ICE, CBP & Others Testify Before Congress

[0:00] violation of House rules and the rules of this committee to engage in [0:03] personalities regarding other members or to question the motives of a colleague. [0:07] It is also a clear violation of the rules of the House to make statements [0:11] that might personally be offensive to the President or the Vice President of [0:15] the United States. Remarks of that type are not permitted by the rules and are [0:19] not in keeping with the best traditions of our committee. The chair will enforce [0:23] these rules of the quorum at all times and urges all members to be mindful of [0:26] their remarks. Further, under the rules of the House, the chairman is responsible [0:31] for maintaining order and preserving decorum in the committee room. I expect [0:35] audience members to be respectful of the witnesses, members, and the public. If [0:39] members of the audience are personally persistently or overly disruptive, it is [0:44] a violation of federal law and you'll be subject to removal and arrest. I now [0:48] recognize myself for an opening statement. I want to start by thanking our witnesses [0:53] for appearing before the committee today. Today's hearing provides that the [0:58] American people the ability to hear directly from the leaders that enforce [1:02] our nation's immigration laws. It is our imperative, as representatives of the [1:07] people, to be a voice for the people. Transparency, communication, and [1:12] accountability are keys to good government. This is why oversight is [1:17] important. Informing Congress and the public is not casting accusations, nor is it a [1:22] punishment. Congress has a duty to hear directly from the executive branch, a duty [1:27] I take seriously. An executive branch has a duty to keep us informed. While this [1:33] hearing was long planned, we sit here today in an inflection point. An opportunity to [1:38] assess and reinforce the integrity of immigration enforcement to strengthen [1:42] public trust. An opportunity to emphasize and underscore the Department of [1:47] Homeland Security's no-fail mission as a whole. My top priority as chairman is, [1:52] and will always be, protecting America while ensuring the safety of law [1:57] enforcement. This is further important in the context of another potential [2:01] shutdown of the Department. Let me be clear, shutting down DHS makes America [2:07] less safe, and negatively impacts thousands of federal employees like [2:11] those at TSA and CISA. The Department of Homeland Security is the nation's [2:16] largest federal law enforcement agency. It is this committee's duty, regardless of [2:21] administration, to conduct oversight. We need to examine how DHS components are [2:26] enforcing the law and ensure they have the resources in place to do work safely, [2:31] effectively, and properly. Last year, we provided historic resources to [2:37] reconciliation to strengthen public safety and support for the Trump [2:41] administration's unprecedented efforts to secure the border. This was the single [2:45] largest investment in the domestic homeland security mission. To succeed, we [2:50] all need to work together seamlessly, and this committee is a partner in that [2:53] effort. It is important to remember how we got here. For years, we witnessed a [2:58] blanket refusal to enforce the law. Wide open borders, catch-and-release policies, and [3:03] uncontrolled mass migration. These policies undermine the rule of law and [3:08] endangered all Americans. Enforcing immigration law is not optional. The Trump [3:14] administration's record on border security is irrefutable. Nationwide border [3:18] encounters last December decreased 91 percent compared to 2023. Apprehensions [3:24] between ports of entry last December decreased 86 percent compared to 2024. And we [3:29] ended last year with eight consecutive months of zero parole releases by Border Patrol. [3:34] Further, thousands of criminal illegal aliens have been detained and deported. These [3:40] actions make America safer and more secure. But the credibility of these [3:44] successes is on the line. We must take the temperature down and look at the record [3:49] of enforcement actions through rational eyes. We've seen a significant increase in [3:53] violent rhetoric and agitation. We've seen a significant increase in attacks on [3:58] federal law enforcement and in the number of threats facing them and their [4:01] families. This committee highlighted the threat increases to law enforcement at an [4:06] earlier hearing. We have seen state and local jurisdictions refuse to protect [4:10] federal law enforcement officers. And obviously we have now seen the deaths of [4:15] two American citizens in Minnesota. This is all unacceptable and preventable. The [4:21] safety of law enforcement and the communities they serve and protect must [4:24] always come first. When officials or elected leaders rush to conclusions about [4:30] law enforcement or their fellow Americans, public trust suffers. There must be [4:36] complete and impartial investigation. I expect each of our witnesses to keep this [4:41] committee fully informed as the investigations run their course. And I will [4:46] ensure this happens. While these investigations are ongoing, officials and [4:50] elected leaders cannot rush to judgment. I cannot put myself in the shoes of law [4:54] enforcement, nor can I imagine what the families of Ms. Good and Mr. [4:58] Pretty are enduring today. Public trust and public safety go hand in hand. We cannot [5:03] have one without the other. I'm encouraged to see that President Trump sent [5:07] Board of Zar Tom Homan and Commissioner Scott to Minnesota to work with [5:11] Governor Walz, Mayor Frey and other local leaders. I sincerely hope this [5:15] dialogue continues. This should stand as an example of cooperation to anyone who [5:21] continues to incentivize reckless behavior in our streets and lawfully [5:25] impede law enforcement operations or disparage their fellow citizens. State and [5:30] local officials should be partners, not obstacles when it comes to public safety. [5:33] And federal officials should keep in mind that this kind of partnership is a [5:38] two-way street. Everyone should have the same goal of keeping America safe. [5:41] Transparency and communication are needed now more than ever. The [5:46] Department's no-fail mission hangs in the balance. A rule-based order is not [5:51] one-sided. Enforcing immigration law and defending all Americans' constitutional [5:56] rights, including the rights to peacefully protest, bear arms, and privacy, are not [6:01] mutually exclusive. I want to thank Secretary Noem for making these witnesses [6:06] rapidly available. And again, thank the three of you for being here today. As [6:12] Board of Zar, Homan recently said, you can't fix problems if you don't have [6:16] discussions. I hope we can have a positive, civil, and productive discussion today. Only [6:21] together can we make our community stronger and the homeland safer for the future of all [6:26] Americans. I now recognize the ranking member, the gentleman from Mississippi, Mr. Thompson, for his opening statement. [6:31] Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. Good morning to all of you who are here. Thank [6:38] you for calling this hearing today. This important hearing has drawn a great deal [6:43] of interest and attention. And many of my colleagues who represent the border city of [6:49] El Paso and who have been leader on border security, Veronica Escobar, has joined us [6:57] today and would like to ask questions of our witnesses. So, Mr. Chairman, I ask unanimous [7:03] consent that the gentlewoman from Texas, Ms. Escobar, be permitted to sit with the [7:10] committee and question today's witnesses as we have afforded that to other [7:16] individuals in past hearings. Well, I thank the gentlewoman for their interest in [7:21] today's important hearing. As I previously informed, both the majority and minority [7:25] committee will not be entertaining off committee member requests. Therefore, I [7:29] object. Well, your objection is noted, Mr. Chairman, but I would, for the record, want [7:37] to say that it's highly unusual that a member of Congress sitting with as much [7:44] impact on immigration as her area is not afforded that courtesy. But you're the chairman [7:55] one, and that's your prerogative, as if it would be anyone else's. [8:01] As the ranking member knows, we had many requests. This is a very important hearing. It [8:11] is my duty to keep the wheels on this hearing and get actual answers on the record. I thank [8:17] the gentlelady's interest. We had a lot of members who were interested in being here today, [8:24] which is why we thought it would be best just to keep it for members of the committee. These [8:30] gentlemen have repeatedly testified before many committees at the Capitol, and I'm sure [8:39] other members will get the opportunity to do the same questioning. This is the Committee [8:42] on Homeland Security. We had previously said we would not wave on members specifically for this [8:47] hearing, and we're going to stick by that rule today. Thank you very much, Mr. Chair. May I say to [8:55] Ms. Escobar, if there are questions you would like to have asked of these witnesses, if you will [9:02] provide those questions to me or any other member of the committee, we'll be more than happy to [9:09] transmit them. Thank you so much. I hope my Republican colleagues will remember that our job is to [9:21] conduct oversight, not cover for Donald Trump and his out-of-control administration, which is running [9:28] roughshod over Americans' rights, killing U.S. citizens and threatening our very democracy. The [9:35] disease rotting the Trump administration from the inside out started at the top and has infected every [9:42] part of the executive branch. Nowhere is that more evident than at the Department of Homeland Security. [9:50] This hearing is just the start of a reckoning for the Trump administration and its weaponization of DHS [9:58] against American citizens and the principle our country stands for. DHS, led by Secretary Christy Nome, [10:06] must be held accountable for its lawlessness immigration operation. They are reckless, [10:12] creating chaos in our communities, terrorizing adults and children alike, and undermining our moral [10:19] authority as a nation of liberty and rule of law. Last month, an ICE agent shot and killed Renee Good, [10:28] a Minneapolis mom in cold blood, as she drove away from him. After killing her, the agent called [10:37] her a disgusting name. I won't repeat here. Other agents refused to allow a nearby physician [10:45] to treat her. Democrats called for accountability. Instead, Secretary Noem blamed the victim, [10:54] Ms. Good, and attempted to gaslight Americans with false claims that Ms. Good was a domestic terrorist. [11:03] Renee Good was nothing of the sort. She was a mom, a wife, a neighbor, and an American citizen who did [11:11] not deserve deserve to die at the hands of her own government. She should be alive today. Ever since, [11:20] the Trump administration has devoted the full resources of the federal government to blocking a [11:26] legitimate investigation into Ms. Good's killing. If that isn't a sign of guilt, I don't know what is. [11:34] Fellow prosecutors had a warrant to collect evidence from Ms. Good's vehicle for a civil rights [11:40] investigation into ICE's use of force, but FBI Director Cash Fatale and other Trump administration [11:48] officials demanded they drop it. Korea prosecutors, duly bound to the rule of law, not the political [11:57] prerogatives of the White House, resigned in protests. Blocking an investigation into the government's [12:04] use of force against one of its own citizens is a self-dictatorship, not democracy. Every American [12:13] should be outraged. Democrats tried to get answers in the aftermath of Ms. Good's shooting. We called on [12:21] Acting Director Todd Lyons to testify at the committee's hearing three weeks ago. Unfortunately, [12:28] he turned down the committee's invitation. This is part of a pattern of the Trump administration's refusal [12:37] to comply with regular congressional oversight. Committed Democrats have sent multiple letters [12:44] to ICE and CBP on critical issues, but most of them, 10, have gone unanswered. Mr. Chairman, [12:52] I ask unanimous consent to include all 10 of these records into the record, letters into the record. [13:02] That objection. ICE has blocked members of Congress from visiting its detention facilities, [13:09] even after reports of horrific conditions, detainee abuse, and a detainee being murdered [13:16] in a DHS facility. I was one of those individuals who parted to a lawsuit to try to get ICE to just follow [13:27] the law that says members of Congress can visit ICE facilities and present themselves at any time. So I [13:37] understand that it's still being litigated, but I've been given authority to go, and I plan to do it this [13:44] week just to test ICE's adherence to the law. Mr. Lyons is here today, nearly a month after we invited him. [13:54] I guess DHS needed time to get his story straight before he came to testify under oath. Fearing more [14:02] violence from federal law enforcement, Democrats have also called on DHS to ring in immigration agents [14:10] and their brutal attacks on Americans immediately following Ms. Good's murder. But DHS ignored our [14:18] pleas. Instead, Greg Vino, who styled himself in Nazi attire and takes joy in deploying tear gas at [14:27] Americans, continued to roam around Minneapolis with his mass gang, terrorizing people and violating [14:35] their constitutional rights. And tragically, our worst fears were realized. Just days after the hearing, [14:44] Mr. Lyons refused to participate in. CBP personnel shot Alex Preeti, and he was face down on Minneapolis's [14:56] sidewalk, killing him in broad daylight. In the video of the incident, a DHS agent can be seen cheering [15:05] Mr. Preeti's death. Americans watched the video in horror. Yet once again, Secretary Noem gaslit the [15:15] public, made up a demonstrably false story about Mr. Preeti and blamed the victim for his own death. [15:25] Mr. Preeti was a law-abiding U.S. citizen and a VA nurse who dedicated his career to caring for our veterans. [15:34] Mr. Chairman, at our last month hearing, I asked for a moment of silence in the memory of Renee Good. [15:43] Today, with great sadness about another American killed at the hands of DHS, I asked that the committee [15:51] observe a moment of silence in honor of Alex Preeti. Thank you. The slaying of Ms. Good and Mr. Preeti [16:09] by DHS are the most tragic examples of what is wrong with Trump's DHS, but far from the only one. [16:18] Last fall, a Border Patrol agent shot Miramar Martinez, a U.S. citizen and preschool teacher from [16:26] Chicago five times. The agent bragged in text messages about shooting her, saying, quote, [16:34] I fired five rounds and she had seven holes, but that in your book, boys. Again, the Trump [16:43] administration tried to blame Ms. Martinez, the victim, but prosecutors dropped charges against her [16:50] when it became apparent that the evidence contradicted the Border Patrol's phony account. [16:57] Unlike Ms. Good's and Mr. Preeti's, we can no longer tell their stories. Ms. Martinez has shared her story [17:05] about what Trump's DHS did to her. I want to play a bit of the video here, because people need to see [17:14] what ICE and CBP are doing to America. So this is the first one I realized. I was like, oh, [17:25] it's just a pepper palette, but no. And then I got shot right here. And then I have a wound on the side [17:35] of my chest right here. And then I got two holes in my thigh. Yeah. Wow. Okay. Wow. You're covered in [17:49] wounds. Yeah. And I want people to see like what's going on, like the type of stuff they're doing. [17:57] What happened to Ms. Martinez, Ms. Good and Mr. Preeti is a scourge on this country and shameful chapter [18:09] in our nation's history. But tragically, there's more. DHS agents recently used a five-year-old [18:18] Ecuadorian boy, Lehman Ramos, as bait to lure his family members outside their home to arrest them. [18:27] The family had entered the country legally as asylum seekers and were living in Minnesota [18:34] while awaiting their immigration proceedings. DHS sent the little boy and his father to detention in [18:40] Texas for over a week. Thankfully, a judge ordered him release, slamming DHS for its, and I quote, [18:49] incompetently implemented deportation campaign. Incompetently implemented deportation campaign [18:59] is putting it nicely, especially as it relates to small children. More apt in the Bible quote from John [19:08] 11, Chapter 35, referenced at the end of the judge's opinion, Jesus wept. DHS personnel are now forcing [19:18] their way into private homes without a judicial warrant in violation of the Fourth Amendment. In one recent [19:26] incident, ICE dragged a U.S. citizen from his home at gunpoint in underwear before realizing they had [19:34] picked up the wrong person. The person ICE was actually looking for was sitting in jail in Minnesota. The [19:45] Minnesota Department of Corrections says that ICE had this information all along. Bystander videos from [19:53] Minneapolis and cities around the country show ICE and CBP personnel having behaving like unprofessional [20:01] goons cursing at bystanders and mooning people from their hotel room. News reports have a border patrol agent [20:11] was found passed out drunk and covered in vomit in a vehicle. And ICE personnel apparently stole a child's [20:20] phone and sold it for cash. It's an embarrassment and DHS's so-called leadership should be ashamed if only [20:29] they had any shame. Secretaries known Department of Homeland Security has the blood of American citizens [20:37] on its hand, but she takes no responsibility for anything. To the contrary, Secretary Noem was last seen [20:46] in this committee room hiding behind her family in a desperate attempt to distract distract from her [20:54] department's failures and abuses. Then she ran from our questions, leaving early under the guise of [21:01] needing to attend a meeting that it turns out didn't even exist. Her inexcusable behavior should come as no [21:10] surprise. She all she's always been more concerned with photo ops and wardrobe changes than following [21:18] the law and fulfilling the mission of her department. Since being sworn in, Secretary Noem has enriched [21:25] herself, abused the power of her office, obstructed congressional oversight and violated her oath to the [21:33] Constitution. Donald Trump and Christy Noem are doing real damage to this country and to the department that was stood [21:42] up 25 years ago in the wake of 9-11 to protect American citizens from future attacks. Secretary Noem is a liar with no [21:53] concern for the lives of Americans killed by the department she runs. She must go. Mr. Chairman, I yield back. [22:02] I yield back. Other members of the committee are reminded that opening statements may be submitted for [22:08] the record. I would now like to formally introduce our witnesses. First is Mr. Rodney Scott. Mr. Scott is [22:15] Commissioner of U.S. Customs and Border Protection. After decades of service at CBP, including a stint as [22:20] Chief Border Patrol, he has served as a Senate-confirmed Commissioner since June of 2025. Second is Mr. Joseph [22:28] Edlow. Mr. Edlow is Director of Citizenship and Immigration Services. Director Edlow has served in numerous [22:33] legal roads across Executive Branch and Congress, including Chief Counsel to USCIS. Mr. Edlow has [22:40] served as a Senate-confirmed Director since July 2025. Third is Mr. Todd Lyons. Mr. Lyons is the Acting [22:48] Director of Immigration and Customs Enforcement. Acting Director Lyons began his federal service in the [22:52] U.S. Air Force in 1993 and joined ICE as an agent in 2007. Mr. Lyons moved up the ranks and has served as [22:59] Acting Director since March of 2025. Thank all the witnesses for being here today. [23:06] Pursuant to Committee Rule 8C, I ask that the witnesses please rise and raise their right hand. [23:15] Do you solemnly swear that the testimony you will give before the Committee on Homeland Security of [23:19] the United States House of Representatives will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the [23:23] truth, so help you God. Let the record reflect that the witnesses have answered the affirmative. [23:28] Thank you and please be seated. I will now recognize Commissioner Scott for five [23:34] minutes to summarize his opening statement. Chairman Garbarino, Ranking Member Thompson, [23:41] Members of the Committee, thank you for the opportunity to appear here before you today. [23:45] I'm honored to represent more than 67,000 dedicated men and women of U.S. Customs and Border Protection [23:51] who are tirelessly protecting this great nation every single day by simply trying to make sure we know who [23:57] and what is entering our homeland. Border security is national security. Law enforcement personnel that [24:04] selflessly provide this service to America increasingly perform under difficult conditions [24:09] and intense public and political scrutiny. But these brave men and women deserve our gratitude and [24:15] thanks. It's my privilege to be here today joining my colleagues from Immigration and Customs Enforcement [24:21] and Citizenship and Immigration Services. Our agencies work in partnership to secure the homeland [24:27] and uphold the integrity of our immigration system. CBP has spent the last year rebuilding what was an [24:33] intentionally broken border. As I informed Congress in 2021 and again in 2023, the open border policies [24:40] of the Biden administration all but eliminated any meaningful border along this any meaningful border [24:46] and it replaced it with a porous geographic line defined by record high encounters with illegal aliens, [24:53] overwhelmed facilities, and a workforce that was stretched so far beyond their capabilities that [24:58] hostile nations and the cartels exploited our border at will. That all changed on January 20, 2025 under the [25:06] leadership of President Trump. We have now implemented effective policies, established unified priorities [25:12] and objectives across all federal departments, and empowered our workforce to do their jobs by simply [25:17] enforcing the laws that already exist. We have imposed consequences for those who break our laws, [25:24] the laws that this body enacted. And today, the United States, because of these efforts, enjoys the most secure [25:30] border in our nation's history. But this progress did not happen by accident. It's a result of a [25:35] comprehensive approach to border security. We ended catch and release, we prioritized detention and [25:40] removal authorities, and we sent a clear message that illegal entry into the United States will not be [25:45] tolerated. And the numbers speak for themselves. We have achieved record low illegal crossings between ports [25:51] of entry. Border Patrol apprehensions along the southwest border totaled over 90,000 for the entire year. [25:58] That's a number that used to represent a single month under the Biden administration. [26:03] Daily encounters have dropped by 95%, averaging about 250 per day, compared to 5,000 a day during the [26:11] Biden administration. Our increased enforcement also resulted in the seizure of over 617,000 pounds of [26:18] illicit narcotics. That's nationwide, an 8% increase over the prior year. This included nearly 11,000 pounds of [26:26] fentanyl and more than 186,000 pounds of methamphetamines. This is what having a secure border looks like. [26:33] None of this would have been possible, though, without the vision and leadership of President Trump [26:37] and the historic investments made in border security. The one big beautiful bill, a $65 billion investment, [26:44] is enabling CBP to modernize border infrastructure, deploy additional advanced technology, and to grow our [26:50] workforce. Since January 2025, CBP is building smart wall at record levels. We're installing high-tech [26:57] attributes where the Biden administration had shut it off. We're installing water barriers along the [27:02] Rio Grande River, which denies criminals access to these routes. But that is not all. We're investing [27:08] in technology at our ports of entry, non-intrusive inspection equipment, biometrics, and advanced [27:13] surveillance to improve our ability to know what's coming into this country, the land, air, and sea, [27:19] at and between the ports of entry. CBP's workforce is without a doubt the greatest asset that we have. [27:25] The one big beautiful bill is investing historic amounts of money in recruitment, hiring, and retention, [27:31] and training to ensure that we have the most highly qualified and capable law enforcement [27:36] professionals securing our border. Due to the collaboration across all federal departments, [27:41] the resultant wrecked low encounters, CBP has been able to surge resources to support ICE's [27:46] targeted enforcement operations across the nation. CBP has integrated with ICE and other partners to [27:52] identify and remove dangerous criminals and others who remain in the country illegally. As recent events [27:58] have demonstrated, though, our officers and agents are increasingly facing an unprecedented level of [28:03] aggressive interference and intimidation when executing the laws that you have asked them to enforce. [28:09] These attacks on federal law enforcement personnel are coordinated and well-funded. [28:13] This is not peaceful protest. No law enforcement officer should be put at personal risk simply for [28:19] doing the job that we have asked them to do. I thank you for your continued support of CBP's mission, [28:24] and I look forward to answering your questions today. Thank you, Commissioner. I now recognize [28:29] Director Ed Lowe for five minutes to summarize his opening statement. