COMMISSION WORKSHOP - Jun 03, 2025

Okay, welcome, good morning to the June 3rd, 2025 City Commission workshop, calling the meeting to order, and we're going to start with the Pledge of Allegiance by Jen, our city attorney. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands, one nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice. Okay, we're going to go to citizens' input. Does anyone in the audience wish to speak on a topic that is not on the agenda? I'm seeing nobody coming forward. I will close citizens' input, go right to our workshop items, of which we have two, and I'm going to go to staff presentation, City of Dunedin Employee Experience Survey, Teresa and Dr. Neely. Good morning, Vice Mayor and Commission, Teresa Smalling, Director of HR and Risk Management for the City. For your review, we are presenting the 2025 City of Dunedin Employee Experience Results. It's been about four or five years since we last did an experience or engagement survey, and I just want to give kudos to our HR manager, Alex Simpkins, who worked tirelessly first to do the request for quotes for a consultant to conduct the survey, and then also working with Dr. Neely of Forward Analytics, the selected consultant, to put the initial questions together and to coordinate the implementation of the survey. The survey was open from March 4th through March 25th, and employees were all encouraged through an email from Jennifer to go ahead and participate. We selected a consultant so that the responses would be totally anonymous, out of the hands of the city, so in hopes of giving the employees that sense that, you know, they wouldn't be pinpointed it for their results, for their responses. And so I have Dr. Neely with us here today to present the final results and just go over the high points of the survey with the commission for your review and comment. Great. Thank you, Teresa. Good morning, everyone. Yes, Dr. Neely is coming in through Zoom. He's actually out of state right now, so he's sharing through Zoom. Can you hear me okay? We can. Okay, perfect. Well, good morning, everybody. Thank you for having me. I appreciate it. I want to apologize in advance. I'm going to leave my camera off. I'm having some connectivity issues with this device, and on the off chance that it drops me, I have my phone ready to reconnect on that on Zoom for that. So I apologize. Hopefully, we won't have any issues though. Teresa covered a little bit already of how we went about doing the survey this year. I want to thank her and Alex and the team there for their support. They were very responsive when we needed to make adjustments and kind of promote the survey a little further. So thank you to them and to Jennifer for that. We were able to get a good response rate on the survey of 45%. I know that sometimes when I say that that's a good response rate, people say, wait, they're our employees. Why didn't they all take it? That doesn't happen. Anything above 30% is usually pretty good for drawing inferences from the workforce as long as you have a sizable workforce, which Dunedin does. And so this is right on par with what we would typically see. Something in the 30 to 55% range for a response rate would be standard. So we're confident drawing inferences. We're also confident because we had some good balance in the responses. We didn't get an overly large response pool from any one group that would threaten to throw off the validity of the survey. For instance, we have a mix of about 29% of people with two years or less experience, but we also have almost 20% of people with 20 or more years experience, 18% of people with 11 to 20 years experience and so forth. So we have a lot of balance. We had about a 50-50 balance on those with and without supervisory responsibilities. And we had a good mix of people coming from different departments throughout the organization. So there's not a fear here that one department is really dominating the responses in a way that would skew the results toward issues in that particular department. So overall, we were really pleased, got a balanced sample of employees, a good sample size to draw inferences about the workplace. And as a result, we can be confident that what we're looking at is a good representation of what your employees are experiencing and believing with, of course, the caveat that there could be some employee experiences that are in any employee survey that are kind of not expressed because employees weren't confident to take the survey. I do want to reiterate to any employees who will hear this, that the survey responses are completely anonymous. The city will never be able to identify where they came from, IP address, name, or otherwise. So with that, I am ready to jump into the key findings from the survey unless there are any questions about how we did it. Anybody have any questions on how it was done at this point? Okay. All right. Let's go ahead and go. Dr. Neely. Thank you. And please call me Steven. Feel free. Okay, Steven. So the first key finding that stood out, this is a kind of an interesting thing we found here. There's high employee satisfaction at the individual level, but employees don't perceive that among their peers. I found this kind of fascinating. The overwhelming majority of your employees say that the job, they like their job, the job contributes to their quality of life. They're overall satisfied with their job. Really, really first time we've included some of these in recent surveys that I've done on employee engagement, but the strong sense of belonging in the organization, that's a great number for 90% of people to be saying they have a strong sense of belonging there. They have meaningful workplace relationships. These are all really good numbers. But then when we ask them if overall morale in the workplace was high, a significantly smaller number agreed. So only about 60% of your employees, when they look around at their peers say, I perceive that morale is high in the workplace. That's an interesting dichotomy or distinction. So in individual employee experiences, whoops, I went too far. I'm sorry. Individual employee experiences are good, but they're not seeing that among their peers. And so that is an interesting finding that kind of opened the survey. And it, it echoes some things that I'm going to show you in a couple later slides that I think that one of the, just the banner word flying over this, over these findings would be communication or, or demonstration. And I'll explain a little more what I mean by that as I, as I move forward, but there's, I think a sense that there's some room to better communicate and demonstrate to employees, some of the things going on in the organization to help some of these overall impressions. But again, the, the, the core numbers here are very positive. The individual experiences are very positive. It's just a matter of a lot of employees not seeing that in their peers, which makes us wonder a tiny bit about the 50% who didn't respond, if there would be some morale issues there. But we don't have any evidence of that from the survey data. So that's the first really key thing that stood out. Whoops. The second, one of the things we always measure in a public workplace, and I, we call this mission alignment in the, in the survey report. But really, I think that we could talk about this as, we could talk about this as public service motivation. Those of you who have been in government for a while probably have heard that phrase public service motivation. We try to measure that in the survey because a public sector workplace has to have strong public service motivation of strong sense that employees are there because they want to serve the citizens, they want to serve the needs of the community, and that they find meaning and value in doing that. And we found really good numbers on that. We have 94 or 90 plus percent of employees say they're proud of the work that they do. They understand how the work they do contributes to the city's goals. That's critical. If employees don't understand how their tasks, how their job contributes to what the city's trying to achieve, contributes to how, how it's bettering the community, then that can become a little bit problematic. But we don't see that here. We see, we see really good numbers in this regard. We have no real lack of clarity on responsibilities. 93% say they know what's expected of them in their role. Again, this is all really, this is all really, these are all really positive numbers. Not, not pictured here, but I understand how my job contributes to the larger mission of the organization. That, that is a, again, a very high, very positive, almost 96%, I believe, said that they agree with that. They understand how their job contributes to the mission of the city, or mission of, yeah, mission of the city, and feel a sense of accomplishment in my work. Again, we're over 90% on that. So we have really good numbers on mission alignment, or if we want to call this kind of public service motivation of employees. That's bedrock. That's the first place we always look in a, in a public sector organization. And if those numbers are bad, then there's a lot of work to do in that area before you do anything else. Your numbers are great in that area. So you have a really engaged, motivated workforce to, to serve the community, to, to understand how their role serves the community, and find a sense of purpose and an accomplishment in that work. So that was one of the really, the really shining points of the results. And again, if I'm, I can't see you, so if I'm going too fast, please feel free to interrupt. I think you're good. So organizational values, how, how their values align with the organization's values is another key area we look at, because this is one of the places where, where discontent can, can fester among employees. If they feel, A, that their values don't align with the organization's values, or B, that the organization isn't living up to its values. And so this is an area where we did a little digging. And overall, the large majority, almost 90% of your employees say that their values align with the city's values. But I would have liked to see a little more strongly agrees, excuse me, in there. We got 37% who strongly agree, while about 52% just say they agree. And so that's an area that I would highlight, and I think we did highlight in the report, to, to be looking to improve. And based on everything, I'm kind of triangulating everything I'm seeing in the survey, from the open ended responses to the previous questions we talked about. And I don't see an area of concern to say that the city's values are off. I see a lot of area to, to communicate and demonstrate where the city is living out those values, and where the city, and how the city is living out those values. Because I think that the general sense we're seeing from employees isn't that it's not, it's that they're not always seeing it or aware of it. An example would be the accountability issues that came up. We asked some open-ended questions about this, about this issue of value alignment. And one of the things that kept coming up was accountability. In a sense that, and you'll see this in a little bit with the department findings, a sense that maybe employees aren't being held accountable for the work they do, and that that's creating extra work for others, is kind of the sense that is being conveyed by that potentially big bullet point there, number two. Excuse me. And so those, those are areas, again, that it seems from the results and from the responses, and you will have a file with all of the responses to go through the, the open-ended comments. It seems that that's more about communication and demonstration than any glaring gaps in actual behavior on the part of the organization, if that makes sense. Does that make sense? Am I explaining that clearly? Are there any questions on that? Everybody good on that? Could he say that again? Yeah, can you just repeat it? Um, again, I think the sense is not that there are areas that stand out where, where employees are saying, oh, the city's failing to live up to its values here or there. It's more a sense of they're not seeing that communicated clearly enough, how and where the city is kind of living out its values. Okay, gotcha. And so there's, there's nothing that stands out where, where we have a large number of employees saying, oh, we see, we see this kind of mismanagement or this kind of misbehavior. It's just a sense of like, I'm not really sure my fellow employees are always held accountable for their, for what they're supposed to be doing. There's of course, concerns over compensation, and some people tie that to organizational values. We understand the challenges right now, both broader economic challenges, and it's just the challenges of compensation and public sector organizations to begin with. And so, um, some of that creeps in, but there's no glaring areas of concern. There's maybe just a sense that they're not seeing that as much as demonstrated as clearly as, as, um, they could be. Gotcha. Um, again, please feel free to interrupt me if anything's not clear or if I'm going too quickly. Um, you guys really, this, this one kind of surprised me. This is great. Um, these, these numbers aren't in the nineties, like some of the other slides, but again, we've got to take the context of a public sector organization where innovation and adaptability are, are often points of criticism. And you guys have some of the better numbers I've seen in that area. Um, three quarters say, I mean, some jobs, the reality is that some jobs just are not going to have the ability to encourage innovation because of regulations and because of rules that have to be followed and procedures that have to be followed. And so these numbers tend to look pretty low in a lot of public sector organizations. Yours look, look very strong. Um, 76% say innovation is encouraged cities in the city adapts well to challenges. That's for a public sector org. That's a great number. Um, 78% say, believe the city operates efficiently. Again, that's a very strong number for, for a government organization. Um, but again, that number drops down a lot here at 58% saying they believe employees are held accountable for expectations. Um, and I want to emphasize again, um, we're, these are perception data. I'm giving you employees perceptions of the workplace. I cannot tell you from these data, if employees are, or are not held accountable for expectations, that this is about the perceptions of the organization and about a data point that can cause some, um, cause some discontent among employees, if it's perceived to not be, to not be as not being done. And so, um, this is the perception that about four in 10 of your employees are saying, yeah, I'm not sure that others are held accountable for their expectations. And so, or for meeting expectations. And so again, that kind of stands out across the survey is something that it might be that there are some strategic changes needed in response to that, or it might need be that just better communication and awareness is needed. Um, that's something that really falls to, to cities leaders to kind of determine the best path on that. But that, again, that is the, one of the places that stands out where the numbers drop every time we look at, um, expectation or accountability to employee expectations. And then overall, a strong number saying that employee, that leaders set clear performance expectations. 