The City Council workshop is called to order for April 16, 2026. Ms. Beggarrow, would you like to call the goal? Councilmember Anderson? Here. Councilmember Fadgen? Here. Councilmember Horland? Here. Councilmember Einstein? Here. Mayor Sortel? Here. City Attorney Israel? Here. Thank you. Thank you, Ms. Beggarrow. Are you here? Yes. She's here. Okay. This evening, this is a workshop about the Plantation Preserve Golf Course Improvements Project Phase 1. The workshop will provide an overview presentation by Miller-Legg, the consultant, highlighting assessment findings, anticipated phasing approach, preliminary timelines, the consultant's proposed scope of services, and the general scope of Phase 1 improvements for the Plantation Preserve Golf Course Improvements Project. He'll be presenting. Dip, welcome. Please introduce yourself for everybody in the chamber. Good evening, Mayor, Councilmembers. Dip Machuca, administration, project manager. So today, as you mentioned, we have Miller-Legg, who will be providing an overview presentation of the findings on the assessment that was conducted for the Plantation Preserve Golf Course. Part of the assessment will highlight the existing conditions of the golf course turf areas, bulkheads, bridges, irrigation, pump house, and other related infrastructure. And based on the findings, the consultant will also highlight or provide a – present the anticipated phasing approach, including timelines, priorities, recommended Phase 1 improvements as well. And in addition to that, the presentation will also include a brief overview of Miller-Legg's proposed scope of services associated with Phase 1 to support, you know, council discussion and direction. And with that, we have Miller-Legg. I will introduce Dylan Larson with Miller-Legg, and I'll turn it over to him. Thank you, council. We appreciate being here and excited to present these findings to you and our next steps that hope you'll consider. I'm Dylan Larson with Miller-Legg, project manager, and we'll have to apologize to look this way. There's a lot of information to kind of go through to go pretty quickly to have plenty of time for questions and answers. Like Dib mentioned, here's our overview of the things we'll talk about. Just want to talk about our team quick. Miller-Legg's a prime consultant, landscape architecture engineering. We have several folks online who are watching. One of my partners and our president, Mike Kroll, who will also be here next time, Brian Schor, our principal landscape designer. Signature design, Harry Bowers. Mr. Harry Bowers is our golf course architect right here. He's done over 90 golf courses and 30 renovations. And Masters is our structural engineers. That was part of our scope that's already been occurred. So as Dib mentioned, we're going to go over four key things here, goals and objectives that we talked to staff about. And that was identifying deficiencies, evaluate any major infrastructure improvements needed, create a priorities list, and look at any phasing options needed to aid in funding or cash flow. Okay? So quickly, we're going to go over our condition assessment and findings. And that really creates some of the priorities and things like that. So just, you all know where this is at, hopefully, obviously. But for those who don't, and also for those who don't know, this was a golf course before it became a golf course now. So before that, pre-1996, this is what it looked like. Not many lake features. This is the overlay of what's happened in it. And then during construction and after construction. One of the neat things I want to point out, too, that over time, normal maintenance, wear and tear operations, tree establishment, changes the configurational golf course. You're at 20 years. Some improvements need to be done. Here's a good comparison on the opening of 2006 to 2025. And one of the things to note, there's a laser, but particularly the landscaping around the lake bank area, you can see what it looked like before versus after. A lot of the mounding is now dried out. An establishment of trees. In this case, we're looking at hole 2. You can see some of the features, the tee boxes in the foreground on the right side, a little more worn from use because of the small tee box size. And in the background, you see those sand bunkers. You see how there used to be like four or five of them. They've kind of become combined over time. It's just part of the maintenance of the scalping that it takes when you do the maintenance of sand bunkers and so forth. And here's another example on hole 5, a good comparison. On the left is the opening. On the right's current conditions. You see the tee box in the foreground, how kind of worn it is due to the use, excessive use. I shouldn't say excessive. High demand use, which is a good thing. And then if you notice the sand bunker in the back, just the shape and change over time as also weeds have come in the lake bank. So with that, you have the layout of the course. And really, as an overall condition assessment, this is what you have. Everything, everywhere, all at once. And what we have is a relative scoring here. Kind of using the red-green, yellow symbology. Red's in poor condition, yellow's in fair condition, and green is in good. And these are some subjective things based on many different characteristics. But we'll go through all the little different things, all the different features of the tee box that make that up. But you can get an idea of where things stand from a condition perspective just all at one shot. And with that, we'll go into some details very, very quickly. Your practice area, one of the features, what that looks like. And in the right-hand corner, you can see what some of the high-ranking features are of why that scoring or the condition is of that. Fair to poor conditions. T-box marker conditions we looked at. Here's your acreage of tee boxes and the size of that. What the conditions of that are. Pretty poor around it. Some good conditions and fair, and you have over-seeding of the pass-up element areas. That is a factor in as we evaluate grassing. Cart path damaged areas, you can get an idea of that. How the fairways look in a green, yellow, red configuration. Kind of a good mix there. All the roughs are in very bad condition, poor condition. Excessive wear areas. This is areas that are excessively wear by cart path and things like that based on design. That has happened as the course is established. Sand bunkers are all poor condition. Again, for many issues, and that's quite common. Waste bunkers are a different factor. We don't have as much areas, and those are in fairly good condition. The greens, it's one good thing that I think is a good factor. The greens are currently in good condition on the course. Lake banks we