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Chairman Garbarino, [28:36] Ranking Member Thompson, and members of the committee, it is an honor to speak to you about the priorities and [28:42] progress of U.S. citizenship and immigration services. I'm grateful for your partnership as we work [28:47] together to uphold the rule of law, protect our citizens, and safeguard our homeland. Let me begin [28:53] by expressing my appreciation to President Trump for his trust in me and to Secretary Nome for her [28:58] leadership at the Department of Homeland Security. I'm proud to serve alongside a workforce that's deeply [29:03] committed to advancing the president's agenda, protecting our communities, and restoring integrity to [29:09] America's legal immigration system. As Director of U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services, my vision [29:15] has been straightforward and clear. Restore accountability to our immigration system and ensure that it [29:20] serves the interests of the American people first and foremost. Today, I want to highlight some of our [29:26] most significant accomplishments. Ending the exploitation of immigration programs, putting American [29:31] workers first, protecting our communities from public safety threats, protecting national security, and combating [29:38] immigration fraud. Fraud isn't just a paperwork issue. It's a national security and public safety concern. [29:46] Often those who wish to do us harm exploit weaknesses in our system. Over the past year, USCIS has made [29:52] nearly 33,000 fraud referrals to law enforcement, a 138% increase over previous years. We conducted thousands [30:01] of site visits to homes and workplaces and thousands of social media checks to ensure aliens aren't espousing [30:07] anti-American sentiment. Moreover, our fraud detection and national security team completed over 21,000 [30:14] investigations identifying fraud in approximately 65 percent of those cases. In Operation Twin Shield in [30:22] Minneapolis-St. Paul back in the fall, we uncovered marriage fraud, visa misuse, and student visa abuses, [30:28] leading to denials of immigration benefits, arrests, and removal proceedings. This work led to Operation [30:35] Paris, where we continue reexamining thousands of refugee cases in Minnesota, conducting thorough [30:41] background checks and in-person reviews. We've also strengthened our vetting policies. If someone [30:47] falsely claims U.S. citizenship to get a public benefit or try to vote, we hold them accountable [30:53] through denial of citizenship or loss of immigration status. We've tightened screening to determine whether [30:58] claimed marriages and family relationships are legitimate. And we've changed regulations to employ [31:03] authorization — excuse me — to employment authorization is no longer automatically extended. Now we require [31:10] more frequent renewals so that we can vet aliens more frequently and ensure that they deserve to remain [31:16] in the country. Additionally, we've taken action to end the exploitation of immigration programs. Mass [31:22] humanitarian parole programs were being abused by the prior administration. So we've restored them to [31:28] Congress's original intent, allowing those benefits on a case-by-case basis. Secretary Noem also ended decades of [31:36] temporary protected status for several countries, returning the program to what Congress intended — temporary [31:41] protection, not permanent status in the United States. Moreover, this administration is doing more to [31:48] ensure the integrity of our elections. We enhanced the SAVE program so states can verify citizenship of those on their [31:55] voter roles more effectively. Since January 2025, we've processed over 58 million queries, and 27 states are [32:03] participating. Additionally, federal agencies ran nearly 206 million SAVE queries last year to identify fraud [32:11] and preserve public assistance benefits for lawful U.S. residents and citizens. We've also — we're also [32:17] putting American taxpayers and communities and workers first. We affirmed that aliens should be self-reliant, [32:23] not dependent on public assistance, and that their sponsors are liable for the cost of public benefits [32:29] that they access. The Department of Homeland Security is also working to rescind the 2022 public charge [32:36] rule, restoring our discretion to determine if an alien will rely on government assistance. We've proposed [32:42] protecting American jobs by prioritizing H-1B visas for higher-skilled, higher-paid workers, so that companies can't use [32:49] those visas merely as a way to get cheaper, non-citizen labor. We've also streamlined agricultural visa [32:57] processing to better support American farmers. A major milestone was implementing the One Big Beautiful Bill, [33:03] which added new fees for certain immigration processes. USCIS collects those fees, but only [33:09] retains a small amount of the money, while the rest goes to other agencies and deficit reduction. [33:15] Finally, protecting the American people is at the heart of everything we do. After the attack on two brave [33:20] service members of the National Guard last November, Secretary Noem directed us to review immigration [33:25] benefits for aliens from high-risk countries. In closing, U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services [33:33] is restoring integrity, accountability, and security to America's legal immigration system. [33:39] These accomplishments reflect the dedication of our workforce and the transformative leadership [33:43] of President Trump and Secretary Noem, both of whom have allowed USCIS to do the job it was created [33:49] by Congress to do. We stand ready to continue working with Congress to protect the homeland and uphold [33:54] the rule of law. Thank you, and I look forward to your questions. Thank you, Director Udlow. I now [33:59] recognize Acting Director Lyons for five minutes to summarize his opening statement. Good morning. [34:05] Chairman Gabarino, Ranked Member Thompson, distinguished members of the committee, [34:09] thank you for the invitation to discuss the critical work U.S. Immigration and Customs is doing every day to carry out [34:15] President Trump's agenda to keep America safe, restore order to our communities, and return law [34:22] return the rule of law to this country. Under the leadership of President Trump and DHS Secretary [34:27] Kristi Noem, the men and women of ICE have been empowered to do exactly what they're trying to do, [34:32] arrest and remove illegal aliens and criminals from our communities. We are enhancing public safety, [34:37] securing our national security, and finally restoring integrity to the immigration system [34:42] that have been allowed to collapse. We have supercharged our partnerships with state and [34:46] local law enforcement, empowering officers around the country through the 287 program [34:51] to help ICE identify and remove criminal aliens. Those partnerships have increased more than 900 [34:57] percent since President Trump took office, and our communities are safer for it. I am also proud of [35:02] our agency's unprecedented hiring campaign that led to hiring of more than 12,000 officers and special [35:07] agents in less than a year, and more than 222,000 individuals submitted applications. This expansion of [35:15] our well-trained and well-vetted workforce will help further ICE's abilities to execute President's [35:20] and Secretary's bold agenda. Before discussing our broader operations, I must address the situation in [35:27] Minnesota and the dangers that ICE agents and officers face nationwide. While the investigations [35:33] remain ongoing, I'm encouraged that some Minnesota officials are finally signaling the willingness to [35:38] cooperate with ICE. But let me be clear, promises are not enough. We need action. In the wake of the [35:44] unprecedented border crisis of the previous administration, ICE has stepped into the breach [35:49] to enforce the law. This commitment has a cost. We are facing the deadliest operating environment in our [35:55] agency's history. In fiscal year 2025, death threats against ICE personnel increased more than 8,000 percent. [36:02] Assaults on officers have skyrocketed over 1,400 percent. One officer in Minnesota had his finger [36:08] bitten off by a protester, egged on by elected officials, characterizing our offices as the [36:13] Gestapo of secret police. The families of ICE personnel have been made to feel unsafe in their homes. [36:20] I know this firsthand because my own family was targeted. But let me send a message to anyone who [36:27] thinks they can intimidate us. You will fail. Despite these perils, our officers continue to execute their [36:33] mission with unwavering resolve, and we are only getting started. ICE remains committed to the [36:38] fundamental principles that those who illegally enter our country must be held accountable. [36:42] Since the beginning of the second Trump administration, we have achieved historic results. [36:47] From January 20, 2025 through January 20, 2026, ICE has conducted nearly 379,000 arrests. Among those [36:56] arrests were more than 7,000 suspected gang members and over 1,400 known as suspected terrorists. [37:02] The president tasked us with mass deportation, and we are fulfilling that mandate. Thanks to the resources [37:08] provided by this Congress, we are ramping up detention capacities and removal flights daily. [37:13] In the last year alone, we conducted over 475,000 removals. It's a brutal reality that criminal [37:20] immigration today is organized by sophisticated, ruthless, transnational criminal organizations. [37:25] These include cartels and transnational gangs. President Trump has rightly designated at [37:31] foreign terrorist organizations. The only way to defeat them is to destroy their revenue. Within [37:37] Homeland Security investigations, our special agents are delivering critical outcomes in the fight [37:41] against transnational crime. We are seizing fentanyl before it kills our children and dismantling [37:46] the networks that poison our communities. In FY25 alone, we seized more than 2.5 million pounds of [37:53] narcotics, a 50 percent increase from the previous year, and a critical blow to transnational [37:58] organization groups everywhere. HSI criminal arrests are at the highest point in history. However, [38:03] our approach is just not about enforcement. It is about restoring order and dignity to human beings [38:09] sold alive by smugglers and exploited by these TCOs. In August 2024, the DHS officer inspector [38:16] general released a report that concluded that more than 291,000 unaccompanied alien children out of [38:24] nearly 450,000 transferred from DHS to HHS custody were simply lost by the system. We are talking about [38:31] children exploited in factories, abused in sexual trades, and living as indentured servants on American [38:38] solar. HSI is leading the charge to find them. We have conducted more than 71,000 field engagements [38:44] to locate children, verify sponsored legitimacy, and uncover criminal activity related to exploitation. [38:51] Since February 2025, ICE has arrested more than 500 criminal sponsors of these offenses, including [38:57] sexual exploitation and forced labor, dismantled more than 2,400 human smuggling operations, [39:03] and along with our federal partners, located more than 145,000 children. [39:08] To further ensure TCOs can never threat our nation again, President Trump dedicated [39:14] the establishment of the Homeland Security Task Force. The Homeland Security Task Forces represent the [39:19] most aggressive and coordinated attack on TCOs in history. Through Cross-Border Financial Crime Center, [39:26] we have developed and inflated a strategy to combat rampant fraud, including government programs in [39:31] Minnesota and across the country. Using this strategy, HSI has opened numerous criminal [39:35] investigations into the complex fraud systems that have resulted in the thefts of billions. [39:41] Much of the fight ICE faces continue to be fueled by so-called sanctuary cities. These jurisdictions [39:50] provided a shield for criminal aliens when a local jail refuses to honor ICE attainer and [39:55] releases that predator back into the community. ICE exists to enforce America's long-standing [40:02] immigration and custom laws. These laws are grounded in common sense, national sovereignty, and simple [40:07] morality. Our office as an agent enforce these without hesitation, without apology. I ask that all [40:14] the members of the community treat them with profound respect that they have earned. Thank you. [40:18] Thank you, Acting Director Lyons. Members will be recognized by order of seniority for their five [40:24] minutes of questioning. As we have when Secretary Noem was here, we're going to limit it to the five-minute rule. [40:32] I'm going to be strict on that for both sides, so do not be surprised. If you go over, I gavel you down. [40:37] I now recognize myself for five minutes of questions. Acting Director Lyons, I understand that you cannot [40:45] discuss the details of the two recent shootings in Minnesota because they are subject of several [40:49] investigations, including by the FBI, the Department of Homeland Security, and the DOJ Civil Rights Division. [40:57] Once concluded, will you commit to providing the reports and findings of each investigation to this [41:02] committee? Yes, Mr. Chairman, we're fully committed to give you the full and unabridged investigation [41:08] and the outcome. Thank you. Commissioner Scott, can the committee have the same commitment from you? [41:12] Yes, sir. Thank you both. Commissioner Scott and Acting Director Lyons, following this hearing and [41:19] writing, I'd like to know what is the standard operating procedure for each of your agencies for an [41:24] investigation when deadly force is used? Currently, Acting Director Lyons, are those procedures being [41:32] followed for the two uses of deadly force in Minneapolis this past January? Yes, Mr. Chairman. [41:39] Were those, and Mr. Commissioner Scott? Yes, sir, they are. Were the standard procedures [41:45] followed from the beginning? Mr. Lyons? Yes, sir, they were. Mr. Scott? Yes, for CBP, they were as well. [41:50] Thank you very much. We're all obviously concerned about officer safety and have seen and heard about [41:59] increasing threats and assaults against law enforcement. Director Lyons, are your officers trained [42:06] regarding the difference between a protected protest and what is unlawfully impeding law enforcement? [42:13] Yes, sir. Deportation officers and special agents are taught at the federal law enforcement training [42:18] center. They are taught in defensive tactics, personal safety, but as well as laws to include [42:25] first, second, fourth, fifth, 10th, 14th amendment. The officers are trained before they go out into the [42:31] field and then while they're in the field. They are specialized training with disturbance control and other [42:35] special tactics. Commissioner Scott, are your officers similarly trained? Yes, they are. [42:40] FLETC, ongoing training in the field, and then anytime we're deploying them to the interior, [42:45] they get updated law refresher training to include first amendment and fourth amendment. [42:50] So I want to focus on the training here because with the historic investment in both ICE and CBP, [42:58] there was a surge in hiring. I need to know, for these new hires, is the training different [43:04] different than what other agents and officers received before the hiring surge? Mr. Lyons, [43:11] I'll let you start there. No, sir, it's not. The training was never, the meat of the training [43:16] was never removed. The timeline was. We took training from five days a week, eight hours a day, [43:22] to six days a week, 12 hours a day. In addition to that, training is different in the fact that before [43:28] officers even go to the federal law enforcement training academy, there's pre-employment training, [43:32] which we never had before. And on top of that, we've adapted our on-the-job training program, [43:37] which is much like a city or state field training officer program, that once they are removed from [43:44] the federal law enforcement training academy, have graduated, before they return to their field [43:47] officers, they're assigned a field training officer, and that's continued on after that. So let me get [43:52] to this. For ICE officers, the curriculum has stayed the same, but it's now a quicker training, [43:58] the timeline has moved up? That's correct, sir. Okay, but the curriculum is the same? Yes, sir. [44:04] All right. Commissioner Scott, can you talk about if there's been a change in training since [44:10] the hiring surge? There's been no change in the training within Customs and Border Protection. [44:15] Border Patrol agents go through 117-day academy. The CVP officers go through 103-day academy. That's [44:21] actually training days. There's been no changes to that. So the only change that has been made is in [44:25] our quarterly training. We've added scenarios based on what we most likely think they will encounter in [44:31] the field. So we've encountered some of, we've actually added some of the protest type encounters [44:36] as well. So there's been no change in the timeline either? It's similar. ICE did that. You did not? [44:42] No, we did not. Okay. And while this is another thing, well, because I'm, this is my last question, [44:48] I'm sure. While understanding they are not suitable for every occasions, every occasion, there's been a lot of [44:53] talk about the use of deadly force. Are agents and officers equipped with and trained in the use of [45:01] tasers or other less lethal alternatives to avoid the use of deadly force? And Mr. Director Lyons, [45:08] I'll start with you and then Mr. Scott, you can finish. Yes, sir. Every deportation officer special [45:11] agent are trained in secondary weapons, which include the taser, OC spray, and baton. [45:17] And those are made available. And they're equipped. Yes, sir. Mr. Scott. It's a similar answer that all [45:24] of our agents have to carry a secondary weapon. They trained at the academy and then they go through [45:28] quarterly refresher training every three months. Okay. I appreciate it. I will have, I'm sure, [45:34] for some follow-up questions today. And I will submit those to you in writing. But with that, [45:41] I yield back and I now recognize the ranking member for five minutes of questions. Thank you very much, [45:46] Mr. Chairman. Mr. Lawrence, how many ICE agents have cameras as of today? Sir, as of today, more than [45:55] 3,000 ICE officers have cameras that are active in the field with another 6,000 being deployed, sir. [46:02] So how many in the field? How many ICE agents are in the field as of today? Oh, I'm sorry, sir. [46:10] Agents in the field today? You said agents in the field. I'm just trying to get the number of ICE [46:15] agents who have cameras on their body as of today. Approximately 3,000, sir. 3,000 out of how many? [46:24] Out of 13, approximately 13,000, sir, that are in the field. So you have 3,000 out of 13,000 who have [46:32] cameras? Yes, sir. Mr. Scott. I don't have the actual number in front of me right now. It's about [46:37] 10,000. We're building that program out as we speak. 10,000 out of how many? Out of about 67,000. [46:46] But the ports of entry, we have significant video. I don't want to go to ports of entry. [46:52] I just want to know how many cameras right now do you have on your agents? When you say agents, [47:00] Border Patrol agents, there's about 10,000. 10,000 out of how many? Out of 20,000 Border Patrol agents. [47:09] So half of them? Approximately, yes. So I'll give you a chance to look at that, [47:14] since you said approximately, and get back to the committee on what's the accurate number. Not how [47:19] many you're purchasing. How many as of this day? Understood, and I will get you that number. [47:24] Thank you. Uh, Mr. Lyons, what's the regular timetable of training in ICE agent? Sorry about [47:38] that, sir. Right now, the training is approximately 47 days at the Federal Law Enforcement Academy. [47:44] Overall training is about three months, sir. So you went from three months to 47 days? No, no, [47:51] sir. The whole total training to include the pre-employment training and then the OJT program [47:56] is three months, and 47 days in the Federal Law Enforcement Training Academy. So they go to Flexi [48:04] for 47 days or for three months? No, sir. You asked for the total training time. The total [48:10] training time now is a combined three months, sir, with 47 days at the Federal Law Enforcement Training [48:15] Academy. So you didn't reduce the timeline for any of the ICE agents to come on board? We reduced the [48:22] timeline for the previous certified Federal Law Enforcement officers or special agents, where we [48:29] went to the ones who are already trained in firearms and defensive tactics and criminal procedure. We [48:37] adapted to a shorter program so they would just have the extensive Immigration Nationality Act training, [48:43] immigration law, and ICE-specific training. So if you hired somebody for ICE today, [48:49] how much training would they receive before they become a full-time agent? So for a person off the [48:56] street who has never been a law enforcement officer, they're looking at approximately three months of [49:00] training, sir. And the 47 days is for who? That is for everyone that hasn't, uh, who's never worked [49:08] for ICE, sir. So you could have someone that's a Capitol Police officer. They would not have to go through [49:15] extended training for when it comes to defensive tactics, firearms, etc. They would have to go to the [49:21] rigorous immigration training, which, unfortunately, immigration law is just as confusing and long as [49:26] tax code, which we have to ensure that we devote that extensive time to. Thank you so much. But [49:31] Yes, sir. Would you provide the committee, uh, with the timeline? Yes, sir. We will provide you. Some [49:40] of us understand it's 47 days. Yes, sir. We will provide you. But you're telling us it's three months. From the [49:46] beginning, sir, when they go ahead and come on pre-employment training to the OJT program afterwards. But we will [49:51] provide the committee with a full breakdown. Okay. Uh, for Mr. Lyons and Mr. Scott, over the past [49:57] several weeks, the president has made a series of comments regarding the midterm election. Uh, [50:05] the president has urged my Republican colleagues in Congress to nationalize elections. Now, are you [50:13] involved in any planning on guarding precincts in this country as of today? Mr. Scott? No, sir. Mr. Lyons? No, [50:25] sir. So there's no information. You've not been asked to start deploying people for areas anywhere? [50:33] No, sir. Well, thank you very much. Uh, Mr. Lyons, uh, I'll, I'll get it in right, Mr. [50:41] Chairman. I'm going to follow your, your directions on that. Uh, gentleman yields back. Thank you, [50:49] uh, ranking member. Uh, I now recognize the gentleman from Texas, Mr. McCall, for five minutes of questions. [50:55] Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Uh, uh, you know, a decade ago when I chaired this committee, Mr. Thompson [51:01] and I passed a bill to authorize ICE into law. It was a bipartisan effort. It