About this transcript: This is a full AI-generated transcript of Collin Gosselin exposes the truth about mom Kate FULL INTERVIEW — The US Sun from The US Sun News, published July 1, 2026. The transcript contains 13,879 words with timestamps and was generated using Whisper AI.
"Your mom has returned to social media after years of living this very reclusive life. Could you tell us a little bit about why you think she's finally sharing her life with her followers? I guess the first thing I do want to say, like I'll start by saying this, is I'm not here to cause any trouble."
[0:00] Your mom has returned to social media after years of living this very reclusive life.
[0:04] Could you tell us a little bit about why you think she's finally sharing her life with her followers?
[0:08] I guess the first thing I do want to say, like I'll start by saying this, is I'm not here to cause any trouble.
[0:14] People love to be in my comments on social media saying like, oh, you know, if you're trying to get close to your siblings, why are you doing things like this?
[0:21] Why are you releasing stuff like this?
[0:23] I am just in pursuit of the truth.
[0:25] I think that anything that I'm releasing directly pertains to them.
[0:28] So I think if it's a truth for me and it pertains to me, then it obviously pertains to them.
[0:32] Financial documents in specific.
[0:34] That's what I'm talking about.
[0:36] So her return to social media, I don't really know.
[0:39] I mean, maybe it's to make money.
[0:40] Maybe it's like her trying to redeem herself or act reform, just something like that.
[0:44] And I can absolutely say, knowing my mother, I think she's mellowed out with age.
[0:50] But I think just because we slow down and we're like mellowed out, I guess you could say, I think that she still has the same ulterior motives.
[1:00] And, you know, since her return, everybody has just seen her as like reformed.
[1:03] And oh, like, I think they're just buying right into what she's doing, eating it up, per se.
[1:08] They're really people just think she's a completely different person.
[1:12] And, you know, that it may be that on the outside, but we have to look on the inside, you know, so.
[1:18] She revealed over TikTok that she's been dating someone for a little over a year.
[1:22] She said she has known him for a really long time.
[1:24] Is this Steve?
[1:26] I absolutely believe it is Steve.
[1:28] Even before any articles came out, I always had information pertaining to her relationship with him.
[1:33] However, I always believe that advocating for abuse and things that went on in the home and just any bad things that come from reality TV,
[1:41] I always believe that those were higher on the list of priority versus talking about her relationship with him.
[1:46] However, when it does pertain to it being cheating, I think that's a different story that should be put out there.
[1:53] I do not condone cheating.
[1:55] I do not appreciate it.
[1:56] I'm just very disappointed in my mother, especially since I believe Steve was divorced from his wife, Gina, about two years ago.
[2:02] We did know Gina and his two kids, Chris and Mike.
[2:04] We knew them.
[2:06] She actually brought me and my siblings to one of his kids' graduations, which is a little bit strange.
[2:11] If you ask me, looking back at the moment, I didn't think much of it since, you know, he was always very close with her.
[2:18] But, yeah, it is absolutely him.
[2:20] And my only thing is that I can see her playing this off, it being somebody else magically, like some pawn prop man or something,
[2:28] or her saying, oh, you know, well, this really did just start, you know, about 15 months ago when, you know, there were the signs were always there.
[2:35] Pictures, people would see them out in Berks County together.
[2:38] I mean, we have pictures of them in North Carolina together.
[2:42] We also have his home address registered to her home in Warnersville.
[2:47] So even before she moved to North Carolina, his address was registered to Warnersville.
[2:52] And actually, my sister, Hannah, has spoken to me and my dad about him actually living in the home.
[2:57] I remember he used to stay over here and there, like, some nights, maybe if it was, like, before vacation or something like that,
[3:03] or we'd leave the home and he'd be coming with us.
[3:06] However, it was later on that Hannah revealed that he was, like, literally living at the house with them.
[3:11] So, and she did go and visit my mom a few times in North Carolina, and he's been there.
[3:15] So, you know, that looks how it looks, right?
[3:18] He was living in the Pennsylvania home, the one by your mom's?
[3:22] In Warnersville.
[3:22] His address, his home address was registered to Hefner Road.
[3:26] So, you know, that speaks for itself.
[3:28] Did you know your mom was having, you were young, but did you, looking back,
[3:33] did you know something odd was going on with your mom and Steve while she was married to your father?
[3:37] So when we would go on vacation, she was always very close with him,
[3:40] like, whether that was in the bus or in the limousines or anything like that.
[3:44] And that was in front of all my siblings.
[3:46] However, later on, my mom would start to keep me in the hotel room with her,
[3:50] either in a connected room or in a hotel room on a cot, on, like, those rollout cots.
[3:55] It would be my two brothers, and they would be in, like, a room with Kara,
[3:59] who usually stayed with, like, the boys.
[4:00] And then Maddie would be with, like, the little girls, like my sisters my age.
[4:05] And then we would have another room with my mom, and she would keep me with her.
[4:09] And like I have spoken on before, that was her attempt to keep me separate from my siblings
[4:14] or maybe keep an eye on me or whatever it was.
[4:17] But Steve was always very, like, he would come in the room and be very close with her,
[4:21] very touchy, and with me right there.
[4:23] And she would either keep me there or in a connected room.
[4:26] And I do remember in Mexico, I was in a connected room,
[4:29] and he stayed in the same hotel room as her.
[4:31] So this was not news to me.
[4:33] There also was another bodyguard that was hired on for Mexico,
[4:36] and I think he was local, native to Mexico.
[4:40] And she would actually keep me back with him so that Steve could go out with them and do whatever.
[4:46] Or if the kids stay with the babysitters, she would go out with Steve.
[4:50] So this was nothing new to me.
[4:52] When was Mexico?
[4:53] I don't remember the exact year.
[4:55] Was your mom the dad?
[4:56] Were they still?
[4:56] No, no, no, no.
[4:57] This was afterwards, yeah.
[4:59] This was after.
[5:01] Yeah, I want to say I was maybe 10, 11 maybe at the time.
[5:06] It was my mom's 40th birthday.
[5:08] So, you know, I don't like to talk about age, but if you do the math, then it's there, you know.
[5:13] How long do you think they've actually been dating for?
[5:16] Do you believe it's been a year?
[5:18] I do not believe it's been a year.
[5:20] They were always very close.
[5:22] And, like, the signs were there of romantic involvement or an affair because things were always very shady.
[5:29] So I don't buy the, oh, it's been a year.
[5:32] I mean, maybe she's okay talking about it now, especially since Steve's divorced with his wife.
[5:38] And mind you, I'm not here to slander Steve.
[5:40] I actually do want to put a good point in here that oftentimes when Steve would come on vacations with us, I actually felt very safe because he used to actually defend me against her.
[5:48] In the sense that my mom always treated me very differently than my siblings and anybody could see that.
[5:55] Anybody that she was comfortable doing that around.
[5:57] And oftentimes on vacations, it was nice having Steve there because he would literally defend me and tell her, like, stop, like, stop.
[6:03] Like, why are you?
[6:04] He would literally, that was his thing, like, stop, stop.
[6:06] Like, why?
[6:06] Like, why are you treating Colin that way?
[6:08] Because she completely treated me differently than my siblings.
[6:10] So I'm not here to slander him.
[6:12] I don't even really want to talk about his family much or his divorce.
[6:15] That is his own matter.
[6:17] However, where it involves a party, being married, and then having an affair, that's where I don't really appreciate it.
[6:24] And it disappoints me a little bit, a lot, actually.
[6:28] So my afterthought to that was, like, obviously my dad doesn't like Steve at all and he has his own reasons.
[6:33] But, you know, I'm not hopping on anybody's bandwagon.
[6:36] Steve did defend me against my mom plenty of times where he would literally tell her to stop.
[6:41] Like, because she treated me very differently than my siblings and would just pit me out, especially on vacations when he was, like, there for every second of everything.
[6:49] Um, so, you know, I'm not here to just hop on the bandwagon against Steve.
[6:53] He was defensive towards me, you know, with my mom involved, so.
[6:57] Do you feel comfortable sharing maybe an example of how he defended you?
[7:01] Well, like I said, he would tell her to stop or, like, if she was trying to, like, separate me from my siblings, like, drag me by my arm or my ear or whatever, he would, like, tell her to stop.
[7:09] And he, like, it was vacations that I think he realized, like, we were kids, too.
[7:14] Like, we're going on vacation.
[7:15] We just want to have fun.
[7:16] But everything was an itinerary for my mom.
[7:18] Um, even a vacation was a schedule and it had to be, like, to, to, everything was, even at home.
[7:23] But vacations, we were filming and, like, you know, production paid for the vacation.
[7:27] So, I guess everything had to be stuck to an itinerary.
[7:30] Um, but yeah, he, like, I actually really could say I like the guy I do.
[7:34] And I haven't seen him since then, but my last memories are of him defending me against her.
[7:38] So, I have nothing bad to say about him.
[7:41] Um, and I will not speak on his family too, too much either.
[7:44] So, in your last interview with us, you had spoken about your mom, the restraining with his upties and stuff.
[7:50] Yes.
[7:51] Um, was Steve around at that time?
[7:53] And did he, was that something that he did?
[7:54] He was not there that day.
