How a 17-Year-Old From Tehran Turned $750 Into a Toy Empire — Isaac Larian

[00:00:00] Speaker 1: So this next guest is a story of someone who went from being a nine-year-old kid getting beat up on the streets of Tehran as a Jew, a poor Jewish kid who everyone hated, to building the largest private toy company on the planet. You know, it's a story of entrepreneurial success, but it's just a story of true survival. Yeah, overcoming adversity. I mean, I was a little choked up there for a second. So was I. I mean, he arrived in America 17 years old with no money and built an empire, a true empire, from brats to Nintendo to LOL dolls. The products he created have shaped modern culture, the modern zeitgeist. But if you go back to his childhood, he told this great story that coming home after getting beat up, his mom said to him, if you get beat up again, I'm going to beat you up. Tough love of you have to figure out a way to stand up for yourself and survive. He became a fighter. And he became a fighter, and he's still a fighter. Through a lawsuit from the biggest companies to, you know, sitting down with Sam Walton, founder of Walmart, and convincing him to buy his products and build a relationship together. [00:01:08] Speaker 2: But he doesn't have the characteristics that you would think a fighter has. I mean, what I took away from this is he's not afraid to be vulnerable. He cries a lot. He says that very early in the interview, and then he talks about how that played into these fights over time that were drawn-out fights. [00:01:24] Speaker 1: That's right, where actually, for him, vulnerability is not a weakness, but rather a strength. So now you've got this fighter, this tough guy, who's incredibly vulnerable. [00:01:32] Speaker 2: My favorite story was when he's talking about how he controls the supply and demand of Brad's dolls. I mean, Brad's dolls, the most successful dolls, wasn't that successful at first. I mean, he took out a second mortgage on his house and didn't tell his wife. [00:01:44] Speaker 1: And those bets he took, he keeps taking. We said to him in the interview, what happens if you lost it all right now? And very confidently, he says, I could do it again. So he has this quote that he loves, which is, fortune favors the bold. And I don't know if we've had anyone on the show who's as bold as Isaac is. And that, to me, is true confidence. He manifested everything he has. And the success he's had and the fortune he's created is because of incredible boldness and a courage to simply fight and work harder than everybody else. [00:02:19] Speaker 2: This is a spectacular story told by a spectacular storyteller. You're going to love it. It's unbelievable. Ladies and gentlemen, Isaac Larry. [00:02:42] Speaker 1: Isaac, we're going to start. I mean, I think the thing, actually, that we find to be remarkable is that at 17 years old, on your own, you end up coming from Tehran to the United States, under $1,000, I think like $700 in your pocket that your uncle lends you, I believe. But we actually want to go way back to you living in Iran. One of the things that Dave and I, as entrepreneurs, always did is we always had little jobs, little businesses, little hustles when we were kids. You worked at your father's store when you were nine years old, I believe. Tell us about that experience. Let's start there. [00:03:21] Isaac Larry: Yeah. So I'm going to go back a little bit. You know, my dad, I was born in Kashan, which is about 150 kilometers from Tehran. And at one time, he had a big, big Jewish community. And now there is, there are two, three synagogues, but one person to take care of. So, wow. So my dad was an entrepreneur, a textile merchant, and very successful. But he also liked his friends more than he liked his family, I guess. What do you mean by that? He, everybody who asked him for money, he would give, and then, you know, because of that, he went bankrupt. [00:04:07] Speaker 1: Wow. [00:04:07] Isaac Larry: Because they wouldn't pay him back. [00:04:08] Speaker 1: Was it, was it generosity? [00:04:10] Isaac Larry: Yes. Too much of it. But I think really generosity can be there, but not at the expense of your family. My dad went bankrupt and moved to Tehran and moved to an area called Narmak, which was truly the slums of the world. No running water, no electricity, none of that. And, you know, my dad, my mom, who just recently passed away, came from a wealthy family, but she went along with him. And we were, I was raised there. And imagine, now I have a lot of Muslim friends, but that area in Narmak was all fanatics, all fanatics. And, you know, one of the things, I'm going to give you an example. A lot of fanatic Muslims believe that the Jews are dirty. So if you go out, so when it was raining and I was walking to school, I would get beaten up because I was Jewish and I was dirtying the earth and I should have stayed in my house. Wow. So that's how the whole thing got started. I was bullied a lot growing up in that area to a point. My mother had me when she was 14 years old. So, you know, one day I came back from school and I was bloodied. My mother said, if you ever come back home bloodied again, I'm going to also hit you. So you better fight back. So I started, you know, I made dumbbells out of bricks and started pumping up in my head and my body also to fight back. So the next time I was, I think I was about seven or eight years old that I went out and this, the group was a circle. The bullies were a circle and the biggest bully in that group was a guy named Mortaza. You remember his name. Yes, of course, I never forget that. So they circled around me and put me to fight with him. And what I remember is that I got so pumped up and he was bigger than me. But I hit him so hard, to be honest with you, I had rage. I had, I couldn't see anything. And when, when I got a hold of myself, I saw him on the ground bloodied and people are trying to take me out, pull me out. That was the end of the bullying. Mortaza became one of my best friends. [00:07:23] Speaker ?: Wow. [00:07:24] Speaker 1: That's an amazing story. And then also, you know, that idea, that, that metaphor of you being smaller than the others, but you outworking them or having more chutzpah, audacity. That feels like it's a bit of a theme for your, for your life. [00:07:37] Isaac Larry: Yes, yes, exactly. So this was the foundation of who I became and what I became. And there are other incidents, another incident that I remember so well. In Iran, in winter, Tehran, December, snows like it does in, right now in New York or East Coast. And it was snowy, snowy there. I would, I think I was seven or eight years old. And a creditor of my father knocked on the door to come in. My father, we all lived in one room, a little bigger than this. Okay. We slept on the floor. So, at that time, it was me and my sister, Shirin, who was four years old. And one of the creditors with a bouncer, really, was at the door. And my dad said, go get the door, see who it is. I went there and my instinct was, these are bad guys. So I said, my dad is not here. They passed, crashed through me, went to the room and beat my mother. I mean, my father, so hard with the metal stick this big, that he was bloody on the floor. I was frozen. I couldn't do anything. And my mother was crying. My sister was crying. And they said, you give, they said, okay, tell him to bring us the money. Or next time, we're going to kill him. And they left. They left. My mother said, go get your uncle. And I walked maybe four or five kilometers in the snow to go get my uncle. I had galush. I don't know if you know what it is. So, it had holes in it. My socks had holes in it. And my feet, I still feel it, was freezing while walking in the snow to get my uncle. And during that walk, I cried and I promised myself that one day I'm going to have so much money that my family is not going to go through this. And that became the metaphor, the thing that really made me, I said that story, I became the U.S. Entrepreneur of the Year. I don't remember, I don't remember, I don't remember, 2008. And I said that