passed the House [51:10] overwhelmingly, both Republican and Democrat. A decade later, here we are. The Don's have called to [51:19] abolish ICE. Now they're trying to shut it down. So what has happened in that 10 years? Let's go back to [51:28] the last five, four to five years. What happened in this country and at the border as a, uh, someone [51:37] who lives in the border state of Texas, we saw the most dangerous wide open border that I've seen in [51:44] my 22 years in Congress, 10 to 12 million people. And that's what we know about. I think it's far greater [51:51] came into this country. Many of them dangerous, violent criminals, some known or suspected terrorists, [51:59] which I find extremely dangerous. That's why I served as an impeachment manager for Mayorkas because [52:08] he violated federal law. The federal statute says, as a former federal prosecutor, I know this, [52:14] shall detain aggravated felons. What did Mayorkas do? He told his agents, that's discretionary. [52:21] You can release them. As a result, we had tens of thousands of aggravated felons [52:30] left on the streets of America to roam freely, not to to mention the human and sex trafficking of [52:39] children. Mr. Lyons, as you pointed out. So what is the administration trying to do? They're trying to [52:44] remove a public safety threat from the United States of America. That is their job. Restoring public safety [52:52] should be the number one priority. And one of the problems here, as I examine it, [52:57] is that Minnesota, Minneapolis in particular, is a sanctuary city. What does that mean? That means [53:03] that it's a magnet for illegal. They're protected under the current situation because state and locals [53:09] will not cooperate with federal law enforcement. In fact, Mr. Lyons, is it not true that they were not [53:16] honoring ICE detainers that were put on dangerous felons in prison so that you could remove them [53:23] from the United States? That is correct, sir. The detainers were not honored at the local level [53:29] in Minneapolis. This is the number one violation. In addition, the rhetoric on the left led to over a [53:36] thousand percent increase in assaults on ICE officers, an increase of over 8,000 death threats to them. [53:48] All this created a perfect storm for our officers being thrown into this situation. [53:54] And then agent Bovino came into the picture. And I would argue in fairness that he escalated the [54:01] situation by the way that was handled. Your officers are not trained to effectuate crowd control. [54:11] They are trained to move in surgically, go in and remove these dangerous, [54:16] violent criminals from the United States of America. I've called for de-escalation after the two [54:23] deaths, the two shootings that took place. I believe that these roving patrols should be done at the [54:29] border rather than in the major cities of the United States. So when the president decided to remove agent Bovino [54:40] and put in Tom Homan, who I've known for years, a consummate professional, law enforcement [54:46] professional, I commended the president. And what has been done since Mr. Homan came into the job? [54:53] We now have targeted law enforcement operations. He is returning to the original mission of ICE. [55:02] He is working with state and locals to do the crowd control. He is getting them to honor the ICE detainers. [55:09] He is also getting the body cameras put on them. And the roving patrols, in his words to me, [55:18] should be done at the border, not in major cities. My question to you, Mr. Lyons, is Mr. Homan now, [55:24] are his operations in Minneapolis now bringing the situation under control? [55:32] Sir, we've seen a de-escalation in the fact that the protests, while they still go on, have subsided. [55:39] And ICE has been allowed to do their targeted, intelligence-driven enforcement operation. [55:43] Just the other night, local authorities arrested 54 protesters at the local level, where ICE [55:49] officers did not have to be engaged in that. My final question to you, do you believe the [55:53] model that Mr. Homan is now setting in Minneapolis should be a model for the nation? The gentleman's [55:58] time is expired. I understand that. I'd like it on the record an answer, Mr. Chairman. [56:04] Do you agree that Mr. Homan's model is one for the nation? The gentleman's time is expired. [56:09] Yes or no? [56:09] I now recognize the gentleman from California, Mr. Swalwell, for five minutes. [56:14] A couple nights ago, I met with a woman who works as a cashier at a grocery store, [56:20] and I told her I was coming to see you, Mr. Lyons. And she said, [56:24] will you ask him? And she didn't want to give her name. She was terrified to give her name. [56:28] But she said, when I get off my shift around midnight and I walk through the parking lot to my car, [56:34] she said, if somebody rolls up in an unidentified van and gets out wearing all black and their face [56:42] is covered, and they don't have any identification, and they asked me to get into the van, how do I [56:48] know who they are? How does she know, Mr. Lyons? How does she know if they're an ICE agent or bad guys? [56:58] Sir, ICE agents have identifiable placards on their uniforms as well as their badges representative, [57:05] but you won't see ICE agents rolling through the parking lots and just snatching someone up. [57:09] ICE does intelligence-driven, targeted enforcement operations. [57:13] Well, Mr. Homan and others have said that they target individuals based on the color of their skin [57:18] and the accents that they speak, and that's why people are running through the fields and factories [57:22] where they work. Director Lyons, last year you said in Phoenix at the Border Security Expo that you [57:27] wanted to see a deportation process that was like, quote, Amazon Prime, but with human beings. [57:34] Mr. Lyons, how many times has Amazon Prime shot a mom three times in the face? [57:40] None, sir, but you're also- [57:42] It's the square root of zero, that's right. [57:43] Yes, sir. But if we're going to go down that route of my comment, I did say that comment. [57:47] However, that comment was taken out. If you go back and watch the video, [57:51] I did say that we need to be more efficient when it comes to removing individuals from the United [57:56] States because ICE doesn't detain punitively. We detain to remove. I don't want to see people in [58:01] custody. At the end of my statement was, and again, to your point, it was an industry day for AI and [58:09] efficiencies, but I did say at the end of it, but we deal with human beings, so we can't be like them. [58:14] That's the key part that you're leaving out. [58:16] Well, speaking of human beings, how many times has Amazon Prime shot a nurse 10 times in the back? [58:21] None. [58:22] How many times has Amazon Prime dragged a woman out of a car by her hair and then dragged her down the [58:27] street? None. [58:29] How many ICE agents have been fired for their conduct under your leadership? [58:33] Sir, I can get you that data. I'll get that back to you. [58:37] Is it more than one? [58:37] I'm not going to speak about personnel actions, but I'll get you that data. [58:42] Can you tell us if at least, God, I hope at least one person has been fired [58:46] for their conduct since these operations have begun. Are you telling us you can't even say [58:50] one person's been fired? [58:51] Sir, I'm not going to talk about personnel actions, but we will get back to you. [58:54] But two people have been killed so far. Is that right? [58:56] A nurse named Freddy and a mom named Good. Two people have been killed so far. [59:02] Yes, sir. [59:02] Mr. Lyons, will you apologize to the family of Renee Good for being called a domestic terrorist by [59:11] the president and his leadership? No, sir. Why not? [59:16] Sir, I welcome the opportunity to speak to the family in private, [59:19] but I'm not going to comment on any active investigation. [59:21] Is she a domestic terrorist? [59:24] Sir, I'm not going to comment on the investigation, and the president and [59:29] Secretary Noem are elected officials. That's your right to their comments. [59:32] But as law enforcement, career law enforcement, we won't speak to any. [59:35] Do you agree with their comments? [59:37] Sir, I'm not going to go ahead and talk about any ongoing investigation. [59:40] Will you apologize to the family of Alex Preddy for also being called a domestic terrorist? [59:45] Sir, again, I'm not going to speak to any ongoing investigation. [59:49] Mr. Lyons, you're staying to lead ICE is a decision. [59:55] Sir, I'm sorry, could you repeat? [59:56] You're staying on to lead ICE is a decision, and I've read your background. [1:00:00] You have a decorated career. You've served in the military. [1:00:05] You are what I would call otherwise employable. [1:00:08] I think most people would agree this is not the only job that you can get. [1:00:14] But since you've been on this job, women have been dragged by their hair through our streets, [1:00:20] a six-year-old child battling stage four cancer has been deported. [1:00:24] And it turns out he was a U.S. citizen. [1:00:27] People are running through the fields where they work. [1:00:31] People who've gone to the streets as allies have been shot and publicly executed. [1:00:38] It's a decision to stay on at this point. [1:00:41] And considering your honorable service in the past and the dishonorable acts [1:00:47] that those who have worked for you have conducted, [1:00:50] and the disgraceful statements that the leadership above you have said, [1:00:54] you now have a decision. [1:00:57] Will you stand with the kids who you're supposed to protect, [1:01:01] or will you side with the killers bringing terror to our streets? [1:01:06] Mr. Lyons, will you resign from ICE? [1:01:09] No, sir, I won't. [1:01:10] Why not? [1:01:11] Because, sir, that child that you're showing right there, [1:01:13] the men and women of ICE took care of him when his father abandoned him and ran from law enforcement. [1:01:17] Time has expired. [1:01:18] You never should have gone into custody. [1:01:19] Gentlemen, time has expired. [1:01:20] I recognize the gentleman from Mississippi. [1:01:21] You're back. [1:01:22] Mr. Guesser, five minutes. [1:01:24] Thank you, Mr. Chairman. [1:01:25] Mr. Chairman, we stand on the verge of a second Democrat shutdown [1:01:30] of the United States Department of Homeland Security just within the last 90 days. [1:01:35] The Department of Homeland Security employs 260,000 men and women across 22 different agencies. [1:01:45] Those agencies include 63,000 men and women who work for CBP, 60,000 who work for TSA, 22,000 for FEMA, [1:01:55] 18,000 who works for USCIS, almost 50,000 civilian and military employees with the United States Coast Guard, [1:02:05] 7,800 Secret Service employees, 2,500 CISA employees, and over 8,000 agents and analysts [1:02:14] with the Department of Homeland Security investigation who perform a crucial function, [1:02:21] a crucial function to protect and serve this country. [1:02:27] This second government shutdown led by my friends on the Democrats side of the aisle [1:02:35] will leave our country less safe. [1:02:38] Don't just take my word for it. [1:02:40] Let's look at the words of the Biden administration. [1:02:43] President Biden and Kamala Harris, Department of Homeland Security, in September of 2023, [1:02:51] as the nation faced a potential government shutdown, they issued a fact sheet. [1:02:57] That fact sheet is entitled The Impact of Government Shutdown on the DHS Workforce. [1:03:04] This fact sheet says this. [1:03:08] It says DHS workforce is comprised of extraordinary public servants who safeguard this nation. [1:03:17] It goes on to say any lapse in federal funding would disrupt this vital work, [1:03:21] leaving Americans less safe as a result. [1:03:26] Those working without pay include law enforcement, [1:03:29] conducting such acts as seizing illegal narcotics like fentanyl, [1:03:34] combating child exploitation and child predators, [1:03:37] identifying and arresting human trafficking, responding to natural disasters, [1:03:43] preventing cyber attacks and protecting U.S. government leaders. [1:03:50] And so I ask you, gentlemen, as we are once again on the verge of a shutdown of the Department of Homeland Security, [1:04:00] if the Democrats take us to the edge, if they refuse to sign a CR, [1:04:04] if once again the men and women who serve under your leadership, if they are once again not paid, [1:04:11] I ask you, how will that impact our nation? [1:04:15] Will America be more safe or will America be less safe [1:04:20] if we are once again led into a government shutdown by the Democrat Party? [1:04:26] Mr. Scott. [1:04:27] I believe consistency and seeing support from the leadership of on both sides of this building [1:04:36] and the president is very important to border security. [1:04:39] I think the rhetoric and the back and forth, the politicizing of law enforcement in general [1:04:45] detracts from the general morale of our personnel. [1:04:48] Is it not important that we pay the men and women who serve under your command? [1:04:53] It's critically important. [1:04:54] And in a government shutdown, the bills don't stop, do they not? [1:04:56] The bills continue to accrue. [1:04:59] Correct. [1:05:00] And the deployment of technology ceases in many cases and America becomes less safe. [1:05:08] Would you agree with that statement? [1:05:10] I would agree America becomes less safe. [1:05:11] Mr. Edler, what about you? [1:05:14] Congressman, as I'm sure you're aware, USCIS is a little different in that we are fee funded. [1:05:18] So during a shutdown, the men and women working for USCIS will continue to be paid. [1:05:25] However, in terms of our screening and vetting enterprises, as well as everything else we do, [1:05:30] we have formed very, very strong working relationships with the other components, [1:05:37] and that's critical for us to be able to do our work. [1:05:40] While we may be there able to continue without our partners being paid and with them being furloughed, [1:05:46] it's going to make America significantly less safe. [1:05:49] And Mr. Lyons. [1:05:52] Yes, sir. [1:05:52] It will have a great impact, especially on the Homeland Security Task Forces [1:05:56] and the men and women that are focused on the transnational crime and foreign terrorist organization. [1:06:00] Mr. Lyons, very quickly, we've had many members of this committee who have made allegations. [1:06:06] The Democrats have once again taken the mantle of the party to defund the police and abolish ICE. [1:06:12] Do you wish to take the last few seconds to speak about the consequences [1:06:16] that has on the men and women that you serve? [1:06:18] The men and women of ICE have sworn law enforcement offices [1:06:21] who are dedicated to do their mission to protect the United States. [1:06:26] Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I yield back. [1:06:28] The gentleman yields back. [1:06:28] I now recognize a gentleman from California. [1:06:30] Mr. Correa, five minutes of questions. [1:06:32] Thank you, Mr. Chairman. [1:06:33] I want to welcome our witnesses today. [1:06:38] Gentlemen, I wanted to start out by talking a little bit about my district, [1:06:42] Southern California, Disneyland. [1:06:45] Southern California is the center of manufacturing for the United States. [1:06:50] California, biggest act state union. California also, big donor taxpayer dollars to the United States. [1:07:03] President Trump got elected on the promise to deport the worst of the worst. [1:07:10] Your numbers, Mr. Lyons, less than 14 percent of those arrested by ICE first year, 2025, [1:07:18] had charges or convictions of violent violence. [1:07:23] Seventy percent of those deported had not even a traffic ticket. [1:07:28] Mr. Lyons, I think we're all patriots. [1:07:32] But I'm trying to figure out how this is a question to you, sir. [1:07:36] How deporting a nanny makes our nation safer, stronger? [1:07:40] How trying to deport the father of three Marines make this country stronger? [1:07:46] How deporting the parents of a number of Marines at Camp Pendleton makes this nation stronger? [1:07:55] Sir, thank you for your welcome, first off. [1:07:56] Just to address the numbers with the 14 percent, sir, [1:08:00] that's 14 percent that are listed as violent criminal felonies. [1:08:05] However, what's left out of that is the fact that what's left off that list- [1:08:08] Those 70 percent, they don't have a traffic ticket and deported. [1:08:12] How has that made our nation stronger? [1:08:15] Sir, if you look at what ICE has done, more than 60 percent of every individual that is in ICE custody [1:08:21] has a pending or a conviction or a criminal charge. [1:08:23] Not to counsel- [1:08:24] Sir, let me move ahead. I only have three minutes and we'll talk later. [1:08:28] Let's talk about American citizens. Again, back home. [1:08:34] People, young people asking me, what do I have to carry with me so I won't be deported? [1:08:41] Is Mr. Lyons carrying a passport, is that enough so they won't be detained or deported in my district? [1:08:48] Sir, an American citizen shouldn't carry or shouldn't feel the need to carry- [1:08:52] Let me tell you what some of your ICE agents have done. [1:08:54] They pulled over a gentleman in a pickup truck, showed his passport, [1:08:58] they threw it to the side, detained him. [1:09:02] What do we have to do to show that we're American citizens? [1:09:06] Sir, no American citizen falls onto Title 8. [1:09:08] No American citizen will be arrested for being American citizens. [1:09:10] But you just said to my colleague that nobody has been fired because of violations of the law [1:09:17] for disciplinary actions, yet this is happening in my district. [1:09:22] Mr. Lyons, we're a very boring district. [1:09:25] We work hard, mind our own business. [1:09:28] Ice in our streets now. [1:09:29] People are terrorized. [1:09:31] American citizens. [1:09:33] Number of cases of Americans being detained, [1:09:36] being taken in, some being held for five days. [1:09:41] Sir, what do we do with those people in that situation? [1:09:45] What do we tell them? [1:09:48] Sir, I don't know of any particular case that you're speaking of American citizen being- [1:09:52] I'm more than happy to provide you a list, sir. [1:09:54] 100 percent, sir. [1:09:56] So, let me ask you, sir, are you surveilling U.S. citizens today? [1:10:02] No, sir. [1:10:05] Those people protesting, practicing this First Amendment right, [1:10:08] photos of them, data taken, they're not being placed in any kind of a database? [1:10:15] There is no database for protesters, sir. [1:10:17] One of your officers in Maine said to one of the individuals protesting, [1:10:22] we're going to put your face in a little database. [1:10:25] What does that mean? [1:10:26] Do you have a little database? [1:10:27] No, sir. [1:10:27] Of Americans? [1:10:29] No, sir, we don't. [1:10:29] Then what do you think your ICE agent was doing to this individual when he said those statements? [1:10:34] I can't speak for that individual, sir, but I can assure you there is no database that's [1:10:37] tracking genocide citizens. [1:10:39] Sir, California, we're a sanctuary state. [1:10:44] Does that cause you a problem picking up individuals? [1:10:47] Yes, sir. [1:10:50] I have with me today some data from Sheriff Barnes, Orange County Sheriff, [1:10:55] very good friend. [1:10:56] He's been here to testify numerous times. [1:10:59] For 2025, he referred about 300 individuals for your office to pick up. [1:11:08] 250 were picked up, 50 were never picked up. [1:11:11] We had a long conversation saying, what is going on? [1:11:14] If these are the worst of the worst, you've called ICE to pick them up and you didn't pick them up. [1:11:19] Can you explain to us why you didn't pick up all these individuals that were referred to [1:11:23] your office to pick up? [1:11:25] Yes, sir. [1:11:25] That's the key part of that is the referral. [1:11:28] We make sure that those individuals are eligible to be placed in detention and for movability. [1:11:33] You never even looked at those individuals. [1:11:36] I would like to talk to you about this issue later on, Mr. Lyons. [1:11:39] Thank you very much. [1:11:40] Time has expired. [1:11:41] I now encourage the gentleman from Texas, Mr. Pflueger, for five minutes of questions. [1:11:44] Thank you, Mr. Chairman. [1:11:46] Why are we here? [1:11:48] And I think it's pretty clear that until proven otherwise, at five years of experience, that [1:11:54] it seems like one side of the aisle is in favor of open borders and wants to abolish ICE. [1:12:02] And I hope that that can be proven wrong. [1:12:05] And the other side of the aisle wants to enforce the laws that are on the books. [1:12:11] Commissioner Scott, how many administrations have you worked for in your career? [1:12:16] Since the Clinton administration? [1:12:18] So multiple Republicans, multiple Democrats. [1:12:20] Correct. [1:12:21] Is it a crime to enter this country illegally and to skip a notice to appear, [1:12:25] to skip a court-ordered appearance and to not comply with the laws that are on the books? [1:12:31] Yes, sir. [1:12:33] Has that changed since you started working for President Clinton? [1:12:36] No. [1:12:37] So I can't imagine establishing the fact that it is a crime to skip a notice to appear. [1:12:44] We had 10 to 12 million people who entered this country illegally in the Biden administration. [1:12:49] As a conservative estimate, there are sanctuary cities all throughout the United States who have [1:12:54] said we will not comply with federal laws. That's why we're here today. [1:12:59] I can't imagine being a DHS officer, an ICE officer, and being threatened with violence, [1:13:06] having death threats, being doxxed, having your family identified, putting that on the internet, [1:13:12] and violently telling you that they are going to kill you because you are enforcing the laws that [1:13:17] are on this books that were passed by both sides of the aisle in this body. [1:13:22] Director Lyons, how many of your agents are being doxxed, threatened, or harassed? [1:13:27] We've had over an 8,000 percent increase on death threats. [1:13:32] You know, I'm in the middle of working a bipartisan domestic terrorism working group [1:13:37] with another member on this committee. There is a group called Defend 612 that has come out with [1:13:45] tactics, techniques, and procedures in Minneapolis to do things like encourage protesters to impede law [1:13:51] enforcement to push civilians towards legally and physically risky confrontations, to help mobilize [1:13:57] a counter-protest, to coordinate strategies and trainings to aid illegal immigrants to avoid [1:14:03] detention. Are you familiar with groups like this, Defend 612? [1:14:08] Yes, sir. We have multiple groups around that in all 50 states. [1:14:11] There's an article written by Christina Buttons, and I'd like unanimous consent to enter this into the record, [1:14:17] called Inside Minneapolis' Ice Watch Network. Chairman, I'd seek unanimous consent to- [1:14:23] Give that objection. [1:14:25] This article talks about these tactics, techniques, and procedures that put your law enforcement agents [1:14:30] and your agents at risk. What is different about Minneapolis? What kind of coordination have you [1:14:35] received from the local police department that we don't see any of this in Texas? We've not seen, [1:14:41] and there have been many ice operations that have happened in Texas, but what's different [1:14:44] from what you've seen in Minneapolis? Unfortunately, sir, in the beginning of the Minneapolis operation, [1:14:50] we didn't see any cooperation at the state or the local level, whether it be from the Minneapolis [1:14:54] Police Department or the Minnesota State Police, which led to ICE officers and agents, [1:14:59] as well as our other federal partners, pretty much having to defend themselves from whatever [1:15:03] impediment riots or protests- Were they told by local elected officials not to cooperate? [1:15:09] Yes, sir. Is that because they're a sanctuary city? I- I'm assuming that's what it is, sir, [1:15:14] but I can't speak to the mind of those elected officials, but they were ordered not to stand. [1:15:18] How did it make you feel as somebody who carries out the laws that this body has passed [1:15:22] when you hear the mayor of Minneapolis say F ICE? [1:15:25] Well, sir, it's- I mean, from a morale standpoint, it hurts us to the fact that [1:15:30] for decades, and I've worked since President Bush, ICE has always been in Minneapolis. [1:15:36] We've always been in every major city and state, so it wasn't