Donald Trump; France on Fire — 60 Minutes Full Broadcast

[0:06] How are you, Mr. President? [0:08] It's great to see you. [0:08] Nice to see you. [0:09] In his first sit-down interview since the election, [0:12] we found President Trump seemingly accepting of defeat [0:16] and in a surprisingly reflective mood. [0:18] So you think your deportation policy went too far? [0:21] I think it was too tough. [0:22] It was too tough. [0:22] I think it might be too tough, yeah. [0:24] We talked about everything, from the White House decor... [0:27] It's the highest quality, 24-karat gold. [0:32] ...to the Iran war, working with Democrats, [0:34] and even his own mortality. [0:37] Do you think you're going to heaven? [0:38] I hope so. I don't want to go to hell. [0:43] For weeks, France has been on fire, [0:46] businesses ransacked, police injured, [0:49] a government that can't get the chaos under control. [0:52] Because when it's unfair, you have to fight. [0:55] And the person most likely to gain from the turmoil [0:58] is right-wing populist Marine Le Pen. [1:01] Are you a fascist? [1:02] No, absolutely not. [1:08] I'm Leslie Stahl. [1:09] I'm John Wertheim. [1:11] I'm Nora O'Donnell. [1:12] I'm Ross Douthat. [1:13] I'm Trevor Phillips. [1:15] I'm Bill Whitaker. [1:16] Those stories and more tonight on 60 Minutes. [1:28] This past Tuesday, President Donald Trump's Republican Party [1:32] suffered an extraordinary midterm repudiation, [1:35] losing not just the House and Senate, [1:37] but statewide offices in red states, [1:40] from Texas to Kansas to South Carolina, [1:43] that Democrats hadn't won in decades. [1:46] In the past, this president has met defeat with claims of fraud [1:50] and the effort to overturn the 2020 election. [1:53] But when we met with him in the White House on Friday [1:56] for his first sit-down interview since the midterms, [1:59] we found him in a surprisingly reflective mood [2:02] and seemingly accepting of defeat. [2:05] Our wide-ranging conversation covered immigration and corruption, [2:09] Iran and artificial intelligence, [2:11] his potential successors, and his own mortality. [2:15] But we began with the election results. [2:18] Two years ago, you won a big, some might say historic victory. [2:24] Just now, the Republican Party in the midterm suffered a big, [2:27] some might say historic defeat. [2:29] Give me your political analysis of what just happened. [2:33] Well, number one, I was not on the ballot. [2:35] But I campaigned hard for some people. [2:38] And I think if I was on the ballot, [2:40] it would have been a much different situation [2:43] because you saw the level of popularity and love. [2:46] There was love with massive rallies. [2:48] You had to transfer those voters, however, [2:50] to candidates that they didn't like. [2:53] But there's something beyond that. [2:55] They didn't like the war. [2:57] They didn't like the fact that gasoline went up [3:00] because I had it down at a low. [3:02] And there's a great dislike, incredibly, for Israel. [3:06] Let's go through those, then, one by one. [3:07] Start with the candidates, right? [3:09] You said it was tough to transfer your own appeal to candidates. [3:13] But in a lot of cases, you picked the candidates. [3:16] You endorsed Ken Paxton in Texas. [3:18] He had a tough time. [3:19] You endorsed Darlene Graham in South Carolina. [3:21] But Conan would have lost also. [3:23] Darlene, I did that in honor of a man named Lindsay, [3:28] who was a friend of mine. [3:30] And she fought hard. [3:31] She fought hard. [3:32] She really did. [3:33] She lost a very Republican state to a very liberal challenger. [3:37] I won South Carolina by the highest vote in history by far. [3:41] I won Texas by the highest vote in history by far. [3:44] I won Florida, who, by the way, I did endorse. [3:47] And he's going to be a great governor and a great senator. [3:50] I would endorse both of them. [3:52] And had I not endorsed them, they wouldn't have won. [3:54] Why can't it transfer? [3:55] You were out on the trail and you said, vote like I'm on the ballot. [3:59] Yeah, it didn't. [3:59] And people didn't? [4:00] Or did they? [4:01] Did they vote because they were mad at you about- [4:03] No, I think they didn't vote, really. [4:06] I think in some cases they didn't like the candidates. [4:08] And that's, you know, their prerogative. [4:11] A couple of days ago, your vice president, J.D. Vance, [4:14] wrote a social media post where he says, [4:15] the reason we lost is the war, meaning Iran. [4:18] And he said things in that post about Israel. [4:19] I don't disagree with it. [4:21] Yeah, so you agree with his analysis. [4:22] I don't disagree with it. [4:23] Did you know he was going to write that post? [4:24] He asked me, what do I think? [4:26] I said, you write what you want. [4:28] By the way, what are you going to write? [4:30] The only thing I wish he would have said there, if he felt it, [4:34] and you'd have to ask him about that. [4:36] But if you had it to do again, would you do it? [4:38] You know he was part of a decision-making process. [4:41] And my answer is an emphatic yes, [4:42] because you can't let Iran have a nuclear weapon. [4:44] I think, historically, this will be a very good decision. [4:48] Is it a good decision for today and tomorrow? [4:51] Maybe not. [4:52] But, you know, I have to go with what's right for our country. [4:55] If they had a nuclear weapon during my term, [4:57] I would be excoriated far worse than what's happened. [5:01] So I've stopped them from having a nuclear weapon. [5:05] That's a big thing. [5:07] The president argued that even with the Iran war, [5:10] the U.S. economy in his second term has been very strong. [5:14] But in poll after poll, people say they're unhappy [5:17] with this economy in a way they weren't in the first term. [5:19] Cost of living, inflation, and so on. [5:22] Is that all just