[7:55] Um, and the staple in that day was that, that's the day that she took me away to the hospital.
[8:01] Um, like, the day that she literally got me out of the house.
[8:04] Um, she had her ambulance friends come pick me up.
[8:06] But I'm not going to talk much on that because I'm putting all of this in a tell-all that I'm writing right now.
[8:10] And we will be going into detail on every single thing.
[8:12] So, um, however, speaking on the topic of zip ties, if I may add a thought.
[8:17] Um, I know you're probably going to ask about this.
[8:19] But I did just say on social media that I would like to invite my mom to do a lie detector test.
[8:24] And that would be one of the questions.
[8:25] Mom, if you're listening to this, um, we would ask about the zip ties.
[8:29] And, um, I would also ask, I would also let her ask questions like,
[8:32] Were you ever violent towards your siblings?
[8:34] Did you ever put your hands in your siblings?
[8:35] Stuff like that.
[8:36] I want to get into everything.
[8:37] And this is where we are both hooked up to lie detectors.
[8:40] Heart monitors, everything.
[8:42] I mean, they test for everything.
[8:43] And we can either ask each other questions or we can have an interviewer ask us questions.
[8:47] And, um, that to me is, uh, is just basically saying, like, for so long,
[8:52] she's been putting on this facade to the media.
[8:55] I mean, even before TikTok.
[8:56] Um, and for me, I have nothing to hide.
[8:59] I want to ask her these questions.
[9:01] We can even do a live stream, too.
[9:04] I want these questions to be put out there.
[9:05] I want us to be hooked up to a machine that can catch any ifs, ands, buts, faults, lies, anything.
[9:11] I mean, I want the truth to be told.
[9:12] I always say there's the truth and then there's the truth from Kate Gosselin's point of view.
[9:16] So, um, let's just put it all out there.
[9:19] This is my formal invitation to her.
[9:21] What else do you want to ask her and lie detector?
[9:23] So first things, I definitely want to address the zip ties because people love to say,
[9:26] oh, like he's lying about abuse, which I want to say that's the main problem.
[9:30] When kids come forward about abuse, when we call them liars, when we try to shut them down,
[9:34] when we try to muffle their voices, this is the problem.
[9:37] And mind you, I will do this.
[9:39] I will fight this fight every single day.
[9:41] People can go on social media and say that whatever, this and that, they can call me names,
[9:45] but I'm an advocate for those children.
[9:47] And even grown adults who are still in my comments telling me, like, I'm 50-something years old
[9:52] and I still struggle with these things.
[9:54] I'm a voice for them and people can hate on me all day long.
[9:57] And it's a very small majority that are saying these things, but, you know,
[10:01] you can try to discredit me, but I will be that voice and I will be the advocate.
[10:06] So first things we would ask about that,
[10:07] I want her to ask me about the violence that she claims I had against my siblings
[10:10] and my dangerous and violent tendencies.
[10:12] Let's ask about that.
[10:14] And then another thing, fiscal matters, so any financial matters.
[10:16] I want to ask about where all the money disappeared in the court documents that I've been reading.
[10:20] And yes, I'm an adult now.
[10:21] I'm going to do my own research.
[10:23] Everybody loves to say, oh, this was definitely John behind this.
[10:25] It was definitely John behind this.
[10:26] I'm an adult now.
[10:27] When these documents have my name on them and my sibling's name on them,
[10:31] I will find and justify the means of their money and my money.
[10:35] And we will find the truth.
[10:36] So on the live detector, I would love to ask her about all these financial matters.
[10:42] So I'm sure she's going to watch this and be a little bit scared,
[10:45] but let's just put it all out there.
[10:46] I don't have anything to lose.
[10:47] I know you do.
[10:48] So let's put it out there.
[10:50] You mentioned the trust funds.
[10:51] I know that there was, she admitted taking money from the trust fund.
[10:55] Yes.
[10:55] Did you get anything from the show?
[10:56] Um, she took a lot of money from a portion that was, so basically all the money was collected.
[11:02] It was like all the siblings were supposed to receive money out of a collective fund.
[11:08] Um, and I, I don't want to say exactly how much it was, but then we saw in court that a lot was taken and they received some.
[11:16] Um, and, um, I received a small portion that was like signed out on my name, but I can tell you that it was close to nothing because she took so much from it.
[11:25] And I do have court documents for that.
[11:26] And I would like to release those too.
[11:28] Um, however, I'm getting flack for already wanting to do that.
[11:31] So, but in my theory, it was a collective, like fund for all eight of us.
[11:38] And she portioned out to the kids who live with her, like a lot of money, like a lot, a lot.
[11:43] And then gave me, I don't know how Hannah works because Hannah still talks to her, but I think she just threw me like scraps in return.
[11:51] So, yeah.
[11:53] Do you think she'll ever, I mean, she has to be making money now on TikTok, right?
[11:56] Like she's getting back on social media.
[11:58] Do you think she'd ever give you money that you deserve?
[12:02] I think, I don't think any money that she's like positively earning.
[12:06] Um, but there's probably money that's still owed in my name.
[12:10] Um, and from what I received to put in proportion or to put in perspective, like that helped me with my first year of college.
[12:18] Um, and my second year of college, good news, I received scholarships for having a very good GPA.
[12:24] Um, and I also wait tables in college full time to now pay for the continuing, like the continuing of my education.
[12:29] So, to put in perspective, I mean, I was thrown about everything I could for my first year of college.
[12:34] And no, I don't go to a private college either.
[12:36] So, don't think it's anything crazy.
[12:40] Um, your dad had mentioned that he had gotten Steve suspended because he was disciplining Maddie.
[12:46] Um, did you ever see Steve as, well, first, do you remember that time where he wasn't with your family?
[12:54] Um, I do not remember a suspension.
[12:56] I was very young and I'm not going to like bandwagon on my dad's memories.
[13:00] I will tell you what I remember.
[13:01] Um, I do remember at a time we had a different bodyguard.
[13:04] His name was Luke.
[13:05] And yes, I remember details.
[13:06] I'm very, I very much get into depth with these things.
[13:09] We had a different bodyguard.
[13:12] I only remember Luke being any other bodyguard that we had.
[13:15] Um, and then there was Cesar in Mexico, but he was like from Mexico.
[13:18] And I don't know how he came to be.
[13:21] Only time we ever saw him in Mexico.
[13:23] Um, but there was a bodyguard, Luke.
[13:25] And that's the only time I remember having a different bodyguard.
[13:27] So, if I can put two nudes together, maybe that was during a suspension.
[13:32] And if that suspension happened like 2009, 2010, that would make sense.
[13:36] Because I think that's remember, that's when I remember Luke being on with the family.
[13:41] So, did you, do you remember how your mom acted in that time?
[13:45] Was she upset?
[13:46] Because you were too young, right?
[13:48] Yeah, I was too young.
[13:48] I'm not going to count on things that I was like, that I don't have memory of.
[13:52] Which I do have memory, memories of things from then.
[13:54] But not everything, obviously.
[13:56] So, did you see Steve as a father figure for you at all?
[14:01] I know you said you felt safe with him.
[14:03] I think, well, he was so close with the family.
[14:06] Um, which, by the way, I mean, bottom line, he was an employee of TLC.
[14:13] Um, so boundaries, professional boundaries need to be set in every scenario.
[14:17] It doesn't matter, TLC or not TLC.
[14:19] However, based on his nature with the family and how he was defensive specifically for me,
[14:26] um, I felt safe with him.
[14:28] I wouldn't say I saw him as a father figure.
[14:30] Um, I mean, he had his own family.
[14:32] But, like, because he was an employee with us, I shouldn't say that I saw him as a father figure.
[14:35] I mean, professional boundaries needed to be set.
[14:38] However, I would say he was defensive in, uh, in my pursuit, so.
[14:44] Were you at the house when he would, when he lived there or would sleep over?
[14:49] Um, I do remember him staying over, whether it was, like, in our basement or, like, I don't know,
[14:55] maybe our family room at one point.
[14:56] We had a couple, we had, like, two living rooms.
[14:58] Um, or if it was, like, the in-law suite above the garage.
[15:00] In-law suite, it was, like, the bedroom and all that.
[15:02] He did stay overnight a few times.
[15:04] Um, however, when he was living with us, registered to the house in Warnersville,
[15:08] I believe that was literally right after the time that I was sent away from the home.
[15:12] Um, and that was on account of something my sister said.
[15:14] And then also, as an adult, like I said, I did my own independent research,
[15:17] and I did find records where his home address was registered to Hefner Road, so.
[15:24] What did you think, as a kid, of this man sleeping in your house?
[15:26] Do you think, were you uncomfortable, if you feel like?
[15:28] Well, to put it in perspective, no other producers, cameramen, audio guys,
[15:33] nobody slept at our house.
[15:34] Nobody.
[15:35] Um, actually, like, my mom didn't even bring, like,
[15:38] even if she went on a date with anybody else, any other man,
[15:40] he never slept at our house.
[15:42] Nobody slept at our house.
[15:43] You know who slept at our house?
[15:44] Andrea, like, the Smiths, the Smith family who were close.
[15:48] Um, I don't even remember babysitters sleeping over.
