Fiery Congressional Hearing on Renee Good Killing: Dems Clash With Officials Over ICE

[11:02] okay thank thank you everyone well thank you we are going to go ahead and start this joint [11:30] hearing and i want to first begin by welcoming everyone my name is robert garcia and i'm the [11:34] ranking member on the house oversight committee and i especially want to thank senator blumenthal [11:40] for his incredible leadership this is our second joint hearing between our two committees in both [11:47] of course the senate and the house and today of course we're going to be examining the use [11:53] of violence in immigration enforcement and so this is a very important moment for us [11:58] as a committee and of course an important moment for us to understand what is happening across this [12:05] country and so we are of course excited to be here and understand how important it is for everyone [12:11] to really understand what's going on at this moment we're also going to be hearing from a [12:16] variety of witnesses as well and we're very grateful to to everyone for uh for being here [12:22] i want to [12:23] also just mention that we're going to have members of the senate as well as members of the [12:28] house that are coming in and out to ask questions and so i want to welcome of course our members of [12:33] the house oversight committee and then of course we're going to be having members of the u.s senate [12:36] here as well i'm going to begin with some opening comments then i'm going to turn over to senator [12:41] blumenthal who's also going to be introducing our two of our first witnesses that are that are here [12:47] we'll be hearing from them in just a minute welcome to both of you of course and then we'll [12:53] be hearing from both of you as well so we're going to begin with the first and last one [13:00] so let's get started and we'll go ahead and begin i want to just note that we're here because the [13:05] department of homeland security ice and of course broader agencies across dhs are completely out of [13:12] control and because congress has a responsibility to step in when constitutional rights are being [13:19] violated now in december of course senator blumenthal and i convened a hearing to call out the [13:25] And since that time, the violence and the lawlessness has actually escalated. [13:31] So we're going to continue to hold hearings and we're going to continue to push back. [13:35] I want to begin by just showing this chart right here. [13:39] Now, back in July, Donald Trump and Republicans passed a law that cut hundreds of billions of dollars from health care and food assistance. [13:48] And they used that money to hire thousands of ICE agents who are now terrorizing cities and killing United States citizens. [13:56] Now, this chart shows how they made ICE the highest funded law enforcement agency in the history of the United States. [14:04] Ten years ago, the ICE budget was less than $6 billion. [14:08] Last year, it was over $85 billion. [14:13] And if you look at funding for the agency and look at what just... [14:19] What just happened in the last year, it is stunning to see how much we are spending across this country to terrorize, disfigure, in some cases, kill U.S. citizens and people across this country. [14:35] Now, oversight Democrats have tracked, reviewed, and vetted over 470 incidents on our immigration enforcement dashboard. [14:42] And 186 of them include problematic uses of force by agents. [14:48] Now, these are not isolated mistakes. [14:49] They are a clear pattern. [14:51] And we know that's a tip. [14:52] We know that's a tip of the iceberg. [14:54] We're seeing ICE, CBP, other parts of DHS, all across our country, terrorize communities. [15:05] We've seen warrantless searches of homes and vehicles. [15:07] We've seen folks arrested, detained with no criminal history. [15:14] We've seen folks be sent to detention centers only to be released with no explanation as to why. [15:19] Now, American citizens and innocent people have been brutalized, and our witnesses today will testify to that. [15:25] And to be clear, we've seen people dragged from cars, beaten, gassed, attacked with crowd control weapons, blinded, like back in my home state of California, left with broken ribs, run off the road, beaten, injured, disfigured, and shot. [15:41] Officers have been ordered to enter homes without warrants in violation of the Constitution. [15:47] And we've also seen the federal government labeling American citizens as domestic terrorists, calling people, quote, assassins. [15:56] And falsely claiming they intended to kill law enforcement, which we know, of course, has been untrue. [16:03] We're seeing the results of policies set by powerful people of no respect for the Constitution, no respect for the law, no respect for basic humility. [16:12] And these folks here, which we know well, Donald Trump, J.D. Vance, Kristi Noem, Stephen Miller, of course, Tom Homan, and Greg Bovino, these people, every single one of them, has to be held accountable. [16:31] For the crimes, for the terror, and for the murders that are happening to our own people in this country. [16:38] We're taking action today because the stakes could not be higher. [16:41] Now, this morning, Oversight Democrats released our initial investigation into the killings of Rene Good and Alex Preddy. [16:50] Now, Alex, of course, was a VA nurse who was peacefully exercising his First and Second Amendment constitutional rights before he was pepper sprayed, tackled, disarmed, and then shot repeatedly in the back. [17:05] Now, Rene Good was a mom who told an officer, which we've all seen on video, I'm not mad at you. [17:12] She said, I'm not mad at you, before she was shot dead. [17:16] We mourn both of these two Americans today, and we find that these shootings cannot be justified. [17:26] We also know they were part of a broader pattern of escalating unlawful violence by the Trump administration and DHS to intimidate dissent. [17:34] Now, this administration then lied about the events and is now obstructing independent action. [17:40] Now, this administration then lied about the events and is now obstructing independent action. [17:46] Our hearing today will build on evidence, not just that we put out in our reports, in our investigation, but the incredible work being done by the Senate, its various committees, and, again, I especially want to thank Senator Blumenthal for his leadership of holding these hearings. [18:02] The stories that we're going to hear today are hard to tell, and they're hard to hear. [18:07] So I want to thank, again, our witnesses for the courage and the strength that it takes to be here today. [18:11] Thank you. [18:12] We're taking a step towards accountability, and we know that the courage, that the strength that you all have that are bringing is in light of what you're hearing from the administration. [18:23] I think it's important for the public to recognize that this administration has lied, has defamed, and has smeared people that have been peacefully protesting. [18:35] They've weaponized the Department of Justice to silence protesters, observers, and, of course, journalists. [18:41] But I also remind folks that Donald Trump won't be president forever. [18:46] Kristi Noem won't be the secretary forever. [18:50] And when you serve this country in an elected office or in uniform, you swear an oath to the Constitution. [18:56] You pledge to work for all Americans. [18:58] You don't get a license to kill, and there's no absolute immunity. [19:03] We're going to stand up for the rights of our communities, and we believe strongly that we need to hear the stories of those that are in front of us today. [19:11] I want to thank our witnesses for the courage, and I want to yield back to our host today and really the person that's been organizing and leading. [19:19] For all of these hearings, Senator Blumenthal. [19:23] Thank you so much, Representative Garcia. [19:26] Working with you has been a great experience in partnership, and I am really gratified that we're going to continue our work, continue our investigation, continue our efforts to hold DHS accountable. [19:42] This hearing is extraordinary and unprecedented. [19:45] But so is the inhumanity and brutality that we've seen from a government that has not been able to do its job. [19:51] Thank you. [19:52] Thank you. [19:52] Thank you. [19:53] Thank you. [19:54] Thank you very much. [19:56] You have the power, especially when we are in a B dadoomdade, Secretary Hmmm, from a government agency. [20:04] With us today are brave Americans who have come forward to speak truth to power. [20:11] That phrase is overused, but truly, it applies today. [20:19] With us in spirit are also Renee Nicole Goode and Alex Preddy. [20:27] In spirit. [20:27] They should be here in person. [20:29] how painful it must be for you to see that image of your sister, which speaks [20:41] to your courage, your guts, your grit and determination to be here. And you have [20:49] won the admiration and gratitude of all of the colleagues here and many others [20:56] and Americans throughout the country. The witnesses here bear the scars of [21:04] government lawlessness and DHS brutality, mental scars as well as [21:11] physical scars. They're here as the face and voice of Alex and Renee and of [21:17] thousands of others who span the country and who have experienced this in [21:22] humanity. And let's be very clear, these stories are not just about Minneapolis. [21:30] People here from all over the country, these stories span the country, the [21:37] nation. [21:38] The nation is Minneapolis. We are all Minneapolis. And these stories are a call [21:45] to action. I was in this room just a few hours ago at a hearing of the Armed [21:54] Services Committee. I sat on this dais as we heard from witnesses about our [21:59] national nuclear security in the face of threats from enemies and adversaries [22:06] abroad who have nuclear weapons. We are here about a matter of [22:13] national security that is equally important to the one that we heard about [22:21] this morning. The violence unleashed by the Trump administration against our [22:28] fellow citizen can touch any American at any time, any one of you who are [22:36] listening by livestream or C-SPAN or who are hearing and seeing this hearing, [22:44] whether you're going to a church clothing drive to make a donation on your way to a doctor's appointment, [22:52] or even heading home from dropping your six-year-old son off at school. [22:57] Real stories we will hear today. These stories, and far too many others, [23:05] demand that every one of us stand up against the injustices and demand accountability. [23:13] The directives underlying this lawlessness come from the top. Those pictures of the leaders that [23:20] Representative Garcia showed you are ultimately the culprits here. [23:24] They, [23:25] with their responsibility. They are the ones who issued the quotas for arrests and detention that [23:33] are driving the brutality. They are the ones who have issued a policy directive kept secret until [23:41] a whistleblower came to me showing that the acting director of ICE is authorizing agents to break [23:48] down your door, ransack your home, terrify your children, detain and arrest you, as has happened [23:55] countless times across the country. [23:58] Deportors came to my defense upstairs and said you can't use muitoques because they will not be [24:04] saved if you come back came to their room for cuestianly. [24:10] And I'm curious. [24:11] Where have you been today with this brutality? [24:14] In light of all of the behaviors they have done against you all, [24:19] the top ranks of the WHS are more than complicit. [24:22] They're the driving force behind this brutality and [24:29] they should be held accountable. They have not only directed those actions but also the lies and misinformation that have been presented to court in violation of the duties lawyers have to present only the truth to courts, and they have engaged in character assassination against today's witnesses, as well as firing against today's witnesses, as well as firing against us. [24:31] countless others including alex and renee we are at a defining moment it's a moral moment we are [24:43] determined to continue to investigate and uncover wrongdoing but we'll also seek action for [24:49] accountability and justice my feeling is that we should demand a complete overhaul a rebuilding of [25:02] dhs and the agencies that fall here these reforms should include body cameras and identification [25:10] on every officer mass off at all times rigorous use of force training and policies [25:22] independent investigations into acts of violence and ongoing monitoring of these agents a [25:30] police force that has these kinds of systematic failings would be supervised by a monitor [25:40] and [25:40] we've seen it in connecticut as my colleagues have seen it in their states around the country [25:45] and most important for me rights of citizens to seek redress rights of anyone to set to have [25:55] recourse in the courts to make sure that agents violating the rights are held accountable if you [26:07] go to your local police chief and ask what are the norms every one of the demands that i've listed [26:14] here is going to be recounted [26:17] to you including a right of action on the part of people to seek accountability it can be done with [26:23] four words four words in the current united states code 1983 all we need to do is add [26:40] when we say every person under color of any statute ordinance regulation custom or usage [26:46] of the united states of the united states or any other state or [26:58] territory that basic responsibility ought to be the right of every citizen because we know that [27:07] rights without remedies are empty promises if a local cop can be sued [27:15] so should an ice agent or a cpb official and so should greg bovino [27:26] and christy noem and lion todd lyon and steve miller and yes donald trump there is a [27:40] real need for a full accounting of what these agencies have done someday we should have a truth [27:46] and justice commission to investigate the systematic failing but for right now i can [27:53] promise that i will not support another dime for the department of homeland security unless there [28:01] is this fundamental far-reaching reform and restraint in effect a rebuilding of the agency so [28:12] renee and alex are not with us but [28:16] the silencing of their voices should strengthen our resolve to force change to stand up for what's [28:23] right to show our neighbors our communities and the world that we won't let totalitarian tyranny [28:29] prevail and fear crumble this great nation one day i think we will look back and [28:37] hold ourselves accountable whether we stood up and took stands luke granger and brett granger [28:51] are showing that courage and strength today and they're here to share [28:56] some words about their sister luke and brent on behalf of all of us i want to express [29:01] again our gratitude and we offer our condolences words are inadequate but just know from our hearts [29:15] we are with you in spirit for this devastating loss and we thank you for being here today and [29:23] i recognize you now for your remarks thank you ranking member blumenthal and ranking member garcia [29:40] members of congress my name is luke ganger and i'm here with my brother brent renee good is our [29:52] sister we're here on behalf of nay's big family and those who loved her we're here to ask for your [30:06] help i was talking to my four-year-old last week when she noticed i was not doing well [30:17] i had to come here today and talk to some important people she knows that her aunt died [30:26] and that somebody caused it to happen she told me that there are no bad people and that everyone [30:38] makes mistakes she has nay's spirit the deep distress our family feels because of nay's losses [30:52] in such a violent and unnecessary way is complicated by feelings of disbelief distress [31:02] and desperation for change [31:08] our family took some consolation thinking that perhaps nay's death would bring about change in [31:17] our country and it is not the completely surreal scenes taking place on the streets of minneapolis [31:31] are beyond explanation this is not just a bad day or a rough week or isolated incidents these [31:45] encounters with federal agents are changing the context of our lives and our lives are changing the [31:49] needing that support many people into our security trust members we interesting at our community [31:59] and changing many lives including ours forever i still don't know how to explain to my four-year-old [32:08] what these agents are doing when we pass by our family is deeply grateful for the outpouring [32:16] of love and support from the community in minneapolis and from people across the country [32:23] and around the world the prayers and words of support have truly brought us comfort and [32:28] from people of all colors faiths and ideals that is a perfect reflection of renee who carried peace [32:41] patience and love for others wherever she went our family is a very american blend [32:52] we vote differently and we rarely completely agree on the finer details of what it means to [32:59] be a citizen of this country we attend various churches and some not at all and despite those [33:08] differences we have always treated each other with love and respect and we've gotten even closer [33:15] during this very divided time in our country and we hope that our family can be even a small example [33:25] to others not to let political ideals divide us to be good like renee but the most important [33:36] thing we can do today is to help this panel and our country understand who nay is and [33:45] what a [33:46] beautiful american we have lost a sister a daughter mother a partner and a friend [33:58] good afternoon my name is brent ganger and um i'd like to share some thoughts from the eulogy [34:16] that i gave my sister's behalf this past saturday when i think of renee i think of [34:23] dandelions and sunlight dandelions don't ask permission to grow they push through cracks [34:30] in the sidewalk through hard soil through places where you don't expect beauty and suddenly there [34:37] are bright alive unapologetic unapologetically hopeful that was renee and sunlight warm steady [34:50] life-giving because when she walked in a room things felt lighter even on cloudy days renee [35:00] had a way of showing up in the world that made you believe things were going to be okay [35:05] not because she ignored the hardship but because she chose optimism anyway she chose to look for [35:12] what was good what was possible and what was worth loving nene loved fiercely openly and without [35:19] hesitation as a mother renee poured herself into love the kind of love that shows up every day [35:29] that sacrifices quietly that cheers loudly that believes deeply her children were and are her heart [35:37] walking around outside her body and she made sure they felt safe valued and endlessly loved [35:58] as a sister she was constant someone you could lean on laugh with or just sit in silence beside [36:15] she had a ma a way of making you feel understood even when you didn't have the words yet [36:23] she didn't just listen she saw you she believed in second chances she believed tomorrow could be [36:31] better than today she believed that kindness mattered and she lived that belief even when [36:38] things were hard they looked for the light and if she couldn't find it she became the light for [36:45] somebody else it was the excessively ordinary things that made nay so beautiful there are [36:50] billions of people who now know her name and it would be so easy to fall into the false belief [36:57] the great heroic things are required to overcome difficult things in the world but as tolkien wrote [37:04] it is the small everyday deeds of ordinary folk to keep the darkness at bay small acts of kindness [37:10] and love that's why the image of dandelions feels so right people try to pull them up overlook them [37:24] dismiss them but they keep coming back stronger brighter spreading seeds of hope everywhere they [37:32] land renee planted those seeds in all of us and her children in her family and friends co-workers [37:55] and people who maybe didn't even realize they needed her light at the time and sunlight sunlight [38:02] doesn't ask for recognition it just gives it warms it nurtures it helps things grow renee did that for [38:10] us she helped us grow she helped us believe in ourselves she helped us see the good even when [38:18] life felt heavy renee is not gone from us she's in the light that finds us on hard days she's in [38:27] the resilience we didn't know we had until we needed it she's in the laughter the memories the [38:33] love that continues to grow like dandelions like sunlight and like renee thank you thank you thank [38:46] and luke for that really powerful appeal to the nation's conscience and i hope to our colleagues [38:59] on both sides of the aisle and i hope that all of our colleagues will join in seeking the action that [39:08] you just described that is so important not just as a tribute to your sister but as a way to prevent [39:16] the kind of lawless brutality that caused her death literally murder thank you for being here [39:24] today we are going [39:27] to now have the second panel come forward and excuse the first we're ready to begin the second [40:55] panel i want to welcome all five of you and reiterate our thanks to every one of you for [41:03] being here uh everything that i said about brent and luke could apply to every one of you your [41:12] courage and your strength enable us to move forward to seek action to appeal to the conscience of our [41:22] nation we're fortunate to be joined today by antonio ramanusi mr ramanuchi is an attorney [41:30] representing the family of renee nicole good he has extensive experience representing victims of [41:39] policy violence including the family of george floyd marimar martinez is an american citizen [41:48] resident of chicago she is here to share her experience of being shot five times [41:56] by customs and border protection agents in chicago this past october alia raman is an american [42:06] citizen and resident of minneapolis she is here to share her story of being violently stopped and [42:14] detained by immigration agents while on her way to a doctor's appointment just three weeks ago [42:23] martin daniel raskin known as daniel i believe he is an american citizen and resident of san bernardino [42:32] california mr raskin is here to share his story of being fired at shot at by an immigration agent [42:42] while traveling in a vehicle with family members last year finally on our panel steph stoughton [42:53] he is a former police officer and professor at the university of south carolina school of law [42:59] where he is faculty director of excellence in policing and public safety he is here to share [43:06] his expertise about the proper methods of policing [43:11] including when and where it is appropriate for police to use force mr ramanucci we're we'll begin [43:22] with your testimony ranking member blumenthal ranking member garcia and distinguished members [43:31] of congress my name is antonio romanucci and i'm a civil rights and tort litigation attorney [43:38] with the deep honor of representing the renee good family for her tragic shooting death by [43:43] federal agents in minneapolis i have handled the [43:47] excessive force cases across the country for decades my colleagues and i are deeply distressed [43:54] at these invasions onto