the Iran war? [5:24] Well, it's not really the Iran war, [5:26] because the numbers are phenomenal. [5:28] I think it was bad messaging, maybe by me, [5:31] but I would talk about it all the time, [5:32] so I don't know how much can I talk about it. [5:34] Look, the press doesn't cover positive news for Republicans. [5:39] They don't cover, certainly, positive news for me. [5:43] So I have to do it myself. [5:44] I have to get it out there. [5:45] We have historically good numbers. [5:47] We have the highest stock market in history. [5:49] But why don't Americans feel it? [5:51] They don't. [5:51] Why don't they? [5:52] Because obviously, like, you and the press, [5:55] you and the media, you and our business, [5:57] have been in tension throughout your career. [5:59] Correct. [6:00] But you still won elections, right? [6:02] So why couldn't you win this time? [6:03] I think it was bad messaging. [6:05] What was the bad message? [6:07] We couldn't get the word across. [6:09] Whether it was the message or the record, [6:12] the Republican collapse will give Democrats in Congress [6:15] new powers over budgets, hearings, and subpoenas. [6:19] You came out after the midterms. [6:21] You congratulated the Democrats. [6:22] You said that you were open to working with them. [6:24] True. [6:25] What is one thing you would like to work [6:27] with a Democratic majority on? [6:28] I'd love to do something on immigration. [6:31] What? [6:31] Because, well, so... [6:34] Do you think immigration hurt you in the midterms? [6:36] Do you think the crackdown hurt you? [6:37] I think it both helped and hurt. [6:39] I think I got an A-plus for closing up the border. [6:42] I get very high marks for getting the bad ones out. [6:45] But I get hurt because we also took people [6:48] that had good jobs that created one violation [6:53] for breaking of the law, [6:54] and that was that they came into the country illegally. [6:57] Now, there is a large part of the country [6:59] that think that they should be put out, [7:01] and there's a large part of the country [7:03] that think that they should be allowed to stay. [7:05] If they're good people working in a landscaping company [7:08] or working in a hotel or doing something, right? [7:11] And, in some cases, paying taxes. [7:14] Mm-hmm. [7:15] And there's a large group of people [7:16] think that they should be allowed to stay. [7:18] So you think your deportation policy went too far? [7:20] I think it was too tough. [7:21] It was too tough. [7:22] I think it might be too tough, yeah. [7:23] What would happen? [7:24] What does the deal look like with the Democrats? [7:26] I think ultimately that hurt me. [7:27] Well, the deal would be we would work something out, [7:30] and I think it's something... [7:31] I think that's something that's actually doable. [7:33] Doable to create some kind of legal status [7:36] for the landscapers and the... [7:37] Yeah. [7:38] When you go into a hotel, [7:40] and you have a woman that's worked there [7:41] as a maid, as a cleaner, as a this, as a that, [7:46] as a waitress, a lot of good things, great jobs, [7:49] and all of a sudden, [7:50] they're being taken out of the country, [7:52] it's tough, it's a tough thing. [7:53] But there's a group of people [7:55] that I would say on the sort of pretty far right [7:59] that would like everybody taken out. [8:00] And there's a group of people on the... [8:02] Do any of those people work in your administration? [8:05] Are they in the building with us right now? [8:06] Yes, no, no, well, there are a lot of those people. [8:08] Then there's also people [8:10] that are more modified on that. [8:11] In other words, get the killers out, [8:12] get all the rough ones out, [8:14] get the drug dealers out, [8:16] but let the people that are here, [8:19] and in some cases here for 10 and 15 years, [8:22] work a deal for them. [8:24] You think the Democratic Party right now [8:26] has people in it [8:28] who would be interested in this kind of deal? [8:30] I think so, yeah. [8:31] People have already called me. [8:32] So I'll say I saw James Tallarico, [8:35] the new Democratic senator from Texas. [8:36] Said very nice things, yeah. [8:37] I saw him on Fox News, [8:38] and he said immigration was one of the things [8:40] he wanted to work with you on. [8:41] Others, too. [8:42] South Carolina said. [8:43] Numerous people at once said that. [8:45] In the course of the campaign, [8:47] you did occasionally call him Tallarico. [8:49] Yeah, I did. [8:51] Do you think you could work with the Democrats [8:52] without insulting them consistently? [8:54] Yeah, I could. [8:55] You think so? [8:57] I also call many of them Democrats. [8:59] You did that just the other day. [9:01] If it took six months of not insulting the Democrats [9:04] to get a deal done, do you think you could do it? [9:06] Very easily. [9:07] Okay. [9:08] That'll be interesting to watch. [9:09] I'm here to help the country. [9:11] Do you think you could do it if they're investigating you, [9:13] if they're running investigations into your administration? [9:15] Can you work with them? [9:16] Well, I did it for four years. [9:20] You know, what they did with me was there's never been weaponization. [9:24] They impeached me twice. [9:26] And there are those that say that worked out to my advantage. [9:29] I mean, you know, because... [9:30] Do you think they'll impeach you again? [9:32] I can't imagine it. [9:33] You know, they did. [9:34] Hey, look, what have I done? [9:35] I've had the best two years in the history of the presidency. [9:39] All this winning, according to the president, [9:42] doesn't preclude some change of White House personnel. [9:45] In a previous lifetime, you were rather famous [9:47] for saying you're fired quite often. [9:50] After a big midterm defeat like this, [9:52] do you expect to fire anyone from your team? [9:54] I do, yeah. [9:54] You