71% of employees say that leaders set clear performance expectations. Again, for public sector organizations, that's a very solid number. Um, any questions on, on how I'm explaining that? I, I feel like I'm, um, I'm probably, it probably makes a little more sense in my head than it does coming out of my mouth. Okay, I think we have a question. Mr. Walker. Um, yeah, so, um, so the 58% believe employees are held accountable for expectations. That, um, that's a little confusing to me. Um, what type of expectation? Are they performance expectations or? Yes, I think, I think if I, if I could be so bold as to kind of paraphrase this a bit, um, I think that what you're seeing is that only about 60% say that others are being held accountable for pulling their weight. And then if that makes a little easier to understand. Yeah. Well, then it kind of, it kind of conflicts with the next one. Then, uh, that's just an interesting, uh, data point for me. It is. And again, I really want to emphasize that these data don't answer whether or not that's correct. They just answer what the employees perceive. Um, and so I think that, um, the, in a lot of cases, employees aren't privy to the accountability mechanisms that are being used for their coworkers. They just have a perception of whether or not others are kind of doing that. And if I could jump to the, um, if I jumped to the department data here, um, if you can bear with me for just a moment, I'm going to do this on paper. Um, the workload in my department is fairly distributed is one of the questions we ask on any employee survey. When we get to the department level, a third of your employees disagree. So one third of employees say the workload in my, in my department is not fairly distributed that tends to overlap with this number here. So where we see, where we see low results on this question here of accountability, we tend to see low results there on that question within departments. And that's the same. I'm seeing that same pattern here. It's not an uncommon pattern. Um, it's just one that stands out. And again, a lot of the times when we dig into these strategically with organizations, when they're doing this as part of a strategic planning process, we often find that communication and visibility are some of the key issues more so than a lack of actual accountability. Public sector organizations tend to, um, tend to have accountability built into their structure by, by necessity and nature. And so I would, I lean toward wondering if it's more of just a visibility of that, of those processes. No, I appreciate that. Thank you. Anybody else have anything up to this point or? Okay, cool. I mean, I, I think, um, Dr. Neely, that would be, I mean, as a former HR director, it's not uncommon. That's kind of people seeing their supervisors treating people differently and some people doing more work than others. And, and, and I don't disagree that some of that would probably be what you said, which is they don't always see what's going on behind the scenes. Um, okay. Uh, you can keep going. I work at a very large bureaucratic organization, public sector organization, and by design, you are not supposed to see the accountability and the, in the individual kind of, um, employer, uh, supervisor, employee relationships of others. And so I think part of it is just the ability to communicate that as effectively as possible. Gotcha. Okay. I think you can go on. So, um, inclusion stood out as a strength of the organization. Um, obviously when it comes to some of these questions, we would love to see a hundred percent, um, across the board, but we never do, um, individual experiences of course factor into these, but there are no systemic issues standing out in your workplace. Um, there, there's nothing here that's different from what we see in a healthy workplace survey. Um, I've seen some unhealthy workplace surveys. These numbers can get really bad in them. Your numbers are right where we would kind of expect them to be. Um, obviously we, again, we would, we would love to say that we can address any and all concerns. They're not always brought forward. Um, I would just emphasize to, I emphasize to every organization, um, having reporting, uh, channels where people can feel comfortable and safe raising any concerns is critical. I know the city is committed to that. So there's nothing here, um, that looks different from what we see in just about any city or county that we run this in. Oops. The real strength, the one that really impressed me, um, on top of the public service motivation of your organization is these individual supervisor relationships. Great numbers on these close to, um, above 80% in all of them, close to 90% in some, the overall, the overall message here is that your employees have good relationships with their direct report, with their direct supervisor. They trust them. Um, they say that they support their growth. They receive regular feedback, feel comfortable sharing their concerns. Um, this is, this is again, another kind of bedrock necessity for an, for an effective workplace, a healthy workplace. And your numbers are much better than we sometimes see. It's not uncommon to see these numbers in the seventies or sixties. Um, so yours are, yours stood out to me as a little stronger than some others. Um, any questions on these and what these mean before I kind of move on? Um, anybody? Good city manager. Good. Okay. Yeah. I want to linger on this slide because it's a high point. And now that we're done with it, we have to go to this one. So let me start by saying that I have run dozens of employee surveys for cities and counties in Florida. Communications is always, always the weakest point. Um, and again, part of this is just the nature of us as human beings. Part of this is the nature of public sector and bureaucratic organizations. Um, but there's one number in yours that, um, that stands out to me. So let's, let's talk about some of the other numbers first. Um, department leaders communicate well within departments. So we have, we have three levels of communication that we measure in this survey. We measure communication within departments, cross departments, and across the organization. Your within department communication is pretty much on par with what we typically see. 78% say department leaders communicate well within departments. Your communication, um, they're not pictured here, but your comms numbers for the organization as a whole were not very bad. Um, we have, um, so almost 80% saying that the city manager's office effectively communicates with employees. So right around the same number as within departments we see within the organization as a whole. So your department level communication is solid. Your organizational communication is solid, but departments communicating effectively with one another that dropped significantly. Um, and that dropped to be, to be, you know, in the interest of, of being helpful and constructive for you, it dropped more than I expected and more than I typically see. Um, so only just a smidge over half say that departments communicate effectively with one another. And I have a little bit of experience seeing this trend. And I can't tell you this for certain from the data, but what I typically see in public sector organizations where this kind of trend emerges is that the disconnect is between, disconnects exist between internal and external facing departments. So an internal department, and this is, this is, this is a hypothetical example. I don't have the data in your survey to say this, but an internal department would be, um, procurement or, um, information technology or human resources. An external facing department would be public works, emergency services, um, disaster response, parks and rec, people who are facing out toward the community serving there versus those who are serving stakeholders within the organization. Those tend to be areas where departments speak different languages. They have different, they have a slightly different sense of their, their mission, and they have, they have procedures and protocols that they need followed. The classic example of this is procurement. Procurement almost always gets dinged when you ask about internal, um, when you ask about individual departments because they speak their own language and they're kind of a gatekeeper to others for, for being able to do the tasks you want to do. And so this tends to be where these issues stand out. Um, I can't say that definitively based on what we asked in this survey, but that would be my hunch of where you want, would want to start looking, but I'd be honest and say that this is probably the data point that stands out to me the most in your survey that I would say if you really want to improve it. And the, and the, the responses overall, um, paint the picture of a very healthy workplace, an effective workplace, a place where people are happy and belong, where there's not systemic issues that are causing discontent among employees or thwarting the mission of the city. This would be one data point that kind of stands in contrast to that. And one where I would say that would be kind of step one would be how can we get departments speaking better to one another? Um, there's a lot of ways to do that. Department liaisons, um, more interdepartmental meetings, um, clarifying procedures and expectations, and, you know, kind of where those departments fit in the mission of the organization. Those are all areas that could be, that could be used to improve that number, but that's honestly the number that stands out the most in your, in your responses as an area, as an opportunity to strengthen the organization. Uh, any questions on that? That's a mouthful. Okay. Um, any questions? Sorry. Not seeing any. I think, uh, you can keep going. Okay. Um, and again, I will say, I like to be honest and give you the feedback that will help you make improvements. Um, but I also like to, to be fair and say that if that is the biggest problem we're seeing in your survey, you're well positioned to fix it. So, um, it's, it's an opportunity for improvement. It's not a cause for grave concern. Um, hey, excuse me, Dr. Neal, just hold on one second. Um, I know we have Commissioner Dugard, who's now gotten on via Zoom, um, since he's out of the country. Um, and I just want to give him a chance. Commissioner Dugard, I mean, I know you're just on. Do you have any questions up to this point so far? Not so far, but thank you for sharing. Okay, great. Thank you. Okay. We can keep going. All right. The last key finding was just about the wellness programming. Um, this was included as a kind of breakout section of the survey. It yielded some interesting data. Um, and again, presentation, um, demonstration kind of stood out as one of the key words that hung over this. Um, most people say they have some interest in attending sessions. Um, but timing and relevance were the big barriers that kept a lot of people away. Um, the timing of these, um, and the relevance of the topics. And I'd love to tell you that from the responses, a clear ideal time and some clear ideal topics emerged. Um, but that would not be true. There's a lot of, there's a lot of people saying the timing doesn't work, but they're, they're suggesting different times that would work for them. Not the same kind of, there's no, there's no, uh, consensus there and the same with topics. So really we want to leave this data. I think to the wellness programming team to, to look through and make decisions based on, um, what the data remind us here is that, uh, you can't please everyone each time. And so some variety and diversity of offerings and times is probably the best way to reach, um, to reach the workforce comprehensively. And that is the last key finding that we have. And so I'm going to do is make everyone happy and stop talking and take any questions you have and, um, remind you as always that I am always happy to go back in the data and look at anything in more detail that you would like more information on if it's not included in the report. Great. Okay. Um, so I'm going to go to, uh, more formalized questions if we have any, and I guess I'll start with the vice mayor. Mayor, no questions at this time. Okay. Um, commissioner Sandbergen. Out of the, there was 423 cent and 45, uh, percent responded. Uh, was there any trend in per department, which departments were higher or lower? Um, right here is the, um, percentage of completes by department. So utilities and parks and rec were the biggest, um, biggest, uh, public works a little behind that. That's a pretty standard, um, picture. I don't know the size and perhaps I should have asked that up front. I don't know the size of your departments. Um, fire and, and EMS usually is a larger percentage, um, of completes, uh, and library and community development in this case are a little larger than I would typically see them. But again, I don't know the size of your individual departments to know if that, um, should stand out or not. It's just kind of a pattern I'm used to see. So commissioner just, just for perspective, the, the first three are largest, um, operational units. So like for example, public works just under 18%, is that 18% of the total responses or of the employees in that, in that department? It's 18% of the total responses. Okay. Okay. Um, and I noticed that we're, we're picking up a larger percentage of employees less than five years. Um, I mean, you know, so they're relatively new, probably younger. Would they be more inclined to ignore this survey or would they be the ones that would have participated in this survey? Well, I would say right now we're looking at what 45, 46% of your respondents were five years or less of employment. Right. But we only have three percent of your respondents between 18 and 24 years old and 14% or, and, uh, 17% total under 35 years old. So newer does not necessarily mean younger in this case. Um, it just means that they've been with the city for a less period of time. When I look at the breakdown, this is page five of the report. If anyone has it with them, when I look at the breakdown of completion by years of employment, the story this tells me is that you're a growing organization that's hired a lot of people in the last five years. Um, you can correct me if that's not the case, but that's kind of the, the, the initial thing that the data seemed to suggest. Okay. We're in the process of implementing an efficiency program. Will there be any monitoring or keeping an eye if that improves any of these numbers? Um, that's ultimately up to the city. I, I recommend, um, it always feels a little weird to recommend this because I'm the one who does it, but, uh, I recommend doing these every year and I recommend that after about the third year you start tracking trends. Um, and you, you gotta be careful. I think we discussed this with the citizen survey last year. You gotta be careful when you don't have enough data points because a little sampling error can create noise that looks like a trend when it isn't. Okay. Um, but after about three years you can start piecing together some underlying trends beneath that noise, but beneath that kind of random fluctuation that comes from sample to sample and that, that way you can start tracking progress. But I think it's important. There's two, two things I always tell people when it comes to employee surveys. One, it's important to do them because it's important that employees know that they're being heard, but if you do them, you have to act on them. If employees think that you're just collecting data, but not acting on that data, not using it to make improvements, um, then they'll stop taking the survey and it, and it hurts trust within the organization. So what I recommend is the next time you do a survey, when the announcement, the email goes out from Jennifer's office saying, you know, you're going to be receiving a survey. It should also say we did this last year, or we've done this for however many years and here's some of the changes and improvements we've made. Okay. Based on what we've done. I think that's a really important piece for kind of building that trust and buy in from employees. And my last question on this survey, was there anywhere that, um, the staff had a chance to make notes or comments, or was it just multiple choice? Yes, there are several points where open-ended comments were allowed and those are covered in the report. Um, I, I, I mentioned to this, to the city up front, when we started this, that I use a generative AI platform to analyze, help me analyze those, um, to code them and identify key themes. And so those are identified in the report in several places. That's, uh, table four includes some of that. And then, um, table seven and then one near the end as well. But, uh, you also, there also should be a file that was shared, uh, de-identified file with nothing but the raw responses. And those should be included in there as well to read through. I appreciate your help. That was all my questions. Thank you, sir. Okay. Commissioner Walker. Thank you, Mayor. Um, did we, uh, you know, so when was the last employee survey that we did? It was conducted in 2019. 