Board of County Commissioners on 2023-11-21 9:00 AM - Nov 21, 2023

The first 2023 our board of county commissioners meeting I'll call it to order this morning we are going to have an invocation from our friend Pastor Blaine Allwright from the Christ Fellowship Church followed by the Pledge of Allegiance this morning we don't have a member of our military to lead us in the pledge so we'll just have to do it on our own if you would all please stand thank you good morning good morning let's pray together father as we prepare to celebrate Thanksgiving in a couple of days we come before you as we always should with grateful and thankful hearts thank you for the privilege and the responsibility entrusted to us as leaders and servants of this great community your word reminds us in Proverbs 11 14 says without wise leadership a people falls but there is safety in an abundance of counselors and so we seek your wisdom and your guidance today for every word every decision in gratitude we recognize the blessings that surround us the strength and the spirit of this community the opportunities that we have to make an impact on the lives of those that we get to serve thank you for that pray that you would give us your compassion and your understanding and your heart for justice especially at this time we lift up those who are less fortunate than we are I pray again for wisdom that you'd give us holy inspiration because we know that we need to make decisions and live in a way that reflects your heart again your heart for mercy and justice and justice and justice and love and your word says that when we surround ourselves when we unite around those purposes that there's a blessing there Psalm 133 says that you command a blessing where there's unity so thank you again for that thank you for these commissioners their commitment to serve both humbly and selflessly we pray that you'd continue to bless us personally our families and our county not not for our own sake so that we could just we could just so we could just so we could just so we could just be conduits of your blessing and love to everyone that we get the privilege of serving so thank you again for for this time and all of our blessings we're grateful to you for them in Jesus name amen amen As a matter of fact, I do see a couple of military veterans in the audience, and I thank you. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands, one nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Thank you very much, Pastor. Okay, we have a couple of, we have one additional item, a tangible personal property grant program. See, consent agenda number eight. There are no consent polls. We do not have any additional items, so that is the agenda. Commissioner Smith. Chairman, I would move approval of the agenda with the addition of consent item number eight. Second. Thank you. Let the record show that Commissioner Hetherington will be absent for the entirety of today's meeting, so the votes will be from a grand total of four. We have a motion by Commissioner Smith to accept the agenda as presented, seconded by Commissioner Jenkins. All those in favor? Aye. All those opposed? That motion carries unanimously. We have one proclamation. It's a proclamation declaring Prematurity Awareness Month in Martin County, Florida. Ms. Beaupre, good morning. Good morning, Commissioners, and happy early Thanksgiving. Moms and babies face serious health risks, and March of Dimes fights for their health through research, education, advocacy, and programs. In Florida, March of Dimes has worked extensively to improve maternal and infant health, including advocating for policies that improve health outcomes. November is recognized as Prematurity Awareness Month, with November 17th recognized as World Prematurity Day, as March of Dimes and other organizations work together to respond to the continued maternal and infant health crisis of prematurity. And here to accept, we have Caroline Valencia, who is the director of maternal and infant health initiatives with March of Dimes South Florida. Good morning. Good morning. Thank you all for this opportunity to accept this proclamation. If you all haven't been affected by preterm birth, it is a very scary time for women and families, when oftentimes, if baby is born too soon, women are not able to, women and families are not able to hold their baby, might have to stay in the neonatal intensive care unit, and nationally, one in 10 babies is born preterm. This can have long-standing health issues, socio-emotionally, cognitive delays, or other physical delays. So it is a critical issue that March of Dimes continues to work for. Luckily, in Martin County, this rate is less than that, less than the state, so we're doing great work here. But we want to continue to raise awareness so that everyone knows how they can prevent this issue and know the signs and symptoms of preterm labor so they can get care right away. So thank you all for the time this morning. Okay, we're at the public comment portion. I only have one request to speak for them. If you have two. So we'll start with the first one that I have. Just for the record, how it works, the folks that are here probably know this, but how it works is you'll have three minutes to explain or discuss anything you'd like with us of a general nature or of an agended item that will be coming up later in the meeting. At the two-minute and 45-second point, you'll hear a tone, which means you'll have 15 seconds to sort of finalize your thoughts. If you speak on an agended item in the morning, you cannot speak again on that same agended item later when the item appears. So if I call your name and you'd like to wait, you can just let me know. Otherwise, we will have it. And we'll start this morning with Mr. Tom Pine. Mr. Pine, good morning. My name is Tom Pine. I live in Jensen Beach. I've been a member of, lived in Martin County for over 50 years. Once again, this county commission will use this consent agenda to approve $13,869,947.22 in expenditures from taxpayers between October 24th and November 6th of 2023, without identifying the payees or the purpose of the payments. At this meeting, more than $11 million in contracts that will be hidden in the consent agenda. This is just one more way to circumvent Florida's open sunshine laws. They include Bathtub Beach and Sailfish Point Beach Restoration, $5,920,000. Management and maintenance of the St. Lucie Inlet South Jetty, $2,498,000. And last but not least, the operation of that fantastic Marty bus system, $3,192,510, all hidden in the consent agenda. And of course, none of them are routine expenditures. And if that wasn't enough to question the integrity of the majority of our county commissioners, why is the county going to pay 60% of the amount of the tangible property tax owed by Florida Power and Light for equipment and other taxable materials at the Indiantown facility? The extent as well as the reason for the tax break for FP&L is unclear. It will not be disclosed or discussed by our county commissioners because, of course, this item is hidden in the consent agenda. Just like the special deal that Martin Jensen Beach Chamber of Commerce got a few years ago when they were given the community center to run as they see fit. We, the taxpayers of Martin County, paid $1.5 million for that community center in 2020. How much rent does the Chamber of Commerce pay? Sorry, it's hidden in the consent agenda. And today we're going to see, once again, the LPA, just like the majority of our county commissioners, could care less what the overwhelming majority of Martin County residents want when it comes to development. The 3-2 vote to continue to destroy Western Martin County was on full display at the last LPA meeting. The LPA pointee of the county commissioner who sits on the Martin County Chamber of Commerce Board of Directors gave an impassioned argument for allowing property owners to make more money by converting agricultural land to a use that will generate a bigger profit. It sounds like the Martin County Chamber of Commerce is well represented on the Martin County Commission and on the LPA Board. They won't be happy until every piece of land in Martin County is developed. What you permit, you promote. What you allow, you encourage. What you condone, you own. Thank you for your time. Thank you, sir. Our next request to speak for Mr. Casey Kass. Morning, Commissioners. Morning. Morning. Ms. Hurd, how are you? Morning. So, in the past week, we met with Susan Kors, meaning we, Salerno residents, met with Susan Kors and George Stokas, and we tried to hash through an understanding of some of the things that are going on in Salerno, and we were tasked with going back to our group, which is rapidly becoming the majority of residents in that area, and asking what their opposition was to the linear park and some of the other issues there. The overwhelming response was they simply just do not want it. That's what the majority want. Unlike what just happened in Palm City when the residents wanted land purchased to prevent something, we feel that the NAC and CRA is being sidestepped and pushed aside with personal agendas, and I'm here to implore you to at least seek out what the residents of that area are requesting, want, or care about prior to voting for any expenditures of taxpayer money to purchase properties. And that's basically it. I'd also like to say that I've seen all of you more than I've seen my own family in the past four months. I never imagined that I'd be here doing this every time. I certainly hope that you'll take that into consideration as the things push forward. Most of you are heavily supported by our community, and we're becoming a pretty substantial voting bloc. We appreciate everything that you do, and I hope you have a great Thanksgiving. Thank you, sir, very much. Our next request to speak for him is Mr. Bob Ernst. Greetings, Commissioners. Greetings, Commissioner Hurd, Commissioner Jenkins, Commissioner Ciampi, and Commissioner Smith. I sent you all an email because I won't have time to cover it all today, and I wanted to make sure that you had the information I'm going to speak about. You'd think when I go into this that Tom and I conferred on this. We did not. I haven't seen Tom for years, but we're speaking on the same subject. What got me to come here is what you all got, too, I'm sure, the tax bill, the exorbitant tax bill. And I wasn't here during budget hearing time because I don't stay in Florida in the hot summer, but I follow it. And it's too late to come here at budget time to talk about what's in the budget because what we're going to talk about today will already be in there, and we won't be able to address it. I'm here because of the exorbitant tax bill, and then I look at the agenda, and I see this exorbitant agenda, which Tom has already touched on, the same items that I wrote you previously. The 60%, that's $18 million, I think, as best as I can find, FPL shareholders don't need to be supported by Martin County taxpayers. That's outrageous what you're doing there. You've already done it. I don't know how many millions of dollars we've already lost in taxes, and now you're suggesting to do it again. And I wonder, you know, how's FPL influence this vote with you? What do they do to get your vote if you're going to vote for it? I mean, that makes me very concerned about why they're getting this kind of break that we taxpayers are going to end up paying for, commissioners, accountability. And we're going to be watching and hear how this vote goes because I'm fed up getting a tax bill like this. Tom already touched on it. I went out to Bathtub Beach last night because I wanted to see what I was talking about. And you should not even discuss this, really, until you go out and look at that disaster. Bathtub Beach is an environmental disaster paid for by the taxpayers of Martin County and directed by whoever runs the county. It is a disaster. Not one more penny should be thrown into that beach. Ask your staff how many millions of dollars has already been squandered, and look at the condition of that beach. Now, I went to St. Lucia Beach, and I went to Stewart Beach. Those are beautiful beaches. They need better management. There are people in the dune grass. They shouldn't be up there. There are Shays lounges in the dune grass. They shouldn't be up there because that's what protects the beach. That's why I gave you this, Commissioner, is so you could read all the items that I haven't covered. And I appreciate your time. And, again, we're going to – I can't stay here. I've got to go find the money to pay the bill. So I can't stay here for the meeting. I don't know what – Your time is up. Thank you. Thank you, sir. Your time is up. Thank you. Mr. Ernst, hopefully you can hang around for like 10, 15 minutes. I'm going to respond to some of your – Give me a few bucks because I'm going to try to make this – We'll see what we can do. Our next request to speak for them is Ms. Robin Cartwright. Good morning, Commissioners. As you know, the LPA voted last week to approve a project that would expand the urban service boundary. We all knew the floodgates would be opened with the approval of Becker and Discovery's, the poster child for the lawsuit. In fact, there was an article in 2010 about four projects specifically, including the one that was approved by the LPA on Thursday, about how these projects