do? [9:55] A little bit. [9:55] A little bit? [9:56] I love my cabinet. [9:58] I think they're good. [9:59] But I'll be doing maybe a few changes. [10:01] The first change came an hour after our conversation [10:05] with the president. [10:06] Susie Wiles, the president's chief of staff, [10:08] was replaced by deputy chief of staff Stephen Miller, [10:12] the architect of the president's mass deportation policy. [10:15] It's a move that seems to conflict with the president's [10:18] professed desire to work with Democrats on immigration. [10:22] We asked the president about another administration official [10:25] whose job security is the subject of speculation. [10:28] We saw Secretary of Defense Pete Hegseth in the hall. [10:31] He was meeting with you just before now. [10:32] His name has come up a few times as someone people have called for his resignation. [10:38] Do you have confidence in him? [10:39] I do. [10:39] Look, we've won two wars. [10:43] We've won Venezuela and taken out billions and billions and billions of dollars already, [10:51] and we will be taking out many billions of dollars and get along very well. [10:55] And you could call it a territory, you could call it whatever you want. [10:58] We won that war in less than one hour. [11:01] And you credit Hegseth, you credit Pete Hegseth for that? [11:04] No, but he was a part of it. [11:05] We don't back down. [11:07] This past week, Hegseth released a long video message [11:10] defending his own tenure and the prosecution of the Iran war, [11:14] a war the president claims is essentially finished. [11:18] So you're not going to escalate the war now that the midterms are over? [11:21] Well, I'm not looking to. [11:21] I don't think there's any reason to. [11:23] I don't think there's any reason to. [11:25] Look. [11:26] They still have nuclear material. [11:27] Right. [11:28] They have nothing. [11:29] It's buried under thousands of tons of rock. [11:31] So what's the deal in the end with them that gets the strait open? [11:35] Because it's important to stress. [11:37] No, no, the strait is open. [11:39] We have ships going through. [11:40] But the ships that are going through are being babysat by a large U.S. military presence. [11:44] So how do we make a deal that gets that presence out of there? [11:48] Not very expensive. [11:49] We can just leave them there indefinitely. [11:50] And at the end of this whole thing, those countries that we've protected [11:54] are going to pay us back any and all costs that we've had for the war. [11:58] Because without us, they wouldn't exist. [12:00] Without us, Israel wouldn't exist. [12:02] Let me tell you. [12:03] Israel. [12:04] Tell me about- [12:05] Israel would not exist except for Donald Trump. [12:08] Because we went in with those beautiful B-2 bombers more than a year ago, [12:13] and we hit the three sites at the time. [12:15] But on Israel, do you have regrets about the decision to help the Israelis do decapitation [12:22] strikes on a round? [12:23] Because that changed the Iranian regime, and it seems like it made them escalate. [12:27] You could have just kept hitting the nuclear facilities, right? [12:30] Yeah, you could have done that. [12:31] But we had people that would have gone further. [12:35] We decapitated their nuclear arsenal. [12:37] Look, I deal with these people. [12:39] I deal with a lot of people. [12:40] And that's what I've done my whole life. [12:41] I make deals, and obviously I make good deals because I made a lot of money and I became [12:46] president. [12:47] You know, that's a deal, too. [12:49] One place where the president's deal-making has thus far fallen short is the war between [12:54] Russia and Ukraine. [12:56] Our interview came just days before Ukrainian, Russian, and American delegations were scheduled [13:01] to meet in Abu Dhabi for the first time since February. [13:05] You came into office promising to make peace in Ukraine. [13:07] Yeah. [13:08] There was still a war going on. [13:09] What's the biggest obstacle to peace? [13:11] It was the hatred between Zelensky and Putin. [13:15] If I had been president, that war would have never started, zero chance. [13:19] But it did start. [13:20] So I inherited that war. [13:22] I believe we're very close to making a deal. [13:24] Who do you trust more, President Putin or President Zelensky? [13:26] Well, I'd rather not say. [13:28] But I get along with both. [13:30] I believe that that war is going to end and it's going to end soon. [13:33] And the only reason it's going to end is because of me. [13:35] There is tremendous hatred between President Putin and President Zelensky. [13:40] And, you know, I— [13:41] Isn't it more understandable coming from President Zelensky, given that his country [13:44] was actually invaded? [13:45] Well, it is. [13:46] But when they had their first meeting, there was great disrespect shown to Russia. [13:51] So I'm not going to say anything. [13:52] I mean, but balancing out. [13:53] Well— [13:54] Invading. [13:55] Disrespecting. [13:56] Let's put it this way. [13:57] The war never happened during my four years and it was never going to happen, even though [14:00] it was the apple of President Putin's eye. [14:02] Do you think he is stringing you along? [14:03] Oh, I don't think so. [14:04] Because you've been saying over and over you're going to make peace. [14:08] And it just seems like he's the obstacle in the end. [14:11] Well, there's been nobody that's been tougher on Russia than me. [14:14] Look at our trade. [14:15] What have I done to them on trade with the sanctions and everything else? [14:18] You've gone back and forth. [14:19] At some point, you have done lots of things, big things, in support of Ukraine. [14:23] But just recently, you lifted diesel sanctions on Russia. [14:27] Like you've done various things to take pressure off Russia. [14:29] I didn't lift diesel sanctions. [14:30] I made