story to the people or 2,000 people in my speech. And a lot of people started crying. But that became the metaphor for everything I did going forward. [00:10:48] Speaker 2: And Isaac, it's quite a traumatic experience. You're a young boy. You must have had a lot of mixed emotions around your father. How did you see him? [00:10:59] Isaac Larry: Yeah. [00:10:59] Speaker 2: You know, were you mad at him? [00:11:01] Isaac Larry: I was. And to be honest with you, that anger, it lasted for many years. And my father on his deathbed told me, please forgive me. And because, you know, as you said, he had a small shop. I would go work, come from school, go work in the shop. I would take two buses to go down to Bazar, two buses would take three hours to go buy textile and bring it back because of two reasons. My mother said, oh, he has a better taste for textile than you do, told my dad. And my dad was happy because if he wasn't there, the creditors would not ask him for money. And so there is, and that's what I did. I mean, I got to tell you another thing about Bazar of Tehran. In Bazar of Tehran, where you go, they have, as you enter, they have this circular water and with metal glasses on chains. If you're thirsty to drink. But there was a sign, and I'm talking during Shahz, I'm sure it's still there, that says, only for Muslims. [00:12:33] Speaker 1: No Jews. [00:12:34] Isaac Larry: No Jews. And I said, fuck it. I was thirsty. I took glass. And drank it. They saw me. So they started running after me, running after me. And I was running. I was running fast. And I went to one of my father's friends who was also a textile maker. He says, what happened? I said, this is what happened. And they're coming. He says, go hide. He went and hid me behind the racks of textile. And these guys came and said, he said, what's going on? And they said, we're looking for this guy who drank water from the area. And he's a Jew. And my father's friend says, well, I haven't seen anybody here. Get the hell out. So they left. I stayed there until 4 or 5 a.m. And then I left. The Bazar of Tehran is huge, grand. I didn't go back through the main entrance. I went through the side to get back. So all these things here have really built me to fight. [00:13:54] Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, it's not just your father. It's not just the fighting of the creditors. It's also the fact that you're a Jew in a Muslim country. So they want to hurt your father because he didn't have a lot of money. They want to fight you because you were Jewish. I mean, that type of adversity, I think, is part of why Jews have been successful. Right. Yes. Do you believe that? [00:14:16] Isaac Larry: There, I 100% believe it. You have a hunger. If you come, not the new generation, not the new generation. You know, when I came here, I worked in the... You came here in what year? What year? 1971. You were 17 years old. 17 years old. [00:14:36] Speaker 1: And why did you come to the U.S.? [00:14:38] Isaac Larry: Never. I'm going to tell you a funny story. You guys are too young. I used to go to movies, watch movies, American movies. It was a movie called Easy Rider with Peter Fonda. And he was on the motorcycle and all these blonde girls, etc. So shit, I said, I have a big Afro and a little olive scone. I used to have a big Afro. I'm going to go to America and become successful and see some of these girls. So that's the reason. Wow. You came for the women. [00:15:10] Speaker 1: And what did your parents say when you said, I want to go? [00:15:13] Isaac Larry: So my dad, because I was still working at the shop, the shop had gotten bigger. My mother worked at the shop. Was your dad rich? [00:15:21] Speaker 1: No. Okay. But he was able to pay the bills. [00:15:24] Isaac Larry: Yes, finally. But, you know, my mother worked at the shop. My brother worked at the shop. My sister worked at the shop. And I worked at the shop. [00:15:31] Speaker 2: And this is the second shop, right? The first one went bankrupt. [00:15:34] Isaac Larry: Yeah. No, the first one was a wholesale textile. Right. It was a big business. That was when it bankrupt. But my dad never recovered. So to your earlier point, yeah, I was angry at my father. You know, I never had. He stole my childhood. I never went to. My life was work and study. Work and study. Nothing else. No camps. None of these things here. So that's why I was angry at my father. But the reason I said the new generation versus the last generation is, so when I came here, 17 years old, $753. By the end of, I think, 37 or 40 days, I had 25 quarters in my pocket. And I was in my hand. In my pocket, I would count it. And I started looking for a job. I lived in Inglewood. And I started walking down La Brea, going to every 7-Eleven, every gas station, every coffee shop, every restaurant to get a job. And 11 and a half, 12 miles, and nobody would give me a job. Finally, I got to a coffee shop called Aspires Coffee Shop. And they also said, we have nothing. So, I started walking back, hungry, thirsty, crying. And the guy who was behind the counter looked at Middle Eastern. So, as I'm walking, he put his hand on my back and said in Farsi, are you Persian? I said, yes. He said, come back. So, we went back, and he sat me down and gave me liver and onion. That coffee shop was still there. I still, after 40, was it 50 years, 45 years, I still go there to have liver and onion. So, that was my first meal, real meal in America. And he gave me a coffee, and then he says, I have one job for you. It's washing dishes at 11, from 11 p.m. to 7 a.m. It's called Graveyard Shop. That's $1.65 an hour. And he said, do you want it? I said, yes. And if you touch my hand here, I still have it from the hot plates. So, I took my three kids to that coffee shop. They were all born here. And, you know, my oldest son, Jason, said, wow, dad, sorry, you went through this. We appreciate all the hard work you have done. My daughter, who owns a business now called Cult Gaia, she just had a show. She does $100 million. I'm really proud. [00:18:47] Speaker 1: Amazing company. Tell her about it. Yeah. [00:18:48] Isaac Larry: Yeah. She does $100 million a year. Amazing. And she's also a friend of each. So, she was, oh my gosh, she started crying. My youngest son, Cameron, said to me, and I never forget these words. He says, dad, you work so hard, so we don't have to. So, the point I'm making is that I hope the next generation has that hunger. Yeah. I hope they keep the tradition going. Yeah. I'm not very religious, but I think the religion gives you the roots of a tree. Culture. Yeah. Keeps it together. Keeps it on the ground. If you don't, if a tree doesn't have roots, a wind will come and fall down. Yeah. [00:19:40] Speaker 2: So, when did you stop being afraid, though? I mean, this is, there's adversity, and then there's what you went through. Yeah. When, was there a moment where you just, you stopped being afraid? [00:19:50] Isaac Larry: There was, yes, so I went through a lot of things, and I, when you were at the bottom, you know, I gave a speech for my son's barbiswa, and one of the things I said there is that when life is like a roller coaster, when you're at the bottom, there's nowhere else to look but up. But when you are on the top, you need to be like a pomegranate tree, because when you look at the pomegranate tree, the more food it has, the more it bows down. You have to be humble. You have to bring your head down. So, to your question, you know, as I thought, I'm still, you know, I went to, I go to a therapist, and he says, Isaac, you made it already. You need to stop fighting, and it's in my DNA. [00:20:52] Speaker 1: You can't, you can't stop. You can't. There's no way, because this, the survival instinct is so baked into, in fact, I think it's, it's baked into, you know, we often talk about 8 billion people on the planet. [00:21:02] Isaac Larry: Right. [00:21:03] Speaker 1: 15 million Jews. Right. Tiny. [00:21:05] Isaac Larry: Yeah. [00:21:06] Speaker 1: But if you look at the impact on entrepreneurship, it's so disproportionate. And the only explanation that we