job I ever had [17:24] in politics. [17:25] I would encourage people [17:26] watching this show [17:27] to act locally [17:28] and to run for local offices. [17:30] We can make a difference. [17:31] There's 3,000 counties [17:33] in this country. [17:34] Run for one of those offices. [17:36] We got to change it [17:37] at the grassroots first. [17:39] All right. [17:39] When you make your decision, [17:40] hopefully you'll come back [17:41] and share it here. [17:42] Congressman Massey, [17:43] thank you very much [17:44] for joining us this morning. [17:45] We really appreciate it. [17:48] Thanks, Kristen. [17:49] And when we come back, [17:51] Democratic Congressman Ro Khanna [17:52] joins me next. [18:04] Welcome back. [18:05] And joining me now [18:05] is Democratic Congressman [18:07] Ro Khanna of California. [18:09] Congressman Khanna, [18:09] welcome back to Meet the Press. [18:13] Thank you for having me on. [18:14] Thank you for coming back. [18:17] I do want to start off [18:18] by talking about Iran. [18:20] As I was just discussing [18:21] with Congressman Massey, [18:23] President Trump has said [18:25] that they may be close [18:26] to reaching a short-term deal [18:28] on Iran. [18:29] Would you be supportive [18:30] of a short-term deal [18:32] that doesn't directly address [18:34] the nuclear program [18:35] but allows for more negotiations? [18:40] Kristen, on this Memorial Day, [18:41] let me just begin [18:42] by paying tribute [18:43] to the men and women [18:44] who made the ultimate sacrifice [18:46] and gratitude [18:47] to their families. [18:48] The answer to your question [18:50] is yes. [18:50] I do believe we need [18:51] a negotiated deal. [18:53] Thomas Massey and I, [18:55] as he mentioned, [18:56] actually had the Iran [18:57] War Powers Act [18:58] two months ago. [18:59] We would have avoided [19:00] this war. [19:01] Food prices wouldn't [19:02] have gone up. [19:03] Gas prices wouldn't [19:04] have gone up. [19:04] And we could have done [19:05] this negotiation. [19:06] But I've always said [19:07] that I would support [19:08] negotiation [19:09] and it's time [19:10] for this war to end. [19:11] Well, let me ask you [19:12] about the War Powers Act [19:13] because House Republican [19:14] leaders abruptly [19:15] canceled a vote [19:16] to limit President Trump's [19:18] war powers in Iran. [19:19] It came just days [19:21] after the Senate [19:21] voted for the first time [19:22] to advance [19:23] a similar measure. [19:25] Do you believe [19:26] there are now [19:27] enough votes [19:27] to pass the War Powers Act [19:29] in the House? [19:32] Kristen, I do. [19:33] It was a bit surreal [19:35] last week. [19:36] I mean, first, [19:36] they delayed the vote [19:38] by 45 minutes [19:39] to 60 minutes. [19:40] And then they just [19:41] pulled the vote. [19:42] And the reason is [19:43] that now, [19:44] unlike when Thomas [19:45] and I introduced [19:46] the resolution, [19:47] there are a lot [19:47] of Republicans [19:48] who believe [19:49] the war should end. [19:50] They've talked to farmers [19:51] who say the price [19:52] of nitrogen, ammonia, [19:54] urea are through [19:54] the roof [19:55] because of the blockades [19:56] and control [19:57] of the Strait of Hormuz. [19:58] They know that [19:59] the price of gas is up, [20:00] the price of diesel is up, [20:02] and they're hearing it [20:03] from their constituents. [20:04] So this is putting [20:06] pressure on Trump [20:07] to get a negotiation. [20:09] And it's why [20:09] Congress matters. [20:10] Even when we don't [20:11] get a vote through, [20:12] we do put pressure [20:13] on the president. [20:14] Hopefully this war ends. [20:16] And I've always said [20:16] I would support [20:17] a negotiated end [20:18] to the war. [20:19] All right. [20:19] Well, let's talk [20:20] about Congressman Massey. [20:21] You've worked closely [20:22] with him, [20:23] including to push [20:24] for the release [20:24] of the Epstein files. [20:27] Congressman Khanna, [20:27] what was your reaction [20:29] to his defeat this week? [20:33] Sadness, disappointment. [20:35] Thomas is a real friend. [20:36] He's a good man. [20:37] And he was taken out [20:38] for two reasons. [20:39] One, he had the courage [20:41] to go after [20:42] some very powerful people [20:44] in working with me [20:45] to get the Epstein [20:45] Transparency Act passed. [20:47] As he mentioned, [20:48] that's historic [20:49] bipartisan legislation [20:50] that finally got justice [20:52] for the survivors. [20:52] And he had people [20:53] spend millions of dollars [20:55] and had the president [20:56] of the United States [20:56] after him. [20:57] And second, [20:58] he worked with me [20:59] to stop this war in Iran. [21:01] So for taking on [21:02] the Epstein class [21:03] and taking on war, [21:04] he basically lost his seat. [21:06] And I admire his courage [21:08] in taking those positions. [21:09] All right. [21:10] Well, let's talk about [21:10] some other issues. [21:11] President