it possible for Russia to give, not us, but to the world, thousands and thousands [14:37] of barrels of oil, of diesel, which it needed, didn't do any big favor. [14:43] Would you expect it to all work out with a free and independent Ukraine? [14:46] I think we're going to have it done. [14:47] And I think it's going to happen. [14:48] And they're going to end up with a little bit different shape Ukraine. [14:54] When we come back, we talk with President Trump about his potential successors. [14:59] Why he's bullish on AI and intrigued by UFOs. [15:03] We also ask him about allegations of corruption. [15:15] President Donald Trump has been the dominant figure in American politics for a decade. [15:19] But now, his time is running out. [15:23] In the next two years, Mr. Trump will need to decide whether to endorse a successor. [15:28] He'll have to deal with accusations of corruption, a major concern for midterm voters, over wealth [15:34] he piled up during his time in office. [15:37] He will make consequential decisions about artificial intelligence amid fears that AI threatens the [15:43] future of the human race. [15:45] All of this in the shadow of the 80-year-old president's own mortality. [15:51] In two years, someone else is going to be the Republican nominee for president. [15:56] I assume you're going to endorse someone for that. [15:59] Probably, not necessarily. [16:00] Not necessarily? [16:01] What would make you, what are you thinking about when you decide whether or not to endorse someone? [16:06] We have a tremendous bench. [16:07] I mean, I have so many people that I have great relationships with and, you know, not necessarily. [16:13] Who would be on the list besides the vice president? [16:16] Well, I think Marco's great. [16:19] Is he staying, by the way, as Secretary of State? [16:21] I think so. [16:22] I mean, he certainly loves it, and he's doing great. [16:24] He's doing a fantastic job. [16:26] The ones they think about, but there are many others, and I'd rather not mention their names. [16:30] There's some senators that are excellent. [16:32] I know them all. [16:33] I like them a lot. [16:34] So I may or may not get involved. [16:36] I don't know. [16:37] Maybe I'm better off not getting involved. [16:39] Do you think you can have MAGA without you as the leader? [16:43] I think so, because MAGA is basically common sense. [16:46] You know, MAGA's strong borders, good military. [16:49] We have created wealth at a level that our country has never seen before. [16:54] Including for yourself. [16:56] There's a Forbes story that said that your net worth, [16:59] maybe it's changed with the stock market recently, [17:01] but your net worth went up by three billion dollars. [17:04] Well, so did everyone. [17:05] Since you, since you returned to- [17:06] Okay, you ready? [17:07] So here's- [17:07] Everyone's, my net worth did not go up by three billion dollars. [17:10] Well, you should have had stock. [17:11] I, I should have- [17:13] You should have had stock. [17:14] I should have had stock. [17:15] Excuse me. [17:16] So, how did, how did, how did, how did it go up by three billion? [17:19] Well, let me explain. [17:20] I devote almost no time to my net worth. [17:22] I don't care. [17:23] I make, I have a lot of money and far more than I ever thought I'd have. [17:27] And I guess it's gone up. [17:29] I don't even know. [17:31] I have a son who's a very straight, good guy. [17:36] He watches over money. [17:38] I don't even talk to him about it. [17:39] He watches, he gives, they gave my money. [17:42] I have a lot of cash. [17:42] I've had a lot of cash long before I came in here. [17:45] I don't take a salary, you know? [17:46] Do you know I'm the only, supposedly, I don't know if that's right. [17:49] It's very generous of you to the American taxpayer. [17:51] I am the only, I am the only president that didn't take, [17:54] every other president took their salary. [17:56] But this is, all right, here's, here's what I want to understand. [17:58] So, your son manages or helps manage a cryptocurrency company [18:03] called World Liberty Financial. [18:06] Which son are we talking about? [18:06] You are a co-owner of that company. [18:09] That's correct. [18:09] That's correct, right? [18:11] This company is also partially owned by investors connected to the government of the United Arab [18:17] Emirates. [18:18] I think if I told you that story, and it was about the Biden family, if I said, [18:22] Joe Biden is the part owner of a company, and it has all of these investments from the Middle East, [18:28] you would say that sounds corrupt, right? [18:31] Well, he did have a lot of different things. [18:33] Sure, but you, but why is it different? [18:36] Well, here's, I'll tell you why. [18:37] Because I know nothing about it. [18:39] But why do you need? [18:39] I made a lot of money before. [18:41] But then why do you need the money? [18:42] Why not just divest, walk away? [18:44] I do. [18:45] Look, most of my money, most of my money is in, is given to the biggest firms on Wall Street [18:52] to invest in their index funds. [18:54] Yeah. [18:54] So it came out that I traded like 40,000 stocks. [18:58] So among the stocks would be like, they'd have a tiny little amount. [19:03] It's billions of dollars. [19:04] Right. [19:04] It's billions. [19:05] I understand that, but companies that are invested in by [19:10] people in foreign countries, it seems like you could just walk away from that. [19:13] And then, you know, and then you would not be accused of corruption. [19:17] I have, but you have sons where they go around and they build buildings. [19:21] That's what they do. [19:22] That's what I did long before I became president. [19:24] I did it better than anybody. [19:26] I was very good at real estate. [19:27] I made a lot of money, but I have a company. [19:30] My sons are in the company. [19:31] It's hard to