'Anything is possible': AOC on her political future

[0:00] Congresswoman Ocasio-Cortez joins me now. Thank you for being here. Thank you for having me. Well it's been a huge week. What does Abdel [0:09] Syed's victory in Michigan say about the future of the Democratic Party. I think that we are in a time of renewal for the Democratic Party and it's [0:20] tremendously exciting for all of us for the big tent of the Democratic Party. We have really an ascendance of a young inspiring exciting [0:32] electorate energizing wave of candidates that I think really inject a new energy to the Democratic Party and add to the toolbox of [0:44] candidates that we have to win the midterm elections hopefully in November. And as you'd seen [0:50] progressives winning in a lot of these other primaries. It was often dismissed. People saying all this is in very blue parts of the [0:56] country in big cities. But this is this is Michigan. I mean this this is battleground Michigan. And he won. Now he has the biggest test. [1:06] Can you win in November. What does he have to do to win over those Democrats who opposed him. Well you know I think that this really is a [1:14] moment not just in Michigan but across the country where the party is unifying. The party is unifying and it is focused on the [1:23] November elections. We understand that our priority is the working class of this country. And we have to make the case that we're here to make [1:33] people's lives better. And the Republican Party right now is jacking up prices making housing impossible to afford. And we are [1:42] focused on everything from health care to your grocery bill and making it more affordable for for working people. You know this week there was also a [1:50] prominent Republican. I mean a very prominent Republican who said some things about wealthy corporations profiting [1:58] effectively fleecing Americans. It sounded a lot like what I've heard you said. I want to I want to play this and see your reaction. [2:05] They're making too much money. OK based on a shortage. They're making too much money. I don't like it. When you look at one [2:13] company where they made 12 times what they made the year before. They're going to give some of that back to the public. And they [2:20] better cut the retail price. The consumer price. Well that was Donald Trump obviously talking about oil and gas companies [2:28] and high gas prices. What do you make of that. I think that everyday people everyday Americans. We can see the very [2:37] large gap between what Trump Donald Trump says and what Donald Trump does. And so Donald Trump may be saying that oil companies [2:45] are making too much money. But what Donald Trump is doing is starting a reckless war in Iran having closed door meetings with oil [2:55] companies before his election saying you know you give me money you give me campaign contributions and I will do whatever you want. And [3:04] so what we have seen everything from Supreme Court rulings to Donald Trump's own policy is what he is doing is jacking up the [3:12] price not just at the pump but at everything that you buy that requires the transportation of goods. And so he can say whatever [3:19] he'd like from the Oval Office. But I think people are more looking at what he chooses to do. But that's a reflection of what he is [3:26] seeing. People care about what the people are thinking. Mm hmm. And you know to the president's credit. He is. He comes from [3:33] television and he's very responsive to public sentiment. And so he knows what he needs to say. But again none of that is going to [3:43] lower the cost of your rent or your mortgage. None of that is going to lower the interest rates that you're paying. None of that is [3:50] going to make your grocery bill more affordable. And what we want to know and what we want to see is action. But I want to go back in [3:55] time just briefly to 2018 when you won. And you shocked. You absolutely shocked the political world. We saw the pictures of [4:03] you that night. You were obviously shocked that you had won. You probably don't recall this but I interviewed you hours later the next morning. And let's play just a little bit of that. Sure. Judging from the reaction that we all saw of you on television it seemed to surprise you as well. [4:21] You know I wasn't even checking the election results at all. I wasn't even following the precincts coming in. We had driven straight to our [4:31] little party at a little billiard spot in the Bronx and we hopped in and I just kind of walked into a TV set and I looked at the screen and I [4:38] saw not only the numbers but what those numbers were. And it was a complete shock. [4:45] So I mean you sound there a lot like you sound today. But you've changed as well. Right. How have you changed since you came in as this insurgent rebel at odds with the Democratic leadership. How have you changed. [5:00] You know I think life has a way of of really weathering you and adding to your context and your experience. It it humbles you but it also [5:13] emboldens you in a lot of ways. And I think it has been the greatest privilege of my life to be able to represent the working people of my [5:23] congressional district. And I think some of the ways that it's changed me has been to be able to come in with so many [5:33] aspirations for our country and then to have the remarkable opportunity to be in the arena and try to make the country a better place [5:44] challenges and all. And I love that it's hard. I love that I have to and I get to engage with people from all across the [5:56] country elected officials from all across the country to try to actually fulfill our dreams to guarantee health care to every [6:04] American. And you're you continue to push for change in the Democratic Party. But you're also one of the most prominent figures in [6:11] that party right now. Your endorsement is incredibly valuable. I've noticed that this time around this election cycle you have [6:18] not endorsed against you've not endorsed candidates that were challenging Democratic incumbents in the House. And somebody [6:27] took note of this. A fellow progressive wrote recently the headline in The Hill was today's cautious AOC would not have [6:35] endorsed the AOC of 2018 because you were obviously running against an