Trump, [21:12] as I just discussed, [21:13] was facing Republican [21:14] pushback this week [21:16] over what the president [21:17] referred to as [21:18] an anti-weaponization fund [21:20] to pay people [21:20] who claim to have been [21:22] unfairly targeted [21:23] by the government. [21:24] Here's how Vice President [21:25] J.D. Vance defended [21:27] the $1.8 billion fund [21:30] this week. [21:30] Take a listen. [21:32] Anybody can apply for it. [21:34] Republicans can apply for it. [21:35] Democrats can apply for it. [21:36] As you know, [21:37] the president of the United States [21:38] has pardoned a number [21:40] of Democrats [21:40] who he felt were actually [21:42] subject to this lawfare. [21:44] I mean, if Hunter Biden [21:44] wants to apply [21:45] for this particular fund, [21:47] he is welcome to. [21:48] The vice president says [21:50] this should be bipartisan. [21:51] What is your reaction [21:52] to what the vice president [21:53] had to say? [21:56] You know, [21:56] I feel sorry for J.D. Vance. [21:59] I mean, [21:59] they're trotting him out [22:00] to defend policies [22:01] he knows are defiant [22:04] of common sense. [22:05] They're trotting him out [22:06] to defend the Epstein class [22:07] when he actually was [22:08] one of the advocates [22:10] for releasing the files. [22:11] They're trotting him out [22:12] to defend this war in Iran [22:13] when his whole career [22:14] he was against these wars. [22:16] And now they're trotting him [22:17] out to defend Donald Trump [22:18] stealing taxpayer dollars [22:20] to give to his political allies. [22:22] I mean, [22:22] I'm sure if J.D. Vance [22:24] was asked in honesty, [22:26] he'd say, [22:26] why aren't we giving this [22:27] as a check to people [22:28] whose gas prices are going up? [22:30] But for his own ambition, [22:32] he has been so convoluted [22:34] that he's basically become [22:35] the spokesperson [22:36] for very unpopular policies. [22:39] Well, [22:39] let me ask you [22:40] about one of the big headlines [22:42] for Democrats this week. [22:43] Of course, [22:44] the DNC autopsy report. [22:46] It was commissioned [22:46] by the DNC. [22:48] It was shelved. [22:49] And then it was finally released [22:51] amidst a lot of pressure [22:53] and pushback. [22:54] We're going to talk about [22:55] what was not in the report [22:56] in just a moment. [22:57] But first, [22:57] I want to talk about [22:58] what was in the report. [23:00] The author writes, [23:01] at times, [23:02] it seems Democrats [23:03] are trying to win arguments [23:05] while Republicans [23:06] are focused on winning elections. [23:08] Democrats operate [23:09] in an ecosystem [23:10] defined by reason, [23:12] even in cycles [23:13] when the electorate [23:14] is defined by rage. [23:16] Do you believe Democrats [23:18] need to completely overhaul [23:19] how they think about [23:21] running and winning elections, [23:23] Congressman? [23:24] I don't think we need [23:27] to give up reason. [23:28] I think more Americans [23:29] probably want reason debate [23:31] in this country. [23:32] But we do need to recognize [23:33] that the status quo [23:34] has failed, [23:35] that this is a system [23:36] that has created [23:37] massive inequality, [23:39] that the economy [23:40] is lopsided and unfair, [23:42] and it's not working [23:43] for many working class [23:44] and middle class Americans. [23:46] Too often, [23:47] we've run status quo [23:49] establishment candidates [23:50] who have been unwilling [23:52] to call out an economic [23:53] and political system [23:54] that has failed. [23:55] Well, the report also found, [23:57] quote, [23:57] the White House [23:58] did not effectively support [24:00] Vice President Harris [24:02] over three and a half years [24:03] to improve her standing [24:05] before the candidate switch. [24:06] You served, of course, [24:08] on the Biden-Harris [24:09] 2024 National Advisory Board. [24:12] Does that ring true to you? [24:16] Well, look, [24:16] I have great admiration [24:17] for Vice President Harris. [24:19] I campaigned my heart out for her. [24:21] I do believe that, [24:22] in retrospect, [24:23] had she been in Pennsylvania, [24:25] Michigan, Ohio, [24:26] talking about the economy [24:28] and been the lead [24:29] for the president's [24:30] economic policies, [24:32] the Inflation Reduction Act, [24:33] the American Rescue Plan, [24:35] the CHIPS Act. [24:36] Perhaps we would have done better. [24:38] But we need to look forward now, [24:39] and looking forward, [24:41] we need to have [24:41] an economic message [24:42] that actually is talking [24:44] to the working class folks [24:45] who have been shafted, [24:46] and that's taking on a system [24:48] that has been rigged. [24:49] Congressman, [24:49] as you know, [24:50] a number of Democrats [24:51] are now calling on DNC Chair [24:53] Ken Martin to resign. [24:55] Do you agree that he should resign, [24:58] that it's time for new leadership [24:59] for the DNC? [25:02] No. [25:03] Ken