say to them, don't do anything anymore for four years because I'm president. [19:38] But you could divest from the company yourself and let them do whatever they want. [19:42] That's all. [19:42] Well, but how do we? [19:43] You're not like sitting in the Oval Office thinking, [19:45] thank God I have that 50 million in World Liberty Financial, right? [19:47] You're right, but how do you divest from cash? [19:49] So I took a lot of heat because I think they traded like 50,000 stock, [19:54] because that's what they do. [19:55] It's all computer generated. [19:57] I have no idea what the hell they're buying. [19:59] Do you think the people who are investing in the company that you co-own with your sons, [20:06] who are coming from foreign countries, who want things from your government, [20:09] don't you think they think that they are buying influence? [20:11] I don't know, but that's true. [20:14] Look, every president has a problem. [20:16] You have people, and they work for you. [20:19] And guys like you cover them, and you do profiles on them, [20:22] and they become like everybody thinks that Trump loves them and everything else, [20:26] which in some cases is true, and some cases are not. [20:29] This is true for every president, going back to George Washington. [20:32] Yes, every president has not owned a cryptocurrency company, however. [20:36] But they owned something, whatever crypto was at the time, okay? [20:39] You know, there's crypto, and before that there was oil. [20:41] And every president has had this problem. [20:45] So you have a guy, a trusted aide, everything's good. [20:47] And then the trusted aide says, sir, I love you so much, and I'll be leaving. [20:52] I said, well, good luck. [20:53] No matter what they do, there's a conflict because the president is all-encompassing, right? [20:58] And this is not me. [21:01] Every president that there's ever been, they have people, many people. [21:05] I watch it all the time. [21:07] Every time you have a president, they're top people. [21:09] Sometimes they stay. [21:10] I mean, I have some that will stay right till the last day. [21:13] But after they leave, they go crazy. [21:16] They go crazy. [21:17] It's true for every president. [21:19] Sometimes they'll leave. [21:19] I feel like there have been more people doing things like that while serving in the administration. [21:25] But listen, I'm a bigger name than other presidents, whether we like it or not. [21:29] There's another one of George Washington. [21:31] That's the place of honor. [21:32] Mr. Trump has adorned the Oval Office with portraits of those other presidents, [21:37] aware that the full history of his own unusual presidency has yet to be written. [21:42] And when it comes to the AI revolution, with its high stakes for jobs, national security, [21:49] and human life itself, some of his most significant choices may still lie ahead. [21:54] I talk to people in Silicon Valley who say that the decisions you make around AI [22:00] are the most important things that you'll be remembered for. [22:02] That's what they think. [22:03] I don't know if that's true. [22:04] But at the same time, there is all of this anxiety and concern. [22:08] You are an AI bull. [22:10] I am. [22:11] What does the average American get out of that technology? [22:14] Excuse me before I answer that. [22:16] The reason I'm an AI bull, one of the reasons, is because President Xi left here two weeks ago. [22:23] We had a great meeting. [22:25] He's all in to SI, as I call it, because it really is superintelligence. [22:30] It's a much better name, I think, because it's not artificial. It's actually super. [22:34] Well, that at least is what they think they're racing towards, yes. [22:38] So we're in a race with China. [22:40] And I've said whoever wins that race wins. [22:43] The level of power of winning that race is very important. [22:47] You had all of the AI tycoons in here. [22:50] Yeah, I did. [22:50] The people in this AI industry, I almost said the superintelligence industry, [22:55] you're working on me, are weird. [22:57] They're strange. They do things like stand outside their company and say, [23:01] Hey, we're creating this amazing company, and there's a 10% chance it kills humanity. [23:06] Like you standing outside a hotel and saying, [23:08] Here's my new hotel, and it might collapse. [23:10] I know, but that's saving from drinking. [23:12] You think that's fake. [23:13] Why are you not worried about the doom fears that the people building it have? [23:19] Because, first of all, because China's going to have it, okay? [23:22] So if we don't have it, China's going to have it. [23:24] That would put us at an unbelievable disadvantage. It's all between us and China. [23:28] Right. [23:28] There's nobody else. [23:29] But so we're racing China, and that makes it worth the risk? [23:32] Or you just think the risk is not real? [23:34] I think that the risk is not nearly as real as they talk. [23:40] And I think the risk can be managed. [23:42] Would you work with the Democrats? [23:44] I would, absolutely. [23:45] I don't mind gut rolls. [23:46] On AI safety. [23:47] I don't mind gut rolls, but I don't want to put us in a deep second position. [23:52] We're leading number one. And China has no guardrails, by the way. So if AI is dangerous... [23:57] Well, they have the guardrails of being a totalitarian state, right? [24:00] They have the guardrails that whatever President Xi says goes. [24:03] Yeah. [24:04] With me, it's pretty strong, but it's not quite that strong. [24:07] We asked the president about one of his more unusual flexes of presidential power, [24:12] on a subject that's captured the public imagination. [24:15] Your administration, alone among modern administrations, [24:20] has spent a lot of time releasing footage of UFOs, unidentified flying objects. [24:27] Is there anything that you have seen, or heard