would change the complexion and personality of Martin County. So I ask you, why have a planning department if they aren't planning? There's supposed to be consistency and continuity regarding what goes where so that traffic patterns don't have to be justified, and infrastructure, including sewer, drainage, and schools, can be easily implemented. But instead, we have developers who come in and ask nicely without anyone having any concern for the impact down the road, and they are aided by staff, committees, and commissioners who inevitably help with the PR campaign. But back to Thursday's vote. One committee member was upset that people speaking were upset because we don't feel like we're being heard, but his family has been here longer, so we should just defer to him. Presumably, he knows better, and he voted yes. There's a committee member who is in over her head, and she voted yes, though I'm not sure she could actually tell you why. And there's one committee member who said he felt sorry for the developer that he owned the land for so long and wasn't able to make any money on it. Well, first of all, are you kidding me? But any land purchase is speculative. There has been an agricultural exemption for many years, so any taxes that were paid were comparatively minimal. But the reality is that the most recent holding company purchased this land just this past February for $50 million, but we should still feel sorry for him, and that LPA member voted yes. Thankfully, there is one LPA member who was focused on the actual comp plan and the ramifications of approving such a project. A second LPA member understood these concerns and voted accordingly. They voted no for objective, valid, and understandable reasons. This goes hand-in-hand with one of the county commissioner's statements that they approve projects in part based on somebody's reputation and if they're a good person. That same commissioner voted to approve a consent agenda budget item to fund a project whose owner currently has a series of complaints and violations with Martin County as a business owner, but on his private property as he is doing projects on his personal property without proper permitting. And if I'm not mistaken, the DEP has also gotten involved as per the county's own notes. These are but two examples of decisions being made that affect 168,000-plus people in Martin County with a lack of consistency and approach, which is only to be outdone by the lack of consistency and rationale. There are no standards, just justification sometimes accompanied by a friendly phone call to an applicant or their counsel as to any opposition that might exist. Personally, I look forward to the 2024 elections. Thank you very much. Is there anyone else that would like to address us at this time? Seeing none. We'd come back to the board and we will start with you, Commissioner Smith. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Um, typically, usually I don't like, uh, getting into personal family matters, but I will share with you last week, uh, that our little one, um, required 9-1-1, uh, to be called. Um, she had a temperature of 104 and, um, that was not good. Uh, and there were other things going on at the same time. And part of that I share with you is that, uh, Fire Rescue showed up. They were incredibly professional. They did their job. Um, and for a three-year-old to have to get into an ambulance and have to understand what's going on around her, um, she did remarkably well, but they were incredibly professional, um, incredibly good at what they do, um, and then top of their, um, job. And so, uh, kudos to all of them and thank you, um, for their sense of urgency that they always perform. And if it was someone else I knew, I would share with you the same story, but it just happened to be us. So, uh, thank you very much. Okay, thank you for sharing. And by the way, have a great Thanksgiving. Thank you. Thank you for sharing that. Commissioner Jenkins. Um, just two things. Um, we have two Christmas parades, uh, before our next, um, meeting. December 2nd, uh, at 1 p.m. is the Hope Sound Parade. And Indiantown Parade lines up at 4 on the same day. So, come out. Okay. That's it. Thank you. Commissioner Hurd. Yes, last week I spent three very busy days in Washington, D.C. The, uh, original purpose of my visit was to attend the South Florida Ecosystem Restoration Task Force Advisory Board meeting. It's a, it's a meeting of, of federal and state and tribal, uh, representatives to discuss Everglades Restoration. And it's very encouraging. Uh, the state and the, uh, uh, federal government are, are both enthusiastic, uh, participants in Everglades Restoration. Projects are moving along, uh, very, very well. There's a lot of good cooperation. It was a very good meeting. The, uh, one of the main purposes of the task force is to establish the integrated delivery schedule, which funds, uh, and, and also strat, uh, does the strategic planning for SERP. So, that's proceeding very well. We also, uh, met with everything from, uh, elected representatives to, uh, Army Corps personnel. It was a very, very busy and productive three days. And, and I just wanted to assure Martin County residents that you're in good hands. And on Friday, I went to the, uh, C-44 project. Um, there were, uh, Army Corps and state representatives there, uh, to describe the progress and the testing on the C-44, uh, project. And I know that there has been, uh, a newspaper article that implied that the, uh, project was not successful and that it couldn't be farther from the truth. The project is testing. Uh, it's been tested up to 10 feet successfully. Uh, the capacity, the, the design capacity is 15 feet. So, operational testing is done, is being done now so that we can obtain peak performance from the, uh, uh, reservoir and the STAs. And it's going according to plan. Um, tweaks are being made and, and the project is, is performing, uh, satisfactorily. So, that's what I have. Thanks. Thank you very much. Uh, a couple of, oh, Commissioner Smith. Yeah. Thank you, Commissioner Hurd, for bringing that up. I, I agree. Um, I, I was to be there for the full, um, couple days. And unfortunately, what was going on at home, I needed to get back home. But I did make the better part of the meeting, the task force meeting on, uh, Wednesday morning. Um, one thing I think I would share with everybody relative to the entire storyline for Everglades restoration and for our purposes here in Martin County, it's incredibly complex. Um, there, there are all sorts of projects that are happening. Um, as Commissioner Hurd said with C44, there's C43 going on. Um, there's the big project south of the lake. There's Picayune Strand going on. Um, there's Western Everglades going on. But all of those projects come with an enormous amount of complexity. And that was very much, if you listened through the conversation of the morning, the complexity and the dynamics of everybody involved is very much apparent, um, relative to what people had to say. And so, um, I encouraged, uh, John Mayle to get with our staff when he got back to put together, uh, excerpts of the meeting. I, I think it would be helpful for people to hear and, and see the presentation so that they understand it's, it's, it's not just as simple as saying, just do this with the water. There are so many different pieces of the puzzle that are in, in the midst of it all that have to be put together. Um, and so I, I think if you listen to the presentations and you listen to the various comments from the board members from the task force, you'll have maybe a little bit better understanding for those complexities. And, uh, so anyway, Don, I, I hope that staff can put that together, get it on our, our website and under hot topics and, um, keep sharing the progress because there's a lot of progress being made. There's a lot of money being spent, but at the same time try to capture the complexity so that everybody understands that it's not just, if we just do this, that'll solve all the problems because it's not just a simple one silver bullet handles all the water and all the complexities of what's happening. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Thank you very much. A couple of quick things. One, um, I know that there was some question and concern regarding a consent agenda item. Uh, I had received a few emails and then I received Mr. Ernst's email, uh, first thing this morning. I had asked Mr. Donaldson to explain a little more, uh, clearly how that situation comes to be. It's not exactly a 60% discount to FPL. So Mr. Donaldson, can you explain what that is and how that works, please? Yes, commissioner. So the, um, TPP agreement with, uh, Florida Power and Light does provide essentially a rebate on, on taxes that they... Can you explain what a TPP is, please? Tangible personal property tax. That's, um, equipment and industrial equipment that is, uh, eligible for taxation by, under state, uh, law. And, uh, uh, so in this particular case, the, um, so the power plants, all any kind of, uh, if you have, uh, heavy manufacturing equipment, it's going to be taxed based upon the value of it, uh, it can be depreciated. But in this particular case, the property in question in Indiantown, FPL stores typically brand new equipment waiting for disbursement to, uh, either power plants or equipment such as, um, large transformers, other types of, uh, of things. Um, and they have the choice of placing that anywhere. So this isn't like what's inside their, their, um, their, their power plants. This is, uh, basically spare parts and other things that's made available. So back in, uh, 2017 or so that the, um, the, uh, uh, FP&L was looking and they had determined that they had other, other sites in the state that they were looking to relocate their entirety of the, of the, of the, of the materials stored in, in Martin County, um, uh, unless we could arrange an, arrange an agreement that could, uh, provide a equal taxation compared to some of the lower taxed counties in the, in the, in the state. Um, and, and so that was the, that agreement was signed in 2018. Um, it came to, was due to expire. Uh, this simply renews the existing agreement. Um, one caveat was, is that there was a goal that they would actually increase the storage there. So, uh, uh, to basically try to max the amount of taxes that we had collected before the agreement by basically storing a lot more value in equipment. Um, they did meet that goal one year. They did not due to, uh, Hurricane Nicole and Ian. They did have a reduction due to that storm, but they did over time, uh, bring it back. So, um, the, uh, final, the short story is the agreement as, uh, adopted today is the same as the agreement was in the last years of the last agreement. Um, again, FP&L was, um, uh, you can either work with us or we'll move our stuff. Or somewhere else, I think is probably the simplest way to say it. Uh, and, uh, and so for us to, we still are, uh, are, are collecting, uh, over $2 million, $2.6 million in taxes from, from FP&L based upon the estimate. Uh, and again, we're looking to measure, um, the equipment that they place in, um, uh, over time. Uh, their goal is to, again, to continue to increase the, the valued equipment there. So, uh, this, we, uh, anticipate that the tax dollars collected from this site will go up, um, part of this agreement expanded the area, actually made it a little larger, um, than it was existing. And the final thing was, is that, uh, for our own planning purposes, uh, we've asked that they provide us notice, uh, um, you know, six, uh, six months prior to, like in February of each year, um, on their anticipated, uh, amount that they would have on there so that we would have some warning, uh, in the event of, like, hurricanes or other, and they had to deplete the supply that we would have a heads up, um, um, um, in time to, uh, uh, um, adjustments to our budget if necessary. And that's included in this agreement update that, um, Ms. Woods helped negotiate. So, thank you. Thank you. Just to, before Commissioner Smith, just to, uh, reiterate some of what Mr. Donaldson had said. I was involved at the time with negotiating with FPL on behalf of the county and our staff, because the location of that warehouse and storage facility was in my district, not anymore. Um, it's in Commissioner Jenkins' district now, so is everything else. But with that in mind, uh, I want to be clear that the messaging that we're giving a 60% discount is inaccurate because this is not at a power plant, as Mr. Donaldson said. This is a arbitrary storage and warehouse site that could be anywhere in any of the counties that FPL operates in. So, instead of thinking that we're giving them 60% discount, think of us getting 40%, and as Mr. Donaldson said, 2.6 million. There are other counties that were aggressively courting FPL with a much more lucrative, uh, negotiated opportunity for FPL. And I'd like to thank the folks. Um, this is a, this is a renewal of an agreement that we already had that also dramatically impacts Indian town, because, you know, this facility is also within the boundaries of Indian town. And if you'd think, well, you know, FPL, you know, they're not going to move this stuff. There was a previous commissioner who's no longer sits up here, who really had a problem with this negotiation, with this deal, and kept pushing and pushing. And FPL was, was days, if not