Martin is a Paul Wallstone Democrat. [25:05] There are two things he's done [25:06] that I actually agree with. [25:08] One, he said, [25:09] no super PACs in Democratic primaries. [25:11] We shouldn't have what happened [25:12] to Thomas Massey [25:13] happening in our primaries, [25:14] where we have all this money [25:16] coming in in Democratic fights. [25:18] And two, Ken has said, [25:20] we shouldn't have superdelegates [25:21] picking our nominee. [25:23] So for those two reasons, [25:24] I agree with him. [25:24] Now, could he have handled [25:25] this autopsy better? [25:26] Absolutely. [25:27] He has said he should have. [25:29] Should he be working more [25:30] with state parties [25:31] to make sure they're funded [25:32] into 26 and 28? [25:33] Absolutely. [25:34] But I don't believe [25:36] he should resign. [25:37] All right. [25:37] Let me ask you finally [25:39] about the Supreme Court [25:41] after its ruling [25:42] limiting voting rights. [25:44] You called for term limits [25:45] for justices [25:46] and for expanding the court [25:48] from nine to 13 seats [25:50] once Democrats regain [25:51] full power of the government. [25:53] But you have seen [25:55] this redistricting [25:56] back and forth play out. [25:58] If Democrats expand the court, [26:00] if they were to have [26:01] control of both chambers, [26:03] what's to stop Republicans [26:04] from doing it [26:05] once the tables turn again? [26:10] Kristen, first, [26:10] we need to talk more [26:11] about the Supreme Court decision. [26:13] This is a Dred Scott court. [26:15] They have engaged [26:16] in the fastest rollback [26:18] of black political rights [26:19] since Rutherford Hayes [26:20] ended Reconstruction in 1877. [26:22] One-third, one-third of African-Americans [26:26] in the Congress's seats [26:27] are being threatened. [26:28] They're doing it [26:29] to Jim Clyburn in South Carolina, [26:31] to Benny Thompson in Mississippi, [26:33] and across Alabama and the South. [26:35] And we are not speaking up [26:37] loudly enough, strongly enough [26:39] against a court [26:40] that is really rolling back [26:41] civil rights. [26:42] I do believe if you combine [26:44] term limits on the court [26:45] and the expansion of the court, [26:47] where every president [26:48] gets two appointees, [26:49] you would depoliticize this. [26:51] You would stand up [26:52] for the Voting Rights Act, [26:53] and you would stand up [26:54] for basic American democracy. [26:56] But this is an assault [26:57] on John Lewis, Dr. King, [27:00] and the civil rights legacy, [27:01] and the Democratic Party [27:02] needs to run against this court [27:03] and call this court out. [27:05] All right. [27:05] Congressman Ro Khanna, [27:07] thank you, as always, [27:07] for being here. [27:08] We really appreciate it. [27:11] Thank you, Kristen. [27:12] And still ahead, [27:13] growing GOP pushback [27:15] on President Trump's agenda. [27:16] The panel is coming up. [27:24] Welcome back. [27:25] The panel is here. [27:26] NBC News Chief Foreign Affairs [27:27] and Chief Washington Correspondent [27:29] Andrea Mitchell. [27:30] Amy Walter, [27:32] editor-in-chief [27:32] of the Cook Political Report. [27:34] Jay Johnson, [27:35] Secretary of Homeland Security [27:37] under President Obama. [27:38] And Mark Short, [27:40] former Trump Director [27:41] of Legislative Affairs. [27:42] Thanks to all of you [27:43] for being here today. [27:45] Andrea, [27:45] I have to start with you [27:46] on Iran. [27:48] President Trump [27:48] posting on Saturday [27:50] that it seemed like [27:51] a deal was closed. [27:52] We haven't heard anything, [27:54] any update really, [27:55] since then. [27:56] What are you hearing? [27:57] Could there actually [27:57] be a deal? [27:58] There could be a deal, [27:59] but it's not really a deal. [28:01] It's a memorandum [28:02] of understanding, [28:03] and it leaves so much [28:04] still to be negotiated. [28:06] So, first of all, [28:07] on the nuclear issue, [28:08] which is so critical, [28:10] what are they going to do [28:11] about getting all of that [28:12] enriched uranium out? [28:14] These are volatile [28:15] canisters of radioactive gas. [28:19] Will they give up [28:20] the stockpile? [28:22] Will they give it up [28:23] and let it be taken out? [28:24] Will they agree [28:25] to no further enrichment [28:27] and for how long? [28:28] I mean, [28:29] the nuclear piece [28:30] is so important. [28:31] The president has made [28:31] such a big deal out of it. [28:33] This trade of Hormuz, [28:34] that's critical, [28:35] to get that open. [28:36] So, [28:36] are they going to charge fees [28:38] for tankers [28:39] that go through? [28:39] And how do fees [28:40] differ from tolls, [28:42] which the president [28:42] has ruled out? [28:44] They certainly [28:44] are not getting back [28:45] to what existed [28:46] before the war started. [28:48] And when you talk [28:49] about the Iranian assets [28:51] being unfrozen, [28:52] how does that