about, or been told about, [24:32] that would lead you to think that there's something more there than just, [24:36] we're having a good time looking at things in the sky? [24:38] It's so amazing that you asked this question, because it is one of the questions in private I get [24:45] asked about. More people ask me about UFOs than, I mean... [24:48] I believe it. [24:49] People, people that you wouldn't think. [24:52] So what's the answer? [24:53] So here's the story. I'm not too much of a believer, but I sat in the Oval Office, [24:59] first term and a little bit second term, meeting with Air Force pilots that are really good, [25:05] solid people. These are not people that you would say are conspiracy theorists, but they're great, [25:10] great pilots. They're the real deal. [25:12] And they've told me things that are very strange. They said that, in certain cases, [25:19] they said, yes, there's something going on out there, because they're flying an F-22, [25:25] which is the best there is, the fastest, the best plane that anyone's ever seen. [25:30] And something goes by them at three times their speed, and it's round. It's not aerodynamic, it's round. [25:37] So that's the mystery. But then along with those pilots, there's a set of people who have styled [25:41] themselves as whistleblowers, who have come out and said, actually, there's also a secret program [25:48] that even presidents don't know about to study this stuff. Have you seen any evidence that that [25:54] is the case? No, and I haven't heard that. But if there is, I'm going to find out about it right [25:57] after this interview. Our last questions were about an even deeper mystery. [26:03] Let's talk about death. You have survived multiple assassination attacks. One came very, [26:08] very close to you. I imagine that that had some kind of effect on how you think about mortality. [26:15] What do you think happens when you die? Well, I hope I missed. [26:20] I mean to you. No, but I really missed. I hope I missed. I don't know. [26:23] I understand. I mean to you. I think I've done a good job. [26:25] What do you think happens to Donald Trump when you die? Not your memory, yourself. [26:30] You mean where I go? Exactly. Well, I'm a religious person. So in theory, [26:34] I go to heaven. Do you think you're going to heaven? [26:37] I hope so. I don't want to go to hell. So I watched you at Charlie Kirk's memorial service. [26:42] Yes. And Erica Kirk, his widow, got up and gave some very moving remarks about Christian [26:48] forgiveness, how you have to forgive your enemies and your opponents. And you followed her. And you [26:54] said, and I know this was a little bit of a joke, but I think facts come through jokes. You said, [27:00] quote, I hate my opponents and I don't want the best for them. Let's say you pass away. You're [27:09] entering the next life. And all you have to do to enter paradise is feel love and forgiveness for [27:19] James Comey, Nancy Pelosi, anyone who you have expressed hate for over the years. Do you think [27:25] you can do it? Well, then I wouldn't be real, would I? I mean, if I said to you, sure, the easy answer to [27:30] that. Oh, yes, I could forgive. No, I don't think it's an easy question at all. I found them to be [27:34] extremely dishonest people, very bad people, very bad for our country. I love our country far more [27:38] than I can love people and people like that. Is the answer no? The answer is no. I want to be honest. [27:44] Before the judgment throne of God. Before the judgment. No, I think they were very bad people. [27:48] And I dislike, I can use the word hate. I do hate some of my enemies. I think they've been terrible. [27:54] Look what they put me through, the weaponization. I got indicted. I got impeached. Mr. President, [27:59] Mr. President, you have had the most charmed and remarkable life of any American in my entire [28:05] lifetime. And you are telling me you couldn't find it in your heart to forgive some of your enemies? [28:11] After all that's been given to you? I mean, it's such an easy answer. All I have to do is say, [28:16] yes, I can. Again, I don't think it's an easy answer. That's why I asked you. [28:20] Can I be honest? I probably cannot do that now because I do hate some of my enemies and I always [28:25] will. Watch the full interview with President Trump on the 60 Minutes YouTube channel. [28:34] Protests are tearing across France. Violence has erupted in its romantic boulevards. [28:50] Looters have invaded the chic boutiques and the scent of warm croissants and fresh baguettes [28:55] has been overwhelmed by the whiff of tear gas. For many across Europe, particularly the young, [29:01] conventional centrist political parties are failing to revive the continent's stagnating economies. [29:08] Support for extremist politicians has risen dramatically. We spent a week in Paris trying [29:14] to understand who and what are driving the demonstrations. And we talked to the leader [29:19] of France's populist anti-immigration party, who now months away from crucial elections, [29:24] could benefit from the strife in the streets. [29:28] They used to call Paris la ville de l'amour, the city of love. But there hasn't been much [29:36] amour on show lately. For weeks, France has been in turmoil. 