weeks away from, uh, sending in a fleet of trucks to remove a majority of the most expensive items, leaving things that would not have, would have been negligible on the tax roll. So when people want to complain and be concerned about an issue like this, I wish, and some did, not with enough time to respond. So, um, most of what we do has a legitimate reason. Now people, you know, uh, rational thinking people can disagree, but this particular one is an advantage for the county. They could put those things anywhere they want. They happen to be putting them here. We have a very good relationship with, uh, FPL corporate, uh, they are massive taxpayers for the county. They are massive, gigantic taxpayers for Indian town. And this was another opportunity for them to collaborate with us to the tune of $2.6 million. So I am appreciative that they would store those items that they could store anywhere they want. They store them with us. Commissioner Smith. Um, two additional highlights to what Commissioner Campy just said, I think, just to emphasize that if we had lost this facility, the significance to Indian town was enormous. Um, it might have compromised their ability to operate. That's number one. Number two, uh, this was also at a time when, uh, one of the units had been shut down permanently, uh, was going to be lost in one of the power generation units. And certainly part of the discussion and part of the, the understanding was that how, how could we balance out losing one of the power units in the value of that to our tax base and manage this at the same time? And I agree with Commissioner Campy. It was, it was a, it was a, um, long and difficult discussion. Um, but at the end of the day, I think the right decision was made for Martin County and for the taxpayers specifically of Martin County that we kept a significant amount of value and tax base coming back into the community that FPL could have otherwise gone to two, three other communities that they were actively looking at. And so, um, when you factor in all of the competing discussions, Indian towns discussion, what we lost with the power generation unit going down, um, and keeping this facility, I think it was the right thing to do and still do. And just to let you know that's Indian town also has the same agreement with FPL to provide a reduction. Thank you. The next thing that was discussed that I know causes people concern, I've had people ask me about it as well as our Marty bus system. Um, Mr. Donaldson, I'd like to have a, um, an agenda item where we can have that conversation again. Uh, I'd like to, for me, what is really compelling is the comparison between how our service is being, uh, utilized by our residents versus how that service, which is a comparable service in a comparable County, Indian river County, uh, and how successful it is there. So instead, in my opinion, instead of us looking to say, well, it hasn't worked to the level that we'd wanted it to. So we should get rid of it. I think we should look to see how is it working so well in Indian river County, um, which is not Miami-Dade or Palm beach or Jacksonville. It's a sister County of ours. It's a very comparable demographic, uh, logistical County as ours. I think theirs is a tremendous success. Uh, I'd like to use that comparison to show what our system could be and should be. Uh, so if we could have an agenda item that explains how well it's going in Indian river County and what we could potentially be looking at here. Uh, there's a lot of conversation and, and I, I drive my car as well and I participate in, in some of the frustrations that residents have in terms of our traffic. If we could continue, uh, most communities use public transportation as a way to decrease potential traffic, I think instead of looking at Marty as something we should get rid of, I think it should be something that we figure out what's wrong with it or with the riders, you know, philosophy that they don't want to ride it, but they do ride it in Indian river. Uh, and with that, I am done. Mr. Donaldson, anything for us? Yes. Well, we'll continue with the vein of transit because we did get a report from the triennial review from Florida, uh, federal transit administration. And we had no findings at all, which is significant because of the agencies out there, I think between federal transit administration, uh, or FEMA is a toss up of which one is the most difficult to survive and audit through. So, um, our staff did a wonderful job. Ashman, uh, uh, Beecher and, uh, and his staff has, has really been doing a really great job. Um, I, I know this community has always questioned transit. In fact, uh, when I, uh, was, uh, in engineering and, um, and made some comments, uh, years ago about, uh, a transit audit and how things could be better. That's when Russ handed me the transit duties and said, well, why don't you take it over? And so, uh, lesson to staff about when you, uh, make some comments, see, I want to volunteer. But, you know, we've come a long way in, in, in, I think, uh, transit, um, um, uh, serves us, uh, uh, uh, an underserved portion of the population. A lot of folks rely on that for, um, um, um, to get to work and to get to their doctors and, and, and, and other things. And so you need to keep an eye on that. The other thing is, uh, it's largely funded by, um, the, uh, federal government, uh, is a large part of how we fund transit. We've always had a debate in this county of how we should operate it. I think when we do bring that agenda, Ina back, you'll find that Indian River spends at least four times more than we do, uh, on the system. Uh, and so, uh, it's been always a challenge of what you, how much service you provide and how much we invest in it. But the last thing I wanted to say is from the beginning, um, why don't we have a staff member who's been working on these audits with, with us and with me over the years and now with Ash, and that's Diane Moore. And she's been part of the budget office and has done a tremendous job of, uh, navigating the, the bureaucracy and the, the fine tuning of, to get that. So I just really, to end on a positive note on transit is we really have some outstanding staff. Ash has got great group and Diane Moore is doing a fantastic job. So, uh, I want to, uh, personally thank them for their hard work and it shows up, uh, on a, on a no finding letter from, uh, FTA, which they rarely give to anybody nationally. I received as the chairman, I received that letter from them and it was glowing, uh, in their praise of our staff and said, like you said, that very few communities ever get the, the findings that we did or no findings in this case. So, uh, well done for them. We'll go now into Ms. Elder. You're sitting here for County Attorney Woods today and we appreciate that. Anything to add? Thank you so much. We will take up agenda item departmental quasi judicial. Oh, you're going to be sitting over there instead of, I won't be looking at you to. Quasi judicial number one request for revised major final site plan approval for seven J's industrial subdivision park parcel 19 and a portion of parcel 11 P one zero two dash zero 78. Um, it's quasi judicial. So I will ask my colleagues, commissioner Smith, have you had any ex parte communications? If I do, they're filed. Thank you. Commissioner Jenkins. If I do, they've been filed. Thank you. Commissioner Hurd. If I have any, they've been filed. Thank you. If I have any, they've been filed as well. Um, anyone that's going to be offering testimony, if you would please stand to be. Raise your right hands. Do you swear or affirm the evidence you're about to give will be the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. Are you return receipts that are necessary? Do you have a copy of your work history and the agenda item? Let the record show that it's being submitted. Is there anyone intervening? Nobody's intervening. Thank you. And with that, sir, you are recognized. All right. Thank you, chairman. Chairman, commissioners. For the record, Brian Nealon, principal planner with the growth management department, a copy of the agenda item and my work history have been provided. This is a request by Engineering and Design Construction, Incorporated on behalf of C.W. Roberts Contracting, Incorporated, for approval of a revised major final site plan. Included with this application is a request for a certificate of public facilities reservation. This project proposes reconfiguring a developed parcel 11 in the 7J subdivision to accommodate relocating an asphalt plant to the west and reconfiguring parking. Parcel 10 will install a paved access road, and the site will make the required improvements to infrastructure and landscaping. Project site includes all of parcel 10 and a portion of parcel 11 of the plat of the 7J subdivision. The proposed development is approximately 13 acres and is located at 8530 Southwest Jamie Way in Palm City. This proposed development is being heard before the board today due to the height standard requirements defined in Article 3, Division 2, Section 3.14 of the land development regulations related to non-habitable structures which requires any non-habitable structure exceeding 60 feet to be approved at the discretion of the board of county commissioners. The proposed height of the asphalt silo is 62 feet and 3 inches. You can see here this is parcel 10, portion of parcel 11. This is the existing asphalt plant, and this is where the new asphalt plant is proposed, as well as providing some parking and the stabilized access on parcel 10. Development review staff have found the 7J subdivision park parcel 10 and portion of parcel 11 application to comply with all applicable regulations. And the comprehensive growth management plan is detailed in the staff report. Review of this application by the LPA was not required. Staff approves this application, and we move that the board receive and file the agenda item and its attachments, including the staff report, as Exhibit 1. And we move that the board approve the revised final site plan for 7J's subdivision park parcel 10 and portion of parcel 11 project. That concludes the presentation. Mr. Elam, thank you very much. Questions for staff? Commissioner Hurd. Yeah, why is there a height limit of 60 feet, and why is staff recommending that that be ignored? Well, that's within our land development regulations. Why is it 60 feet? Is that arbitrary? It's 50% of what's allowed in the code. So 40 feet is what's allowed in industrial. So 50% of that allows 60, which can be administratively approved. Anything above that has to be approved by the board. Okay. And why is staff recommending that this be approved? Well, we're bringing it before the board for your approval. We do. We do. I'm sorry. Peter Walden, Deputy Growth Management Director. Staff does recommend approval because this silo is integral to the operations of the asphalt plant. It's located in an area where it can't be seen from the public. It's well hidden in an existing industrial park. And the height increase is very minimal over what the regulations already accrue. And the opportunity is in the code for the board to make these types of exceptions. And is this height restriction new? No. No, it goes back to... So the applicant has known for a very long time that this height restriction existed? I would assume. Okay. Thank you. I've had the opportunity to tour the original plant. It's in my district. It is professionally done. It is very clean site. The advantage of having a plant like this in our county would mean that product can be made and then trucked locally versus having to truck product in from out of the county and put these heavy trucks all over the roadway. They can generate the product where it is and then utilize it closer. I mean, I think that the system is working, that if staff saw the need for an opportunity for an existing business that has been operating out there, it cannot be, I've been there, cannot be seen from the roadways or from the neighborhoods. And the reason in my mind why we are agreeing to do it is because we're trying to support and encourage economic development and existing businesses to work, employ people, make a profit, God forbid, and work in our county and be productive, you know, give residents an opportunity to work at this plant because I know locals work there, and it's owned locally. It was built by a local, a long-time local resident. And so why would we not support an opportunity to show that we are trying to assist existing businesses? Commissioner Smith. And I don't know who has the best institutional knowledge on this, but the code has been in existence to allow these kind of exceptions since? At least since 2002 with the adoption of Article III. And are there other industrial sites in Martin County that have used a height exception standard? I am not familiar with one. Maybe Mr. Robinson is. I don't. There's at least three that I know of. Yeah. Dreyfus? Dreyfus is one. FPL. Yes. Our biggest taxpayers. You just answered the question. I did. Paul Schilling, Growth Management Director. So the FPL site is one of those with the power plant. These are few and far between. These are peculiar and particular to a certain site with the conditions of the site. They are peculiar and particular with the business owner. So that all being said, we feel it's appropriate to recommend approval. There are enhancements that