looked at. And then irrigation is one of the things we looked at. We were able to find the as-built plans with the superintendent on site. And there's minor field modifications. But the takeaway from that, we could get a quantity of the heads around there that gives an idea of what needs for, is the order magnitude we have. But one of the key findings with the irrigation is the software's not supported. It's 20 years old, heavily run on software. Replacement parts aren't available from the manufacturer, so they're using secondary market refurbishment for that, and some irrigation coverage issues. And we really have to look at that in more detail. Another factor and thing to be aware of is the irrigation for the golf course also runs on the properties or in the rear yards of these folks. It's actually the city property, but it's separated by a lake. It was that way before the construction, so it's that way, too. And the irrigation system runs the trail, south trailhead, north trailhead, and the clubhouse. So as we move into improvements, we have to consider those systems and keep those online. Pump house. We looked at the pump house. And one of the things is that we'll need a further evaluation that we'll talk about. The pumps itself, further evaluation is needed. We kind of looked at that. And we'll have to look at some of the wear and tear. One of them got replaced, but also electrical code and things like that should be looked at. And we'll talk about that later. Fertigation was looked at. That's a system that allows fertigation to go through the irrigation system. Another factor that we looked at is some species on site. There's a burrowing owls. That'll become a factor during construction. They have to work around and during permitting, so that information's there. Landscape beds, exotic vegetation areas. And then also looking at elevation is important to look at drainage issues and how much soil we might have to move around within the construction areas. And what's kind of interesting about how to read this is 2.5, you see on the legend over there, kind of that line of blue is where the water control is. So kind of how you read this. When it's really dark blue, that's your lakes, right? It's a lighter blue. There's just lower-lying areas. And red is higher. So you get an idea of the elevation range you have in the golf course there, so it's pretty neat. So with that, we can kind of overlay some lower-lying areas that could be problematic drainage areas. That doesn't mean they all are, but some are based on our knowledge and working out there. And that's just that, overlay that. So that'll be an important factor in going forward how much to improve some of those drainage low-lying areas. The course, by the way, does drain really well, doesn't close very often, and only a few holes usually close, and that could be addressed. We looked at the drainage structures of what needs maintenance and repair and so forth from prior and secondary structures. So all that was done and evaluated. And lastly, most importantly, bulkhead and bridges were looked at. Kind of small-scale, but the good, fair, and poor was done with that. Okay. All right, so that was 10 minutes. That was pretty good. A lot of pictures are pretty quick there. So one thing, I understand the link doesn't work, but if anybody has an interest, you can go to this website. You'll have the link, and you can go. It's an online GIS portal, so you can click any of those features we just looked at. Look at photos of that, the view of each sand bunker, everyone of those attributes. So if you don't want to go to the golf course, you can get, like, almost a web view based on this link if you get bored and want to look at those details. So now we went through that. Again, our goals and objectives, I want to go back to that. I wanted to identify the deficiencies, evaluate infrastructure improvements, credit priorities list, and evaluate options. So the first thing we identified was the deficiencies. And one of the important things we saw in working with our team is, you know, it's really improvements are needed. It's not really a redesign or renovation. What that means is, you know, laying out the holes differently, relocating greens or T's and redesigning the whole things, really not necessary. The course is a good layout, the par layout, things like that. It's a good bones of a design, if you will. So really what needs to be done is the turf obviously needs to be improved and replaced. The condition consistency is an issue. The bunkers, quantity, and the maintenance demands need to be evaluated. It's a little, and the shape of those. It's high maintenance, high costs, as well as a T-box layout and size. And again, this is a very high summary of what is in our assessment. And then, of course, those have been identified as a mounding in certain areas. You could see those elevations as well when you saw that LIDAR. There's some mounding, which kind of creates mowing issues and scalping and some things like that. And again, it drives maintenance demands and excess turf wear. And how some carts are channelized during this really wears on the course and then wears on the turf and then has an appearance of a downtrodden condition and just not green and lush like you want golf course to kind of be and attracts, you know, golfers, et cetera. It keeps your level of play and service level up, we should say. So goal and objective number two, the staff asked us to do, is evaluate major infrastructure improvements. So that was the bulkhead bridges, the irrigation pump, and we recommend further evaluations needed there, as well as the pump house and structure, as well as the turf. And one of the things I'll say about the turf and kind of repeat, when we talk about the timeline, one of the unique things with a golf course, we really need to procure the turf in advance. It's not something you just go to Home Depot or get. So we actually have to have a deposit to kind of get it far enough in advance to do this project. So that's one of the unique things. We kind of have to kind of have that commitment to know we've got enough turf for the hundred of acres we need to have the right stuff to come in to do the work. So we'll talk about that a little bit more, but that's very important. And again, as a basis of information for the non-golfers, we kind of made this chart for what the cost of order magnitude drivers are on a golf course. And the highest cost typically is irrigation, right, because it's a lot of it. And it can be dependent on the levels of repairs and things like that. But irrigation is one of the biggest cost drivers in improvement or construction. The next one we have is all the turf, and that's your greens, fairways. Because the turf goes in, a lot of precise