2019. And I, I don't know if this would be, uh, apples to apples or apples to other, but, um, did we do any sort of comparison of where we stood in 2019 compared to this survey? Uh, honestly, no, because the, the demographics of our employees had changed so much that we, we did not see them. That's fair. I, yeah, I get that. Um, and this is for Dr. Neely, um, in terms of, uh, identification and implementation of the best practices to, um, to improve some of these areas. Um, any, any thoughts on, um, those best practices and how they might impact cross department communication? Yeah. So I think that one of the most effective things I've seen for cross department communication is the liaison model. Um, so for instance, uh, you know, one of the counties in the region here, very large organization, they had some of those issues with procurement that we've talked about. Um, the procurement office sent a liaison to, or created a liaison program, and they identified a liaison in every single department within the organization. And that person just learned some of the procurement language, learned how to communicate what procurement needed for things to work smoothly, um, learned and communicated back to procurement, the needs of that department, um, and how they spoke and what they, you know, what their expectations were. And that helped to dramatically smooth out those relationships and improve those numbers over time. Um, so I think that's a very strong model. Um, feasibility will always depend on the organization itself of whether or not that works. Um, sometimes just having some more, um, cross departmental meetings where, where these kind of needs are, are communicated can be an important thing. Um, and so I, I think, I think that in a city setting, the liaison model works really well. Um, but again, this, this doesn't tell us where the issues lie, just that employees say, you know, in general say that departments don't communicate effectively with one another. A little internal digging might help to identify some of those pressure points a little better. Yeah, I appreciate that. Um, then the other thing, and I, I just, this might be a little bit of a comment, but well, no, there's a question here. Um, why, uh, why do we think that fire and community development were so much lower than the other areas? I don't think I could answer that because I don't know the size of those departments. Um, I don't know what percentage of the total workforce they make up. And maybe, maybe it's reflective, like for instance, community development, uh, you know, four or five, six people compared to the whole organization. That is that how that 6% is arrived at, or is it 6% of the department? No, it's 6% of the total responses came from the community development departments. Okay. Um, they are a smaller department. They're a smaller department. Yeah, that makes a little bit of sense to me in this. Oh, I'm sorry, go ahead. That's all right. Uh, Steven, I was just, uh, uh, telling the commissioner that community development is actually a smaller department comparatively. Uh, for example, I mean, you have administrative departments, which is all those internal departments grouped together, right? So the, the really small departments, um, HR, um, IT community development, they're all together. City manager's office. City manager's office, most importantly. But anyway, so I'm just kidding. And city clerk, right? Most importantly. But that for the next smaller group, I think commissioner would be community development after that. Yeah. No, I, that's, that's the clarification. I, that's what I kind of assumed, but, uh, yes. Fire, fire being low is, it doesn't surprise me in the sense that, you know, if you think about the work of a fire department on a day to day basis, they're not sitting at the computer waiting for emails. Um, and so having a lower response rate among that department doesn't surprise me. It does tend to be a larger department in some cities and counties. So we see a larger number there. And I guess you guys don't have police force, correct? Correct. We do not. A lot of times I see fire police and EMS kind of lumped together in a survey and it'll be a larger number, but, um, it tends to be a larger employee base in those cases. Um, but they're not sitting at the computer in the same way that some of the other departments are. So their individual response rate within that department might tend to be lower. So, uh, Dr. Neely, I'm sorry, I need to clarify. We do have a police force. It's the sheriff's office by contract. I don't want anybody watching to think that we don't have law enforcement in Dunedin. Yeah. And just as an, um, fire represents about 13% of all our employees. So. Okay. Then that number doesn't really surprise me because again, the, the individual response rate within that unit is going to be lower just by the nature of the work. Yeah. Okay. I don't know. Thank you very much. Uh, commissioner to guard. Thank you. Can you hear me? We can. Oh, that's excellent. Thank you. And thank you for this wonderful survey. Um, when I'm looking at the participation by department, um, I'm just struggling a little bit with the math there and I wanted to be sure I understood what I'm looking at. Um, the total on the percentages seems to be less than a hundred, but very low when it pertains to a response group of about 190. Help me understand this slide. Um, can you, can you, I'm sorry, can you clarify what you mean? Uh, pers, participation by department. Does that mean that within each of those departments, 20.2% participated in utilities and engineering of, or of the overall utilities and engineering was 22, 20.2% of the results? Um, that overall they were 22% of the results. Of the, uh, response group, which was a little bit more than, uh, 190. Is that correct? Um, the exact number was 190 exactly. Okay. Excellent. Um, so what do you look for when you have a response rate of 190 for validity of the results? How do you find your validity? Because you're well under the 500 mark relative to trying to figure out the statistical validity of a group. And so you're looking at a percentage of under 50%. How do you measure your validity? So the validity is conceptually it is validity of a statistic is referring to whether we're measuring what we believe we're measuring. Um, and when we talk about sample size, we tend to be talking about the reliability of this, of the sample. Um, can we generalize it to the population as a whole? So can we generalize this 40 some percent of the workforce to the workforce as a whole? These, these data points here help us to answer that to some, whoops, to some degree. Um, it shows us that we do have representation of the workforce by department. We're not skewed too abnormally to any one department or another. If we look at page, um, I think three and four of the report, we have the table that should, or I'm sorry, page five. We have a table that shows the characteristics based on length of employment, age, supervisory responsibilities. Um, that shows us again that we have some balanced representation of the workforce. And so we, we have some reliability there. Um, I'm going to do a quick calculation for you. Um, so we talk about, um, we talk about margin of error with surveys a lot. And the margin of error is tricky because the margin of error assumes that the sample is representative. And if the sample isn't representative, then you can do all the statistical calculations you'd like. It doesn't matter because the margin of error is, is, is, is based on the assumption that it is representative. If we assume here that your sample is representative of the employees, which it appears to be based on the data in table one and in that figure, then, Oh, go ahead. That's okay. It's just, uh, I'm on a ship and they're wanting to come in and help me with my luggage. Sorry. Okay. Um, I feel honored that you would waste your time talking to me when there's so much more. I assure you, you're not a waste of time. Keep going. So your margin of error in this case would be about five. And so could we, would we like to see that tightened up? Yes. Um, that, you know, getting another 30 to 50 responses would help to tighten that up to about a three, which is kind of what we use for big national, you know, um, public opinion surveys, the margin of error of about three. So it's a little bigger than we would like, but it's not glaringly bad. Um, so you could say that for any of these data points, you might want to think about them in a plus five minus five kind of range as the possibility of what you would see if every employee in the organization responded, but there's no, there's nothing in the demographics of who responded by department or by individual characteristic that suggests that the serve sample is unbalanced. Um, so I do think you have a representative sample of employees. Could it be that employees who are, who are more satisfied, we're less likely to respond. That's common. Um, it tends to be, um, people who respond tend to be those who, you know, um, first and foremost are dissatisfied. Um, and so some of the numbers could improve if you had a larger sample or a larger, a larger pool of, uh, employees responding. But again, I think that plus, plus minus five range is probably a helpful frame for that. Okay. Put half the audience to sleep. I can't see you. So I apologize. Is my camera off? Let me get that camera back on. No, I can't see anyone. So it's okay. Oh yeah. Well, I think the audience could see me as I was trying to jerk a cork out of a bottle, but that's another matter. Um, I, I, I, surveys is something that I do myself for my particular business. So I am familiar with the process. Your ordinal seemed kind of interesting to me. Um, and I found that to be a little narrow when you have only four possible responses on an opinion. Um, very favorable, favorable, not favorable and not favorable at all, or something along those lines, but the four ordinals I saw most, why did you pick just four instead of giving them five where if they didn't know the answer, they would, uh, get kind of locked into trying to figure out where they land. Sure. Um, I use two rules when creating a scale like that. Uh, the first rule is I don't give you the option to punt unless it's really possible for you to not know, like, could you work at this place and really not know if you have good morale or if you're, if this contributes to your quality of life or whatever it might, whatever the question might be, unless there's an option, unless there's a possibility that you just really don't know. So really the only place that I include in an unsure in this survey, I believe is when it came to the city administration, like this questions about the city manager's office, because employees are so far removed from that experience that they don't know. But within your department or about your supervisor, I don't give you the option to say unsure. Um, you can skip the question, but I don't give you the option to say unsure because people overuse that category when they just don't want to answer. Um, in terms of the number of items, a lot of scales, there's two things that I like to avoid. I like to avoid scales that don't include context cues. Like when it says on a scale from one to 10, how satisfied are you? There's no meaning in the difference between a three and a four. There is a meaning in the difference between not much and not at all. And so I like to use actual context cues for the scale. And I like to avoid situations where there will be so, where the difference is so open to interpretation that you and I could mean the same thing, but choose different answers. So I see some scales that say like somewhat happy versus slightly happy. I don't understand the difference. Right. Um, and so if, if you and I could mean the same thing, but choose different options, I try to avoid that, that kind of, that kind of variation in the scale. I don't know if that, that helps. A little. Thank you. I appreciate the answer. Um, finally, um, I'm looking for the actionable, um, translation of this into something in the daily life of our administration, our management team, and our employees. What would you recommend if you had to make a recommendation that we take as actionable steps with our team? Um, so I do, I, I appreciate the question. I do like to leave that to the extent I can to, to the leaders of the organization who know the feasibility of those things and know the, the on the ground challenges of the organization. But I think the things that stand out to me in your case for what they're worth are, I do think that some sort of liaison model to improve departmental across department communication could be really helpful. I think that communicating and reinforcing, um, the accountability mechanisms that are in place, um, in a way that helps employees understand that even if I don't see it, my, my peers are being held accountable to their, to their job, um, or, or to the standards of the organization. I think that that could be, that could be a useful communication strategy. And if you believe that there are problems doing a workload distribution study within departments could help, um, just to make sure that there aren't glaring inequities in workload distribution, um, clarifying paths for growth and development. And I don't know the extent to which this is already built into your annual evaluation process for employees, but, um, ensuring that there's some form of career planning in that evaluation process, should employees desire it would be really valuable just to make sure that employees don't feel adrift in like, I'm in this role and I don't know how I get to the next one. I don't know if I, if the next one will ever be an option for me here. So maybe I'll look elsewhere. Um, having that kind of career planning built into, um, evaluations could be really helpful. Um, and then just again, leveraging your communication channels to communicate how the city is living up to the, the, the values that his spouse is. There's not a clear sense in the survey that it doesn't. Um, but there is a sense that maybe it would help if that was communicated a little more. And I, I think, thank you for excuse me. I think that the city manager wanted to jump in here too. Yeah. Thank you, mayor. And, and actually I, I'd like, uh, if the mayor would, would give me some time towards the end of the survey, just to go over what some of the action items are. Okay. Do you want to wait on that? Yes, if I may, till, till we wrap it up and hear all of your comments and then the actions that we're going to take moving forward as leadership to address some of the, um, uh, concerns in the survey, as well as I'd like to touch upon some of the things that I really liked about the survey. Okay, cool. Okay, great. Um, mayor, just, just for reference, the, uh, recommendations that, uh, Dr. Neely referred to there on page 30 and 31 of the report. Okay, great. Um, Commissioner DeGuard, any other questions? No, that's all I have. Thank you. Okay. Um, so, you know, every, every, a couple of us have touched on this. I'm going to touch on it one last time here. So percentage of respondents again, and I know it's 190 is, is, is it anywhere that we can see for those areas, how many people were surveyed in those areas and what percentage of those employees, like IE percentage of employees in community development, there's actually this number and this number is how many responded. Uh, does that exist anywhere other than in percentages? It doesn't exist in what I've given you, but I could make it exist if you could tell me how many employees were in each department. Yeah, I think that would be helpful just to know the exact numbers because for the small departments, I mean, it could really be very meaningless if it's just a couple of people that responded. And, and I'll ask you again, because it sounds like you feel like if there is a bias, the bias would be, I'm happy. I don't really feel like filling this out. Um, yes, that tends to be the case. So there's two reasons that, um, or let me rephrase that. There's one of the reasons that people will quickly take a survey is they're dissatisfied. The only way that a dissatisfied person will not take the survey is, is if they don't trust that it's anonymous. I think the city did a very good job. I mean, normally these, these emails asking you to take the survey came direct, come directly from the city manager's office. In this case, um, the city said, no, no, no, we want, we want complete, we want our employees to be completely comfortable taking this. Let's have it come from you. So I sent the email with the survey link, and I'm the only one who has the, the raw data that would, you know, that came in with the metadata from responses. And that, that is not shared with the city. And so it's never shared with the city, um, in any case, but, um, so I think the city did a good job of communicating that it's always possible that some people just don't trust the process and still think that they could, they could be identified. But for the most part, if someone is dissatisfied and wants to air that dissatisfaction, they're going to take the survey. If someone is happy and busy and feels like this isn't a good use of their time, then they're not going to take the survey. Um, and so I do think in general, when we see response rates go up, we tend to see the overall responses improve in terms of satisfaction. Where did department directors fall in this? I mean, so would the director of, you know, community development, not to pick on community development, they're just the one that comes to mind. Uh, would, would the department, the director be included in community development, or would he be included in admin? Um, that would depend on what he chose, uh, when he reached the, that question in the survey. Okay. If he, if he chose, I could see, you know, with department heads in particular, it's possible that they could have clicked administration instead of clicking community development or whatever the department might be. I, I hope not Steven. Most of the time we identify with our department. So, um, so I guess that just kind of lends itself to my other question, which is, are, are these the right units? I mean, should it be broken down into, you know, clear units? You know, like I could, you know, I could, you know, you brought up internal, internal user, um, internal departments and can't come to terms with the right way to call it now, but it, uh, HR facilities, all the ones that everybody uses. I mean, uh, is there, but does there any reason it should be more clear on, on what departments are what in, in terms of helpful information back to the actual departments themselves or divisions or sections and units? So I had a conversation right out of the gate with Teresa and Alex about