can, we hear is that it's because no one gave us a chance. It's because we have the survival instinct. Right. There's grit. Right. The only problem is that there's no off button for it. [00:21:23] Isaac Larry: Right. [00:21:24] Speaker 2: Is it a blessing or a curse, or it's a double-edged sword? [00:21:26] Isaac Larry: It's a double-edged sword. I mean, two, two, but 10, 15 years ago. Now, you know, business, my business is thriving, and I'm flying business class. So I'm flying to go to Nuremberg on Lufthansa, and on a business class. The guy sitting next to me, blue-eyed guy, et cetera. So I started talking to him, and he said, what's your name? I said, I gave him my, because he had an accent. So I gave him my Persian name, which is called Eshau. And I said, where are you from? He said, I'm from Syria. Oh, what do you do? I'm a pharmacist. Oh, great. And so we started talking. Oh, we are Syrians, and the Iranians have a lot of things in common. Then he started going after the Jews, saying the Jews control everything. Control banking, control businesses, control everything. Media, the same shit you hear now. So I said, yeah, interesting. When we landed in Frankfurt, I took my phone. I had, while he was talking, I went on Google, and I said, how many Jews live in the world? He says, oh my God, at least a billion. So I showed him the Google, and I said, 13.7. By the way, my American name is Isaac, and I'm an Iranian Jew. And his face was so red until we got to the terminal to get out. He was ashamed of what he said. Now, I don't want to talk about, and make these interviews I've done in the past about Jews were Muslims. The guy who gave me my first job in America was Muslim, and some of my best, best friends still are Muslims. So you have to distinguish between them, but for me, it was not about the religion. It was about survival, being able to survive. And I said, I still work 15 hours a day, and when I'm on vacation, I'm also working. [00:24:17] Speaker 1: We're not, we've discussed that we don't, none of us vacation very well. Right, yeah. [00:24:22] Isaac Larry: None of us do, you know. [00:24:23] Speaker 1: In fact, this show, Big Shot, came because David and I were on vacation in Turks and Caicos, on the beach. We were supposed to be relaxing. We conceptualized this entire show, because the way that our minds work, there's these sort of antibodies that stopping is death. Right. And you've got to kind of keep going. It's a river, not a faucet. That's right. I want to ask a little bit about, so, you know, you worked at your debt store at nine. Your business out of college, surprise gift? Wagon. [00:24:50] Isaac Larry: Yeah, wagon. I'm a civil engineer, by education. [00:24:54] Speaker 1: So you went to university here. [00:24:55] Isaac Larry: Yes, and in 1978, I graduated from a university called Cal State LA, which is in the East Coast, for blue collar work. [00:25:06] Speaker 2: Just to put this in context, you didn't speak English when you got here. [00:25:09] Isaac Larry: No, I didn't speak any English. I had a dictionary and I would read that. I would listen to Johnny Carson at night. Yeah. Because that's, I said, okay, I got to hear the words. And I would get LA Times and go through it line by line and look at each dictionary to see what it says. So I didn't speak. My kids say, oh, you still don't speak English. [00:25:33] Speaker 1: I think you speak fine. Yeah. But you decided to go to college and you take civil engineering. Right, yes. [00:25:38] Isaac Larry: Why? Because in Iran was rebuilding. And a lot of engineers, a lot of Persians who came to America have been in engineering. But, you know, they are, they are, Iranians are some of the smartest people. If you go look at NASA. It's unbelievable. Yeah. It's like 10% of them are, are Iranians. Yeah. And then Khosrow, who is the CEO of Uber. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. He is Iranian. So, because we, when we went to school in Iran, our, the education level was so much higher. If you failed one class, you had to repeat every other class for another year. [00:26:31] Speaker 1: And there's a work ethic also, I believe, with our friends that are Persian and are Iranian. They work so hard. There's this incredible, you know, ability to just outwork everybody else. It's remarkable. [00:26:44] Isaac Larry: Yeah. Because they're hungry. They're hungry. They want to show a shame on the... And you had both. [00:26:50] Speaker 2: You had Jewish and Iranian, you know, which is, well, I mean, you get this degree in, in engineering. Right. [00:26:57] Isaac Larry: So, I wanted to go back to Iran and build buildings. [00:27:00] Speaker 2: Yeah. The country. Yeah. But instead, you've got to sell tchotchkes now. [00:27:04] Isaac Larry: Yeah. So, yeah. So, I, after the revolution, first of all, when I graduated, it was the most depressing day of my life. It was raining in L.A. and I had a VW, old VW bug. I drove it in the rain from L.A. to San Diego and back, crying. I cry a lot. So, because I said to myself, fuck, now what? I worked, I didn't go, I didn't have a childhood here, didn't have Saturday nights, I worked. Friday nights, I worked. I worked during the holidays, New Year's Eve, I worked because they paid you three times. So, what for, was it worth it? So, I came back, and I started, I got a job for a week or two weeks for, with the California Highway Patrol. And these guys were asking me to go bring files. So one day I said, I didn't, I worked hard to get my degree, I want to go do filing for you. He said, oh, you got to earn your way. And I said, earn my way, fuck you. [00:28:21] Speaker 1: I've already learned, I wrote there. [00:28:23] Isaac Larry: Yes. I quit. I quit, and I had about $13,000, $14,000 in savings. So one of the classes I had taken at school was, because I took civil engineering and marketing at the same time, was about mail order. And so, I learned from this guy who was also a professor who had made his money in mail order, that, hey, mail order is a good business. So I started, and he taught what you do. At that time, you didn't have Shopify or Amazon, etc. He would put ads in the magazines, and he had to wait three, four months. And one of the things he taught was, you go get a magazine, and if you see the same ad, three, four, five times, that means that product is successful. So, I saw this brass giftware, wear three, four, five times in this home and garden magazine, etc. So, I said, okay, I'm going to do that. So, I went to the Korean consulate in downtown LA, and I said, do you guys know what a telex machine is? Of course. Another big shot. [00:29:45] Speaker 2: We didn't, but another big shot. [00:29:47] Isaac Larry: Yeah. It was a telex machine. And I bought a telex machine. You had to type like this, and if you made a mistake, you had to redo the whole goddamn thing all over again. So, I started sending telexes to these Korean suppliers asking for brass and they would send me the pictures. So, I started buying those and putting ads in Home and Garden and other magazines. Wow. [00:30:16] Speaker 1: And that was all from your $12,000 of savings? Yeah. You were spending your own money? No, no, no. [00:30:22] Speaker 2: You didn't raise money? No, no, no. But is your brother in the business with you right now? No, not yet. Okay. But this wasn't actually very successful. I think it wasn't until Electronics. [00:30:29] Isaac Larry: Yeah. Well, it was successful, but I'm impatient. I always tell people that if I had the patience, I would have been Jeff Bezos. I would have gone and made mail order. But you know, at that time, you had to put the ad, it would take three months before the magazine comes. Then you go to the PO box to pick up the checks, and then you got to mail it. So, it wasn't big enough, and I was impatient. I was impatient. So, I called that company Surprise Gift Wagon. And then, you know, I said, okay, this is not going to make me wealthy. So, now I know import, export, and I started studying electronics. And there was a company called Olympic Sales in LA, who did big advertisement in LA Times, a full