2,500 businesses have been damaged, [29:47] more than 1,500 police injured, and the bill for damage to property is said to have climbed to more [29:54] than a billion dollars. This nation is used to street protest, but the French have been jolted by the [30:01] violence and bewildered by their government's failure to get the chaos under control. Now, [30:07] more and more voters are turning to a political alternative that, for decades past, they regarded [30:13] as beyond the pale. [30:14] I have a simple rule. If you don't stop criminals, they won't stop. That's it. [30:20] Marine Le Pen is easily the best-known face of right-wing populism in Europe. She's the long-time [30:29] leader of the national rally party, and now the favorite, after three failed attempts, [30:34] to win the keys to France's presidential palace next April. Since the protests began, [30:40] Le Pen's popularity has risen. What is happening in Europe? Has politics here just become more radical? [30:49] What is the explanation for that and your own rising popularity? [30:54] The extreme left creates chaos. They generate violence against people, [31:00] against the police, against public property. It's the same phenomenon all over. [31:05] Le Pen and the protesters may be political opposites, but both agree on one thing. [31:11] The way that France has done politics for the past few decades has failed. [31:15] It has to be said that a number of the high school students' demands are perfectly worth listening to, [31:23] but that does not justify allowing people with violent urges to act out. [31:29] The turmoil didn't start here in the city, but back in mid-September, [31:34] in a quiet, working-class suburb, home to many immigrant families, [31:39] the cause here a dilapidated school and a shortage of teachers. [31:44] Now, I think a lot of students are angry because, like, an example, I want to go to the bathroom, [31:50] and I say there's no toilet paper anywhere, and I'm just pissed off. [31:53] Can I say it? [31:55] You can say whatever you like. [31:56] OK, I'm sorry. [31:57] MALYA GUERIN JOINED AN EARLY MORNING DEMONSTRATION AT HER HIGH SCHOOL ON THE EDGE OF PARIS. [32:04] Naturally, the students captured the protest on their phones. [32:07] MALYA GUERIN JOINED AN EARLY MORNING DEMONSTRATION AT HER HIGH SCHOOL ON THE EDGE OF PARIS. [32:08] Some people had the idea, like me, to post it on social media, and it came viral. [32:14] And after, we have protests in Paris, Marseille, Lyon, a lot of big cities in France. [32:21] The students at Saint-Ex never imagined that they'd become the spark that lit a fire across the nation. [32:28] Within weeks, the demonstrations were drawing half a million people. [32:32] Parents came out to back their sons and daughters, workers to protest the cost of living, [32:39] and black and Arab youth frustrated at job discrimination. [32:43] Let's stop police! [32:44] What started as a campaign for better funding of education has broadened into a wider protest [32:51] about economic inequality. [32:56] Jack, tell us in English what they're chanting. [33:00] They're saying there's money in the billionaire's pockets, in the bosses' pockets, in big corporations' pockets. [33:06] Much of the animosity focuses on France's president. [33:10] The problem is the government. Macron is the worst president we had since a lot of time. [33:17] Elected nearly ten years ago, Emmanuel Macron seemed like a fresh face, promising centrist leadership. [33:24] A decade later, he's a lame duck who voters think has left France with too many bills and too little money. [33:32] Many of the young activists see France's salvation in this man, Jean-Luc Mélenchon, a 75-year-old former communist. [33:41] He declined our request for an interview, but his supporters say that only he stands between them [33:48] and what they would call a right-wing tyranny. [33:52] I am... [33:56] France are not for fascism. [33:57] And I'm here because everything is f***ed up right now. [34:01] Fascism is here. [34:02] You said fascism is here in France, but you're going to vote for a new president. [34:08] That's your democracy. [34:09] No, this is not how it works, democracy. [34:12] Democracy, this is the vote, because when it's unfair, you have to fight. [34:17] I was here 20 years ago when young people from the poverty-stricken Paris suburbs were setting cars [34:24] alight. [34:24] They were angry about job discrimination, about the treatment of minority communities by the police. [34:31] These latest demonstrations feel very different to me, but they become much broader, more political. [34:38] People are talking about inequality, about the failures of capitalism. [34:42] And there's even a very small minority that appears to believe that before you can build a better [34:48] society, you need to smash this one apart. And I mean that literally. [34:55] Exactly a month after the first school protests on October 17th, all hell broke loose across France. [35:03] Arsonists in the city of Limoges set fire to its iconic town hall, which first opened its doors on [35:10] Bastille Day in 1883. The inferno obliterated more than a century of local history in a single night. [35:20] That same day, 250 miles away in Paris, Jemima Sheila's bakery had been ransacked by looters. [35:31] The emotions I felt last Saturday still bring tears to my eyes. [35:35] Sheila immigrated to France from the war-torn Democratic Republic of the Congo as a nine-year-old, [35:41] and created her successful bakery business with her husband. She now employs dozens of people. [35:48] What does it cost you? [35:51] It has cost me five years of hard work. It has cost me the time I couldn't spend with my children. [35:57] But what it's costing me today? It's having to ask myself, [36:00] if I do start again, will it last? How long before it happens again? [36:06] As always in France, the arguments have been passionate. [36:09] Sheila clashed with a student activist on primetime TV. The confrontation went viral. [36:15] The system we're in is literally burning our planet, is burning our home, is killing so many people. [36:23] 22-year-old Lola Fleur Whittaker is half British, half French, and hell-bent on ending capitalism. [36:32] Whittaker was accused of playing down the destruction by the looters. [36:36] I mean, sure, let's just say how bad it is to break a window, but that's just not going to solve any issue. [36:40] That's just not going to help anyone. [36:41] You met this lady, Jimmy. [36:43] Yeah. [36:44] I