[15:51] It was really only, like, the close nannies, like Andrea, for instance,
[15:54] or, like, Ashley, something like that.
[15:55] But even, like, one of our babysitters, Judy, like, she never slept over.
[15:57] And she was close to her family.
[15:59] I still talked to her.
[16:00] Um, but no one else slept over.
[16:02] The nannies.
[16:03] And they were all female.
[16:04] See, see the pattern here?
[16:05] So.
[16:07] Do you ever remember your mom being affectionate with him,
[16:09] like, when your dad was still in the picture?
[16:12] Do you remember them kissing?
[16:13] Do you remember them holding hands?
[16:14] Anything?
[16:14] Um, I, like I said, I'm not going to talk on things I, like,
[16:18] don't have a clear account of.
[16:19] However, she went on a lot of, like, business vacations.
[16:23] And it's like, she would go on, like, a vacation with him.
[16:26] And my dad would stay at the house.
[16:28] And what was it for?
[16:30] Because no book was being released.
[16:31] There was no show being filmed.
[16:33] Like, it was nothing.
[16:34] So, you know, I always like to fill in the blanks.
[16:37] And then it happened a lot more afterwards.
[16:38] But even during, when she was still with my dad,
[16:41] they left a lot.
[16:42] And he was with her all the time.
[16:43] I mean, I did a little bit of my own research, like I said again.
[16:46] And I found a lot of pictures of them together and very close.
[16:50] And then, like, at one point I saw a clip where he was more of a consultant to her
[16:55] instead of a bodyguard.
[16:56] And it just gets to a point where we're, like, overstepping professional boundaries.
[17:00] So they were very close.
[17:01] We touched on the family vacations.
[17:05] Was there anything that you wanted to add to that?
[17:08] No, I mean, I don't think I should be in a connected room that she's sharing with a bodyguard.
[17:13] That's disgusting, actually.
[17:14] Sorry.
[17:16] That's just not okay.
[17:17] So, yeah.
[17:19] Well, when they go in the room together at night and, like, I can hear them through the wall.
[17:23] And I'm in a, there's two rooms and there's a door in the middle of them.
[17:26] You know, you can hear what's going on.
[17:28] And he was there.
[17:28] So, that's pretty disgusting.
[17:31] Like, you could have put me in a separate room, not trying to sound, like, stuck up.
[17:36] But, geez, I would have liked my own room at that point.
[17:39] And that was at the 40th.
[17:40] That was after that.
[17:42] Yeah, that was Mexico, yeah.
[17:43] Do you remember her and Steve ever fighting?
[17:45] Do you remember them?
[17:46] They, like, bickered.
[17:48] I mean, how do you imagine, like, a married couple arguing?
[17:50] I tell some of my friends, I'm like, you guys argue like a married couple.
[17:53] It was like that.
[17:54] Like, they bickered.
[17:55] Like, they were obviously very comfortable with each other.
[17:57] It was, like, bickering.
[17:58] And they were very touchy.
[18:00] I even remember when this was when my mom and dad were still together.
[18:03] Like, they were just very touchy.
[18:05] And I don't know if he ever did it in front of my dad.
[18:07] I mean, I wouldn't if somebody was married.
[18:10] I wouldn't be touching up on someone.
[18:12] But they were, like, very, like, touchy-feely.
[18:15] Which, if that's not a sign of, like, romantic feelings, I don't know what is.
[18:19] And at the time, you didn't think anything of it because you were a child, right?
[18:22] Yeah, and I was like, oh, yeah, this guy's here all the time.
[18:24] Whatever.
[18:25] Do you believe they've been dating this entire time?
[18:27] Why are we on TikTok saying it's been a year?
[18:30] I believe that they had romantic feelings and actions were taken back then before the divorce.
[18:37] And then in the heat of the divorce, I believe they probably mellowed things out, slowed them down.
[18:42] And then after the divorce, with this timeline here, that's when I was talking about, like, going to Mexico and then being close.
[18:48] And I think they were okay doing that then because, like, she was done with my dad.
[18:53] But they had to slow the heat down in the moment of the divorce in late 2009.
[19:00] But romantic feelings were definitely there.
[19:02] And I think before any rumors of her having an affair got out, she automatically stapled my dad to being this guy who left his kids and partied and got with all these different women.
[19:12] And then she's always been good at shifting the blame.
[19:14] So that's the picture that you can see.
[19:18] I've been doing a lot of my own research and I've been putting the pieces together.
[19:22] But, yes, I believe there was an affair and then they had to, like, almost cut things off.
[19:27] And then I guess it was all fine and done once they were divorced because she was very touchy and staying in the same bed as him.
[19:32] So, same room, sorry.
[19:33] I don't want to be gross on camera.
[19:35] But, so, yeah.
[19:37] And then why was he living at the address after I was sent away?
[19:41] Because that's now we're, like, following the years up here.
[19:43] And then why was his home there registered at her house in Wernersville?
[19:48] And why is my sister telling me that he lived with them and then all of a sudden he's getting divorced and then now they're together?
[19:55] Do you see what that looks like?
[19:56] It's like she had to wait for all the other boxes to be checked off before she could be public with this.
[20:01] But she'll play this off as it's a different man.
[20:04] It's not Steve.
[20:05] I mean, if you read between the lines, you can see very easily.
[20:09] She forgets that, you know, my mom is very smart.
[20:12] You know, I'm not going to not say she's smart.
[20:14] She's very intelligent.
[20:15] She's very much always a step of everybody else.
[20:17] But she forgets that I'm her son and I can read him between the lines like she does.
[20:21] So, that's one quality I get from her is that I'm able to see things in, what's that, in retrospect or, like, the forethought of things.
[20:34] And I get nothing else from her.
[20:37] I wish I got her ability to cook because I'm a horrible cook.
[20:40] I can't make anything.
[20:42] I can try, but it's not usually good.
[20:44] But, yeah.
[20:45] I don't want to make it sound like I'm like her and I don't want to make it sound like it's a good thing to be like her because, you know, I can never see myself having children.
[20:54] Well, I can never see myself having eight children, but even with any children, I can never see myself pitting one of them out, you know, for whatever reason or ever putting my hands on them.
[21:06] That's not okay.
[21:09] Do you blame him or do you have any, I know you said you liked him, but do you blame him or have any resentment towards him and believe that he caused the divorce man now?
[21:20] Okay, so I don't know if resentment is the right word towards Steve.
[21:25] However, you know, I do not condone cheating and I'll keep saying this.
[21:28] Like, you don't have an affair with a woman whose life, first, who has eight kids, who's married, and then it just makes it completely messy.
[21:35] Like, he should know this as an employee of TLC.
[21:37] You don't do this.
[21:37] I mean, everything is on camera.
[21:39] You just don't do that.
[21:40] Um, so I don't have any resentment towards him besides the fact that he was a married man with two kids and she was a married woman with eight kids.
[21:50] Um, and I guess the word could be resentment.
[21:54] Um, but yeah, that's my thought on that.
[21:56] You just don't do that.
[21:56] It's, it's like two married parties with their own children and that's disgusting, so.
[22:01] If there was no Steve, do you think your parents would have stayed married longer?
[22:05] Probably not.
[22:06] I mean, if you look back at, like, I mean, I think people tend to forget, like, everything is on camera.
[22:12] You can see everything, all the falling out if you really look closely.
[22:16] Um, and if you can see that on camera, imagine how it was off camera.
[22:19] However, people tend to forget all this stuff is on camera and you can see how she treated my father.
[22:25] Um, like, I just watch clips and I'm like, there's just no way I would ever, like, let a woman talk to me like that.
[22:31] And then laugh it off and then playfully hit me.
[22:33] And then, who knows what happens behind closed doors?
[22:36] I don't remember it as a kid.
[22:37] I mean, who knows when it was just my mom and dad having conversations.
[22:40] I, I can imagine how messy that was.
[22:43] Um, but it just made it worse that everything was under a magnifying glass.
[22:48] And who knows, maybe if there was no cameras, maybe she would still be that way towards my dad.
[22:53] I mean, just, I don't know what the word is like.
[22:57] Um, making him feel less of a man, whatever the word for that is.
[23:01] Um, or just less of a parent.
[23:03] I mean, he wanted his kids to have fun.
[23:05] And I, I think she often forgot, like, when she wanted to be in control and kind of hunker down on everything and have things going the right way.
[23:14] I think she tended to forget that, like, my dad, you know, my dad was someone that she could reach out to for help.
[23:19] Um, instead of constantly putting him down and making him want to feel like floating away and leaving the scene and being absent, she should have confided in him for help.
[23:29] I mean, you know, that was your partner.
[23:31] You guys could have talked it over, but instead she put him down so much that he just wanted to be absent.
[23:36] He did not want to be there.
[23:37] You could see, you can see it in his eyes.
[23:39] I mean, watch the show.
[23:39] You can read people's eyes.
[23:41] He, he looked like he felt defeated.
[23:43] And, um, I'm sick of people online.
[23:46] Sorry.
[23:47] I'm sick of people online defending her saying, oh, like she was just stressed out, like just trying to control the situation.
[23:53] Well, that's the thing.
[23:54] Maybe confide in your partner and don't put him down and make him want to leave.