differ [28:53] from what the president [28:54] has been so critical [28:55] of the Obama administration [28:56] for doing? [28:57] You know, [28:58] that's taking [28:58] the maximum pressure, [28:59] all of them. [29:00] I think that they [29:00] underestimated [29:01] the degree of pain [29:03] that Iran was willing [29:04] to withstand. [29:06] They certainly [29:06] underestimated [29:07] in listening to Israel [29:09] about going into this war, [29:11] what the regime [29:11] would look like [29:12] at this stage, [29:13] because it's much [29:14] more radical. [29:15] As each layer [29:16] got eliminated [29:17] by assassination, [29:18] you have worse people [29:19] to deal with, [29:20] arguably, [29:21] inside Iran. [29:22] They got rid [29:22] of the political leadership. [29:24] And what do they [29:24] really have to show for it? [29:26] And it's going to take [29:27] months and months [29:28] to get back [29:29] to the prices. [29:30] It is not, [29:31] the prices will come down [29:33] with a ceasefire. [29:35] Plus, [29:35] Israel is furious [29:36] about this. [29:37] Will they really stop [29:38] attacking Hezbollah [29:39] and Lebanon [29:39] and go along [29:40] with this ceasefire? [29:41] That remains to be seen. [29:42] It sure does, Andrea. [29:44] And Israel's not [29:44] the only one [29:45] who's furious, Mark. [29:46] There are a number [29:46] of Republicans, [29:48] hawks within the [29:49] Republican Party, [29:50] who say this short-term [29:51] deal would be disastrous [29:52] for all the reasons [29:53] Andrea's laying out. [29:54] Let me read you one [29:55] who posted online [29:57] this coming [29:58] from Roger Wicker, [30:00] chairman of the [30:00] Senate Armed Services [30:01] Committee, [30:01] who posted the rumored [30:02] 60-day ceasefire [30:04] with the belief [30:04] that Iran will ever [30:06] engage in good faith [30:07] would be a disaster. [30:09] Everything accomplished [30:10] by Operation Epic Fury [30:11] would be for naught. [30:13] The president has a lot [30:14] of voices in his ears [30:15] right now. [30:16] Mark, who's he [30:16] listening to? [30:18] Well, he listens [30:18] to a lot of different [30:19] voices. [30:19] That's part of the challenge. [30:21] But, you know, Chris, [30:22] on this Memorial Day [30:22] weekend when we honor [30:23] the fallen, [30:25] there's 241 servicemen [30:27] killed by the Iranians, [30:29] including 220 Marines [30:31] in Beirut. [30:32] There are hundreds more [30:33] that were killed [30:34] by manufactured car bombs [30:36] and roadside bombs [30:39] in the war in Iraq [30:40] that were manufactured in Iran. [30:41] And if we in this [30:43] Memorial Day weekend [30:43] are capitulating to Iran [30:45] and basically sending [30:47] multiple, multiples [30:49] of what Obama sent [30:51] and $1.7 billion in cash, [30:53] the frozen assets [30:54] are significantly greater [30:55] than that for a vague promise [30:57] that they'll one day, [30:58] you know, allow investigators [31:00] to look at the uranium [31:01] or get it out. [31:01] The whole purpose, [31:02] the president said many times, [31:03] was to ensure they would [31:04] never have that uranium capacity. [31:06] I think there'll be [31:07] a lot of Republicans [31:08] who'll be quite disappointed [31:09] and quite unhappy. [31:11] But there'll also be [31:11] a lot of Iranians, [31:12] a lot of Iranians [31:13] who have been looking [31:14] for America to stand with them. [31:15] And if we flee, [31:16] then they're going to be [31:17] in a position where [31:18] they're going to be [31:18] more slaughtered in Iran. [31:19] And a lot of the people [31:20] that we have relations with [31:22] in the Middle East [31:23] that have stood with us [31:24] in recent years, [31:25] I think will be concerned [31:26] because they'll think [31:27] Iran's coming after them [31:28] if America leaves. [31:29] Secretary Johnson, [31:30] what about that? [31:31] How would this play [31:32] on the world stage? [31:34] I regret to say [31:35] that I think [31:36] that whatever moral authority [31:37] we had as leader [31:40] of the free world [31:41] may be lost. [31:43] And no deal, [31:44] I think, [31:45] can restore that. [31:46] Let's not forget [31:47] that on the first day [31:48] of this war, [31:49] one of our missiles [31:51] hit a school, [31:52] killed over 100 children. [31:54] Our president threatened [31:55] genocide on Easter Sunday, [31:57] provoking the Pope. [31:59] Mark, I'm going to disagree [32:00] a little bit. [32:01] I fear we've turned [32:02] 93 million Iranians [32:04] against us, [32:04] the so-called great Satan. [32:07] Gas prices globally [32:08] are going up, [32:09] not just here [32:09] in the United States. [32:11] And we're leading, [32:15] I regret to say, [32:16] by the example of our power, [32:18] not the power [32:19] of our example anymore. [32:21] Amy, talk about the politics [32:23] of a potential deal. [32:25] Here we have gas prices surging, [32:27] and I know you've