this, and we kind of settled on this list, um, based on their guidance because we want to avoid asking at a granular enough level that could be identifying. Yeah, no, that makes sense. So if you start to say, you know, I'm between this age and this age, and I am white, female, um, been with the organization for five years, and I'm in this subunit of that department, now it becomes identify. And so I think that they, they were really wise in walking a balance between getting some information that's usable, but also keeping employees safe and comfortable. Yeah, no, that, that, that makes sense. Um, although I, you know, when I look at that, and I look at like poor community development, they're still small. And so they're, they're kind of outed, but then, uh, you know, some other areas are deeper into some bigger numbers, so they're kind of protected. So anyway, uh, but yeah, that's good that you talked through it. Um, so our, you know, I get that 45% is good. And Jorge, I know you're deep into something over there, but my recollection is climate surveys at Pinellas County were pretty highly, I mean, it was a big number in terms of participation. I just, I tried to text Peggy Rowe to try to get the information, but she hasn't responded. Um, and I, I don't know, like, uh, do you know, cause I think Pinellas County's climates, and again, that's their employee survey. Um, they're, I don't know if they give, give something for people to do it. I don't know, but it seems to me like it's a pretty high number. Um, I'm not sure. I don't, I don't do theirs. Yeah. I can tell you, I have, um, done some larger cities than yours where the response rate has been in the thirties. Um, I do some very small organizations, um, like a hundred employee organizations, like a, um, clerk of courts office kind of setting, um, with a hundred employees where they sometimes get up in the eighties. But again, it's a much smaller workforce and there's a little more leverage. Um, when the, when the clerk asks you to do this, you know, you kind of are more, a little more compelled to do it. And so with an organization at your size, you're right around where I would expect you to be. Um, I, I would love to see it over 50%, but I think if you, if you kind of make it a regular thing and you communicate what you're doing with the results and make that visible, I think that's very possible, uh, moving forward that you would start getting higher responses. Um, with an organization with 423 employees, I would not expect to see an 80 or 90% response rate unless some kind of incentive was being given. I think the most common incentive, I'm going to get myself in trouble here. I think the most common incentive is some sort of PTO benefit or something like that. Um, that some organizations will offer if they get, if they reach a large enough threshold. Okay. Um, do we know what the participation rate was back in 2019? Uh, no, but I can get that. Yeah. That'd be kind of interesting to see. Um, um, um, I don't know if I had any other questions. I, I do think the cross departmental communication area, um, you know, potentially doing a focus group there to really understand the dynamics of that would be really, really good. So, uh, we just restarted our supervisor round tables, um, and we're still blaming COVID for things. Uh, and that was actually a question that we asked of all, we had, I think four sessions and we asked each group in the session to just getting groups and talk about it. So we do have some of those results that we will be, um, sharing this week with all our supervisors. And I think Jennifer's going to talk about that a little bit more as a first step anyway. And again, I'm not trying to pick on internal service, uh, departments cause it could be just as easily just their interaction with each other. But my experience is, you know, understanding from focus group perspective, how well I'll pick on facilities. Cause I know we're trying to get the vacancies filled. We've had, we've had issues with that. And so you hear it like, you know, I turn it in and I can't get it done, but now they're trying to catch up to getting it done. So that really hampers the department. So it'd just be interested in a focus group to see, you know, you know, that whole, um, purchasing HR facilities, IT, what's that dynamic of them, you know? So anyway, you, you guys get my point. Um, so, um, anyway, I guess I've crossed over a little bit into comments, so I apologize for that. And, um, okay. Um, so what do you, I mean, I'm going to give you a chance to do, do what you want to do your, your comments, but do you want our comments first? And then is there anything you want from us in particular or just, okay. Okay. All right. Sounds good. So, uh, final comments. I'll start with Commissioner Walker. Thank you, Mayor. Um, yeah, I think all in all, it's, it's a, it's a good survey. Um, you know, obviously the, uh, the survey is an indicator, but the real benefit of the survey is the, is the actions that are taken to improve the results. And so to me, I, that's equally as important as the survey itself. Um, and, uh, the other thing is, is just, I mean, I understand that, you know, the last survey was, was several years ago, but you know, I, I, I think Dr. Neely had recommended that perhaps we do this once a year and I don't think that's a bad idea, uh, because benchmarking, uh, is also an important aspect of the process. Um, so, uh, I, I think probably the, the best, uh, the thing I'm, I'm looking forward to, um, city manager is the, is the actions and the do outs and how we're going to implement any sort of improvements to our, to our processes. So anyway, but all in all, um, you know, I'm, I'm happy with the survey. There's, there are some things we need to work on, but, uh, there always will be. So thank you. Uh, Commissioner Dugard. Thank you, Mayor. Um, I share, uh, Commissioner Walker's point of view. It, this is a point in time measure and we don't, uh, we are unable to build a trend line from what we have. We simply have a, um, although I noticed that we tried to avoid the term satisfaction. We have something of a satisfaction measure of our employees and I wouldn't consider this to be a bad measure in any comparative context. However, it's nice to know even if the employee workforce of, uh, five, six years ago was completely different, what that workforce had as an opinion in these areas as opposed to this workforce. So in the future, I would like to see more of a comparative approach. So we know if we are losing or gaining ground, um, that, that just strikes me as necessary for us to continue this process. I too share the view that this is an overall good report. I think it speaks to a highly motivated team. I found some responses within the departments to be rather interesting, but in conversations with the manager, they became, uh, much more clear. And therefore, uh, I think that we can pat ourselves on the back and say, this is a good report. That's all I have, Mayor. Great. Thank you, Commissioner. Uh, Vice Mayor. Thank you, Mayor. Uh, yeah, I'm actually a big fan of surveys. Uh, but as Commissioner Walker mentioned, it's the action steps that come from them. They're the ones that are most important. And I know that we take great focus in our citizen surveys. And so it'd be nice if we could take that same focus and approach to the employees as well. And, uh, it's been five years since 2019. And so I'm wondering if part of this is, because we, when we talked about the citizen survey and starting those, we talked about, we need to build trust in, from the residents that will actually take action steps from them. And that's, it's the repetitive, it's that trend line that really builds the trust. And I'm sure, I wonder how many employees even remember taking the survey back in 2019. So in their minds, this is the first time you've ever asked them. And so, but if you do it, uh, with a shorter timeframe, annually by annually, whatever that ends up being, I think you'll end up building that trust, especially when it's coupled with, um, action steps. So I do agree with that. And I do wonder whether or not old feelings show up on new surveys, things that employees just can't shake. Um, and, um, compensation comes to mind. And I know that we have taken some great steps in the last few years on really doing what we can to, to make them right in the marketplace. And I'm wondering if there isn't some feeling out there that they just don't remember those steps or that feeling of I'm underappreciated in that category. Um, uh, I do agree. It would be nice if we would have had that percentage, uh, by department. And so we had a better reflection or idea of the percentage of each department. So that way that gives us a little focus on what we can do to improve. Uh, but overall well done, uh, Teresa, uh, and Steven, thank you very much. Um, it's, it's what we do with this information that, that is most important. So thank you. Thank you. Um, commissioner Sandberg, you know, in reading through it, I really, I think I'm overall very satisfied. Uh, you know, there's notes about work and life balance, but look at, look at what the, the city staff went through in 2024 with hurricanes, the cleanup, the expectations, you know, the public asking them why or when we're going to get it done. You know, I, I think one of the, the biggest assets the city has is our city staff. Um, we hear about first responders. It's not just Dunedin fire rescue, but it's, uh, the water department, wastewater, solid waste. You know, if there's a problem in the community, the citizens want it taken care of. And I think, you know, if we took the survey again today, it would probably have different results based on how someone's day is going or how they feel they've been treated. And I, when I, I guess a couple of the, the, the, the, the factors that showed the morale, I, I, I guess I, I, I don't see it. And I, and I, I hope that any of you that are listening that are concerned about the morale, we have an incredible city manager and it's been pointed in here that her door is open and she's willing to listen. And, uh, you know, that the support that whatever we can do or whatever I can do as a city commissioner to support the city staff, I will always do, uh, the biggest asset that we have. And I appreciate the 190 that responded and I would love to see us improve that if we could get that number higher so we could get a real true feel for what's going on. But I'm very satisfied and, uh, especially when, you know, it's a good place to work and, and I feel wanted and appreciated. And I think that speaks a lot for all of us. And that's, that's all I have mayor. Great. Thank you. Um, yeah, no, I think it's a very good, uh, survey as well. I mean, you know, uh, just when you look at sense of belonging and I mean, and I mean, really, I mean, when you look at it, people have choices these days. And, um, so belonging and feeling a sense of pride where you work and, and those things showed up here is a big deal. And, um, and we need to keep that going. Um, I know that like, you can't look at this and not think about for those of us who were at the rodeo, you know, like, you know, you could, you could kind of feel it. It was a fun day. And of course, you know, Jennifer, you did everything, I think. And, um, and, you know, I made a complete fool of myself multiple times, but it was just, I mean, but you really, you, you, you understood how much the, the employees have those technical, um, abilities. They're proud of them. It was kind of fun to share them, use them in different ways, Commissioner Sandberg and you. And, um, so it was, uh, I don't know if that's all part of belonging to something and it's always important to be competitive on salary, but, you know, you better give people a sense that they belong here, that they enjoy it here, that they feel valued here. So I think there was a lot of good things within this survey that showed that, that that's true. Um, I do think like with the cross communication, as I said, I think, um, a little bit deeper dive into that to really understand where people are feeling that really is, what are they not getting that they really need and understanding what that is. And if there's some, you know, uh, parts of the system that, that in particular we could focus on, um, um, I, I think, yeah, obviously we don't want to do this every five years. It might be more appropriate every other year like we do the other surveys every third year at minimum. Maybe every other year is the right one, but you all can recommend what you think on that. Um, and then, and I, I, I mean, I don't know, you guys decide, but you know, if I was sitting here, I might do a little bit of difference in how I'd split up the sections to get more helpful information for everybody. But, um, yeah, I don't, I don't have anything scientific to add to that. But, um, then, um, and, and, and Jeff, I have to say this, you brought up an issue that I just, it just cracked me up because about is there old stuff that kind of hangs on and people can't let go of it comes out in the survey. I remember this is like, this is old story. I mean, probably 30 years ago when John Lawrence was a city manager and well, it was before the police department went away because it was a police department. It was all this stuff about bad morale and the police department and, and, you know, what are we going to do about it? And so one by one, the city manager was meeting with the police. So this one sergeant comes in, he'd been there forever. And he said, you know, I'm hearing all these rumors about bad morale in the police department. Like, you know, tell me what's going on. What are people feeling? And the guy thinks about it and he can't come up with one thing that's wrong, but he's disgruntled. And John's like, well, you would just give me one tangible thing. Why you feel disgruntled? His tangible thing was that seven or 10 years before that the city used to give a turkey at Thanksgiving and people were still upset about that, that why the city wasn't given a turkey anymore. But it is funny how it was like, it's just a word of like, it was like 10 years ago. It might be time to think about, you know, it's okay. Other things are being given. But it is funny how people can hang on to stuff. I think this is a great survey. Dr. Neely, thank you for what you bring to the table. And so I look forward to hearing the manager's comments on where we go next. Thank you, Mayor, Vice Mayor and Commissioners, and Teresa, Alex, and Stephen. First of all, I took the survey. I did take the survey myself as well. So the open-ended comments, how'd you do? Yeah, the city manager were mine. Just kidding. They were not, actually. So a couple of things that when I read the survey and when I'm listening to Stephen's report that I want to celebrate about this survey is, first of all, the innovation and the innovation aspect. We want to be an innovative organization. We want to innovate. We want to welcome innovation. And we want to encourage it in our employees. And we're seeing it here in the survey. And so if, you know, there's a message for new employees coming in and existing employees and that type of a thing that we can convey is that we want to hear how to do things differently, more efficiently. And we're welcome to those types of comments. So, and I think that's difficult for a governmental organization. Typically, it's like, we've done it this way forever. We're going to keep on doing it until the end of time. And we have, I mean, I remember when we started strategic planning, I said to Nicole, we are not getting rid of the epic goals. And actually, we did. But the point is, though, is that we actually innovated and made our goals even stronger and more reflective of the organization, which is, that's the type of innovation that I want to see moving forward. The fact that they feel aligned with our values is extremely important for that workplace. I want our employees to wake up in the morning and want to go to work and enjoy their work when they're there. And, you know, the old adage, it's not work, you know, if you enjoy what you're doing. Well, every now and then, it's work. I've got it. But still, I want them to be here. And I want them to enjoy what they're doing and feel that, you know, people who work in the public sector often feel, although it's difficult nowadays, but often feel that there is a greater purpose to what we're doing. And it's serving the public, the general public. And you can see that in the survey. And so I celebrate that as well. The fact that they feel so aligned with their supervisors, I think, is because, you know, over and over again, you hear in a strong organization that it's that relationship that is the most important, the direct report to the employee. And we're seeing that here. So I feel that that strength, that backbone, is there in the organization. And they enjoy working with each other as well, which is really important. Again, that's the backbone. So those are the things that I really celebrate in this survey. The other things that we really need to work on, and I'll tell you about how we're going to