[23:57] Maybe confide in him and become a team and, you know, handle this TV thing together, handle your eight children together.
[24:04] You know, you know, besides the fact of having eight kids, they had this new show going on and I'm sure it was not easy for either of them.
[24:12] They had to find a way to pay the bills.
[24:13] But instead of putting your partner down and just cracking your team apart, why don't you build that team up and confide in each other?
[24:20] And, uh, she often was just quick to put him down instead of trying to build up with him.
[24:25] And that's what I think the problem is.
[24:26] So I think because of that, no, their marriage would not have lasted.
[24:31] TLC protected your mom and Steve a lot.
[24:33] Um, you know, spoke with your dad that there were photos of them that resurfaced.
[24:37] TLC bought them and killed them.
[24:39] Um, they helped your dad be painted as this cheater, this womanizer.
[24:44] Um, what are your thoughts on that?
[24:45] What do you think about, like, the fascination of your dad's character?
[24:48] I think it's absolutely disgusting.
[24:50] Um, I mean, I look back, he received death threats, um, you know, and, and people, because people really thought it was this, right?
[24:59] And the disgusting part about it all is not only did the outside world and the media see this man who cheated and then left his children and killed a show that everybody loved, right?
[25:09] On the inside, we were getting told that our dad abandoned us as well, that he wanted to leave and go party and do this and do that and go get with all these women.
[25:17] And we got that picture as well as kids.
[25:19] And that's the disgusting part of it all.
[25:21] You know, I think in divorce, you should leave, you know, all your mess away from your children, right?
[25:26] And the worst part is not only did the public see it, but we saw it as kids.
[25:29] And that's disgusting.
[25:30] Um, and the biggest part of it all that really disappoints me is that, like always, my mom likes to shift the blame.
[25:37] So, you know, why are we having an affair and then not taking accountability and probably feeling pretty ashamed and having eight kids to have to own that up to?
[25:46] But instead of owning up to it and having to ever tell your kids about it and having to ever tell the world about it, because her image to the world mattered more than her image to her kids, I'm sure.
[25:55] Um, why instead of doing that, why are we shifting the blame and, and, you know, whoever, whatever, why are we pushing the blame to the other side?
[26:04] Um, and she always did that always.
[26:06] So I know you can't speak for your siblings, but why do you, you're obviously upset about this and it's understandable.
[26:13] Why do you think your siblings, I mean, we don't know if they're upset, right?
[26:17] But they saw everything you did.
[26:19] Is it shocking that none of them have spoken out?
[26:22] Absolutely not.
[26:23] It's not shocking.
[26:24] You want to know why I'll tell you because before my mom sent me away and a little bit after the divorce, everything she told us about my dad, I believed it too.
[26:32] So that's the crazy part.
[26:33] It is not shocking that they don't know the truth.
[26:35] It is not shocking that they can't find and build these own viewpoints for themselves and these own perspectives for themselves.
[26:42] It's not shocking at all because I was them too.
[26:45] And I, and thank God I was born stubborn and a little bit, and I could think, and I could really kind of crack down on details and think for myself because I was them at one point.
[26:55] Everything she fed me, everything she told me about my father, I hated him at one point.
[27:00] I hated him.
[27:03] And so I do not blame them.
[27:04] No.
[27:05] So it was just as easy when I was sent out of the house.
[27:09] It was just as easy for her to tell them these lies about me and to believe them.
[27:13] And I put myself right back in that little kid who believed everything my mom told me.
[27:18] And I say, you know what?
[27:19] I don't blame my siblings.
[27:20] However, they can get mad at me all they want, but I'm going to release financial documents.
[27:23] I'm going to release everything so that they at least have the proof to build their own perspective.
[27:29] I'm not going to tell them what to think, and I'm not going to tell the public what to think.
[27:32] But I'm going to release proof that puts everything there so that people can think for themselves.
[27:36] A little off topic, but also on topic.
[27:38] How did you feel when you found out about your parents' divorce?
[27:41] How were you told, and how did you feel?
[27:42] Honestly, I don't remember much.
[27:47] I remember them having an argument.
[27:50] And then I remember my mom being at the house with those kids, and then my dad being at the house with those kids.
[27:55] And every time my mom was there, my dad was away.
[27:58] And every time my dad was there, my mom was away.
[28:00] And then I also remember my dad moved into the apartment above our garage, and he lived up there separately.
[28:06] So those are, like, core, like, physical details that I remember.
[28:11] And then after the fact, like I said, we just got told that my dad left, and he didn't want to be around, and he was out partying, and he was out with all these women, and he was living his life.
[28:21] That's literally what she told us.
[28:22] So, you know, what do you think of that as a kid?
[28:26] And like I said, I believed it for a while, and then I started, you know, and then I considered both sides.
[28:31] And even as a 12-year-old before I was sent away, I could start to consider both sides of things.
[28:36] I really could look at things in retrospect, and I was stubborn enough to question my mom.
[28:41] I questioned her about everything.
[28:43] And that came before the rebellion of me not wanting to be on camera and be a part of her circus.
[28:48] But the questioning came.
[28:50] None of my siblings ever questioned my mom, not even my older sisters.
[28:53] It was me, and I wanted answers as a kid.
[28:56] I literally saw things.
[28:57] I could always step back and see things from outside, and I don't think she liked that.
[29:00] What did you ask or something?
[29:02] Well, I asked her more about my dad.
[29:03] I said, what's really going on?
[29:04] I said, why is daddy gone?
[29:06] I, you know, I asked about everything.
[29:08] I said, I was even curious at one point, like, why we kept filming after my dad left, because the show was always the 10 of us, you know?
[29:15] And I think that questioning led to me later not wanting to be on camera.
[29:19] And, you know, that really killed her.
[29:20] And then at one point, she had to get work permits signed.
[29:22] And I believe so.
[29:24] I don't know what reason it was, whether it was her reputation she was saving by sending me away from the home, or whether it was the fact that maybe it's easier to sign a work permit for seven children that are voluntary instead of seven children that are voluntary and one that's involuntary.
[29:38] So, there's a lot of things to question here.
[29:41] How does it feel to see your dad kind of even decayed all these years, and for you as well, to kind of not have to hold this secret anymore?
[29:49] I don't know if it's, I don't know if it's much relief, because the relief for me comes from the accountability of my mother.
[30:01] And I don't know if I can see her, like, coming out and being accountable for these things.
[30:05] So, even though the truth is out there, and I lived it, and I saw how close and weird it was, that dynamic, that chemistry between them, I think the accountability comes from her end.
[30:18] And I think that's, well, no, I don't.
[30:20] I know the accountability comes from her end, and I think the relief also comes from her accountability.
[30:25] So, I don't know.
[30:26] I have mixed feelings.
[30:27] You know, I'm kind of in the middle on things right now.
[30:30] Are you grateful that Steve was in your life?
[30:34] It sounds crazy.
[30:35] It's like a little bit of a bittersweet thing.
[30:36] It is a bittersweet thing.
[30:39] I'm not grateful, nor do I appreciate the actions of, like I said, cheating or having any type of affair.
[30:47] But I'm grateful in the fact that when he was around, I honestly did feel a little bit safer.
[30:55] Because, you know, she couldn't really, I mean, even as close as she was with him, and she could probably do anything, and it would be fine in his eyes because of how together they were.
[31:03] But I think, in a sense, it was nice that he was there because, I mean, even the slightest little bit of seeing that how she treated me differently than my siblings, I mean, you saw it, and it just caught, it could catch anybody off guard, you know?
[31:18] So it was nice that he was there to kind of separate that.
[31:22] And, yeah, he really did defend me a lot in front of my mom in terms of how she treated me differently from my siblings.
[31:28] So, yeah, you know, it was nice to have him there.
[31:31] Do you think that he lives with, you think he lives with her right now?
[31:34] I can't really speak on this, but what I will say is that I saw pictures of them together in North Carolina walking her dogs.
[31:45] I have literally full pictures of them together.
[31:47] So, and mind you, she hasn't really done anything besides special forces.
[31:53] So if we look at the timeline here, you know, why is he there when she's not working?
[31:57] But even then, why is he out walking the dogs with her, walking one of the dogs, and she's walking one of the dogs?
[32:02] I mean, it just looks a little bit odd, you know?
[32:05] So usually it was, he drives to the house and goes with her to the airport and da-da-da-da-da, so.
[32:12] The photos, were they sent to you? Did you see them on an outlet?
[32:16] I found them somewhere. I did some digging, but, yeah, they weren't sent to me, but I found them, yeah.
[32:22] Did anybody get married? Would you like them to get married? Do you care?
[32:27] I mean, if you get away with something for so long and, you know, you have an affair with somebody and you're just dragging along,
[32:34] I mean, might as well get married to them, right?
[32:35] So, I guess if she comes forward and talks about 2009, I guess 2025 being married to this guy, what doesn't really matter, you know?
[32:44] So I think the big point is 2009 versus, and all the years following up, but I think marriage isn't, I mean,
[32:51] I think in comparison, it doesn't really weigh back to all the other events.
[32:58] So, sure, get married to him if it makes you happy.
[32:59] I feel like Kate blamed many things for destroying the family, right?