like it was a brand new thing. [1:15:40] We've always been doing immigration enforcement, so that's demoralizing. [1:15:43] Commissioner Scott, are you separating families? [1:15:46] No. [1:15:47] Tell me about when you served President Obama. Has anything changed in the policy [1:15:55] of deportation, and how many people did President Obama deport? [1:15:59] I don't have that number in front of me. Policies and how things are enforced do change. The laws [1:16:06] have not changed. I believe what you're referring to is literally when someone is arrested, whether it's [1:16:11] on immigration or whether it's a normal criminal offense and they have children, we don't necessarily [1:16:18] prosecute the children. But when someone's deported, if they want to take their children with them, [1:16:22] they have that right. We do not separate them. [1:16:25] I hope that the other side of the aisle will read this article on Defend 612 and look at the tactics, [1:16:30] techniques, and procedures. And if this is domestic terrorism, where we have a group that's on [1:16:34] signal that is calling out agents and doing things to interrupt, intercede, and prevent law enforcement [1:16:41] from carrying out the laws that this body passed, that you'll have the courage to call it domestic [1:16:45] terrorism if it is that way. And I yield back. [1:16:48] The gentleman yields back, and I now recognize the gentleman from Michigan, Mr. Panadar, for five [1:16:53] minutes of questions. [1:16:54] Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and good morning to our witnesses. Commissioner Scott, did the ICU nurse Alex [1:17:09] Freddie deserve to die? I cannot comment on an ongoing investigation, sir. [1:17:17] Do you believe that he deserved to die? Should he be killed by your agents? [1:17:24] I'm not going to comment on an ongoing investigation, sir, before it's concluded and all the facts [1:17:28] are available. Do you agree with CBP Commander Bovino's statement that Alex Freddie was planning [1:17:39] to massacre law enforcement agents? I'm not going to comment on an ongoing investigation, sir. [1:17:47] Director Lyons, did Rene Goode deserve to die? Sir, I can't comment on ongoing investigations. [1:17:58] Director Lyons, do you agree with Secretary Noem and Vice President Vance's characterization of Rene [1:18:05] Goode as a domestic terrorist? Sir, I can't speak to their comments as that they are their own, [1:18:11] but as an ongoing investigation, I can speak to that. Director Lyons, what did your agents mean [1:18:18] when he said, you raise your voice, I erase your voice? In the video just that we have seen, all of us [1:18:28] have seen. Sir, I'm not aware of that video that you have, sir. I can't comment on what that officer said. [1:18:33] Does that statement, if that statement, if I show you the video of that, does that statement reflect [1:18:41] the value of your agency, and does ICE respect and adhere to the First Amendment? Yes, sir. ICE does [1:18:49] respect and refer to the First Amendment, but that doesn't respect that, your statement that you said [1:18:54] doesn't represent the values of the men and women of ICE. Commissioner Scott, does CBP respect and adhere [1:19:01] to the First and Second Amendment? Yes, we do. Don't you agree that Alex Freddie had every right [1:19:09] to exercise his First and Second Amendment freedoms before being shot in the streets by one of your [1:19:19] agents? I believe every person in the United States has a right to their constitutional rights. [1:19:26] Look, I have heard and seen enough. I'm just sick and tired of your agents running around in our cities, [1:19:38] in our streets, causing illegal activities. ICE and CBP thugs are roaming our streets, attacking our [1:19:50] communities, using our children as bait, referring to people as bodies and numbers, targeting people for [1:20:02] their accents and the color of their skin, and killing American citizens, all while showing zero remorse [1:20:14] for their actions. Director Lyons and Commissioner Scott, do you think President Trump will pardon you [1:20:25] and your boss, Christine Ohm, before he leaves office, just like he has for insurrectionists and his [1:20:35] political allies? Do you believe President Trump will pardon you? Because- Go ahead. I'm not going to speak [1:20:45] on behalf of President Trump, but I'll tell you, I signed up for this job to protect America, and I'm [1:20:51] very proud of the service that I provide, and I don't need a pardon from anybody. Well, you better hope so. [1:20:57] You better hope you get being pardoned, because you will be held accountable for the absolute disregard [1:21:03] of the law your agencies have shown over the past year. Your agencies have lost the trust of the American [1:21:13] American people, with millions taking to the streets to protect the illegal actions of your agencies. [1:21:24] And that's why I introduced a bill in the United States Congress to abolish ICE. ICE must be abolished. [1:21:37] I also co-sponsored a bill to impeach Secretary Christine Ohm, and I believe Christine Ohm must be impeached, [1:21:48] and this Congress must do everything in its power to carry out oversight actions against these rogues [1:21:55] departments, including if- The gentleman's time is expired. A witness has requested a break. The [1:22:03] committee will recess for five minutes. Members of the audience will remain seated. The committee on [1:22:50] Homeland Security will come to order. Without objection, the chair may declare the committee in recess at any [1:22:55] point. The purpose of today's hearing is to conduct oversight of the Department of Homeland Security [1:23:00] and assess priorities for U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement, U.S. Customs and Border Protection, [1:23:06] and U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services for the calendar year 2026. Before we get started, [1:23:12] I'd like to remind the members and the public of the rules of decorum. These issues we are debating are [1:23:18] important ones that members feel deeply about. While vigorous disagreement is part of the legislative [1:23:23] process, members are reminded that we must adhere to established standards of decorum and debate. It [1:23:29] is a violation of House rules and the rules of this committee to engage in personalities regarding [1:23:34] other members or to question the motives of a colleague. It is also a clear violation of the rules [1:23:39] of the House to make statements that might personally be offensive to the President or the Vice President [1:23:44] of the United States. Remarks of that type are not permitted by the rules and are not in keeping [1:23:49] with the best traditions of our committee. The chair will enforce these rules of decorum at all times [1:23:54] and urges all members to be mindful of their remarks. Further, under the rules of the House, [1:23:59] the chairman is responsible for maintaining order and preserving decorum in the committee room. [1:24:04] I expect audience members to be respectful of the witnesses, members, and the public. If members of [1:24:09] the audience are persistently or overly disruptive, it is a violation of federal law and you will be [1:24:15] subject to removal and arrest. I now recognize myself for an opening statement. I want to start by [1:24:22] thanking our witnesses for appearing before the committee today. Today's hearing provides that the American [1:24:28] people the ability to hear directly from the leaders that enforce our nation's immigration laws. [1:24:33] It is our imperative, as representatives of the people, to be a voice for the people. Transparency, [1:24:40] communication, and accountability are keys to good government. This is why oversight is important. [1:24:47] Informing Congress and the public is not casting accusations, nor is it a punishment. Congress has a duty to [1:24:54] hear directly from the executive branch, a duty I take seriously. An executive branch has a duty to keep [1:25:00] us informed. While this hearing was long planned, we sit here today in an inflection point. An opportunity [1:25:07] to assess and reinforce the integrity of immigration enforcement and to strengthen public trust. An [1:25:14] opportunity to emphasize and underscore the Department of Homeland Security's no-fail mission as a whole. [1:25:20] My top priority as chairman is and will always be protecting America while ensuring the safety of law [1:25:26] enforcement. This is further important in the context of another potential shutdown of the Department. [1:25:32] Let me be clear. Shutting down DHS makes America less safe and negatively impacts thousands of [1:25:39] federal employees like those at TSA and CISA. The Department of Homeland Security is the nation's [1:25:46] largest federal law enforcement agency. It is this committee's duty, regardless of administration, [1:25:51] to conduct oversight. We need to examine how DHS components are enforcing the law and ensure they have the [1:25:58] resources in place to do work safely, effectively, and properly. Last year, we provided historic [1:26:05] resources through reconciliation to strengthen public safety and support for the Trump administration's [1:26:11] unprecedented efforts to secure the border. This was the single largest investment in the domestic [1:26:16] homeland security mission. To succeed, we all need to work together seamlessly, and this committee is a [1:26:22] partner in that effort. It is important to remember how we got here. For years, we witnessed a blanket [1:26:28] refusal to enforce the law, wide-open borders, catch-and-release policies, and uncontrolled mass [1:26:34] migration. These policies undermined the rule of law and endangered all Americans. Enforcing immigration [1:26:41] law is not optional. The Trump administration's record on border security is irrefutable. Nationwide [1:26:47] border encounters last December decreased 91 percent compared to 2023. Prehensions between ports of entry [1:26:54] last December decreased 86 percent compared to 2024. And we ended last year with eight consecutive months [1:27:00] of zero parole releases by Border Patrol. Further, thousands of criminal illegal aliens have been [1:27:07] detained and deported. These actions make America safer and more secure. But the credibility of these [1:27:14] successes is on the line. We must take the temperature down and look at the record of enforcement [1:27:19] actions through rational eyes. We have seen a significant increase in violent rhetoric and agitation. [1:27:25] We have seen a significant increase in attacks on federal law enforcement and in the number of threats [1:27:29] facing them and their families. This committee highlighted the threat increases to law enforcement [1:27:35] at an earlier hearing. We have seen state and local jurisdictions refuse to protect federal law [1:27:40] enforcement officers. And obviously, we have now seen the deaths of two American citizens in Minnesota. [1:27:47] This is all unacceptable and preventable. The safety of law enforcement and the communities they [1:27:52] serve and protect must always come first. When officials or elected leaders rush to conclusions about law [1:28:00] enforcement or their fellow Americans, public trust suffers. There must be complete and impartial [1:28:07] investigation. I expect each of our witnesses to keep this committee fully informed as the [1:28:13] investigations run their course. And I will ensure this happens. While these investigations are ongoing, [1:28:19] officials and elected leaders cannot rush to judgment. I cannot put myself in the shoes of law [1:28:24] enforcement, nor can I imagine what the families of Ms. Good, Mr. Prette are enduring today. Public trust and [1:28:30] public safety go hand in hand. We cannot have one without the other. I am encouraged to see that [1:28:36] President Trump sent Board of Czar Tom Homan and Commissioner Scott to Minnesota to work with Governor [1:28:40] Waltz, Mayor Frey, and other local leaders. I sincerely hope this dialogue continues. This should stand as an [1:28:47] example of cooperation to anyone who continues to incentivize reckless behavior in our streets, [1:28:53] unlawfully impede law enforcement operations, or disparage their fellow citizens. State and local [1:28:59] officials should be partners, not obstacles when it comes to public safety. And federal officials [1:29:04] should keep in mind that this kind of partnership is a two-way street. Everyone should have the same [1:29:09] goal of keeping America safe. Transparency and communication are needed now more than ever. [1:29:16] The Department's no-fail mission hangs in the balance. A rule-based order is not one-sided. [1:29:22] Enforcing immigration law and defending all Americans' constitutional rights, including the rights to [1:29:27] peacefully protest, bear arms, and privacy are not mutually exclusive. I want to thank Secretary [1:29:34] Noem for making these witnesses rapidly available. And again, thank the three of you for being here [1:29:39] today. As Board of Czar, Homan recently said, you can't fix problems if you don't have discussions. [1:29:46] I hope we can have a positive, civil, and productive discussion today. Only together can we make our [1:29:52] community stronger and the homeland safer for the future of all Americans. I now recognize the ranking [1:29:58] member, the gentleman from Mississippi, Mr. Thompson, for his opening statement. [1:30:03] Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. Good morning to all of you who are here. Thank you for calling [1:30:09] this hearing today. This important hearing has drawn a great deal of interest and attention, [1:30:15] and many of my colleagues who represent the border city of El Paso and who have been leader on border [1:30:23] security. Veronica Escobar has joined us today and would like to ask questions of our witnesses. So, [1:30:31] Mr. Chairman, I ask unanimous consent that the gentleman from Texas, Ms. Escobar, be permitted to sit. [1:30:38] I now recognize the gentleman from Texas, Mr. Gonzalez, for five minutes of questions. [1:30:44] Thank you, Chairman, and thank you, gentlemen, for your service to our great country. [1:30:48] I was speaking to some agents that were deployed from Texas to Minnesota just asking for the ground [1:30:54] truth of what was happening, and one of the things that stood out to me is one of the agents said, [1:30:58] Tony, it reminds me a lot of Fallujah. Having someone that served in Fallujah, that caught my [1:31:02] attention, and so my question first is to you, Commissioner Scott, is on the safety of our agents. [1:31:08] In particular, I see that these task forces work, these anti-gang, these anti-terrorism task forces, [1:31:15] but thinking of Fallujah reminds me of we were fighting a war that was the Persian Gulf when the [1:31:20] world had changed, and so my question is, is there a way we can protect our law enforcement, [1:31:26] our federal law enforcement agents? In particular, through, I've got a bill in particular, through [1:31:32] bulletproof glass or ballistic windshields. Is that something you think that could help protect [1:31:39] the law enforcement officers that are on the front lines? [1:31:42] I think that can help protect the officers on the front lines, but it goes much farther [1:31:46] than that because things have changed. So the tactical infrastructure at the border, the bulletproof [1:31:51] vests, all of that, that helps tremendously, but we're fighting a different fight now. [1:31:56] The reason you saw so many people surged into LA at one point and then now into Minneapolis [1:32:01] was because we had to surge additional resources in to protect the ICE agents that were literally just [1:32:06] going to try to make a lawful arrest. So we had to put in two teams, one to do the arrest and another [1:32:11] one to deal with the protesters. Luckily, CBP, well not luckily, unfortunately, CBP's had to build out [1:32:17] this capability over the years because we had been dealing with increased protests at the border, [1:32:22] mass incursions, so we trained our people how to do crowd control. But let's not miss the fact that we [1:32:28] have coordinated, well-funded, and I think insurgencies or terrorist organizations, however you want to call [1:32:33] it, literally trying to prevent legal laws from being enforced in the United States. That is a dramatic [1:32:39] change. That's why we've had to shift. So we've got to figure out how to protect our officers and [1:32:43] agents more holistically on social media. How do we keep them from being doxxed? When somebody goes [1:32:48] to like, like did to Director Lyons, they follow his kid home and then have protests in his front yard [1:32:54] and then put it out live on video. That needs to be a crime. I don't want to violate anybody's right [1:33:00] to free speech, but going into your front yard and harassing your family just because you're a law [1:33:04] enforcement officer, that should not be a protected action. The world has changed and we need to change [1:33:09] with it to make sure our federal law enforcement officers and their families are protected. My next [1:33:14] question is for Director Lyons. Body cameras have been deployed in Minnesota. I think transparency [1:33:20] helps regain public trust. Is there any plan to release any of the footage to the public? 100%, sir. [1:33:27] That's one thing that I'm committed to is the full transparency and I fully welcome body cameras all [1:33:33] across the spectrum in all of our law enforcement activities. It is, sir. Body camera footage will be [1:33:38] released. I agree with you completely. Everyone assumes this body camera footage is bad footage. [1:33:45] In so many cases, it's the exact opposite and we get a show from the officer's lens what exactly we're [1:33:51] dealing with on a date on a daily basis, not just a 15 second clip we see on TikTok or whatever it may be. [1:33:57] I'm very pleased to hear the releasing of more public footage. My next question is for you, Commissioner Scott. [1:34:04] As a member of Congress, I have a very similar question for all of us. As a member of Congress, [1:34:10] what can I do to make sure what happened in Minnesota doesn't happen in my community? [1:34:16] Put laws in place to protect our officers and agents so they can go out and do their job confidently and [1:34:22] know they really truly have the backing. And then I got to plug it, actually fund the programs. So when [1:34:28] body cameras got rolled out to CBP, the technical capability of the camera got rolled out, but the [1:34:33] funding for the personnel to support the programs and the data, that can drain basically all your [1:34:39] other operations. So fund the entire program so that we can be transparent and that we can make sure [1:34:45] America knows what we're doing because that trust is critically important. Thank you for that. My next [1:34:51] question is to Director Edlow. Too many times we talk about the enforcement side, which I think is [1:34:55] very important. We see the millions of criminal aliens that are loose in our country. We got to go out [1:35:00] there and keep our community safe. But we need to be talking more about the legal aspect of it, the [1:35:04] people that are doing it the right way. I was very encouraged to see 65,000 visas get released not too [1:35:09] not too long ago. The question I have is, what are the details? What is the timeline behind that? What is the [1:35:15] purpose of those? Can you can you specifically speak to the legal visa process? Well, you're referring [1:35:22] to the 65,000 that were the supplemental H2Bs. Exactly right. There's 60,000 or 65,000, 66,000, [1:35:30] excuse me, that go out every year at two times in the year. And then Congress has for many, many years [1:35:36] given the department the authority through the secretary to increase that based on the needs of the country. [1:35:44] So that that those visas were released. I don't remember exactly when the time has expired. I [1:35:51] apologize. And again, any questions? I know I'm being tight on the rules. We have to be. There's a lot [1:35:56] of questions. We want to get through everything today. Any members will be able to submit questions [1:36:01] in writing and you can detail these. Thank you very much. I now recognize a gentleman from Rhode Island, [1:36:07] Mr. Magaziner for five minutes of questions. Mr. Lyons, has ICE hired anyone who is charged with [1:36:13] a crime related to the January 6th riot here at the Capitol? Sir, I don't I don't have that [1:36:19] information, but I would say no. Would you if you could you find out and please report back? Yes, [1:36:23] sir. I'll get that. Would you hire someone who attacked police officers here on January 6th, [1:36:29] even though they were unfortunately pardoned by the president? Sir, we take assault on law enforcement [1:36:34] very serious and we have a good strenuous vetting program. Thank you. Commissioner Scott, [1:36:38] how many of your agents have been disciplined for excessive use of force over the past year? I cannot comment on [1:36:45] ongoing. I'm not asking you to comment on specific investigation. How many of your agents have [1:36:50] been disciplined? I'm just asking for the total. I'll get that number to you. I don't have it in [1:36:54] front of me. All right. I sent you a letter asking that question and haven't received a response. Will [1:36:59] you commit to sending a response to me, please? Yes, sir. All right. I'd like you to view this video. [1:37:06] This is video of what appears to be pepper spray thrown by a federal agent into Rafael Verraza's car. [1:37:12] You're okay, mama? You're okay? Seconds later, he realized his daughter, [1:37:16] one-year-old Ariana, was in the back seat, also battling the chemicals. [1:37:21] Are you familiar with this incident? Yes. Okay. Now, this is a family of United States citizens [1:37:28] who were out to get groceries at a Sam's Club in Chicago. When they arrived, they could see that there [1:37:32] was a chaotic operation in the parking lot. They turned their vehicle to leave, at which point your [1:37:38] agents sprayed pepper spray out of their vehicle and into the driver's side window of the Verraza's [1:37:44] family vehicle. Is it proper procedure to aim pepper spray into the window of a moving vehicle? [1:37:51] I'm not familiar. I don't have all the details on this. It's an ongoing investigation. [1:37:54] I'm not asking about this. But to answer your specific question- [1:37:57] Is it proper procedure? [1:37:58] We try to avoid that. No, it's not- [1:37:59] We try to avoid it. Because you understand it's dangerous, right? Not just for the driver, [1:38:03] but for pedestrians, for other people who could be hit by a car if a driver is blinded, right? [1:38:09] I 100% understand that, but you're talking about intentional versus not intentional. [1:38:13] Well, now listen- [1:38:13] I've been in a vehicle in one of these situations- [1:38:15] This is Scott, reclaiming my time. From the video, this was clearly intentional, [1:38:18] and you know as well as I do that in any other law enforcement agency, if an officer did this, [1:38:23] they would be put on leave, investigated, and likely disciplined. Were any of your agents [1:38:29] ever investigated or disciplined for this incident? [1:38:32] I have to get back to you on this incident. I believe it's still an ongoing investigation, [1:38:36] but we have at least- [1:38:37] I'd like to show you another video. This one is from Minneapolis. [1:38:41] So as you can see, the agent sprayed pepper spray at close range directly into the face of an [1:38:59] individual who had already been pinned to the ground by three other agents. And there's a picture of [1:39:03] this behind me to give you a better view. Is this proper procedure for the use of pepper spray? [1:39:09] I cannot comment on that because you're only showing one piece, and that subject is clearly not [1:39:14] compliant. But this is not the intended use of this weapon, correct? [1:39:19] The intended use is to try to avoid escalating. It's to de-escalate the situation. [1:39:24] Well, he was already pinned to the ground by three other agents. I think he had been de-escalated. [1:39:29] Is there any investigation into this agent for doing this? [1:39:32] I'll get back to you. There are several open investigations. [1:39:34] All right. Listen, there has been no accountability in your agency under the Trump administration. None. [1:39:40] Your agency has repeatedly been caught on tape using unnecessary violence against civilians, [1:39:45] and you can't even tell me if any of these agents have been investigated or disciplined. [1:39:50] You are supposed to be making people safer, and instead your agents