been watching [32:28] every single poll number. [32:29] They've been dropping, [32:30] including on his handling [32:32] of the economy, [32:33] the number one. [32:34] Especially on the issue [32:35] of inflation. [32:36] Yeah. [32:36] Before the attacks in Iran, [32:40] the president's, [32:41] opinions of the president [32:42] on how he was handling [32:44] inflation were already [32:45] underwater by about 25 points. [32:47] Today it's close to 50 points [32:49] underwater on his handling [32:50] of inflation. [32:51] So if you're a Republican [32:52] up in 2026, [32:55] you definitely are seeing Iran [32:58] as an anvil on your chances [33:00] in the midterm. [33:01] The possibility of gas being [33:03] more than $5 a gallon [33:05] going into the election [33:06] was a real stressor. [33:09] Potentially this takes [33:10] that off the table. [33:12] And I think it was beyond [33:13] just the numbers writ large. [33:15] Remember, this was an unpopular [33:17] war among the broad public, [33:19] but it wasn't that popular [33:20] among Republicans. [33:22] Even as voters were sticking [33:24] with the president, [33:25] his strength with his base [33:27] is there on the issue. [33:30] But the enthusiasm [33:31] for showing up to vote [33:32] was dampened a lot [33:34] by this war. [33:35] Just very briefly, [33:36] the Gulf leaders [33:37] with whom the president [33:38] spoke yesterday, [33:39] despite some of their [33:41] internal rivalries, [33:42] which we know about, [33:43] they were united in saying, [33:44] get this over with. [33:45] They are so worried [33:46] because Iran has the capacity [33:47] to retaliate against them. [33:49] They did not want [33:50] a resumption of bombing. [33:51] Well, so striking [33:52] that they want this deal. [33:53] And as you point out, [33:54] Andrea, Israel does not. [33:57] Staying on this idea [33:58] of divisions [33:58] within the Republican Party, [34:00] Republican senators [34:01] also growing very frustrated [34:03] with President Trump [34:04] over this weaponization fund. [34:06] In fact, Senator Ted Cruz [34:08] weighed in on this. [34:09] Let's take a listen [34:10] to a little bit [34:10] of what he had to say. [34:11] I'll get your reaction [34:12] on the other side. [34:13] And I don't know exactly [34:14] what will happen, [34:14] but we will see [34:17] the administration announcing [34:18] at a minimum [34:19] a modification of this [34:21] because if they don't, [34:23] they've got a full-on revolt [34:24] in the Senate. [34:26] Mark, this has been remarkable [34:27] because we did see a break. [34:30] Is it being overstated? [34:31] How do you see this rift [34:32] between President Trump [34:33] and Republicans [34:34] on the hill right now [34:35] on this issue? [34:36] I have no doubt [34:36] that there are people [34:37] that have politically prosecuted, [34:39] Kristen, on both sides. [34:41] But we've talked about [34:43] this number, [34:43] about 1.8 [34:44] or more than 1.7. [34:45] It's actually 1.776. [34:48] Some idiot thought [34:50] it'd be clever to say, [34:51] well, harken back [34:52] to the nation's founding [34:53] of 250 years ago [34:54] and to think [34:55] that we're comparing people [34:56] who assaulted police [34:57] in the Capitol [34:58] who were trying [34:59] to ensure [35:00] the certification [35:01] of election [35:01] in democracy [35:02] to those [35:03] who lost their lives, [35:05] their treasures, [35:05] their sacred honor [35:06] in forging a country [35:07] out of a wilderness [35:08] 250 years ago [35:09] against a monarchy [35:11] to ensure [35:11] the greatest democracy [35:12] ever could live. [35:13] This is so idiotic [35:15] and so stupid [35:16] that of course [35:16] there's going to be [35:16] a lot of Republicans [35:17] upset about this. [35:18] And what you've already seen [35:19] is what should be [35:20] a slam dunk for us [35:21] in passing a bill [35:22] to fund ICE and CBP. [35:24] It puts us in comparison [35:25] to Democrats [35:26] who are weak [35:26] on border security [35:27] has already been derailed [35:28] because of this. [35:29] And there'll be more things [35:30] derailed if they continue [35:31] to pursue this stupid idea. [35:32] Well, Jay, [35:33] some lawmakers are saying, [35:35] Republicans are saying, [35:36] is this even legal? [35:37] That's one of the critiques. [35:39] I'd say it's barely legal. [35:41] The way it's structured, [35:43] it draws upon [35:44] the judgment fund, [35:46] which is managed [35:46] by the Department of Treasury. [35:48] It's a standing fund, [35:49] multi-year money. [35:50] You can fund things [35:51] that are not lawsuits [35:52] out of it [35:53] under the proper circumstances. [35:56] But Congress [35:57] has the power of the purse. [35:58] Congress, [35:58] with this one paragraph bill, [36:00] could easily undo it. [36:02] But it's also rich in irony. [36:04] The prime applicants [36:05] for this would be [36:05] Jim Comey, [36:07] Tish James, [36:08] and the Congressional