page, selling Walkman's, Apple Computer, believe it or not. He was the Apple distributor, et cetera. So, I started watching that, and Sony Walkman 3 came out. It was this big. The first portable electronics. And it was $220. You couldn't get it. You would go to buy one. They didn't have it. So, I said, okay, I'm going to go after this. So, I went to the Japanese console at this time, and asked for the list of all the electronic distributors in Japan. And I got lucky. I saw somebody offered me 18 pieces of Sony Walkman 3 at $90. I said, shit, I'm going to go buy this, bring it, and sell it to Olympic Sales, and below $220, and make money. And I have the inventory. So, the guy in Japan says, yeah, send the money by, you have to send the money by Swift. At that time, it was not wire, Swift. Right. So, I sent the money. And sure enough, they gave the merchandise to forwarders. I air freighted it here to LA. And by the time I cleared customs, et cetera, my cost now was, I think, $120, $130. I had a Ford car with the back. So, I put those in my car and went to Olympic Sales, 216 South Oxford. You remember the address? Yeah. I ended up buying that building. A real big shot move. We love that. Yeah. I'm from France. I said, shit. One day, I'd like to buy that building. I want to buy that building. Yeah. And I bought it. Amazing. So, you manifest the things that you make up in your mind. Yeah. So, I went to him and I went to the cash register and I said, to the receptionist, I said, I want to see the owner. He says, who are you? I said, I'm Isaac Larian. What do you want? I said, I have certain merchandise I want to sell to Olympic Sales. So, he's saying, well, he's not here, etc. This short Moroccan guy, French guy walks out and he, the receptionist gets very excited. So, I thought he's the owner. So, I said, are you the owner of Olympic Sales? And he says, yes. And I said, my name is Isaac Larian. What's your name? Francis Ravel was his name. So, he said, what do you want? I said, I have Sony Walkman 3 that I want to sell. So, he said, do you have Sony Walkman 3? I said, yes. He said, how many do you have? I said, I have 18. He said, where is it? In the back of my car. Which is in the parking lot. Yeah. No, on the street. On the Oxford. Yeah. So, he says, are they stolen? I said, no. So, I said, I have, it's not stolen. He said, let's go take a look. So, he goes and I show him this. He said, how much do you want for this? I told him, I think 135. I was making $18, $20 a unit. For me, it was great. And he says, okay, I will buy it all. One condition. I don't know who you are. I don't know if these are stolen or not. I will give you 30 days posted the check. So, you cash the check in 30 days. And that's how I got started in electronics. And I became the king of gray market. King of gray market. Because at that time, and I always, you know, my mind worked like this looking for arbitrage. Yeah. Looking at what to do. So, I found out that the Japanese, I still think they still do that. They make the product and they sell it to America at a higher price than they sell it to Panama. Because they think, okay, this guy is per GDP. Right. So, then I went to Japan. And I started meeting with these guys. I went to a place called Akihabara. Which is, I don't know if you've been there. It's an electronic mecca of the world. [00:36:08] Speaker 1: It's like Shenzhen, but in Japan. Yeah. No, but this is all the stores. And all the brands are there. [00:36:13] Isaac Larry: It's all the electronic, all the stores are there. So, that's how I got started. And I took my profit. And I went to Japan for the first time. I went to Akihabara, bought every Sony Walkman. Now I expanded to Yamaha DX7, etc. And brought it here and kept selling it. And published the mail order catalog. [00:36:36] Speaker 1: But you were not, I mean, were you direct to consumer at this point? Or you were wholesaling? No, I was wholesaling. [00:36:41] Isaac Larry: You were wholesaling. I was wholesaling. But there was, at the time, back then, a lot of small electronics chains and stores. At that time, CMC was the biggest, not Best Buy. Yeah, yeah. They went out of business. And they were small, and they were all always fragmented. [00:36:58] Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah. Isaac, I'm listening. You've had a lot of incredible guests on Big Shot. You're a remarkable storyteller. Thank you. Where did you learn how to be a great storyteller? [00:37:08] Isaac Larry: It's not, you know, life is the real life. It's just, you know, I think it comes naturally when you experience things in your life. Now, there are people who are victims. And those who are victims are never going to make it. They're never going to make it. Because always, I could have said, okay, it's my dad's fault. Is this guy's fault? Nothing. I cleaned my head, and I fought. And, and, next, next. And the reason I became good at storytelling, because I told and taught my children. I taught my children. And this is, like, one of the things, when my kids were growing up, I have three of them, as I told you. You know, I told, I always said, never say no in, in the house. And fear is an effort. Don't ever have fear or say about fear. So, I said, if she, my kid, my dad, really, we can do everything? Yes. Like, I said to them, you can walk on water. So, it was somewhere we were sitting next to the pool. And my daughter says, dad, look, look, look. And he starts jumping and walking and sinks in. And then, you know, my son did it. Oh, did I do that? Yes. More. Next time. Next one, more steps. More steps. So, I like to, I like to, I like to share back to the people. I, you know, Cal State LA, where I went to school, they invite me for these entrepreneurial classes also at UCLA. And I go and I think people like to listen to stories. So, come 200, 220 people. And the first thing I write on the whiteboard is, in order to succeed, you must embrace failure. In order to succeed, you must embrace failure. Because from failure, you learn to get up and do it again. And do it again. And do it again. [00:39:31] Speaker 1: And do it again. And relative to your childhood, nothing can actually hurt you. Because you've had the worst in the world. You can go lower. Yeah. You got beat up. You watch your father get beat up. You're in Tehran, every, you know, as a Jew. Right. Talk to us. So, through this sort of- My cousins are wealthy and rich and go. Yeah. And you're getting beat up. Yeah. I want to talk about the progression from selling Walkmans to what seems to be a This is your first big break, which is really Nintendo. Right. [00:39:57] Isaac Larry: Yeah. Tell us that story. So, I became known. First of all, I named the company ABC International. No more surprise gift back. And the reason was, at that time, there were yellow pages. So, your ABC, you were the first guy. [00:40:16] Speaker 1: First guy. [00:40:17] Isaac Larry: Very smart. Yeah. And then I went and registered the name, 1-800-A-B-C-I-N-T-L. So... International. No. The 800 number. Yeah. So, people can call and place orders. So, I started publishing catalogs and sending it to all these small stores, et cetera. My business became 70 million dollars a year. Wow. How old are you at this point? 