incumbent. I mean I mean that's probably correct. Right. [6:45] What what what what you're thinking there. You know I am I wasn't endorsed by anybody when I was running your friends. Yeah. [6:55] Just just some just some friends. So I wasn't endorsed by by I don't think I was endorsed by a single elected official when I was running [7:01] for office. And you know I think when I see so many of these incredible insurgent candidates that are running today. [7:11] That's part of what makes me so proud of them is that they do not answer to any master. They are not beholden to any corporate [7:20] interest or any party boss. And they are completely independent which allows them to be responsive to their communities and the [7:30] people that elected them. And I think that in many ways that makes our movement stronger when you have to rely on your own [7:39] organizing skills. And and I think that it has proven to be quite successful. And I I mean I I see so many of these candidates [7:50] and they remind me of that moment. I mean but but like in New York you had the the candidates that were endorsed by Mayor [7:57] Mamdani. Two of whom were challenging sitting members of Congress powerful members of Congress Democrats. And you you you [8:05] decided to sit that one out. Is that part of wanting to work with your colleagues that are in the House. I mean what what [8:11] what's the. You know I think we're all in different you know politics is also a workplace and we're all in different positions to [8:19] that. I endorsed for example in New York and on the state level I endorsed a slate of challengers to incumbents in the [8:26] assembly in the assembly and in the Senate. And I don't work in state government which gives me a greater freedom to be able to do [8:35] that and to assess it. And I'm very grateful you know that we now have a progressive movement that doesn't that that is in large enough [8:45] numbers that you know used to be that you could fit five people in a closet. And that was that was that was the caucus. And now we've grown into [8:53] quite a successful movement. So you have Wisconsin coming up next Francesca Hong who is the Democratic Socialists of [9:00] America supporting candidate for governor. Are you you haven't endorsed her are you going to. No I haven't endorsed in that [9:09] race. My focus has been in winning back the Congress winning back the House and positioning ourselves to have the best chance [9:18] possible to to win the Senate. So I've been focused on on those legislative. What do you make of those controversial [9:23] statements. I'm sure you've seen. I mean she's you know the Thanksgiving dust up. She says she doesn't you know still [9:30] believe that. But you know the abolish prisons abolish police which is also positions that have been taken by a lot of the [9:37] progressive candidates who have won. Mm hmm. How do you how do you get around that. Yeah. Not positions that are supported by. Right. I mean I [9:46] think that a lot of these races even right now they'll have a tendency to be [9:51] nationalized. Yeah. But these races ultimately are local and all politics are [9:58] local. My understanding is that is is that Francesca Hong has made clear her [10:04] present stances to her. Yeah. She's moved away from. Right. She's moved away from it. And I have a local city [10:11] councilman that has this saying woke one was crazy. One was crazy. And I think that what's important is that we [10:23] have to assess what. Was it. I mean did the movement go too far with some of those positions. I mean you you [10:28] briefly supported the idea of defunding the police. Well you know I think I think that during this time [10:36] and during especially during covid there was a huge opening of the Overton window we were shut down. There [10:42] was some of the highest unemployment rates that we have seen because of those shutdowns. Yeah. And I think [10:46] that the the doors were really open in trying to entertain any and every policy that was going to get us to a [10:55] better place. And I actually think that the discussions that had that were had in that time were quite fruitful. I think [11:03] that when we talk about crime today it's fundamentally different than the way that we talked about crime in bringing crime [11:09] down. Right. And I think that we all share in the goals of having as low a crime rate as possible. I think [11:16] that you know during lockdown of course rhetoric in that time is not rhetoric that we would use today. And I'm grateful that [11:24] these candidates have the opportunity to present who they are to their electorate and what they're campaigning on in this [11:31] moment. Because you know and obviously the Democratic Socialists of America are having quite a moment. [11:39] But you know how Republicans are responding. Let me just give you a brief sampling. Sure. Let's call it what it is. [11:48] It's communism. The commie caucus is coming to Congress. Communism is on the ballot this November. We're not going to turn this [11:54] country into a communist experiment. Well you kind of get a sense of the theme. And obviously the president has said the same thing. [12:02] But by the way just a quick definitional thing. What in your mind is the difference between socialism and communism. [12:08] I think to me the fundamental differences. I mean there's there's many. One prevailing one is democracy. And I believe [12:18] that Democratic Socialists are fundamentally pro-democracy. And we believe in the ballot box. We believe in in respecting the [12:30] the outcomes of elections and governing democratically. And ensuring that that the ideas that and policies that are implemented are one [12:40] through popular vote and popular opinion. And so I think that's why so much of what we focus on is also making sure that we are [12:49] providing for the majority of Americans guaranteeing health care raising wages strengthening the right to a union. And and I think that that's at its core [13:00] what we're about. Are you still a member of Democratic Socialist of America. Of the New York City chapter. The New York City [13:06] chapter. Not the national. And what's the difference. So every DSA chapter is is formed locally. Yeah. And so the New York City [13:18] DSA chapter. Those are folks that you