[33:05] She blamed, with fathers, cheating and womanizing. I think she blamed you at one point.
[33:10] Oh, yeah. So, in 22 months of me being where she sent me away to, she visited me one time for probably about 20 minutes,
[33:18] and the whole time I was blamed. I mean, mind you, this was about middle point, I think it was about a year of me being there,
[33:23] and the whole time, like, I had these glasses on, and I'm just, like, tears coming down my face.
[33:29] I was overweight, I was sick, they had me on all these medications, and she's sitting there looking at her kid,
[33:34] who was clearly not who he used to be, and, like, sick and just out of it,
[33:40] and she's just telling me that I broke her family, that my siblings want nothing to do with me, all that stuff.
[33:46] So, that really makes me feel good, you know?
[33:49] I mean, knowing that it was, you know, her actions that really did destroy the family, I mean, what do you, like,
[33:57] what do you think of that? Just that she's, it's her.
[34:00] It's an accountability issue at the end of the day.
[34:02] She was always good at making things look like what she wanted them to look like.
[34:06] So, a part of me feels, like, angry about that, because she could always get away with anything.
[34:11] I mean, this, my mother could get away with murder.
[34:14] She could, she's, like I said before, she's very intelligent, very smart.
[34:18] She can play the game.
[34:20] She could get away with murder, literally.
[34:23] So, it frustrates me that, you know, looking back at my younger self,
[34:28] that I was told that I broke our family, and I was, and I was fed all these lies about my dad that I almost believed.
[34:34] And then to find out that all this time, it was her affair.
[34:38] It was her reputation to be saved, which is why I was sent away.
[34:42] It was her telling my siblings all these things about me when, when they were away out of the house.
[34:50] That's when the damage was dealt to me from my mother.
[34:52] So, they weren't even there.
[34:53] And then it frustrates me, because they don't think for themselves how I thought for myself back then.
[34:59] So, think, you know, if you're, if you're being told all these things about your brother,
[35:02] when all you saw was me being withdrawn and sad and whatever,
[35:06] after all the events that occurred when you weren't even in the home.
[35:09] I mean, think about it.
[35:10] She can play any story to anybody, and she was always able to.
[35:14] If you could say something to your mom and Steve today regarding their affair and what they did, what would it be?
[35:19] Do the right thing.
[35:21] Tell the truth.
[35:21] Come clean.
[35:22] If you get married, congratulations.
[35:25] That's good on you, but let's fix the past before we button it all up in flowers and rings, you know?
[35:31] Everyone's, like, so happy for her.
[35:33] How do you feel about the feedback she's getting?
[35:36] People are always going to be ignorant.
[35:39] That's the world we live in.
[35:40] I don't let it get to me.
[35:41] I mean, people are always going to tell me, and they're always going to try to tell other children
[35:45] when they're beat and zip-tied and go into school with the side of their ear purple and report it to their guidance counselor.
[35:51] They're always going to tell these kids that they're wrong for using their voice.
[35:54] And I'm here to tell these kids that they're right for using their voice and to use your voice.
[35:58] And my voice is going to be your voice.
[36:00] So it's just do the right thing, you know?
[36:04] So, you know, that's how I feel.
[36:08] After you came forward with the abuse claims, I believe to our outlet, has your mom made any attempt to reach out to you?
[36:15] Have you tried to reach out to her recently?
[36:17] She has not made any attempt to reach out to me.
[36:19] If I reach out to her, oh, well, actually, if we want to talk about that, I'm never going to go out and say,
[36:24] oh, I'm not going to be petty about it.
[36:26] But, you know, she has me blocked on every platform.
[36:27] So, you know, it makes it real easy for me to reach out to her, you know?
[36:31] I'm sorry.
[36:33] No, it's understandable.
[36:37] That's what she does.
[36:38] If she unblocked you and wanted to have a relationship with you, would you be open to it?
[36:43] What would it take or something?
[36:45] Relationship isn't just saying, oh, hey, let's have a relationship.
[36:47] It is a lot of steps.
[36:48] I mean, there's a lot you need.
[36:50] There's just, it's a lot, any kind of relationship.
[36:52] So I don't see her ever pursuing that, no.
[36:57] I feel like she has so much guilt that weighs on her that I think I'd be a constant reminder
[37:02] that she needs to take accountability for her actions.
[37:04] So I feel like that relationship would have to be after the fact of just her taking accountability.
[37:10] I take accountability.
[37:11] I wasn't a perfect kid.
[37:13] I never want to say I was a perfect kid.
[37:14] But the claims she's made against me are only to fit her narrative.
[37:19] And, you know, if we look beyond them, it's just her trying to fill the gaps.
[37:22] She has a relationship with Hannah after their estrangement.
[37:28] Why do you think, I'm not sure who reached out to Hoot with that one, but why do you think
[37:32] they have?
[37:32] No, absolutely.
[37:33] That's a great question.
[37:35] I think Hannah, she's very, like, sentimental and reminiscent in a way.
[37:41] And I think she wants to still have a piece of that family.
[37:46] And I even look back at it like this.
[37:50] So, like, during my parents' divorce, Hannah was always so much closer with my dad.
[37:54] But I don't even, now that I look at it, I don't think it was that she was closer with
[37:57] my dad.
[37:57] I think it was just that she wanted both of her parents in her life.
[38:01] And it makes a lot of sense.
[38:03] And that literally is normal.
[38:04] That's a normal thing.
[38:05] Kids want that.
[38:07] So the way I look at it is, like, when she was with my mom, still in the home, being fed
[38:13] these things about my dad, I feel like Hannah was always more resistant to those claims.
[38:17] But she wanted a relationship with my dad.
[38:19] And then, you know, she saw some things go on in the home that made her want to leave
[38:24] and live with my dad.
[38:25] And now that she's with my dad and she knows that my dad loves her and, you know, he's
[38:29] never going to leave her or throw her out on a limb or anything like that, I think she
[38:33] wants to now fix that relationship with my mom.
[38:36] And what hurts me on that is that Hannah wants to fix the relationship with my mom.
[38:41] Hannah wants to get into the emotional and the feelings parts of it because she cares
[38:44] about people.
[38:45] But for my mom, it's going on social media.
[38:47] It's going on TikTok and saying, oh, I just talked to Hannah today.
[38:50] Every little thing she's trying to mention, I just talked to Hannah today.
[38:52] Hannah just helped me do this, this and that.
[38:55] And Hannah was just here.
[38:56] And so for Hannah, it's a relationship.
[38:58] And for my mom, it's a PR stunt.
[38:59] And that's what really hurts me.
[39:01] And Hannah's sweet and she doesn't see that.
[39:03] And she lets people walk all over her.
[39:04] And, you know, I'm never going to tell her, but I'm a little more stubborn.
[39:08] And I can help her recognize that, but she probably won't listen.
[39:12] But, you know, for Hannah, it's a relationship.
[39:14] And for my mom, it's all for the public.
[39:17] How do you have a good relationship with Hannah?
[39:21] It's difficult when you have a family member and there's another family member who causes
[39:27] all this chaos.
[39:28] And then the two family members...
[39:29] When there's a mutual party that one person's good with and the other's not.
[39:35] I know, I've had friendships like that.
[39:37] It makes it really, it makes it difficult.
[39:39] I always say, like, with my friends, like, if I have a friend who doesn't like someone,
[39:43] but I like that individual, you know, someone's on, someone's off.
[39:48] I always say, like, I'm not going to let your relationship with them determine our relationship.
[39:53] So I love my sister.
[39:54] I'll always be there with her, for her.
[39:57] And I even texted her the other day.
[39:59] And I said, like, I know you don't want to, like, it was about some recent events.
[40:03] And I said, I know you don't want to talk about these things.
[40:05] And we're not going to.
[40:07] I just said, I love you.
[40:08] And I'm always going to be there for you.
[40:10] And I just want her to know that her relationship with my mom and my siblings is never going
[40:16] to determine our relationship.
[40:17] And I'm never going to have any hard feelings for her because of that.
[40:21] I always say, I'm not worried about telling her to tell my siblings this or tell my mom
[40:25] this because the truth will always come out and it will.
[40:27] And I literally said that over text.
[40:28] I said, things will always be brought to light.
[40:30] So I'm not worried about it.
[40:31] I'm going to do my best.
[40:33] And I'm going to put all my effort into releasing whatever I can that has to pertain to my siblings
[40:38] because I'm going to be there to show them that, you know, maybe question a few things
[40:41] and do some of your own research.
[40:44] But I'm never going to tell her how to feel.
[40:47] So I'm always there for her despite her relationship with anybody else.
[40:51] How is your relationship with your siblings?
[40:53] Do you speak to them?
[40:54] Have you reached out to them?
[40:55] Have they reached out to you?
[40:56] I've not reached out to them.
[40:57] Um, I think there are a lot of things that, that they must know, like first, you know,
[41:04] there's a lot of things that went on in the home that they don't know because they weren't
[41:08] pulled out of school.
[41:08] I was at home every single day with my mom and they weren't.
[41:12] And until they know the things that went on, which by the way, I'm going to write about
[41:16] them.
[41:17] They will be written about in detail.