Six, [36:09] who the Trump Justice Department [36:11] tried to prosecute [36:12] and couldn't. [36:14] Amy, [36:14] one of the things [36:14] that makes this rift [36:16] so interesting, [36:17] we really saw it start [36:19] earlier in the week [36:19] when President Trump [36:20] decided to endorse [36:21] Attorney General Ken Paxton [36:23] in Texas [36:23] over Senator John Cornyn. [36:25] They have a runoff [36:26] on Tuesday. [36:27] Republicans saying [36:28] this could make Texas [36:30] a toss-up, effectively, [36:31] if Paxton wins. [36:31] Everything that we're [36:32] talking about right now, [36:34] whether it's the fund [36:35] or whether it is [36:38] the ballroom, [36:39] which you highlighted [36:40] earlier, [36:41] or this decision. [36:43] These are roadblocks [36:44] that the president [36:45] is putting [36:46] in the way [36:47] of Republicans. [36:48] These are own goals. [36:49] This did not have [36:50] to be this way. [36:51] And I think [36:52] the biggest question [36:53] in Texas, [36:54] because there's no doubt, [36:55] Republicans and Democrats [36:56] agree, [36:57] Ken Paxton [36:57] is the weaker candidate. [36:59] The big question is, [37:01] will the president [37:01] put his money [37:02] where his mouth is? [37:03] His super PAC has [37:04] more than $300 million [37:06] that, right now, [37:10] is sitting there [37:11] waiting to be spent. [37:12] Texas sucks up money [37:13] like nowhere else, [37:15] and Ken Paxton [37:15] is not a strong fundraiser. [37:17] He's going to need [37:17] a lot of outside help. [37:19] All right, guys. [37:19] Great conversation. [37:21] Thank you so very much. [37:22] Still ahead, [37:24] our Meet the Moment [37:24] conversation [37:25] with Reshma Sujani [37:26] on the fight [37:27] to empower women [37:28] and girls. [37:29] Stay with us. [37:34] Welcome back. [37:35] Former Congressman [37:36] Barney Frank died this week. [37:39] During his more than [37:40] three decades in Congress, [37:42] Frank became [37:43] one of the most influential [37:44] and outspoken voices [37:46] on Capitol Hill. [37:47] He was a trailblazer [37:49] for gay rights, [37:50] becoming the first member [37:51] of Congress [37:52] to voluntarily [37:53] come out as gay. [37:54] And he later helped [37:55] lead the overhaul [37:56] of Wall Street regulations [37:58] after the 2008 [37:59] financial crisis. [38:01] In 2015, [38:02] Barney Frank joined [38:03] Meet the Press [38:04] to discuss his memoir [38:05] and reflect [38:06] on his years [38:08] in public service. [38:10] I started out [38:11] in thinking about politics [38:12] when I was 14, [38:13] thinking, you know, [38:14] I'm gay, [38:15] so I'm probably never [38:15] going to get that [38:16] influential in politics. [38:18] But I'd like to be [38:19] because I'd like [38:19] to make these changes [38:20] more economic fairness [38:22] against discrimination. [38:23] And as I said, [38:24] by the time it was over, [38:25] I had become [38:26] very influential. [38:27] I was chairman [38:28] of a committee, [38:28] lasted long enough. [38:30] Being gay [38:30] was not an obstacle. [38:31] The problem was [38:32] government wasn't [38:33] influential anymore. [38:34] The notion that [38:36] government can be [38:36] a positive force [38:37] in our lives, [38:38] that's lost power [38:40] and that makes it [38:41] very hard for me [38:42] to see the objectives [38:43] that I would like [38:43] in our society [38:44] to accomplish. [38:46] Congressman Barney Frank [38:47] was 86 years old. [38:57] Meet the Moment [38:57] is presented by [38:58] Progressive Insurance. [39:00] Progressive Insurance [39:01] makes bundling [39:02] home and auto easy. [39:03] Learn more [39:04] at Progressive.com. [39:12] Welcome back. [39:13] Rashma Sujani [39:14] has spent her career [39:15] fighting for girls [39:16] in the classroom [39:17] and women [39:18] in the workforce, [39:20] founding nonprofits [39:21] Girls Who Code [39:22] and Moms First. [39:24] She was named [39:24] one of Time's [39:25] 2026 Women of the Year [39:27] for her work [39:28] on women's rights. [39:30] And her upcoming [39:31] documentary, [39:32] No Country for Mothers, [39:33] advocates for paid leave [39:35] and affordable child care. [39:37] I sat down with Sujani [39:38] for a Meet the Moment [39:39] conversation [39:40] about closing [39:41] the gender gap [39:42] in technology careers [39:43] and why she's teaching [39:45] girls to be brave, [39:47] not perfect. [39:49] When did you know [39:50] that you wanted [39:51] to really dedicate [39:52] your life [39:52] to fighting [39:53] for women's rights? [39:55] Probably from the time [39:56] I was a little girl. [39:56] You know, [39:57] my parents came here [39:58] as refugees. [39:59] They were expelled [40:00] from Uganda in 1973, [40:02] 90 days to leave the country [40:03] or they'd be shot on spot. [40:04] And so I knew [40:05] from the time [40:06] I was a little girl [40:07] that I wanted [40:08] to give back. [40:09] That I, you