grading, precise drainage needed, the level of sand and stuff that has to go in there as well as the turf itself. Sand bunkers and tee boxes are the same. Then lower in cost, which is put medium, is the rough areas, the waste bunkers, lakes, and things like that. And lowest is landscape and cart path. The bottom I put was bulkhead and bridges. Those are high. Those are kind of separated out just because of a nuance saying not all golf courses need those features, right? They're an amenity to most, but they're not critical. Some don't have it at all. But your bulkhead and bridges are a high driver. So just to put an order to magnitude, those are kind of the big things that float out there, okay? So what we looked at, we talked about, was the bridge condition. And one of the issues, they basically require a replacement. Repair could be done, but based on where they're at in the 20-year life cycle and the structural analysis that our sub-consultant did, they'll really need a replacement. And there's really two bridges on the golf course, and then there's three within the trail. And one of the things we did with the city as part of our first scope is looked at alternatives, putting just the repair in, rehabilitation with timber, but also looking at other alternatives of precast concrete, culvert, steel, fiber, polymer options. And here's some pictures of different options of that that was kind of kicked around a little bit as alternatives to the wood. Let's talk about bulkheads, and we'll come back to that. Bulkhead conditions, a similar thing. It's all wood now. This is an issue because it requires replacement. You can see photos here. One of the areas considered as hole 7 bulkhead, if you notice, in the upper left corner, kind of that settling, the splitting out you see. And you see the lower left-hand photo, how they're not even lining up. That's kind of a concern of the stability of that. The right-hand photo is another area in that same bulkhead. There's a few other photos in the web, but this kind of gives you an idea of the bulkhead condition of most concerns. You could see that. Same thing. We looked at alternatives to wood. And there could be the timber repair, the repair, a steel pile wall, another H-beam wall, pre-placed concrete. And again, some pictures that you could visualize. Again, costs go up with all those alternatives, a different mechanism. They might last longer. Maintenance costs might be less. It's all those pros and cons. There's neither right or wrong. There's cost differences with installation, maintenance, cost of life, et cetera. And some very nice options for wall with a very nice feature. And, of course, one in Arizona here you see a bulkhead feature used for a green, a very nice feature in Marcosi. But with that said, with staff and the city looking at just thought timber replacement was the most cost-effective. Okay. So that decision point or leaning was a recommendation the city had. And with that, you know, you'd have one specialty contract to replace all those bridges and bulkheads. And with that, they also would have the ability to work in smaller transport and equipment hauling. And why that's important in some areas, like on the trail, you see this picture down on the trail. If you did get, like, a precast concrete thing, it could go quicker and they could pop it in. But they'd probably have to have larger equipment with a crane drive down that trail. Really not made for that. You'd probably have to be trimming the trees along the trail so you'd kind of lose your canopy feature of the trail. That you have because you have three bridges along your linear trail, not part of the golf course. So, again, you know, that's a consideration of that. Whereas here with wood, they can come in with small John Deere wagons and get that stuff there. And then the city looked at this aesthetic consideration. Okay. So the next major infrastructure improvement was the irrigation system. And, again, a further evaluation is really needed on that, as well as the pump house and structure. And as we looked at it, one of the key things that is of concern is how much of the pump will need to be replaced with the roof hefts to come off for that. And one of the drivers of that, you see pictures of the roof and the pump slab there, some of the corrosion, et cetera. When we touch some of these things, and for any of these improvements, if we get beyond a repair, and I think the code is, like, if you're more than 50% repair, you might have to bring up to code. But when we replace, you have to bring up to code. So a lot of these things, we have to look, do we have to replace up to code? So we have to look at are these things up to code or not and bring them up to code. The bulkheads bridges, the pump house structure and all that. Other consideration, lower left-hand corner, is a bit of erosion from the lake bank there. And then you see some undermining of the foundation. So that gives them concern, a little bit more assessment. It needs to make sure that gets shored up and so forth. And, like I mentioned, to look at the turf. We consider the turf a major infrastructure requirement to procure ahead of time. So with that, the prior's list that the city asked us to do. So we created the prior's list. We said the bridges and bulkhead replacement or repair should be looked at. Then the pump electrical evaluation. And, again, we're leaning to it's likely got to be replaced, but we have to look at that closer. And, again, with touching all the pump and everything within the structure, look at the pump house structure and that foundation. And the key is that pump is the heartbeat of your whole irrigation system. If we're going to put a new pump in, I want to make sure the building protected works too because none of these will be cheap. Turf procurement. And then the other thing is pre-qualifying golf course contractors for our Phase 2 work. And then evaluate potential phasing options. And some of the considerations to include in talking to everybody is try to minimize disruption and closure, particularly during the peak golf season. That's November to April, roughly. That's when you get your highest rates and so forth. That's when it's spring. We have a lot of the snowbirds, et cetera. The other thing is the fiscal year cycle. When does the city have some monies budgeted and so forth. The other factor we're looking at is the golf course contractor availability. To have folks lined up for 2027 is probably not realistic, okay? It might be possible. But part of the thing with a public project, y'all, we have to have procurement. We have to have a few bidders. We can't just go to one, right? So we have to have some lined up. And many contractors might have their next job lined up because most courses want to do all their work in