[41:19] Um, until they know these things, they can't, they can't understand the concept of repair
[41:24] with their brother because all they understand of me now is that I was cast out of the home
[41:30] and that I'm troubled.
[41:31] And cause all they saw of me was when I was withdrawn.
[41:33] I mean, there's pictures, it's on, it's on TV.
[41:35] I'm withdrawn in interviews.
[41:37] I'm out of it.
[41:37] That is the aftermath of, we know, we all know what, um, but that's all they see of
[41:44] me.
[41:44] So before they have the information to form their own concept of me, it'll be really hard
[41:51] to, to start that repair process.
[41:54] Do you, would you be open to it one day if one of your siblings sets you?
[41:57] I'm more than open to it.
[41:58] You know, I, I think of it like this, like when I have kids one day and they have kids
[42:02] one day, like I want the cousins to know each other.
[42:04] I want my kids to be friends with their kids and I want them to know like, Hey, you
[42:08] know, these are your aunts, these are your uncles and they're here for you.
[42:11] Um, I want that more than anything.
[42:13] So I was watching TikTok a few weeks ago and there was this clip of you holding a stuffed
[42:20] animal and I can't remember what happened, but your mom got very angry with you.
[42:23] I think you like got the stuffed animal dirty or something.
[42:25] And she's like, I'm going to throw it away now.
[42:27] And all your siblings like came to your defense.
[42:29] Like they were saying like.
[42:30] There there's, there's many times where they actually came to my defense.
[42:33] I see clips and I hate watching them because it upsets me.
[42:36] But like the one time we were at a pool, we were down in like North Carolina, I think.
[42:40] And I like, I took my croc off and dipped my foot in the pool or something like that.
[42:44] Like, like, I don't know.
[42:45] And my mom yelled at me for getting wet.
[42:48] Like I did my foot in the pool.
[42:49] And then my, I remember like in the clip, Joel was saying, but Aiden did it, but Aiden did
[42:54] it.
[42:54] He's coming to my defense saying like, if Aiden did it, why can't Colin do it?
[42:58] You know?
[42:59] So it's a morality thing.
[43:01] Like, I think even when we were young, we just knew right from wrong.
[43:06] So you have been extremely brave talking about your trauma with your mom.
[43:12] How do you cope with it?
[43:15] I mean, you know, I feel like a lot of times childhood abuse can come out in your late
[43:20] twenties or it can come out, you know, later in life.
[43:23] How are you coping?
[43:24] And what would you say to other people who are struggling?
[43:27] That's, that's a great question.
[43:28] I love that you asked that.
[43:29] So I always say that who you are is a product of your environment.
[43:34] And until you're put in a good environment, it's really hard to be like a good version
[43:39] of yourself.
[43:39] And by environment, I mean people that are around you.
[43:41] So like when I first came home after being an institution, only ever being under the things
[43:49] that I went through with my mom.
[43:50] And then in that institution, which was horrible, I came home and I struggled a lot.
[43:54] And there were like, there was that, there was that residue from those places.
[43:59] And I struggled having a relationship with everybody around me, with Colleen, with my
[44:03] dad, with her kids, with teachers, with classmates, with everybody.
[44:06] I had so much, so much of a struggle integrating back into society that like, I didn't even know
[44:13] how to have a relationship with my dad.
[44:15] All it was, was anger.
[44:16] And I just blamed everybody for everything.
[44:19] Cause what I was used to was nobody ever wanting to help me and everybody only ever being
[44:23] out to hurt me.
[44:24] That's what I was used to.
[44:26] So I didn't know that people really wanted to help me.
[44:28] So the first thing I want to say is not everybody's out to hurt you except to help and also surround
[44:34] yourself with good people.
[44:36] Colleen and my dad, very much heavily on Colleen.
[44:40] She was, she was my star and that's how you do it.
[44:44] That's the secret to it.
[44:46] Find somebody who's in your corner.
[44:47] Cause you know, at the end of the day, that is, that's what really helps.
[44:51] Yeah.
[44:52] Going to therapy is super cool, but you know, it's not, talking to a stranger,
[44:56] in a room where you feel more pressure being put on you.
[44:59] It's not the same as just being with somebody who loves you and who's a mother figure to
[45:03] you.
[45:04] So I was very fortunate.
[45:06] Not everybody who takes the flat for the mother for all those years and then is away
[45:11] for three years and then comes back, has somebody like that.
[45:13] But honestly, that's a good secret.
[45:15] That's the secret to it.
[45:16] Um, you know, I could, I could say it's all these other things like me, like tinkering
[45:20] under the hood of a car or, you know, being outside and hiking.
[45:23] But the truth is it's, it's the people in your life.
[45:26] And, uh, I think they'll recognize that pain and that struggle and they'll want to be there
[45:29] to help you.
[45:30] So that's the truth to it.
[45:33] Do you still have Colleen in your life?
[45:35] Absolutely.
[45:35] I just saw her this summer.
[45:36] It's been, we're both busy, so it's hard to see her all the time.
[45:39] But, um, yeah, I just saw her this past summer, went down to visit her.
[45:43] Um, I actually found a little kitten down in the bush.
[45:45] You got, if anybody's watching, you've probably seen, I've had him on my like TikTok lives
[45:49] and I like post them here and there.
[45:51] But, uh, we found him in a bush and I, my friends brought him home cause I flew and they,
[45:54] they were down there.
[45:55] So they drove and, uh, yeah, that's my buddy.
[45:58] So, but yeah, I actually saw her this, uh, this summer.
[46:01] It was great.
[46:02] It was really great.
[46:03] It's always a great time.
[46:04] Nice that you still have a relationship with her.
[46:05] Absolutely.
[46:06] Yeah.
[46:06] When you came forward with us about your story, how did you feel that it was, um, received from
[46:12] the public?
[46:12] Like I saw all positive things, but I was very hesitant to do that at first.
[46:17] Um, and I've said my reason why people always like, I don't know why, but, and it's a small
[46:23] majority.
[46:23] I shouldn't really say it's a lot of people.
[46:25] It's like one, maybe 2% of people who will try to like, they'll look at someone and they'll
[46:30] just see someone who's broken.
[46:31] And then they'll think that their claims are invaluable or, you know, uh, what's the word?
[46:37] Um, they'll look at someone and when they come out about this and see them as broken and then
[46:42] not choose not to believe them.
[46:44] Um, and, and I, I think the hard part for me coming out about that was like, that's what
[46:49] I was afraid of.
[46:50] I wanted to be that voice.
[46:51] But at the same time, I knew that this would spark a lot of controversy.
[46:55] And I knew that when my siblings heard about this, that would, that would draw us ever coming
[47:03] back together.
[47:03] That would draw us apart.
[47:04] Um, however, in the pursuit of truth and in the pursuit of advocating for children who
[47:09] go through these things, not just on reality TV every day in homes where it's never seen
[47:14] by the light of a camera.
[47:16] Um, I had to choose that as a priority over what my siblings may think.
[47:21] And that was really difficult for me because I knew as soon as I came forward with these
[47:25] and, and with the, with, with what happened in the home and I'm not even done because like
[47:29] I said, I'm writing a book and it gets into very, very, very, very harsh detail.
[47:33] Um, I knew that would draw a barrier between us, um, already, even after the barrier that
[47:40] my mom already put between us, I knew that would even, that would draw us even further
[47:43] apart.
[47:44] But I, I had to prioritize being a voice, um, over amending that relationship, unfortunately.
[47:51] You've touched on why you came forward with the abuse.
[47:55] Why is it important for you to get the story out there about your mom and Steve's affair?
[47:58] I think it's just the pursuit of truth in general.
[48:01] Um, everybody thought for like so long before she finally came forward.
[48:07] And admitting everything.
[48:08] And before I ever chose to say anything about Steve, that it was just the abuse, but it's,
[48:13] it's not about the abuse.
[48:14] It's not about the affair.
[48:15] The moral of the story is that for being on reality TV, where things are supposed to be
[48:19] real and we're just supposed to show the world who we are as a family, everything was fabricated
[48:23] and everything was under the thumb of my mom.
[48:25] And she was always able to do that.
[48:28] Um, and, and that's the moral of the story is that things are fabricated and then people are
[48:32] still buying it up on TikTok.
[48:33] They're just eating it right up.
[48:35] And, um, that's the truth part of it.
[48:38] And everybody loves to say that my dad's going on TikTok and talking about his ex-wife and
[48:42] talking about this.
[48:43] Well, read a textbook guys.
[48:44] I'll give you a little bit of something right here.
[48:46] If you read about narcissists, narcissistic, uh, what is it?
[48:50] Personality disorder, MPD.
[48:52] It says that narcissists cause damage.
[48:54] And if, if anybody's ever been in a relationship, you, you'll know this.
[48:56] They cause damage and then they pretend the next day or the next hour that everything's
[49:00] okay.
[49:01] Look at what's going on.
[49:02] She's caused all this damage.
[49:04] She was never on social media, but then she comes back and, you know, everybody thinks
[49:08] that she's trying to keep her peace.
[49:09] But really what she's doing is she's putting this propaganda and this persona of her right
[49:14] back out there for you to just eat it up.
[49:16] And narcissists, they cause damage to me, to my father.