24, 25. Incredible. Yeah. It was incredible. So... And I became the target of many, many Japanese electronic companies. Roland, Yamaha, all of them. But I am in Japan. You know, I was a distributor for Atari. Atari went bankrupt. So, I am reading Wall Street Journal now. And Nintendo has become a five billion dollar business. So, in Osaka, from Osaka to Kyoto, where Nintendo's headquarters still is, by train is about an hour. So, I get on the train. I go to their headquarters. And I go to the front and give my business card. And I said, "I need to talk to the export manager." And she picks up the phone and says, "There was something in Japanese." And I said, "He's not here." And I said, "What's his name?" Again, she picks up, "He's not here." So, I said to myself, "She's talking to somebody. Somebody's here." I said, "Okay, I'll wait until he comes." So, I sit in the reception at Nintendo. And every female, she looks at me, faces red, and talks to somebody. And if you've been to Japan, they work like a machine. At 12:30, everybody goes to lunch. At 1:30, they come back. So, at 12:30, the whole group is out. And there's one tall guy who goes to talk to the receptionist and looks at me. And he comes and says, "I am..." No, he didn't say that. He left. They went for lunch. And the receptionist says, "Lunch time." He said, "I'm not hungry." I said, "Poor girl." I had to sit there because I was sitting there. [00:43:04] Speaker 1: Because you didn't want to leave. I didn't want to leave. And you were not going to leave until you were going to meet someone. You were in Japan. [00:43:10] Isaac Larry: You were going to do this. Slow all the way down from there. Incredible. I'm going to do this. And I come back and this tall guy comes over to me and says, "I am Mr. Toduri." I'll never forget his name. And I am the export manager. What do you want?" He said, "I want to buy a Nintendo game and watch and sell it in America and Latin America because you don't sell it there." And he says, "Not interested." And I said, "Wow. Can I have your business card?" So, I gave him mine. And the Japanese are polite. So, he gave me his business card. And he says, "Not interested." I came back to LA. I banked with Mitsui Manufacturers Bank at the time. I went there and opened a million dollar letter of credit. Full cable. Attention, Mr. Toduri. Full cable. Attention, Mr. Toduri. Of Nintendo. And two days later, I called. And I said, "Mr. Toduri, this is Isaac Larian. Did you get my letter of credit?" "Yes, I told you I was not interested." I said, "I wanted to show you how serious I am." And Japanese, when they take your money, they don't want to give it back. So, he says, "Okay, we will sell it to you only in Japanese packaging." And I said, "Can you give it to me in bulk?" Because I had to repackage it here. "No, only in Japanese packaging. And it takes three months." I said, "Okay." So, I had bought some samples. And I went and found a packaging company. And I changed, I put my company name, Micro Games of America. It was Nintendo of America, Micro Games of America. Same fonts, same type of things. And repackaged this. Then I hired, at that time Nintendo used to have reps. And I hired a rep who was here, Ron Bernard, who passed away. And I said, "I have the rights for a Nintendo game and watch out." So, he helped me price it, et cetera. [00:45:26] Speaker 1: But to be clear, you didn't have the rights? No. They said yes to the rights? Yeah. [00:45:31] Isaac Larry: Okay, all right. And it was exclusive? No. No, no. They don't do that. So, it's a fascinating story here. So, first year, I imported and sold $23 million worth of Nintendo game and watch. Wow. To everybody. Walmart, Target, everybody. Everybody. And made 32% margin. But in consumer electronics, you're lucky because you have branded names to make 8%. I thought I'd died and gone to heaven. How did you make 32% when everyone else made eights? No. You made 8% of consumer electronics. [00:46:10] Speaker 1: Yes, right. But how did you make 32? [00:46:12] Isaac Larry: Because Ron Bernard told me that, "Hey, you need to pay rep 5%. This is how we're going to price it." And Ron was working for Nintendo. [00:46:19] Speaker 1: You poached him? He was a rep. [00:46:21] Isaac Larry: He was a rep. Okay. He was an independent rep. And then he knew all the other Nintendo reps around the country. Were you early? [00:46:28] Speaker 2: I mean, presumably Nintendo had multiple reps trying to sell into Walmart at the same time. [00:46:33] Isaac Larry: Well, Nintendo did not sell Game & Watch. These were the first handheld games. This is before Game Boy. [00:46:40] Speaker 2: Yes. So you just beat everyone to the punch? [00:46:44] Isaac Larry: No. No. Because Nintendo started here with, let's say, Yamaguchi, who was son-in-law of the owner. And he started selling Nintendo Game & Watch in America. And he failed. He failed. So now I am there. I'm successful. And never mind, I almost went out of business because I didn't know toy business was a fashion business. So I didn't come up with new ones. And a company called Tiger Electronics went and got the rights for Batman and made Batman handheld games, made in China instead of Japan, and sold it at my cost. But anyways, so one day I got a call. His name, I'm sorry, his father-in-law's name was Yamaguchi. His name was Mr. Arakawa. I'm Mr. Arakawa of Nintendo. Can you come to Seattle? Sure. So he said, you need to tell me how you succeeded to sell Nintendo Game & Watch in America and become successful. Because I started Nintendo America selling that. And I failed. I failed. I said, okay, I got lucky. He said, no, no, no, you got to tell me. I said, imagine I'm going to succeed. I'm going to sell these and succeed. And that's what happened. [00:48:18] Speaker 1: There was no secret sauce. He was trying to figure out some hack. But there wasn't a hack. The hack was work ethic. Right, exactly. [00:48:24] Speaker 2: Well, but I'll challenge that for a sec. Because when you were selling tchotchkes, you said, I got impatient. And I realized I wasn't going to make money. Right. So you manifested that, I'm sure, just as much as this. Yeah. So why did this work and that didn't? [00:48:36] Isaac Larry: The other one would have worked if I was patient. Nintendo Game & Watch was fast. Yeah. You could get rewards right away. I mean, when I waited tables, the day I wanted to quit my job was, I worked in the restaurant. There was a restaurant at LAX on the top. The day I wanted to quit my job was the most dreadful day of my life. Do you know why waiters and waitresses stick to the same job for many, many years? Because every night they get instant gratification. You get tips to take home. And you don't have to wait. So this is really the reason. But, you know, I did get lucky. Because now they had come with Nintendo family system to replace Atari and they had succeeded with that. And I was basically running on their coattail. Yeah. So that's how it became successful. Wow. So after that meeting, Nintendo told me they will not sell me any more Game & Watch. [00:49:55] Speaker 1: You were doing too well. They wanted to do it themselves. [00:49:58] Isaac Larry: So they saw the success of this. And Mr. Arkawa, I became friends with him later on. And he said, "You showed that this could be successful." And that's how we came with Game Boy. That was, you gave us the inspiration to come with Game Boy. Incredible. [00:50:18] Speaker 1: And then, of course, Game Boy would change the entire company for generations. Oh my God. For generations. Every time you're cut out now. [00:50:24] Isaac Larry: Yeah. I'm cut out. So I said… So what do you do? So I am cut out. I said, "What am I going to do?" I go get the licenses for Pac-Man, for Star Wars. Nobody knew what Star Wars was at the time. A bunch of other licenses. And I go to China to make handheld games. So, to sell, to replace what I lost with Nintendo. That's what I did next. And then I got into licensing. And I found out, you know, my kids were young, 1993. Power Rangers was the biggest thing. And my son, Jason, and his cousin, Jonathan, they were all over Power Rangers. I said, "Shit, what the hell is Power Rangers?" I found out. I went to Haim Saban, who owned Power Rangers. And I said, "I want to have the license to sell electronics. Not only handheld games, but walkie-talkies, etc." I got that license for $40,000. Amazing. And I started making Power Rangers electronic products. Including, I invented the first walkie-talkie that looked like a Power Ranger. And a mask that became a voice changer, which Hasbro still makes. They don't pay me any royalties, but they still make it for Star Wars, etc. That was my biggest break with the Power Rangers. That was the Power Rangers. [00:51:59] Speaker 2: Why were you so successful in licensing? [00:52:02] Isaac Larry: Not always successful. You know, one of them, I was just inducted into Toy Hall of Fame. And it's really unfortunate with that. Because