a fellow american's civil rights by our own government that have gone well [44:01] beyond the initial scope of removing criminals the occupation by ice and cbp in our cities is way [44:09] beyond their mission leading to unnecessary provocation that causes needless harm and death [44:17] these operations in multiple states [44:19] have routinely and consistently included violations of the constitution we call for an [44:27] immediate end of false narratives by federal officials about the victims of excessive force [44:34] the character assassinations and conclusions before an investigation has been started let alone [44:40] completed must stop in america our leaders must be held to a standard of truth and responsible speech [44:52] the first thing is absolute immunity and that perceptions leads to agents who behave with [44:58] absolute impunity leading to exaggerated and violent provoked encounters with people this is [45:07] an unprecedented and deeply unsettling time and the road map to navigating this national crisis [45:13] lies within this august body my job today will be to share information about the process to hold [45:20] federal officers accountable for actions we believe are [45:24] necessary in order to protect the lives of the people who have been killed in the event of an [45:28] unlawful investigation of constitutional rights in the face of other investigative bodies failing to [45:34] do so in renee goode's civil case our team has promised to provide transparency about what [45:40] happened to her as we continue our independent investigation in an aggressive way but also in [45:47] a moral and ethical manner we want to be the voice of reason for the country that wants to understand [45:54] and deserves the facts for example [45:56] the fiasco on the streets of new york and the [46:05] crime scene in the area is an example of what happened to her [46:08] in this case we have a final report from the federal police which will provide [46:12] a detailed summary of the case and also a list of relevant federal agencies asking for responsible [46:18] handling and preservation of evidence such as renee's vehicle records of the agent's declared [46:24] injuries his cell phone and any statements he made about the use of force and protesters at the family's request we conducted an independent autopsy of renee's body so we could better understand her injuries and her experience in those final moments and we release some of those high level results again to provide transparency [46:27] transparency, and truth to Americans. And lastly, we are providing information to the public on [46:33] reasonable policing policies and practices so people can view the video of Renee's death [46:38] through that lens. The lens is a wide-angle one where the totality of circumstances must be viewed [46:45] and not just one frame. The United States legal system allows for individuals to pursue civil [46:51] justice with the suit against the city, county, or state for the conduct of its officers and [46:57] against the officers individually. These types of legal claims are made under what is called 42 [47:04] U.S. Code Section 1983. This was part of the Federal Civil Rights Act of 1871, and this is [47:12] essential for accountability when an officer behaves unconstitutionally. Keep in mind that [47:19] this act is 155 years old and desperately needs an amendment. However, similar legal action against [47:27] federal law enforcement can be made under the U.S. Code Section 1983. [47:29] There is a current possible path of civil recovery through the Federal Tort Claims Act, or FTCA. But this [47:43] is challenging. It requires first the filing of a claim with the government agency that has harmed [47:48] you, and then waiting up to six months for a reply. Our current paradox is that America should [47:56] not require the permission of the federal government to sue the federal government for [48:02] violation of constitutional rights. If the government must give you permission to seek [48:07] accountability for violation of constitutional rights, then your rights are just words on [48:12] paper. [48:14] There is a legislative remedy to this paradox. At the state level, Minnesota and other states [48:20] can pass bills making it a state law to violate constitutional rights. In Illinois, we did [48:28] this by signing House Bill 1312. Congress can remove this roadblock to federal accountability, [48:35] by amending Section 1983 and adding 4 words. As you, Senator Blumenthal pointed out, so federal [48:42] officers can be sued civilly if their conduct merits it. The current language spells out that state, [48:49] county, and municipal law enforcement can be sued. Congress would only need to add the words, [48:56] or the United States, to the list of governments whose officers could be brought to civil justice. [49:01] It's that simple. I am urging you to consider this amendment and fix a bill that will be passed. [49:04] Thank you for joining us this afternoon. [49:06] a 155-year-old problem. The current path to hold federal officers accountable is narrow [49:13] and an uphill climb, and that will not deter us in the Renee Good case. Please, let's not repeat [49:20] a very recent moment in history when we said never again and having Congress miss the opportunity to [49:28] pass harm-stopping legislation, seeking accountability when the law requires. I thank [49:36] you. I thank this esteemed panel for your commitment to the truth, American values, [49:41] and of course, our Constitution. Thank you. Ms. Martinez. Thank you for having me here. [49:54] Before I begin, I would like to take a moment to express my gratitude. Thank you, Chairman, [49:59] for giving me the opportunity to be here today, for taking the time to hear my testimony. I give [50:06] thanks to God. He has been a constant presence in my life and the source of my strength. Without him, [50:13] I wouldn't be here standing. I am a living testimony of his grace. Sincerely, thank you, [50:23] everyone who has kept me in their thoughts and prayers and who has supported me since day one. [50:28] From the parents of my school to my neighbors, to my family and friends, strangers near and far, [50:36] from Mexico to Colombia, thank you all from the bottom of my heart. [50:42] My name is Marimar Martinez. I am a first-generation Mexican-American. [50:53] As a survivor of disadministration actions, as an advocate for those who do not have a voice, [51:01] those that are pleading for justice, living in fear, and those who are asking for meaningful [51:05] change and accountability. I come from a beautiful family full of immigrants. I am proud of my roots. [51:13] I am born and raised in Chicago, Illinois, where I learned the values of resilience, community, [51:19] respect, love, and hope. Those lessons have shaped me since childhood and continue to guide me [51:25] through my adult life. On October 4, 2025, those values were tested when my life was nearly taken [51:33] by my own government. This testimony is my attempt to give voice to an experience that we struggle to [51:39] hold, but silence cannot justify. On Saturday, October 4, 2025, I woke up tired but committed [51:47] to doing the fall cleaning. I promised myself I would do that day. After two hours, I have [51:52] successfully filled an entire bag of good quality, [51:56] clothes, and shoes I wanted to take to donate to my local church. After a quick shower and a cup of [52:02] coffee, I put the bag of clothes in the back of my car and headed towards the church. As I was getting [52:11] close to the church, I noticed a SUV that appeared to be similar to the Border Patrol vehicles that [52:18] had been invading our Hispanic neighborhood. In the previous week, I got a quiet but firm sense [52:25] that something wasn't right. As I passed the vehicle, I realized that I was in the wrong place. [52:30] In the vehicle, I noticed an overlight in the front windshield, no front plates as required in Illinois, [52:38] and an out-of-state license plate in the back. I then noticed a uniformed Border Patrol agent in the vehicle. [52:44] As a 30-year-old USA citizen with no criminal history, I believed that I had nothing to worry about, but I was concerned [52:52] for my friends and neighbors based on the well-publicized incidents involving Border Patrol agents in our community [53:00] over the past few weeks. [53:01] I was also concerned that the Border Patrol agents would be harassing anyone with brown skin for no legitimate law enforcement reasons. [53:07] For the next 15 to 20 minutes, I followed these Border Patrol agents through my neighborhood, honking my horn and shouting out [53:14] La Migra to warn my neighbors about the presence of these agents who have been terrorizing our community over the past few weeks. [53:24] As I did this, my neighbors started standing on the porches and sidewalks, joined in on this spontaneous life alert system, and began [53:34] setting off their car alarms to warn others since it was yesterday. [53:37] As the Border Patrol vehicle turned near Ketsey Avenue, I continued to beat my horn and warn my community. [53:46] As we approached the intersection of 39th and Ketsey, my vehicle had two or three feet to the left of the Border Patrol vehicle. [53:56] It started to swerve into my lane as it was driving. [54:00] I made eye contact with the driver of the Border Patrol vehicle and watched as it turned the steering wheel [54:07] once again. [54:07] by yourездеve IP嗚 [54:07] r April E. [54:07] to his left, and so I swept my vehicle. I immediately froze, slammed on the brakes, [54:14] and stopped my car. The Border Patrol vehicle stopped just one to two car lengths ahead of me. [54:22] It seemed like time stopped. I knew from watching the news coverage of other Border Patrol [54:29] encounters in Chicago that I was in danger. I watched the vehicle of Agent Border Patrol [54:36] agent killing Silverio Villegas Gonzalez just three weeks prior. I knew I had to get to safety [54:43] before I was dragged from my car and likely beaten or killed. I drove forward and went around the [54:50] Border Patrol agents who jumped out of his car and pointed his gun at me. I moved to the far [54:55] left lane, striking the curb on the far left side of Ketzee. The next thing I knew, I felt a burning [55:02] sensation in my arms, legs, and that I had been shot by pepper balls, which I also [55:08] seen these agents fire at people in our community. As I continued to drive past the Border Patrol [55:15] agents, I could hear my back passenger window shattered, and I felt bullets continue to pierce [55:22] my body. As I attempted to drive to a safe location, I began to feel lightheaded. I looked [55:29] down, and I noticed blood gushing out of my arms and legs, and I realized I'd been shot multiple [55:34] times. As I became lightheaded, I became worried I would pass out and in danger, [55:40] other drivers on the road. I managed to drive a mile from where the incident happened, and I [55:50] pulled into a parking lot of a mechanic's shop, and I called 911. I told the 911 operator that [55:58] Border Patrol agents had just shot me, and I needed help. I recall some of the workers from [56:03] the shop sitting me down in the chair as I was waiting for help, but I was losing this battle. [56:09] I saw my life flash before me and slowly began to think this was the [56:15] end for me, and before losing consciousness, the next thing I remember is the EMT putting me on a [56:21] stretcher, taking me to the hospital. At the hospital, I remember seeing multiple agents [56:28] standing around watching me be treated for my wounds. My arms, legs, and chest were all wrapped [56:36] in bandages. I had seven bullet holes in my body. I remember the agents rushing the nurses to finish [56:43] up so they could take me with them. I still felt dizzy. I was not able to fully process [56:48] what had happened to me. After being at the hospital for less than three hours, I was discharged [56:55] from the hospital and took custody of the FBI. As we left the hospital, I was escorted out through [57:02] the back in a wheelchair. I observed over dozens of Border Patrol agents waiting outside the [57:09] hospital. One of the agents came up to me with his cell phone and took a photograph of me. [57:16] It was the same agent who had previously [57:21] come in and out of my room, and I had to repeatedly tell him to leave. I told him I did not consent [57:29] for him to photograph me, but he did not care. It still haunts me that this agent has my [57:36] photo on his phone. Was this the agent that shot me? Was this a trophy for him? I was [57:44] next taken to the FBI building for further processing. Because they rushed me out of [57:51] the hospital so quickly, the blood started soaking through the bandages. [57:55] I heard the police say, [57:56] I heard the agents talking about how the jail will not accept me in this current condition. I begged the [58:03] agents to take me to a different hospital to give me proper medical care. Seeing me stand in a pool of [58:09] my own blood, they were concerned about my health. One of the kind FBI agents brought a bag of [58:18] additional bandages and worked quickly to pour more dressings over my bloody bandages. The FBI [58:26] agents agreed to take me to a different hospital, [58:29] where my wounds were treated again, and I received additional medical care before being released back [58:35] into law enforcement custody the following day. The agents took me from the second hospital to the federal [58:50] detention center in downtown Chicago. I had never even had a parking ticket before, and now I was [58:57] staying in a federal detention center. Just for being the victim in a minor traffic accident, [59:04] things were... [59:05] Things were surreal. The news in the jail that evening had my story and was being called a domestic terrorist. They said I [59:16] quote unquote rammed federal agents. I was in shock. If they only knew I was a month away from paying off my truck, and I [59:26] would never intentionally damage my vehicle, much less be crazy enough to hit a law enforcement. On Friday, I was [59:36] teaching the young children at the Montessori school, and we were singing and dancing and getting ready for [59:41] spooky season, preparing fall activities to do the following week, and on Saturday, my own government was calling [59:50] me a domestic terrorist, and I was in federal detention centers with the bullet holes all over my body. [59:57] I went to court on Monday, and I met my attorney, Christopher Perente. He told me the government was trying to have been, [1:00:08] was trying to have me kept in jail until the trial, because they claimed I was a danger to the community. This is what they said. [1:00:10] They said, don't you know the police? I'm at the prison right now. I'm a judge, and if I have a story to tell, I'm going to uproot my entire這 [1:00:11] claimed I was a danger to the community. I told them I had never been in trouble before and that [1:00:20] the government claims were all wrong. I looked around the courtroom and I recognized over dozens [1:00:25] mom and dads from the Montessori school along with my boss and most of my family members who [1:00:31] came to support me. I heard my attorney tell the judge that he had received over 50 letters from [1:00:37] the moms and dads from the kids, all describing me as caring, loving, empathetic teacher, the exact [1:00:47] opposite of a domestic terrorist. I heard the government describe me as being armed even though [1:00:56] I knew my gun was always inside my snap closed holster at the bottom of my purse where I always [1:01:02] kept it. The prosecutor told the judge there was no allegation that I have took the gun out my purse [1:01:10] but that did not stop D.A. [1:01:12] Chess from continuing to say I was armed. During this incident, my attorney explained to the judge [1:01:20] that I have a valid concealed carry license and that as a young woman living in Chicago, I carry [1:01:26] a gun to protect me from danger. Thankfully, the judge quickly denied the government's [1:01:32] detention request and released me on bond that day. Over the next six weeks, everything was [1:01:40] surreal. I continued to work and teach my children, but knowing that I was a danger to the [1:01:45] community, my attorney told me that I was under federal indictment and facing felony charges and [1:01:48] potentially years in federal prison over a minor car accident where the other driver was at fault [1:01:55] and attempted to kill me was terrifying. There was times where I did not believe this was all real, [1:02:01] and then I would touch my bullet wounds and knew it was certainly real. Imagine waking up every [1:02:07] morning reliving this trauma. I would go to work each day to take care of my children. I knew my [1:02:18] attorney was hard at work and exposing the lies of eyes. I knew the truth of what happened. The [1:02:24] agent swerved into me. The agent shot me as I drove away from him. My attorney and his investigators [1:02:30] found videos, evidence demonstrating the agents were lying, and I knew that no press release or [1:02:37] tweet could ever trump the power of the truth. Two weeks before the government dismissed all [1:02:44] the charges in my case, I sat in federal court and watched from 20 feet away as the border [1:02:50] protruded from me. I was in a state of shock. I was in a state of shock. I was in a state of [1:02:50] shock. I was in a state of shock. I was in a state of shock. I was in a state of shock. I was in a state of [1:02:51] shock. I was in a state of shock. I was in a state of shock. I was in a state of shock. I was in a state of [1:02:51] shock. I was in a state of shock. I was in a state of shock. I was in a state of shock. I was in a state of [1:02:52] shock. I was in a state of shock. I was in a state of shock. I was in a state of shock. I was in a state of [1:02:53] shock. I was in a state of shock. I was in a state of shock. I was in a state of shock. I was in a state of [1:02:54] shock. I was in a state of shock. I was in a state of shock. I was in a state of shock. I was in a state of [1:02:56] Charles Exum. Charles Exum, my attempted executioner, was Charles Exum. I hope the [1:03:06] government does not consider my use of his name here to be considered doxing, but I think it is [1:03:13] important now that the truth is out of this case is exposed that people know his name, Charles Exum. [1:03:21] Exum was in the courtroom testifying, attempting to weave a coherent story explaining why he took [1:03:28] his vehicle that I allegedly rammed out of the secure FBI evidence garage and drove it back to [1:03:36] Maine, where the Border Patrol on-site mechanic was ordered to buff out the damages of the vehicle. [1:03:44] This was all done prior to me or my attorney having the ability to examine the vehicle. [1:03:49] Because he did this, no expert witness will ever be able to prove that it was Exum who swerved into [1:03:55] my vehicle. Watching Charles Exum testify made me sick. [1:04:00] I grew up revering law enforcement. Prior to this incident, I had great respect for local and [1:04:07] federal law enforcement. I knew every day they put their lives on the lines to keep me safe, [1:04:13] to keep the kids at my school safe, and I thought to keep everyone in our community safe. [1:04:19] But seeing what ICE was doing in our community at this time changed my view of law enforcement. [1:04:24] This administration has misled the American people by claiming it will focus on the, [1:04:31] quote-unquote, worst of the worst, while their actions show otherwise. [1:04:36] Evidence from these operations, including statements made on their own, [1:04:40] reveals a pattern of misleading the public. The government told the people they were targeting [1:04:46] the worst of the worst, but their actions demonstrated otherwise. They are not targeting [1:04:51] the worst of the worst. They are targeting individuals who fit a certain profile, [1:04:55] who simply have a certain accent, a non-white skin color, just like me. [1:05:04] This racist, [1:05:04] serious concerns about fairness, discrimination, and abuse of authority. [1:05:10] The lack of accountability for these actions is deeply troubling. We the people are tired of [1:05:17] this misconduct and demand transparency and accountability. Seeing Charles Exum sit in [1:05:23] federal courtroom and lie about what happened that day completely eroded all my trust in law [1:05:29] enforcement. I know just because Exum is not telling the truth that I cannot hold that against [1:05:35] all other law enforcement. [1:05:37] But to be honest, I don't know if I will ever view law enforcement the same way again. [1:05:41] As my attorney showed the court the disgusting text messages Exum sent to his fellow border [1:05:52] patrol buddies, literally bragging about how many times he shot me. I got sick to my stomach [1:05:58] seeing how a federal law enforcement officer will talk this way about shooting me. A woman who [1:06:05] he swore into was both eye-opening and heartbreaking. [1:06:13] Thankfully, I survived Exum's attempted murder of me and was able to shine a light on his lies. [1:06:22] But what about all the others who either did not survive or were not fortunate enough to have videos [1:06:30] proving the agent's lies? I know deep down this was God's purpose in having me survive Exum's five [1:06:36] bullets. It was for this moment to happen so that the world could see these text messages, which were [1:06:45] a window into the soul of the U.S. government. [1:06:46] Thank you. [1:06:47] I hope you will come back with a video of the U.S. Border Patrol at this critical time in our country's history. [1:06:53] Fourteen days after Exum was confronted with his own disgusting text messages, my attorney called me [1:07:00] with the wonderful news that the government was dismissing all my charges against me. [1:07:07] We showed up in court later that day and some of the same parents from the Montessori school [1:07:12] who came to support me and my arrangement were there again, this time with tears in [1:07:17] their eyes. [1:07:18] heard judge alexakis tell me i was free to go and the charges were dismissed with prejudice [1:07:25] i have learned that surviving the physical wound was only the beginning the beginning of this long [1:07:31] and painful journey the real battle started after and the in the weeks that followed i thought i [1:07:37] will feel great but still struggle i struggle with the memories of the day the initial swerving into [1:07:44] me by agent exxon the shots ringing out and the burning sensation as the bullets ripped through [1:07:50] my skin and body the images of the puddles of blood dripping from my dressings listening to [1:07:57] fbi agents arguing about whether the jail will accept me in this condition later in federal [1:08:05] prison staring out through a small window looking out into clark street as i struggle i struggle [1:08:16] every day with the physical pain and the suffering i can't [1:08:19] i cannot close my hand yet to hold the pen i try to play with the children at my school and i am in [1:08:27] a significant pain as i attempt to do things i was easily able to do before october 4th [1:08:34] i have 10 weekly physical therapy sessions to work on these issues and hope one day [1:08:40] i can move in the same way i was able to move prior to october 4. i know [1:08:47] that what happened to me in the matter of seconds on october 4 [1:08:51] will unfortunately [1:08:52] eternally be with me for a lifetime. The physical scars will always be there in the mornings and [1:08:59] evenings when I get dressed and I stare at my body, now