the off-season too. Everybody wants to do the same thing, right? They want to maximize their revenues during the winter, so they're all looking for those contractors to work here. So some folks are already spoken for 2027. And I mentioned the turf procurement. We couldn't even meet to get to 2027, the turf in time, based on the schedule outline, okay? So a lot of overall course improvements we're looking at doing would be actually 2028, okay? So now we get into phasing elements with that in mind, kind of those constraints and everything we talked about. So with the city, we came up, well, bulkhead bridges are kind of a big driver. If the repair might be needed, it was consideration as a repair done. And then in 2028, we have to rip that out and replace it anyways, right? So the consideration is to replace those bulkhead bridges in fiscal year 2027. With that, when you replace those bulkhead bridges, it's a redo. It will impact those greens that are around it. Those bulkheads are 7, 9, and 12. So those greens would have to get done by that bulkhead being replaced, not just repaired, replaced. And the replace and repair that pump system. And the advantage of doing that is to make sure in 2028, when the future work is done, we don't have issues with a pump being delayed, coming in or whatever, because we want that pump to work, irrigation to work, because when you grow in the whole course, you have to have irrigation. The whole thing is it's at minimum eight weeks, but preferably four months, right? You want that turf and grass to grow in. You have to have that pump and irrigation system running. So we really recommend that being in place earlier, because we don't want delays in the future of tariffs or supply chain issues or gosh knows what, to not have that thing online and have it ready. And it's just an insurance policy, because you're going to need it anyways. And with that, we're touching that pump and doing it. We have to look at what we have to do to that pump house, the foundation, et cetera. I mentioned many times, also procure that turf product to have in time for fiscal year 2028, as well as get those golf course contractors pre-qualified to do that work in phase two. So here's just a schematic quickly so you can all see where the locations of the bridges and bulkheads are and just how scattered are and the three along the trail. Then the phase two in fiscal year 2028, that would be the balance of the golf course. And that would be everything remaining. The tee boxes, the remaining greens, or the 15 greens, sand waste buckers, the fairway rough, the practice area, cart pass circulation, and the turf placement, and the replacement of the irrigation system. So that's really kind of everything else to get done at that time. So moving forward into our next step is to do all those elements we're adding to our team. Not only do we have Harry, our golf course architect, and masters of structural, we're also bringing in a turf specialist and agronomist. They're looking at some of the real details of what the grass should and could be, as well as a focused irrigation design firm, Aquatarf International, okay, as well as an electrical engineer to help look at the electrical, the code of what's coming into the pump house structure, because if that pump changes, we have to make sure that's all up to code and everything else. And so I've got to do some geotechnical around the foundation of that pump house structure. So we've had to supplement our team with a few more subconsultants. So with our scope we're presenting that would be presented, we have 10 major tasks here broken down. Assess the pump house, get our base map and concept plan going, and develop construction plans for the bulkhead bridges and the greens and that. We have to do permitting, and then a fair bit of bidding assistance, which we can get into details of what that is. This is not our typical bidding, and Mr. Spencer could talk to it. But we might need to do a proposed two-step qualifications for bidders and the contractors, even the turf procurement folks, even the pumps, things like that, because we want to make sure the folks are qualified, they've done this before, et cetera. And ideally work along when we're doing the construction plans to value engineer so we can get the best price from them and make any tweaks we can to the plans. So that's an element of the bidding assistance we'll kind of get into. And then our phase two fiscal year 2028 scope and bid items, we'd have to come back to the council in April 2027 because it would be that far out. This is in our scope, and this kind of details the breakdown of that. There is a mix of phase one, phase two items in here, so it gets a little confusing. And I'll get to the schedule because that kind of helps most of it. These are the fees proposed for the ten tasks of a lot. And really what that amounts to is the schedule is not all those tasks are just limited to phase one. Almost 40% of it or so is advancing what we have to have for phase two, if that makes sense. So it gets phase one done, which is construction, but part of what it really does is our, down in the fifth row, our concept plan development and so forth, that's for the entire course, right? It's for the all 18 holes. And the reason we start that now is to get a good handle on what does the city want to see, have that plan out there, and also to give our irrigation designer the ability to narrow down the irrigation layout and things like that because that's our highest cost drivers. We want our irrigation guy to be kind of value pricing the layout during this fiscal year, a better irrigation product of what we can do while we're pumping it, while we're doing that. So some of these elements are advancing what we need to do for phase two, if that makes sense. So really what we're trying to do in this fiscal year is get our permitting done. If we can get authorized, you know, this quarter, we're really kind of tight with stuff. It kind of makes me nervous, honestly, because we have to get going in May. Even though we think we have time, procurement does take a while, right? And we really got to, we want to hit that target to have the construction be in the May-June time frame of next year, complete by November, then open, and then repeat the same cycle for the following year, okay? And with that, I'll stop because I'm sure there's a lot of questions. Thank you for that. Until I see my colleagues jump in, I'm going to ask a couple of questions. Understanding the phasing of the project. I think as we've had conversations about the golf course over the years, we all understand what a gem it is, and it's doing quite well for us. We want to continue to preserve that, not just the revenue stream, but the gem that it is in our community. I