people like Walt Disney are part of the Hall of Fame. A lot of big people. So, and I said in my speech, my son actually said it in this speech. He says, "My dad always told us for every success there is ten failures." Nobody talks about the failure. I had so many failures. But I didn't let the failure to pull me down. Yeah. I focused on the successes. And I started, so I was working for Namco, for Pac-Man, for Lucas for Star Wars. And then after three, four years, they would say, "Okay, no, thank you." Lucas says, "Now we're going to give the license to somebody else." So I says, "I'm going to do my own. I'm not going to work for the Japanese anymore. I'm going to do my own brands." That's how I started making new brands myself. [00:53:17] Speaker 1: So the reason that I want to talk about Bratz, and I want to talk about LOL dolls, because I have two girls. Right, yeah. In my house, you are very, very, you know. [00:53:26] Speaker ?: Thank you. [00:53:26] Speaker 1: You are like the Mick Jagger of my home. You are iconic and legendary. Thank you. I will say that I was unclear how the jump happened from Nintendo to Bratz. And I guess, correct me if I'm wrong, Isaac, but you wanted to own the IP yourself. Yes. Because it couldn't be taken away. Is that right? [00:53:45] Isaac Larry: Yes. This doll I did called, I named it Singie Bouncy Baby. Okay. And I've never made a doll before. An inventor came to me, and I said, "Okay, I'm going to try this." And this inventor had gone to Hasbro, Mattel, everybody said no to him. I like this toy. I went to China. I went to a factory. He makes dolls. He says, "You make this doll for me for $6.00. I buy $200,000 pieces." They came back. The next day, he said, "625." I said, "Okay." I said, "I don't know how to develop it. You got to do all of it." So that doll, we sold a million pieces. It became Family Fun Toy of the Year that year. That's how I got into it. Now it was mine. It was my own brand. And that's how I got into the doll business. But there was a buyer at-- Have you ever been to Bentonville, Arkansas? [00:54:41] Speaker 1: I mean, sorry, Bentonville. Yes, I have. Yes, of course. Before this, before Shopify, I was a schmante guy. So I was trying to sell every buyer at every store. So you'd make aliyah to Bentonville, Arkansas. Exactly. [00:54:53] Isaac Larry: So at that time, to go to Bentonville, Arkansas, you had to fly to Houston. Yeah. Take one propeller and go to Fayetteville and drive 60 miles to get to Bentonville, Arkansas. Yeah. And there was nothing. Now it's changed. [00:55:12] Speaker 1: Well, now Bentonville has a massive airport because everyone wants to know. Yeah, but everything. [00:55:15] Isaac Larry: So, and I go there and I meet with this guy, Ron Stoll. It's over. I have sold now this singing bouncy baby to Toys R Us, to Target, to Kmart. And you needed at that time to have four big customers to be able to afford to go on TV, go on Nickelodeon and advertise. [00:55:47] Speaker 1: And Nickelodeon was the place you wanted to go. [00:55:50] Isaac Larry: Yeah, Nickelodeon was the place about that time. So how things have changed. So they didn't believe a newcomer. So I took a risk and shot a TV commercial without having one sale. So I go to Ron Stoll. I show him the TV commercial. Show him the product. Retail $19.99. He said, I'm not going to buy it. I said, come on, Ron. I came all the way from L.A. And I have three, two at that time, I had two young kids. And give me a break. I need this. He said, can you give me a reason? He said, you're Microgames of America. Why would I buy a doll from a company called Microgames of America? He said, oh, so you like the commercial, you like the ad, everything. You just don't like the name. I'm going to change the name to MGA. That's where MGA comes from. He's on the spot. On the spot. Yeah, on the spot. He says, you're too fast. Okay, I'll give it a try. So, wow. Yeah. So that's how I got into the doll business. But then, Ron, I've come up with the next- So he's a buyer. [00:57:13] Speaker 1: He's a toy buyer. [00:57:14] Isaac Larry: Yeah, he was a buyer. So I come up with the next one, the next doll. He was a buyer. I said, come on, Ron. You were successful with singing Bouncy Baby, or you got lucky. This again, Ron? [00:57:27] Speaker 2: Huh? We're going to be like, this again, Ron? [00:57:30] Isaac Larry: Yeah. So he took me to a Walmart store, Walmart number one, which is right across street from the Red Quarter. Okay. And they have 98 feet of Barbie in coffin boxes. [00:57:46] Speaker ?: They covered them. [00:57:47] Isaac Larry: It was no- So he says, Isaac, they own 98% market share of the doll. I don't have to do anything. They come and do everything. They do the planogram, and I make my bonus, et cetera. Why would they risk and put something else in there? He said, Ron, what if I come up with something that's better than that? He says, if you do, I will buy it. He said, give me your card, and write on the back. I come back to my office, and I said to my team, give me something to go after Barbie, but not a knockoff. I want something very different. Because you knew a knockoff wouldn't do the trick. Wouldn't it? Yeah. It had to be different. Other companies had done and failed. Yeah. So they kept showing me concepts and looked like Barbie. I said, no, no, no. One day, September 1, 2000, my daughter Jasmine, I used to take my kids to work during the summertime. So she's there. She's, I think, 10 years old. And Paula Garcia, who is still with me, comes and says, Isaac, I think we got something to go after Barbie. Okay, let me see it. So this guy walks in, Carter Bryant was his name, with some drawings, et cetera, and a dog that looked like an alien, really looked like an alien. And he says, and he named it Bratz. I said, hmm, that's interesting. Where do you work? He says, I work at Mattel. And I knew Mattel was litigious. So I said, you're working at Mattel. I don't want this. So he says, no, I made this in Missouri in 1988 and I have proof to show you. So he showed us the proof, et cetera. I said, okay, let me think about it. And in the meantime, my daughter is kicking me under the, so Carter leaves and says, Dad, this is the coolest thing that I saw. He's not blonde. You need to make a doll like that. Okay, so we called Carl Bryant. We made a deal with him. And we said, okay, he was making $50,000 a year in Mattel. He said, we give you 55, 10% more. You come full time, work on this. I give you 3% royalty. And everything we said. So that is how Bratz started. Wow. You went back to Bentonville. Of course. And Ron Stover says, I'm not going to buy it. I said, Ron, come on. I did it. So he said, Ron. I said, here, I did what you asked for. And he says, it's not going to sell. Only blonde dolls sell. And so this time, I went to Lee Scott, who was the CEO. I've known every CEO of Walmart. And it's not enough time for me to tell you that story. How did that happen? I met Sam Walton. Up to now, I'm friends with John Furland. So I go to Lee Scott. I bypassed the DMM, the GMM, et cetera. And I said, Lee, what the hell is going on? Is it my accent? Or is-- this guy doesn't want to buy anything. So he calls him and says, come on. Throw a bone to Isaac. So Ron comes and says, OK, we will buy it, but only Chloe, which is the blonde one. And I named the dolls Chloe, Jade, Sasha, and Jasmine. Jasmine, my daughter, and Sasha was her best friend. So-- and it has to be-- the price-- we're going to sell it at $10. And it has to be $7, $8 cost. I said, Ron-- he said, your cost should be about $4 on this. So I said, Ron, my cost is actually $2.25. But if you want to buy this, the price is $10.50. And you buy all four, I won't sell it to you. And so he bought that, and it became-- so Lee Scott had a big, big, big vendor meetings. I didn't know that. He says-- he told the story. He says, Isaac was persistent for us to get brass because he wanted other vendors to come back. So that's how-- That's amazing. But did it not sell at first? I thought you had to mortgage your house at one point. No, so-- no. So this-- what happened was that-- so