permanently disfigured by the five lead [1:09:05] bullets X on fire into me. They will be there this summer when I head to the beach with my dogs and [1:09:12] family. They will be there when I get down on the floor with my students and work with them on their [1:09:18] motor skills. And perhaps even worse, the mental scars will always be there as a reminder of the [1:09:26] time my own government attempted to execute me. And when they fell, they chose to vilify me. I am [1:09:34] Renee Good. I am Alex Pretty. I am Silverio Villega Gonzalez. I am Keith Porter. They should all be [1:09:42] here today. I know each of them will trade my bullet wounds and lifetime of mental distress [1:09:48] and a heartbeat to be able to [1:09:50] be back with their loved ones this afternoon. And we must also remember the countless other souls who [1:09:59] lost their lives at the hands of these entrusted with authority. I know that by being a survivor, it is my [1:10:08] duty to be here today to let you elected officials know what is happening on the streets of our country [1:10:15] because silence is no longer an option. This needs to stop now. Why do we continue? [1:10:22] How do I continue to wait for public execution, a time of the greatest [1:10:28] punishment for those who have served in the most dire straits of our lives? [1:10:31] Why do we continue to wait for more public executions, when we have already seen the [1:10:35] evidence in our TVs and computer screens? We have heard the testimonies. We have watched the [1:10:40] pain unfold in real time. How many more lives must be lost before meaningful action is taken? The [1:10:47] United States is and will always be a country of immigrants, built by immigrants. We are a country [1:10:52] and a great nation that people around the world aspire to call home. [1:10:57] And prior to this recent war on immigrants, [1:11:01] we were a country where law enforcement acted lawfully and appropriately [1:11:05] with respect of all human life. [1:11:08] I am happy to see people of different nationalities speak up. [1:11:12] This is the spirit of love, unity, and courage. [1:11:15] This is what makes America great. [1:11:18] I am asking you today, pleading with you, [1:11:20] to please help bring back the America I grew up loving and idolizing. [1:11:25] In America, the values, human dignity protects life [1:11:28] and lives up to the ideals our founding fathers proudly proclaimed. [1:11:33] If there's no justice for the people, [1:11:36] let there be no peace for the government. [1:11:38] Thank you for your time. [1:11:42] Thank you, Ms. Martinez, Ms. Rahman. [1:11:45] And I'm going to suggest to the witnesses that we stay to five minutes [1:11:50] because we're running a little bit behind. [1:11:52] Thank you. [1:12:00] Thank you. [1:12:00] Thank you, members, for taking time to be here today. [1:12:03] And thank you, staff, for making this happen. [1:12:07] My name is Ali Rahman, and I am a resident of South Minneapolis. [1:12:14] I'm a Bangladeshi-American born in northern Wisconsin, [1:12:18] and I'm a disabled person with autism and a traumatic brain injury. [1:12:25] Not all autistic brains do this, [1:12:27] but mine fixates on sounds, numbers, and patterns. [1:12:35] And while what the world saw happened to me [1:12:38] exactly three weeks ago today on video, [1:12:41] was a terrible violation, [1:12:43] it is still nothing compared to the horrific practices [1:12:46] I saw inside the Whipple Center. [1:12:50] So I am here today with a duty to the people [1:12:52] who have not had the privilege of coming home, [1:12:56] and I offer this data because these practices must end now. [1:13:04] On January 13th, on the way to my 39th appointment [1:13:07] at Hennepin County's Traumatic Brain Injury Center, [1:13:10] I encountered a traffic jam caused by ICE vehicles [1:13:14] and no signs indicating how to get around it. [1:13:18] I had not wanted to pull into one of these buildings, [1:13:20] so I pulled into a blocked, chaotic intersection, [1:13:23] but verbally agreed to do so and rolled down my window [1:13:26] after an agent yelled, [1:13:28] move, I will break your effing window, his first instruction. [1:13:36] Agents on all sides of my vehicle yelled conflicting threats [1:13:39] and instructions that I could not process [1:13:41] while watching for pedestrians. [1:13:45] Then the glass of the passenger side window flew across my face. [1:13:51] I yelled, I'm disabled at the hands grabbing at me. [1:13:55] And an agent said, too late. [1:14:00] I felt it was too late. [1:14:01] Immersed in a pattern, and I thought of Genoa Donald, [1:14:05] an autistic black man killed by police during a traffic stop in 2021. [1:14:12] I remembered Mr. Sliberio Villalba Gonzalez, [1:14:16] who was killed by ICE in his vehicle last year. [1:14:21] An agent pulled a large combat knife in front of my face, [1:14:24] which I thought was for cutting me, [1:14:27] and later learned was used to cut off my seatbelt. [1:14:32] Shooting pain went through my head, neck, and wrists [1:14:35] when I hit the ground face first, [1:14:38] and people leaned. [1:14:39] I felt the pattern, and I thought of Mr. George Floyd, [1:14:45] who was killed four blocks away. [1:14:50] I was carried face down through the street by my cuffed arms and legs [1:14:55] while yelling that I had a brain injury and was disabled. [1:15:00] I now cannot lift my arms normally. [1:15:06] I was never asked for ID, never told I was under arrest, [1:15:14] never read my rights, and never charged with a crime. [1:15:22] Approaching the Whipple Center, [1:15:23] i saw black and brown bodies shackled together chained together being marched by yelling agents [1:15:33] outdoors i continue to hear the word bodies because that is how agents refer to us we're [1:15:45] bringing in a body they're bringing in bodies seven eight at a time where do i put them [1:15:52] we can't use that room there's already a body in there you have no reason to believe you will [1:16:00] make it out alive if you are already being called a body agents repeatedly had to stop and ask how [1:16:08] to do tasks i received no medical screening phone call or access to a lawyer i was denied a [1:16:17] communication navigator when my speech began to slur agents laughed as i tried to immobilize my [1:16:25] own neck i asked for my cane [1:16:29] and was told no pulled up my my arms and prodded forward and leg irons by agents laughing and saying [1:16:37] walk you can do it walk agents did not know if the facility had a wheelchair when i was finally [1:16:46] placed in one to be taken to interrogation an agent taunted you are driving right so your legs [1:16:50] do work i pleaded for emergency medical care for over an hour after my vision had become blurry my [1:16:59] heart rate went through the roof and the pain in my neck and had became unbearable it was denied [1:17:06] when i became [1:17:07] unable to speak my cellmate pleaded for me. The last sounds I remember before I [1:17:13] blacked out on the cell floor were my cellmate banging on the door pleading [1:17:18] for a medic and a voice outside saying we don't want to step on ICE's toes. When [1:17:26] I opened my eyes at Hennepin County's emergency room I learned I was brought [1:17:31] there to be treated for assault. The impacts of DHS detention on my physical [1:17:39] mental and financial well-being and safety have been very severe, but I do [1:17:44] not deserve more humane treatment than anyone else [1:17:48] US citizen or not. And I am here today with a strong spirit and a duty to the [1:17:56] many people who haven't had the privilege to tell their stories or see [1:18:00] their loved ones come home. I am extremely distressed by the [1:18:05] pattern that violence from law enforcement has been happening to [1:18:09] black and non-native [1:18:10] communities for centuries and to DHS survivors for over 20 years. We call [1:18:18] ourselves a civilized nation, but we lack rules and accountability around what a [1:18:23] person claiming to be law enforcement is permitted to do to another human being. I [1:18:28] am not afraid and I'm not afraid to keep working on this problem even after ICE [1:18:35] is gone. Thank you for your time. Thank you Ms. Rahman. Mr. Raskin. Hello, good [1:18:46] afternoon and thank you for allowing our story to be heard. I am Daniel Raskin, a [1:18:52] 23 year old US citizen from SoCal. I'm the eldest of three brothers and [1:18:57] father to a nearly three week old baby girl. I operate a forklift for work and [1:19:04] currently have my CDLA license and dental assisting certification. I'm not [1:19:10] celebrity, but I am loved by many in my community and there are many that I love [1:19:14] and I'm thankful for. The morning of August 16, 2025 would quickly [1:19:21] become a year for me to be able to be a part of the human rights movement. I'm [1:19:21] forgottable, especially because my [1:19:24] future father-in-law Francisco Longoria wanted me to run an errand with him and [1:19:29] his son Jonathan when all I really wanted to do was just sleep in. We took [1:19:36] Jonathan's truck with him sitting in the passenger seat, Francisco driving and me [1:19:41] sitting behind Francisco when we were just two minutes away from home. At 8 49 [1:19:47] a.m. two unmarked trucks suddenly boxed in our car. I had been looking down at my [1:19:52] phone, but when our car abruptly stopped I [1:19:55] Mhm. [1:19:56] I looked up thinking we must be at a red light or in a traffic jam, but to my surprise, I was instead met with four men in face masks, sunglasses, and baseball caps, and guns drawn, pointing straight at us, walking towards our car. [1:20:13] These four men then tried forcing their way into our car by pulling on the handles, pounding on the windows, and yelling at us to roll down the windows, all while failing to answer our repeated requests for their identification and what they wanted. [1:20:28] I did not know who these men were. They were refusing to identify themselves, and the only thing I felt I could control was capturing this event by recording it on my cell phone. [1:20:40] There were two men on either side of the car, and they were not wearing any uniform. I could not tell who these men surrounding our car with guns were. [1:20:48] We again asked them to show identification and why they were approaching us with so much aggression. [1:20:53] Only seconds after they started pounding on the windows, one of the men broke the driver's side window, punched Francisco in the face. [1:21:00] He then began reaching into the car. At the same time, a man on the other side of the car broke the passenger window, where Jonathan was sitting, and began reaching into the vehicle. [1:21:11] They shattered the windows, and in that moment, the whole world felt like it was the size of the inside of our pickup, and we were sitting in harm's way with nothing to do but record the horrifying experience. [1:21:23] Terrified for our lives, Francisco bravely drove straight through the only open pathway. [1:21:33] We were driving down the street, hoping to be driving towards safety, when we were instead met with gunfire. [1:21:40] After we had passed the men, one of the four men attempted to murder us after we passed by, as he fired and made contact with the passenger side of our car multiple times. [1:21:51] I will never forget the fear and having to quickly duck my head as the shots were fired at the car. [1:21:58] Any one of those bullets could have killed me or two people that I love. [1:22:03] We narrowly escaped as pieces of glass... [1:22:06] fell on our heads as we drove down the bumpy road. [1:22:09] Three minutes changed our lives forever. [1:22:12] The incident began at 8.49 a.m., and we were home by 8.52 a.m. [1:22:17] We left home that morning with the truck in good condition, but we returned home with a... [1:22:23] Excuse me. I'm sorry. What is that? [1:22:33] We were in... Sorry. I lost myself here. Yes. [1:22:41] We were home by 8.52 a.m., left that morning with the truck in good condition, but we returned home with a truck that had two shattered windows, [1:22:51] and bullet holes. [1:22:52] We then called 911 to report that four men who were hiding their identity assaulted and shot at us. [1:22:58] By 9 a.m., a police helicopter was flying over our property. [1:23:02] Next thing we know, local officers showed up at our home, handcuffed Francisco, put him in the officer's car, and began individually questioning us. [1:23:10] The officers then allowed the same four men who had just attacked us to come to our home. [1:23:16] Those four men were asked to identify who they were looking for, but they had zero idea as to who they were even targeting. [1:23:21] Pointing to me as the driver, these masked men had just shot at us, and they were now in our home, treating us as the people who had done something wrong. [1:23:31] The men who shot at us went to my future brother-in-law, asked him questions about the video we took of their attack, and lied, saying those were not shots. [1:23:40] When the officers left our home almost three hours later, we were told that the FBI would continue the investigation. [1:23:46] However, almost immediately after the officers left our home, two men walked out, up to our gate, [1:23:52] and told us to let them in. [1:23:54] We could immediately tell this was not the FBI, but instead ICE and HSI agents. [1:24:00] The HSI agent then said, is he here? [1:24:03] But they never clarified who he was. [1:24:06] I said we were told the FBI would be coming, and we would be waiting for them to arrive. [1:24:12] The HSI agent looked at me and said, for all intents and purposes, we are the FBI. [1:24:17] As time passed, more and more ICE and HSI agents arrived in unmarked vehicles with no license plates. [1:24:23] They had gear on and walked around our home with submachine guns, assault rifles, and holstered pistols, [1:24:32] making sure to keep their hands on their weapons for fast drawing. [1:24:35] The agents blocked every exit out of our home and shut the entire block of our neighborhood. [1:24:40] More than 20 HSI ICE agents and more than 30 police officers were banishing weapons, [1:24:46] ranging from paintball guns to a manned drone, flying and mapping out the layout of our home. [1:24:51] Our home that used to be our safe place is now being used as a weapon again. [1:24:55] To trap us and take advantage of our surroundings. [1:24:59] Once the agents finished asking us questions and watching our recordings of the terrifying event, [1:25:04] they left, but we no longer felt safe. [1:25:07] We didn't feel like we could leave our home or operate normally in the world. [1:25:12] How do you move on from knowing someone tried to kill you and people you love for no reason? [1:25:18] Then just two weeks later, on August 28, 2025, I was sleeping on the couch [1:25:23] when I was awoken up at 4 a.m. by horrified family members, [1:25:27] telling me that men were entering our property through our gate and surrounding our entire home. [1:25:34] These men had weapons, were wearing night vision goggles, [1:25:39] and utilizing a bright green laser beam from their assault rifles. [1:25:43] An armored truck was in front of our house and one of the men used a megaphone [1:25:47] to announce we needed to come outside of our home with our hands up. [1:25:51] Our hearts were racing and we tried getting everyone in the house awake since it was the middle of the night. [1:25:56] Again, we were placed in a position of pure terror and did not know what to do. [1:26:00] We called our lawyers because we did not understand what was happening. [1:26:04] But then, the men breached our front doors by breaking the locks [1:26:08] and yelling that we needed to come out of the house with our hands up. [1:26:11] The agents pointed the bright lasers attached to their rifles at each of us inside the home. [1:26:16] They even pointed their weapon at my fiancée, who was pregnant at the time. [1:26:22] We kept telling them she was pregnant and we would comply. [1:26:26] I was surrounded and trapped in a room full of the ones I love and fearing for every single one of our lives. [1:26:31] We kept asking for a warrant and eventually they showed one and we listened to their commands. [1:26:38] Francisco was in his sleeping attire and we begged them to allow us to give him a shirt and socks [1:26:43] since it was cold outside and we did not know where they were taking him or what they would do to him. [1:26:49] We then watched as they took him away, breaking our hearts. [1:26:53] Eventually, Francisco went in front of a federal judge who validated that the incident was scary to watch [1:26:58] from the recording inside our vehicle. [1:27:03] Despite the lies and misinformation given by the agents, the judge believed our truth [1:27:10] and eventually the federal charges were dismissed. [1:27:13] However, Francisco was taken to immigration custody and held for three months [1:27:18] where he had to endure horrible conditions. [1:27:23] Months later, Francisco was released on bond and able to witness the birth of his first grandchild, my daughter. [1:27:29] Yet our fight for justice is not over. [1:27:33] We will carry this incident with us forever. [1:27:36] Thank you, Senator Blumenthal and Senator Garcia. [1:27:39] Thank you very much, Mr. Rascón. [1:27:45] Ms. Stoughton. [1:27:57] I'm a law professor at the safety portfolio. [1:28:09] I've spent the last 13 years studying policing. [1:28:12] I'm also a former police officer. [1:28:14] This administration's approach to immigration enforcement falls far short of professional norms. [1:28:23] This is not policing. [1:28:26] This is not normal. [1:28:29] And this is neither professionally nor democratically acceptable. [1:28:33] I want to be clear that my comments are not about federal immigration policy. [1:28:38] Reasonable people can disagree on policy and yet still agree with something more fundamental, [1:28:43] that any enforcement must be performed professionally, legally, and safely. [1:28:51] That is not what we see right now. [1:28:54] Instead, we see a lack of interagency, collaboration, or even basic communication, [1:28:58] reducing both efficiency and public trust. [1:29:02] We see poor tactics that put community members and federal agents themselves [1:29:05] in unnecessary danger. [1:29:07] And we see profound failures of leadership after critical incidents that never should have happened. [1:29:14] With regard to interagency collaboration, [1:29:16] federal law enforcement has partnered with state and local agencies for generations. [1:29:20] Highly targeted police efforts have long been known to be the most effective approach to enforcement, [1:29:27] but they depend heavily on local knowledge, relationships, and expertise that federal agents lack. [1:29:35] Today, we see federal immigration authorities [1:29:37] simply ignoring established channels of communication, [1:29:40] demanding state and local agencies blindly comply with federal priorities [1:29:46] and contravention of basic tenets of federalism. [1:29:49] We see federal immigration authorities sending in agents [1:29:52] who appear to have no connection with, insight into, or even basic concern [1:29:57] for the communities they are in. [1:30:00] Having deprived themselves of a scalpel, [1:30:03] federal officials have fallen back on the hammer, [1:30:06] using dragnet-style enforcement tactics that are demonstrably overbroad. [1:30:10] According to government data, more than half of ICE detainees have no criminal record, [1:30:16] and only a very small percentage have been convicted of any violent crime. [1:30:19] We see similar departures from established professional norms [1:30:23] when it comes to what immigration officials are doing in the field. [1:30:28] Professional policing depends on clear identification, [1:30:31] including uniforms, badges, and, in most cases, visible faces. [1:30:38] That reduces the risk of tragic misidentification, [1:30:41] both blue-on-blue shootings and defensive violence by confused citizens. [1:30:47] By contrast, recent federal operations have involved officers in plainclothes and masks, [1:30:52] sometimes refusing to identify themselves even when asked, [1:30:55] leading to dangerous confusion. [1:30:57] Among other things, local officers have responded to kidnapping and shooting in progress calls. [1:31:02] In one incident, a local officer drew his weapon on a motorist [1:31:06] that he saw pointing a gun at someone else, [1:31:09] only to later learn that that motorist was an ICE agent. [1:31:13] Professional policing also depends on sound tactics [1:31:16] to keep officers and community members safe. [1:31:19] This includes, among other things, attempting to de-escalate [1:31:22] passively non-compliant subjects, [1:31:25] such as those who fail to exit their vehicles when initially commanded to do so. [1:31:29] But we see federal agents rushing vehicles, [1:31:33] prying on door handles, [1:31:35] and breaking windows within seconds of initiating an encounter. [1:31:38] This is substantially more likely to scale [1:31:41] a non-compliant subject into actively attempting to escape a potential assault. [1:31:46] Good tactics include preemptively avoiding the risk of being struck by a vehicle [1:31:52] by not stepping in front of vehicles. [1:31:54] But we see federal agents taking and maintaining positions in front of vehicles. [1:31:59] Good tactics include not shooting at moving vehicles, [1:32:03] a practice professional policing has constrained for decades, [1:32:07] both because it is unlikely to actually stop the vehicle from moving, [1:32:12] and it can create an unguided missile. [1:32:15] There have been at least 10 instances of federal immigration officials [1:32:18] doing exactly that in the past few months. [1:32:21] We've also seen uses of force that appear on their face [1:32:24] to be deeply problematic or simply outright excessive. [1:32:28] An agent in Cicero, Illinois, [1:32:30] deploying pepper spray into the window of a moving vehicle [1:32:33] with a toddler inside. [1:32:35] An agent in Chicago, who from a position on a nearby roof, [1:32:38] shot a minister who was standing on the sidewalk below [1:32:41] in the head with pepper balls. [1:32:43] And agents in Minneapolis, New York, Los Angeles, and elsewhere [1:32:46] shoving people to the ground, [1:32:48] including some people who appear to have no idea [1:32:51] that they are even being approached by agents [1:32:53] to say nothing of the stories you've already heard [1:32:56] from other witnesses today. [1:32:58] When the actions of a law enforcement officer results in a loss of life, [1:33:02] as we've seen most recently with the killings of Rene Good and Alex Preddy, [1:33:06] professional policing should follow a disciplined protocol, [1:33:10] conduct a thorough investigation while sharing what is known, [1:33:14] identifying what is unknown, and avoiding speculation. [1:33:18] Competent leaders know that premature narratives [1:33:21] can contaminate investigations and corrode trust. [1:33:25] But we've seen senior officials issue definitive, [1:33:29] exonerating conclusions within hours of an incident, [1:33:33] far sooner than would be possible with any careful inquiry. [1:33:36] We've also seen public claims about absolute immunity [1:33:40] that are legally incorrect. [1:33:42] These statements signal that any oversight [1:33:46] is purely performative, [1:33:48] that accountability and outcomes are preordained. [1:33:51] More troublingly, we've seen traditional accountability mechanisms [1:33:56] sidelined in ways that repeatedly prompted resignations [1:34:00] by experienced attorneys and investigating agents. [1:34:03] This