work on those in a little bit. But that communication aspect, and I thank Dr. Neely for finally really pinning down exactly what it is. It's not within the department. It's not across the organization, but it's interdepartmental. It's that one fact. And we see it, actually. We saw it in the hurricane after action, which we will be presenting to all of you, but we're acting upon right now. We saw it in the strategic planning employee groups that we put together as well. We know that that that is a weakness of the organization, and that's called a silo. And we know that. And I've been talking to the employees about those silos, and most certainly the department directors, for a long time. So that's something that we need to work really hard on, on breaking down those silos. And we are going to meet this afternoon as the department directors, as a team, and put together what that action plan fundamentally looks like. And Dr. Neely has some really good recommendations. But I also have a room full of subject matter experts who are going to help us. They have experience from other organizations. You know, I think that in that room we have a thousand years of experience as far as supervisory skills, and we can really, you know, declare that war on silos as well. And we will come back to you specifically with what we're going to do about that. You know, one of the things that we did as a result of the 2019 survey was that we set up the DEN, the Dunedin employee network. And then we went to teams, so we had to take a step back. But it is a communication mechanism for the employees, but what we find is that not everybody accesses the DEN. You know, some of our folks who are out in the field do not access the DEN. So we had to kind of, we butt up against that, and then we had to figure out a different way to communicate with them, you know, around that barrier. And it is a barrier, I think, for our employees. So we're going to talk about accountability as well, and this perception of the inequity within the organization as far as workload goes. And I'm not sure how we're going to do that, exactly how we're going to address that. But again, we need to put together that specific action plan. And it might be, as Dr. Neely said, just a matter of communicating that people are accountable, you're just not seeing it. You know, and one of the things that I will say is that when we have issues in departments, HR will start an investigation. They may or may not work with the supervisor or the department director, depending upon what the issue is in the department. And then we don't report back to the department because, you know, a lot of that information that we have is not to be made public. And so, you know, employees have this perception of something happening that's really being kept on the hush-hush, an HR activity. It's really not. It's a matter of something is happening here, but it's not going to be, you know, generally known exactly what occurs to protect all parties involved in it. So there are all sorts of things, you know, that happen in an organization of our size in those terms. So, you know, I think as far as the communications go, we're just going to really drill down on that interdepartmental aspect. I do feel that we're communicating across the organization well. One of the things that I'm going to do as a result of this survey, you know, I traditionally wait until the budget is a little bit more formed, but go back around my employee communications and talk about the survey and talk about the actions that we're going to take as a result of the survey and show results as a result of the survey. I don't have blinders on as far as the weaknesses in this organization goes. I feel that we have many, many, many more strengths than weaknesses, and we do need to address, you know, some of them, and we have been. For example, the perception that Dr. Neely said, you know, spoke about that employees are just kind of sitting in place with no opportunity for advancement, and, you know, that's their career. We're doing career laddering. As you know, you approve that in utilities, which allows them to get certifications and be compensated for those certifications, even if it's not necessary for their position so that they can move up the organization. So we're looking at all sorts of innovative things like that to address some of those questions and comments from the employees. So, you know, I really think that overall, this is an excellent reflection of our workforce, and I'm actually very comfortable with it as far as those really important things. Like I was saying, the employees feel aligned with the organization. They feel aligned with their supervisors. We are communicating to a certain extent from, you know, organizationally, and there are some things that we need to fix. There's no survey that we could ever take or do that would be perfect in an organization of this type. And especially working for government is difficult. So there's lots to do with this. Like I said, I'm excited about it. I'm excited about the things that we can do. I'm excited about the things that have been identified within the survey. And I thank the surveys who answered the surveys. I thank the employees, I think, who took the survey. I, you know, I'm grateful to them eternally because, you know, when I do my employee communications, they'll say, well, you didn't do this or you didn't do that. But how do we know unless you tell us, you know, via the survey? So, you know, I'm grateful to them. And there's, like I said, there's work to be done and we are going to do it. So, and I thank all of you for allowing us to do the survey, which you did. You saw it as an informational item. So, we'll report back to you what actions that we're going to be taking. I might do it during the one-on-one, depending upon what, you know, what time we have in workshops and that type of a thing. So, but if I can convey one message to the employees, it's number one, thank you for taking the survey. And number two, we're going to be looking at the items that we showed were of concern to you and we're going to be acting upon them. So, thank you. Okay. And I did forget to do public input. So, if anybody is in the audience and wishes to speak to this issue, come forward. Seeing no one coming forward, I'll close public input. And so, Jennifer, if there's nothing else for this. Okay. Dr. Neely, thank you very much. Appreciate it. Teresa, did you have anything you wanted to close with or? Okay, great. Thank you. And thank you, Dr. Neely. Thank you, Jennifer. And thank you. So, we'll go on our next item or we'll take, I think, a five-minute break and then we'll go to our next item. Okay. We'll call the meeting back to order. And our next item is 2025 grant program update. And so, city manager, did you want to say anything or just turn it right to? Okay. So, right to Nicole and Camille. All right. Here we go, guys. Actually, Camille, I was going to say this is your inaugural, but you've been up here before. So, it's not your inaugural. So, okay. So, we'll go ahead and turn it to you guys. Fantastic. No pressure. No, better be good. No. Good morning, mayor, commissioners, city manager, city attorney, city clerk. Nicole Delfino, strategy and sustainability manager here today with Camille Zoller, our grant specialist, to just give you an overview of where we are with the grant program since it is a fairly new program to the city. So, we'll jump right in. As you are well aware, you approved in the 2024-25 budget the position for a grant specialist. It was, this position was selected to be housed in the city manager's office in the division of strategy and sustainability. We posted the position in the fall of 2024. And Camille was unanimously selected as the candidate of choice from a staff panel representing, we actually have some of our panel here in the room, parks and rec, engineering, public works, and then two of our own staff from the division of strategy and sustainability. Camille started in December of 2024, and she was provided with a robust 30-60-90 day onboarding plan consisting of some benchmarks for success to develop and enhance the city's grant program. So, initially those tasks included meeting with all of the department staff to understand their capital and funding needs, becoming familiar with the city programs, the capital improvement plan, the business plan, the city's budget, join and become involved in local grant-related organizations, develop an internal grant application process and database, and review and update the city's grant policy. So, I'm going to turn it to Camille. So, go over some of those highlights. Thank you. Good morning, everyone. Good morning, Mayor, Vice-Mayor, Commissioners. So, perhaps my two biggest early contributions to the city's grant-seeking efforts can be categorized as a little bit of necessary housekeeping. So, when I started in December, the city had no amalgamated record of our previous grant-seeking efforts. So, all of those records, any applications, any communications with agencies, that was all housed in the individual departments that were submitting those applications. And, of course, our finance team was always aware of our successes, but nobody was keeping a record of any of our failures. And that is actually really, really important to do, because, ultimately, grant-seeking is a lesson in networking and in persuasion. And it's easier to get money from somebody who knows you well, from somebody who you know well, because you know what makes them tick. You know what they care about. And that applies to all different sorts of organizations, great or small. So, it's really important to keep a record of all of our attempts, whether or not they were successful, so that we know what to change moving forward to try and achieve greater success. So, when I created the grant application database, or the GAD for short, my goal was to put all of our applications, successes and failures, in the one place, so that staff had a really easy way to reference these materials as we pursue future funding. So, in January of this year, that was my first project. I worked with our IT staff to build the GAD actually in Microsoft Teams. So, that's a database or repository of all this information where staff members who are invited, which is almost everybody in the organization, can actually go in there and search using a search function, or just navigate to different folders to find materials for all of our different grant applications that we've submitted. And I populated it to the last about five years or so, since 2020. So, that includes things like communications records, copies of the applications themselves, feedback from funding agencies, because frequently they will return feedback to us, and an at-a-glance tracking spreadsheet that compares all of our grant-seeking efforts for those past five years. And I will show you that on a future slide. And then another important facet of grant-seeking is the ability to actively pursue funds, which can be difficult when a lot of these big agencies, whether that's state or federal, the ones that are giving you the highest dollar amount in opportunities for grant funding, usually the windows for that application is not longer than about 60 days. It's very rare to find an application window of 90 days or greater. So, it's important that we are mobile as staff, that we have the ability to, as soon as we learn about an opportunity for funding, we have the ability to pursue it. So, the grant-seeking policy when I arrived here at the city hadn't been touched in about nine years and was prohibitively restrictive in a couple of ways, which you might recall when I presented on that in April. And in April, you approved some updates to this policy, which I am happy to review those again for you today in detail if you'd like. But ultimately, the bottom line is that the updated policy has conferred that sort of necessary freedom on city staff to pursue that grant funding. So, this is a screenshot of that tracking spreadsheet I mentioned in the GAD. And I apologize for cutting it off. It actually extends in all four directions. Excuse me, Camille. I'm thinking we were going to have the presentation in front of us as well. We'll still have Commissioner Dugard up there. But, okay, good. Good. And, yeah, this shall be done. Okay, there we go. Thank you, Camille. No problem. Okay, so I cut this off in the hopes that it would still be readable on these screens. That's good. But it does extend in all four directions, just so that you're aware. But you can actually, I'm actually not sure if I've invited you to the GAD team, which I'll rectify if you want. But ultimately, so this is our tracking spreadsheet. So, this is where a staff can go at a glance to figure out kind of the basic information on any of our grant applications that we've submitted. So, staff can add project rows to this sheet. So, on the bottom of the sheet is our kind of newer applications. That's why they're not colored yet, because we don't have information on those yet. Those are out for review. And if you scroll up on the sheet, you'd see lines for grant applications dating back again to about 2020. Documentation, when you actually delve into the folders of the GAD, documentation is sorted first by success or failure, then by the responsible city department, and then by project year and title. So, why this is important to do is maybe you are trying to ascertain whether or not we've obtained funding for a particular type of project in the past. Maybe it's a water main. We want to get more funding for a water main upgrade. Have we ever funded that before? Before I go into trying to sort through all this documentation in these folders, let me just open the spreadsheet. And I can scroll through or control F and at a glance find whether or not we were successful in that inquiry in years past. And if I see that we were, that we submitted an application for a project of that type, whether or not it was successful, I can go, okay, now I see the basic information. I see the title, the year, the responsible department. I can then very easily navigate into the folders in the database and find those previous application materials, which will then help you not have to reinvent the wheel necessarily when you are applying for future funding. So, speaking of previous funding. You know, is it better for us just to wait till the end to ask questions or as we go? Oh, however you would like. Okay. Do you have any thoughts on that? I don't want to get cumbersome, but I guess if anybody has a question as we go, just, yeah. Do you have one, Commissioner? Do you want to go backwards the slide? When it says funded and the word fully, does that mean that's the amount that the city would receive? Yes, sir. So that, when it says fully, it means that we received 100 percent of what we asked for. There's also a categorization for only partial funding, but that's just not visible here on the screen. Okay. I'll have questions later on. That's all you did. Thank you, Mayor. Absolutely. So, go ahead. Yeah, related to that. So, so means, so if you take a look at that fully means that we've actually received funding for that grant. Is that correct? Yes. Okay. All right. Yeah. That's. And I assume the date field is hidden? Yeah. So it's, it's, it's, it's out on the sides, unfortunately. It just got a little bit, a little bit too tiny, I thought. So, these are just some examples of previous grant funding that we have obtained. This is, this list is by no means comprehensive, but rather it just shows off the most weighty or most impactful grants city staff were able to obtain in recent years. So hopefully my position then will facilitate pursuing and securing more, more grant awards like these in the future. And just to point out a couple, which are my personal favorites, our Florida Communities Trust, which acquired the Gladys Ellis Preserve. I, I adore that preserve. I think it's super important on a lot of different levels. Our Resilient Florida Planning Grant, that was huge for our vulnerability assessment planning. So these are some, some just really impactful grant awards that the city has received. Well, you might've gone too far. Number, sorry about that. My mic wasn't on. We've, we have a number, number of other agency grant submittals that we have supported, including Pinellas County grant applications in regards to their safe streets planning. They, we've supported their HMGP request for making some signal boxes more resilient by raising them. Um, and of course the Denny and Causeway Bridge, the PSTA application, um, was that the next slide, just out of curiosity. I, I, I somehow, I, yeah. Oh, we're missing the slide. I somehow am. We have it on here. Okay. I got you. So we'll just follow it on the right back. That's okay. Um, uh, the, um, PSTA, uh, for the, uh, reconstruction of the Clearwater Ferry Dock. Uh, we've provided a letter for the National Science Foundation, uh, grant for a scientist looking to digitally map our city for disaster resiliency. And then of course, uh, we have other requests that are out there, um, in regards to state appropriation