know, [40:10] that this country [40:10] had literally saved [40:11] my parents' life [40:12] and I loved it so much [40:14] that I wanted [40:15] to do something [40:16] to make it good [40:18] for everybody else. [40:20] Girls Who Code [40:20] was really inspired [40:21] by my father, [40:22] you know, [40:23] wanting to march [40:24] into the middle class [40:25] and saying you can be [40:26] a doctor, a lawyer, [40:27] or an engineer [40:28] because those were [40:29] the jobs [40:29] that gave you [40:30] the opportunity [40:31] to be able to do that. [40:32] Well, let's talk [40:33] more deeply [40:34] about Girls Who Code. [40:36] You founded [40:37] this nonprofit [40:37] in 2011. [40:39] You wanted to address, [40:40] as you say, [40:40] the gender gap [40:41] in technology. [40:42] Well, let's look [40:43] at where it stands now. [40:44] In 2026, [40:45] women make up [40:45] 35% of STEM employees [40:48] in the U.S. [40:49] Women earn 26% [40:51] of degrees [40:52] in engineering, [40:53] 23% in computer science. [40:56] How is Girls Who Code [40:58] working to increase [40:59] those numbers? [41:00] Yeah. [41:01] So when I started [41:02] Girls Who Code, [41:04] there was like [41:04] less than, you know, [41:05] 1% of girls [41:06] were interested [41:07] in going into science, [41:08] technology, [41:08] engineering, math. [41:09] And for me, [41:10] it was not just [41:11] about closing [41:12] the gender gap [41:13] for the sake of it. [41:14] It was about [41:14] giving girls [41:15] an opportunity [41:16] to get jobs [41:17] into the future. [41:19] We have taught [41:19] 860,000 girls [41:22] to code [41:22] in the United States. [41:24] We've reached [41:24] millions across the world. [41:26] So these problems [41:27] are solvable. [41:29] Now the thing is, [41:30] is we've got to [41:31] protect the progress [41:32] that we've made. [41:32] How early [41:34] should girls be starting? [41:36] Is there [41:36] too young of an age [41:38] to get girls [41:39] excited about coding? [41:40] It's so important [41:41] to get them [41:41] at the youngest [41:41] of possible ages [41:42] to tinker [41:43] and to take things apart, [41:44] to fail, [41:46] to push themselves, [41:47] to not only, [41:48] you know, [41:48] move towards things [41:49] that they think [41:49] that they can ace, [41:50] but to know what failure [41:51] and risk-taking feels like. [41:53] We have to teach [41:55] young women courage. [41:56] And the thing about courage, [41:57] it doesn't always feel good. [41:59] It doesn't feel like [42:00] you're Tom Cruise, [42:01] you know what I mean? [42:01] And you're getting [42:02] flowers thrown at you. [42:04] It feels like rejection. [42:05] It feels hard. [42:06] And that's what I love [42:07] about STEM education [42:09] is that it's that [42:10] annoying process [42:11] of doing it over [42:12] and over and over again [42:14] until you get it right. [42:15] Moms first. [42:16] Let's delve into that. [42:17] That's your nonprofit [42:18] that fights for paid leave [42:19] and affordable childcare. [42:22] The United States, [42:23] and I think a lot of people [42:24] would be surprised [42:25] to know this, [42:26] is the only major [42:27] industrialized country [42:29] that does not guarantee [42:31] paid leave. [42:32] How is that possible? [42:33] What are you doing [42:34] to address that? [42:35] I mean, it's unconscionable. [42:38] You know, one out of four women [42:39] go back to work [42:40] two weeks after having a baby. [42:41] We're also the wealthiest nation [42:43] that puts the least amount [42:44] of money into childcare. [42:45] And mothers in America, [42:46] quite frankly, [42:47] have been getting conned [42:48] since the ink dried [42:49] on the Constitution. [42:50] And, you know, [42:51] what do I mean by that? [42:52] Like, why does work end at six [42:53] and school pickups at 3.30? [42:56] You know, why do I pay more [42:57] for my childcare [42:57] than I pay for my mortgage? [42:58] Why do one out of four women [43:00] go back to work [43:01] two weeks after having a baby? [43:02] The reason why [43:03] we don't have childcare [43:04] and paid leave [43:05] is because we haven't built [43:07] a mother's movement [43:08] that's across all aisles, [43:11] across every single divide, [43:12] to say enough is enough [43:14] and to demand it. [43:15] And I think on childcare, [43:17] we're really close. [43:19] You do. [43:20] You're optimistic. [43:21] I am optimistic [43:22] because I've seen [43:22] what's happened in Vermont, [43:24] in New Mexico. [43:25] I saw what we did [43:25] with Governor Hochul [43:26] and Mayor Momdani [43:27] in New York. [43:28] I was just speaking [43:29] to, you know, [43:30] Governor Moore. [43:31] And we know [43:33] that this has got to happen [43:35] because childcare [43:36] is the linchpin [43:37] of affordability. [43:39] 55% of Americans [43:40] are in debt [43:41] because of the cost [43:42] of childcare. [43:43] Families are drowning. [43:45] And so that