thought we were going to do more of a renovation, but when I'm looking at the phasing, am I to understand that because of the assessments, you need to get in there and take care of all the structural issues before we get into that? Because I'm seeing more improvements rather than renovation, and maybe that's not a fair question to you. Maybe that's more for DIP. But I'd just like to explore that a little bit more. When I talk to golfers who go out there, they enjoy it, but you were the original team on the golf course when it was built. It's showing its age. So I'd just like a little bit more information about that, and I'm assuming that the management company that's currently in place, that they've been consulted on this, the day-to-day operations, because they deal with the golfers on a day-to-day, to get that feedback. Okay. You're nodding your head on that one, so I'll say yes. Understand the cost effectiveness of the timber with the bridges, but when I look at the bulkheads, that also is a visual element on the – so not only is it structural, but it's a visual element on the golf course. Has there been any consideration to doing some kind of stonework there? Is it going to be – I know there's going to be a cost escalation, but it would be – when I think of a renovation or improvement to that course, I think that's something, having been out on the course, which would be a benefit. So if you could answer that. Sure. Well, I think I'll try to address a few questions. So when we say improvements, there's a few things. It'll be a facelift. Your 2028 will shift things around. The mounds will change. The sand bunkers will probably change. Again, we haven't done the plan. That's the concept. That's the heavy lifting Harry and us will have to do and bring back to you. But when I say that, renovation redesign is not happening. Like we're not flipping 9 and 18 around and we're not going to just do it because you don't have the money for that. And when I say we're not laying all those things, you're not changing the par layout. You're not changing the yardage of the course. That's what we're proposing when I say improve versus redesign renovation because sometimes when you say that, a golfer might say, oh, man, it's going to be a whole new layout, right, like whole, you know, so that's not where we're going because you're probably not at the budget for that because we still have to be reasonable with what you're doing. But improvements are changing the turf, changing some layouts. Some mounds will change because of the cart circulation. A lot of areas might become waste bunkers where there's been establishment of trees. You have shading now. You're not going to get turf to grow and it's not going to come back in those areas because when I was planted, they were small trees, right? You have 20 years of maturity. Those areas are logical to become waste bunkers like a sand bunker where you could play through it, if that makes sense. So there will be a lot of improvements. And to you, that might be, that's a renovation. That's a redesign. You know what I mean? And I appreciate clarifying. It's kind of we're trying to be careful with the words. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's when the community hears renovation or improvements versus renovation, and I appreciate the clarification on that. Yeah, so your point, we want it to, when it comes back open, it's going to look like it did before. We want it green everywhere, and where it's not supposed to be green, we want to see sand or we want to see that waste bunker. So it's clear definition of rough and fairways, things like that, because we have a lot of weeds and things like that. So there will be some shifting and things like that, but, again, not a total redesign or re-layout. What about the bulkheads? The bulkheads, yeah. Yeah, so typically, and, again, we could have restructural brine speak to it, but I don't think you can really clad onto timber like that to have a stone feature, things like that. You probably have to have the concrete. So it has to be built up with the concrete. Concrete and things like that, and some cum stamp like that. So it's very possible the costs go up. I mean, it's definitely an option. But some of the orders of magnitude are on that chart. I don't know if we can read them, but, you know, those can be looked at, because you do, if that could be budgeted, that's fine. You will save on future repair costs and things like that. And that's it. You don't want to be penny-wise and dollar-foolish. Yeah. So I think we have to look at the long-term in that. Yeah. Okay. Thank you. I'm going to turn it over to Council Member Andreu and then Council Member Anderson up next. You actually, I was going to discuss the bulkheads in the same statements. I don't know. You made it sound like a decision had already been made by administration. It's just a leaning, but, again, it's, I mean, deferred. But that's the most cost-effective and felt was the aesthetics that matched. You could obviously change it and come back with what the alternatives are. You can get just a pretty good idea there if you see that column or rough order magnitude of cost. Timbers for restorations, $200 to 400, a linear foot. And then the concrete there at the end is $600 to $1,000. So order magnitude is three to about three times higher. It is. But like you said, the lifespan also doubles as well. And if we're going to make this type of financial investment, then I'd rather see it done. And one of the other considerations, too, again, there's no options, if, you know, the city did decide. Because, again, turf and things like that, you probably have to look at every 20 years, you're going to have to reinvest in the turf and things like that. So in 20 years, would you want to do a whole redesign, potentially, or say we don't like the layout anymore? I don't know. I can't think that far in advance. But if you put the bulkheads in like that, then you probably don't want to be changing those elements. And you might not want to. In some areas, you really can't. There's on hole 12, it's up against a conservation easement. Could change it, but that's kind of hard. You know, so it's those kind of considerations where, you know, every 20 years, you're going to have to do something with your turf. And you have the option to potentially change it. You'd be locked in. So it's just another decision. But there's no, again, I always say, there's no right or wrong with what's happening. It's not engineering. It's not this is the way it's done. And we're designing something that our future folks are going to use, you know, so. And then my other question is, do you so are you looking for us to make a decision today regarding next steps? That's for Mr. Nunamaker. Hi, Jason, CAO. No, because of