is an extraordinary warning sign [1:34:06] that critical safeguards are being bypassed or weakened. [1:34:10] We are in the terrifying position of seeing federal agencies [1:34:14] unwilling or unable to conduct the kind of thorough, [1:34:17] meticulous investigations that these incidents demand, [1:34:21] or even denying that any investigation is necessary [1:34:25] when we can plainly see that it is. [1:34:28] Abandoning these longstanding principles, [1:34:31] threatening state and local officials, [1:34:33] sidelining highly experienced and deeply dedicated public servants, [1:34:37] precluding accountability by actively inhibiting any meaningful review, [1:34:42] these are not normal decisions. [1:34:44] History suggests that these are the hallmarks [1:34:48] of authoritarianism. [1:34:51] These deviations from longstanding professional norms [1:34:54] should be deeply concerning. [1:34:57] Equally concerning is the effect that this administration's approach [1:35:00] will have in the future as thousands of ICE agents [1:35:03] who have recently been hired [1:35:05] or who are going to continue to be hired [1:35:07] will eventually change jobs, [1:35:09] moving into other aspects of federal law enforcement [1:35:12] or taking jobs with state and local agencies. [1:35:15] What we're seeing right now is not normal, [1:35:17] but if it is not addressed, [1:35:19] it will become normal. [1:35:21] And that will send professional policing back decades, [1:35:26] and the cost will be in lives. [1:35:28] Thank you for your time. [1:35:30] I look forward to your questions. [1:35:33] Thank you. [1:35:34] Thank you, Professor Stoughton. [1:35:35] I'm going to turn to Representative Garcia. [1:35:37] He will ask the first round, [1:35:39] then we'll go back and forth [1:35:40] between the House and the Senate. [1:35:42] I want to express my appreciation [1:35:43] for the tremendous turnout that we have today. [1:35:45] We're going to have four-minute rounds [1:35:48] because we have so many people [1:35:50] and we have limited amounts of time. [1:35:53] Representative Garcia. [1:35:54] Thank you. [1:35:55] I want to just begin by thanking all of our witnesses. [1:35:57] Each of your stories has been very honestly hard to hear. [1:36:00] Like many of my colleagues, [1:36:02] I'm enraged by what you've all had to go through. [1:36:04] I'm so sorry that the stories are horrific, [1:36:08] and I promise you that every single one of us, [1:36:11] whether it's the House or the Senate, [1:36:14] we will hold all of those that cause you harm accountable. [1:36:17] You all deserve justice and you deserve peace. [1:36:21] And it's horrific [1:36:22] because anyone in our country [1:36:24] has to go through what you have all been through, [1:36:26] and I'm so sorry. [1:36:29] We know that they're calling some of you [1:36:31] and Americans across this country [1:36:33] terrorists and anarchists. [1:36:35] And I want to be clear that President Trump [1:36:37] and his administration continue to lie [1:36:39] about what they're doing over and over again. [1:36:41] I want to start with Ms. Martinez. [1:36:43] You shared a heartbreaking story, [1:36:45] and I just want to go over some information [1:36:47] on the record again to be very clear. [1:36:50] You were shot five times, [1:36:52] which is terrifying and horrific. [1:36:53] Your own government called you a domestic terrorist, [1:36:55] is that correct? [1:36:56] Correct. [1:36:59] And you're not a terrorist, of course, correct? [1:37:02] No, I'm not. [1:37:03] You're a teacher, is that right? [1:37:06] Yes, correct. [1:37:07] You were convicted of no crimes, is that correct? [1:37:10] Correct. [1:37:11] Have you ever been convicted of a crime? [1:37:14] Never. [1:37:15] Never been convicted of a crime. [1:37:16] But the government kept calling you a domestic terrorist [1:37:20] even after all the baseless criminal charges against you [1:37:22] were dismissed, is that correct? [1:37:24] Yes, correct. [1:37:25] Would you agree that the government [1:37:26] was trying to intimidate protesters [1:37:28] and to encourage more violence? [1:37:29] Yes. [1:37:30] Is it true that in the body cam footage [1:37:32] the CBP officer told you to, [1:37:34] and I'm so sorry for saying this, [1:37:36] the officer told you to, quote, [1:37:38] do something, bitch, before he fired? [1:37:41] Yes. [1:37:43] It's disgusting, shameful, and it gets worse. [1:37:47] Ms. Martinez, these are images of texts [1:37:49] sent by the agent who shot you. [1:37:53] And they're actually disturbing to read, [1:37:56] but I think it's important for the public to see this. [1:37:58] The agent linked an article about your shooting [1:38:01] and texted, read it, five shots, seven holes. [1:38:06] I fired five rounds, and she had seven holes. [1:38:10] Put that in your book, boys. [1:38:13] Oh, well, it is what it is. [1:38:15] Shit happens. [1:38:19] This is someone that works for the United States government. [1:38:23] I fired five rounds, and she had seven holes. [1:38:27] Now, he was talking about you, and it's our understanding [1:38:31] that he was actually bragging about his aim, [1:38:34] shooting an unarmed American citizen. [1:38:38] Is that right? [1:38:39] Correct. [1:38:42] I'm so sorry, Ms. Martinez. [1:38:43] DHS has allowed the agent who shot you [1:38:46] to remove evidence and to potentially destroy it. [1:38:48] Is that correct? [1:38:49] Correct. [1:38:50] They're actively working to deny you justice [1:38:54] to an American citizen who's been shot [1:38:56] and almost murdered, and I'm so sorry. [1:38:59] I want to turn to Ms. Rahman very briefly. [1:39:01] The government, and I'm sorry, it's important that, of course, [1:39:04] that those that are watching can see this. [1:39:06] I'm going to turn this for a minute. [1:39:07] I'm going to turn it over to Ms. Rahman. [1:39:08] Thank you. [1:39:10] The image above you just saw, Ms. Rahman, [1:39:11] we've taken it down, of course. [1:39:12] Ms. Rahman, you were literally just driving to a doctor [1:39:15] in your own city. [1:39:16] Is that correct? [1:39:17] That's correct. [1:39:18] You shared that when officers were yelling at you [1:39:20] that you thought about others who had been shot. [1:39:22] Is that correct? [1:39:23] Yes. [1:39:24] You told officers that you were disabled. [1:39:25] Is that correct? [1:39:26] Yes, many times. [1:39:27] You were still brutally arrested, denied, [1:39:30] and denied medical care, and you lost consciousness [1:39:32] in your cell. [1:39:33] Is that correct? [1:39:34] That is correct. [1:39:35] Horrific, outrageous, and I'm so sorry [1:39:37] that this happened to you. [1:39:38] And I would encourage the American public [1:39:40] to view the photos of what happened to Ms. Rahman, [1:39:45] which are very hard to see. [1:39:47] These agents are unleashing violence [1:39:50] against people across our country. [1:39:52] And I have one final picture as I close. [1:39:54] I want to remind the American public of Stephen Miller. [1:39:58] There is probably no single person in this government [1:40:01] who has done more damage, more damage, [1:40:04] and more harm to people across this country, [1:40:07] immigrants and U.S. citizens, [1:40:09] in the terror that is happening across this country. [1:40:11] Thank you. [1:40:12] Thank you so much. [1:40:15] And I probably um [1:40:18] don't have a betterili... [1:40:20] advantages, [1:40:21] um, [1:40:23] than this man right here. [1:40:24] And it's our job as a House, [1:40:27] a Senate, [1:40:30] and a United Congress [1:40:33] to hold him responsible for the crimes [1:40:35] that are happening to United States citizens. [1:40:38] As a country, we have to do better. [1:40:40] And with that, I yield back. [1:40:44] Thank you very much. [1:40:45] Um [1:40:46] I want to express [1:40:48] an apology as well. I'm going to hold up the same poster that Representative Garcia just asked you [1:40:58] about. We thought alike. Great minds think alike. Ms. Martinez, Charles Exum, that's what Charles [1:41:12] Exum had to say about shooting you. What would you say to Charles Exum? That I hope that he never [1:41:22] goes through this pain again. I mean, I hope that him and his family never goes through this pain, [1:41:28] that what me and my family, we went through. Well said. What I would say to him is, [1:41:34] have you no sense of decency? Have you no sense of shame? And I would say the same to [1:41:44] Kristi Noem and to all at DHS responsible. Because what this poster shows is that those [1:41:57] DHS agents made our streets less safe. ICE and CBP are making our neighborhoods less safe. If an [1:42:12] agent of the United States government can shoot you, literally shoot you, cause you almost to [1:42:21] bleed to death and feel this kind of callousness and cruelty, there is a need to change the training, [1:42:32] the recruiting, [1:42:33] the structure, completely overhaul, rebuild from the bottom up and house clean from the top down. [1:42:49] And I think you really summarized it best in the testimony I just heard. What about all the others? [1:42:55] I'm quoting you. What about all the others who did not survive or were not fortunate enough [1:43:03] to have videos proving that the agent lied? Charles Exum sought to assassinate you. [1:43:15] And then DHS sought to assassinate your character. That is unconscionable and intolerable. [1:43:27] Mr. Raskin, how do you feel now about what happened to you? I gather the emotions are still with you. [1:43:40] Yes, sir, they are. I feel like I still look over my shoulder and so does the rest of my family. [1:43:47] And it's tough to relive the situation and think about it on the daily because [1:43:54] our fight is not over. [1:44:00] I would like to ask you, Ms. Rahman, because your outrage and your anger was so powerful, [1:44:10] whether you would endorse the kind of remedies that would enable you to bring a lawsuit against [1:44:21] the agents who so brutally abused you. [1:44:25] Yes, this is a solvable problem. I'm very angry that it's not being solved. [1:44:30] And Ms. Martinez, would you want to seek justice and accountability? [1:44:35] I do. [1:44:37] Mr. Raskin? [1:44:38] Yes, sir, I do. [1:44:42] And just finally, I'd like to ask this entire panel, all the United States citizens here, [1:44:49] please raise your hand. Thank you. And thank you for being here. [1:44:56] I think I want to call Representative Krishnamoorthy, please, for his four minutes. [1:45:05] Thank you very much. And thank you to the witnesses for your courage in coming here [1:45:08] and telling us your testimony. [1:45:10] Mr. Stoughton, during Operation Midway Blitz, Secretary Noem posted on Twitter the following. [1:45:18] She said, [1:45:20] I'm a representative of the Chicago area, so this was something I paid attention to. [1:45:28] Let's look at what DHS has done to, quote, unquote, make Chicago safer. [1:45:34] According to the Chicago Sun-Times, in November, a federal agent pepper-sprayed this one-year-old baby [1:45:41] in a Sam's Club parking lot in Cicero. That didn't make people safer, right? [1:45:46] And Chicago wasn't safer when, according to CBS, ICE agents, [1:45:53] Edgar Ruiz pictured in this middle panel, a U.S. citizen in the face after he didn't open his car [1:45:59] door to allow them in, correct? And it didn't make my constituents in Elgin, Illinois, safer when, [1:46:09] as ABC7 reported, ICE agents in this panel here deployed tear gas and smoke bombs in a residential [1:46:17] neighborhood against peaceful protesters, right? And my constituent Evelyn, an 18-year-old U.S. [1:46:23] citizen, was not safer when she was dragged from her car and tackled by agents in a residential [1:46:28] neighborhood, as reported by Chicago Tribune, right? And Ms. Martinez, you were certainly not [1:46:35] safer when, according to your own testimony today, you were shot with five bullets. Is that right? [1:46:41] Correct. Let me turn to the story of Mr. Silverio Villegas Gonzalez. Here's a picture of Mr. [1:46:52] Silverio Villegas Gonzalez. Mr. Romanucci, he dropped his kids off at [1:46:57] school one morning, and then ICE agents stopped his car. When he tried to drive away, the agents [1:47:03] claimed that they, quote, feared for their lives and then shot him in the neck. Mr. Villegas tragically [1:47:10] died of his injuries. Mr. Romanucci, videos from the scene do not show Mr. Villegas Gonzalez [1:47:17] hitting or attacking the agents. You're not aware of any evidence to the contrary, right? [1:47:22] I am not aware of any of that. DHS also claimed an agent was, quote, seriously injured, but body [1:47:29] cam footage showed the agent in question said his injuries were, quote, nothing major. You're not [1:47:36] aware of any evidence to the contrary, right? I am not, and that is very typical of the cover [1:47:41] stories that we hear in the false narratives in order to defend their actions. There was no [1:47:46] evidence. This is part of a pattern. As you know, Mr. Romanucci, Mr. Villegas Gonzalez was stopped [1:47:53] and then he was shot dead. The nation knows the names of Rene Good and Alex Preti, but let us [1:48:00] not forget Mr. Silverio Villegas Gonzalez, a Chicagoan and a father of two, pictured here. [1:48:10] Let me turn to another topic. Mr. Stoughton, in a ruling on DHS's excessive use of force, [1:48:18] U.S. District Judge Sarah Ellis accused Greg Bovino, a commander in the Customs and Border Patrol, [1:48:26] of, quote, unquote, outright lying. That's what this poster shows, and that's what he did [1:48:31] in a court of law, right? In fact, during the day, Mr. Stoughton, who was a member of the [1:48:34] Customs and Border Patrol, was arrested. During his deposition, Mr. Bovino falsely claimed and [1:48:37] lied that he was attacked before he deployed tear gas at peaceful protesters in Little Village in [1:48:43] the Chicago area, correct? It did not happen. He also lied about something else. In court, [1:48:55] he falsely claimed that he did not tackle a protester to the ground during a demonstration [1:49:01] outside of Broadview's ICE facility, but here are the pictures of him doing just that. He lied, [1:49:08] he lied, and he lied again. [1:49:11] I've already called for Secretary Noem to be fired or impeached. Today, I'm calling for Greg Bovino [1:49:16] to be fired. In addition, he must be investigated and held accountable for his actions, and I [1:49:22] believe crimes, in Chicago and across the country. Thank you, and I yield back. [1:49:30] Senator Klobuchar. [1:49:31] Thank you. I want to thank Brent and Luke for their powerful testimony earlier and for being [1:49:39] with us to honor the memory of their sister and my constituent, Renee Good. Senator Smith and I [1:49:44] had that conversation. I want to thank them for their testimony. I want to thank them for their [1:49:45] testimony. I want to thank them for their testimony. I want to thank them for their testimony. I want [1:49:45] to thank them for their testimony. I want to thank them for their testimony. I want to thank them for [1:49:45] the privilege to meet with them ahead of time. I also want to thank you, Ms. Rahman, for coming [1:49:51] forward in the hardest of circumstances to tell your story of, despite the claims that ICE's focus [1:49:59] is to go after the worst of the worst, the most violent offenders. In fact, they went after you [1:50:03] when you were on your way to a doctor's appointment. Our state is once again the center of [1:50:11] America's heartbreak, but I hope my colleagues see that we're also the center of America's [1:50:16] courage and hope. Courage and hope when 50,000 people march peacefully in below zero weather. [1:50:26] Courage and hope when neighbors are helping neighbors and people they've ever even met. [1:50:30] And courage and hope when you, Ms. Rahman, are willing to come forward and Renee's brothers are [1:50:36] willing to testify in her memory. So I had seen the video, Ms. Rahman, of what happened to you, [1:50:43] but hearing your story is even more chilling. Can you talk about the chaos in the moment as [1:50:49] you're just driving to a doctor's appointment that made it hard for you or really any other [1:50:54] person to figure out what to do? Yes, there are no signs. There's no sign of the skill that [1:51:03] elementary crossing guards have. There's no single person giving instructions. Inside the Whipple [1:51:12] Center, it is like that also. And I have an auditory processing challenge that means multiple [1:51:18] voices sound like they're at the same volume. I did comply with at least one of those people. [1:51:28] Okay, thank you. Thank you, [1:51:31] very much. And I think when you listen to the professor talk about right policing and how it's [1:51:35] supposed to work or our Minneapolis Police Chief O'Hara, who's been very outspoken on this, [1:51:40] part of the problem is you have these people that are not police officers in our state. They're not [1:51:45] following the rules of conduct. And you were a victim of that. Ms. Rahmanucci, I know you're [1:51:51] representing Ms. Good's family, but I'm sure you've also seen about, heard about to your firm [1:51:56] other constitutional violations. I just use examples that may not be, [1:52:01] your clients, but the two-year-old deported that my office worked on in the middle of the night [1:52:06] to get this little girl back. The five-year-old Liam, who was brought back and people were very [1:52:12] happy about that with his little blue hat with the ears and his Spider-Man backpack. And we just [1:52:19] found out today that the Deputy Attorney General has announced that they're appealing that ruling [1:52:23] out of Texas. The Hmong elder who was pulled out in his underwear when they figured out they had [1:52:29] the wrong guy and he was driven around. [1:52:31] And then they realized the guy that they were trying to get was already in jail, publicly available [1:52:36] information had been for years. Can you talk about the repeated constitutional violations happening [1:52:42] in my home state? Madam Senator Klobuchar, we see this routinely. It's cringeworthy to watch the [1:52:48] video every day on the news and to see what is happening in Minneapolis to American citizens [1:52:55] who are having their rights violated consistently, routinely. It sounds like a [1:53:00] school [1:53:01] yard when you're saying constitutional violation, First Amendment, Second Amendment, Fourth Amendment, [1:53:06] Tenth Amendment, Fourteenth Amendment. It's like we're reciting something. It is consistent, [1:53:12] it's routine, and it must be stopped. There needs to be accountability. Without accountability, [1:53:18] we will continue this day in and day out until law enforcement officers are able to be held [1:53:25] accountable. And speaking of that, how does the Trump administration's refusal to cooperate with [1:53:30] our state attorney general's office, Keith Ellison, our local authorities, refusing to [1:53:35] have the Minnesota Bureau of Criminal Apprehension investigate your client's family's loved one's case [1:53:43] interfere with holding people accountable? Well, it absolutely starts with the false [1:53:48] narrative that officers, law enforcement officers, have absolute immunity because that gives them the [1:53:54] right to think they have absolute impunity. And without any significant parallel investigation, [1:54:01] or cooperative investigation, there cannot be accountability either on the civil side, [1:54:07] administrative side, and certainly there's going to be compromise then on the civil side [1:54:12] without meaningful, transparent, real investigation. Thank you. Thank you. Next, [1:54:23] I'd like to ask Representative Ro Khanna, please. Thank you. Ms. Martinez, the entire country [1:54:30] needs to hear your story. You were born in Chicago and raised there. You're an American citizen. [1:54:37] Correct? [1:54:38] Correct. [1:54:38] And you were in your car driving around in the neighborhood as ICE agents were there. [1:54:45] And your interest was simply to warn neighbors that ICE was in the neighborhood, correct? [1:54:51] Yes. I was also going to take clothes to donate [1:54:54] at my local church. [1:54:55] And as you were driving along, following the rules of the road, an ICE agent slams his car [1:55:04] into your car, correct? [1:55:05] Correct. [1:55:06] And you panic. You immediately stop on the ramp, need to break food, use legos during the day, [1:55:09] work with your reads to check for blood pressure. Why? [1:55:09] stop. The ICE agent doesn't ask you politely get out of the car. The ICE agent comes and so you [1:55:16] panic. You move to the left lane and then the ICE agent gets out and starts to shoot you, correct? [1:55:22] Yes, I was driving away, yes. Shooting an American citizen, not once, not twice, not three times, [1:55:32] not four times, but five times. Is that correct? Correct. That you testified that my life was [1:55:40] narrowly taken by my own government and then, correct? Correct. And then the ICE agent doesn't [1:55:47] say how can I help when you've got blood running out of your body. The ICE agent doesn't call 9-11. [1:55:53] You have to drive a mile before you call 9-11, 9-1-1, to get medical attention, correct? Correct. [1:56:02] And then you go to a hospital and they're so concerned about detaining you, they don't even [1:56:07] let you get adequate health care. Is that correct? Correct. You have to beg them to take you for [1:56:13] medical care? Correct. As an American citizen? Correct. And then you're arrested, detained, [1:56:20] and called a domestic terrorist after this ICE agent shot you five times? Correct. I'm angry on [1:56:27] your behalf, Ms. Martinez. Tell me, what do you want this government to do to apologize to you [1:56:33] and make you whole for what happened to you? Apologize and accountability, that's all I want. [1:56:38] Just, sorry, you're not a domestic terrorist, that's it. That's all I want, that's all I'm [1:56:43] asking for. For them to admit, [1:56:45] that they were wrong. Everything that they said about me, I just want accountability and for them [1:56:52] to say, no, you're not a domestic terrorist, we were wrong. And I'm sorry, a simple sorry, that's it. [1:56:58] And I know you mentioned Charles Exum, the agent who shot you five times? Correct. I believe he [1:57:05] should be arrested. I believe he should be prosecuted. I believe it is outrageous what [1:57:10] happened to you. This government owes you an apology, and I appreciate your courage for [1:57:14] telling your story here today. Thank you. [1:57:20] Thank you both, Senator Blumenthal, Representative Garcia for convening us once again on these difficult [1:57:28] but necessary conversations, and to bring these stories to light. And I want to thank all the [1:57:34] witnesses for your participation here as well, for your bravery, for your courage, [1:57:42] to share your stories, particularly Ms. Martinez, Ms. Rahman, and my constituent [1:57:47] from California, Mr. Rascun. I know it's not easy. It's time on your party motion, on your [1:57:53] part, so fresh because of what has happened to you and to your families. I want to repeat some of [1:58:02] what's been said by my colleagues or ask you questions, because you've done such a powerful [1:58:07] job in sharing your experience, not just for this committee or these committees to hear, but for the [1:58:12] world to hear. Because the cameras are here, the press is paying attention. We hope the American [1:58:17] people hear what's happening through your eyes. But I do want to add a couple of other elements to [1:58:24] the context here. First of all, why is it just us? It's the House, it's the Senate, but why