have been done to this asphalt plant over the years, and these are anticipated. So this would allow the successful business to continue. I just wanted to, for the public's purpose, let them understand that there are at least, I thought there were three, but maybe there's just two, Dreyfus and FPL. And I thought there was a third. Cogen? Cogen? Yes. Cogen. The old Cogen. The old Cogen, yes. Thank you. With that, unless there's another. Well, yeah, but that's. I'm just saying. Sometimes when it's needed, you've got to do it. Is the, and I'm not trying to. Rush it. Rush, but is the applicant making any kind of presentation or. I was about to find out. Because if not, I was going to make a motion. Well, I guess he's going to. Applicant's opportunity to make a presentation. Sir, good morning. Good morning, Commissioners and Chair. David Baga with Engineering, Design, and Construction out of Port St. Lucie. We don't have a presentation prepared this morning. I think staff did a great job and certainly has been expeditious and great at helping us through this process. Most of the high points have been presented and discussed in what you just had that we are here before you with the requirement being the only thing triggering it for a major site plan. You know, I will speak that the team explored many, many options mechanically, physically, structurally for that. And there wasn't a real feasible manner to get the particular silo for this plant to less a height than the 62.3 inches that we have on here. So we appreciate the consideration for that. I will say, you know, it does give us an opportunity now submitting a final site plan to you all to do some improvements on the site associated with this. So, you know, as Brian's presentation showed, there are site plan improvements, you know, for stabilizing the access, getting cleaned up. I mean, asphalt plants by nature can be messy. But this particular site, as the Chairman alluded to, has been run clean. And there's no other intent than to improve the site beyond what it's operating at now and get it in good running shape. Last point I'll make is that, you know, this particular plant does serve a local need, not only to private contractors, but public works projects. Having the ability to have those materials in county is not, you know, only a cost and transportation benefit, but also timing. There's time factors in having, you know, a plant such as is operating at 60% capacity like they have and bringing in things from Okeechobee County and such. So with that, I'm open to answering any questions you all might have. Thank you. Questions for the applicants, Representative. Leave that for us. Commissioner Smith. If there aren't any, if there's any public comment. I have one request to speak for him. Ms. Galels, are you here to speak on this item? Please come forward. Thank you. Still three. Just from what I've heard, I don't, I would like to know where the plant's going to be located. You said it's in your district. I'm in your district. Where? I'll tell you when you're done. I don't want to eat into your time. Okay. Well, my time today is mainly about myself. I'm disappointed with the fact that I have not been at more of these meetings to comment and know where all this growth was coming from. You just see it now. We have way too many buildings everywhere. I don't know if you all anticipated the increase in crime that we have here, but it's really increased. And you all do not live in a glass bubble. It could affect you as well. We just had another incident where a young woman got hit crossing a pedestrian crossway by Kyle G's restaurant, and it was a hit and run. Now, are those the kind of people that we want here? We're going to have them. We already have drugs in Port Salerno. We have the police everywhere calling us, telling us you've got robberies in Palm City. Expect more of them in Hobes Sound. These may not just be people coming up from Miami. These are probably people here now. And again, you do not live in a glass bubble, and I do hold you responsible for this. Property owners have a right to sell their property, but because they sell it does not mean that everything they want to do should be approved. That's my point. And I got a letter from you, an email, about the entrance to Tractor Supply. That swamp is still a swamp. It is not a Sand Hill Crane sanctuary. And I would like to know when that's going to be rectified. I emailed you. I know you have a staff. I know you get a lot of emails. I got no response. So please let me know when that property is going to be cleaned up, because it is quite an eyesore. It's a third world eyesore. That's all I have to say. I would like a response to that. Thank you, ma'am. We're in the middle of an actual agenda item, though it's quasi-judicial, so I want to finalize this. And then I will, the point that you made in regards to this particular project is this is in the 7Js. It's been in existence. It's not a new one. It's just asking for a revision to their existing plan. If you know where the transfer station is, the Martin County Transfer Station or the Sheriff's Shooting Range at the end of, it's not a landfill anymore. It's a transfer station. It's that most people would remember it in the previous life. It was a landfill, the Martin County Landfill. So, and it's already been in existence for quite some time. We have a motion. Any other public request to speak on this topic? We have a motion yet. What? You don't have one yet. Okay. We're about to have a motion. You ready? Yes, sir. I would move staff's recommendation. Second. Thank you. We have a motion by Commissioner Smith for staff's recommendation, seconded by Commissioner Jenkins. All those in favor? Aye. All those opposed? Opposed. Motion carries three to one with Commissioner Hurd dissenting and Commissioner Hetherington absent. As an aside, the area on High Meadows to the eastern side of the tractor supply location, I agree with the previous speaker. It looks like a mess. It looks, I use the word dystopian. It is, so if it is some kind of a sanctuary, I think it, and I'm not an expert, it looks like a mosquito sanctuary to me. I think it needs a fence, because I have to drive past it every single day. Whatever is happening there, if it's some environmental, and I'll give you a chance to respond to Mr. Schilling. It's just a mess. And I do agree. It's a mess. What would you like to say? A couple things. And first of all, it wasn't recognized as a Sand Hill sanctuary. It is, in fact, a wetland with a buffer around that wetland that are protected in Martin County. So no net loss. It's not mitigated. It's a wetland, and it is associated with a Preserve Area Management Plan with the Palm Pike Plaza. So there have been ongoing efforts, specifically a year or two ago, to remove exotic vegetation that was in that underperforming wetland, let's just say. Over time, that wetland vegetation that was planted will grow, but it's not something that happens overnight. So we're working with the POA for the Palm Pike Plaza, the Property Owners Association, and a couple of the applicants to perhaps enhance that area with additional vegetation along the sidewalk. As you know, it is very close to the roadway, so there is not room within the right-of-way to facilitate a fence or any type of other screening. But it is a natural area. It is a wetland. Those are protected in Martin County. So there may, from time to time, be certain waterfowl that visit that site, but it is not a sanctuary in that respect. It is a wetland preserve area associated with the PAMP. I do remember reading your response to that in the past. There is large stumps, I guess, at some point when they had done some of the initial work. And I do remember you saying that there was a two-year time frame for them to organize and get their acts together. I believe the two years are up. I think it was up in the summer. We have, in fact, been coordinating with the consultant that works on that preserve, and there are some plans for potentially revegetating some of that area, or enhancing it, rather. But we have to keep in mind that for decades that was infested with very, very large amounts of invasives that were removed. And as a result of that, there were requirements to revegetate it with the appropriate native vegetation. And those things take time. No, I hear you. But when you have your next meeting out there, or if you could schedule one, I'd like to come. Yes, sir. I get that. I personally agree, and I get that from a lot of our residents. I mean, your answer, I get you. I respect you immensely. I count you as a friend. With that in mind, it looks horrific, the way it used to look. And I'm not criticizing you. I know you have the whole county to look after, as does Commissioner Jenkins. It's most of the county is in his district now. But with that in mind, it just needs something, because the way it is, most residents, when they drive past and they look at it, they don't know your answer. And your answer, although legitimate, it just still, it's, I've seen nature preserves and wetlands and things like that. Some of ours, I think, are award-winning. This is just, did I use the word horrific? It's horrific. Commissioner Smith. What is a PAMP for the explanation for everybody that may not understand why we have PAMPs and what do they do and what is the, so when a PAMP is part of a development order, what does that really mean? So the PAMP is an acronym for a Preserve Area Management Plan, which memorializes and maintains the wetland or upland habitat and the associated buffers. Those are a pillar of development in Martin County with respect to development. Any new development, if it does have habitat, wetland habitat, upland habitat, there's, of course, a 25% native upland habitat requirement. There's other requirements for rare and unique habitat. So those areas that are identified on a site are put, the geometry of those, whether they be a quarter acre or an acre or a thousand acres, are put into a Preserve Area Management Plan. And that's maintained in perpetuity by the Properties Owners Association, in most accounts, or a private individual. There are repercussions for not maintaining those areas with respect to invasive removal. But prior to any of the certificates of occupancy for that Palm Pike Plaza, which includes the tractor supply, the Wawa, and a couple other developments that are coming out of the ground, prior to the COO of the first building out there, namely the tractor supply, I believe, there was a requirement for that whole site to be in compliance with respect to the PAMP. And that's a part of the environmental component of growth management. And we work very, very hard with applicants to successfully inspect and maintain compliance with those areas. And so effectively, the wetland area that's being discussed, right, part of that PAMP requirement is to remove the exotics and then to revegetate with whatever the agreement was relative to how that wetland should be restored? Yes, sir. But that is actually absolutely right. The other component of that, though, is there's native vegetation that is not coming in at 10 feet high, it's coming in at ground level, native vegetation associated with the appropriate hydrology. So it takes time for nature. It takes time. Thank you. Yes, sir. Commissioner Hurd. Yeah. I'm just curious. You said that a couple other things are coming out of the ground at Palm Pike Plaza. What are those? There is an application for a dog daycare associated with a doggy daycare as well as human daycare. I thought they changed their mind. I was just using the term generally. I believe that's still in effect. Well, there's a Waters car wash. Yes, sir. And a previously approved storage facility, which I... So the board, these are minor applications, so the board won't review them? We've reviewed the storage facility. Yes. And the majority are minors because of the fact it's a platted subdivision. The thresholds are appropriate. Is there still vacant land there after those applications are received? I think that's it. I believe that's the last lot. Yes. Mr. Donaldson. I shouldn't probably weigh in on this. But in terms of a wetland restoration for under-preserved areas management plans, there's nothing in the code that has an aesthetic kind of component to it. It's just basically taking the wetland in its current form, removing the exotic vegetation, and then adding plants that would be indicative of the type of wetland it is, whether it's shallow or femoral or whether it's a deeper... So when it comes to the actual preserve area management plan, there is nothing in the code that guides the aesthetic of that particular PAMP. Just... Thank you. There should be or there shouldn't be? There should be native. But we do have a staff that reviews it and approves the plan. So that staff, that environmental review staff, should be making recommendations about what's appropriate there. Let's... Yeah. Yes. I apologize. One more thing. Yes, sir. Along those lines. We'll have the final word. We have wetland scientists who review those plans. So those plans are approved with the understanding and acknowledgement that the species of... or the plant material that is being installed at that wetland is the best for the environment and in the cases as Mr. Donaldson, the appropriate hydrology. So we have that covered. We'll go out there. We'll brainstorm a little