the amount of information, we thought giving you this opportunity to kind of absorb it, ask questions, would then kind of tee it up nicely for consideration on the 29th. And so, like, just y'all gave us some feedback on the bulkheads. From staff's perspective, we looked at that, and the current state of affairs is very little maintenance. We have not been very proactive out there. So I think if we stepped up our maintenance schedule, which is our intent, we'd get more life out of that. It wouldn't look like it does today. If y'all want to step that up, that's for tonight. That's the kind of guidance we need. We can dig deeper on those costs. But we are very cost sensitive. We want to make sure that we can do this on a sound budget. We want to keep the play rate reasonable. We're not looking to be a $400 West Palm public golf course. We'd like to undercut Jacaranda, be competitive. And, you know, rate studies are going to have to come concurrent with this at some point. But, no, we want y'all's feedback and, you know, move at y'all's pace. Thanks. Thank you. Council Member Anderson and then the mayor. Hi, Dylan. The bulkhead, I've built a couple freshwater seawalls and a couple freshwater docks. It's usually soft sand and you can just inject posts down. Could a either vinyl or wood be put literally immediately in front of what's existing to not have to remove it? It would give you a lot less weight against it and longer life. And then you don't have the cost of removing it and possibly not have the cost of redoing the greens then. And yet you get a nice facade on the outside. And if it were vinyl, I'm not sure if you can attach like a brick, the brick overlay over the vinyl. I'm not sure if that works. I know you can with lattice and concrete and things. So that's essentially a driven post that has the wood driven behind it. So you could just do another layer. You're only going to lose the one foot, less than one foot. And you could put it in front of it and then cover it over. You need that foot for what? That would help, right? We'll give you one more foot for the ball not to go in. Yeah, get more green space. You could remove, obviously, the cap and shave down the posts and then make it transition so you wouldn't even see the old one. But it's just a thought. Then you wouldn't have to redo the whole green there necessarily. Right. And then that still has some load bearing, even though it doesn't look great. It's still got a pretty good load bearing in most places. And then the new thing would be able to take the load, but for many of the years would have virtually no load on it. So we don't have our structural engineer here. She's watching. But in the backup you have, there is a detailed report of the framing and bracing and stringers and things like that. I'll say this is a concern. You know, the way, and I'm not a structural engineer, we have one on the team, but the way these link and had dead man anchor, it's no longer functioning. It ultimately will fail. When it will fail, we don't know. But it's settling, and this is not load bearing anymore. And you can zoom in, you can see the subsidence even on the grass of the staining. So it's been happening in a while, but I wish I had a little laser there. Right. But what I was saying is to still construct something in front of it, it's still completely load bearing with the dead man's. You just go right through it or whatever, but not go to the expense of demolishing, because then you're going to lose the green and have to redo the green on top of that. And you could potentially cut costs and get longer life out of both. Yeah. It's just something. I'm not sure. You just bring it up to them. I'm not the expert. I know enough to ask the right questions. I understand, because I've brought it up, too, and I never, I didn't think vinyl or that was enough, because I always think it needs to be like steel, because if you drive this steel sheet pile in, then you have the stability, because you have to get down a certain depth, and that has the capacity to withstand that. I'm not sure about vinyl or anything. Some of the pictures you had before were vinyl. Yeah. Yeah. It's possible. Anyway. But I don't know. I don't know the anchoring they have and all that. I will say the greens and all that would get done in 2028 or whenever, so it's not a total redo, but they all have to get redone. Now, our hope is, in Harry's details, what level we have to do, but all would get stripped and redone anyways. So just the level of replacement for bulkhead would be greater than, and hopefully we're optimistic. We only have to take the top layer off and the drainage all works, and that'll be a money saver for the city. But just, you know, all greens will get redone in the improvements that I mentioned. Also, I think when you were talking about phasing and how far out you have to go to procure turf and everything, but really, couldn't these be being addressed ongoing? Couldn't they be already addressing these before? Could this be earlier in the phasing, like in the order? Well, that was looked at of doing a repair, but the repair is – No, no, to – yeah, go ahead. Anyway, to replace, but let's see. What else did I have? And then my other notes. I talked to an avid golfer, and he's – I don't know if the – I'm sorry. I know the report was many pages, and I didn't catch the type of turf, and I don't know if you went into the detail of naming the type of turf. If you recommend it for 7-9-12, but he recommends turf eagle – TIF eagle turf. But then he recommends we should do the whole – all 18 in that. So that'll be something we will come back to as part of this phase on grass in particular, because that's – like I mentioned, we're bringing an agronomist on because it's high sensitivity. And we weren't going to get in tonight, but we will come back to the council if need be, but the turf selection will be very important, and that turf types, the pros, cons, all that will be laid out. We've started that, but that's really part of our next phase, because you have to have what works, what's available, maintenance requirements, pesticide and fungicide requirements of all those things, and the maintenance requirements of those, and what works, and what we have. I mean, Harry's already got ideas on it, what works, but we have to come back, and you all have to select that, right? So this decision is not made, right? They'll have to come back, because you have to procure that, and it's a big ticket item, relatively speaking. So that decision's not made, no. Okay. The last two are just comments from my colleagues. The avid golfer said the current superintendent we have is doing a good job with what we have, and that the pictures – that the course actually looks better than the pictures in there, because