[49:18] So when we come out about it and we're talking about it and we can't seem to let parts of
[49:22] it go, we're hung up, but she's over here pretending like everything's fine.
[49:26] And there was never any damage that was caused.
[49:28] And, um, that's literally in a textbook.
[49:30] That's what narcissists do.
[49:32] So, um, and yes, I read about narcissists to understand my mom or I had to, cause she
[49:36] literally portrays so many personality traits of a narcissist.
[49:40] Um, and, and no, people are gonna say, Oh, that's John coming out of college.
[49:43] No, it's not.
[49:44] I've done my own research.
[49:45] I'm an adult now.
[49:46] I, I, I've chose to do my own research.
[49:48] And start looking into things in my past.
[49:50] Um, but that's the truth.
[49:53] So it's the moral is that there were so many stories, um, that were just fabricated and
[49:59] covered up and made to believe what she wanted you to believe.
[50:04] I know, I know you had mentioned your blog.
[50:06] Have you seen any of her to tell videos?
[50:08] Uh, they I've seen some.
[50:09] Yeah.
[50:09] They like came on my for you page, but they don't anymore.
[50:12] So I think that's like, I don't know how you check, but, um, if I like look up her
[50:17] account, like nothing comes up.
[50:19] So like, I looked it up cause people were telling me what her user and I can't see
[50:22] it.
[50:22] So from what you've seen, um, is she the same person you remember?
[50:27] And do you see those like narcissistic traits?
[50:30] Well, she is a little different.
[50:31] Like, like I saw someone saying that she was like mellowed out and I see that she like
[50:36] seems a lot more calm.
[50:37] Um, but like the way I look at it is like back then, even like in the heat of things,
[50:44] like she only made you see what she wanted you to see, even though like reality TV caught
[50:48] a lot more of it in a sense.
[50:50] And now like, I can't help but think maybe she's especially on TikTok, a platform that
[50:54] she controls.
[50:54] Maybe she's, it's just the same showing us what she wants us to see.
[50:58] When you came forward with the abuse, um, Kate and your sister, Maddie responded.
[51:02] Kate denied the claims, claims against her.
[51:05] Um, and they both accused you of violence.
[51:07] Um, sorry if you touched on this, but what, what, what do you, why do you think they did
[51:13] that?
[51:14] Do they?
[51:14] Well, so Maddie didn't just accuse me of violence.
[51:17] She accused me of hate crimes, something like that.
[51:20] Um, I don't understand that part.
[51:22] Um, hate crimes, like seriously.
[51:24] Um, and to even just touch on that in general, Maddie's literally like a mini version of my
[51:31] mother.
[51:31] I love her.
[51:32] She'll get what she wants and she's very outspoken and that's, that's not a bad thing.
[51:36] Um, but it's a bad thing when she's not speaking for herself, when she's speaking on behalf
[51:40] of what somebody else wants her to say.
[51:41] Um, that's where it gets a little bit, that's treacherous waters right there.
[51:46] Um, so for Maddie being in college and living her life and doing social media and whatever
[51:51] she's doing, I, I just think it's like troublesome that like my mom wants her to
[51:56] say these things about her brother.
[51:58] Um, and especially things like hate crimes and violence and never specific details, just
[52:03] broad.
[52:03] I give details.
[52:04] They just give broad statements.
[52:06] Um, and that was Maddie attacking me for my mother.
[52:10] So she was like my, my mom's Sergeant going out and getting it done for her.
[52:15] So yeah.
[52:16] When this interview comes out, what do you think your mom's going to say?
[52:19] I don't know if she will say anything.
[52:22] Um, I don't know.
[52:24] I'd like her to speak the truth and just come forward.
[52:27] I mean, I think for anything, for her thinking that she's so high and mighty above everybody
[52:33] else, which like people in my hometown have like told me stories.
[52:36] I think it's okay to just be human.
[52:39] I mean, just talk about the affair.
[52:42] If you guys loved each other, just speak on it.
[52:45] I think it will be a weight lifted off of everybody's shoulders.
[52:48] Um, love is not a bad thing.
[52:51] Cheating's horrible, but I guess like, you know, love is love.
[52:55] And, uh, I'm not making that sound okay.
[52:58] By the way, they were both married, but like, just come forward about it.
[53:02] If you love each other now, I guess there's no harm anymore because you're both, you know,
[53:06] divorced.
[53:07] So, and if you want to get married, just, just speak on it, you know?
[53:11] So.
[53:12] Do you think we'll see Steve on one of her recent TikToks?
[53:16] Up to TikToks?
[53:17] I don't, I don't know.
[53:18] He never wanted to be on camera even back in the day ever.
[53:20] Like he, he is on some parts.
[53:22] Like he's, there's pictures obviously, but like when we were filming, I think it was
[53:27] only like, there was like one show where he was being kind of like an advisor to her
[53:31] or something like that.
[53:32] And that's like the only thing I ever saw.
[53:34] I just saw it recently.
[53:35] It came up on my For You page, like a clip of her, like them in a car.
[53:38] And I was like surprised.
[53:39] I was like, I had to do a double take because he never wanted to be on camera ever.
[53:43] Like that wasn't his thing.
[53:44] So I don't know.
[53:45] Maybe like, maybe that's still him and he probably doesn't want to be on social media at all.
[53:49] But she actually said that the person doesn't like to be on camera and that he'll probably
[53:53] just like pop in and out.
[53:55] So it seems pretty, yeah, he, he never, he like never wanted to be on camera ever.
[54:00] Like he always walked behind him or to the side.
[54:02] Like he was with us a lot of time, but he was off out of frame.
[54:05] So how was your problem with his children?
[54:07] I know you don't like TikTok.
[54:08] That we shouldn't have to answer, but does she have the word?
[54:12] Um, well, so there's just, there's two things.
[54:15] Um, I remember briefly that we went to a graduation of one of his sons.
[54:22] Which is interesting.
[54:23] You know, that's a little bit odd.
[54:24] He was an employee of TLC.
[54:26] And then another thing, I mean, people are loving, they're loving fighting me in my comments
[54:30] on TikTok, but I released recently, there was an education trust made for me and my siblings.
[54:35] Okay.
[54:36] Let's redo that.
[54:36] Cause this is in here.
[54:38] Cause he loves to go in and out of that door.
[54:40] My dad.
[54:40] So, um, there was an education trust made for me and my siblings.
[54:44] It's called the Gosselin family education trust.
[54:47] Um, it's not a will, it's a trust fund.
[54:50] And it says that after, so Steve, the bodyguard was listed as a co-trustee.
[54:56] And it says that after living nieces and nephews, and in the event that my siblings and I shall
[55:00] not be here anymore, that Steve becomes a co-trustee and his children are listed on there as beneficiaries.
[55:07] People are allowed to tell me, oh, that's normal.
[55:10] You know, that's normal.
[55:10] We do this all the time.
[55:12] So why not the million other family members that we have?
[55:14] I mean, why not the aunts and uncles, people who, you know, might benefit from the money
[55:19] that were there, that helped with the family that were in our lives, anything like that.
[55:22] Right.
[55:23] And, and, and, and it's not in the event that like they would have to take care of us.
[55:26] We're all adults now, but it says that in the event that we would not be here anymore.
[55:30] Right.
[55:30] So my question is like, even though it's a bit extreme, cause it's after like my mom, my dad,
[55:37] me and my siblings, and no nieces and nephews could receive the money, but that he becomes
[55:41] a co-trustee and his kids are beneficiaries.
[55:42] Even if we're just looking at it in general, back in 2009, that was made by the way.
[55:48] And this was before their divorce too.
[55:50] So it just looks a little bit odd.
[55:53] Why are an employee of, like, why is an employee of TLC's kids listed as beneficiaries?
[55:57] That's weird.
[55:58] Of a, of a trust made for me and my siblings, where it could go to a million other family
[56:02] members.
[56:04] So, and people are like, oh, well, like, you know, the bodyguard was the only one that
[56:09] Kate could trust in her corner of time.
[56:11] That's what she wants you to believe.
[56:12] When she'd go away, oh my gosh, people, we had babysitters and nannies with us all the
[56:16] time.
[56:16] We had people she was so close with.
[56:18] She could have made that written out to any of them that were actually family members where
[56:22] there wasn't a conflict of interest of it being a TLC employee.
[56:26] So that's where it looks a little tricky.
[56:28] There was a lot of people who she could trust in her corner, but she made it out to be like,
[56:32] I don't have anybody to trust.
[56:33] I'm on my own with things.
[56:35] Besides the fact that there were nannies with us all the time and they were super close with
[56:38] us and they took very, very good care of us.
[56:41] What are your thoughts on that?
[56:43] Obviously it didn't go.
[56:44] Well, some of the nannies did.
[56:45] Let me just clarify that.
[56:46] Some did.
[56:47] But I just, that's, that's odd.
[56:49] It's really odd.
[56:51] If first he's an employee, point blank period.
[56:54] But if he wasn't a love interest or anything, why was he down if he was just a bodyguard?
[56:59] Why was he to be made a co-trustee, a decision of your family's money with his kids listed
[57:04] as viable beneficiaries?
[57:06] That's a, that's just very weird.