is [43:46] the one thing [43:47] that we can do [43:48] as a country [43:49] to reduce people's costs. [43:51] You've said [43:51] people are being [43:53] priced out [43:54] of parenthood [43:55] because of the high costs [43:57] of childcare. [43:57] What we're discussing [43:58] is having a child now [44:01] a financial decision [44:02] as much as it is [44:03] a personal decision [44:04] about building [44:05] one's family. [44:06] I mean, [44:06] it's absolutely [44:07] a financial decision. [44:08] I mean, look, [44:09] I mean, [44:09] 500,000 women [44:10] left the workforce [44:11] because they couldn't [44:12] afford childcare. [44:13] And I think [44:14] young families [44:16] see that [44:16] and they say [44:17] we're pricing them [44:18] out of parenthood. [44:19] And that's happening [44:21] also, again, [44:21] and we are [44:22] the wealthiest nation [44:23] that doesn't have [44:24] paid leave [44:24] and childcare. [44:25] Think about that. [44:26] We're spending [44:27] billions for bombs [44:28] and pennies [44:28] for children and moms. [44:29] And you know what? [44:30] Parents see that [44:31] and they're paying attention [44:32] and they're choosing [44:34] not to have families. [44:35] You talk about [44:36] being a warrior [44:37] and you've spoken [44:39] openly about [44:40] how you struggled [44:40] with fertility [44:41] while you were [44:43] building Girls Who Code. [44:45] How did you get [44:46] through that period [44:47] and what did you learn [44:48] during that period? [44:50] You know, [44:50] I wanted to be a mom [44:51] more than anything [44:52] and it just [44:54] wasn't easy for me. [44:56] You know, [44:56] I had more miscarriages [44:57] than I could count [44:58] and, you know, [44:59] I went through this [45:00] kind of, [45:01] I would say, [45:03] phase where I would [45:04] get the bad news, [45:05] you know, [45:05] be in the doctor's office, [45:06] not get the heartbeat [45:07] and I would just [45:08] come on a TV show [45:10] like this, [45:10] stand in front [45:11] of a group of children, [45:12] like, [45:13] I just would perform. [45:15] When I was trying [45:15] to have my second, [45:16] I just couldn't [45:17] do it anymore [45:18] and I stopped [45:19] and I asked for help [45:21] and I started, [45:22] you know, [45:22] sharing my story [45:24] but here's the thing, [45:25] it's like, [45:26] we make it so difficult [45:28] for people [45:29] who want to be parents [45:30] in terms of the price [45:32] of IVF, [45:33] in terms of the ability [45:34] to, like, [45:35] live in a society [45:35] in a country [45:36] that will hold you. [45:37] I'd rather tell someone [45:38] I had cancer [45:39] than just say [45:39] I went through [45:39] a miscarriage, [45:41] right? [45:42] And then when you [45:42] become a mother, [45:44] we make it [45:44] so damn hard. [45:46] I want to look [45:48] to the future [45:48] a little bit [45:50] and get you [45:52] to talk about [45:52] this idea [45:54] that you have promoted, [45:55] brave, [45:56] not perfect. [45:57] What does that mean? [45:58] What is that message [45:59] that you are trying [46:00] to send to little girls, [46:02] women of all ages? [46:03] So the thing I learned [46:04] in building Girls Who Code [46:05] was that, like, [46:07] bravery is an anecdote [46:08] to perfection [46:09] and the metaphor [46:10] for bravery [46:10] was coding. [46:11] Like, [46:12] so many girls [46:12] came to our program [46:13] they had never coded before [46:14] and they're like, [46:14] I can't do this. [46:16] And then after a week, [46:17] after two weeks, [46:17] when they made [46:18] the Sprite dance [46:19] and they built a website, [46:20] they're like, [46:20] I can do this. [46:21] That is what we need [46:23] right now. [46:23] We need people [46:24] to do brave things, [46:26] brave small things [46:27] and brave big things. [46:28] I learned my bravery muscle. [46:29] I ran for Congress. [46:30] I've lost office twice. [46:32] I'm like a serial [46:32] failed politician. [46:34] But that, [46:35] that the fear [46:36] of, like, [46:37] going out there [46:38] and losing [46:38] and losing [46:39] so spectacularly [46:40] was just such a gift [46:42] because it didn't make, [46:43] I'm like, [46:44] not afraid [46:44] of anything anymore. [46:47] And a note [46:47] before we go, [46:48] this Memorial Day weekend, [46:50] we want to extend [46:50] a special thank you [46:52] to those who have served [46:53] and those who have made [46:54] the ultimate sacrifice [46:56] for this country. [46:57] That is all for today. [46:58] Thank you so much [46:59] for watching. [47:00] We'll be back next week [47:01] because if it's Sunday, [47:02] it's Meet the Press. [47:03] We'll be right back. [47:29] We you know it's Friday. [47:29] We'll be right back. [47:30] And we'll be right back. [47:31] And remember, [47:32] stay updated [47:34] on breaking news [47:35] and top stories [47:36] on the NBC News app [47:37] or watch live [47:38] on our YouTube channel.