bit. Okay. Thank you. Sure. Okay. I apologize for taking us offline for a minute there. Let's get back into the reason we are here. Departmental Quasi-Judicial No. 2. Request approval of the second amendment to the preserve at Park Trace planned unit development zoning agreement including a revised master and final site plan V038-005. Mr. Elam, you will be presenting this one as well. It's quasi-judicial. I'll ask my colleague. Commissioner Hurd, do you have any ex parte communication? I don't believe I do, but if I do, they've been filed. Thank you. Commissioner Jenkins. I don't believe I do, but if they do, then filed. Commissioner Smith. I don't believe I have any, but if there are, they're filed. I agree. I don't believe I've had any, but if I've had, they've been filed as such. Anyone that will be offering testimony in this agenda item will be sworn in. Do you swear or affirm the evidence you're about to give will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? Do you have a copy of your work history and the agenda item for this item as well? Is there any interveners? No interveners. Do we need to have a copy of the return receipts? No notice requirement. Thank you. With that, Mr. Elam, you are recognized. Thank you, Chairman, Commissioners. Good morning again, and for the record, Brian Elam, Principal Planner with the Growth Management Department. This is a request by Lucido and Associates on behalf of D.R. Horton Incorporated for approval of the Second Amendment to the Preserve at Park Trace PUD Billing Agreement, including a revised master and final site plan for the purpose of constructing recreation facilities and a stub out. The proposed amendment will remove lots 50 and 51 of the approved master and final site plan, reducing the single-family lots from 114 to 112. Included with this application is a request for a certificate of public facilities reservation. The site is approximately 97 acres and is on the south side of Cove Road at the intersection of Cove and Willoughby Boulevard. You can see here the proposed changes to the master and final site plan for this amendment with the approved plan shown on the left and the proposed on the right. So here we have on the approved the lots 50 and 51 with your common area, sorry, and then over here on the proposed we have the stub out and the amenities shown within the common area. Development review staff have found the Preserve at Park Trace PUD Second Amendment application to comply with all applicable regulations and the comp plan as detailed in the staff report. Review of this application by the LPA was not required. Staff approves this application and we move that the board receive and file the agenda item and its attachments, including the staff report as Exhibit 1, and we move that the board approve the second amendment of the Preserve at Park Trace PUD zoning agreement, including the revised master and final site plan. That concludes the presentation. Thank you. Questions for staff? Seeing none at this time. Applicants, Representative. Good morning. For the record, my name is Morris Crady, senior partner with Acido and Associates. I have no formal presentation. We are in agreement with staff recommendation. This is pretty simple, removing two lots and adding a recreation amenity to the site, but I'll be glad to answer any questions. You've been sworn in, correct? I have been sworn in, yes. Thank you. Questions for the applicant's representative? Seeing none. Any members of the public looking to address us on this topic? Also seeing none. Commissioner Smith. Move's recommendation. Thank you. Second. Okay, we have a motion by Commissioner Smith to accept staff's recommendation, seconded by Commissioner Jenkins. All those in favor? Aye. Aye. All those opposed, the motion carries four to zero, with Commissioner Hetherington absent. Our next agenda item is Departmental No. 1, Office of Management and Budget Items, which require board approval. It will be presented by Ms. Stephanie Murley. Ms. Murley, good morning and welcome. Good morning. Stephanie Murley, Director of OMB. I'm here to present the OMB item for today. The first item we have is permission to apply for the Florida Department of Agriculture and Consumer Services, Urban Forestry Plannings, Preservation, and Invasive Control Grant for Jimmy Graham Park. This is a grant award of $75,000, and it's going to remove two-acre stand of invasive Australian pines at Jimmy Graham Park, and there's no match required for this. Our second item is a permission to accept the Resilient Florida Program for the Old Palm City North Neighborhood Improvement Project. It's a grant award of $3.2 million for funding the design and permitting, construction, and project management of the Old Palm City North Neighborhood Improvement Project. It requires a 50% match of another $3.2 million, which is already budgeted within our CIP. And the project will address poor drainage and flooding in the roadways and will improve water quality, mitigate flooding, and improve drainage in surrounding residences. Our next item is permission to accept the Florida Inland Navigation District Fine Waterway Assistance Program for the 96th Street Artificial Reef Bulkhead Project. It's a grant award for $400,000 to build a bulkhead at 96th Street on the county-owned right-of-way to stabilize the shoreline at the staging area for the Artificial Reef Program. It requires a grant match of $400,000 plus an additional local contribution of $200,000, which is already budgeted in our CIP. Our next item is a permission to accept FDEP Resilient Florida Planning Grant. This is to update the county's existing vulnerability assessment to be in compliance with the Future Climate Adaptation Plan. It's for $75,000, and there is no match required. Number five is permission to accept the Resilient Florida Program Implementation Grant for Southwest Mockingbird Lane Flood Mitigation. It's a grant award of $1.8 million for funding the construction to support the elevation of Mockingbird Lane, installation of a weir structure with check valve discharge, and installation of ancillary drainage to support adaptation and mitigate flooding. It requires a $1.8 million match, which is anticipated to come from a FEMA hazard mitigation grant program. Number six is a request for funds for the multi-agency enterprise resource planning advisory service project. The clerk of the circuit court, along with OMB IT and purchasing, are planning on embarking on an advisory service project to evaluate our current business processes with our enterprise resource planning ERP program. This is a long-term effort, and we are requesting $45,000 to begin that item. And the last item today is a request for funds from the Martin County Sheriff's Office. They're requesting $320,000 to purchase 20 portable and 20 mobile radios due to their newly added positions in this fiscal year. The radios will be issued to assign positions where communications are necessary for their job functions and also while others are taken out of service due to damage. And that's all I have. Thank you very much. Questions for Ms. Murley? Move staff's recommendation. Second. Thank you. We have a motion by Commissioner Hurd to accept staff's recommendation, seconded by Commissioner Smith. All those in favor? Aye. All those opposed, the motion carries four to zero. Thank you. Ms. Murley, thank you very much. Ms. Brotherton, you are next for departmental number two, contracts that meet the threshold for board approval, $1 million or greater. Good morning. Christy Brotherton, Chief Procurement Officer. Three items for your consideration today. The first item is a contract for our Bathtub Beach and Sailfish Point nourishment project. Staff is recommending that the board award the contract to the lowest responsive and responsible bidder, which is Atlantic and Gulf Dredging and Marine, in the amount of $5,921,000. And move that the board authorize the county administrator or designee to execute all documents related to this request. And last but not least, we have a contract amendment for our on-road transit and support services. Which is our minority bus system operation contract. Just to clarify, each year that we bring this before the board to add additional funds to the contracts not to exceed value based on grant funds received. This request is to approve amendment number three to MTM transit for year four of the transit program to increase the total contract cumulative not to exceed amount to $11,977,900, which will be effective December 1st of 2023. And move that the board authorize the county administrator or designee to execute all documents related to this request. And this concludes the item. Commissioner Hurd. What's the county's ad valorem contribution? The county's ad valorem is roughly $1.1 million, I believe it is, is what we're currently at. And the remaining $2 plus million is from grants from the state and the federal government. And we're going to have an agenda item to discuss this? You've already approved it in the budget for our operation. So this is the grant. We use a contract management. So our bus system is operated by a contractor. So we own the buses, but we hire a contractor to provide the staffing and the maintenance operation and also to rent a building to provide maintenance of the facility. And that's so it's a, we use a private sector basically in the help of our operating of it. So the bus system, we have a triennial review. You all go through part of the MPO. You look at the overall planning for the program. So this is a program that's looked at many times. I would suggest if you want to look at it, again, we can, you know, through the MPO, we can look at the future planning of our operations, what we committed to with the DOT. And you can review it through the budget process. But this is simply the portion of the, of the, of where we are. We had bid out the service. It has an annual renewal. The amount that we get in grants fluctuates somewhat. And so this is the, the time where we're just simply amending the contract to reflect what we committed to. But this is year four of a four year contract. So we recognize, I recognize that the Marty is extremely expensive and extremely inefficient and it's time to evaluate its effectiveness. So it would be bid out again, you know, so I think that's, you know, that's the opportunity to look at how, how we provide the service. I mean, some, some communities do it all in-house where they hire the drivers and, and do all the, the maintenance in-house. And then in our particular case, we're using private sector contractors to, to operate, to provide the majority of the staffing. Thanks. Mr. Gordon. Jim Gordon, Public Works Director. We also have the transit development plan that's going on right now. So, um, it's, it's being administered by our MPO and, uh, each of the commissioners is going to have time to meet with a consultant that's doing that study that looks at how we deliver, um, our transit service. So that's happening right now. And you guys are going to get invites to, uh, have those meetings over the next month or two. Yep. Any other questions for staff? Seeing none. And back to the board. Approval stops. Thank you. We have a motion by Commissioner Smith, seconded by Commissioner Jenkins. All those in favor? Aye. Aye. All those opposed? The motion carries unanimously. Thank you. What I'd like to do now before our break, we only have a couple of agenda items. I have been working, as your chair, I've been working on something, uh, that I think was, uh, really a great opportunity for all of us. My friend, Emily McHugh, who is with the Small Business Development Center at Indian Riverside, uh, IRSC, has, um, she shared with me an interesting story about her dad. And I thought it was so interesting that I wanted her, if possible, to bring her dad for all of us to meet. And, uh, we've been working on it a little bit, and when you find out his story, you'll understand it's, it's not just say, hey, come at nine o'clock on this day. So, Emily, if you could bring your dad, you could take these seats right here in the front, uh, and you brought your sister as well. And once he sits down and we get a chance to, uh, introduce him, you'll see what I believe is remarkable about him. Emily, these meetings are videotaped, so we can get you a portion of this as well. You can sit next to him if you'd like. Bring him in closer so we can hear him in the microphone. Mr. McHugh, it's an honor to have you here this morning. Um, Emily, why don't you introduce your dad and your sister to us? Okay, well, thank you so much, Ed, Commissioner Campy. I introduce to you all John Lambert McHugh, my father and my sister, Helena McHugh, and my name is Emily McHugh. And Daddy is a native of St. Anne's Bay, Jamaica, the island of Jamaica. And his age, shall we guess his age? Would anyone like to guess Mr. McHugh's age? We have 50. What do you have? 56. 56. 