is it [1:58:31] just Democrats? What is the administration in engaging in this truth and accountability [1:58:39] conversation? Sadly, you know, we've come to not expect it from Donald Trump because we know who [1:58:45] he is. We're not shocked at how his cabinet acts because they're just a reflection and extension of [1:58:52] him. Let's not let our Republican colleagues off the hook, because under normal circumstances, [1:58:59] regardless of who's in the majority, we're not going to let our Republican colleagues off the hook, [1:59:00] regardless of who's in the majority, we're not going to let our Republican colleagues off the hook, [1:59:00] regardless of who's in the majority, we're not going to let our Republican colleagues off the hook, [1:59:00] regardless of who's in the majority. When tragedies like this happen, [1:59:04] congressional committees convene to conduct our job to provide that oversight. But our [1:59:10] Republican colleagues refuse to, not in the House, not in the Senate, not in the full committee, [1:59:14] not even the subcommittee level. But at least we are here doing what we can to bring this [1:59:21] information to light. Now, over the course of the last year, we've all seen the images because [1:59:28] while Minneapolis is in the most intense spotlight right now, what we're seeing and hearing began [1:59:35] in Southern California, in the greater Los Angeles area. We've seen incidents in Chicago. [1:59:39] We've seen incidents in Charlotte. We've seen incidents [1:59:45] in Portland. And now we're seeing it intensely in Minnesota. We've seen the masks, the unmarked cars, [1:59:53] the agents who refuse to identify themselves. We've seen the agents coming out of helicopters [2:00:00] rappelling onto an apartment building in Chicago kicking indoors indiscriminately, [2:00:05] all for purposes of making a promotional video for themselves. [2:00:10] We've heard and seen about the tear gas. We've seen the shootings of cars like Mr. Rascón's [2:00:15] experience and others. And a few weeks ago, we saw the killing of Renee Goode. [2:00:23] And it brings us back to that point because under normal circumstances, [2:00:27] you might get a sense of like, oh, let's bring the temperature down a little bit. [2:00:32] There was an officer, not just use of force, officer involved shooting, a fatal officer [2:00:37] involved shooting. And instead of proceeding with the best practices of an independent investigation, [2:00:45] what do we hear from the administration all the way to the top? No, these officers have complete [2:00:52] immunity. Number one, that's not true. It's wrong. Number two, it's the opposite message, [2:00:58] the wrong message to send the aid to the agents in the field. So as heartbroken as I am, [2:01:05] I'm not shocked that less than three weeks later, Mr. Preddy was shot 10 times in the back. [2:01:20] All for what? Because Ms. Goode and Mr. Preddy were exercising their First Amendment rights? You're [2:01:28] setting up a military training camp. That's just ours. You can't be making it for [2:01:30] people who are stood up on behalf of their neighbors. That's so core to our democracy. [2:01:39] Freedom of speech. I appreciate Mr. Stoughton's contribution to this conversation here, [2:01:44] because under normal circumstances, but I've been in public service a long time. I've served [2:01:49] in local governments, state government, and now at the federal level. Under normal circumstances, [2:01:53] we lean on a credible independent investigation. Sometimes it's administrative at the beginning, [2:01:59] to find out what happened. [2:02:00] And if consequences or accountability aren't ordered for us, I'll go back to you and say, don't do that. [2:02:01] order for an officer. Absent that, because our country's history is not perfect, under normal [2:02:07] circumstances, we turn to the Department of Justice and the Civil Rights Division to oversee [2:02:14] a credible independent investigation and bring forth consequences and accountability when [2:02:19] warranted. But sadly, we're not living in normal times. And so we do need to exercise any leverage [2:02:28] point we can for the important reforms and restraints of what's happening on the streets [2:02:33] for the safety of our communities and our constituents. And I bring that independent [2:02:41] investigation as an example because when it comes to state and local law enforcement, [2:02:48] our citizens have yet another recourse. They can bring a civil right of action when the government [2:02:56] fails in their responsibility. But colleagues, sadly, that is not an option when it comes to [2:03:03] ICE agents or CBP or other federal law enforcement officers. So we're living [2:03:07] in a time when we're not able to do that. And so we need to exercise any leverage point we can [2:03:08] when we're not able to do that. And so we need to exercise any leverage point we can [2:03:08] in a time when victims of their violence have no other recourse for justice. And Senator [2:03:15] Blumenthal and I and others, both sides of the Capitol, are working hard to advance legislation [2:03:23] to that effect. Ms. Martinez deserves justice. Ms. Rama deserves justice. Mr. Rascón deserves [2:03:32] justice. The people of our country deserve better. Thank you all. [2:03:37] Thank you, Senator. Next up, we have Representative Brown. [2:03:42] Thank you. Law enforcement has two very straightforward goals. Keep people safe and build [2:03:51] trust in our communities. Yet somehow, President Trump has managed to weaponize ICE and CBP in a [2:03:58] way that has shattered trust and made entire communities more dangerous. What we are seeing [2:04:06] right now is not normal. It is not acceptable and it is not right. In just the first month of the [2:04:13] administration, just two U.S. citizens, Alex Pretty, a nurse, and Renee Good, a mother, were [2:04:26] killed by federal agents. As if that weren't bad enough, top administration officials like J.D. [2:04:32] Vance and Kristi Noem rushed to publicly justify those killings and slander the victims. Just weeks [2:04:40] earlier, Keith Porter, a 43-year-old father, was shot in the head and killed in a very brutal way. [2:04:43] Keith Porter, a 43-year-old father, was shot in the head and killed in a very brutal way. Keith [2:04:44] Porter, a 43-year-old father, was shot in the head and killed in a very brutal way. Keith Porter was [2:04:44] just a topic of discussion. In just a couple of weeks, a former U.S. ambassador, Ralph [2:04:45] Brown, has been arrested despite a state of emergency andlecture charges. He is somehow unable to [2:04:45] shot and killed by an off-duty ICE officer in Los Angeles. [2:04:51] And nearly every day since, [2:04:54] Americans have watched footage of masked federal agents [2:04:58] dragging people from cars, menacing peaceful protesters, [2:05:04] tear-gassing neighborhoods, harming bystanders, [2:05:08] including babies, [2:05:10] and ripping children from their parents. [2:05:14] These are not one-offs. [2:05:15] These are not honest mistakes. [2:05:18] These are predictable results of an administration [2:05:22] from the president on down that uses disgraceful language [2:05:26] to dehumanize immigrants as criminals, rapists, [2:05:30] and invaders. [2:05:32] And it is the result of a regime [2:05:35] that prioritizes quotas over judgment, [2:05:39] intimidation over restraint, [2:05:42] and political theater over human dignity and life. [2:05:47] When the government kills its own citizens [2:05:50] and then rushes to defend itself, [2:05:54] rather than seek the truth and ensure justice, [2:05:57] something is fundamentally broken. [2:06:00] And just this week, that same recklessness [2:06:03] was aimed at my home state of Ohio. [2:06:06] In Springfield, thousands of Haitian families, [2:06:11] people who have lived and worked legally [2:06:14] under temporary protected status, [2:06:17] have been thrown into chaos. [2:06:19] Not because they broke the law, [2:06:21] not because conditions in Haiti have improved, [2:06:25] but because Trump's ICE needs bodies to deport [2:06:29] to meet draconian, political-driven quotas. [2:06:33] These families are workers, taxpayers, parents. [2:06:39] They have stabilized local economies, [2:06:42] filled critical jobs, and strengthened their communities. [2:06:47] Even Ohio's Republican governor, Mike DeWine, [2:06:50] has raised concerns about the damage this will cause. [2:06:55] Just last night, a federal judge [2:06:58] blocked this administration's attempt to revoke TPS [2:07:02] for the hundreds of thousands of Haitians [2:07:05] that legally live in this country. [2:07:07] The judge also noted that the administration [2:07:10] was motivated by racial hostility against Haiti. [2:07:15] This was wrong in Minneapolis. [2:07:17] It is wrong in Ohio. [2:07:19] It is wrong in every corner of this nation. [2:07:24] And Congress has an obligation to say, [2:07:28] clearly and unequivocally, that this is wrong. [2:07:35] So, Mr. Stoughton, can you briefly explain [2:07:38] why this administration believes it is appropriate [2:07:41] to publicly exonerate agents and blame victims [2:07:44] before independent investigations are finished? [2:07:46] And is that practice consistent [2:07:48] with the constitutional principles [2:07:50] and basic accountability? [2:07:53] I could not begin to offer a rational explanation [2:07:56] for why the government and the current administration [2:07:59] preemptively and prematurely exonerates officers [2:08:02] prior to any investigation. [2:08:03] There is no professional or democratically appropriate [2:08:07] justification for doing so. [2:08:08] Thank you. [2:08:09] And would you say that practice is consistent [2:08:12] with constitutional principles and basic accountability? [2:08:15] It certainly is not. [2:08:17] And, Mr. Stoughton, does stripping legal status [2:08:20] from law-abiding immigrant families, [2:08:22] make our communities safer, or our borders more secure? [2:08:26] Both legally and empirically, no, it does not. [2:08:31] Thank you. [2:08:33] See, this isn't just about immigration policy, [2:08:37] politics, or party. [2:08:39] It's about people. [2:08:41] It's about defining what kind of country we are. [2:08:46] We can be a nation that enforces the law [2:08:49] without sacrificing human rights. [2:08:52] We can be a nation that protects people [2:08:54] who are committed to their rights, [2:08:54] who are contributing to our communities [2:08:56] and honoring the law. [2:08:58] And we can be a nation that demands accountability [2:09:01] when the use of force goes too far [2:09:04] and when innocent lives are lost. [2:09:07] Because every life deserves dignity, safety, and justice. [2:09:11] And at the end of the day, [2:09:14] this is about this administration's lack of respect [2:09:17] for human life, [2:09:20] lack of respect for the Constitution, [2:09:23] and lack of respect [2:09:25] for the rule of law. [2:09:27] Enforcement without accountability is not justice. [2:09:30] And silence in the face of harm is not leadership. [2:09:35] We owe our constituents and the families [2:09:37] who have suffered better. [2:09:40] Thank you. [2:09:42] Senator Urban. [2:09:44] I want to thank all of the witnesses [2:09:46] who appeared before us today. [2:09:48] My friend, Tony Romanucci. [2:09:51] And I particularly want to call attention [2:09:54] to this Marimar Martinez. [2:09:58] Your name on this side of the table, [2:10:00] is El Milagro. [2:10:03] You are a miracle. [2:10:04] The fact that you are here today [2:10:06] after being shot five times to tell your story. [2:10:11] God had a purpose for you. [2:10:13] And your purpose was served today [2:10:15] by telling us this story. [2:10:17] I'm a ranking member of the Senate Judiciary Committee. [2:10:21] And I want you to know for the record, [2:10:23] Secretary Noem has not appeared before our committee [2:10:26] in over a year. [2:10:28] She's too busy to come and answer [2:10:32] for the mismanagement of this agency [2:10:34] and the damage that's being done, [2:10:36] not only to the people, [2:10:37] the people of America, [2:10:39] but to our reputation in the world [2:10:41] when you consider the police tactics [2:10:43] that are being used. [2:10:45] Mr. Stoughton, I was going to go through [2:10:47] some of the things that Ms. Martinez lived through [2:10:49] and ask you to comment. [2:10:51] I sense from your earlier answers [2:10:53] what you will be saying. [2:10:55] But this much I want to make clear. [2:10:58] Chicago was one of the first victims [2:11:01] of this policy of massive deportation. [2:11:04] I came to the Senate Democratic Caucus Luncheon [2:11:07] and I told my colleagues after it got started, [2:11:10] after I visited Little Village and the neighborhoods [2:11:12] and saw what happened, [2:11:14] be prepared because this show is coming to your town next. [2:11:18] They may leave Minnesota, [2:11:19] and I'm sure people in Minnesota [2:11:20] can't wait for that to happen. [2:11:22] They may leave some other place, [2:11:25] but they're headed to a new place. [2:11:27] You see, they appropriated billions of dollars [2:11:30] for this effort, this mass deportation, [2:11:32] billions of dollars, [2:11:34] so that the force that they have created, [2:11:37] that we've heard described today, [2:11:40] is larger than the United States [2:11:41] Marine Corps, larger than the FBI. [2:11:46] They are prepared to take this show on the road [2:11:49] and to visit it to polling places and schools, [2:11:53] nurseries, Montessori schools all across America. [2:11:57] We have to do something. [2:11:58] It is up to us. [2:12:00] The courts are doing some things. [2:12:02] I wish they would do more. [2:12:03] But we have to do our part. [2:12:05] That's why we've made it clear that this negotiation [2:12:08] to change the standards for ICE is critical for us [2:12:11] to continue funding this agency. [2:12:14] Critical. [2:12:15] Ten days. [2:12:16] The Republicans are arguing, [2:12:17] it's not long enough, we need longer. [2:12:18] No, ten days is plenty of time [2:12:21] to do what needs to be done. [2:12:22] The basics, Mr. Stoughton. [2:12:24] The basics of policing. [2:12:26] All we're asking is that this effort [2:12:29] by ICE and other federal agencies [2:12:31] adhere to the same standards and principles [2:12:34] as policemen and policewomen [2:12:36] across the United States already. [2:12:38] That's not too much to ask. [2:12:40] Thank you, Mr. Chairman. [2:12:43] Thank you, Senator. [2:12:44] Next up is Representative Stansbury. [2:12:49] Thank you, Mr. Chairman. [2:12:50] I just want to start out by saying thank you all [2:12:58] for being here and being brave enough [2:13:00] to share your stories. [2:13:04] I don't know what to say, [2:13:06] but I do have to say that I'm literally shaking [2:13:09] and my heart has been pounding sitting here [2:13:11] listening to your stories. [2:13:13] And particularly, Ms. Martinez, [2:13:18] as you shared your personal story [2:13:20] of sitting outside the jail as you were bleeding out [2:13:22] and having your picture taken. [2:13:25] I don't normally talk about my own personal experience [2:13:29] with the justice system and my family [2:13:33] because it's such a painful experience. [2:13:35] But your story for me really made me think about [2:13:41] an experience that our family had about a decade ago. [2:13:46] And the reason why I want to share it here in this space [2:13:48] is because I think it helps to amplify [2:13:52] and hopefully show that we're listening. [2:13:57] And that is that I had a member of my family [2:14:00] who about 10 years ago, 15 years ago, [2:14:03] was picked up not in a detention for immigration, [2:14:07] but for other reasons, [2:14:09] and was taken to a local county jail [2:14:12] where he had a medical emergency in the jail. [2:14:16] And the agents in the jail not only did not help him [2:14:20] when he had a medical emergency in the jail, [2:14:23] they watched him and laughed as he died. [2:14:30] In the aftermath of his death, [2:14:34] the agents that were involved, [2:14:35] both the local law enforcement and the jail officials, [2:14:39] tried to intimidate members of my family [2:14:41] to try to cover it up. [2:14:43] And at the end of the day, [2:14:45] obviously there was a wrongful death settlement [2:14:48] and Department of Justice was ultimately brought in [2:14:51] to provide oversight over this county jail [2:14:54] because this was not the only incident [2:14:56] in which that had happened. [2:14:57] And I think that goes to the points [2:14:59] that the senators were making, [2:15:01] that at the end of the day, this should not be happening. [2:15:04] This should not happen to anyone in America. [2:15:07] It should not be happening to US citizens. [2:15:09] It should not be happening to immigrants. [2:15:11] It should not be happening to anyone in America. [2:15:14] I don't care who you are or what your identity is [2:15:17] or how your status is under the law in this country. [2:15:21] This should not be happening in the United States. [2:15:23] And there are systems in place to provide a check and balance [2:15:28] to make sure that this does not happen [2:15:30] to people in our country. [2:15:32] And so to hear your stories [2:15:34] and to hear the violence that is being committed [2:15:38] in our communities against our people, [2:15:43] and then to see White House officials, [2:15:45] the president of the United States, [2:15:47] disparaging entire communities, [2:15:49] going after members of Congress, [2:15:51] the vice president telling the American people [2:15:54] that these individuals have total immunity, [2:15:57] to see Kristi Noem go on national television [2:16:01] and lie about you, to let you know [2:16:03] that they're a lie about you, [2:16:06] that they're tampering with evidence, [2:16:08] and then to see that the actual agents [2:16:10] committing these crimes, [2:16:12] because I wanna be clear, these are crimes. [2:16:15] This is not in the line of duty. [2:16:19] You don't shoot, murder, and harm people [2:16:22] in the line of duty. [2:16:25] That is a crime. [2:16:27] That is crime. [2:16:29] And this is not an accident. [2:16:31] I wanna be clear about that. [2:16:33] There's a lot of discussion going around in these halls [2:16:34] about this crime, particular and very specific crime. [2:16:35] It's a crime. It's not an accident. [2:16:37] It's not a crime. It's not an accident. [2:16:38] They need better training, that this is just a few isolated incidents. [2:16:44] Well, let's be clear about what's going on here for the American people. [2:16:48] Over the last year, over 37 individuals have died in immigrant detention. [2:16:57] Multiple people have been murdered and gunned down in the street. [2:17:03] We have three individuals in front of us here today who, in front of the entire world, their lives were shattered. [2:17:11] And this was not an accident or a lack of training. [2:17:15] This is the policy of the United States government, and it is being paid for by your tax dollars. [2:17:22] Because literally, this chamber passed $85 billion in funding to allow this to happen [2:17:33] and to arm these agents with those night vision, with those guns, [2:17:37] and then to unleash them under a policy that is so based in cruelty [2:17:42] so based in a lack of humanity, so based in a lack of basic respect for human dignity, [2:17:50] the Constitution due process, that they would allow people to die in the streets [2:17:56] and then go lie to our faces about it. [2:17:59] So I don't know what to say about what comes next, [2:18:06] but I do want to just say to Mr. Granger, both of the brothers who came here to share about your sister today, [2:18:14] and the story, [2:18:16] the story of her light, her sunlight, being like a dandelion. [2:18:20] I mean, this isn't just about sunlight. [2:18:23] We're here to bear witness, we're here to tell the truth. [2:18:26] But I'm sorry, we need to defund and dismantle this agency immediately. [2:18:31] And a bill just passed a few moments ago before we walked into this hearing room to give another two weeks to think about a deal. [2:18:39] No, it's time to defund this. [2:18:41] This has to end. [2:18:48] I think I'll just close out by saying, because I really don't know what else to say, [2:18:54] that there's, you know, a saying, Nelson Mandela said that both the oppressed and the oppressor are robbed of their humanity. [2:19:07] And what this administration is doing right now is robbing America of our humanity, and it has to stop. [2:19:15] Senator Warren, if you are ready, if not, we can give you a few minutes. [2:19:20] I'm always ready. [2:19:22] That's what I thought. [2:19:24] So I really do want to start by saying thank you very much. [2:19:27] Thank you. [2:19:28] Thank you. [2:19:29] Thank you very, very much to Congressman Garcia, to Senator Blumenthal for holding this important forum. [2:19:36] And thank all of you for being here. [2:19:39] You've already said it many times over, ICE is terrorizing our communities. [2:19:46] They have used military-style riot gear against peaceful demonstrators. [2:19:52] They've seized school kids. [2:19:55] They've gassed a baby. [2:19:58] They've gunned down American citizens on our streets. [2:20:02] And meanwhile, Vice President Vance is telling agents that they have, and I want to quote him, [2:20:10] absolute immunity from any repercussions. [2:20:15] And Trump and Republicans are now trying to shovel billions of additional dollars into the ICE funds [2:20:24] so that they can continue to run amok. [2:20:27] With no real constraints over their behavior. [2:20:31] It is not a surprise that ICE agents seem to think that they are above the law [2:20:38] because Donald Trump, J.D. Vance, and the Republicans are treating them like they are above the law. [2:20:46] It is the responsibility of the United States Congress to make clear that, no, the law applies to everyone, [2:20:55] and that includes ICE agents in America. [2:20:58] So I appreciate your being here. [2:21:00] Let me just ask a couple of questions. [2:21:02] Ms. Martinez, you've told us that last October you were driving in your car [2:21:07] when a Border Patrol agent rammed the back of your vehicle, pointed an assault rifle at you, [2:21:13] and opened fire, shooting you five times. [2:21:17] You weren't ever found guilty of any wrongdoing. [2:21:22] And yet you were shot five times. [2:21:24] You were shot five times by Border Patrol. [2:21:28] So my question is, do you know if anyone will ever be held accountable for this? [2:21:33] I don't even know, but I hope soon. [2:21:41] Do you know what happened after you were shot? [2:21:44] What happened to the agents who shot you? [2:21:50] I'm not too sure what happened to him, honestly. [2:21:53] I just know that he drove his vehicle back to Maine. [2:21:58] That's all I know. [2:22:01] But I don't know if he's working or, honestly, I don't know. [2:22:05] So as I understand it, this agent left town, [2:22:11] making it even harder for an investigation to go forward. [2:22:14] And I take it you at least have not been apprised of any investigation [2:22:19] that's ongoing against this agent who shot you at point-blank range? [2:22:23] Correct. [2:22:24] Yeah. [2:22:26] So we just need to be clear here. [2:22:29] Immigration agents shoot our neighbors at point-blank range with no justification. [2:22:37] That's the big part. [2:22:38] And no accountability afterwards. [2:22:41] And Mr. – Ms. Martinez and Mr. Romanucci, did I get that right? [2:22:48] Good. [2:22:49] Yes. [2:22:50] You're an attorney. [2:22:51] You represent the