are being unnecessarily violent. [1:39:55] And that is why the Trump administration has lost the trust of the American people on immigration. [1:40:00] Understand, it's not just the actions of the agents in the field. It is the lack of accountability [1:40:05] from the top that has caused public trust to erode. And there need to be major reforms [1:40:11] before we vote to give any of you any more funding. Your agencies need to act like other law [1:40:17] enforcement agencies, take off the masks, wear badge numbers, enforce discipline with real standards of [1:40:23] conduct. But accountability starts at the top. Kristi Noem is completely unfit and should be removed from [1:40:29] office. And all of the operations that we just watched were overseen by Commander Gregory Bovino, [1:40:35] who himself engaged in excessive use of force. He even admitted that he lied to a federal judge [1:40:41] when he claimed he had been hit by a rock prior to throwing tear gas, a tear gas canister at a crowd [1:40:46] of civilians. But then after the footage came out and that turned out to be not true, he admitted that [1:40:51] he had lied about it. Mr. Scott, what disciplinary action do you plan to take against Mr. Bovino? [1:40:56] I cannot comment on personnel actions on India. [1:41:01] Is there is there an investigation underway or being considered into Mr. Bovino? [1:41:05] Every allegation and every use of force is fully investigated. [1:41:08] Well, please investigate him. [1:41:10] It goes through a review board. You need to and start enforcing discipline. [1:41:13] The gentleman's time has expired. I now recognize the gentleman from Alabama, [1:41:17] Mr. Strong, for five minutes of questions. Thank you, Chairman Garbarino, [1:41:20] Ranking Member Thompson. And thank you to all our witnesses for being here today. [1:41:24] Let me start with the simple facts. The border is now closed. Fentanyl poisonings are down by more [1:41:30] than 35 percent. I thank each of you for your service to our country. I remember in April of 23, [1:41:37] when then-Secretary Maorkas testified before this very committee that the U.S. border was, [1:41:45] and I quote, secure, close quote, and not open. At the same time, under his leadership, [1:41:53] illegal alien population surged to over 11 million. They were coming from more than 160 different [1:42:02] countries as migrants were released into our country by the millions. That's what the Biden [1:42:07] administration in concert with Secretary Alejandro Maorkas did to America. They sold America out. [1:42:17] The consequences of their failures were predictable. When the United States failed to enforce its border, [1:42:24] the winners are not legal immigrants or American communities. It's the cartels, drug smugglers, [1:42:32] human traffickers, and violent criminals. We didn't need new laws to stop this crisis. [1:42:38] We needed a president willing to enforce the laws already on the books. President Trump [1:42:44] did exactly that. Another promise made, another promise kept. And today, the number of illegal aliens [1:42:50] being released into our country is zero. Zero. That's what it took a president to make the hard [1:42:57] decisions. And America is better because of it. So my question is straightforward. Commissioner Scott, [1:43:04] was Secretary Maorkas telling the truth when he testified before this committee that the border was [1:43:10] secure? Consistent with my prior testimony, no, he was not. As you stated earlier, the underlying [1:43:16] immigration laws haven't fundamentally changed in decades. What has changed, what has changed is how [1:43:23] different administrations choose to enforce these laws, particularly during the previous administration. [1:43:31] It was 100 percent orchestrated to allow illegal aliens to invade our country under the Biden [1:43:37] administration. From an operational standpoint, how important is consistency and enforcement [1:43:44] for deterrence and border control? It's extremely important. And we keep talking about immigration, [1:43:49] but let me remind people, border security really is national security. The cartels use [1:43:54] illegal immigration to literally overwhelm law enforcement at the border and bring in all kinds [1:44:00] of other threats. It's the second wave that always is the most critical. The interior [1:44:04] enforcement sent a message around the world that we're not going to just let you go. It took away [1:44:09] the marketing ability of the cartels to get people to come to the border and overwhelm law enforcement. [1:44:14] This all works together. It's critically important because it is national security. Thank you, [1:44:18] Commissioner. The men and women of DHS deserve our respect and the ability to do their job effectively [1:44:23] without mixed signals from Washington. I also want to be clear. I support the men and women who work [1:44:29] every day to secure our borders and enforce federal immigration laws. But lately, we've seen growing [1:44:35] strain on political rhetoric that goes beyond policy disagreement and targets the legitimacy of law [1:44:42] enforcement itself. Rhetoric that puts a target on the backs of agents doing their jobs. Acting Director [1:44:49] of federal immigration law enforcement. We keep hearing calls from left-wing politicians to abolish ICE. Some, [1:44:55] including many who should know better, have denounced federal law enforcement as secret police. How would you [1:45:03] respond to these reckless attacks? Sir, I can speak from personal experience. Having served multiple [1:45:09] administrations at the minimum of ICE are out there every day doing the law as it's written. [1:45:15] What are the consequences of not enforcing federal immigration laws? [1:45:20] Sir, if you look at what ICE has done, if you look at the amount of, as I said earlier, [1:45:24] the amount of known and suspected terrorists that we removed from the country, we arrested 1,477 this [1:45:30] year and removed 1,480. Just that impact alone, along with the 7,800 gang members, makes a significant [1:45:36] impact on public safety and national security. Thank you. Turning to you, Director Edlow, [1:45:40] the U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Service plays a role in administering legal immigration and protecting [1:45:48] the integrity of the system. When immigration enforcement is undermined or treated as illegitimate, [1:45:55] how does that affect USCIS's ability to manage lawful pathways, prevent fraud, and maintain public [1:46:02] confidence in the legal immigration process? It makes it absolutely impossible, Congressman, [1:46:07] and that's why we've done everything we can to administer that system now and to not cut corners [1:46:12] that were previously cut during the last administration. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I yield back. [1:46:16] The gentleman yields back. I now recognize the gentleman from New York, Mr. Goldman. Five minutes [1:46:20] of questions. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Lyons, what guidance have you given to your agents about [1:46:26] asking people walking on the streets of America to show proof of citizenship? Sir, as I stated earlier, [1:46:33] the men and women of ICE, Deportations Office of Special Agents, we conduct targeted, [1:46:37] intelligence-driven operations. We don't walk around on the streets asking people about their [1:46:41] American citizenship. Really? So all of those individual American citizens who have been [1:46:48] randomly asked are lying? Is that what you're saying? Sir, if the men and women of ICE are conducting [1:46:53] an investigation, whether it be for Title 8 Immigration Enforcement or Title 8 T and criminal [1:46:57] enforcement, they'll ask someone their nationality. Right. But that's not targeted, [1:47:00] because they're asking all sorts of American citizens, including off-duty law enforcement. [1:47:06] Now, have you directed at any point your agents under the Supreme Court's racial profiling [1:47:13] ruling to only stop non-white people and those who look like immigrants to ask for their citizenship [1:47:21] papers? No, sir, I haven't. Now, you are aware, of course, and there's well-documented, [1:47:28] numerous well-documented instances of people, American citizens, being asked to show and prove [1:47:36] their citizenship. Do you know what other regimes in the 20th century required similar proof of [1:47:44] citizenship? Yes, sir. What? Sir, there's various nefarious regimes that did that. Is Nazi Germany one? [1:47:55] Yes, but I... Is the Soviet Union one? Sir, I'm asking the questions. Is the Soviet Union one? [1:48:00] Yes, sir, but I totally... I totally... This is the wrong type of question that you should ask me. [1:48:05] No, what's... I'll tell you what the wrong type of thing is. But actually, sir, it's my time. [1:48:08] It's my time. The Holocaust Museum is not at 14th of independence. If you want to go see Nazi, [1:48:13] that's what it is. It's not the men and women of ICE that are out there doing it every day. [1:48:16] So to say that the men and women of ICE... Mr. Chairman, I'm reclaiming my time. I would like my time back, [1:48:21] please. Please give me another 15 seconds because he was unnecessarily speaking. You said in your [1:48:27] opening statement that references to ICE as the Gestapo or the secret police encourages threats [1:48:36] against ICE agents. 100%. The problem is you have it backwards, sir. People are simply making valid [1:48:43] observations about your tactics, which are un-American and outright fascist. So I have a simple suggestion. [1:48:54] If you don't want to be called a fascist regime or secret police, then stop acting like one. But people [1:49:03] are simply just observing what they are seeing. And that's why people are making those comments. [1:49:11] Now, I was a prosecutor for 10 years. Prosecuting mob bosses, organized crime, violent criminals. [1:49:18] The actual worst of the worst. Not a single criminal law enforcement agent that I worked with [1:49:26] wore a mask to conceal their identity. But your department, which is a civil law enforcement [1:49:33] agency, is defending the use of masks by your agents because of a so-called rise in threats and [1:49:40] assaults against your officer. Now, you said in your opening testimony that assaults against ICE [1:49:45] officers are up by more than 1400%, which is now even more than the 1300% that your gaslighting [1:49:53] spokesperson, Trisha from Ohio, has recently been citing. But here's the problem. There are two [1:50:00] separate, very detailed, very thorough investigative reports based on your own data that both conclude [1:50:09] that assaults against ICE officers are up about 25%, which is far less, of course, than you assert, [1:50:17] and far less than you would expect from an agency that has more than doubled its hiring and has an [1:50:25] even greater increase in arrests. Now, why is that a problem, Mr. Lyons? It's a problem [1:50:34] because the explanation that your agents are wearing masks because of fear of assaults or doxing [1:50:44] is outright bogus. You and your untrained, unqualified, unvetted, unidentified agents are [1:50:53] intentionally terrorizing our cities and communities all over this country to avoid accountability for [1:51:01] their excessive force and their lawless actions. That is why you're wearing masks. So no one can hold [1:51:09] you accountable. And you know that the FBI is not going to because notwithstanding all of the [1:51:16] investigations all of you say are going on, the Department of Justice and the FBI has stated they are not [1:51:23] investigating those two murders. This is not the America that I know and love. This is not the America my [1:51:30] immigrants came to. And it's long past time that you rein in your out-of-control agency and start [1:51:37] following the law and the Constitution, and I yield back. The gentleman's time has expired. [1:51:42] I now recognize the gentleman from Arizona, Mr. Crane, for five minutes of questions. Thank you, [1:51:47] Mr. Chairman. It's interesting being in this hearing today, you know, where my Democrat colleagues continue [1:51:53] to demonize ICE and Homeland Security. I think history and context are very important here. [1:51:59] It's not lost on most of the American public that my Democrat colleagues actually caused this entire [1:52:06] crisis with their open border policies that they all voted for, letting in close to 15 million [1:52:12] illegal aliens. I also want to go through real quick some numbers of ICE deportations with other [1:52:20] presidents who I believe both you, Mr. Scott, and you, Mr. Lyons, have worked for. Under President Clinton, [1:52:25] 12 million illegal aliens were deported and removed from this country, some voluntary, [1:52:32] some departures. He, no riots. Under President Bush, two million, no riots. Obama, who was often referred [1:52:41] to as the deporter-in-chief, five million, including returns, no riots. President Trump in his first term, [1:52:47] two million deported, no riots. President Biden, four million, including expulsions, varying by estimates, [1:52:55] no riots. President Trump again this year, 625,000, with two million voluntary leaving through CBP [1:53:04] home app. Mr. Scott, can you explain why these other presidents that you work for, both Democrat and [1:53:11] Republican, have deported far more people than this president, and we've seen no riots? [1:53:16] I would say it has a lot to do about rhetoric and misleading the American public about what's [1:53:22] really going on and how important border security really is to this nation. Let's talk also about my [1:53:29] Democrat colleagues and something they also supported, and that's these sanctuary cities. [1:53:34] I think that's very important, and I don't think a lot of Americans really understand these sanctuary [1:53:38] cities. Mr. Scott, Mr. Lyons, is it true that you would rather send your officers into a jail to get [1:53:45] some of these illegal alien criminals? Is it safer for your agents and also the illegal alien criminal [1:53:52] if your officers are able to go into a jail instead of having to go out and find them on the street? [1:53:58] Mr. Lyons, I'll start with you. Yes, sir, it would be. You wouldn't see the amount of law enforcement [1:54:02] officers involved in immigration operations. Right. How about you, Mr. Scott? I 100% agree with the [1:54:07] director, and more just as importantly, it would allow me to put more agents back on the border to [1:54:11] prevent people from getting in here in the first place. Let's also talk about these riots. Mr. Scott, [1:54:17] Mr. Lyons, do you guys remember any riots for some of these victims that were assaulted and [1:54:24] victimized by illegal alien criminals like Nate Baker, Laken Riley, Fletcher Harris, Schuyler Provenza, [1:54:33] Ivory Smith? I've got a whole list of them. Do you remember any riots from our Democrats or their [1:54:39] constituents when any of these American citizens were victimized by illegal alien criminals? [1:54:45] Mr. No, sir. No, sir. Why do you think that is? Because that's the question that I get asked all [1:54:51] the time. Congressman White, why do the Democrats care more about illegal alien criminals than they [1:54:57] care about these American citizens? Many of them who are young, have their entire lives ahead of them, [1:55:03] didn't show up to a protest, right, to obstruct federal law enforcement. They're just going about their [1:55:09] daily lives and they get victimized by people who aren't supposed to be here. Why do you think they [1:55:14] don't care about American citizens? I cannot speculate, but when I look at the chaos that it [1:55:20] creates and the corrosive nature that it creates, I go beyond the politics of the United States and I [1:55:26] look at our nation state adversaries like Iran, Russia and China and their influence on social media [1:55:32] to keep this negative discourse going. And I think this is a much bigger issue than we're actually [1:55:37] admitting that it isn't here. I want to tie this together to something that's very pertinent that's [1:55:42] going to happen this week here in Congress where the American people are going to see the bookend [1:55:48] of what's going on. We are going to attempt to pass the Save America Act, okay, which requires [1:55:57] documentary proof of U.S. citizenship to register to vote, it imposes photo ID requirements to vote, [1:56:04] and it penalizes officials who do not enforce these requirements. And you won't see most of these [1:56:11] folks over here on the other side that are demonizing you guys right now, you will not see them support it. [1:56:16] So they let millions and millions of illegal aliens into the country, they set up these sanctuary cities [1:56:22] so you can't go enforce these federal laws that are on the books that Congress has passed, [1:56:27] and now they won't vote to stop these illegals from voting in our elections. If the American people don't [1:56:34] understand what this whole thing is about, it's about one word, and it always has been, and that [1:56:41] is power. They want power, and they need these illegals to vote in our elections. That's why they [1:56:47] don't care about the fraud either, because they need those votes as well. Thank you, I yield back. [1:56:51] The gentleman yields back. I now recognize the gentlelady from Illinois, Ms. Ramirez, for five minutes of questions. [1:56:58] Thank you, Chairman. My mother, a Guatemalan immigrant and an American, taught me that I have [1:57:03] the responsibility to look evil in the eye and to fight it back. Mr. Lyons, Mr. Scott, Mr. Edlow, [1:57:15] you have used your power to perpetrate great evil, and it's about time you answered this committee for [1:57:20] the lawlessness that you've empowered and defended in your testimony. Mr. Lyons, I want to start with you, [1:57:27] and I want to talk about ICE, because under your leadership, ICE has shot and killed Silverio [1:57:33] Villegas Gonzalez and Renee Goode, violated nearly 100 court orders in January alone. You've used [1:57:41] banned chokeholds in more than 40 cases, engaged in warrantless arrests despite of a consent decree, [1:57:48] and you used children as bait to put 3,800 children in detention. You created traps for people [1:57:55] at immigration court who were following the law and doing it the legal way, and you broke the law by [1:58:00] entering into people's homes without a judicial warrant in violation of the Fourth Amendment. Now, [1:58:06] let's talk about you, Mr. Scott, and CBP next. Under your leadership, CBP has attempted to execute [1:58:15] Marimar Martinez, shooting her five times and not releasing the footage that you should release so that [1:58:23] we can see the evidence, murdered Alex Preddy, used chemical agents dozens of times in Chicago after [1:58:31] a judge ordered you to stop, conducted warrantless surveillance and racial profiling, and acted with [1:58:38] total disrespect and disregard for the law while engaging in roving patrols, plate switching, dangerous [1:58:45] traffic maneuvers, and observer intimidation. Again, criminals act with that total disregard for the law, [1:58:52] and we continue to see it. You would both have us talk about respect for your mission and your agents, [1:58:58] but your agencies are unaccountable paramilitary forces, and I have just as much respect for you [1:59:04] as I do for the last white men who put on masks to terrorize communities of color. I have no respect [1:59:11] for the inheritance of the Klan hood and the slave patrol. Those activities were immoral then and criminal, [1:59:18] and so are yours. And that brings me to you, Mr. Edlow and USCIS. Truly, USCIS is the most disappointing [1:59:28] part of this whole panel for me. Mr. Edlow, let me ask you a question. Is USCIS's mission to uphold [1:59:36] America's promise as a nation of welcome and possibility with fairness, integrity, and respect for [1:59:43] all we serve? Yes or no? Is that the mission? Congresswoman, the mission is to administer the [1:59:50] lawful immigration system. Okay, so let me move on. So it is not for the possibility of fairness, [1:59:54] integrity, and respect. I get that. I want to tell you about Mr. about Stephen, my constituent, Mr. Edlow. [2:00:00] Stephen is a 14-year-old with autism who is seeking asylum. This child has spent 60 days in [2:00:06] detention center after he was detained with his dad at a check-in. Let me ask you this, [2:00:13] what kind of agency would strip asylum protections from children, even those with pending asylum [2:00:20] claims, and deport minors without due process? You don't have to answer that. It's your agency, [2:00:25] Mr. Edlow. You are doing that to Stephen, my constituent, an eighth grader. You have abandoned [2:00:31] the mission and allowed USCIS to become a tool in DHS's abusive enforcement apparatus, Mr. Edlow. [2:00:39] It is shameful to see what USCIS has become. As I've said before, DHS, ICE, and CBP, they're not really [2:00:50] rogue. Congress designed DHS to violate our rights under the pretense of securing our safety. I'm going [2:00:58] to say it loud and clear, and I'm proud to stand by what I say. DHS cannot be reformed. It must be [2:01:04] dismantled, and something new must take its place. Because if we let DHS persist, it will continue to [2:01:11] be a weapon that can be pointed at anyone the government considers the public enemy. And let me [2:01:17] tell you, fascism always requires a public enemy. But the power of the people is stronger than the [2:01:23] weapons they would wield against us. So Mr. Lyons, Mr. Scott, Mr. Edlow, you have weaponized the government. [2:01:32] You have supported a fascist enterprise at the expense of our constitutional rights. You have [2:01:38] violated law. But let me remind you, you will not always be in power. One day, you will be held [2:01:44] accountable for your role in this dark moment in America, in our nation's history. I guarantee it. [2:01:50] And with that, Mr. Chairman, I yield back. [2:01:52] The gentlelady yields back. As I said, the issues we're debating here are important, [2:01:59] ones that members feel deeply about. While vigorous disagreement is part of the legislative process, [2:02:04] members are reminded that we must adhere to established standards of decorum and debate. [2:02:08] Witnesses are here today voluntarily, and I will continue to remind members that while oversight is [2:02:13] important, aggressively attacking witnesses personally is inappropriate and not in keeping [2:02:18] with the best traditions of our committee. And I now recognize the gentleman from Oklahoma, [2:02:24] Mr. Burkine, for five minutes of questions. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you to the witnesses. I [2:02:29] I want to start with a display over my shoulders. And this is something that is not specific only to [2:02:36] Oklahoma. This is something that every member of this committee, if you will go to the DHS website, [2:02:41] every constituent of every member of Congress, if you're curious of really the dark days, [2:02:48] I want you to go to the DHS website, and I want you to look at those not far from where you live, [2:02:54] moms and dads, the arrest of the illegal aliens who were preying on minors. Just because of a [2:03:02] really intentional act by Kate Bryant on my staff to go a couple of weeks ago and look just in [2:03:07] eastern Oklahoma, on the right side of me here, just in eastern Oklahoma, I represent almost all [2:03:12] the entirety of eastern Oklahoma. These are just the individuals, heinous acts to include those with [2:03:19] children. And yet I want to read you in a wider, to my left over here, what is happening in the state [2:03:26] of Oklahoma. This person was picked up. Angel Nick, sexual exploitation of a minor. Renton Andrew, [2:03:34] molestation of a minor. Chan Truding, child fondling. Lillisano Garcia, enticement of a minor. [2:03:43] Caetano Lopez, statutory rape. Rosmo Avila, rape and lewd acts with a minor. So for everyone who is in short-term [2:03:53] memory, it's the way things operate in the court of public opinion. Everyone is looking and you're [2:03:59] forgetting the conversations you were having two and three years ago. If you had teenage kiddos [2:04:05] wanting to go outside of your home and you knew that they were going to go to Dallas, Texas, [2:04:10] or some city, and you knew that you had to have a conversation with them with what was happening, [2:04:14] the 15 million you knew were in the country illegally, that you had no idea what they would be doing, [2:04:19] who would they be preying upon. And moms and dads, don't you feel just a little bit safer if we're [2:04:25] going to be gut level honest? That's the realization of what the generational opportunity this [2:04:31] administration has afforded this country. It's the ability to feel safe over the madness of opening [2:04:38] the border for that four-year period that allowed 15 million people. You don't know where they came from, [2:04:43] you don't know their background, you don't know their history, and this that is occurring right now [2:04:50] is designed to make sure we have law and order in this country. If you do not have law and order, [2:04:56] you don't have prosperity. So to all those who are second-guessing the reactionary moments, [2:05:03] to the law enforcement who have to respond in real time, the quarterback who is questioned Monday [2:05:11] morning because he's facing the 300-pound defensive lineman, it's easy to do that. But law enforcement [2:05:18] walks out of their home every day and is faced with life or death questions. And we have to understand, [2:05:25] they are the ones who are affording us the opportunity for our children to feel safe against [2:05:28] these that are in your backyard. It's not just in the north. It's not just in Minneapolis. It's not just [2:05:35] in Minnesota. They're in every state in the country. Go to the Department of Homeland Security website [2:05:41] and Google your area and look at who's being picked up in your backyard. That's how we recenter this [2:05:46] conversation to truth. I want your children protected. I am grateful for this president [2:05:54] who wants your children protected and in administration. The same playbook is happening [2:06:02] now to create chaos and take your eye off. The real goal was to secure our communities, [2:06:08] to get back to a place of safety. Mr. Lyons, can you describe, because of not allowing these people [2:06:14] to stay in jails, these sanctuary cities are letting them go, thousands released from jail, [2:06:18] because they will not cooperate with ICE. And when ICE tries to execute a detainer, [2:06:23] ask them to hold a criminal illegal alien for potential deportation, how is this compared with [2:06:28] other non-sanctuary city regions in the country? Sir, it's night and day. With the jurisdictions [2:06:35] that we do have cooperation, we're able to take that individual in a safe, secure environment. [2:06:39] Not only is it safe, secure environment for the officers and agents, but it's also for the [2:06:43] individual and the community, because we only need one to two officers to make that arrest. [2:06:47] Where now we're historically five or six, we need up to 15. [2:06:52] From what you've seen in terms of protest in Minnesota and elsewhere, do you get the sense [2:06:55] these agitators are trying to provoke your agents into reactions? Yes, sir. [2:07:00] Can you expound upon that? We've seen multiple times, and unfortunately, [2:07:04] we saw like the shooting in Dallas where agitated groups use apps to identify the location of ICE [2:07:09] officers, sometimes prior to even the law enforcement action begins. And sometimes using those apps, [2:07:15] put the officers and as well as other federal agencies and local agencies with them in danger, [2:07:20] because it exposes the fact of where a law enforcement operation is happening. [2:07:23] Mr. Scott, can you describe how the 300,000 children, the UACs, unaccompanied minors that [2:07:28] we're trying to find them, how these protests are stopping us from being able to recover those? [2:07:32] The gentleman will respond in writing to that question. I now recognize the gentleman from [2:07:37] New York, Mr. Kennedy, for five minutes. Thank you. Mr. Lyons, your written testimony today does not make one [2:07:43] single mention of Renee Nicole Good or Alex Preddy, not one. Two American citizens have been murdered at [2:07:51] the hands of your agency, and you have deliberately chosen under oath before Congress to ignore these [2:07:58] tragedies. And so today, in my five minutes, I look forward to getting the American people [2:08:03] some answers and some accountability that I believe they deserve. Mr. Lyons, I have some simple yes or no [2:08:11] questions. Do you believe the U.S. Constitution provides due process for everyone in this country? [2:08:17] Yes. Do you believe American citizens have the right to protest freely without being assaulted [2:08:25] or killed by our government? Yes. Do you believe there should be an independent investigation [2:08:31] when an innocent person is killed by a law enforcement agency in this country? Yes. Do you [2:08:37] believe your agency has a legal obligation to follow court orders? Yes. Well, Mr. Lyons, [2:08:45] you have a very strange way of showing it with a federal judge finding that your agency is in [2:08:51] violation of 96 orders in one month alone, and that's just Minneapolis, Minnesota. This administration [2:09:01] and the agencies represented before us have shown a complete and utter disregard for the law and the [2:09:06] Constitution. Renee Nicole Good and Alex Preddy, both American citizens, both dead at the hands of federal [2:09:14] federal agents. Alex Preddy was a VA ICU nurse who dedicated his life to healing people, healing [2:09:22] veterans. I worked as an occupational therapist for over a decade. In that video that we've all seen, [2:09:32] it was Alex Preddy who was doing what health care workers do, what nurses do. They help people, [2:09:40] help people who are hurting, help people who are in trouble. In this case, helping a fellow peaceful [2:09:47] protestor who was shoved to the ground right before your agents shot him 10 times. And we're now learning [2:09:58] that FBI Director Cash Patel stopped the U.S. Attorney's Office in Minnesota from investigating [2:10:04] the death of Ms. Good because of fear that an investigation would contradict President Trump's [2:10:09] falsehoods that she violently, willfully, and viciously ran down an agent. Six federal prosecutors [2:10:16] resigned rather than participate in a cover-up. Kristi Noem, Stephen Miller, and you, Mr. Lyons, [2:10:24] have appointed yourselves judge, jury, and executioner, allowing American citizens to be gunned down in [2:10:31] our streets with impunity. We all know the president is a liar. He sold snake oil his entire life, but he [2:10:39] can't tell us and the American people that we did not see with our own eyes what we saw in that video. [2:10:48] Two Americans shot dead in cold blood. The American people aren't stupid like he thinks we are. The fact [2:10:56] that our government murders American citizens lies about it and then refuses to investigate or seek [2:11:02] justice is beyond abhorrent. It's un-American. Mr. Lyons, in America, we shouldn't have secret police. We [2:11:10] shouldn't have masked government agents executing citizens in the streets. The Constitution does not give [2:11:18] your agency the right to hide their faces while they kill Americans. Will you commit, yes or no, [2:11:25] to immediately unmasking every agent conducting immigration enforcement and requiring them to wear [2:11:30] standard uniforms with identifiable badges? No. Well, that's a sad response. Your answer is [2:11:39] completely unacceptable. People who are proud of what they do aren't hiding their identity. We're a nation of [2:11:47] laws and you, your boss, Secretary Noem and Donald Trump are not above the law. The American people [2:11:56] are angry and they're demanding accountability and justice from those giving the orders. Mr. Lyons, [2:12:02] yes or no, do you believe that Secretary Noem should resign? I'm not going to comment on that, sir. [2:12:08] So you're going to look the families of Renee Nicole Good and Alex Preddy in the eye and tell them [2:12:14] Secretary Noem should keep her job after their loved ones were killed? Sir, the loss of any life [2:12:21] is unacceptable. In the heart, my heart, prayers and thoughts go out to anyone who tragically [2:12:28] losing his life, especially a child, since I've suffered personal loss in my life. But I'm not [2:12:34] going to comment on an ongoing investigation. Well, Mr. Lyons, the American people are watching. Your [2:12:38] unwillingness to demand accountability from your own leadership speaks volumes to American citizens. [2:12:43] The gentleman's time is expired. The American people, the gentleman's time is expired. [2:12:47] The members are reminded that we must adhere to established standards of decorum and debate. [2:12:53] It is a clear violation of the rules of the House to make statements that might be personally offensive [2:12:58] to the President or the Vice President of the United States. I now recognize a gentle lady from South [2:13:03] Carolina, Ms. Biggs, for five minutes of questions. Thank you, Chairman Garbarino, and thank you to our [2:13:09] witnesses. A big thank you for what you do each and every day to secure our border and to carry out the will [2:13:17] of the American people. You know, this Trump administration and the CBP and ICE, they've done [2:13:23] a stellar job of securing our border. And we can just look at the numbers. They tell the facts. [2:13:30] Crossings are down from a high of over 300,000 a month under President Biden to around 10,000 a month [2:13:38] under President Trump. However, the lax border policies of the Democrats have flooded our country [2:13:46] with tens of millions of illegal immigrants. This invasion was facilitated by sanctuary cities. [2:13:54] Most cities will hand over criminal alien aliens with a deportation order to ICE, but sanctuary cities [2:14:03] refuse to do so, often releasing them back into the public around our communities, our children, and [2:14:11] making it unsafe. Cities like Minneapolis pick and choose which laws they want to enforce. And by doing [2:14:19] that, they place our federal law enforcement in danger, forcing ICE agents to make arrests out in public, [2:14:27] something that could be avoided if sanctuary cities simply cooperated with the federal law. [2:14:32] At the same time, radical leftists have stirred hysteria over routine immigration enforcement, [2:14:39] calling immigration officers the secret police and even the Gestapo. Let me be very clear. This rhetoric [2:14:48] has consequences. Between 2024 and 2025, we saw a more than 16,000 percent increase in threats of assault [2:14:59] against immigration officers and over 8,000 percent spike in death threats targeting those who enforce [2:15:08] our laws. In Minnesota alone, there have been over 60 threats and 20 assaults to ICE officers. Just think [2:15:17] about that if you were going to work every day and had to deal with that. Sanctuary cities, they choose criminals [2:15:25] over citizens. My bill, the Mobilizing Against Sanctuary Cities Act, would cut off every single federal dollar to [2:15:35] any city that helps illegals instead of law enforcement. Mr. Lyons, my question is to you. Why should taxpayers [2:15:45] find far left politicians who put your agents at risk? [2:15:52] Ma'am, unfortunately, what we've seen over and over is just the fact that there's so much rhetoric out [2:15:56] there against the work the men and women of ICE have done. Again, going back in my career, this is my [2:16:02] second decade, multiple administrations, and it's never been like this. And the actual public safety [2:16:08] impact that the men and women of ICE do every day is significant, and it should still be true for all 50 states. [2:16:15] Thank you. So I want to take it a little closer to home. What's happening in my district, the third [2:16:22] district of South Carolina, it should alarm every single individual. These are real crimes committed [2:16:29] by individuals illegally in our country, right here in our communities, confirmed by the Department of [2:16:35] Homeland Security. We heard a little bit from my colleagues earlier. So let me just give you a few of [2:16:41] the worst — vehicular homicide, child cruelty and indecent exposure, armed robbery, assaulting a police [2:16:50] officer with a weapon, and making terrorist threats. And I could go on and on. We're also seeing [2:16:57] convictions for drug trafficking, burglary, forgery, repeated illegal reentry, and more and more. [2:17:03] And this is what I consider chaos. And it's the direct result of open border policies that put [2:17:10] American lives at risk. But amid all of this, we're seeing true heroes step up. Our federal immigration [2:17:18] officers are on the front lines of securing safety and prosperity for us and for our children. [2:17:24] They've been given a difficult task, but they are up to the job and certainly meeting the demands. [2:17:32] We stand behind our immigration officers and their historic mission to restore the rule of law to the [2:17:39] United States. And right here at home, our local law enforcement is rising to meet the challenge, [2:17:46] and I'm very grateful to them. So just look at Anderson County Sheriff's Department, which you'll see in [2:17:52] the photo behind me, which recently seized 180 pounds of cocaine. That's 180 pounds of deadly drugs that [2:18:01] will never reach our streets, thanks to the courage and commitment. So I just want to say thank you, [2:18:08] and I'm grateful for the job that you do. [2:18:11] Gentle lady yields back. I now recognize the gentle lady from New Jersey, [2:18:16] Ms. MacGyver, for five minutes of questions. [2:18:18] Thank you, Mr. Chairman and ranking member. Mr. Lyons, as the senior official lead in ICE [2:18:25] enforcement, much of today's scrutiny falls on you, and it should. You have seen repeatedly, [2:18:30] we have seen repeatedly that Republicans, Trump administration, its DHS, and your agency will do [2:18:36] absolutely anything to avoid answering for your actions. When I showed up to inspect Delaney Hall, [2:18:43] a private prison that you contract with, ICE tried not to give us an oversight tour. [2:18:50] Then, instead of taking accountability for ICE's attempts to keep us from seeing this facility's [2:18:56] conditions to know if people's basic rights were being upheld, this administration is doing all they [2:19:02] can to try to put me in prison for 17 years. When ICE shot and killed Renee Good, Kristi Noem called [2:19:08] her a domestic terrorist. When Alex Preddy, you all tried to tell us, he was threatening officers with a gun, [2:19:15] but all we saw was a phone. This administration's clear lies fell apart, not because someone had a [2:19:21] come-to-come-to-Jesus moment, but because we saw these murders from every angle. You are only here [2:19:28] because public outrage has become so unavoidable. You are here, Mr. Lyons, because white people are [2:19:35] being are getting shot in the face and chest when the cameras are rolling, because now my Republican [2:19:41] colleagues care about optics. But when Keith Porter Jr., a black American citizen, a son, a father, and a man [2:19:50] loved by many was killed by an off-duty ICE agent on New Year's Eve, there were no hearings. So this [2:19:56] is for him today. In my district, John Wilson Brutus, a Haitian immigrant, a beloved family man, [2:20:03] died within 24 hours of being in ICE custody. He is just one of more than 30 people who have died in ICE [2:20:11] custody last year. This is for all of them. Every human being your rogue, out-of-control agency has hurt, [2:20:19] hunted down, imprisoned, killed, and continued to hold hostage even after they have agreed to be deported. [2:20:28] We know this administration doesn't care about protecting people or sparing lives. We all see [2:20:34] so plainly what you are doing, what you have been doing to black and brown folks, immigrants, people's [2:20:41] silence in the shadows, now in broad daylight to people peacefully rejecting your cruel agenda in the [2:20:47] streets, which is their right to do. This is the despicable or predictable result of an agency that [2:20:54] lacks accountability. This administration believes it can act first, explain later, or hell, never [2:21:01] never explain at all, as we see here today. You all seem to think you are the highest power who decides [2:21:07] which people deserve dignity, protection, due process, and due process. But you are wrong. [2:21:15] We are here for answers. We are here for accountability. And we are here because people are dying. Let me [2:21:22] repeat that. People are dying. And you don't seem to care. So, Mr. Lyons, I've heard my colleagues [2:21:29] ask many questions over and over again, and you cannot answer them. So let me ask you some questions [2:21:35] that you may be able to answer. Mr. Lyons, do you consider yourself a religious man? [2:21:40] Yes, ma'am. Oh, yes. Okay. Well, how do you think judgment day will work for you with so much blood [2:21:47] on your hands? I'm not going to entertain that question. Oh, okay. Of course not. Do you think [2:21:52] you're going to hell, Mr. Lyons? I'm not going to end. Of course not. How many government agencies? [2:21:56] The gentlelady will suspend. The gentlelady will suspend. Chairman. A gentlelady will suspend. As I said, [2:22:02] the issues we're debating here are important to ones that members feel deeply about. Thank you. While vigorous [2:22:07] disagreement is part of the legislative process, members are reminded that we must adhere to [2:22:12] established standards of decorum and debate. The witnesses are here voluntarily. And I will [2:22:17] continue to remind, continue to remind members that while oversight is important, aggressively [2:22:21] attacking those witnesses personally is inappropriate and not in keeping with the traditions of our [2:22:27] committee. Mr. Chairman, I'm just asking a question. You all, you guys are always talking about [2:22:31] religion here in the Bible. I mean, it's okay for me to ask a question, right? But let me continue on. [2:22:36] I got your notes. All right. The gentlelady may resume. Thank you so much. Let me get back to my [2:22:40] question, Mr. Chairman. Thank you. I appreciate you. How many government agencies, Mr. Lyons, [2:22:44] are you aware of that routinely kill American citizens and you still get funding? Ma'am, [2:22:50] I'm not going to entertain that. Of course you're not. Exactly. Exactly. [2:22:54] Once again, questions that you cannot answer. And that is exactly why, Mr. Chairman, and to this [2:22:58] committee, to my colleagues and to my colleagues across the aisle, this is exactly why we should not be [2:23:03] funding this agency. The people are watching you. They are watching you. And this is why we need to [2:23:09] abolish ICE. With that, I yield back. Thank you kindly. Gentlelady yields back. I now recognize [2:23:16] a gentleman from Colorado, Mr. Evans, for five minutes of questions. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, [2:23:20] ranking member for this important hearing. This past year has been historic for national security, [2:23:25] thanks to the joint work between the agencies present today and our Republican colleagues. The big, [2:23:30] beautiful bill unlocked billions of dollars to finally secure the border and deliver much-needed [2:23:35] support for law enforcement officials who keep us safe every day, slashing things like the scourge of [2:23:41] overdose deaths that claimed approximately 400,000 lives under the previous administration. And this [2:23:47] is despite increasing violence against federal officers, which has been inspired by fear-mongering from [2:23:53] the Democrats. As a soldier for 12 years, as a cop for 10 years, and as the only Latino in Colorado's [2:23:59] delegation, it's been my long-standing position that with a secure border, we must use all available [2:24:05] resources to target the worst of the worst. Violent offenders like murderers and rapists and so-called [2:24:10] non-violent like drug dealers and thieves and child porn producers. Get the gangsters, not the grandmas. [2:24:16] Director Lyons, is ICE's priority the apprehension and removal of criminal non-citizens rather than the broader [2:24:24] population of illegally present individuals. Yes, sir. ICE's continued focus is on the criminal [2:24:30] aliens that are in our neighborhoods. Thank you. Unfortunately, Democrats in my state in Colorado [2:24:37] champion soft-on-crime sanctuary policies at the state level and in cities like Denver, which borders [2:24:42] my district. These policies not only impede federal investigations that target cartels, gangbangers, [2:24:49] entities like Trenderagua, MS-13, the Sinaloa cartel, but they also endanger our communities [2:24:55] by releasing dangerous criminals back into the streets who continue to traffic drugs, steal cars, [2:25:01] intimidate families, and recruit children. In fact, fentanyl overdose rates in Denver are going up [2:25:06] in 2025. It's common sense that when local or state police arrest an individual for a crime, [2:25:13] those officers should be able to obtain basic information about the arrestee, and those state and [2:25:18] local officers should then be allowed to share information with federal law enforcement to [2:25:23] communicate threats, honor detainer requests, and work together to ensure national security and [2:25:30] public safety. So, Director Lyons, can you please explain how ICE works around sanctuary policies [2:25:37] to go after the worst of the worst, and do these sanctuary policies that release criminals back into the [2:25:44] community increase or decrease ICE's presence in the community and the temperature of the interactions [2:25:50] that ICE has with the community? Sir, when we deal with sanctuary jurisdictions, we do have to have [2:25:56] more law enforcement officers in the street. Like I said earlier in my testimony, we'd much rather have [2:26:01] the chance to take an aggravated felon, repeat DUI offender into custody at a prison, local jail, or some [2:26:11] type of lockup environment where it's safer for my officers and for not only the individual but that [2:26:16] community as well, and then given the opportunity to take that person into custody before that person [2:26:22] can reoffend. Unfortunately, as a field office director, when I ran the Boston field office, we saw too [2:26:26] many times that we placed a detainer on a sexual assault individual who just went out later after the [2:26:33] detainer was dropped to rape again, and that is why we need cooperation at all levels, especially local and state. [2:26:39] Thank you. Director Lyons, my district, 40 percent Hispanic, it's full of successful business owners [2:26:46] and strong immigrant families. Unfortunately, my colleagues across the aisle are fanning the flames [2:26:52] of fear for their own political gain in my Hispanic communities, scaring people over events that haven't [2:26:59] happened in my district. So I'd like for you for just a brief moment to speak directly to my constituents [2:27:04] who are legally present in the U.S., not criminals, but who are fearful of being searched or detained via [2:27:11] immigration efforts. Should they fear ICE? And what policies does ICE have to prevent the seizure [2:27:17] of people with legal status? Sir, ICE officers and special agents are trained in immigration [2:27:23] nationality, so anyone that is here legally or lawfully or a U.S. citizen should not be concerned about [2:27:28] being deported or detained. Unfortunately, many times there are individuals that are with criminal [2:27:35] legal aliens. And sir, as you being a former law enforcement officer, you know, you arrive on a [2:27:40] scene, you ID everyone in that case. If, you know, if we're looking for an individual and someone is here [2:27:45] present in the country legally, then we're going to take action. We're not going to turn a blind eye no [2:27:50] more. But someone that's in the country lawfully should not feel scared to walk down the street, [2:27:55] drive. Thank you. Sorry. Sorry. I got 23 seconds left. I have one thing that I want to ask. [2:28:00] As a cop, if I had an arrest warrant, there's a difference between arrest warrants and search [2:28:04] warrants. If I had an arrest warrant for an individual and I thought they were in the house, [2:28:08] or if I was assisting social services with a child removal, I still had to have an arrest warrant to go [2:28:13] in the house. So I have many questions about the memo saying that you don't need a warrant to go into [2:28:18] the house. Will you commit with me at a later date to discuss this? 100 cents, sir. I would look forward [2:28:22] to sitting down and discussing that. Yield back. Gentleman yields back. I now recognize [2:28:28] the gentlelady from Texas, Ms. Johnson, for five minutes of questions. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. [2:28:33] I would like to, Mr. Lyons, I wanted to just follow up on a statement that you just made, [2:28:40] which is that if you're here legally and lawfully, you should not worry. I think the problem is there [2:28:46] are many, many immigrants that are here legally and lawfully that are very worried because they have [2:28:52] been snatched off the streets. They have had their face beat in by ICE agents. They've been yanked out [2:28:59] of their car. They've been driven around and harassed. And so that is, I think, at the end of the day, [2:29:06] you know, the key nut of the crux here, which is that unfortunately there is not just this focus [2:29:13] on criminals and that people who are here in legal status. And for example, I have an example of this [2:29:18] that I'd like to highlight for you. And back in October, Maher Tarabishi, a North Texas resident, [2:29:25] who was allowed to be in this country legally and was under a supervision order to check in on an [2:29:31] annual basis since 2008, and did that because he had an adult disabled son. And so he was here working [2:29:39] as an IT consultant and was here in the legal process to take care of his adult legal son. [2:29:44] He went to check into his appointment. It so happened to be at the time that the Dallas ICE [2:29:49] office was closed due to the shooting. And so he was not able to check in. When he went back to check [2:29:54] in, he was immediately snatched up and detained because he missed his appointment that was unavoidable [2:30:01] because the office was closed. He told everyone he was in legal status. He had been here since 2008 [2:30:07] and he had an adult disabled son that would likely pass away if he was not released. He was not released. [2:30:13] His son died. And then to complicate it, he was not allowed to go and attend the funeral. And he's [2:30:19] still in detention in the Blue Bonnet facility in Texas. He is not a criminal. He has no criminal [2:30:26] history. He was here legally. That is an unacceptable outcome. And I would like to know if you are willing [2:30:32] to review his case and help us get his release, because he should not be in the Blue Bonnet detention [2:30:37] facility under these facts. Yes, ma'am. We were I'm committed to reviewing that case for you. I appreciate that. [2:30:43] The other issue that I am really very concerned about is these warrantless entries into people's homes. [2:30:52] It is a problem that is of epic proportion. There was just recently, yesterday, [2:30:58] circulation. A Latino family ice just broke into their home without a warrant. And there was an example [2:31:05] where they arrested a man in his pajamas who had every right to be here as a U.S. citizen, [2:31:11] but wrongfully snatched out in the freezing cold without a warrant to do so. The problem that we're [2:31:16] having, nobody wants to see attacks on ICE agents, sir. But this is something I have brought up in this [2:31:21] committee time and time again, which is unfortunately, under your leadership and under Secretary Noem's [2:31:27] leadership, this rogue brutality that ICE agents are inflicting upon the people of this country is not [2:31:33] being reined in. It's not being the agents who are abusing their power are not being held accountable. [2:31:41] I'm sure that there are many, many fine agents who are doing everything they can to exercise their duty [2:31:47] lawfully. But the problem is, there are agents who are not. And the power that they have has gone to [2:31:53] their head. And they use that power unconstitutionally in violation of many people's direct constitutional [2:32:01] rights. And what you're seeing in this country is the fact that your agency, you're not it's not [2:32:06] stopping. And rather than saying, yes, we're going to take steps to keep these people who are abusing [2:32:13] their power and who are terrorizing citizens of this country wrongfully, that we're going to hold them [2:32:18] account rather than have. Well, that's what we want to see. You're doubling down on that. We're only going [2:32:23] after criminals, which is in your own comments, you said that you had 397. I think that's right, [2:32:30] 379,000 arrests, but only 8700 of them were suspected gang members or known suspected terrorists. That's [2:32:38] 2%. And the problem is, we can't terrorize 98% of the people in this country that have been wrongfully [2:32:47] detained for 2%. That's that's not how the system works. And that is not okay. And so we have to do [2:32:56] a better job. And so what what procedures are you putting in place to hold agents accountable [2:33:05] who clearly have a hot trigger and who hear who clearly abuse their authority because someone has [2:33:10] a phone and a whistle? Ma'am, ICE does have the Office of Professional Responsibility. It's a robust [2:33:16] internal investigation agency that does investigate allegations of special agent or deportation officer [2:33:23] misconduct. And we do take everyone seriously and we do investigate those. Well, those are not being [2:33:28] public publicly reported. And so that's where there's a huge breach of the public trust, [2:33:32] because there does not appear to be any accountability, sir. Thank you. And I'll yield back. [2:33:37] General Lady yields back. I now recognize the gentleman from Pennsylvania, Mr. McKenzie, [2:33:41] for five minutes of questions. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And I appreciate all of our testifiers [2:33:46] being here today. Before I begin, I would like to thank all of our members of law enforcement across the [2:33:51] country who work every day to keep our communities safe and also to their families that sacrifice. [2:33:58] We know that it's a challenging job and the environment is made particularly challenging [2:34:03] by those who want to oppose our law enforcement from carrying out their lawful duties to keep everybody [2:34:09] in our country and our community safe. As was discussed earlier, there are a couple areas that were [2:34:16] I think it's appropriate to discuss potential reforms and the way that we can improve our [2:34:21] government operations. DHS guidance indicates that ICE does not arrest or detain U.S. citizens. [2:34:27] On the other hand, social media is full of reports and accusations that this is occurring. As you know, [2:34:33] any accusation that an American citizen's rights are violated is very serious. Can you clarify, Mr. Lyons, [2:34:40] whether this is something that it occurs and what are the circumstances where a U.S. citizen might be [2:34:47] detained and what steps does ICE take to prevent mistakes? Yes, sir. I appreciate the question. [2:34:52] Well, unfortunately, there's a misnomer that ICE is just a civil enforcement agency, and that's [2:34:58] completely wrong. ICE enforces over 400 criminal statutes as well. Special agents, especially with the [2:35:05] Homeland Security investigations, they're consistently out there doing human trafficking cases, drug cases, [2:35:10] terrorism cases, and we do encounter U.S. citizens, and those who do commit federal crimes are arrested. [2:35:16] But under Title VIII, no U.S. citizen is subject to civil immigration enforcement, and that just [2:35:20] doesn't happen. There are multiple safeguards in that way, and if a U.S. citizen is detained in the course [2:35:28] of an immigration investigation, they're quickly released. We don't take action on American citizens. [2:35:33] If it does occur where a U.S. citizen is detained during the course of another investigation, [2:35:39] how is that documented and conveyed to the public about the fact that this did occur and what the [2:35:45] circumstances around that were? So, sir, if you say it's a separate investigation, [2:35:49] if it comes to a criminal case, obviously a lot of those are on the seal or ongoing investigations. [2:35:55] We won't expose that, but we're transparent in the case when it comes to any U.S. citizens that's [2:36:02] detained in any law enforcement operations that's subsequently arrested. I appreciate that. I think [2:36:06] greater transparency could be beneficial for both the American public and everybody involved here [2:36:12] if we clearly articulate what occurred in many of these instances. I've seen it myself when I'm [2:36:17] looking into local issues in our community. There are oftentimes two sides of the story, [2:36:22] and when it is actually conveyed what did occur and why it occurred, there's a greater understanding [2:36:28] in our local community of the law enforcement activities that occurred. The second thing I would [2:36:32] like to hit on is jurisdictions, which are sometimes referred to sanctuary cities. Not a clear definition, [2:36:39] as we all know, but local authorities in our community, we have Northampton County, which does [2:36:45] not honor ICE detainer requests for 48 hours and properly convey to ICE and law enforcement about the [2:36:54] release of that individual, when that may occur, or even during that detainer period, allow ICE to come onto [2:37:01] their property to make an arrest in a secure facility. Obviously, that leaves our community in a vulnerable [2:37:08] position. In our case, members of Trende Aragua domestic abusers have been released onto the street, [2:37:15] and ICE had to stake out that location, making the arrests in an unsecure way out in the local community. [2:37:22] From your perspective, how does this dynamic affect public safety and day-to-day operations, and where [2:37:28] or how can we change and improve the coordination between ICE and state and local partners? [2:37:34] Thank you, sir. Again, and what I would say is just very basic communication would go a long way for [2:37:40] public safety. You know, ICE respects and abides by state and municipality laws or well, [2:37:46] where sometimes you can't hold for any reasons, but a simple phone call to let us know that that [2:37:52] individual is going to be released, or if that individual is released, sharing that biographical data [2:37:57] with us, we'll go a long way. Because the last thing we want is a criminal legal alien to go back [2:38:02] into the community, and more often than not, they prey upon other migrants who are coming here for a [2:38:07] better life, yet that they can hide in plain sight because these sanctuary jurisdictions won't just [2:38:13] pick up a phone, notify ICE that they're being released. Well, I appreciate that. I think we want [2:38:18] full cooperation between our local law enforcement and federal agents when they're trying to do their job. [2:38:23] If somebody is on a detainer, they should be allowed onto that property. Given the ability [2:38:28] within that detainer window to make a lawful arrest, I think it would go a long way to keeping our [2:38:32] community safe. I would like to thank all of you again for being here. The fact that you are here [2:38:37] and present for this kind of testimony, I think, brings greater accountability and increases the [2:38:42] ability for us to make reforms in Congress. Thank you again. [2:38:45] Gentleman yields back. I now recognize the gentlelady from New Jersey, Ms. Poe, for five minutes of questions. [2:38:51] Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and to our ranking member, Thompson. Gentlemen, thank you so very much for being here. [2:38:58] Let me just be clear. Secretary Noem must step down or be impeached by the House, period. [2:39:06] The lawlessness, the cruelty, the outright viciousness that she has created has destroyed an agency whose very [2:39:16] mission is to protect our country. Under Noem's leadership, congressional oversight is ignored. [2:39:24] Detention visits are blocked. Due process is ignored. And laws are broken without thought. [2:39:33] This is the first time any of you have testified before our committee. It took two American citizens [2:39:41] of being murdered in cold blood to get you to show up. Ice raids, schools, churches and hospitals. [2:39:50] And let's not forget five year old Liam Ramos. You used him as a bait and then detained him despite his father's [2:39:59] legally his father legally seeking asylum. Liam is the face of your cruelty. My district is one of the most [2:40:09] most ethnically diverse in America. Our diversity is our strength. But somehow you all seem to believe [2:40:19] it's a weakness. Last fall, the Supreme Court green-lit ICE's ability to yank people off the street based on [2:40:28] one thing such as, quote, the type of work one does speaking Spanish or speaking with an accent. And [2:40:37] their apparent race or ethnicity. Mr. Lyons, I speak Spanish. If I wasn't wearing any, if I wasn't [2:40:48] wearing my member pin, would me being a Latina or speaking Spanish be enough for ICE agents to harass me [2:40:56] or shove me into one of your unmarked cars? No, ma'am. I speak for all of us when I say that I think we know the [2:41:07] real answer to this. These are the realities traumatizing my constituents. We know that ICE is [2:41:17] transferring New Jersey detainees to other states like Texas, ripping them from their families and [2:41:23] leaving them unable to challenge their detention. Mr. ICE? Yes or no? I'm sorry, Mr. Lyons? Yes or no? [2:41:31] Ma'am, I'm sorry. Will you provide us with the list of people ICE has transferred from New Jersey to other [2:41:38] states so that I can inform their families where they are? Yes, ma'am. These are people like my [2:41:47] constituent, Lee, Lee, how Cordelia, whose ICE shipped to Texas and continues to detain, to detain, [2:42:00] despite two judicial orders compelling her release. Over the weekend, Lee Cow was hospitalized for 72 hours [2:42:14] while her family had no idea where she was at nor the status of her condition. Mr. Lyons, would you be [2:42:23] willing to look into this to make sure to release my constituent? Why have we failed? Why have you [2:42:31] failed to inform her family where she was sent and the status of her condition? When will she be freed? [2:42:40] Yes, ma'am. You have my commitment that I'll look into that. Thank you. Now soon, Mr. Lyons and all of you, [2:42:47] my district will host the World Cup matches and hundreds of thousands of visitors will come. [2:42:55] Visitors, confidence is plummeting and jeopardizing the World Cup. Mr. Lyons, will ICE commit, will you [2:43:05] commit to ensure that pausing its operations and raise at FIFA matches and other FIFA sanctioned public [2:43:13] events? Ma'am, ICE, specifically Homeland Security Investigations, is a key part of the overall [2:43:21] security apparatus for the World Cup. We're dedicated to securing that operation and we're dedicated to [2:43:27] the security of all our participants as well as visitors. You realize that if they feel that they're [2:43:32] going to be wrongfully incarcerated, wrongfully pulled out, that's going to hurt this entire process. [2:43:40] I hope you realize that. Yes, ma'am. And ICE is dedicated to ensuring that everyone [2:43:45] that visits the facilities will have a safe and secure event. Without these assurances, our local [2:43:51] communities and national reputations will indeed be suffered. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I yield back. [2:43:57] General Lady I yields back. I now recognize the gentleman from North Carolina, Mr. Knott, [2:44:01] for five minutes of questions. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Using the trope, [2:44:04] diversity is our strength, as an excuse for lawlessness, is unbelievably naive and dangerous. [2:44:12] Nobody in this room would say that diversity is a bad thing. Lawlessness is a bad thing. Law and order [2:44:18] is much more of our strength than open-bordered policies that welcomes anybody with no vetting. [2:44:23] And when you get down to the nuts and bolts of this issue, we would not be having this hearing if the [2:44:29] Democrats attacked illegal immigration with the same vigor that they're attacking law enforcement and the [2:44:33] men at this table. That's a fact. And it's worth noting that the dishonesty in framing these issues [2:44:42] has been unbelievably obvious. It's been consistent. And just to, as an anecdote, Mr. Lyons, [2:44:48] was Liam used as bait by your agency? No, sir. Actually, law enforcement officers took care of the [2:44:54] child after the father abandoned him. Walk us through what that means. So, sir, the individual that [2:45:00] was driving that vehicle with Liam I was in fled from the scene from the officers. Officers, he was [2:45:06] obviously upset. We comforted him. The officers actually placed him in one of our vehicles, played [2:45:11] his favorite song, favorite music. Then they took him to McDonald's. You all got him McDonald's. [2:45:16] So you all did not abduct him. You did not use him as bait. Any characterization of that is a lie. [2:45:22] And it has been repeated over and over by the Democrats to frame your agency. You know, [2:45:28] it's worth noting, again, that the Democrats fought to prevent any vetting of 20 million [2:45:32] illegal immigrants into this country over the last four years. They attack agents rather than those [2:45:39] who are assaulting agents today. They continually misframe what's happening in the ground. They [2:45:46] continually malign the law enforcement officers who are providing legal structure to otherwise lawless [2:45:53] landscapes in this country. And it's worth noting that there have been roughly 2 million people in the [2:45:59] country who have been removed in the last year, some voluntarily and then some by forced deportations. [2:46:05] We've heard roughly about 25 cases of alleged abuse. Some of them, as I just- as I just pointed out, [2:46:11] are dishonestly framed. But let's do a favor to the Democratic side. Let's increase that number by- [2:46:17] by 1,000 times. 25,000 cases of alleged abuse or improper protocols. We're steer- we are still operating at [2:46:26] roughly 99 percent proficiency. Given the scale of the problem, the scale of the solution that you [2:46:33] all are operating under, your agents are doing a remarkable job. And I thank you. But one issue that [2:46:41] I want to talk about is this idea of sanctuary policies. Sanctuary policies is not just a passive [2:46:49] relinquishing effort. It's an active obstruction. Isn't that true, Mr. Lyons? [2:46:54] Yes, sir. And what I mean by that is, when I say it's an active, to be specific, there are state- there [2:47:00] are sanctuary states and cities that will release violent criminals rather than handing them over to [2:47:07] pursuing federal law enforcement. Isn't that correct? [2:47:10] Yeah, that's correct, sir. [2:47:11] I left the hearing a few moments ago just to find a quick example. Here's one right behind me. Just 30 [2:47:18] hours ago, an illegal alien arrested for stabbing an American in the back. He was charged with attempted [2:47:25] murder. He pled to a lesser offense. The feds wanted him, sought a detainer. And then rather [2:47:31] than hold him for your agent's pickup, he was released back into the streets of Maryland. [2:47:38] That is not an unusual action from local, hostile law enforcement, is it, Mr. Lyons? [2:47:45] No, sir. That's what we face every day. [2:47:46] So we've heard the Democrats complain that we're not getting the worst of the worst, [2:47:50] but their sanctuary jurisdictions that control roughly 40 percent of this country's population [2:47:57] will actively release sex predators, drug dealers, violent offenders rather than hand them over to you [2:48:04] for deportation. And these are people who are already in custody. Am I correct, Mr. Lyons? [2:48:10] Yes, sir. The individuals were already deemed a public safety threat by local or state law enforcement. [2:48:14] And then when they get a federal detainer, they will release them [2:48:17] on the street rather than turn them over for deportation. [2:48:21] Yes, sir. It's disgusting. [2:48:22] Mr. Scott, I want to talk to you briefly. I'm running out of time. [2:48:26] How many cities does your agency operate in? [2:48:30] We operate nationwide. [2:48:32] Why is it that there is so much tension in Minneapolis-St. Paul right now? [2:48:37] Because paid agitators are actively trying to stop law enforcement action. Without that, [2:48:42] you wouldn't even have any idea most of these arrests were taking place. [2:48:45] In many parts of the country, local law enforcement assists [2:48:47] your efforts to bring legal structure to these lawless areas. Isn't that correct? [2:48:52] That's correct. [2:48:53] And when order is maintained, you can do your job peacefully, correct? [2:48:57] Correct. And all we've ever asked is for law enforcement to do their job, not necessarily. [2:49:01] In Minneapolis-St. Paul, local law enforcement in some cases have been prohibited [2:49:05] from maintaining order so you can do your job. Isn't that correct? [2:49:08] Correct. [2:49:09] Gentlemen, time is expired. [2:49:11] Thank you. [2:49:12] I now recognize a gentleman from Virginia, Mr. Walkinshaw, for five minutes. [2:49:16] Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Director Lyons, your opening statement referenced the importance [2:49:20] of protecting children, and I'm glad to hear your commitment to that. [2:49:24] I want to focus on one of President Trump's mass deportation policies that the experts say [2:49:30] harms children. Child detention. In this administration, under your watch, ICE has booked [2:49:38] nearly 4,000 children. And 1,000 of them have been held longer than the court-ordered 20-day limit. [2:49:47] Recently, ProPublica obtained handwritten letters and drawings from children detained by ICE. [2:49:54] These are letters from children describing what it feels like and what it does to them [2:49:59] when the government locks them up. This is Ariana. She's 14 years old, detained for 45 days. [2:50:09] Since I got to this center, all I feel is sadness and mostly depression. This is Mia, 7 years old. [2:50:17] I don't want to be in this place. I want to go to my school. This is Scarlet, 17 years old. I feel very [2:50:28] bored and overwhelmed because I am locked up. This is Gabby, 14 years old. I feel so much sadness and [2:50:38] depression of not being able to leave. This is Maria, 9 years old. Me in Dilley. I'm not happy. [2:50:50] Please get me out of here. This is a 12-year-old going to the doctor. And the only thing they tell [2:51:01] me is drink more water. The water here is what makes people sick. And this one got me, Mr. Lyons, [2:51:07] because this is a five-year-old. Luis Annie. My son's five. He can't write many words, [2:51:14] but he can communicate through drawings like this. This is a picture of Luis Annie's family. [2:51:19] And you might be able to see that none of the faces are smiling. Child detention is not required [2:51:30] by law. You know that. It's not the only option available. And it's not effective. We know that [2:51:37] community-based alternatives can ensure compliance with proceedings without traumatizing these children. [2:51:46] Yet you continue to detain and hold children for weeks or months, depriving them of school, [2:51:55] stability, leaving them afraid, sick and confused. And one of the key reasons for your mass detention, [2:52:04] including the detention of Liam and his father, is to pressure people to give up their legal [2:52:12] opportunities and pathways to remaining in the United States. Liam's father was following the rules, [2:52:18] following the legal process with a valid claim. Let me be clear. No child, not Liam Ramos, [2:52:26] not Gabby, or any of these children should be used as pawns in Stephen Miller's sick and twisted [2:52:35] Great Replacement agenda. Mr. Lyons, in 2025, the British Journal of Psychiatry analyzed all of the data [2:52:44] on the impact of immigration detention on children's health. Have you read that study and analysis? [2:52:52] No, sir, I haven't. You're the director of the—you're not familiar with that literature. [2:52:56] No, sir. You could tell me, I'm sure, chapter and verse on the tactics and the equipment that your [2:53:03] agents use, military-style equipment across the country in American cities, but you don't know [2:53:09] anything about the literature of the impacts of your policies on children. You haven't read it. [2:53:13] No, sir. The Flores Agreement—I'm sure you know that—sets a 20-day limit on detaining children. You and the Trump [2:53:24] administration are trying to terminate that agreement. How long would you like to hold children? [2:53:32] 20 days? 40 days? 60 days? 100 days? What's the right number, Mr. Lyons? [2:53:38] So we wouldn't like to hold any children. We would like to remove that family unit together [2:53:42] safely and humanely and as quickly as possible. Thank you. Since you haven't read the literature, [2:53:46] let me tell you what it says. Detention harms children. No period. No period. Not 20, 40, [2:53:57] 75 days that you're holding children can be deemed safe. All detention of children has adverse impacts [2:54:05] and is profoundly detrimental. Your policies are profoundly detrimental to children. I yield back. [2:54:14] The gentleman yields back. I now recognize the gentleman from California, Mr. Fong, for five [2:54:20] minutes of questions. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you all for those who are here testifying. [2:54:28] I want to thank you to you and your teams and your personnel for what you do. Commissioner Scott, [2:54:33] you mentioned in your testimony, national security cannot exist without effective border security. [2:54:37] Couldn't agree more. Everyone on your teams are doing tremendous work under difficult conditions, [2:54:43] and I want to thank you all. I do want to ask and dive in a little deeper as a Californian on the [2:54:50] dangers and the consequences of these sanctuary policies. Director Lyons, I was in the state [2:54:57] legislature in 2017 when sanctuary state policies were put in in California. I opposed SB 54 because at the [2:55:06] time, and everything has proven to be true, it was outlined that the impact on ICE and Border Patrol agents [2:55:12] was that there would be reduced information and access, agents would be conducting higher-risk [2:55:17] enforcement operations, and that there would be operational constraints when it comes to limiting [2:55:23] cooperation between state and local law enforcement. I wanted to get your perspective, Director Lyons, [2:55:29] and I'll go to you, Commissioner Scott, as well. Can you give specifics on how [2:55:36] these sanctuary state policies impact your operations in real time compared to non-sanctuary operations? [2:55:44] Well, sir, for ICE, I'll refer back to what we talked about earlier in my testimony. The fact that [2:55:52] when state or local or county agencies don't cooperate with Immigration Customs Enforcement, [2:55:57] it forces us to go back into the community, which we don't want to do. It also increases the number of [2:56:02] assets we have to put towards that arrest. Like I said earlier, I would much rather send one or two [2:56:06] agents or officers to make that arrest in a safe, secure location rather than being out on the street. [2:56:12] It's safer for everyone involved. And before I go to you, Commissioner Scott and answer, [2:56:17] I just want to let everyone know, in California, and I think it was just reported a couple days ago, [2:56:22] there were currently 33,179 illegal aliens in the custody of California jurisdictions with active [2:56:28] detainers. The crimes of these aliens include 399 homicides, 3,313 assaults, 3,171 burglaries, [2:56:36] 1,011 robberies, 8,380 dangerous drug offenses, 1,984 weapon offenses, and 1,293 sexual predatory [2:56:46] offenses. These are the real-world consequences, isn't that right, Commissioner Scott, when we don't [2:56:51] have cooperation, they're released into the community? Those are exactly the consequences. And I [2:56:56] would just add, California-specific, they went above and beyond everybody else, I mean, in a negative [2:57:01] way. They prohibited state and locals when they saw a crime taking place in front of them from [2:57:06] sharing that information with us. San Diego, for example, right after that law was passed, a highway [2:57:12] patrol pulled over a U-Haul van, and it was a smuggling event, probably a human trafficking event. [2:57:18] A border patrol agent just happened to roll up on it and found out, luckily, that highway patrol was [2:57:24] disciplined and actually investigated internally, and that sent a chilling effect across the entire [2:57:30] state of California that not only can you not actively take, like, help us, you couldn't even [2:57:35] pass information to us in a normal course of duties. Border security law enforcement's a team sport. We [2:57:41] need to be working together, not against each other. Now, can you explain what would have happened, [2:57:46] and I think you alluded to it, but what would have happened prior to that if there was local and state [2:57:53] coordination with federal law enforcement? On a daily basis, especially along the southwest border, [2:57:57] and let's not forget, and the coast, because we have boats coming in, when a state or local agency [2:58:02] would see illegal activity that they could take action on, and then they saw a federal crime, [2:58:08] they would contact us. It happened all the time, and that completely ceased to exist when SB 54 was passed. [2:58:14] And these crimes, of course, as you mentioned before, if you go into specifics, I mean, this is [2:58:18] trafficking, both humans and drugs. This is rape assaults. I mean, anything you're telling me that [2:58:24] if any of those crimes occurred, if right now under in California, if someone witnessed it, [2:58:31] if a state law enforcement or local law enforcement witnessed these crimes being committed, they could [2:58:35] not notify you. They have some felony exceptions, but in most cases, you don't know until you start [2:58:41] asking questions if it's just a smuggling event or a human trafficking event. Until you actually pop the [2:58:46] trunk of the vehicle or the back of the car, you don't know what commodity is back there, [2:58:50] if it's people or something else. It put a chilling effect beyond the actual written language [2:58:56] on any kind of cooperation in the state. Well, I want to thank you for that. Yes, [2:59:00] there were some exceptions when it comes to felonies, but someone who lives in California and was there [2:59:06] for the discussion and debate, everything we warned about when it came to sanctuary state policies [2:59:11] and the consequences to our community and the consequences to public safety, [2:59:15] they have come true. And that is sad and unfortunate, and we need to undo those policies. [2:59:20] So I want to thank you all for your leadership and testimony and your work. Thank you. And [2:59:24] Mr. Chairman, now you back. The gentleman yields back. I now recognize the gentleman from Louisiana. [2:59:28] Mr. Carter for five minutes questions. Mr. Chairman, thank you very much. And to our witnesses, [2:59:32] thank you for being here. What we've heard today and seen play out in the streets of this nation [2:59:39] for the past year, straight out of the Trump administration's fascist playbook, cheat, murder, [2:59:47] lie about it, practice the art of mass distraction. American people are not happy about this. This [2:59:58] administration's officials are sitting before us. Two people are dead. I understand that there's an [3:00:04] investigation and you cannot go into the details about that. But there certainly appears to be no shame [3:00:12] on the part of these officials who have undoubtedly watched some of your officers conduct themselves [3:00:18] in ways that I know you don't condone, not as law-abiding people, right? So I got to give you the [3:00:25] benefit of doubt. And I can't understand why you show no shame, no contrition, no remorse for the human [3:00:32] lives that have been lost or for the trampling of the Constitution and the tearing apart of the moral [3:00:40] fiber of our nation. They think, apparently. You think, apparently. You've been coached, apparently. [3:00:50] You've been called out of the room with a forced break to be told to be more aggressive, to push back [3:00:57] against questions. The American people saw that happen. The American people watched as you all looked [3:01:04] at each other, oh, I didn't ask for a break. And clearly you were called in the back to be coached, [3:01:09] a halftime locker room pep talk. This isn't a game. These are people's lives. We should all be, [3:01:22] you should be, your officers should be held accountable, that no one is above the law. [3:01:29] No one can evade the Constitution. No person can evade what is right. Even though you think [3:01:41] that Donald Trump will protect you, and maybe he will for now, but there will be a time that you [3:01:47] have to answer these questions. And while you have worked on many administrations and it's been asked, [3:01:52] you worked on different administrations, what's different? I'll tell you what's different. [3:01:55] The approach. The approach of how you conducted your search and seizure. The reason there were so [3:02:03] many others and they were not riots was because people were not being trampled. You had trained [3:02:08] officers who knew the art of de-escalation. They understood the rule of law. They understood [3:02:15] the Constitution. Yet now we continue to hear lies. Last year, I took members of Congress on an [3:02:22] oversight visit to ICE facility. We were told certain things that turned out to be patent lies. [3:02:28] They told us things that we witnessed within moments of being there to not be true. Yet we [3:02:34] continue to hear you and some of my colleagues suggest, don't believe your eyes. Don't believe [3:02:40] your ears. Just trust us. Well, the American people can see. And this notion that Democrats [3:02:46] don't want enforcement, those are talking points that are wrong. We want rapists and murderers off [3:02:53] the street. We want the bad, the worst of the worst, to be arrested and to be deported if they aren't [3:02:59] supposed to be. What we don't want is citizens running down the street being chased by ICE agents, [3:03:08] people being shot on the streets by rogue officers who are, in fact, American citizens. What we don't [3:03:16] want is to see people like Ms. Good or Mr. Prette simply doing what we often say, if you see something, [3:03:27] say something. We don't want to see people dying on the streets. So let me let me ask you [3:03:34] a quick question. Mr. Lyons, has ICE ever detained American citizens such as they are not free to [3:03:39] leave, whether it is on the sidewalk, the street or thrown into the back of an ICE vehicle because [3:03:46] they looked or sounded a certain way, even though they said they were American citizens? Yes or no, [3:03:52] quickly. I only got 38 seconds. No, sir. That's never happened before. That we've arrested one? No, [3:03:59] sir. We've detained individuals to verify identity, but we haven't arrested or deported. No, sir. [3:04:05] Detained arrest. Check it out. It's the same thing. Right. All right. Does what does an undocumented [3:04:12] person look like or sound like? Does it look like Mr. Garbarino? Does it look like me? [3:04:17] Could look like anyone, sir. Okay. Well, how are you training your people? Because you've said and others [3:04:22] have said if they sound a certain way, they look a certain way, we're going to stop them. That was quoted by [3:04:27] your people. What do you say to that? Sir, what I say is that ICE does criminal targeted [3:04:32] enforcement based on intelligence and we don't use the color of skin or accents for that. [3:04:36] So the person who said that was wrong? We'll let the gentleman get that answer in writing. His [3:04:43] time has expired. We will now recognize the gentleman from Tennessee, Mr. Van Epps, for five minutes of [3:04:48] questions. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, for holding this hearing and to our witnesses for testifying today. [3:04:53] I want to commend the job the Trump administration and you gentlemen are doing to secure the border, [3:04:59] enforce federal immigration laws and keep dangerous criminals off our streets. [3:05:04] Under President Biden, we saw unprecedented levels of illegal immigration and many of those who came [3:05:10] across the border were connected to transnational criminal organizations and have continued to commit [3:05:15] crimes while in the United States. Despite doing everything they could to secure our borders, [3:05:20] our brave CBP officers and Border Patrol agents were undermined at every turn by the Biden-Harris [3:05:26] administration. Yet under President Trump, CBP, Border Patrol and ICE have been empowered to do their [3:05:32] job and fulfill their mission. As a representative from Tennessee, I can't help but compare operations [3:05:38] in Minneapolis to those in Memphis. Federal law enforcement operations in Memphis have been successful [3:05:44] by every standard and metric, with Memphis State Task Force arresting over 6,000 people. And while [3:05:51] immigration enforcement isn't a stated goal of this task force, there is no question that it is also [3:05:56] taking place. The successful operations are due in large part to the outstanding leadership of Governor Lee, [3:06:03] who has worked closely with federal partners. Over the last year, the Trump administration has arrested [3:06:09] numerous gang members, pedophiles and drug traffickers in Memphis with little fanfare or interference from [3:06:14] activists. As a result of this cooperation, murders in Memphis are down by 47 percent since President [3:06:21] Trump took office, and overall violent crime is down by 30 percent. In May of last year, ICE enforcement [3:06:27] and removal operations worked with Tennessee Highway Patrol and DHS components to successfully arrest 196 [3:06:35] criminal illegal aliens across the greater Nashville area. I am grateful for the role the members of the [3:06:40] Tennessee Highway Patrol played in that operation, and their cooperation has made my district significantly [3:06:46] safer. Since then, over 56 partnering agencies are working together alongside ICE to keep Tennessee [3:06:54] safe. ICE has carefully highlighted the worst of the worst criminal aliens it has arrested. Today, [3:07:00] I will be entering into the record nearly 120 illegal aliens that have been arrested in Nashville, with [3:07:06] rap sheets ranging from identity theft to drug smuggling, larceny to arson, and robbery to rape. [3:07:12] Federal agents are executing their mission to defend American citizens and protect our communities. [3:07:17] The major challenge we've seen in Minneapolis and similar cities are directly caused by sanctuary city [3:07:23] policies and the refusal of local leaders to enforce the law, preventing local law enforcement from [3:07:29] working with ICE. This leaves ICE and others unsupported having to manage protesters and domestic friction [3:07:35] in addition to their actual mission of enforcing immigration law. Local law enforcement is crucial to [3:07:41] facilitate the mission. Director Lyons, contrast ICE's experience in Minneapolis with other cities [3:07:48] around the country, including Memphis and others, that have agreements to work with ICE. What can [3:07:53] successful partnerships with local law enforcement and other partners look like? Sir, thank you. I would say [3:08:00] that Memphis is a prime example, and I have to give credit to the U.S. Marshal Service that's leading that [3:08:05] operation. Homeland Security investigation agents are out there every day with the men and women of [3:08:10] Tennessee Highway Patrol, Memphis Police Department, and the reduction in crime has been significant. [3:08:15] But if you look across the country, almost at every state, we do have cooperative jurisdictions. [3:08:20] If you look at Texas, Texas, we have outstanding cooperation. You don't see any riots or anything like [3:08:24] that. You see side by side law enforcement working together as it would be. If you look at the state of [3:08:29] Florida, state of Oklahoma, state of Louisiana, all across the nation, we do have that. And what it is, [3:08:35] it is public safety. Thank you. Next, I want to commend the Trump administration for locking down [3:08:41] our southern border. A year ago, it was a highway for illegal aliens and illicit materials. Today, [3:08:46] it is secure and closed. Commissioner Scott, as Congress and the Trump administration enabled DHS to [3:08:52] secure the southern border, how are cartels and other criminal organizations adapting to effective border [3:08:57] enforcement? They're going to continue to to push back. I think some of it is in these protests, [3:09:02] because if we can shut down interior enforcement, that allows them to basically market their their [3:09:08] goods, if you will, to smuggle people in. And they need those people to be distractions, [3:09:12] because without it, they have to start digging million dollar tunnels. Without it, they have to [3:09:16] spend a bunch of money on drones, which we're countering. Without it, they have to go out into the [3:09:21] ocean where they stick out like a sore thumb. And we're increasing our radars on the west coast and [3:09:25] increasing our air coverage. Basically, it affects their bottom line. And it makes it harder and [3:09:30] harder for them to bring their poison and anybody that wants to threaten this country that's willing [3:09:35] to pay them here. Thank you. Mr. Chairman, I move to submit for the record, a list of DHS worst of [3:09:41] the worst in Tennessee, three quotes from Tennessee, seven sheriff supporting ICE, and five news articles [3:09:46] germane to the hearing in Tennessee. And so I yield back. Without objection. Gentleman yields back. [3:09:51] I now recognize the gentleman from Texas, Mr. Green for five minutes of questions. Thank you. Sorry, [3:10:01] Mr. Chairman. Can you hear me now? The microphone right there. Will you give me a moment to get a [3:10:11] bit closer, please? Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And I say it sincerely, I believe this is a most valuable [3:10:20] hearing. And I'm honored that the ranking member would be here with us to accommodate us, as is the case with [3:10:27] you. Mr. Lyons, is it true that you have a criminal justice degree, a bachelor's degree in criminal [3:10:37] justice? Yes, sir, it is. Is it also true that you have a master's degree in criminal justice leadership? [3:10:46] Yes, sir. And would you as a professional with two degrees in criminal justice indicate to us that if an [3:10:54] officer commits murder, that that officer should be prosecuted? Sir, any law enforcement misconduct [3:11:02] needs to be investigated and prosecuted. Investigated and prosecuted. And have you seen the widely published [3:11:09] video of the killing of Mr. Alex Preddy? Yes, sir. And sir, my assumption is that if I ask you whether this [3:11:22] was an injustice, you would say you cannot comment because of an ongoing investigation. Is that a fair [3:11:29] statement? Yes, sir. And what is the rationale for not responding to an ongoing investigation? [3:11:36] Sir, I don't want to impede or rigidize the investigation. No, no, no, no. Not this one. [3:11:42] Any. Any. As in your profession now. But any investigation. What's the rationale? Not this one. [3:11:48] Any. Same for any investigation, sir. I don't want to- You would not want to- I don't want to bias or put [3:11:54] my finger on the scale of any investigation. You not. What's the rationale for you're not testifying [3:12:00] about it is my question. I don't understand your question, sir. [3:12:04] Why would- What is the law say? What is the rationale? What harm would it do if you testified? [3:12:11] Because I don't want- have the full facts of the case yet, sir? [3:12:14] Exactly. That's what I expected you to say. You don't have the full facts. Thank you. And I assume [3:12:19] you would agree with this. Mr. Scott, is this true? Yes, sir. And Mr. Edlow, you would agree? [3:12:25] I assume so. I'm not a professional in law enforcement. Well, but you're a professional person [3:12:29] with a degree of intellect such that you can comment on whether or not- Well, I certainly would [3:12:33] not comment on any- Not a specific case. We're talking about now any case. Would you agree that [3:12:40] it would cause harm for you to testify before there's an investigation? Certainly, without [3:12:45] having all the facts. All right. Surely you would agree. Which brings us to Secretary Noem. Secretary Noem [3:12:55] accused Mr. Preddy of brandishing a firearm while wishing to inflect harm on the officers. Secretary Noem. [3:13:07] Same rules that apply to you apply to Secretary Noem. Accused this gentleman, Mr. Preddy, of [3:13:16] brandishing a firearm. Secretary Noem doing this when she did without an investigation. We have to agree [3:13:33] that there's not been an investigation. I don't think I have to ask you that. Not a complete investigation [3:13:37] that we all know of, anyway. She did it right afterwards. Having done this, she is violating [3:13:43] this very basic principle that you have called to our attention today. And we have to ask ourselves, [3:13:52] why would she go so far as to say brandishing when he did not? The video will clearly show it. And [3:14:01] she said wishing to inflict harm. Did not inflict any harm. But the Secretary, without an investigation, [3:14:14] made these comments. I'll tell you why. The Secretary was in a rush to cover up, to make sure that she [3:14:29] was protecting the officers without regard for the life that was lost. And in doing this, she was [3:14:42] violating not only this basic moral concept, she was breaking the law. The Secretary should be [3:14:50] investigated right along with those officers who are out there engaged in this ungodly conduct. She [3:14:59] should be investigated. And in my opinion, based upon my observation, the Secretary should not only be [3:15:07] investigated, the Secretary should be prosecuted right along with those officers. This man did not [3:15:13] brandish. This man was not armed. This man did not attempt to hurt those officers. They should all be [3:15:21] prosecuted. And you, persons associated with the Trump administration, say lock her up. I say lock [3:15:31] her up. The gentleman's time has expired. I now recognize the rank member for UCs. That's correct, [3:15:38] Mr. Chair. Mr. Chairman, I ask unanimous consent to insert two statements for the record. One submitted by [3:15:46] the Refugee Council USA and the other from the Baptist Joint Committee on Religious Liberty. That [3:15:55] objection? Mr. Chairman, on behalf of Ms. Ramirez, I ask unanimous consent to include in the record [3:16:03] three articles. One, a Chicago Sun-Times article describing how U.S. Border Patrol has separated a [3:16:13] family. Number two, an ABC-7 Chicago article that describes how ISIS warrantless arrests in Chicago has [3:16:23] been ruled unlawful by a federal judge. And third, a pro publica article documenting how immigration [3:16:34] agents are using banned chokeholds and other moves that cannot, can cut off breathing. [3:16:43] Mr. Chairman, I ask unanimous consent to insert in the record the following articles. A CBS News article [3:16:53] that states that, contrary to the administration's claim, only 14 percent of those arrested by ICE [3:17:01] had violent criminal records. An NPR story about a DHS memo that says ICE can enter people's home [3:17:12] without a judicial warrant, which has alarmed members on both sides of the aisle. An article from the [3:17:20] Marshal Project that alleges that there are thousands of kids in detention, many for longer than the court [3:17:28] prescribed limit. An article from the Independent about a sick five-year-old Lame Ramos asking for his mom [3:17:40] in a detention center, which rebuts testimony we heard today that ICE was taking good care of him. A report from the [3:17:50] the Center for Election Innovation and Research updated this month that found that non-citizen voting [3:17:58] is rare and allegations of the practice are a result of misunderstandings of fabrication. An article from the AP [3:18:09] which highlights that federal authorities are monitoring and tracking individuals who criticize [3:18:16] immigration enforcement operation. A report from the Brennan Center titled, ICE wants to go after the [3:18:24] sinners as well as immigrants. A report from the Guardian that describes the terrible condition in ICE [3:18:33] facilities and that ICE denied urgent medical care to a 10-year-old. [3:18:40] Bad objection. I want to thank the members or the witnesses for being here tonight and all the members for [3:18:47] their questions. Members of the committee may have some additional questions for the witnesses and we [3:18:51] ask that the witnesses to respond to these in writing. Pursuant to Committee Rule 7-E, the hearing [3:18:57] record will be held open for 10 days. I want to let the audience know that please still be seated while [3:19:05] the witnesses and their teams leave. Without objection, this committee stands adjourned. [3:19:10] On Wednesday, British Prime Minister Keir Starmer appears before members of the House of Commons [3:20:09] to discuss domestic and foreign policy issues during Prime Minister's Question Time. [3:20:14] Watch it live from London starting at 7 a.m. Eastern on C-SPAN 2. C-SPAN Now, [3:20:18] our free mobile app, or online at c-span.org. [3:20:21] Watch America's Book Club, C-SPAN's bold original series. Sunday, best-selling biographer Walter