56. Very good. I have another. Well, let's double that by a couple. We have, Daddy, you want to tell everyone how old you are? Why don't you tell everyone how old you are? Yeah, no, we're glad to have you, sir. You can tell us, Emily. I'm 103 years old. Wow. He's 103 years old. Daddy celebrated his 103rd birthday on August 5th of this year, and it coincided with the launch of his book, his memoirs. He's an author. He's an author, indeed. And this book is special. It's called The Forgotten Reapers of World War II, Gallant Jamaicans Help Defeat the Axis Powers. Can you explain what that is, Emily? Yes, absolutely. So it's based on his diaries that he kept from, he was 23 years old, and Daddy kept diaries from when he was a little boy of like 14. So, and we have all of them, 1934, 1944. So this was based on, during the war, there was a shortage of reapers on the farms in the United States all across the U.S. The soldiers were away, so no one was reaping the crops. And so the British government contracted with the United States government to bring workers from different countries, including Jamaica and the Caribbean, to come here and work on the farms. So it was a whole process to get selected, to get chosen. The whole thing was very involved, and Daddy got chosen, and he documented the entire experience from being chosen to taking the ship up from Jamaica through U-boat-infested waters and how they had to have destroyer vessels guide the ships along the coast until it reached Virginia and then on to New York. So Daddy worked on the onion fields in Elba, New York, in upstate New York, for about a year, and every step of the way, he documented it. And that was put together in his book. And my brother, Michael McHugh, painstakingly went through all the diagrams, I mean, all the pages of the diary and fact-checked everything and put together his book, which I have to say is sold out. Wow. So this copy here has to be shipped to somebody. I just brought it to show you, but it is available on Amazon. So, and then also, Daddy has his new YouTube channel, which I dare say has been launched. It's a John McHugh author, and I have one of his bookmarks that I'm happy to share with anyone who would like it. But his story is important for many reasons, the importance of keeping a diary. Sometimes we kind of think we don't have the time to do it, but he took the time to make this record of a little-known piece of history, I would say, and the impact. Because when the Jamaicans arrived, it was documented in the newspapers how the farmers were so thrilled to finally have their crops get reaped. And be able to feed the soldiers and feed the country. So it had quite an impact. And when his contract was up, and it was time to go back to Jamaica, and he wanted to stay a little longer, as most people want to stay longer in America, he went to the supervisor of the Warman Power Movement. And he says, well, your contract is up. It's time to go. And my father says, well, I'm not leaving. And he says, you're not leaving? He says, no, and you want to know why? Because I want to help Uncle Sam win the war. And with that, his stay was extended. And he was there on VJ Day in Times Square with all the people celebrating, and he was a part of all of it. And returned to Jamaica and continued his life as a printer. He was the manager of a print shop in St. Anne's Bay, Jamaica, which was the same printing shop where Marcus Garvey, the civil rights activist of all time, came from. Marcus Garvey worked in that same printing shop where Daddy worked, Burroughs Printing in Jamaica. So I could go on, hence the book. So anything else you want to say, Daddy? Did I miss anything? I can't for the cry. It's overwhelming, but... If your sister would like to say... Helena, you want to say something? Yes. We apologize for being late, but... That's quite all right. I can't get 20-year-olds in the car. He gets dressed early, but it's just... And he's in a suit and tie. You're looking very sharp. Yes, he insisted to have everything on. Well, even though he's my father, I must say the book is a very good read. It is a very good read. So I recommend it highly. It's a page-turner. It is a page-turner. He did a very good job of it. I think it could be a movie. How old... When did you publish the book? How old was your dad when you published the book? August... He was 103. Oh, so it just published. It just got published in 2000... What are we? 2023. Just a few months ago. I would tell you, I bet I would look into the fact that he might be one of the oldest people that's published. Yes, I think so. I can imagine, you know. He might be one of the oldest residents of the state of Florida. I would dare go as far as to say as well. Yeah. And Daddy, I might as well just share this with you guys. He takes no medication. He has no illness, per se. Just a little eyesight issue, a little memory here and there. But he will remember every name you mention to him in his book. He will remember all the people that he worked with as if it were yesterday. So it's pretty remarkable. So we thank God and people ask, you know, what's the secret of his longevity? And the first thing he will say is God, the grace of God. And he was a star athlete his whole life. He was a soccer champion in Jamaica. Yeah, and he had that history of always exercising and going for long walks and still walks. He still gets to walk, but not as much. Not as much, not as much, but still. But he's still. So God is his day. So thank you for this opportunity. He would be more chatty, but I believe he is a bit stunned. Stunned. Yeah, well, you know, Emily, when you and I first talked about this, you know, I have, you know, I fancy myself a history buff, very interested in World War II with my son. I had never thought about that. You know, when our men went off to fight in the war overseas, you heard about Rosie the Riveter and women that went in and took a lot of these male-dominated jobs to keep the war effort going. But I never contemplated who did all the other jobs, who did all the farming and brought the crops in, as you called reapers. And when you explained that history that the British government, you know, coordinated with the American government and brought gentlemen in from other countries to reap our crops for our residents, I thought, how remarkable that I had never heard of that. And then when you said, well, my dad wrote a book. And I said, oh, that's terrific. And he said, well, my dad's 103. I said, I had to bring him in. I remember a long time ago, one of the highlights of my commission history, Doug will remember, we had a woman come. It was her birthday. And she had come from Ocean Breeze. I think she lived in Ocean Breeze. And she came in here, came to the podium. She was, no, before her. Remember, it was a couple of, several years ago, a woman came in with her friends in a limousine for her birthday. And if I'm not mistaken, she was 105. She was 105 years old. And I went to say hello to her. And I shook her hand. And for whatever reason, someone took a picture. And it appeared on the front page of the Stuart News. And that is one of my most prized possessions. So I'm hoping we can also get an opportunity to take a picture with your dad. Because, look, for most of us, there's never going to be an opportunity to meet someone who was 103 years old, especially he's in a suit and tie. And he came here. And like you said, he's not on medication. And he is just a miracle. And so I think part of it is the fact that he has two loving daughters and a son. Two sons. Two sons. But especially today that have been able to, does he live with either of you? We take care of daddy. Okay. So both of us and our brothers are up north. One is in Virginia. One is in New Jersey. So they visit when they can. And they need to visit more. But anyway. Fantastic. Yes. All right. And might I just add one last comment? In addition to the farm workers coming here to the farms, many Jamaicans as well went to England and worked in the Royal Air Force, in the RAF, as pilots, as mechanics, as all kinds of things. And so not only so, they covered a wide spectrum of things that, institutions that they affected. And that's one of the reasons why today some of the best pilots in the world are from Jamaica, by the way, might I add. It happens to be true. And so it all went dated back to that time. And I can imagine your dad as a young man coming from Jamaica to Buffalo, New York in the winter. It must have been quite a shock. Commissioner Smith. Yeah, so a couple of things. And what you just said there at the end is interesting because the RAF, through Canada, sent their pilots in the winter down to Hendry County, which is south of the lake, and trained there because you couldn't train in the winter in Canada. But the RAF sent them down here. So I have no doubt that we had Jamaicans probably in Hendry County as a result of that training coming in from Canada to do their pilot training. I was fortunate enough to have a great-grandfather that was 103. And the one remarkable thing that you have done, sir, with your family is to put down your history and your stories. I wish if there was anything that I could go back and ask for time to repeat would have been to have more time with my great-grandfather to pass on the stories of what he experienced in his lifetime. And what was amazing, I think he was born in 1888. And so you think of what happened between 1888 and 1988 in that spirit of time. Telephone, transportation, automobiles, all sorts of stuff happened in his lifetime. And, sir, to have that in your notes and your story is absolutely remarkable. And congratulations on hitting 103. It's really remarkable. Amen. Thank you. Commissioner Jenkins. I really appreciate hearing this story. I come from a family of farmers. My grandfather was a squash farmer in Jupiter and farmed thousands of acres, which is now Jupiter Farms. And during the beginning of World War II, everybody left. He had to shut the farm down during the entire war and grew nothing because there wasn't any labor. So I really did not know this. And it's the next topic of the family discussion when farming comes back up. So it's amazing. Thank you for sharing. Commissioner Hurd. It's a pleasure and honor to have you here, Mr. McHugh, and to hear your fun story. Thank you for coming. Thank you very much. So tell us the name of the book again and how people can get it. It's called The Forgotten Reapers of World War II. Gallant Jamaicans Help Defeat the Axis Powers by John L. McHugh, available on Amazon. And Helena, kindly, if you'd like, I don't know if she can hand it to you out. You can receive the bookmarks. But that's where you can get it. Terrific. Can we have your dad come over here with both of the daughters? And if any of the commissioners would like to take a picture, we'll take one over there. What do you want to say, Daddy? Oh, I'm sorry. Yes, I thank you for inviting me for this few moments. You know, the house, we are not very good as I used to. They told me, the warriors, that I was come to England. They were wanting to recruit him for the RAF as well, but he came to New York instead. All these things have happened to me in my life. Yes. So I've got to be alive. I'm invited by this honourable that I can harness it. It's better than me, happen to me. You need glasses for distance. I do. He's so proud of me. I could go on, but I can't take your time. I thank you, thank you, thank you to invite me. Our pleasure. Our pleasure. God bless these people for the dead. He's going to stand up here and take a little picture. He can stand for it, right? Come, we're going to take a little picture. He's in his hand. Yeah. Right here, sir. Let's do a couple here. One, two, three. Everybody keep smiling. Great photo. Take one of me. There it is. God bless you. God bless you. Thank you for your voice. Very beautiful, Dan. Thank you. We're coming to see us. We hope to see you for your time. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you for commissioners allowing me to bring Mr. McHugh and his daughters forward. We're going to take our mid-morning closed captioning break. It is 1038. You're on. Okay. We are back from our mid-morning closed captioning break to continue our November 21st, 2023 Board of County Commissioners meeting. We're going to just flip the agenda one item in front of the other at Mr. Doolin's request. Departmental number four, request for submission of determination letter to the Department of Commerce. Very intriguing. Mr. Doolin, thank you so much for attending. You are recognized. Good morning, members of the board. My name is Clyde Doolin, the Comprehensive Planning Administrator. This is a request for the board to approve signing a letter and sending it to the Department of Commerce, informing them that Martin County will be doing amendments to the Comprehensive Growth Management Plan and based on an evaluation and appraisal process that's required every seven years for every community in the state to consider and go through. This agenda item outlines a couple of ways in which floor statutes have changed and are pressing communities to look hard at our plans and make sure that they're in compliance with all of the latest changes in state statute. Attached to this agenda item are some of the changes that have occurred over the past six or seven years. They don't include actually some of the more substantial changes that have occurred in 2023, and we don't know what will happen in the first couple of months of 2024, but we anticipate there will be more changes from the legislature also. So with that, staff recommends approval of... One second, sir. Commissioner Smith. So curious, what does happen with 2023-2024? Do those have to get included in... If there are changes made in this session in early 2024? Well, the 2023 definitely have some deadlines that must be addressed this year and in 2024. It's possible that there will be changes in 2024 that may not have a deadline in 2024, but may be easily dealt with or it may be appropriate to deal with as part of the year. Or we would just have to amend the comp plan relative to what they do at the state level. Yes. If they made a comprehensive plan move that would require us to do a change to the comp plan, it would just be what we normally do outside of the year, we would amend the comp plan reflective of the state law? Yes. So it doesn't have to run concurrent to the year? No, it doesn't, but it may be easily done. Okay. Thank you. Sorry. Please continue. That pretty much concludes. Staff recommends approval of a motion for the board to approve signing the chair, signing the attached letter, informing the Department of Commerce that we will be doing evaluation appraisal amendments. Fantastic. Commissioner Smith. Staff's recommendation. Thank you very much. Second. Thank you. We have a motion by Commissioner Smith for staff's recommendation, seconded by Commissioner Hurd. All those in favor? Aye. All those opposed, the motion carries unanimously. Thank you, members of the board. Thank you so much. I'm glad I was able to accommodate you. Actually, that was my request. Mr. Stokas, Ms. Miller, let me announce the next item. Departmental No. 3, Affordable Housing Update. It will be presented by Mr. George Stokas with the assistance of Ms. Michelle Miller. Welcome to the two of you. You are recognized. Good morning, Mr. Chair. George Stokas, Assistant Kaya Minister. Share with me is... Michelle Miller, Human Services. I know who it was. I wasn't sure of her title. Mr. Chair, this is a year-end wrap-up. You said that out loud. We all heard you say that. I forgot her title. I know who it is. I just, you know, well, whatever. Anyway, this is your year-end wrap-up for the Affordable Housing Update. We won't be coming before you for probably a couple months into the first calendar quarter of next year. So we wanted to take this opportunity to update the board as to where we're at with the Affordable Housing Issue. By no means have we solved, nor are we claiming to have solved the Affordable Housing Issue. But we have made some good strides moving forward. In 2220, you all had assigned this to staff to address. Here we are at the end of 2023, and we had a couple areas to look at. We wanted us to focus on home ownership. Since then, we've had the development of a community land trust called the Martin County Community Land Trust. They are up and running. They have formed a committee. They are working on projects in Banner Lake. And once they have found or continue to find their stride, we will be looking to come back to you all about addressing some assets or property that can be assigned to that community land trust at that time. We were also asked to investigate the inclusion of tiny homes into the comprehensive plan. We are happy to report that accessory dwelling units are allowable in Martin County. We actually have a couple of programs that we're working with, with both LaHia, which you funded through the American Rescue Plan Act dollars, as well as the Family Promise Program. I'm going to mess up her name, but I believe it was Madeline Bozeman, who heads that up. We are working with Family Promise and investigating whether or not churches can put transitional housing on their property per Florida State Statute as it relates to our code. I believe some of you commissioners took advantage of we actually have a tiny home manufacturer in Palm City. Some of you took advantage and toured that facility. I know, Mr. Chair, you were one of those because I was there with you. We also have prioritized capital improvement projects that assist with home ownership, that being numerous septic to sewer projects, as well as our State Housing Initiative Partnerships Program, or SHIP, is now fully funded. Thank you to the Florida State Legislature. We do know also when we're looking at tiny homes, I want to just step back, we do know there is some work needed with accessory dwelling units as it relates to how the Florida State Statutes requires people to sign certain documents as it relates to the process. So we've made that a part of our, well, we haven't made it a part of our, but a lot of our partners have made it a part of their legislative priorities. And I think there's going to be work done this coming year as it relates to how accessory dwelling units are assigned, or not necessarily assigned, but how they are assigned over and whether or not people will be enticed to actually construct those or not. Then we also focused on, well, monitoring for public-private partnerships. I won't go into big details with this. However, we have worked with the Community Land Trust and other not-for-profit partnerships to deal with these opportunities. And we continue to move forward in that direction. Lastly, there was a request for us to focus on affordable rentals, a sustained rental subsidy program for income-eligible populations. What I'm happy to report, and that's why Michelle is here, is as attached to your agenda item is our announcement of the Home Investment Partnership Program. And with that, I'll hand off to Ms. Miller to brief you on our program and its success. So these funds were specific to seniors age 62 and over, and we have, at this time, put 18 seniors into that program, which has expended all of the funding for this year for that population. Now, we just created a SHIP strategy, so starting on Monday, we'll be able to take applications for rental assistance for those individuals in the county who have experienced a hardship, can apply through our portal on the website, and we'll be able to get some assistance through the SHIP funds. Thank you very much. Do you have any program or anything that's directed towards veterans as well? It's just income eligibility, so if they're income eligible, they would be qualified. Thank you. And I will add that Ms. Miller has done an excellent job at coordinating the various divisions within her department. We invested a number of years ago into a software where everyone is talking to one another, which I believe has seen a profound effect in helping veterans as well as others individually. Is that Snapchat, or is that a different one? You know, Commissioner, I have no social media presence or account, so I don't even know what Snapchat is other than probably what we're doing right now. So, with that, that is our presentation, hopefully brief but brilliant, and we're more happy to take any comments, questions, or concerns at this time. Thank you. We'll start with the commission, with Commissioner Hurd. And this Home Investment Partnerships Program, that's a program that Martin County is funding. What's the amount? So, those are home funds, HUD funds, that come through a consortium that we have with St. Lucie County, and we get an allocation that's based on a formula each year. We had about half a million dollars in that fund at this time, and that allocated the 18 applicants for two years of rental subsidies. Half a million? Yes. Okay. So, these were grant funds. These were not ad valorem. They were grant funds. Okay. Is that it? Yep. Okay. Mr. Chair, I also want to add the Treasure Coast Consortium, if I'm not mistaken. We're going to be coming back to you. We're going to be looking for more representation on that regional board, and we would appreciate your support, the board's support in that endeavor coming into the next year. Thank you. I don't have a request to speak for them. If anyone would like to address us at this time, now is the time. You can fill out a form afterwards. Sir. My name is Michael Dooley, for the record. So, I'd like to address this on a policy level. So, I don't know where we're going to go with it, but I'm going to start on a policy level, and we'll see where we end up. First, I want to make it clear that I am presenting as a member of the public at this time, not in my role as a member of the Affordable Housing Advisory Committee. So, I believe there's an inherent flaw in the language of the Affordable Housing Committee overall goals and definitions of Section 2.4 of the Land Development Regulations of the Comprehensive Plan with regards to rent or occupied units. While I believe the intent was laudable, the actual implementation of the language does not comply with the state of Florida's Housing Finance Corporation, FHFC, the income limits and rent tables, as they're produced annually by the state. As a side note, the figures that are presented by FHFC are generated by HUD. It's important to read the Florida Statute 420.004. Within that statute, the definitions of different classes are significant. Specifically, under number three, the affordable is where the 30% figure comes into play. The statute is clear that there are four subsections that are affected by the 30% language. That's subsection 9, 11, 12, and 17. That document, I believe, was sent to all of you via an email. These subsections are highlighted in yellow in the 420 statute and is attached in your email. Nowhere in the statute is their language limiting the workforce housing to 30%, and the income and rent limit tables bears out that observation. Our comp plan refers that our affordable housing definitions are from the federal, government, and FHFC, as well as other local agencies. And while it is true that within the totality of the language, there is a mention of 30% as measurement to the housing burden, the actual calculations by HUD and FHFC reflect the true intent of the policy. Using the FHFC tables as the benchmark, we need to change the language concerning how we calculate the rent limits for renter-occupied housing. Why? As the calculations are made now, there is never a time when anyone qualifies for workforce housing following the table generated by FHFC. Never. I'll repeat that. As the county calculates the rent limits now, there's never a time that the math works in any category. Now, I've given several examples, and I won't bore you with them at the moment. And I believe the solution is to change the language. And I propose the following, that Martin County shall use the Florida Housing Finance Corporation should I stop. You have 15 seconds. Rent limits and table generated by the state of Florida animals have established the rent rates for the five affordable housing courts used in languages defined by Florida statutes. And I have a great example of a single mom with a disabled child who earns $85,800 a year, and she cannot qualify for workforce housing. Thank you very much. You still have, like, six seconds. Thank you very much, and happy Thanksgiving. Thank you. Anyone else looking to address us? Please, when you're done speaking, fill out the forms. Mr. Ranieri, welcome. Good afternoon, Commissioners. This is Robert Ranieri, CEO for House of Hope, for the record. I just want to, again, thank the commission for taking this topic up and for putting some priority on this issue. It's certainly widespread and being felt all across the county. I want to thank county staff, and in particular, Mr. Stokas and Ms. Miller, for their work over the past year in this arena. They've had great lines of communication with most of the non-profits that are doing work in the affordable housing arena. We've had great lines of communication to hopefully keep each other informed and share ideas and points of view. And one request I'd like to make for future updates, if they could be presets, that would be helpful. There are many of our colleagues, non-profit and for-profit, that would like to, if not attend, at least be able to tune in at the right time on MCTV and hear the latest on this topic. So thank you very much, and happy Thanksgiving. Thank you. I'd like to thank you, Mr. Ranieri. I serve on a board that you chair and facilitate through your connections with House of Hope. There's a lot of us, cross-section of people involved in this situation, and you've done remarkable work, so thank you. Questions? Anybody? Mr. Jenkins. So I spent some time with Mr. Dooley trying to understand the complicated matrix of the state and their requirements and understand ours. So I kind of understand both sides of the future argument. But at the same time, it would seem to me that we should be, have something that actually reflects what the feds and the states are, the state is asking, correct? I'm just kind of wondering what everybody else thinks of that. In the twilight of my chairmanship, I would suggest. Twilight? Today would have been the day. That's right. So I'm in the twilight. I don't know. I think this, have you had, Ms. Elder, before you begin, have you had the opportunity to speak to all five of us, you and Ms. Woods? We spoke to everybody who is here today. Okay. I don't know if we want to delve into this. It's an issue. I get that. Do we want to delve into it right this minute? Do we want to turn it into an official agenda item? I can give an update on the comprehensive plan and how it applies. I guess Commissioner Jenkins asked you a question. Right. You know, you can answer it. Right. So what I think, Mr. One more second. I'm sorry. I apologize. Commissioner Smith would like to opine before you. So as either you respond or as we think about what, Commissioner, can't be just asked, if in your response, if you could also share with us how our comp plan relates to what the state