requests, um, through our Pinellas County delegation. Um, our current requests, although we have really no update as to where they stand, given our legislative session this year, um, was initially for $5 million for marina restoration and 850,000 for stormwater system recovery, i.e. gabion repair replacement. Um, so hopefully, hopefully session will at some time come to an end and we'll have some, some budget that will, um, that will include some support of those two projects. And I will pass it to Camille on what she's done as far as current, current and active applications. Thank you. Um, yeah. So just here on this slide, I've got a little collection of some of our efforts thus far this year. Um, so since the start of the new streamlined grant program, um, we've actually been able to submit several completed applications and several notices of interest, um, which unfortunately couldn't fit on the slide. Um, but I know that you're all familiar with the, um, hazard mitigation grant program, the HMGP. Um, so Pinellas County did actually get, um, an outlet room is slated to get an allocation, um, of HMGP funding for hurricanes Helene and Milton. Um, the city of Dunedin has actually, um, submitted five projects as notices of interest for that funding. Um, so that was through our Pinellas County, uh, LMS work group, which is the local mitigation strategy work group. Uh, I've been working with that group since March in order to facilitate our applications for under those, uh, two disaster recovery programs. Um, right now our, our HMGP, Helene and Milton submissions include, uh, wastewater treatment plant building hardening, water treatment plant building hardening, and the lift station eight rehabilitation project, um, gabion repair and replacement along Cedar Creek, along the, the region of Idlewild Drive. Um, and the reconstruction of our day docks, our emergency docks and the fishing pier at the Dunedin Marina. Um, we submitted those notices of intent to apply on the 16th, on May 16th. Um, and the next steps for that is that the LMS group will actually review and prioritize all submitted municipal projects in the county, um, before authorizing certain of those projects to move forward with applications for funding. So we have not submitted those applications yet. We are waiting on approval from the county group. At that time we will submit those applications, which are then due at the end of July of this year. You're fine. So clearly I apologize. This is completely, I apologize. I'm trying to follow you. I, I, uh, the, the, the presentation that is uploaded to Granicus is the correct presentation. Um, I, I grabbed obviously an older version that is missing our notable results slide. Um, so if you want to go ahead and I will, I just, uh, I wanted to mention our, our perhaps biggest result this year, which is, um, certainly a collaborative effort. Uh, I only was a, a small piece in the team that secured these funds for you, but, um, this year we actually were awarded an EWP grant. That's the emergency watershed protection program grant. Um, that was in the amount of 4.6 million for drainage ditch clearing and drainage area stabilization. Um, and that money did not come with a matching requirement at all. Um, so that was an immense award. Um, and that was a team of a very large team of staff mostly from engineering and public works, um, who worked together to, um, submit that application. Um, it's a USDA grant. Um, that application included drone flight video footage, uh, hundreds and hundreds of pictures, um, an immense amount of GIS data, um, from all the different properties, uh, that we had to analyze and then kind of codify and organize, uh, for the, if the ease of reading of the application. Um, and, and that we actually were selected for award in April of this year. Um, unfortunately, the EWP, the EWP program, um, has paused grant funding, uh, distribution due to current guidance from the federal administration. And there's, there's currently no word on when that funding may resume. Um, but again, that application was a huge collaborative effort, um, among staff from all different departments and its success should be celebrated loudly. So as you're looking here at the screen, um, this is a grant procurement tracking form that we created. Um, this primarily was to help to provide information through the city manager to the commission on what we've applied for. Again, this screenshot does not show the entire form, but there are attachments, um, in your staffing that do show some of the, uh, completed forms, um, for those applications that Camille had mentioned that she, that she has processed and, and has applied to. So as we get more information on whether we get them or not, there's a bottom portion of the form that we'll complete where we're at with the funding, whether it's been approved. Um, and then this is something that we can use where as we apply for these, if they fall within that grant policy, where we can just go ahead and, and handle the application. Um, we can then attach this to a city manager's, uh, report during a commission meeting, and then she can share with you all this is, you know, here's, here's another one that we've applied for. So just to kind of keep you all up to date, um, they are all out there. I think you've got five attached to the staffing as far as those things that are currently active and open. So we're waiting to hear back from, from those, uh, for those applications. Oh, sorry, went too far. Um, and then finally, we just have a, a brief summary of kind of the, the big key points that we're looking to hit this year, looking forward and, uh, and over the next few years for some of these programs. Um, so the, the biggest one on this screen is your community development block grant, um, your CDBGDR down there at the bottom. Um, that is being managed by Pinellas County. We have identified, uh, city staff have identified one potential, uh, project that we have in the city that could be eligible for this funding. Um, infrastructure projects, I will say, as far as the CDBGDR goes, infrastructure projects are secondary and will only be funded after unmet housing needs in Pinellas County have been, uh, have been funded and have been addressed. So we actually have a while, uh, to wait before we can even apply to this program. Um, we anticipate being able to apply in, in about a year and a half, maybe two years. Um, and the life cycle of that grant is six years total. So, um, at that point we will have a few years to complete our project if we're selected for funding, but that's a, that's kind of a longer look in the future. Um, other grant programs and future opportunities are being tracked, um, from our department of environmental protection, uh, for water quality, um, and our vulnerability assessment implementation opportunities. Um, and ultimately, we on the strategy and sustainability team, uh, will continue to work with all city departments to identify, um, funding gaps and to match, uh, current or anticipated projects with funding opportunities moving forward. Um, because really keeping these open conversations and this open communication between all of our, our working departments, um, is the thing that fosters the sort of collaboration that we already know succeeds as evidenced by this, this huge EWP grant award that we got earlier this year. Um, so with that, uh, happy to answer any questions, concerns that you may have. Um, thank you so much for your time this morning. Okay. Uh, questions. Let's start, uh, over with, uh, Commissioner Walker. Thank you, Mayor. So, I mean, uh, it's one of the questions I have is, and I noticed that, um, we've got a couple of, uh, applications specifically to support the freebie looper. Are they, um, are they being, are they an active participant in this process for information, data, content for the proposal? Uh, yes, most of that data has come, um, actually from our, from our own city staff because we do collect data on ridership and things like that. Um, but yes, freebie has been an active participant in that. Okay. Good. Yeah. That's actually the ridership was exactly what I was going for. Um, and, um, you know, in terms of how we track, uh, these grants from inception to actual issuance, um, how, how does that work? Do, do we use our lobbyist? Um, because you know how it, you know, coming up with an idea for a specific grant, that's great. Okay. And then you have to pair the grant up with, or the request for grant, pair it up with a funding source. And, uh, I'm just kind of curious if we have any sort of insight to that and how that gets tracked. Yeah. So that was really one of the primary reasons why the first thing that we did was go around to each department, you know, together. I had given her the, you know, the, the, the Bible of all things to get, um, caught up on before these meetings, which included our capital improvement plan, our business plan and our budget. Um, so we go, you know, we went and we sat with each department. We looked at those projects that they have coming up in the, in future years. What are they, what do they already have budgeted? What do they have coming up? What are there some of those biggest priority needs that way? Camille, when she goes and accesses, um, a grant, we have a access to a grant database that can do search functions where you can put in keywords and you can break it down by private, by, by public, by all sorts of different ways to, to find a grant to match kind of what our needs already are. So that's one kind of tool that she has, that she's, that she uses. Um, and through that, that's where we found like the, the TD, the TD bank and the T-Mobile and the Dreyfus Foundation grants, those private grant opportunities, um, in addition, obviously, to the others. So we, you know, in talking with the departments, we want to make sure that the project does have some funding to support that match request. Um, what we don't want to do is submit a grant, say we have a match and we don't actually have a match and then have to then say, you know, we can't take your grant. So that's the last thing we want to do. Uh, but then, you know, identifying those organizations that we can submit that match what we have coming up, obviously some things, you know, shifted after the storms where we're really trying to, um, cover some of those, um, uh, you know, mitigation kind of projects, which is great that we've got this potential HMGP funding, you know, coming through the county. Um, hopefully we'll see some success with that. Um, again, we feel like there are a few things that are up in the air. I think our lobbyist potentially comes into play. Um, if we, you know, once we've submitted that grant application, um, if there's anything that, you know, we can have her help us with as far as talking with the agency heads, I've actually mentioned to Camille last week, you know, let's go ahead and set up meetings with some of those big agencies. We know we're going to be requesting DEP, um, FDEM, all of those sorts of folks that are kind of like our, our regular go-tos, um, so that we kind of have that relationship already set up. Yeah, that's, yeah, that's great. Um, and then basically does this database, does it provide a historical look? Can you look back at what's, what's, what's been a grant in the past going forward? Yes. So we only went back so far, uh, thus far to collect this. And some of it was a lot of digging, um, in Granicus, in searching, uh, for, for records and reaching out to departments and kind of gathering all of that information. So we've gone back about five years, um, to kind of put in those, you know, key grants and try to start to really create a database that's really useful as we move forward. Yeah. Basically to shape our opportunities. Right. Yeah. Okay. Um, and then all of this, we feed to our, our, our lobbyist group. Um, I, at the, at this point we're handling the grant applications, um, you know, internally. Um, Camille has submitted the, the several that we reviewed here. Again, I think, you know, we did really use our lobbyists. I know we met with, you know, when we were in Tallahassee, we met with the DEP grant, um, secretary. Uh, I think that's something that we can, you know, when we get to that point, we can then say, you know, let her know what we've applied for and see if there's anything that, you know, she can do on our behalf. Um, but she, uh, also assisted us with the, um, uh, historic preservation grant for the golf club. When we got on, there's an issue with the reporting and she did a great job. Great. Yeah. So if we ever kind of have some, some cogs that need to be greased, so to speak, you know, I think that she can, she'll be helpful in that regard. Yeah. Well, that's fantastic. I, yeah, this great presentation. Um, I, um, you know, this is a holistic approach and, uh, I'll just save the rest for comments and it's really more to impart, um, you know, things that I've seen work and not work, but anyway, thank you so much. Thank you. Okay. Uh, Commissioner Dugard questions. Uh, thank you, Mayor. Um, yes. Uh, first of all, very impressed with the, uh, running start, uh, we have now on grant applications. Do we know who in this business is best of breed from municipality standpoints and can we steal, rob, uh, whatever their secrets are? I'm, I'm sorry. Can, I, I couldn't understand the question. So let me help. He said, who's best of breed as far as municipalities go, as far as grant applications go, are there any best practices we could use? Oh, I, I absolutely, I mean, I, I know, you know, Camille actually just attended a training last week, um, through our, you know, the, there's, there's grant associations that are national and then local that, that meet and get together. Um, you know, the, the, the best news is that, you know, as a municipality, everybody operates under the same sunshine. So we're able to look at, I mean, and I, and you know, I've done it in the past as well for our appropriations requests. I'm looking, we look at what other people have, um, submitted, what's been successful, how they've written it, um, what they've, what they're asking for, um, to kind of make sure that, you know, we're right in line with those other, other applications or requests that have been successful. And if I may, I'll just jump into, to say that what that really boils down to, Commissioner, I think is, the answer to your question is, uh, what best practices are best in the breed consistently, it's organization, communication, and record keeping. Those are three very simple concepts, but they are truly the most important things, which is why building this internal database where we keep all of our records, they are clearly organized, they are easy to sort through, easy to find. That all, um, facilitates securing future funding, because it makes the whole process a lot easier, um, and easier for anyone to understand, which I think should be something that we all strive for in government. Thank you. Um, on another point, I couldn't help but notice that we have, uh, one grant that was successful in moving forward, but has now been, uh, suspended, or, um, it's not going forward because of distribution issues at the federal level. So, um, what are we seeing relative to the environment on, uh, grant making, grant development on the federal level, and how's that going to affect us? Well, that's a loaded question. You got this, Nicole. Um, obviously, you know, we, again, we've had these, you know, we've had these conversations. We actually just talked about this last week again. Um, you know, uh, yes, I think there are concerns. There are concerns all across. We were with a lot of our colleagues last week at FCCMA. I was talking with folks from the county, you know, other municipalities that are, you know, are, are concerned about the same thing. Um, until we, you know, until the plug is pulled, so to speak, um, we are gonna, our plan is to continue to apply for those that remain open. Um, the, you know, the other piece is that, you know, we are looking at, you know, we'll look at more private, you know, foundations and, and private grant requests as well. While their dollar amounts are smaller, um, typically, um, that's still something that we're going to try to go after. Um, obviously, we, we hope that, um, you know, in the future that funding will be restored and it will be released. We don't really know where we stand specifically with that grant, whether they're gonna change their mind or, uh, so we're kind of, we're, you know, we're waiting to, for the official art, you know, is it coming? Is it not coming? Um, but I, I, our tactic hasn't changed as far as we're going to continue to apply for what's open and available, um, whether it's state or federal. All right. That's. Thank you. That's all the questions I have. Great. Okay. Uh, Vice Mayor. Thank you, Mayor. And I'm gonna piggyback a little bit on Commissioner DeGuard. Uh, in, in regards to what we're seeing at the federal level, um, and not necessarily grants, but we'll talk FEMA and the concept of FEMA is gonna be reduced or going away. And we've heard, uh, verbiage at the state level because the idea is everything should