family of Renee Good. [2:22:53] We appreciate your being here today. [2:22:55] Thank you. [2:22:56] We've all seen the videos. [2:22:58] Renee was coming back from dropping off her kids at school. [2:23:02] She has stuffed animals in her glove compartment when an ICE agent shot and killed her. [2:23:08] We've got a serious issue with accountability for the agents involved. [2:23:11] And I know you've testified to issues with seeking relief for plaintiffs. [2:23:17] On top of that, it seems that there haven't been any consequences for the agency itself [2:23:23] to prevent these abuses from repeating themselves in the future. [2:23:29] ICE is still sitting on this massive slush fund that Republicans put together last year [2:23:35] as part of Donald Trump's one big beautiful law. [2:23:37] It's one big beautiful bill. [2:23:39] An amount that is larger than most countries' military budgets. [2:23:43] So, let me ask you. [2:23:45] Has even a penny of ICE's slush funding been frozen in response to the killing of Renee Good? [2:23:55] Senator Warren, I am not aware of any money being frozen as a result of what is happening in Minneapolis [2:24:02] or any of the other cities. [2:24:04] But what I can tell you is this. [2:24:06] There will never, ever be accountability until we have real investigations that become public. [2:24:13] Could you ever imagine the disaster that happened just miles from here? [2:24:18] American Airlines crashing, a helicopter crashing into American Airlines [2:24:23] and the NTSB saying we're not going to investigate or ever release any public findings? [2:24:28] We would all be sitting here with our jaws wide open. [2:24:33] There needs to be investigation. [2:24:35] And I would support any pinch point that would not or that would increase accountability for ICE and CBP. [2:24:43] Well, you and I are on the same page here. [2:24:45] And I so much appreciate, and I'm sorry for going over here, but I so much appreciate all of you being here today. [2:24:51] There are a lot of new rules we need to put in place. [2:24:54] You know, the police in Massachusetts do not wear masks. [2:24:58] If there's an officer-involved shooting, there's an independent investigation. [2:25:03] There are a lot of things. [2:25:04] There are a lot of things we could put in place. [2:25:06] But a key has to be accountability. [2:25:10] If you shoot people, if you gas children, if you seize little people out of elementary schools, [2:25:18] if you break the law, part of what our whole system relies on is there's ultimately some accountability. [2:25:26] We understand that we get things wrong. [2:25:28] But the way we get things better is we demand accountability of ourselves [2:25:34] and of those who broke the law. [2:25:37] And for me, that's what this hearing is about. [2:25:40] And that's what this moment is about. [2:25:42] It is Congress's responsibility to step up and say we are going to put new rules in place for ICE. [2:25:49] But most of all, we're going to demand accountability for those who break the law. [2:25:53] Thank you. [2:25:54] Thank you all for being here. [2:25:55] Thank you, Mr. Chairman. [2:25:56] And thank you. [2:25:57] Thank you, Senator. [2:25:58] Next up is Representative Lee. [2:26:00] Thank you, Mr. Ranking Member, to both of our ranking members, [2:26:04] for holding this meeting. [2:26:05] And I just first want to associate myself with all of my colleagues [2:26:09] who have acknowledged that you can't reform authoritarianism [2:26:12] and that we can't unmask fascism and cruelty and oppression [2:26:17] and that the call now is to abolish this agency. [2:26:23] ICE and DHS agents are terrorizing communities. [2:26:28] They're violating constitutional rights. [2:26:31] They're harming, even killing people. [2:26:33] They're calling. [2:26:34] So calling for body cameras. [2:26:35] Calling for body cameras and codes of conduct, quite frankly, isn't enough. [2:26:40] When the agency doesn't care about the current laws or the rules that they're already supposed to follow. [2:26:46] The problem is that these immigration enforcement agents are operating exactly how they were meant to operate. [2:26:53] ICE is uniquely and deeply an American creation. [2:26:57] A lot of my colleagues have called ICE a Gestapo, which makes them seem foreign and new. [2:27:04] It allows people to say that what we're experiencing right now is in some way unprecedented. [2:27:09] But this isn't a new phenomenon. [2:27:11] If you just look back throughout our own nation's history, [2:27:14] look back to the slave patrols or to racial segregation enforcement, [2:27:17] if we look at the decades of run-of-the-mill racism and authoritarianism, [2:27:21] what we're seeing is America doing American things. [2:27:25] The so-called Kavanaugh stops from what the Supreme Court opened the doors to [2:27:30] are stops based on racial profiles or just this era's stops. [2:27:34] Stop and frisk. [2:27:35] For years, black and brown folks have been sounding the alarm [2:27:40] about racial bias and discrimination in law enforcement. [2:27:43] Yet any tiny steps forward have been erased to support tough-on-crime policies. [2:27:49] The lessons learned in the wake of George Floyd and Breonna Taylor and Ahmaud Arbery [2:27:53] have been completely abandoned. [2:27:55] And ICE has been able to take advantage of that and run with it. [2:27:59] ICE and DHS are inflicting generational trauma. [2:28:02] Just listening to our witnesses today, [2:28:04] and what they've been through at the hands of our government, [2:28:08] should be difficult for anybody who claims to love this country to hear. [2:28:12] Anybody. [2:28:13] Mr. Escombe spoke today about going out and running errands with his future in-laws [2:28:19] when immigration agents stopped their car. [2:28:21] Ms. Hermann told us she was going to a doctor's appointment [2:28:25] when ICE ripped her from her vehicle as she yelled that she had a disability. [2:28:28] Ms. Martinez explained how immigration officers rammed her car [2:28:32] and then shot her and then tried to blame her. [2:28:35] And we heard from Mr. Romanucci today [2:28:38] because we can't hear from Renee Good because ICE killed her. [2:28:43] Mr. Escombe, after the sketchy traffic stop [2:28:45] and after they came to your home right after these immigration officers [2:28:49] actually terrorized your family a third time almost two weeks later [2:28:52] when they broke your front door down, correct? [2:28:54] That is correct. [2:28:55] What went through your head as all of this went down at about 4 in the morning? [2:29:05] Just fear. [2:29:08] And your fiancée, she was pregnant at the time? [2:29:10] Yes, she was. [2:29:12] Did they make any effort to make sure that she stayed safe and calm? [2:29:18] Not at all. [2:29:21] They just kept pointing the lasers at her and the rest of us. [2:29:24] How, if you don't, and it's okay if you can't right now answer, [2:29:30] how has your family coped in the aftermath of this? [2:29:33] Just staying strong together and having faith [2:29:38] and slowly moving forward as best as we can. [2:29:41] I just, I want to thank you and all of our witnesses for coming in today [2:29:48] and for speaking your truth. [2:29:50] This cannot be overstated that in these times [2:29:55] it is actually dangerous to speak out against this administration. [2:29:59] It's dangerous to speak out against this agency that we know [2:30:02] has the ability to target people. [2:30:04] When our federal government is willing to lie and to slander anyone [2:30:08] who speaks out against Trump or his minions or their plans, [2:30:11] it is brave and it's honorable for you to do this and be here. [2:30:15] This country needs to really reflect on how we got here. [2:30:18] We have to look back and learn. [2:30:19] Rather than sanitizing our history and forget our flaws. [2:30:23] We can't just stop at abolishing ICE because that's no longer enough. [2:30:26] We need to prosecute the wrongdoings and hold these agents and leaders [2:30:30] and anyone who had anything to do with that accountable. [2:30:32] I thank you for your time and I yield back. [2:30:34] Thank you. [2:30:36] Just a reminder about the four-minute rule. [2:30:39] Senator Schiff. [2:30:40] Thank you, Chairman, for organizing this hearing. [2:30:46] I had a chance to hear some of your testimony, your opening statements, [2:30:50] which were incredibly powerful. [2:30:52] And I am grateful that you're here and willing to share your experiences [2:30:57] with all of us. [2:30:58] I want to follow up, Mr. Rascone, and ask you more about your experience. [2:31:03] One of my Minnesota colleagues sent a clip recently of a woman driving, [2:31:09] filming an ICE vehicle from her car. [2:31:13] The ICE vehicle stopped. [2:31:15] Agents got out, guns drawn, pointing three ICE agents, [2:31:18] pointing guns at her through the windshield. [2:31:22] She could have easily been killed. [2:31:24] And if you're willing to share a little more about your experience, [2:31:30] what was that like, being in a vehicle, [2:31:34] encountering that kind of threat of and use of force by agents? [2:31:39] What is that like? [2:31:40] What should people understand about what goes through your mind at a time like that? [2:31:47] It felt like we were about to be attacked for no apparent reason. [2:31:50] It seemed like nobody, no law enforcement that was legit, [2:31:57] like masked individuals with crazy head power. [2:32:05] Once they had broken the windows and my father-in-law bravely drove away [2:32:10] and the shots fired into the vehicle, [2:32:13] I just thought that one of us would have been killed. [2:32:17] But thankfully we're all okay. [2:32:22] And I'm sorry to the victims that didn't survive. [2:32:26] And what's it like when you drive now? [2:32:32] What are the aftereffects of experiencing [2:32:35] that now when you're out in the community? [2:32:38] What impact has it had on you and your family? [2:32:41] I feel like my head is on the swivel, [2:32:45] always looking everywhere to make sure that nobody's going to attack us [2:32:49] without us being aware of it or anybody else in our community. [2:32:53] I know they made accusations against your family. [2:32:57] Did they ever bring charges? [2:32:59] Did they drop charges? [2:33:00] What was the status of that? [2:33:03] They claimed that we had ran them over [2:33:05] and the judicial judge had watched the video and evidence, [2:33:08] and there was no evidence that we did anything to them, [2:33:11] and so they dropped the charges. [2:33:13] And how long was it after you were arrested [2:33:16] before they dropped the charges? [2:33:18] My father-in-law was arrested two weeks after the first incident. [2:33:24] And how soon thereafter were the charges dropped? [2:33:28] Do you remember? [2:33:29] I would say about a week or two later, [2:33:34] maybe two to three weeks later. [2:33:36] Anyone ever apologize to you for what's happened to your family? [2:33:41] Just our loved ones, not the people who were the cause of it. [2:33:48] And Ms. Rahman, how about you? [2:33:52] Anyone ever express any kind of remorse [2:33:56] for slamming you to the ground, [2:33:59] for not getting medical treatment for you, [2:34:02] for what you had to endure? [2:34:04] Nope. [2:34:06] Senator Padilla and I were recently [2:34:11] at one of the large detention facilities in California, [2:34:14] and we asked about medical treatment there, [2:34:17] and people who were diabetic [2:34:19] weren't getting the medicine they needed. [2:34:22] You didn't get any kind of medical assistance. [2:34:26] How long were you in custody? [2:34:31] I have not been provided information about that from DHS. [2:34:36] I know that the time stamp of my arrival at the emergency room [2:34:42] was after 1 o'clock. [2:34:44] I know that I was on a trip to the doctor's just after 9.35. [2:34:50] And I know that we asked for medical assistance at 11 a.m. [2:34:53] So an hour and 47 minutes later, [2:34:57] I was brought into the ER unconscious. [2:35:00] And Ms. Martinez, [2:35:07] I have a question. [2:35:08] Has anyone ever apologized [2:35:10] for how your family was treated, [2:35:12] how you were treated? [2:35:14] What was the question? [2:35:15] Has anyone ever apologized to you [2:35:17] for how you were treated? [2:35:18] Nope, nobody. [2:35:19] To this day, no apology. [2:35:21] And what is a... [2:35:24] May I ask one last question, Mr. Chairman? [2:35:26] What is the impact on... [2:35:30] You testified earlier about how this has impacted [2:35:33] your view of all law enforcement, [2:35:35] which you had venerated before now [2:35:37] because you thought they were there to protect the community. [2:35:39] Has there been a spillover effect? [2:35:41] How much trust do you think people in your neighborhood [2:35:44] have for law enforcement? [2:35:46] Or are people able to separate out ICE [2:35:50] from the local police department or others? [2:35:52] It's scary because, you know, [2:35:54] when I was at the hospital, [2:35:56] there was, like, FBI agents and ICE agents. [2:35:58] And I didn't know... [2:35:59] I was scared to even talk to both of them [2:36:01] because I was like, [2:36:02] I don't know if they're working together. [2:36:04] So it's scary, right? [2:36:06] Like, people don't even know who to trust no more. [2:36:08] They don't know if they should work together. [2:36:10] They don't know if they should talk to police no more. [2:36:13] So it's really concerning what's happening. [2:36:15] And I don't want that to happen. [2:36:17] But it's the reality what's happening. [2:36:20] Thank you. [2:36:21] Thank you, Mr. Chairman. [2:36:22] Thank you. [2:36:26] Thank you, Senator. [2:36:27] Next up is Representative Kassar. [2:36:30] Americans know that ICE agents shot Renee Good. [2:36:35] But you should know what happened next. [2:36:38] The ICE agents did not render first aid. [2:36:43] They left Renee to bleed. [2:36:46] The doctor approached the scene, [2:36:49] and he wanted to help. [2:36:50] The doctor shouted, [2:36:53] stop the bleeding. [2:36:54] Instead, for three minutes and 26 seconds, [2:36:59] ICE agents held back that doctor [2:37:02] that might have been able to save Renee. [2:37:05] So for the next three minutes and 26 seconds, [2:37:10] I want each of us to imagine someone we know and love. [2:37:15] And imagine that they are shot, bleeding, [2:37:19] suffering, and dying. [2:37:21] And silently think about them being denied help [2:37:25] for the next three minutes and 26 seconds. [2:37:28] Stop the bleeding, the doctor shouted. [2:40:29] And for three minutes and 26 seconds, ICE did not. [2:40:34] Renee still had some pulse when the firefighters arrived, [2:40:37] but no breathing. [2:40:40] CPR didn't start till 10 minutes after she was shot. [2:40:44] It was too late, but it's not too late to prevent this [2:40:48] from happening to more people in our country. [2:40:52] Thank you. [2:40:53] Senator Hickenmover. [2:40:57] Thank you for that, [2:40:58] that almost unbearable amount of time. [2:41:01] Thank all of you for coming. [2:41:05] I am fully aware of what it takes to discuss [2:41:11] and tell again and again when you've gone through trauma. [2:41:16] And I appreciate it because what you're doing [2:41:19] is helping the rest of the country to become aware [2:41:23] of really what's happened. [2:41:25] I want to talk a little bit about masks. [2:41:29] I think transparency and accountability are fundamental [2:41:32] to every form of law enforcement. [2:41:35] And yet we've witnessed more and more masked agents [2:41:39] operating in unmarked vehicles, [2:41:42] creating fear and confusion in people all over this country. [2:41:48] I'll read this. [2:41:50] Research shows that anonymity can change behavior [2:41:54] when individuals conceal their identities, [2:41:56] they may feel less accountable, [2:41:58] be more willing to engage in conduct [2:42:00] they would not otherwise consider. [2:42:04] I also know that crooks, criminals, [2:42:08] have been putting masks on to impersonate federal agents [2:42:13] and then commit crimes. [2:42:15] Crooks generally put masks on. [2:42:18] I guess the question, Mr. Stoughton, [2:42:20] I'd ask this of you. [2:42:23] How does allowing ICE officers to wear masks, [2:42:25] how does that affect law enforcement [2:42:27] to distinguish between legitimate operations [2:42:29] and group of armed impersonators? [2:42:32] And what are the consequences of this policy [2:42:34] in terms of public trust? [2:42:36] What is the core of how we keep our communities safe? [2:42:41] Anonymizing law enforcement [2:42:43] dramatically reduces public trust. [2:42:45] When law enforcement agents act [2:42:47] at the local, state, or federal level, [2:42:49] they act with public authority. [2:42:51] That is, they are policing in my name [2:42:53] and they are policing in your name. [2:42:55] And that should mean that we as the public [2:42:58] have the right to know [2:43:00] who is doing what in our name. [2:43:04] When we don't have that, [2:43:06] it undermines accountability, [2:43:08] it dramatically hurts public trust, [2:43:10] it also creates tremendous confusion [2:43:12] for the individuals who are interacting [2:43:14] with anonymous agents [2:43:16] who may not know who they are interacting with. [2:43:19] There are now at least a dozen or more stories [2:43:23] of individuals who, upon being confronted with ICE [2:43:26] or Customs and Border Protection agents, [2:43:29] called the police because they did not know [2:43:32] who they were being confronted with. [2:43:35] These masked, armed individuals [2:43:37] who are aggressively approaching them. [2:43:39] There is nothing to clearly distinguish [2:43:43] that kind of enforcement operation [2:43:46] from a criminal kidnapping or carjacking [2:43:49] without clear identification. [2:43:52] Exactly my point. [2:43:54] I would just go down, [2:43:56] and I was here for all three of your, [2:43:58] when you gave your testimonies, [2:43:59] and again, I can't, words can't express [2:44:03] how much I appreciate, [2:44:05] I think all of us appreciate that. [2:44:07] Mr. Rascón, [2:44:08] when exactly did the federal agents, [2:44:10] how did they identify themselves? [2:44:12] At what point? [2:44:14] After repeated requests, [2:44:15] they did not identify themselves. [2:44:18] And Ms. Rahman, same question, [2:44:20] at what point exactly did they, [2:44:22] and how did they identify themselves? [2:44:24] They did not identify themselves. [2:44:30] I even asked them their names [2:44:32] to have a conversation in the car, [2:44:35] and they were silent. [2:44:37] And Representative Lee has already talked to us [2:44:39] about the history in America of masked men [2:44:42] taking it upon themselves [2:44:44] to do things to people of color, [2:44:46] and I don't even come from a family [2:44:48] where that has happened for generations [2:44:50] by masked men. [2:44:56] Thank you. [2:44:57] And Ms. Martinez, [2:44:58] I can't ask you that question [2:44:59] because you never even got a chance. [2:45:02] Anyway, I've got more questions, [2:45:05] but I appreciate what you've all done to be here, [2:45:09] and I think it is more powerful [2:45:11] than you can possibly imagine. [2:45:13] So again, thank you each. [2:45:14] Thank you all. [2:45:15] I yield back to the chair. [2:45:16] Thank you, Senator. [2:45:19] I'd like to now yield to Mr. Rascón, [2:45:21] and Representative Crockett. [2:45:23] Thank you so much, Mr. Rancor. [2:45:26] I am so frustrated. [2:45:31] It is so hard to sit in allegedly power positions [2:45:38] yet see this happening in my country every single day. [2:45:43] We are arguably the most powerful people, [2:45:47] not just in this country but in the world, [2:45:50] yet some of our colleagues have decided [2:45:52] that they wanted to abdicate their oaths and their duties, [2:45:55] and they have decided that instead of following [2:45:57] the law or the Constitution, [2:46:00] they want to follow a single man. [2:46:02] There are those that say that our democracy [2:46:04] hangs in the balance. [2:46:06] With every passing day, [2:46:08] I feel as if we are slipping further and further [2:46:11] into a full-on dictatorship. [2:46:14] When we live in a country [2:46:17] where a journalist by the name of Don Lemon [2:46:20] can be arrested [2:46:21] or Georgia Fort can be arrested, [2:46:24] when we live in a country where [2:46:26] a five-year-old little boy, [2:46:28] Liam Ramos, [2:46:29] can be thrown in what looked like a penitentiary, [2:46:32] I did go and see him at Dilley facility, [2:46:35] and the reality is that Liam's picture went viral. [2:46:39] But there are so many children that are rotting away [2:46:43] in that facility, [2:46:44] and it seems like nobody cares. [2:46:47] When we see what happened to Alex and Renee [2:46:52] and my colleagues are silent [2:46:54] or they're in defense of what took place, [2:46:57] I start to wonder what is our purpose. [2:47:00] If we are sitting here and we are seeing [2:47:03] our Constitution desecrated, [2:47:05] at every single turn, [2:47:07] and then when we have an opportunity [2:47:09] in the minority as Democrats [2:47:11] to say, [2:47:13] we are going to stop this [2:47:15] because it's not working out very well [2:47:17] for the Republicans. [2:47:18] In my state of Texas, [2:47:19] they just flipped a seat [2:47:20] where it swung 30 points. [2:47:22] It's not working well for the Republicans [2:47:24] when the Republican governor in Texas decides to say, [2:47:28] well, maybe we're a little off track. [2:47:30] It's not working well for the Republicans [2:47:32] when Donald Trump steps in and says, [2:47:34] well, let me go ahead [2:47:35] and give you a sacrificial lamb [2:47:37] by the name of Bovino. [2:47:38] It's not working well for them. [2:47:41] So we are in the best position that we could be in, [2:47:43] yet, and still, [2:47:45] that package passed [2:47:46] and we gave a two-week pass [2:47:48] for them to continue to negotiate. [2:47:50] My question is, [2:47:52] what are we negotiating for? [2:47:54] What is it that we're trying to get? [2:47:55] Because we know that they already will ignore the law. [2:47:58] The First, the Fourth, the Fifth, [2:48:02] and the Fourteenth Amendments [2:48:03] have all been thrown out of the window [2:48:05] by this administration. [2:48:06] So, Mr. Stoughton, [2:48:09] DHS's internal use of force policies [2:48:12] are supposed to be guided by constitutional protections [2:48:15] under the Fourth Amendment. [2:48:16] Do you think that we're seeing that? [2:48:18] The policies on paper are fairly good. [2:48:23] I do not see those being translated into practice. [2:48:26] In fact, we know that the opinion [2:48:28] that was written [2:48:30] by the judge that ordered the release [2:48:32] of Liam and his father, [2:48:34] it says this case has its genesis [2:48:38] in the ill-conceived and incompetently implemented [2:48:42] government pursuit [2:48:44] of daily deportation quotas, [2:48:46] apparently even if it requires traumatizing children. [2:48:49] This court and others [2:48:51] regularly send undocumented people to prison [2:48:54] and orders them deported, [2:48:56] but do so by proper legal procedures. [2:48:59] A parent also in the government's ignorance [2:49:02] of an American historical document called [2:49:05] the Declaration of Independence, [2:49:07] 33-year-old Thomas Jefferson [2:49:10] enumerated grievances, [2:49:12] against a would-be authoritarian king [2:49:16] over our nascent nation. [2:49:20] Among others were, [2:49:23] he has sent hither swarms of officers [2:49:26] to harass our people. [2:49:28] He has excited