he's done so well on the tee boxes and so forth. So those of you that golf it can probably concur that the tee boxes that he's been addressing, the areas he's been addressing, look better than what's in there, because those were taken a little while ago. But knowing that he's working in the confines of this, and we know we need all this done. And the other thing is Sam Midot works for Delray now, a former employee, and the city of Delray just pumped in $28 million into their course and another $700K into their clubhouse. Thank you for that, and I also heard that the new superintendent's doing a great job, so thank you for that. Mayor, and then Councilmember Reinstein, and then Councilmember Fadgen. Thank you very much, Council President Horland. I'm going to try to connect a few dots here, backing it up to when you asked the vendor involved. We had a great, passionate talk last week. If you talk to Louie, you know it's passionate. Louie proposed some things. Could we do this? Why couldn't we do this? And I think one thing you're feeling is what is there to get excited about. And so what Louie said, and I'm asking you, Mr. Larson, if you can help me with this. Louie said the greens that we were talking about were significantly going to be better and that that would be a selling point and that the prices, of course, would go up, and that would be something worth being excited about. Yeah, and if I could just say. Help me evaluate that. Well, like I said, there's no right or wrong, and there's pros and cons with everything. If 7, 9, and 12 are done now and these are replaced, that's another thing that's also out of the way for 2028. It's another thing that would not be an excuse to delay that other work. Will it necessarily shave four months off that 2028 schedule? No. But it's one less thing they have to worry about. It's one less subcontractor. Because also what we're thinking about, if we do some of this woodwork now and some of the future, you have that specialty contractor mobilizing twice. If you have that one contractor, get them out and get them done and out of there. Because they do bridges and bulkheads if we go with wood. If we do other ones, then that contractor is going to have multiple subcontractors anyways, right? But those kind of increase costs if you have the cement guy coming in versus wood. So can you give me the specific names of the greens grass that we bandied about? No, I know the numbers. But the type of grass that we bandied about and he bandied about. And obviously, it has to be approved. We have to vote on it and that kind of thing. Louis gave us like 12 names in 30 seconds. But, yeah. Harry Bowers, Signature Design Services. I like the idea of converting everything to TIF Eagle Greens. The problem you have right now is, and the problem you had starting in 2006, is that you went with pasphalum, which is a variety of grass that was imported from South America or South Africa. It's salt tolerant. It is drought tolerant. There was quite a bit of hubbub about it 20 years ago. Turns out it's not as economical to maintain as everybody thought. It requires a lot of fungicide. It requires a lot of top dressing and verticating because it gets very thatchy. It also is extremely aggressive and the roots can go as deep as a foot. So it's very difficult to get rid of. In looking at this project, there was also a concern of how much grass we're going to strip, grass and soil, and bury on site. To effectively do convert from pasphalum to a Bermuda or an ultra dwarf, it really requires you to strip them. So what I was recommending or what I was thinking is, it would be nice to just strip and bury the green complexes and the surrounds. And that you would come back with what we call an interface grass, which would be another Bermuda, something like Tiff Tuff. But on the actual putting surfaces, you would go with Tiff Eagle. So Tiff Eagle is probably the longest grass that's been around here in South Florida. It's relatively easy to maintain, very cost-efficient to maintain. The only caveat about it is it cannot stand any shade. But you don't have a lot of shade on your green complexes. And it's a little bit quicker too, right? Oh, it's definitely quicker. Yeah, definitely quicker. And which the good golfers love. He's right. It's a marketing tool for you. It's a good thing. So we were already thinking of that. We just didn't want anybody to think we were already committed and made decisions and whatnot. We're still in that phase of let's keep everything open, you know. But, yes, the pasphalum and the fairways, the roughs, the tees, I think you've got to live with it. We would like to come in with a newer variety of it. You have C-dwarf. C-dwarf hasn't really been used for probably 12 years now. So we'd like to come back with platinum pasphalum. Dylan touched on the procurement of it, the deposit. That's one of the drawbacks with pasphalum. There aren't a large amount of sod farms. And it's a grass that's generated out of University of Georgia. But it is available. You just have to get it to where it's yours. Put a healthy deposit down, but it's yours. Thank you for that, Harry. And to my colleagues, if you have not taken a tour and gone out there with Louie and seen him start to pull up some of those routes and see how long they go, it's quite the education to learn about the turf. Is that it, Mayor? Thank you for that. Councilmember Reinstein and then Councilmember Fajon. I know he's chomping at the bat. Thank you, Mr. Larsen. Thank you for the presentation. When you showed all of the partners and all of the different experts and associates and such that would be working with you, and I'm not sure this question is for you. It may be actually more for Dib or the administration, but will there also be a resident liaison, somebody that will be available to respond to residents that have questions about the effect on their homes nearby? You know, a project like this, it may be a good idea to have something very specific on our website that lays out the time period and lays out a contact for residents with questions. What are you thinking in that regard? Well, we are thinking about it. We had a specific discussion about what we put on the website, to your point. What do we put at the golf course? What do we start distributing? As soon as you all make certain authorizations, we'll start pushing that information out because we do want to keep folks informed. I'm sure we're open to suggestions, but it is our intent to stay engaged on that. I think guidance will play a role in that as well, starting very quickly. What about a contact person, some type of resident liaison to respond to questions, particularly for the homeowners that are in the area? That's probably going to be CAP projects, you know, to have a