now I have Bratz. I don't know if you know Planogram, but you have 98 feet. So fucking Ron put me in the worst corner. Left side, bottom. Nobody could see it. But Toys R Us was enthusiastic. Target was enthusiastic about it. And we launched Bratz actually in Spain first before anywhere else. And Toys R Us in Spain, the product sold out so fast that they told everybody else in Toys R Us. So Deborah Trell, who was the buyer, says, OK, we want to buy this FOB. Fine. He gave me a $6.5 million order FOB. And now we are in USA, and the product-- she calls me in October. So we're going to cancel that order. We already made the product. We're going to cancel that order because it's not-- the early sales are not good as-- as good as Spain. So I said, I got-- this is-- I got a make or break. So I went and got a second mortgage on my house. Wow. And didn't tell your wife. Didn't tell my wife. How did you know that? No, we didn't return. Yeah. I didn't tell my wife. And I put all that money in Nickelodeon, $1.5 million. Bought the ad. No, we were already advertising. But instead of 110 GRP, we went to 220. Double the GRP. And the product sold out. So Deborah Trell calls me in November before Thanksgiving. She says, you know, we're going to take that merchandise after all. I said, Deborah, those goods I sold already. I didn't-- I had it nowhere else. But we have some domestic. If you want to buy it domestic-- It's expensive. Yeah. So instead of 1025, they were selling it at $14.99. It's now $14. He says, we can make 95 cents. I said, well, you know, then don't buy it. Because Bratz will bring food traffic to your store-- To buy other stuff. To buy other stuff. So he went and talked to his boss. Michael Goldstein, CEO, etc. So finally, I said, OK, $13.75. And I sold it to them. And with that profit, I paid off the mortgage. [01:05:27] Speaker 2: Wow. [01:05:28] Isaac Larry: And Bratz became, in 2001, won the toy of the year. Incredible. And by the end of 2004, we had 63% market share. And Barbie had dropped to below 40. And they were in crisis. Yeah. [01:05:50] Speaker 2: And then shit hit the fan. I think, you know, we should build this up a little bit, right? Yeah. [01:05:54] Isaac Larry: So the shit hit the fan. Ron Stover called me. He says, Isaac, you have awakened the-- The giant. Yeah. The sleeping giant. So be careful. I don't know what the hell he's talking about. [01:06:08] Speaker 1: And he was really referring to Mattel going after you. Mattel, yes. [01:06:11] Isaac Larry: Yeah. Referring to Mattel. So Mattel, now they had crisis. And all of this is public record. So they do research. They create a document that says house on fire. And Mattel stocks dropped from $42 to below $10. So-- And the claim was about Bryant? Yes. It was about the creator. Before they even go there. So they knocked off Bratz with a product called Mycene. Yeah. Looked exactly like Bratz. It didn't succeed. Then they came up. They didn't get it. They still don't get it. So they came up with another doll called Flava. And Flava was basically urban. They thought it was all about urban. The Wall Street Journal reporter showed me this and said, what do you think? I said, this is called-- and you can look it up. It's online. This is Gangster Barbie. And the only thing that's missing is the cocaine while. It's going to be DOA. She said, what is DOA? I said, dead on arrival. So she wrote this. And from what I heard, that Bob Eckert, who was the CEO of Mattel-- and you know, frankly, I shouldn't maybe have said that. But that got him going, his ego. So he goes and hires Queen Emmanuel, the biggest, most litigious law firm in America, frankly. And he says, I want to put this guy out of business. And then they ledigate him to death. That came out at the trial. So they filed this lawsuit. And this was the biggest fight of my life. And we went to two trials. It's a long, long, long, long story. But we lost the first trial. 100 million dollars. We won the next trial. Got 330 million dollar verdict. Because fucking Mattel, sorry, I'm using. It's okay. It's okay. We found out they were coming to our showroom, pretending they are-- Fires. No. That they are journalists. And getting our information, they were Mattel employees. They had the instruction manual, 14 pages, about how to steal other people's trade secrets. They had bought a camera. We got the receipt. A spy camera, this size. Wow. So they would come to and take. So that's how we won. It's amazing. [01:09:05] Speaker 2: But I did this, this trial went on for 10 years. And we did our-- Did that not exhaust you? I mean, it must have been like, I mean, I know you like to fight. And that's part of, I mean, you know-- Well, it's awesome. You ended up in the hospital at one point. You were suicidal. [01:09:17] Speaker ?: I was. [01:09:18] Isaac Larry: What happened, this was, you know, their goal was to live. Literally litigate me to death. And I knew that I hadn't done anything wrong. That--and my childhood came to my eyes. The bullying, the mortises. You remember lifting those weights again when you were a kid. Exactly. You know, in Iran. Exactly. I said, I'm going to fight. I'm going to fight. So we are fighting. But we had a judge who was Steve Larsen. My luck, a devoted Catholic with the altar in his house, with six daughters. And when he got this case, he told people that, oh, this was divine intervention that came on my desk. Because he thought Bratz dolls are going to-- [01:10:11] Speaker 1: Inappropriate or something like that. [01:10:12] Isaac Larry: Yeah. Yes, exactly. Crazy, crazy. Can you imagine? [01:10:16] Speaker ?: Yeah. [01:10:17] Isaac Larry: We're talking about 2004, 2005. Anyways, so he was ruling everything against us. And he ordered a settlement. So we go to this settlement meeting. And the mediator and my lawyers, they say, Isaac, you put in a good fight. You're not going to win. You're going to go out of business. You're going to destroy your business, destroy your family. Give him Bratz. You can create-- you're creative, you can create something else. So finally, at the end of the day, I said, OK. I give you Bratz. So Bob Eckert said, I got to get the board approval. So this is a Monday. And we'll let you know by Friday. I go home. Literally, I felt that somebody has raped me. Somebody has raped me. And I had a heart situation. And my wife called 911. They take me to Cedars-Sinai. So I was there overnight. They were monitoring. How old are you at this point? [01:11:43] Speaker 1: You must be 50 years old. [01:11:44] Isaac Larry: Yeah. So you're not-- I mean-- Yeah. No, I'm so-- and so-- and so-- and sorry. And my wife is trying to concern my family. OK, we can make something else. No. And I'm crying. But I cannot get this out of my face. So I come back. I go back to work on Wednesday. Friday, I get a call from the mediator. And he says, "Isaac, we have Bob Eckert here and everybody else. So they have a counter-proposal." I said, "What counter-proposal? We made a deal." So they want-- on top of Bratz, they want $25 million. I said, "Yes!" And the mediator said, "You accept?" I said, "No, fuck you, Bob Eckert. Now I'm going to use that $25 million to kick your fucking ass." And I called him-- he came from Kraft. So I called him, "You cheese face." [01:12:53] Speaker 2: It's like that sidebar where George takes the comebacks in the car like the jerk store called. Wow. [01:12:59] Speaker 1: So, you know, one thing that keeps coming up here-- I mean, you mentioned this term earlier, "manifest." If you sort of look back at your life, Isaac, like-- you manifested this. Right, I did. But also, when it came time to a fight to negotiate, you always were happy to fight when you knew you were right, when you knew you were in the right. There's also another element, which is relationships. You talk about the buyers or the CEOs. I know John also. I'm on the board of NRF. Right, okay, yeah. So I know John very well. I have known a lot. You know, Brian Cornell from Target. Ultimately, these are the largest companies in the world. Right. But it sounds like you also understand that there are just people