be handled by the state. And, and the state has said, I, that we are in a position to kind of take that on or we will get there. Do you see that as, as this relates to grants and the hazard grant mitigation program that is now in a holding pattern? If, if, if the federal government is shrinking on their grants and what might be available, do you see anything loosening up at the state level? Um, so to that, I'll say that right now, because everything is in such limbo, um, there, there hasn't really been any particularly like strong movement, um, at state or federal level apart from just to everyone hold your horses for the moment. Um, with regards to the HMGP program, that hazard mitigation grant program, um, that Pinellas County anticipates getting about $400 million for, combined for Helene and Milton disaster recovery efforts. Um, up until recently, our estimate was about $416 million. That is now down to about $396 million because of the changes at FEMA. Um, again, that program ultimately gets administered through the state to the county level at, in our county work groups. Um, so the state is, uh, still committed to administering that program, but whether or not that, um, the changes at the federal level might, uh, loosen up some funding or increase some funding at the state, we just haven't, it's too soon to tell ultimately. Okay. And that makes sense. That makes sense. Um, other than this, what is the process of your grant funding? Do you sit and scroll through Google every night and, and things just go, Oh, this would be great. This is for, this is for the city or, or what, what's your relationship between you and the grant funding and Nicole and administration and our budget and capital projects that we're doing? Is that kind of hand in hand? Or do you come to us with an idea that we try and work into the budget, or you look at our budget and try and find funding for what's already in the budget? What's that process like? Yes, sir. Um, that's a great question. So I am, uh, my, my expertise is in persuasive pros. I am not an expert in engineering or public works or utilities or any of those programs and departments that are essential to running a city. Um, so what I do is I look in the budget for projects that, um, we have already decided to fund that are already deemed necessary, deemed for the good of the city. Um, and I work with our staff and other departments, um, to prioritize the list of projects that we want to seek funding for, because it would be great if we could fund everything with a grant, but we simply just cannot. Um, so I work with our staff to make sure that I have a very clear picture of what is most important, um, and, and when. So I look for, for projects in the budget. I take consideration of my fellow staff members and then I go to my databases, um, and I look for grant funding opportunities that apply. So I, I don't typically come up with, ooh, here's, here's a grant. Is there a project we could apply it to? It's usually the other way around, although that, that has happened a couple of times just because I've been, been finding things. And, and I will say, I mean, the, the connection, um, I think it's a, it's a great position that she's in, you know, that, that we have her in the city manager's office. Um, we're connected to a lot of projects, you know, Natalie and I, um, even being, you know, I, we even talked to on the vulnerability assessment side, you know, having her attend some of those meetings, Camille attend some of those meetings, just so she knows kind of what's going to come up from those, you know, the adaption plan and what are those kind of future projects we're starting to talk about from that plan so that she can then say, okay, I know we're going to be looking at, you know, these, you know, 15 projects from that plan sometime here in the future, you know, she has that now in her head when she's going through her database or when you're getting your newsletters. And I will say, you know, working closely with the departments, um, we, we are working with every department all the time. Um, so there might be stuff that comes from them and we always say, you know, you're, you, you know, you're the public works director, you get the public works newsletter every, you know, every day. I think Camille signed up for every newsletter that comes to everybody, but you know, a lot, some of that opportunity comes through notification through them. So we'll get, we get a lot of forwarded emails from staff. Hey, take a look at this one. Um, so it's, it's really that, uh, that really that collaboration, you know, with staff and understanding what is already in our, in our business plan, in our, in our budget and our capital improvement plan. Okay. And does your decision on what grants to apply for have any effect on previous grants that we've applied for and we're still waiting on? And an example would be this hazard grant, right? We're in that, we're in that holding pattern at the, for the, for the federal money. Are we looking for more money in case that doesn't come through or do we kind of go, okay, this is where we are. Let's see what happens first. Uh, so to answer that, um, no, right now this, um, kind of freeze on federal funding has no effect on, on whether or not I'm looking to apply for certain grants. Um, so one great example actually from that slide. Um, I don't know if we can go back to it. Um, but the water treatment plant building hardening project is something that we have applied for under two different programs. Um, one of them is the HLMP. That's the hurricane loss mitigation program. The other one is this HMGP. Um, I doubt we'll get both. It would be cool. Um, but ultimately the, the limit of funding right now or, or the, the potential for limited funding from the Fed, um, has no effect on, on, uh, current or previous grant applications and, and whether, what kinds of grants I'm pursuing in the future. We are just honestly trying to apply for as many as is, uh, prudent, as many as are applicable and could help us. Okay. And how does it work when grants in general, a lot of them are partially funded? Well, fund 50%, you put in 50%. And is there in, but okay, you're still looking for grants for that project. How do two or three different grants play into the whole percentage of what gets done? And is there a way to get it fully funded through grants even though all of them, all of them are only partially funding? I was gonna say, I, it's not typical that we're gonna be able to use another grant as the match for a second grant. Um, not to say that it doesn't ever happen. It could, and it, and we've, we've heard in some cases that you can use certain, certain dollars, um, for, for a mat, towards a match. Um, obviously we have not gotten to the point yet where we have to have that discussion. If we'd apply for, you know, $500,000 in, you know, for a grant and they're saying, come back and say, well, we can only give you 250. I think that's when we call our team together and we say, okay, well, here, what is this, you know, are we gonna, can we still accomplish this project? Um, in a lot of cases, what's, what's budgeted in, in, in our future years for a lot of projects is a fully budgeted project. So whatever we can get from the grant basically reduces that bottom line. So in theory, we should still be covered, so to speak, but I, if you want to add any. The only thing I'll add is, um, just in a general sense, what a grant is, is a contract. Um, it's a legally binding document and it has terms, it has conditions. There are certain deliverables, which is things that we have to do or they have to do in order to fulfill that contract. So there are some grants that allow you to use grant funding as part of a project or to match another grant or when another grant is in the picture. There are some that do not. So it's truly on a case-by-case basis as to whether or not a hypothetical single project could be funded by many, many grants. Thank you. That's all I have, Mayor. Commissioner Sandberg. Before this started, we were talking about, um, high school graduations and, you know, the other night they talked about the amount of scholarship money that was available, but there's also some, there were some students that haven't chosen military, haven't chosen a career. Is there ever grant money available to bring young people into the city, maybe groom them to have a career within the city? Yes, actually, there is. Um, uh, through both, uh, through, at least through the, the professional organizations that I belong to, I know Jennifer belongs to the same FCCMA and ICMA, the Florida city county management association and international city management management managers association. I just, if Jorge were in the room, he would say for the, for the benefit of those watching, um, they, they do have programs, um, for internships. So, um, I know FCCMA, it's, you know, a $10,000 grant award to bring it in turn, you know, a paid intern on board and then be able to host that intern. So there are different, you know, ways to, you know, to kind of reach and kind of fund an intern to, to bring them on and then hopefully, you know, get them involved. I know, you know, from, from my, from, from a personal standpoint, I'm involved in the MPA program at USF. I'm an MPA mentor. I, you know, spend time going and talking to, uh, both undergraduate and graduate students on the program and obviously city government. And obviously that's mostly why they're, um, you know, why they're in the MPA program is usually from a nonprofit or a government aspect. That's what they want their career. So, um, yeah, we'll have, you know, have we ever, have we ever tried to, to try to use that? Um, well, no, but we do have an, we do have an intern that actually just started in the city commissioner slash city manager's office today. All right. I mean, I, I'm just thinking that, you know, as our staff continues to age or look for, you know, change careers, it'd be nice to have, you know, there's a lot of fine young people that, you know, we're not committed to next year. And I, you know, it's a nice place to work. We just talked about our employees, just something that had on my mind. I definitely just, the commissioner, I do have that on my radar as far as ICMA fellowship. Okay. Uh, I think it will be great. Of course, city has to commit to 20, you know, $20,000 to pay the intern, but, um, most of them stay with that organization from what I've seen. So, okay. And lastly, either one of you, could you clarify, uh, the TD, the T-Mobile and the District seven for the freebie, maybe so I can explain exactly what we're doing there? Yes, absolutely. Um, so those three applications, um, were for grants to fund our freebie loop, but to help fund our freebie loop, um, which of course for anyone watching at home is that, uh, lovely free service that we have in downtown Dunedin and in a, in a larger great geographical area. Um, so the TD Charitable Foundation, um, that is a grant that doesn't technically have a cap on what you can ask for, for funding. Um, that one I, we requested, um, the full amount to fund our freebie loop for a single year. Fingers crossed we get that. That would be lovely. Um, because if we were selected for that award, um, the, the next, uh, of a very large grant that, again, hopefully we would get selected for is that F dot district seven discretionary funding. Um, so that's a program from the state actually, um, that will pay up to half of the operating cost for, um, developing transportation systems, um, in, in different municipalities. So for example, in, in Miami, um, freebie was awarded, uh, this discretionary funding from, from that district of F dot. Um, and it pays for half the cost for up to three years of developing, running, or expanding such a program. Um, in Miami freebie uses Teslas. Um, here in Dunedin, we, we don't use Teslas. We have a slightly smaller vehicle option. Um, but ultimately what we requested was, uh, that full half the funding amount for a period of three years. The thing about that district seven funding is that it doesn't actually kick in very quickly. It's a very long process to get reviewed and approved for that kind of funding. So ideally in a perfect world, the TD charitable foundation kicks in. We fund our freebie loop a hundred percent over next fiscal year. And at that point we are awarded the F dot district seven discretionary funding, which will then fund three additional years at half the cost. Um, that would be a huge, huge savings to the city. And in, in my personal opinion, a great thing to do. Um, that T-Mobile hometown grant, that's a significantly smaller grant. That's a limit of $50,000. Um, there's also no match required for that. Um, so that's just $50,000 that T-Mobile likes to give out for, um, hometown kind of, um, community development projects. Um, we actually did hear back on that one recently. Unfortunately, we were not selected for funding under that grant, but that is a grant that's open, I believe, quarterly. So we can reapply or apply with different projects and we intend to do so. I just thought it was ironic that $219,000 number, if I recall, that's the most likely the annual contract amount, I think. Am I close? It's close. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So the, I mean, the, the, the reason we did the, we did both was one would cover this, this year while we're waiting for the decision on the next one, which would then come, you know, come for future years. So there's not, that that's not overlapping funding from, for one year, but it's kind of covering, covering one and then looking to the future. Good. Just one last thing. Clay and Jen, can I talk to you guys after the meeting? I just received something that I need to talk to you about. There you go. All right. Wow. You guys are in trouble. Um, so, uh, following up on the freebie one though, so when do we expect to know about the TD Charitable Foundation? Soon. Um, they had originally said that they were going to, uh, get back to applicants by the end of May. That has not happened yet. Um, hopefully they will get back to us this month with, uh, news on whether we've been selected or not. Okay. Um, and this is one of the areas they actually do? Just transportation stuff? Yes. Yes. Awesome. So that, that grant in particular, fingers crossed, I have a strong feeling about it because, um, they, one of their areas of focus is carbon emissions and reducing or eliminating those. And because our freebie loop is a hundred percent, um, no carbon emission, uh, that aligns very well with the purposes of that grant. Okay. And then, and then with the FDOT, uh, District 7, we just don't know about that? Or is that, when would that be expected? Yes, ma'am. So typically awards, um, for that funding are notified in October or November. Um, so we won't know the result of that application until significantly later this year. And there would be, it would, uh, the award would not come until next spring, which means that we, we probably couldn't use that funding until at the earliest fiscal year 27. So that, ideally, that would cover 27, 28, 29. Do you have any reason to think we won't get that? No. But I'm an optimistic sort of person. Yeah. Well, I only say it. I'll say this. It's not, you weren't even here yet, but, you know, it, it is a little bit on my last nerve that when we talked about freebie, I think, you know, there was a, the, the sense was given that it was almost feta complete and sooner. Now you weren't here. And, uh, and then when started to ask questions about it, it was like, oh yeah, no, no, no. And so, um, yeah. And again, you know, we're spending a lot of money on a general fund. I voted to continue with the freebie. Um, I hope the freebie can work here. Um, but, you know, part of that too was the ability to get grants for this. So, um, so anyway, I'm just making that known, uh, and hope, but hopefully it all slide into home plate. So, um, so I was going to make a comment about the best in breed. I use best practices. Best in breed is Maltese's golden retrievers, you know, so that was like, okay, best in breed. Sorry, Tom. Um, anyway, um, there is a, I just, I guess I want to, don't want to lose sight of this, um, because there was a little bit of confusion about it. There's, uh, there's money that was given by Duke for pavilions at Gladys Douglas Preserve. And as we're doing part two of Gladys Douglas Preserve, uh, I just make, I think we, I just want to make sure, because I know when it originally came in, there was a tracking issue of how it came in. So I want to make sure that that was figured out and they are on the list, because I want to say it was like $75,000 for, and maybe even more than that, uh, for two pavilions out there. So, um, let's see. Um, so Thursday night, we're going to be voting on water sewer reclaimed rate increases. Um, can you talk specifically about, um, the effect on grants we've either gotten or could get that might at least, uh, take some relief off our rates in the long term or, um, that we got that question at the first reading and we might get that question tomorrow, but I think it's important to say as we're talking about