liaison there. If they have particular questions about timing, or let's say they think a contractor is doing something wrong, or, for example, we've got some owls on the course that we've got to be very sensitive to. So if somebody says a contractor just... Or something flew into their pool nearby and they wanted to... What have you. We had some residents reach out about golf balls going into their house, various issues like that. So will you look to put that on the... If you're going to add it to the website or going to add some kind of information, that that contact information is there? Yes, sir. Okay, thank you. That's all I have. Council Member Fadgen. Thank you, Council President Orland. Extraordinary amount of rounds that go through that course. It's over 60,000 a year. That's what the guidance has said, yeah. Yeah, yeah. When I took my tour with the previous superintendent, he was... They thought... The last place, I don't remember where he was at, he said they had 39,000 rounds, and they thought that was crazy. So we have something special that people want to go play at. So to the point of, you know, the aesthetics of the course and the bulkheads, I do think that the investment in more of a stonework kind of finish is probably most... We want to make sure it meets the expectations of the people that are going to be on that course. So that's one of my comments. And then lower maintenance, obviously, because it'll last longer. Did we get every dime out of our course? Could our maintenance been better? That's a pretty generic question. I'll say the course is good. Everybody plays it. And again, you have 20 years of use, right? And that's pretty typical, right, Harry? I mean, it's like you said, you saw the sand bunkers, things like that. And there's information in the back here he provided of just how expensive sand bunkers are to maintain. A lot of courses just cut back on them because it's so expensive, right? So, you know, and again, as the course matured, you can see where everybody drives. You know, there's some of the design issues we have, too. We couldn't get into it. Again, I'll just say there's a lot of details to get worked out, a lot of details. They're not all just made. But like on 9 and 14, you know how the mounds come up along the holes? It channelizes the carts up towards the greens or in an area. So you start wearing out the cart path areas because you're forced to go in there. You can't scatter them, things like that. So some things like that we change. So kind of answer your question is I think it's good because you're still getting draw there, but you have to update it to get your next 20 years and be competitive. I mean, that's what I felt was exciting about this and in my opinion on, you know, looking at the places where grass isn't growing to, so it's not like a mud thing or prevent people from keep driving through it and stuff like that. Regarding like the pump system and the irrigation system, we keep using repair or replace. But what I was reading in there was like, you know, we're using refurbished materials to fix. The software is not supported anymore, so that doesn't sound like a repair. That has to be a replace. Yeah, the irrigation will – the heads and all that will be replaced. The key thing is, and we believe like the mains and all that should be good, like the PVC pipes. It's like the laterals and the heads because the heads will be affected when you go strip everything off anyways. But the repair and replace is like the pump itself by leaning towards replacement. Oh, so the repair part is the plumbing of that. We're not going to rip that all out. We'll repair that where it's necessary. Hopefully. That's the key. So it was kind of interesting, that article regarding the cost of – well, they didn't call them sand traps, but bunkers. So it would be like a re-envisioning of where our bunkers are, maybe a reduction of the bunkers. I thought it was interesting, like the assessment of how technology and how the game has changed, that that will go into the course of the T-box directions and all that stuff. So – but like, you know, the bunkers, is there anticipation of getting rid of – you know, removing some of the sand bunkers? And again, those will be details to – Not eliminating them, but removing some of them. Right, yeah, yeah, yeah. And I think they've got to be strategic, and I don't know if Harry wants to expound on that or not, because it comes down to each hole and course and how it plays, because you still don't want to take the fun out of the game. But also, if it's not really in play, and it's just a visual feature, and it's really maintenance – So it just angles right to the hole. Yeah. Well, we can put everything – we can put everything out, which is nice, right, to the green. But yeah, all those things need to be looked at. And again, you know, some are so out of play, are they necessary because it drives up maintenance costs and the steepness of that, and just some things like that to be looked at. And again, a lot of details that we'll have to get into. I think my last takeaway – and this seems like the first meeting of many meetings we're going to have with the decisions that we're going to do with this, but it seems – and I actually – I was calling Trish, Director O'Keefe, O'Toole, sorry. I was up – I was in my office until 2 a.m. last night, so. Sorry, Trish. You know who you are. Is that the maintenance, if, you know, not properly taking care of the evasive things that grow in the course, how exponentially that increases the overall cost of it. And what I'm proud of about this course is that it's been self-sustained over the last, I don't know, many, many years. And that's important. You know, I'm a golfer, but I'm the only golfer on this dais. So I don't really want them to have to pay for it for something that I enjoy doing. So, you know, to me it's like I want to make sure that – and this might more has to do with our management company – that we have the, you know, the best maintenance going on. We're being proactive. So, it seems like with the irrigation systems, with the new technology, less watering, less chemicals. But that's only as good as the people that are implementing that stuff. So, to me, when we get this done, we're going to spend – I don't even know if we have a number in mind yet – that we have the maintenance of this thing in place so that we get another great 20 years out of the course, and people are using it at such a high volume like they have this time. So, very interesting report. I appreciate your time. Thank you. Thank you, Council, Mayor. Great comments. Thank you, Dylan and Harry, for being with us tonight. We look forward to working with you. Okay. That's it. The workshop is adjourned. We will start the City Council meeting at 6.