don't think you attacked her shop, but what would you say to the people who did attack her shop? [36:50] I don't... I don't think those people would... I mean... [36:53] But you would say they're wrong, wouldn't you? [36:55] Yeah, sure. Let's say they're wrong. I mean, we live in a society where we walk past people [37:00] every day that are just sleeping outside, and that doesn't shock anyone. However, [37:06] a shop being, you know, looted and stuff, that's really shocking. And I don't think that's really bad. [37:11] The person most likely to gain from the strife in the streets is Marine Le Pen. [37:18] Her analysis of France's social and economic problems is very different, and so are her answers. [37:25] Today, France is facing very serious difficulties. We're at a point where all the bills are coming due at once. [37:34] In 2011, Le Pen took over leadership of what was then a fringe movement from her father, [37:39] a tough army veteran, convicted and fined for Holocaust denial and hate speech. [37:44] Four years later, in a spectacular display of ruthlessness, [37:48] she ejected him from the party he had founded. [37:52] The aim was to rid the movement of the stain of bigotry. [37:56] I talked to many of the young people on these demonstrations, and I heard again and again that [38:04] what they fear is fascism in France. And it's clear to me that when they spoke about fascism, [38:13] they were talking about you. Are you a fascist? [38:19] No, absolutely not. We support political pluralism. [38:23] There is no element of fascism in our political program. [38:26] Her opponents thought Le Pen's conviction last year for embezzlement [38:30] would dent her popularity. It has not. [38:36] I am innocent. That's why I have taken the case to France's highest court. [38:40] The legal setback has not changed Le Pen's essential message of the past 20 years, [38:45] about what is wrong with France. [38:47] When you take in too many immigrants, you create the conditions for destabilizing your society. [38:55] And that is what has happened in France. [38:57] And she says too many immigrants are too reliant on welfare. [39:02] There is another problem, a problem of numbers. The unemployment rate among foreigners in France is [39:10] twice the unemployment rate among French citizens. We can no longer import unemployed people. [39:16] If I go and talk to people in those immigrant communities, [39:20] they will say that is because of discrimination in France. [39:25] No, that doesn't exist. You're not going to import those ideas here. [39:29] There is no discrimination in France? [39:33] No, there is no discrimination in France, sir. It's not true. And I'll go even further. It's the least racist. [39:39] France is the least racist country in the world? [39:42] Yes, yes, I'm telling you. The British, the Americans, the Canadians? [39:47] Yes, yes. Le Pen's finger-pointing at immigrants is echoed by rising populist leaders across Europe. [39:55] In the Netherlands, in Germany, in Britain, in Sweden and in Italy. [40:03] Your world approaches immigration through integration. [40:06] We believe someone who comes to immigrate to our country must blend into the national community. [40:12] You have something more like a layered cake. Each community can live alongside the others while [40:17] keeping its own customs. That is not how we see things. [40:21] And would a President Le Pen say to those people that you feel aren't adopting the French way, [40:31] it's time for you to go back where you came from, what people now call re-migration. [40:39] If someone comes and says, I hate you, I despise your culture, I don't want to respect your laws, [40:45] well, we say to him, listen, sir, the door is wide open. And we might even, for that matter, force you to leave. [40:52] It's a startling proposal, which critics will say could amount to deportation of legal immigrants. [41:00] But Marine Le Pen wears the smile of a woman within touching distance of the keys to the Elysee Palace. [41:06] And ironically, they could be handed to her by her harshest opponents. [41:12] 20 years ago, people would talk about you and your party as extremists. [41:20] Something's changed here. And I guess what I'm wondering is, is it the French people, [41:26] or is it you have changed, maybe changed away from your original principles? [41:36] I will not allow people to say that France has become extremist. Over time, [41:40] French people have got to know me. Has France changed? I think it's the end of a chapter. [41:46] It's the end of a world, a world built on unrestrained globalization. We've been seeing [41:52] the great return of nations for several years now, and I think that's a good thing. [42:05] The last minute of 60 Minutes is sponsored by UnitedHealthcare Medicare Plans, [42:10] a Medicare experience designed for what's next. [42:16] This week after the midterms, a bipartisan issue Democrats and Republicans will have to face. [42:22] A scourge that kills one American every 15 minutes and is the leading cause of death among adults ages 18 [42:29] to 45. We speak of synthetic opioids, what the U.S. Drug Enforcement Agency calls [42:35] the greatest and deadliest drug threat the country has ever faced. [42:39] There are so many versions of these lethal opioids emerging and poisoning Americans. [42:44] In the ongoing cat and mouse game, it's hard for law enforcement to keep up. [42:49] And we were also stunned to find there are legal addictive opioids, often marketed as natural [42:54] supplements, for sale at your gas station, smoke shop and convenience store. [42:59] 60 Minutes undertook a months-long investigation into the latest front in America's persistent opioid crisis. [43:06] The results of that investigation? A two-part report beginning next week you won't want to miss. [43:11] I'm John Wertheim. We'll be back next Sunday with another edition of 60 Minutes.