did last year and didn't do, and so the interaction between what trumps what or doesn't trump what, and then I think from my perspective versus trying to cram that into a conversation today, which… No, I didn't. No, no, no, no, no, I'm just… It would be helpful for that analysis, even though you're going to give us one, to come back so that everybody in the business can understand what does and what doesn't, which also may lead to a lot of the conversations we've had over the last year about projects that have come forward that whether we can or can't, if we deny or don't deny, based upon Senate Bill 102, what would we send to the legislature for potential adjustments or fixes that would either address what Mr. Dooley is talking about or address what we have to deal with? Does that make sense? That does make sense. Elise Elder, Deputy County Attorney. So I think the provision that Mr. Dooley is talking about is actually our comprehensive plan, so it's strict compliance, and the core of the definition in our comprehensive plan for affordable housing is that for a rental, for example, the rent and utilities together cannot be more than 30 percent of someone's income. That's the crux of the provision, and projects have come forward before the board under our affordable housing provision in our comp plan. And I think what the frustration is now that some developers might be experiencing, our human services department monitors our affordable housing. So when a project comes forward to the board and it's approved, it's not just they have to do affordable housing and we wash our hands. It's actually monitored through our human services department. There's yearly reporting to make sure that if someone agrees to do 49 units of affordable housing that they're providing that. So that's monitored. So the issue here is that the median income, so you have to look at the median income, which it's 140 percent for workforce housing, but there's another component that that rent can only be 30 percent of somebody's income. So that's where the struggle that maybe a developer's coming forward, the answer is that they just have to charge less rent because you have to meet both provisions of our comprehensive plan. So that's our definition of affordable housing and our comp plan for projects that come forward with affordable housing. And when they do that, they get a density bump. So we give them something. Yes. Mr. Church, just quick. And, Elise, what you just described is pre-Senate Bill 102. Correct. So, yes, these are for projects that are not using 102. So we have some in the pipeline that have already been approved. They're not 102. So when something comes forward under Senate Bill 102, Senate Bill 102 requires a developer to comply with a comprehensive plan and comply with our development regulations. Density, height, those things are set in 102 and we are preempted. Whether or not we're preempted on the affordable housing component and the 30 percent, we would have to evaluate. And I would rather bring that back at another agenda item so I can fully evaluate it and provide a better response than off the cuff because I didn't know that question was coming up. But it's not set in stone that that 30 percent would go away with 102. I would have to evaluate the wording of the statute. But we are allowed in our comp plan from general speaking to have affordable housing provisions that are the same as the state. We're not preempted. And I will let Ms. Miller explain the different charts that Mr. Dooley are referring to for ship housing and supplementation. So I'll let her explain that portion because she knows it better than I do. Ms. Miller, one second. Commissioner Smith. And Elise, please, if the board, if it's okay with the board that this comes back as a conversation in a more descriptive way, what you just described, if that is either a barrier or it is problematic given Senate Bill 102 and what would be implemented under Senate Bill 102 versus what our... It's live local law. It's not the bill anymore. It's I want to make the law. Right. It's live local law. Yes. So... But if there is a disconnect between what we have in our comp plan, because that was a pre-state mandated affordable housing component, right? Right. Now we have what we have in our comp plan. The state has what it has in its past legislation. If there's a disconnect between the two, what would be super helpful, I think, for all of us is to say, okay, the spirit of what was trying to be created at the state level is in conflict with what we may have here locally and how do we fix that and what language do we need to suggest to the legislature, at least on a local level here, that would fix that disconnect. And, Mike, I'm not suggesting one way or the other whether it's good or bad for your project one way or the other, other than if there is something not talking to each other, then can that fix be effectuated so that we don't have the disconnect that we have between our comp plan requirements and what the state is requiring of a developer to do what they're doing? Right. We can look at that, but if someone – there are situations where someone would come forward that's not under the Live Local Act, and then our comp plan would control, but we will look at the connection between the two. Absolutely. But to that point, though, if we have projects that were in the pipeline, not even in the pipeline, if they're built and they can't perform and the intent of what the state did, whether we like it or not is really irrelevant, it is, okay, if there is a disconnect and we're bumping up against the disconnect, what does that new language need to look like, whether it's in our comp plan or whether it's in the state statute? I understand. Ms. Miller. I have my light. So, Mr. Chair, rather than delving into all the tables and going, if you all want to have an item, we're more than happy to bring one back, I will say one of the disconnects that the not-for-profits have brought to our attention is the area medium income versus the average wage for Martin County. There's a big disparity in the numbers there, and we'd be more than happy to present some of that if you all want us to come back with language for a comp plan, amendment change. I think there's enough of us that agree that it should be an agenda item so we can dig in a little more thoroughly, take Mr. Dooley's concerns, hear from our staff, hear from Ms. Miller and anybody else that would like to participate. Commissioner Hurd. I don't understand what's being proposed to be brought back to us. What I do understand is that Mr. Dooley and his partners proposed a project, received approval for the project, received density bonuses in order to, with the provision, according to the comprehensive plan, that there would be affordable housing provided. And the applicant knew all of this at the time and now is looking for some relief. From the comprehensive plan? I didn't hear that mentioned in the comments. I'm not talking about that. So I'm asking, is that what you're proposing, is to bring an item back that's going to, you know, or are you contemplating providing relief to an applicant from the requirements of the comp plan? From the past. That's not my, I, we, and we have a light, but my understanding of this is, based on the conversation I had with our legal staff, Mr. Dooley has an issue. It's been addressed with staff. There are tables and other things that are here. I don't, don't want to get into it now. I think we're on the fly now. I'm not saying I would be up or down on any part of that. I just want the process to be explained so everyone gets an opportunity. Mr. Dooley wants to come forward. But just having an agenda item doesn't mean he's, from my point of view, not guaranteed anything. But if our staff has a question and it turns into some legal issue, I'd rather make it an individual agenda item that everyone knows about that we can hear more about and then we're not doing like a side thing because I'm not interested in the side thing. But I also don't understand what this has to do with Live Local. We're going to abide by Live Local. We have no choice. It's a law. So we're going to comply. Correct. So I don't understand why we need to have an agenda item about it. Commissioner Smith. It's my understanding that there are going to be some changes to Live Local because what maybe got pushed through last year was what people thought was the right approach. I think it's an opportunity for us in Martin County to say if affordable housing and Live Local, well, not if, it is the law, it is the rule, if it is to happen, does our comp plan line up with what Live Local does? And if it doesn't and we want something more, then that gives us the opportunity, which I don't think we have in front of us today, to really delve in to understand what that looks like. But that's what I would want from staff to prepare enough information for all of us to say, yes, State, if you could fix this, this, and that, that that would either more closely align ourselves in Martin County with what's in our comp plan and or if this wage discussion and median income discussion is off and there's a better calculation or there's a better number we should be using to achieve ultimately what's wanted to be achieved, then I would be interested in knowing that. It doesn't mean I'm going to support it, but it would certainly be helpful not to have an ad hoc conversation versus having an agenda item that lays all that out for us, for me, anyway. Mr. Stokas. Mr. Chair, just so I'm making sure my notes are accurate, if we were to bring back an item, the first item, part of that item would be what our existing comp plan language is, then explain the process in which it goes about, also talk about AMI versus average wage in the comp plan, and then the third part would be comparing our comp plan language as it relates to the Live Local Act and any potential changes. If my notes are correct, if you all were to take that action, that's what you would want us to bring back to you. Well, I would think also to compare the HUD tables and how we apply it with what is in our comprehensive plan is the way. I just want to make sure I'm taking accurate notes and deliver what you all are expecting. I believe you are. Do you need a motion for that? I think so. I would move that we ask staff to bring back an agenda item in the near future, whenever that's when staff has appropriately gotten time to assemble all the data and bring it back to us as an agenda item for discussion. Hopefully, at least before legislative session starts so that if there is something we would recommend to our delegation that we would like to be addressed, we would have time to be able to work with them to implement that. Second. Okay. Would you repeat what you just said so that I understand what the motion is? Are you talking to me? Because it's your notes. Mr. Stokas or Mr.? Mr. Stokas. Commissioner, I have as the first part of the item to be us putting out the comp plan language, then explaining the process. As a part of that, explaining the difference between average median income versus average area wage and how that relates to the comp plan, as well as comparing the HUD tables and how they relate to our comp plan language and then the last part being where our current comp plan language is versus the Live Local Act, and you would like this all delivered prior to the end of legislative session. No, no, no, before any legislative session. I will promise to do my best, but you don't have a lot of meetings between now and then. So, before legislative session, and I guess I'll add, I'll also make sure to have a meeting with Mr. Dooley as well. Yeah. Okay. We have a motion by Commissioner Smith, seconded by Commissioner Jenkins. All those in favor? Aye. Aye. All those opposed? Opposed. Motion carries three to one with Commissioner Hurd dissenting. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Thank you. Okay. We have reached the end of our official agenda. 5-0-5, end of the day, public comment. Anyone looking to address us at the end of the day? None. Back to the board. Commissioner Smith. I'm also. Commissioner Jenkins. Happy Thanksgiving. Commissioner Hurd. Happy Thanksgiving. I would echo those sentiments. Our next commission meeting is December 5th. Mr. Donaldson, do you have anything at the end of the day? No, only a minor comment from Mr. McHugh after he left. Remember that, you know, they talked about the German U-boats torpedoing vessels off. And there's a, actually there's a decent dive site off of that was, the Halsey was torpedoed off of Palm Beach County and wound up sinking in, just into St. Lucie County off the power plant. It's just a remnant of some of the activities that went on during the war. So that was a significant thing that went off on our coast that most people wouldn't think about. It's interesting how close the war came to the borders of the U.S. Yes, my. Mr. Elder, anything. Did a nice job today. Thank you. I would just wish everyone a happy Thanksgiving. Drive carefully. I have heard their pre-pandemic numbers will be on the roads. I still see crazy driving happening everywhere in the county. So let's not have any tragedies. We've had some tragedies recently in our community. And with that, we will be back on December 5th. And our last meeting of the year is December 12th. Thank you very much. Thank you very much.