[57:09] And we have that.
[57:10] I mean, I mean, sorry to cut you off, but like people say, oh, like maybe she was just
[57:14] looking out for his family and like, she wanted to have the, so, so why not put Gina and
[57:18] Steve?
[57:19] Why not put Steve and his wife and his kids and his family?
[57:22] Why just put Steve as the co-trustee and just his kids as beneficiaries?
[57:27] What about his wife?
[57:27] If we're trying to hand it down to a family that it may be helpful to, that you cared about,
[57:33] why just give it to Steve, right?
[57:35] Why not give it to his family?
[57:37] Are you shocked that they only divorced two years ago, him and Gina?
[57:40] I thought it was longer ago than that.
[57:43] But it, from what I hear, it was only two years ago.
[57:46] And I'll double check that.
[57:49] But I believe it was only two years ago.
[57:50] Yeah.
[57:51] I thought it was like, I thought he was done with her.
[57:52] Like, I thought they divorced a long time ago.
[57:55] Um, and it sucks because I remember meeting her as a kid.
[57:58] She was really nice.
[57:59] It makes sense now when your mom says a little over a year, right?
[58:03] Because that's, she's trying to get, oh, they just got divorced.
[58:07] Right.
[58:07] If we're doing the math, you know, you have the 24 months that they've been divorced and
[58:11] you guys have been dating for 15 of them.
[58:14] So it looks a little bit interesting.
[58:18] I know we talked about the trust.
[58:19] We talked about photos.
[58:21] Anything else from your childhood when your dad was still married to your mom that you can remember?
[58:26] I'm afraid I've already said enough.
[58:28] Um, I think with me writing this book, it's nice because it's like a first person perspective.
[58:32] And, um, there's more emotion, um, which is important when you're reading a book.
[58:38] I'm a big reader.
[58:39] Um, I think I've said already enough and I should probably not say anything else because I want
[58:43] it to be in this book that I'm writing.
[58:45] What made you want to write it?
[58:46] I've always wanted to write a book for a long time.
[58:49] Um, all the way back to institution.
[58:51] I was like thinking about the events of the show and then I was thinking about like being
[58:56] an institution and I was like, I was like, wow, this is crazy.
[59:00] Like, like you just thought about how institution was.
[59:03] And I was like, and I remember so many details of it.
[59:05] And I just, I just thought about life experiences in general.
[59:09] Um, everything from TV to institution to like different family members that she hired to be
[59:15] there with us and just different experiences.
[59:17] And that would, that would make more sense in the book.
[59:19] But there was always just things that I felt were important to be out there in the form
[59:24] of a book.
[59:25] So you wrote letters when you were in the institution.
[59:28] Did you feel like writing helps you with everything?
[59:32] Um, I honestly, no, I, I honestly don't like writing that much.
[59:36] Um, and, uh, my, my, my English class in college here can speak for that.
[59:41] Um, essays are not my thing.
[59:43] Writing in general is not my thing.
[59:44] I do like reading though.
[59:45] Um, and usually people like reading, like writing, but I don't know.
[59:48] It just doesn't click both ways for me, but, um, yeah, I can write and I'll, and, and I
[59:53] think it's important when it, when there's importance behind the writing, but like just
[59:56] in general, probably, probably wouldn't be like my everyday hobby, you know, I have.
[1:00:02] Yeah.
[1:00:02] Yeah.
[1:00:03] Yeah.
[1:00:03] So, um, yeah, we're, we're in the process of that right now.
[1:00:05] So I'm really excited.
[1:00:06] Can you start writing?
[1:00:08] Yeah.
[1:00:08] Yeah.
[1:00:08] I'm actually, I'm, I'm working, um, with a lady who is actually going to, she, she's helping
[1:00:13] me to construct this a little bit better.
[1:00:15] Um, but honestly, like going over these events and putting them on paper and like drafting
[1:00:19] them is, it's almost therapeutic in a way.
[1:00:22] It really is.
[1:00:22] It's nice to, it's nice to talk about these things.
[1:00:25] And the more I talk about one thing is like, I remember little details of it.
[1:00:29] Like I'm talking, I don't want to, I can't go in specifics cause I don't want to give
[1:00:32] everything away, but like, I'll talk about a certain event or like a time in my life.
[1:00:36] And then all these like details and like, I have a visual memory.
[1:00:39] I can remember like what things look like and stuff like that.
[1:00:42] And all these details will come up and it's just like, it's, it's nice in a way.
[1:00:46] It's nice to just put it all out there.
[1:00:48] And take breaks.
[1:00:49] Cause sometimes when you do too much.
[1:00:52] Yeah.
[1:00:52] You get, you get, it's a lot.
[1:00:53] Yeah.
[1:00:54] You get a little bit.
[1:00:55] So I'm super excited.
[1:00:57] Tell us about your life.
[1:00:58] Um, tell me about school.
[1:01:00] Tell me about your career plans.
[1:01:02] So, um, school's going great.
[1:01:05] I love my friends.
[1:01:06] Um, it's really fun.
[1:01:08] I actually like, although I'm in college right now for business finance and I'm pursuing
[1:01:12] my bachelor's, I really want to be a pilot.
[1:01:14] Um, I've always had a fascination with planes.
[1:01:17] I'm going to re-say that cause I, I've always had a fascination with planes.
[1:01:22] Um, and then recently, like I met this guy and I was talking to him and he's a pilot for
[1:01:26] American airlines and we just like started talking.
[1:01:29] I actually, I sold fiber door to door.
[1:01:32] I did door to door sales this summer and I knocked on his door and, um, I didn't even
[1:01:37] want to sell the guy fiber anymore.
[1:01:38] I just wanted to talk to him about like, he was telling me about his passion and it like
[1:01:42] sparked something in me that I, that was there, but I hadn't like explored recently.
[1:01:46] And, um, now I just was like, yeah, like I started researching and I was like, yeah,
[1:01:51] I really love to fly planes.
[1:01:52] It's super cool.
[1:01:53] It's just something that fascinates me.
[1:01:54] And the thing is about pilots.
[1:01:56] Like if they want, if you want to be a pilot, like you want to be a pilot, like it's just
[1:01:59] one of those careers, you know?
[1:02:00] Um, but yeah, so in college now, but I do plan to go to flight school and I also have
[1:02:06] a pressure washing business, which has been very busy this summer.
[1:02:10] Um, and that's going very well.
[1:02:11] Yeah.
[1:02:11] It's super, it's super cool owning your own business.
[1:02:14] Um, I think the worst part for me is writing an invoice.
[1:02:18] Cause like, I, I just feel like, I don't know.
[1:02:20] I don't like charging people money.
[1:02:21] Like I, I, I always want to give them like discounts and breaks and like just do other
[1:02:25] stuff around the house for them.
[1:02:26] But, and, uh, yeah, so I mean, but it's, it's nice.
[1:02:29] Yeah.
[1:02:29] It's cool.
[1:02:29] But I think that's like the part I, I suck at is like making people saying like, you have
[1:02:34] to pay me like this much.
[1:02:35] Like it's, I don't know.
[1:02:35] So, but it's fun, you know, who doesn't like climbing up on roofs and, you know, you know,
[1:02:40] it's fun.
[1:02:41] So it's super cool.
[1:02:42] A lot of fun.
[1:02:43] It's just a fun, uh, like it's just satisfying.
[1:02:45] Like when you're washing something and you just like see it go like clean, it's cool.
[1:02:49] So it's a weird passion to have, I guess, but it's, it's fun.
[1:02:52] I like doing it.
[1:02:54] Sounds fun.
[1:02:55] I like cleaning things too.
[1:02:55] Yeah.
[1:02:56] Yeah.
[1:02:56] No, yeah, no, it's, it's fun.
[1:02:57] Yeah.
[1:02:58] So they par washed my house the other day and I was like staring at it.
[1:03:01] I was like, you don't realize, like I tell a lot of my clients this, I tell them, I'm
[1:03:05] like, you don't realize how dirty your house was until, until we're washing.
[1:03:08] And I always take videos from them, although a dirt running off as I'm cleaning it.
[1:03:11] And I take like before and after photos and photos and I put them next to each other and
[1:03:15] I show them and they're like, wow, like it didn't even look that dirty, but now it looks
[1:03:18] super clean.
[1:03:19] So you can tell how dirty my house is.
[1:03:20] I was like, yeah, so super fun.
[1:03:23] Are you still in the military?
[1:03:24] So, um, I'm currently not, however, I am working and I don't want to talk too much
[1:03:29] on it just because I like to keep those things separate, um, military and like public stuff.
[1:03:34] But, um, I am currently working to, um, appeal their decision and, uh, working to go back
[1:03:41] right now.
[1:03:41] So, yeah.
[1:03:42] That's everything I had.
[1:03:43] Was there anything we didn't touch on?
[1:03:45] No, I think we touched on everything and I, I think I said a little more than I should.
[1:03:48] So in terms of my book.
[1:03:50] So, yeah, you know, but no, there's still a lot more for that book that I have.
[1:03:54] So there's a lot in general.
[1:03:55] Like I could, I could probably yap per hours, you know, but, oh yeah, I'm like, I should
[1:03:59] have left an hour ago.