domestic insurrection amongst us [2:49:32] for quartering large bodies of armed troops amongst us. [2:49:38] He has kept amongst us [2:49:40] in times of peace standing armies [2:49:43] without the consent of our legislature. [2:49:46] We, the people, [2:49:47] are hearing echoes of that history. [2:49:50] And then there is this pesky inconvenience [2:49:53] called the Fourth Amendment. [2:49:55] Right now, I must say that the only branch [2:49:58] that has not completely failed us is the judiciary. [2:50:00] It is time for us to empower the people, [2:50:03] people like you, [2:50:04] that have been traumatized by our government. [2:50:07] We need to make sure that your lawyers can stand up [2:50:10] and they can get money, [2:50:11] they can go and get some type [2:50:13] of justice. [2:50:14] Because if our president can sue [2:50:16] our own federal government for $10 billion, [2:50:19] then something tells me [2:50:22] that maybe we need to loosen the reins [2:50:24] around some of the protections [2:50:26] that these officers have [2:50:28] so that y'all can go and get something. [2:50:30] And maybe, just maybe, [2:50:31] they will decide that it's not worth it [2:50:33] to go out and traumatize its citizens. [2:50:35] Thank you so much, and I will yield. [2:50:37] Senator Hirono. [2:50:38] Thank you, Mr. Chairman, [2:50:41] and also Representative Garcia [2:50:44] for convening all of us. [2:50:45] Here and I was watching the proceedings [2:50:48] on C-SPAN, [2:50:49] so I very much thank our witnesses [2:50:52] for sharing your harrowing experiences. [2:50:55] What we are dealing with, [2:50:57] as far as I'm concerned, [2:50:58] is a lawless regime [2:51:00] with agencies that behave in lawless ways. [2:51:03] And we all should be motivated [2:51:05] by the fierce urgency of now [2:51:08] to do something about this lawlessness. [2:51:11] There have been over 500 lawsuits filed [2:51:13] against this administration. [2:51:15] And the administration's actions [2:51:17] to prevent the continuing lawlessness. [2:51:19] And so this, [2:51:21] the testimony you provided [2:51:24] shows us how critical it is [2:51:27] for us to, [2:51:32] it's really hard to describe [2:51:34] how we all felt watching what happened [2:51:36] to so many of you. [2:51:38] But to really put some parameters, [2:51:42] some guardrails around the behavior [2:51:45] of ICE and Border Patrol, [2:51:47] some common sense kinds of requirements [2:51:50] that has to do with not wearing masks, [2:51:53] having body cameras. [2:51:54] There are some common sense kinds [2:51:57] of behaviors that law enforcement officials [2:52:00] all across our country abide by, [2:52:02] but apparently not ICE. [2:52:04] And so in this, [2:52:06] what I would call the fierce urgency of now, [2:52:09] we need to put in some immediate parameters [2:52:12] to how ICE is operating [2:52:14] so that they cannot drag people [2:52:17] out of cars. [2:52:18] They cannot smash car windows. [2:52:20] They cannot beat people up. [2:52:24] And yes, of course, [2:52:26] they cannot murder people [2:52:27] in front of our very eyes. [2:52:29] And so I, [2:52:30] my hope and expectation [2:52:32] is that the next two weeks, [2:52:33] that there will be these kinds of parameters [2:52:37] and guardrails put around ICE behavior. [2:52:42] And at the same time, [2:52:43] we need to look at some longer term reforms [2:52:47] such as what's happening [2:52:48] in our detention facilities, [2:52:50] such as enabling people [2:52:52] to sue federal agents, [2:52:54] which they cannot for their lawless behavior. [2:52:56] I do have one question for Professor Stoughton. [2:53:01] When you have a senior aide [2:53:05] to the president say to ICE agents [2:53:09] where he says, [2:53:10] and I'm talking about Stephen Miller, [2:53:12] to quote, [2:53:13] to all ICE officers, [2:53:14] you have federal immunity [2:53:16] in the conduct of your duties. [2:53:18] And anybody who lays a hand on you [2:53:21] or tries to stop or obstruct you [2:53:25] and is committing a felony, [2:53:28] end quote. [2:53:29] Now, this is a senior person [2:53:31] to President Trump. [2:53:34] And this sentiment was agreed to [2:53:36] by the vice president. [2:53:39] Professor, [2:53:40] when you say things like that, [2:53:42] what kind of environment, [2:53:43] law enforcement environment [2:53:45] does it create for ICE [2:53:47] and border patrol agents? [2:53:48] It provides every reason [2:53:53] for them to believe, [2:53:54] as Mr. Romanici put it, [2:53:56] that they will be able to act [2:53:57] with impunity, [2:53:58] that there is no meaningful oversight, [2:54:00] that any attempt [2:54:03] or any lip service [2:54:06] paid to accountability [2:54:07] is purely performative. [2:54:09] It creates an extremely dangerous precedent [2:54:12] and risks undermining [2:54:14] professional culture and cohesion. [2:54:16] I would say that probably [2:54:19] all our witnesses agree [2:54:20] that this kind of [2:54:22] lawless environment [2:54:23] was created by [2:54:24] the very kind of statements [2:54:25] made by senior officials [2:54:27] in this regime. [2:54:28] Thank you. [2:54:29] Thank you, Senator. [2:54:32] Moving on to our next member, [2:54:34] and just as a reminder [2:54:35] to the four-minute rule, [2:54:36] please, if possible, [2:54:37] Representative Randall. [2:54:38] Thank you so much, [2:54:42] Ranking Member Garcia [2:54:43] and Ranking Member Blumenthal, [2:54:45] for holding this important hearing [2:54:47] on the deadly use of violence [2:54:49] being inflicted across the country [2:54:51] under the pretext [2:54:52] of immigration enforcement. [2:54:54] I also wanted to say [2:54:56] that I want to join [2:54:57] all of the witnesses, [2:54:58] I want to join my colleagues [2:54:59] in thanking all of the witnesses [2:55:00] for joining us. [2:55:03] Many of you, [2:55:04] as we have heard today, [2:55:05] have experienced [2:55:06] ISIS violence and brutality firsthand, [2:55:09] and I'm grateful for your courage [2:55:11] in testifying today, [2:55:13] for reliving your trauma, [2:55:15] for the benefit of others [2:55:16] to shed light on these abuses. [2:55:19] I hope my Republican colleagues, [2:55:21] who, as others have pointed out, [2:55:23] are not here today, [2:55:24] also take the time [2:55:25] to read your stories [2:55:26] and hear about your experiences, [2:55:27] because what is happening [2:55:29] across our country [2:55:30] is simply indefensible, [2:55:33] and it shouldn't be a partisan issue. [2:55:35] In fact, it isn't a partisan issue [2:55:37] in our communities. [2:55:38] Recent polling shows [2:55:39] that ICE is underwater. [2:55:41] 58% of Americans [2:55:43] have an unfavorable view [2:55:44] of the agency. [2:55:45] That's a 19-point increase [2:55:47] since Trump took office. [2:55:49] 54% of independents [2:55:50] and even 21% of Republicans [2:55:53] nationwide support [2:55:54] impeaching Secretary of State [2:55:56] Secretary Noem. [2:55:59] What has become incredibly clear [2:56:01] to me, my neighbors, [2:56:03] and to a broad majority [2:56:04] of our fellow Americans [2:56:05] is that we need [2:56:06] a fundamental reimagining [2:56:08] of what a just and humane [2:56:10] immigration system [2:56:11] should look like. [2:56:12] Shooting people in the streets, [2:56:14] tear gassing [2:56:15] and pepper spraying protesters, [2:56:17] none of this is an accident, [2:56:19] and it's not happening [2:56:21] in a vacuum. [2:56:22] The Trump administration [2:56:23] is recruiting [2:56:24] unqualified individuals, [2:56:25] giving less training [2:56:26] to those who are [2:56:27] most enthusiastic [2:56:29] about joining this fascist [2:56:31] and I'm using air quotes here, [2:56:32] police force, [2:56:34] and has even proposed [2:56:35] giving them bonuses [2:56:36] based on how many people [2:56:38] they round up each day. [2:56:39] They're pouring $100 million [2:56:43] into, again, air quotes, [2:56:45] wartime recruitment strategy. [2:56:47] Who exactly are we at war with? [2:56:50] The five-year-olds [2:56:51] who are being kidnapped [2:56:52] from their parents? [2:56:53] Folks on their way [2:56:54] to the doctor? [2:56:57] Individuals expressing [2:56:58] their First Amendment right [2:57:00] to free speech and protest? [2:57:04] In my six visits [2:57:05] to the Northwest Detention Center [2:57:06] in my district, [2:57:07] I've seen a shocking lack [2:57:08] of medical care [2:57:10] and detained individuals [2:57:11] being subject [2:57:12] to inhumane conditions. [2:57:14] As you have testified, [2:57:16] Ms. Rabban, [2:57:17] no timely access to medication, [2:57:19] and in our community, [2:57:20] no private conversations [2:57:21] with doctors [2:57:22] when they are taken [2:57:23] out of detention [2:57:24] for specialty [2:57:25] or serious medical care, [2:57:26] always with an ICE or GO agent [2:57:28] in the room with them, [2:57:29] despite of HIPAA protections [2:57:32] that are offered to all of us, [2:57:34] including incarcerated individuals [2:57:36] on felony charges [2:57:37] in Washington state. [2:57:38] Detainees not even provided [2:57:41] enough clean underwear [2:57:42] to wear every day. [2:57:43] First, the administration [2:57:45] took away health care [2:57:46] for millions of Americans [2:57:47] through H.R.1 [2:57:49] and through letting [2:57:50] the ACA tax credits expire. [2:57:51] Then they started shooting [2:57:52] nurses in the street [2:57:53] and physically obstructing [2:57:55] and assaulting citizens [2:57:56] who are simply trying [2:57:57] to get to doctor's appointments. [2:57:59] It turns out wartime [2:58:00] is accurate, [2:58:02] and this fascist regime [2:58:03] is engaged in a full-on assault [2:58:06] on everyone's right to health care [2:58:09] to live and survive [2:58:11] in this country. [2:58:12] Ms. Rabban, [2:58:13] what you were subjected to [2:58:14] is appalling. [2:58:15] I understand, [2:58:17] as you have told us, [2:58:18] you are trying to get [2:58:19] to a routine doctor's appointment [2:58:20] when immigration agents [2:58:21] smashed your windows, [2:58:23] dragged you out of your car, [2:58:25] and detained you. [2:58:26] Is that correct? [2:58:29] That is correct. [2:58:31] My 39th appointment [2:58:32] at that facility. [2:58:33] You told them [2:58:34] you needed medical care [2:58:35] and that you have a disability. [2:58:37] Correct? [2:58:38] Many times. [2:58:39] You've spoken out [2:58:41] about the dehumanizing practices [2:58:43] you were subjected to [2:58:44] after you were detained. [2:58:46] Can you share again [2:58:47] what their response was [2:58:48] when you told them [2:58:49] about your disability [2:58:50] and that you needed medical care? [2:58:52] First they said, [2:58:53] too late. [2:58:54] Then they just laughed. [2:58:56] Then silence. [2:58:59] I'm particularly concerned [2:59:01] by the statement you shared [2:59:02] that two local officials [2:59:04] said they didn't want [2:59:05] to step on ICE's toes [2:59:06] while you were trying [2:59:07] to get medical care. [2:59:08] Healthcare is a human right, [2:59:09] full stop. [2:59:10] And what you've shared today [2:59:11] with us [2:59:12] and what I've heard [2:59:13] from individuals [2:59:14] at the ICE detention center [2:59:15] in my district [2:59:16] makes it clear [2:59:17] that this administration [2:59:18] is doing the absolute most [2:59:19] to sow chaos and confusion [2:59:20] and avoid providing [2:59:21] clear guidance to agents [2:59:22] and local health officials [2:59:23] about the rights [2:59:24] of detained individuals. [2:59:25] Every human, [2:59:27] immigrant, [2:59:29] citizen, [2:59:30] criminal or not [2:59:32] deserves access [2:59:34] to healthcare. [2:59:35] We must impeach Secretary. [2:59:36] We must impeach Secretary Noem. [2:59:38] And beyond that, [2:59:39] we have a lot of work [2:59:40] to do to fix [2:59:41] our broken immigration system. [2:59:43] And part of that [2:59:44] is making sure folks [2:59:45] can access quality [2:59:46] and timely care. [2:59:47] Thank you. [2:59:48] I yield back. [2:59:51] Thank you, Representative. [2:59:52] Next up is Representative [2:59:56] Subramanian. [2:59:57] Thank you, [2:59:58] Mr. Ranking Member. [2:59:59] And thank you to everyone [3:00:00] who spoke here today. [3:00:01] And thank you [3:00:02] to our witnesses, really. [3:00:03] Thank you for your courage. [3:00:04] Thank you for speaking out. [3:00:05] There's a lot of people [3:00:06] that don't want you [3:00:07] to tell your stories. [3:00:08] There's a lot of people [3:00:09] who want you to be silent [3:00:10] and to be quiet victims [3:00:12] of what ICE has done. [3:00:13] But you speaking up [3:00:14] makes a huge difference. [3:00:16] It makes it harder [3:00:18] for them to keep doing it [3:00:19] when you speak out. [3:00:20] And so please continue [3:00:21] to speak out. [3:00:22] And I want to thank you [3:00:23] from the bottom of my heart [3:00:24] for being here. [3:00:25] Because the reality is [3:00:26] you are inconvenient [3:00:27] to ICE [3:00:28] and to this administration. [3:00:29] They told us [3:00:30] from the very beginning [3:00:31] that all they were going to do [3:00:32] is go after the worst [3:00:33] of the worst. [3:00:34] They were only going to go [3:00:35] after the criminals, right? [3:00:36] And they were going to keep [3:00:37] our streets safe. [3:00:38] But in the first 10 months [3:00:39] of the administration [3:00:40] alone, [3:00:41] nearly 75,000 people [3:00:43] were swept up in immigration [3:00:44] operations [3:00:45] with no criminal records [3:00:46] at all. [3:00:47] And you all are [3:00:49] American citizens, too. [3:00:51] Is that keeping us safe [3:00:52] to go after American citizens, [3:00:53] to terrorize American citizens, [3:00:55] to terrorize families, [3:00:57] rip families apart? [3:00:58] And this is not [3:00:59] an isolated incident. [3:01:00] You all are not the only ones, [3:01:02] although your stories [3:01:03] are heartbreaking. [3:01:04] This is widespread. [3:01:05] In my community, [3:01:07] we had an American citizen [3:01:09] who was a Trump voter [3:01:10] him and his wife [3:01:11] himself who had [3:01:12] this happen to him. [3:01:13] He was detained [3:01:14] by ICE agents [3:01:15] who were looking [3:01:16] for someone else. [3:01:17] And they thought [3:01:18] he was the right person, [3:01:19] so they harassed him [3:01:20] and detained him. [3:01:21] He was just driving to work [3:01:22] on a normal day. [3:01:23] And what's interesting [3:01:24] and what I keep seeing [3:01:25] over and over again [3:01:27] and what you have shared [3:01:28] in your stories [3:01:29] is that there is [3:01:30] no accountability. [3:01:31] There are no apologies, even. [3:01:33] There's not even [3:01:34] all there is [3:01:35] is pointing a finger at you [3:01:36] and saying [3:01:37] you're a domestic terrorist, right? [3:01:39] Because you are inconvenient [3:01:40] to them. [3:01:41] You are the good guys. [3:01:42] You're the ones [3:01:43] that were doing [3:01:44] the right things [3:01:45] and they were the ones [3:01:46] that came after you. [3:01:48] And so, [3:01:49] never forget that [3:01:50] and we should never forget that. [3:01:51] And attacking communities [3:01:52] and covering it up [3:01:53] is everything [3:01:54] that stands [3:01:55] it stands for everything [3:01:56] that this country [3:01:57] should not stand for. [3:01:58] And so, [3:01:59] what I want to see [3:02:00] first, [3:02:01] I want to see Secretary [3:02:02] Noem impeached. [3:02:03] I think she needs to go [3:02:04] resign or get impeached. [3:02:05] We need to see [3:02:06] a complete overhaul [3:02:07] and reform of ICE. [3:02:08] But I really want [3:02:09] to ask you all [3:02:10] to think about that. [3:02:11] What do you want [3:02:12] your leaders to do? [3:02:13] And what can we do [3:02:14] to both [3:02:15] bring the healing [3:02:16] that you deserve [3:02:17] and need [3:02:18] as well as bring [3:02:19] the accountability [3:02:20] that we should [3:02:21] see [3:02:22] when it comes [3:02:23] to immigration [3:02:24] and ICE? [3:02:25] Mr. Romanucci? [3:02:29] Am I on here? [3:02:30] Yeah. [3:02:31] Thank you very much, [3:02:32] Representative. [3:02:33] I don't think [3:02:34] there's any question [3:02:35] that without [3:02:36] a legislative change [3:02:37] in order [3:02:38] for these fine people [3:02:39] to be able [3:02:40] to seek redress [3:02:41] by filing [3:02:42] direct lawsuits [3:02:43] against law enforcement [3:02:44] officers [3:02:45] and having [3:02:46] a public trial [3:02:47] if the circumstances [3:02:48] warrant [3:02:49] where there [3:02:50] can be [3:02:51] transparency [3:02:52] and the truth [3:02:53] comes out, [3:02:54] we will have [3:02:55] failed. [3:02:56] We will not [3:02:57] have done [3:02:58] our job [3:02:59] if there is [3:03:00] not legislative [3:03:01] change [3:03:02] because [3:03:03] transparency [3:03:04] is truth. [3:03:05] And we can't [3:03:06] get to it [3:03:07] unless these [3:03:08] people can [3:03:09] have the right [3:03:10] to sue [3:03:11] federal law [3:03:12] enforcement [3:03:13] in a way [3:03:14] that the [3:03:15] estate [3:03:16] of George Floyd [3:03:17] was able to sue [3:03:18] the police officers [3:03:20] who murdered him. [3:03:21] Ms. Martinez? [3:03:25] Same. [3:03:26] I just want [3:03:27] accountability [3:03:28] change [3:03:29] for starters [3:03:30] change. [3:03:33] Ms. Rachman? [3:03:34] I do not believe [3:03:35] that violence [3:03:36] from law enforcement [3:03:37] against communities [3:03:38] is a new [3:03:39] problem [3:03:40] in any way. [3:03:41] However, [3:03:42] I believe [3:03:43] that this moment [3:03:44] has provided [3:03:45] new lenses [3:03:46] for people [3:03:47] who may have needed [3:03:48] help. [3:03:49] It is not [3:03:50] only the tip [3:03:51] of the iceberg [3:03:52] and if [3:03:53] we can set [3:03:54] precedent [3:03:55] that you should [3:03:56] be very afraid [3:03:57] to hurt [3:03:58] someone like [3:03:59] this, [3:04:00] then maybe [3:04:01] we can solve [3:04:03] some of [3:04:04] that larger [3:04:05] problem. [3:04:06] Because even [3:04:07] someone who [3:04:08] was committing [3:04:11] a crime [3:04:12] should not [3:04:13] have been [3:04:16] treated [3:04:17] the way [3:04:18] that we [3:04:19] were treated. [3:04:20] Thank you. [3:04:21] Ms. Ruscon? [3:04:23] I believe the [3:04:24] government [3:04:25] should be held [3:04:26] accountable [3:04:27] because it starts [3:04:28] with them. [3:04:29] Trump, [3:04:30] Vance, [3:04:33] and Noemi. [3:04:37] Mr. Stott? [3:04:38] Thank you, [3:04:39] Representative. [3:04:40] I think there is a [3:04:41] very long list [3:04:42] that I do not [3:04:44] have time [3:04:45] to fully [3:04:46] flesh out. [3:04:47] But in a nutshell, [3:04:48] professionalism [3:04:49] demands [3:04:50] accountability [3:04:51] both administrative [3:04:52] and legal [3:04:53] and it demands [3:04:54] improvement. [3:04:55] That is, [3:04:56] an agency [3:04:58] learns [3:04:59] from its [3:05:01] obligations [3:05:03] to protect [3:05:04] its employees [3:05:05] and is [3:05:06] responsible [3:05:07] for protecting [3:05:08] their [3:05:09] employees. [3:05:10] Mr. Stott? [3:05:12] Thank you, [3:05:13] Ranking Member [3:05:14] Garcia and [3:05:15] Senator Blumenthal [3:05:16] for hosting [3:05:17] this very [3:05:18] important [3:05:19] hearing [3:05:20] today and [3:05:21] doing something [3:05:22] that both [3:05:23] House and [3:05:24] Senate [3:05:25] Republicans [3:05:26] refused to [3:05:27] do, [3:05:28] which is [3:05:29] to hold [3:05:30] any American in this country or any human being in this country, regardless of what their [3:05:34] immigration status is. So I am deeply sorry for what happened to you. And I can assure you that [3:05:39] I will not rest until everybody from the very top, Kristi Noem, to all the way to the bottom, [3:05:47] and these ICE agents who are acting violently and lawlessly must be prosecuted and held [3:05:52] accountable for their crimes. This description, what you have put forward and what we've seen [3:05:58] across this country, ICE is not law enforcement. They're also not immigration enforcement. They [3:06:02] are literally Trump's personal paramilitary force turned against civilians, no different than many [3:06:09] authoritarian regimes around the world. My parents fled an authoritarian regime to come to this [3:06:14] country, and the tactics are extremely similar. Now, I want to dive into some of the details of [3:06:21] Ms. Rahman's testimony. You described that you were violently pulled from your car [3:06:27] by DHS agents. [3:06:28] Ms. Rahman's testimony. You described that you were violently pulled from your car by DHS agents while trying to drive to a doctor's appointment. Agents had told you to move your car towards other federal agents, an action that, according to the Trump administration, was justification for the lethal force that was used against Rene Good. Were you concerned for your safety if you had followed their directions? [3:06:49] Absolutely. There were people everywhere. [3:06:51] The violence of your detention, per your description, just seems so senseless. Why do you think they acted the way that they did? [3:07:03] Because I think that they are trained towards cruelty. Their tactics do not logically make sense to me as an immigration strategy. That would be things like helping immigrants access jobs and things. It doesn't make sense to me as a public safety strategy either, but it does make a lot of sense as a strategy for teaching the population to be afraid and not speak. [3:07:25] And DHS called you a, quote, agitator and claims that you were arrested for obstruction. Is that how you view yourself? [3:07:35] No. [3:07:36] I am a software engineer who was going to a doctor's appointment. [3:07:41] Exactly. Did federal agents treat you with dignity and respect during your detention? [3:07:47] It doesn't seem like they know what that is. [3:07:50] And what do you think the agents meant when they told you that you wouldn't be a problem if you were, quote, normal? [3:07:58] I think the agents believe there is exactly one kind of person who is appropriate for being allowed to live their life in America. [3:08:07] When were you first? [3:08:09] I don't get that. [3:08:09] Thank you. When were you first informed of your rights? [3:08:13] I was not informed of my rights. [3:08:15] And were you allowed to speak with a lawyer? [3:08:18] No. I asked many times, and they said that would happen later, but I was never actually taken to an interrogation room because there were too many, quote, bodies occupying those rooms, and I blacked out before I was able to ever talk to anyone on the phone. [3:08:38] And did you receive appropriate message? [3:08:41] No. [3:08:42] Did you receive medical care or disability accommodations while you were detained? [3:08:44] No. I requested them many times and finally thought to ask for a wheelchair, which they didn't know if there were any. [3:08:53] Nobody should not know the answer to if there is a wheelchair in the facility. [3:08:58] And then when I was put in it, I was taunted, which is strange to me because that did not make their job any easier. [3:09:05] Were you worried that immigration agents might let you die? [3:09:09] One hundred percent, because I read books. [3:09:13] Thank you. [3:09:15] Thank you for your testimony. [3:09:16] I yield back. [3:09:17] Thank you, Congresswoman. [3:09:20] Next up is Representative Bell. [3:09:21] Thank you, Senator Blumenthal, Ranking Member Garcia. [3:09:26] Also to our survivors, for your courage, as well as our witnesses, as well. [3:09:40] My