running them. Right. I became-- And how do you work on those-- how do you marinate those relationships so well? [01:13:44] Isaac Larry: Yeah. So with Walmart, what happened, when I first went there, I was selling-- not even Nintendo, I was selling walkie-talkies. So I'm sitting in the reception area at that time. Every goddamn chair is different. Yeah. And it's lunchtime and waiting for the buyer to call me out. And this guy with the red pickup truck with jeans and a brown dog walks in, looks around, comes and sits next to me and says, "Hey, what's your name, young man?" I said, "Who are you? What's your name?" He laughed. He says, "I'm Sam Walton." I said, "Oh, sorry." Must be nice. I said, "I didn't know that. I'm Isaac Larian." He said, "What do you do?" I told him. He says, "Come back to my office." So he took to my office, to his office, and he says, "You know, I like you that you ask for my name first. Where do you live?" I said, "L.A." He said, "Do me a favor. Can you, every Friday, call me? Wow. This is my direct number. Go to Sears, Kmart, all these." That was their competitor. Tell me what they're doing right and wrong, and call me and let me know. So every Friday, I was calling Sam Walton. Wow. That's amazing. Yeah. So I became friends with Sam Walton. Then he introduced me to David Glass. To Doug. John. To Doug, et cetera. So did Brian Cornell for my Hall of Fame induction. Phyllis will send you the video. They did a nice tribute. Beautiful. [01:15:26] Speaker 2: Beautiful. But you also had a lawsuit at Walmart as well. [01:15:29] Isaac Larry: One time. Yes. Yes. Because they had knocked us off. So we had that. And then the other thing that happened is when we were selling a Nintendo game and watch, the buyer, you were in the business, they kept some of the money for the future, et cetera. So I wrote a letter to Sam. At that time, there was no faxes. I said, if the richest man at that time was the richest man in America, needs my $42,000, you can have it. Keep it. And he told the buyer and they paid me the next thing. [01:16:09] Speaker 2: You know, Isaac, before we go on, I want to go back to something you said earlier, which is you said that you cry a lot. Yes. You know, you're also clearly a fighter and you don't back down. Right. When we think about fighters, we think toughness. We think, you know, we don't think crying a lot. What have you learned about that part of you and squaring those two contradictions? [01:16:29] Isaac Larry: I think crying comes from strength because you show your emotion. We're all humans. We have certain emotion. Why should I hold it back? It doesn't make me weaker. It makes me stronger. Yeah. [01:16:43] Speaker 1: It's like vulnerability actually shows real strength. Right. There were a few, when Dave and I were doing our research, there were a few quotes that kept coming up, which some of them make total sense now having talked to you. You know, future favors the bold. Fortune. Fortune favors the bold. Right. It makes total sense. Everything you've said. You were meant to be an entrepreneur. Right. Totally makes sense. But there's this other one, which is that I don't work for money. Yeah. I work because I love it. [01:17:08] Isaac Larry: Yes. [01:17:09] Speaker 1: That there is. So we are also lifelong entrepreneurs. For us, entrepreneurship changed our lives in incredible ways. But your entrepreneurial journey has been, there's been a lot of fights. There's been a lot of stress. It landed you in the hospital at some point as well. Can you talk about what you love about this stuff? [01:17:30] Isaac Larry: I just, you know, I love children. I love kids. And, you know, my wife, I've been married 42 years. And she says, oh, you know, your wives, especially in Beverly Hills, they become your analysts. So they, she says, oh, you're leaving your inner child. Maybe some truth to that. I mean, as a kid. [01:17:53] Speaker 1: You didn't have a childhood. [01:17:54] Isaac Larry: Didn't have. The only toy I had was a kite that I made with a stick and old newspaper. Yeah. So I get a joy from making toys and see kids happy. I have now five grandchildren. Incredible. And. What do they, what do they call you? They call me Baba G. Baba G. [01:18:15] Speaker 1: Yeah. I want to, I want to just kind of wrap up here. Two, two things come out here. Um, if you, given your upbringing and given your life so far, Isaac, if you lost everything, now. I can do it again. That's what I was going to ask you. You can do it again. [01:18:31] Isaac Larry: I can do, pick, pick up and do it again. [01:18:33] Speaker 1: Does that give you, does that give you confidence? Yes. Yeah. I think that to us, that is true confidence. Right. And you know that you can do it again if you have to. Yes. You don't want to, but if you had to do it, you could do it. I could do it again. [01:18:45] Speaker 2: But, but I, you know, I asked you this question earlier and I, I, I, I, I just, I got to ask it again. You, you said fear is the F word. Right. When did you stop being afraid? [01:18:54] Isaac Larry: I'm not sure if I'm still, I, I'm sure, I think I'm still afraid. Interesting. Yeah. So, but, but I don't let fear. Drive you. To drive. That's right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. [01:19:10] Speaker 1: I, I would let fear give more energy. So you may still have the fear there. Right. Um, it's like the crying and the fighting. Right. Do you feel at this stage of your life that you've made it? Do you have enough now? What do you mean enough? [01:19:24] Isaac Larry: If you're talking about money. [01:19:25] Speaker 1: No, I don't, I don't mean money. I mean the entrepreneurial. Yeah. [01:19:30] Isaac Larry: I still want, you know, look in the history of toy business, we are the, I'm proud to say we are the only toy company, the only toy company, the history of toy business that has come up with a hundred brand new brands from scratch. One hundred. And fourteen of them have gone to do between a hundred million to ten billion dollars. To ten billion. [01:19:52] Speaker 1: Incredible. So. And, and, I mean, and you're private. Right. I mean, all your competitors for the most part are publicly traded companies. We have no debt. Yeah. Why did you say private? Because I hate the banks. I don't want to. You don't, you don't want, you don't want to have partners. You don't want to have. [01:20:06] Isaac Larry: Exactly. And I, I need to be able to talk. Like if, do you think if I was public, I would be able to sit here. Probably have two lawyers sitting there and say don't do that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. [01:20:18] Speaker 2: Say this. You want to have the freedom of that. Well, but Harley's question is even more relevant. Right. You know, with all the success, is it enough? [01:20:23] Isaac Larry: No, I'm not done. You're not done yet? No, I'm not done. You should, you should see the video for my Hall of Fame speech. And we were, your team headed to us. Yeah, it's incredible. Three weeks ago. And I said, you know, most people who stand here at my age are died. Yeah. I said, but please, not yet. Not yet. This isn't a funeral. Yeah, yeah, yeah. [01:20:44] Speaker 1: This is a celebration. Oh, if you may. So, you know, part of the reason Big Shot exists is to inspire the next generation of Jewish entrepreneurs. Thank you. What's your advice to them? [01:20:54] Isaac Larry: Believe in your dream. Do what you love. Not what your parents tell you to do. Yeah. Do what you love. And if you fall, get up, dust up, and do it again. Yeah. If you have a conviction that something you want to do is real, don't give up. Keep on doing it. Get better and better. It will pay off. [01:21:16] Speaker ?: Amazing. [01:21:17] Speaker 2: Isaac, Harley loves to say we stand on the shoulders of giants. Thank you. Growing up, we both looked to incredible entrepreneurs like you for inspiration, which is part of the amazing we started this show. And, you know. [01:21:29] Isaac Larry: Thank you. You guys have done a great job. Thank you very much. You make us proud. We're just getting started, too. Just like you.