know. It's my it's kind of like your local union chapter. Yeah. And yeah. So because I and I know [13:27] there was that strange moment in 2024 when they the national chapter like took away your endorsement. Yeah. But I was [13:35] looking through the DSA program and this is the national program. I'm sure you've seen the document was adopted just a few [13:42] months ago. But but some of the positions here defund the Department of Defense close overseas military bases abolish the [13:49] police and prison system. Grant amnesty to all immigrants in the U.S. replace the Supreme Court and executive [13:58] judiciary with a chosen by lower and lower to Congress abolish the Senate. Public ownership of corporations and [14:06] essential industries. I mean those are some positions that you're going to be hearing a lot about this fall from Republicans. And I [14:12] think we're also going to be hearing a lot about Donald Trump's commitment to getting us into a reckless war in Iran. [14:17] His his collaboration with big companies to make sure that grow everything from groceries to rent stay sky high. And I think that [14:26] people are less interested in these academic debates and they're more interested in how we're going to bring their bills down and [14:33] make sure that they can afford to see a doctor. But do you see I mean those positions you support. No. But I think that this is a free [14:42] country. Everyone can have all sorts of beliefs and they can organize around them. And you're free to do what you [14:48] like. And you know have conversations with your neighbors. But my job as an elected official is to guarantee health care in [14:56] America. And that's what I'm focused on. And that's what I seek to do. And what do you say to the moderate Democrats who say [15:04] first of all that you know they are capitalists and that those positions are going to doom the Democratic Party because again they're not [15:12] positions that are support. Yeah. I mean of course they're they're free to have their economic identity as as they like. And [15:22] you know in terms of dooming the party the idea that there's a diversity of thought in America among everyday voting people [15:30] is a fundamental fact of our country. I don't think that we should be worried about what somebody somewhere believes. I think we should be [15:38] focused on what our plan to improve people's lives are. Another person who's been made an issue is Hassan Piker who [15:46] obviously endorsed Abdul Syed in Michigan. You've been on his live stream you know at least a few times. He's somebody [15:54] who said you know that America deserved 9-11. Now he backed off from that. Yes. He's apologizing. But he said a lot of he said a lot of [16:02] controversial things. Is he somebody that should have a role in the progressive movement going forward. You [16:08] know I think when we look at our elections that have happened we have lost young people. Much hay was made about [16:18] the fact that we lost young men in the last election. And many of the same consultants that are wringing their [16:25] hands today. We're the same ones talking about how we need to go on Joe Rogan and we need to be not not so willing to engage in [16:39] cancel culture. And I think that the flip flopping on this is a tactical debate that they may be having. I think the fact of the [16:51] matter is is that Democrats can go on Joe Rogan. Democrats can go on Fox News. Democrats have a responsibility to build a winning [16:58] coalition. And young people are engaging in mediums and conversations that we have a responsibility to attend to and be [17:08] responsive to. And even right now when we look at this insurgent wave of what is happening. Oftentimes when people are doing that Monday [17:19] morning quarterbacking and what demographics voted where. The big one that's being ignored is the generational title [17:28] wave. It's not you see it in the polling. It is significant. Millennials are not you know punk kids anymore. Yeah. We're grown [17:38] adults with mortgages and kids. And we that generation is starting to be decisive at the polls. And there is anger [17:49] at being ignored. Sidelined having our economic futures mortgaged by the generations that came before us on [17:58] everything from the economy to climate. And we're taking the reins. So I want to we're almost out of time to get to your [18:07] future. I'm sure you saw the poll in New Hampshire that had you as the leading candidate leading choice for Democrats. [18:14] First of all. Are you are you going to run for president? I mean I I'm focused on winning the midterms. I'm running for Congress right now. [18:23] But I mean do you see this as something. You know. I know you said you're open to it. Yeah. Is it a realistic possibility. I haven't. Well I haven't ruled out the possibility and I'm very humbled to the tremendous amount of support out there. I think that we have a responsibility to remain focused on the midterms. [18:43] And not on our individual aspirations or plans. And running for Senate against Chuck Schumer is that also something that's possible. I mean I think that anything is possible at this juncture. All right. And then before you go you did have a personal announcement that you made. [19:01] It was interesting to see you kind of open up in a you know on an Instagram live. Yes. So tell me tell me what it was and why. Yeah. You know I think it's important for us to normalize these conversations especially in this political environment. [19:15] The Trump administration has. Remind us what the announcement. Yes. Sure. So I have decided to start the process of freezing my eggs. Yeah. And in this political environment where this administration is denying reproductive care. [19:30] To women across the country. From abortion rights to the ability to carry out a healthy pregnancy. I think it's important for us as leaders to have these conversations conversations and share these processes especially for working women across the country and normalize them. [19:48] Okay. All right. Congresswoman Casio Cortez. Thank you very much for being here. Let's hope to talk to you again soon. Thank you. And when you're ready to make that decision about. I'll let you know. [19:57] I'll let you know. I'll let you go back and talk to us about it.