first foray into politics was as a city councilman in a small city called Ferguson. [3:09:45] And one thing that I learned as a city councilman is that the relationship with citizens and [3:09:56] their city, there was a direct correlation with their relationship with law enforcement. [3:10:05] I would have people come up to me about their trash and just be mad. [3:10:11] They'd come up to me about a pothole in their street and just be, they're just hot. [3:10:18] But as soon as that trash was picked up, as soon as that pothole was filled, they were ready to bake you cookies. [3:10:27] A bad interaction with law enforcement doesn't go away so easily, though. [3:10:33] And I say all that because as a Ferguson city councilman, as a later on a municipal court judge, we worked hard to change not only policies, but also the perception of law enforcement in our local communities. [3:10:55] We worked hard to get body cameras on every single officer and implementing policies that required those cameras to be on. [3:11:09] We worked hard to implement community policing, where police officers weren't just evaluated by how many arrests they made, but how many people they knew in the community, how many conversations they initiated. [3:11:27] We worked hard to expand treatment programs for folks struggling with mental health and addiction. [3:11:37] And we worked hard to get law enforcement to buy into that. [3:11:41] And they did in our community. [3:11:44] And so I think that's what I learned. [3:11:47] So it's like taking two steps, one step forward and two steps back. [3:11:55] When we see these masked agents that I talked about earlier in this year running around with weapons, with the color of law enforcement around them, but yet without the training, without the adherence to the policies that actually we've seen start to build that confidence, that trust back in many places around the country. [3:12:23] And so it's very frustrating when we look at how much effort we've put in, and then we see Renee Good and Alex Pretty shot less than two miles from each other just three weeks apart. [3:12:24] One step forward and two steps back. [3:12:25] And, Mr. Stoughton, I just want to ask you quickly about the force continuum and dig in a little bit about the use of force and how that is predicated on the [3:13:03] amount of force that an officer is faced with. [3:13:06] And if you could just talk about that and then the duty to render aid as well. [3:13:11] Thank you for that question, Representative. [3:13:16] In very abbreviated terms, officers can and in the performance of their legitimate duties may have to use force to overcome actual threats that would undermine the policing goal, whether that's making an apprehension or conducting a search or whatever. [3:13:36] Thank you. [3:13:37] Thank you. [3:13:40] And I just want to rainy [3:13:53] the idea of the force continuum is just a way of demonstrating the relationship between the nature and severity of the threat presented by someone's actions, and the nature and severity of the force that the officer gets to use in response. [3:14:07] this context is proportionality that is just out of respect for time you can't use an ak if the [3:14:15] threat is a fly swatter would that be fair yes representative that's a that's a good analogy [3:14:20] thank you thank you representative um next is representative simon i just want to remind our [3:14:24] folks with six of the four minutes because i think our our time in the room in the chamber is also [3:14:29] uh wrapped and so representative simon thank you ranking member and thank you for leadership for [3:14:33] bringing us here today um i think it's important to also lift up the voices for the past 22 years [3:14:39] of folks on the ground in communities human rights attorneys civil rights organizations [3:14:46] who have been clear that across administrations ice has been damaging a damaging force in our [3:14:53] communities so what you all have experienced is the ticking up of an unchecked body i say we [3:15:03] listen to women of color particularly women of color women of color women of color women of color [3:15:05] organizers and activists and organizational leaders on the ground who have been citing this [3:15:09] rallying call to deaf ears for too long today we heard a school teacher talk about being shot [3:15:16] five times sister thank you thank you for being here the courageousness in your voice and the [3:15:22] tears the tears so much power i wish that we as legislators had the courage of you all standing [3:15:32] here sitting here with us today we heard [3:15:36] from a disabled woman a disabled woman who was yanked from her car and thrown on the floor and [3:15:41] made bloody and incarcerated with other folks who had not been mirandized we heard from an expected [3:15:46] father who was literally terrorized by ice agents and lived to tell the story the betrayal is a [3:15:55] betrayal it's a systemic and systematic betrayal and we need you to survive we need you and the [3:16:03] rest of the american citizens and the folks who have been killed by the ice agents we need you to [3:16:06] survive we need you and the rest of the american citizens and the folks who are in a process to gain [3:16:08] their citizenship during this moment of tyranny we need you to survive i am so thankful in minnesota [3:16:16] brothers and sisters just a couple of weeks ago many of us went out to a hearing [3:16:20] to hear from folks we were able to go to mrs good's memorial site where good [3:16:29] christian folks were reciting the lord's prayer over and over [3:16:32] we heard from a few of those folks that in minnesota at night you hear two things you hear [3:16:37] whistles [3:16:38] you hear whistles and you hear screams the whistles are coming from the thousands of [3:16:42] volunteers who have answered the call from their lord to bear witness the screams are coming from [3:16:49] the children coming from the mothers and fathers who are being drugged from their homes from men [3:16:54] and women who have sworn to abide by the constitution what you all have done here today [3:17:00] and i know it's been a long day but you are bearing witness your words are sacred your [3:17:06] experiences should hollow the halls of the church [3:17:10] of these hallowed halls now miss robin your testimony did something to my spirit as all of [3:17:20] your testimonies did i came to congress as a disabled woman to consistently humanize our [3:17:27] experiences in an abled world thank you you represent millions of people today who have had [3:17:37] interactions with law enforcement and were dehumanized just one question but before the [3:17:42] question again my deep gratitude for you [3:17:45] miss goods family and all of you have come here today but my question mr roman is for folks with [3:17:54] disabilities now that you become a part of a tribe of folks who have been disrespected and almost [3:17:59] murdered by law enforcement what would you like to lift up your testimony was beautiful today [3:18:06] but being a disabled advocate being an engineer being a scholarly now voice all over the country [3:18:14] as a disabled woman i'm wondering if you could give us a few words [3:18:17] more seconds about your experience and what that means for disabled americans [3:18:23] disabled americans have great worth in this country and anyone who does not identify as disabled [3:18:30] should probably be aware that any one of you can become temporarily or permanently disabled in your [3:18:37] life and you will need the wisdom from folks who have been having this conversation thank you very [3:18:44] much for your work also i appreciate you more than you know thank you thank you all thank you [3:18:52] representative next is your representative mr roman you have been a part of a tribe of folks who have [3:18:53] lived in this country for a long time and you have been a part of a tribe of folks who have lived in this [3:18:53] country for a long time and you have been a part of a tribe of folks who have lived in this country [3:18:54] uh thank you ranking member garcia thank you senator blumenthal for hosting this hearing and [3:18:59] i think it's just very unfortunate that not a single person from the other side of the aisle [3:19:03] is here at this hearing because they are also needing to hear your powerful testimony uh they're [3:19:08] the ones that i think need to grapple with their consciences i want to thank you for taking the [3:19:13] time to share these deeply traumatic stories particularly the three witnesses in the middle [3:19:18] what we heard today was so deeply disturbing and shocking and to think that this could take place in [3:19:23] america is just very very surreal but this is also very inevitable because for now a year almost [3:19:31] we have been seeing a escalation of lawlessness and violence that is being permeated it is being [3:19:37] fomented and encouraged by the top levels of this administration and uh we saw this happen [3:19:44] last year in southern california and mr rusco and you're just to the north of us in orange county [3:19:49] we saw lots of incidents in orange county in los angeles [3:19:52] uh there's a gentleman named narciso barranco who was videotaped um it went viral because he was [3:19:59] being punched in the head repeatedly he's a gardener who'd been in in the united states for [3:20:03] almost 30 years the father of three marines uh and as with you all the the administration followed a [3:20:09] well-worn playbook of trying to blame the victim they accused him of being a domestic terrorist [3:20:15] of trying to attack the ice agents with a weed whacker until that narrative no longer could [3:20:20] withstand the videos that uh clinton and mr rusco and you're just to the north of us in orange county [3:20:22] uh clearly contradicted it uh and unfortunately what we saw here mr rusco and miss martinez is is [3:20:28] that same playbook and i just want to be clear um you were confronted by masked agents who [3:20:35] approached you threatening you with guns drawn and you you in your case mr rusco and your father [3:20:42] drove the car away ms martinez you drove the car away and in both instances it's clear you [3:20:47] were trying to flee you were not trying to hurt anyone you're not driving at agents [3:20:52] yet they fired gunshots both times you were hit seven five times seven bullet wounds and i'm so [3:20:57] sorry to hear that ms martinez but uh they blamed you uh and that is that exactly the same playbook [3:21:04] that they followed with renee nicole goode and alex preti and like my colleague uh representative [3:21:10] simon um i had the privilege of going to minnesota to hear from local law enforcement to hear from [3:21:15] activists and they shared the same story and what is happening right now is that they are gaslighting [3:21:22] uh the police and uh they have a lot of information in their data uh there's a whole bunch of [3:21:25] reports that are unbelievable uh lackluster cases about what's happening even when they have videos [3:21:30] directly contradicting that now some of us have raised concerns for a long time that ice is hiring [3:21:35] the wrong type of person and i know there's been a lot of emphasis on training mr stoughton you talk [3:21:38] a lot about the need for better training and i agree with that uh and yet what we've seen over [3:21:43] and over is stuff that i don't think training would cure we see violence perpetrated by people [3:21:48] uh in ways that dehumanize their victims uh and so i just want to ask you a few questions mr stoughton [3:21:52] that punching walking up to someone in the and punching them in the face [3:21:55] because you don't like what they're saying is that something that's [3:21:58] acceptable for law enforcement to do absolutely not is that a crime yes what [3:22:03] about prepper spraying somebody who's standing with the sign you don't like is [3:22:06] that appropriate for law enforcement to do no is that a crime yes and if you [3:22:11] just decide to tackle someone blindside them in the street they're not resisting [3:22:15] arrest they're not doing anything criminal is that a crime yes it very [3:22:19] well could be and it should that be subject to an investigation absolutely [3:22:24] now we have not had any investigations until the murder of Alex pretty in no [3:22:30] instance that I'm aware of and we've written letters to DHS asking some of [3:22:33] these questions have we once gotten any responses indicating that any [3:22:37] investigations are underway with any of these victims so miss Martinez miss [3:22:41] Rahman Rahman and mr. Esco and I just want to ask you a few last questions did [3:22:46] anyone from the government ever apologize to you you can just say no no [3:22:52] no [3:22:52] no or yes or no no no when you're in the hospital miss Martinez didn't have [3:22:57] anyone ever visit you from the government only FBI and ICE agents no [3:23:04] nobody did Kristi no nobody else who called you a domestic terrorist they [3:23:07] didn't come visit you no no apologies no visits no regrets apparently I want to [3:23:12] apologize to you on behalf the United States government this behavior is [3:23:16] criminal we need to prosecute it every single person in Congress upon taking [3:23:21] office takes an oath to support and defend the Constitution of the United [3:23:24] States we need Republicans to step up right now and honor that oath with that [3:23:28] I yield back thank you represent its alarm thank you so much chairman I come [3:23:33] from the city of Detroit the most beautiful blackest city in the country [3:23:35] so I'm gonna keep it real can I can I blow this is that gonna be a problem and [3:23:39] this that's all of our residents are using right now to protect themselves in [3:23:47] the streets do you understand this is what they're using whistles in their [3:23:51] camera I want to show you let's see what this army fascist army disguised as some [3:24:02] sort of federal agency is using. This is the home of Tiana and Garrison. This is their private home. [3:24:09] Let's see what they have. And I want Seth to pay attention to this because I know you probably read [3:24:13] about all the toys that they have. U.S. Immigration Customs Enforcement agents, I'm not talking about [3:24:20] Border Patrol, they got stuff too, are equipped with a range of tactical weapons, including AR-15 [3:24:26] rifles, options such as pepper spray launchers, I don't know what that is, taser devices. [3:24:34] They also utilize military-grade tactical gear, including camouflage pouches and specialized [3:24:39] rifle attachments. They have ammunition rifles, like endless amount, attached to their body. [3:24:46] They have night vision and thermal cameras on drones, armored vehicles. I even heard, [3:24:51] Martin, at your house, they were using drones on your house. [3:24:55] Contractors like Quantico. [3:24:56] Quantico, you know who I'm talking about, Quantico, whatever, tactical, and these groups [3:25:00] provide these materials. They make money giving us this stuff. Remember that. And every day they [3:25:07] keep any of our immigrant neighbors who are asylee seekers, some of them are literally just waiting [3:25:11] their turn to be able to get that pathway to citizenship. They're making money off of our [3:25:17] babies being imprisoned. You know, there's a lot of equipment here, and military gear here, Seth, [3:25:26] a lot of weapons here, for whistles and cameras and our disabled. [3:25:31] Residents, people going to drop off, you know, donations to their church, a father. That's a lot [3:25:39] of weapons. You think this belongs in the streets within this federal agency right now, with everything [3:25:46] that's happened? [3:25:47] While I do think there's a potential role for specialized equipment and training, I do not see [3:25:55] the role of... [3:25:56] Well, my friends in the veterans, they said this stuff we use in Afghanistan and Iraq, Rashida. [3:26:00] I didn't agree with that either. You know, those are a lot of folks that were innocent lives, [3:26:05] civilians, impoverished. [3:26:05] Well, my friends in the veterans, they said this stuff we use in Afghanistan and Iraq, Rashida. I didn't agree with that either. You know, those are a lot of folks that were innocent lives, civilians, impoverished. [3:26:05] Well, my friends in the veterans, they said this stuff we use in Afghanistan and Iraq, Rashida. I didn't agree with that either. You know, those are a lot of folks that were innocent lives, civilians, impoverished. [3:26:06] But this kind of stuff in war zones, Seth? [3:26:09] It does not belong in day-to-day... [3:26:10] Look how many people showed up to her house. They're unhinged. And I just have to be honest with my colleagues. [3:26:12] Look how many people showed up to her house. They're unhinged. And I just have to be honest with my colleagues. [3:26:19] They're not here to listen to this, but I'm going to tell you all, it's not a slogan, abolish ICE. [3:26:23] My residents in southwest Detroit have been telling us for years. For years they've been telling us. [3:26:29] You know, thinking of that father, I saw the emotion that Martin, especially Ms. Martinez, had, seeing that father of two boys being murdered. [3:26:39] No one talks about Mr. Gonzalez as much as they talk about Renee and Alex. [3:26:46] And I know they would hate that. But I have to be honest with all of you, all of my colleagues that are not here, they think if we unmask them, they'll stop killing us. [3:26:56] They think if we just train them more. [3:26:58] But do you know, Seth, that murderer agent, John Ross, that executed Renee? [3:27:06] He's been with Border Patrol since 2007, then goes to ICE in 2015. [3:27:12] He's been with Border Patrol since 2007, then goes to ICE in 2015. [3:27:12] He's been with Border Patrol since 2007, then goes to ICE in 2015. [3:27:13] I think he trains people with guns. [3:27:17] So it's not more training. [3:27:19] This is an agency that was built to terrorize communities and neighborhoods. [3:27:23] It is an agency that was created with this culture. [3:27:26] It cannot be so-called reformed barriers. [3:27:30] They violate their own policies. [3:27:33] I saw it in my own neighborhood in 2010 and on. [3:27:36] So it doesn't matter who's president, this needs to be dismantled. [3:27:41] With that, I yield. [3:27:44] Thank you. [3:27:45] And I believe we have Representative Pressley. [3:27:47] Who we can grab a seat wherever she would like. [3:27:49] And there you go. [3:27:54] Sure. [3:28:06] Last week, I traveled to Minneapolis at the invitation of my sister in service and by bond, [3:28:13] Congresswoman Ilhan Omar, to the Minnesota 5th, a district that I've been to many times [3:28:19] doing justice work. [3:28:21] I went to bear witness to the trauma that so many communities are being forced to endure. [3:28:29] I met residents who have watched rogue masked agents detained, deported, and even killed [3:28:34] their neighbors in broad daylight, in cold blood, without due process, without care for what their [3:28:43] violence leaves behind, public executions, public terror. [3:28:52] Five-year-olds are being detained. [3:28:53] I'm thinking of Liam Ramos, a five-year-old child held detention for a week, and the over [3:28:58] 3,000 other children whose names we don't know who remain in detention centers across the country. [3:29:05] I'm thinking of his classmates who wrote letters to ICE agents, [3:29:09] pleading, pleading for mercy, appealing to whatever humanity they hope still existed. [3:29:17] I will not accept a system that rips children from safety in the name of quote-unquote law [3:29:22] and order. [3:29:24] This is trauma, and the witnesses here today live with it. [3:29:29] I still look forward to a day when people do not have to relive and weaponize their [3:29:32] trauma in order to compel action from their government. [3:29:36] But I'm grateful to those who bare their heart for the good of humanity. [3:29:41] Each of you have shown immense courage, and it is time for [3:29:44] Democrats to show that same courage and fight against fascism. [3:29:50] As we negotiate funding for DHS, we have a real opportunity to do more than express concern. [3:29:55] We have the chance to reject this campaign of terror, and we have a responsibility to do so. [3:30:00] As Democrats, we can say we give a damn, but that is not enough if we refuse to act with courage. [3:30:06] Requiring agents to remove masks or obtain warrants before entering homes is important, [3:30:10] but let's be honest, that is the bare minimum. We can't leave power in the hands of bad actors [3:30:15] to decide whether or not to follow the law. We can't make demands of people like Trump and [3:30:20] Noem and then hope that they willingly comply. Our Constitution doesn't rely on good faith. [3:30:25] It demands checks and balances. If we want real change, we must check this administration and [3:30:30] rebalance power in the hands of the people where it belongs. Here is a simple fact. [3:30:35] People should be allowed to sue ICE agents for violating their rights and killing their loved [3:30:40] ones. Period. That should not be controversial for Democrats, Republicans, Independents, or any [3:30:46] one. But there are barriers in the way. Congress must remove these barriers with a two-step [3:30:51] legislative fix. Step 1. We need to close the loophole. There is currently a loophole in the [3:30:56] law that prevents federal officials from being sued under Section 1983, which is a civil rights [3:31:01] law protecting constitutional rights. If victims of violence can sue state and local law enforcement, [3:31:07] they should also be able to sue federal law enforcement. Step 2. We need to abolish qualified [3:31:15] immunity. [3:31:15] Qualified immunity is an unjust, court-invented legal doctrine that says law enforcement [3:31:21] misconduct can be excused. That includes violations of constitutional rights. The Supreme Court has [3:31:28] expanded qualified immunity to the point where even Clarence Thomas thinks it's gone too far. [3:31:34] This accountability two-step is critical to reining in this extremist administration. [3:31:40] During these negotiations on DHS funding, Democrats must prioritize giving [3:31:46] power to the people. [3:31:47] Mr. Romanshu, you are the lawyer representing the Good Family during this unimaginable, painful moment. [3:31:55] You have spent decades litigating excessive force cases. How does qualified immunity impact your [3:32:01] ability to seek accountability for your clients? [3:32:04] Thank you, Congresswoman. Qualified immunity is a tremendous barrier. It's a hurdle to achieve [3:32:11] civil justice and accountability for people who want to seek accountability for their clients. [3:32:16] And I think that's what we need to do. [3:32:18] We need to work step by step to stop this right-wing government from [3:32:30] taking out the law TikTok and suing police officers. [3:32:33] I lichen it very much to get out of jail on a monopoly board because unless it's clearly [3:32:39] established that the officer violated a law, they get a pass. They get qualified immunity, and the [3:32:45] lawsuit is dismissed. [3:32:46] You can not achieve that. [3:32:47] By your suggestion, which is a good one, we're aligned. [3:32:49] for the police officer's actions, we have accountability. We have a system of justice [3:32:54] that would be fair and gets rid of that hurdle. Thank you. We need laws that empower families [3:33:02] like those that have testified before us today. We should use these negotiations to rebalance power, [3:33:08] to restore accountability.