grants for you, if you can respond to that. Absolutely. Um, so ultimately, uh, a rate increase is, is not necessarily up to me, but, um, a lot of the grant opportunities that we have been applying for as a city are for infrastructure that directly touches our water and wastewater treatment plants. Um, we recognize that those are critical pieces of infrastructure and their maintenance and how efficiently they function has a direct impact on citizens quality of life here in Dunedin. Um, so again, we unfortunately, we haven't heard back from any of these applications yet. They're still in review. Um, but if we are selected for award, we stand to, um, upgrade our facilities that, that are part of that water system. Um, so whether or not that has an impact on the rates that, that residents will pay, I can't really speak to that, but we are looking to upgrade that infrastructure. Okay. Um, great. And then, um, as far as the, uh, 4.6 million that's on hold from the federal government, that's mainly for Gabion ditches? Yes. So it's, um, it's for the clearing of a lot of herc of debris, like tree debris, other things that were kind of washed into our drainage areas and then remained there and then creates a blockage. Um, so it's to take those out and then to stabilize because there was also a fair amount of erosion. It's all, you know, kind of sugar sand on it. It, uh, yeah. So the, that money is to rebuild, um, stabilize those areas, um, and to clear out, um, some of the, the blockages that were made. And then that, that area helps our stormwater system. Correct. Yes. To, you know, which of course, we've, we've got rate, you know, issues with that as well. Right. So again, those things all kind of help if we can get them. Uh, unfortunately, it's exciting to get it. Unfortunately, sad that it's been paused, um, since it's actually a key, uh, infrastructure area. Um, so Jennifer, I think this question is more for you. Um, on the FEMA, you know, all the ups and down talks about FEMA at the federal level. Um, do we have any reason to think that we're not going to get the reimbursements that we're counting on, um, for Helene and Milton? No, we haven't been notified directly, um, that, that there's a pause on those disbursements. Um, I'm watching the news just like everybody else in terms of, you know, what, what, what, you know, the conversation out there, but we haven't been directly notified. We've, we've submitted what we need to submit. Um, it's been, you know, checked and double checked and, and we're waiting to hear back. We did get actually a, an initial, I believe it was $2.5 million, uh, from FEMA. Uh, and that was within 30 days of the storms. And that's to help us with that, that cash flow. So there was an original disbursement and, and I, I don't exactly remember how much it was, but they, we did get some funding from FEMA to begin with. So. Or initial cleanup kind of stuff. Yeah. Front. I, I did too. There you go. It was like 10% of what you needed, but it helped you get started. So that's great. Um, I think that's my only questions. Um, so let me open it up for public input. Uh, anyone in the audience wish to come forward and provide input on this item. Okay. Seeing no one, Clay, you're not rushing up or anything. Okay. Jocelyn. No. Okay. Okay. Uh, seeing no one, close public input. Uh, and I will go to commission comments and I will start with vice mayor. Thank you, mayor. Uh, great presentation. Thank you. Um, this employee surveys, I think it's all just good information and it's something that we should do periodically. I don't know how often annually probably is good enough, but, uh, just thank you. And thank you for the hard work. Nicole, appreciate it. And thank you, Nicole, as always. Commissioner Sandberg. Nothing to add. Just keep up the good work. Both of you. Thank you. Uh, commissioner Walker. Thank you, mayor. Um, you know, as I alluded to in my, my questions, uh, this is, this is a holistic approach. It's push and pull. And, uh, I would say that, uh, you know, I, I think this is off to a awesome start. I really do. I'm, I'm really, really very thrilled with the fact that we've now got a forward look on this. Um, and, uh, you know, just, just kind of a few things. And this, this is where the advocacy piece really comes into play, my, my opinion. And not only, not only the state, but the federal level as well. And I do have some ideas on that. I can talk to you all about offline. But, um, the, uh, you know, it, it's about identifying the opportunity. It's about qualifying the opportunity. And then it's all about shaping the opportunity. You know, because when you first go to that database and you see, um, you know, a grant opportunity for us, it's always been my opinion that, you know, regardless of what the requirements of that grant are, more than likely you can shape the requirements to be more favorable to us. And, uh, you know, I think so. And it, that's, that's, it's a, it's, it's kind of a robust process. I mean, and obviously we're only a few people here that with limited number of hours in the day, but, uh, you know, I would say, and I'll, I'll use an example. Like for instance, PSTA used their, their federal lobbyist to, um, go to, uh, Congresswoman Luna's staff and have them advocate for, uh, appropriation specifically for the docs. And, you know, me, that's this, this way that, the way that it gets done at the federal level. So I would also say, and I, and we're not, you know, we're, we're, we're a small municipality relatively speaking, and I'm not advocating for a federal presence, but, you know, organizations like PSTA and those sorts of things, um, could be very, you know, instrumental in that. And then this really kind of goes out to my colleagues and I'm, I'm only talking about opportunities that serve the great city of Dunedin. But for my colleagues, you know, I think we've all got a, uh, you know, with all the organizations and liaison positions that we have, you know, let's, let's, let's lever our, leverage our collective resources and, you know, move forward on things that are beneficial to Dunedin. And so anyway, um, I am, I am, I am encouraged, uh, with regards to, um, the opportunities to fund freebie. And just, just for the record, I, I like freebie. I just don't like the fact it's coming out of the general fund. And, uh, so anything we can do to mitigate that is good. Uh, anyway, those, those, what I've got. Thank you. Uh, Commissioner Dugard. Thank you, Mayor. Um, I'm excited by these opportunities as well. Um, there are a number of challenges we're facing in this community, not just within the city, uh, and the opportunities to fund city functions. But I also realize that we've got a number of, uh, nonprofits and nonprofit affiliates that we, um, support and they bring capital to our community as well. And I would imagine that Camille will, uh, forward any application opportunities to those organizations, uh, if she runs across them, uh, it's not to, uh, distract from her work of bringing capital into our budget, but it is something that I think could bring capital into the community. If, uh, we see opportunities for some of the agencies we support to apply for grants. Um, so that strikes me as an opportunity. Also, the more our network grows, uh, with our affiliates, the better we are at being aware of certain things out in the community. Um, but I think that it's going to be incumbent upon us with what we know is going on inside the world of, um, federal and state funding to, um, become much more resourceful and seeking resources. And this strikes me as being right in that sweet spot. Thank you, Mayor. Thank you. Um, so, um, great job, Nicole, Camille. I heard the right person. I can feel it. You go, girl. Um, I, and, and the whole, uh, aspect of the data layout. They had a session at the Tampa Bay Regional Planning Council Sustainability Conference that would completely put you to sleep. It wasn't what I thought it was, but it was all about what you're talking about because, because everybody knows you get that good system in place, pulls your information together, keeps you up on, you know, organizationally what's going on, all the available grants. I mean, that's such a key. So, so by, um, you know, focusing that, I think, you know, you're right on. Um, uh, one project, I talked to the city manager about it yesterday. Um, there, if you guys remember the turnaround, the turnaround at, uh, Honeyman Island to try to keep the traffic flow going. Um, and so, um, just recently it got taken out of the transportation plan for, um, FDOT, at least trying to get money from FDOT, um, because it's not considered transportation. It has to move over to, um, FDP, am I saying? Anyway, because it's a park. So, um, so I was talking to the head of Ford Pinellas Witt yesterday and he suggested if we're really going to get something going, uh, maybe we do a, um, a design of it. And I talked to city manager about it. He's going to talk to his people. Hopefully they can do a design, but we're going to need some engineering. They're going to need some engineering help. And, uh, city manager said that sounded reasonable. Um, but all with the goal of then, um, between hitting the, the department, um, that would fund it and potentially even, you know, talking to our representatives about it, senators and representatives. So, you know, so we can still keep that on track since it's not really a transportation expenditure, even though it has everything to do with transportation. So, I mean, that's just, I just wanted to kind of throw that out as something I think we need to really try to still make happen. Um, and, and that I think goes back to what you said, you know, that you just got to work, work the system the way the system works, right? And just try to bring all our contacts into that and how we can make it happen. So I don't disagree with that, but, um, I think this is great. I think, you know, we know we're going to have some budget challenges this year. I think, uh, so all this coordination and organization around the grants, even though, unfortunately at the federal level, uh, uh, we'll see what happens if that money gets turned back on. Um, but, um, no matter what, we, we've got to just, you know, look for money wherever we can find it to help our citizens and our rate structures and do the right things and make the right decisions. So this is all, you know, very, very important stuff. So, um, so thank you. Um, any other comment for that? Okay. All right. So, uh, thank you. And, uh, now we just, uh, informational items and all we have now before we close the meeting is any commission comments. And so I'm going to turn to vice mayor. Any, anything? No comments, mayor. Uh, commissioner Zambergin? Nothing to add mayor. Okay. Commissioner Walker? It is. It was a first time event. Oh, say it again. Sorry. Well, no, I guess the, uh, the family festival in pioneer park, what a great event that was. And, uh, you know, despite the fact that some of us probably did get swimmers here from the dunk tank. And I said dunk tank, not drunk tank. Anyway, it was, it was really, really well done. Yeah. And, uh, commissioner DeGuardian, you missed being in the dunk tank. So, you know. Yes, I did. Yes, I did. I really missed that. Yeah, I'll bet you did. I want you to know and everybody else to know that I'm just as pleased as I can be that I didn't get, no, I'm sorry. Anyway, any final comments? Uh, a couple. Um, first of all, I apologize for being, uh, a little tardy. Uh, there's this great movie called The Accidental Tourist and I'm, uh, experiencing many of those, uh, types of activities as I travel across a country that doesn't know how to keep trains on time. Uh, so I apologize for being a few moments late, uh, but look forward to joining you, um, on Thursday, uh, on a more timely basis. Uh, and by the way, I was trying to jerk off a, um, little strip of a bottle, uh, when I got here and it appears as though my camera button was, uh, while showing off was on. So I apologize for anybody that wondered what the heck I was trying to do. I was trying to get this bottle open because I was dying. I apologize for that. Um, I am missing all of you as I, I think I've shared. Um, it's very interesting to be out of town. The manager said I can't do it again. I, she's a train driver. Um, and thank you all for allowing me to participate through this means. Have a great day. Thank you. Yeah. My only comments and I, I, I second the whole, um, you know, Pride Day and, and, and Pride Family Fun Day or whatever it was called in downtown Pioneer Park. It was, you know, just very well attended. It was, it was a great, it was a great event. And I actually liked Commissioner Sandberg and made the comment, he goes, and there wasn't any drinking, you know, cause you know, Dunedin is kind of known for its drinking events. And that was all totally by design by the chamber, uh, to make it a very kid friendly, you know, dog friendly, cause there was a dog, uh, fashion show. Um, and it was just, I, I, everybody I talked to was just tremendously successful. Kids had fun, dogs had fun, people had fun. Um, and it just was a, just a cool family, day. And, and it was cool for, especially all of us were in the dunk tanks. So we, we probably stayed cooler than everybody, even though we raised almost a thousand dollars. So the chamber's pretty happy with us, but it also means we'll probably be back in there again. Sometimes it's better not to be too good at something. And of course, Jennifer was in it as well, our city manager and our economic development, Bob Ironsmith. So, um, really, really bad hair when I was done. Just yeah. Yeah. It was, it was, it was, yeah, it was bad. I, that's why I had to have a hat and, you know, a visor to put on. Um, and so, and so kudos to the chamber who is sponsoring, you know, all the pride week things and, and, and just, that was a big risk for them to do the family, uh, afternoon day. And, um, and churches helped a lot with that as well. And, um, but they, they can be very proud of that now. I mean, it's just been tremendously successful. So they're already looking to next year. Um, and then, uh, the only other comment, and, and I, I'll, I'll say it, and I know, uh, commissioner Sandberg and or vice mayor want to tag on, but, um, those of us who could attended the, uh, Denine high school graduation, uh, that night. Uh, we got out of the dunk tank and headed to the, to the Ruth Eckert hall where the graduates were given their diplomas and it was a wonderful event. Uh, and just, uh, we were talking about how, you know, you, you, you hear about, you know, our youth of, you know, tomorrow and where we're headed. And, you know, we look like we're in good hands and, uh, and either one of you want to make a comment about that or I know it had a big impact on all three of us. No, I, I, and I, I agree with what you were saying. The, uh, you know, we shook probably 400 hands and, uh, I, it's, it's sad that the, the youth of today that are, they get publicity that are in the news are for the wrong things because boy, there's a lot of good kids that came out of that graduating class. Uh, congratulations to the, the staff, the principal, the vice principals. I'm very proud of, uh, those kids. And I've, I really, I really enjoyed being there, shaking their hands and looking into their eyes. Uh, thanks. And we really are privileged to be there. And so thank you to the school board. Thank you to, um, Dunning High School that allows us to do that. Uh, because there's no room for us, right? That all those seats are filled and they're filled with the, with the right people, with parents and family. And it truly is a day of celebration. So it's always, always a thrill to be there. Um, and the number of, of older residents that complain about the younger generation and their worthless, et cetera, et cetera. Um, they need to get involved because there is, there is so much going on in our schools. And I know I say it all the time, but they really, there are amazing, amazing things. And just people just need to open their eyes and really have conversations with our young people because they will be amazed at what comes out of their mouths. And so as Mary, as you put it, yeah, the future is bright with our young people. Yeah. And just a shout out to principal Kiplinger. He always gets the biggest round of applause in the house to those graduations. That guy is at everything. He is really a very involved, engaged principal and, and it shows and the students love him and the parents love him. And, and that's a great thing. The only other comment I'd make about it, we had a conversation just before we went out for the graduation, uh, with the superintendent of schools and, uh, boy, interesting enrollment numbers. And most of it is just cause, uh, less kids being born and probably some, you know, less families moving to Pinellas because there's no affordable homes, uh, and they can't afford to buy a home. So a little bit of a wake up call that I think we all know, but you know, nothing hits harder than when you're a Roman is decreasing. I asked him specifically about the impact of vouchers and he said, it's not vouchers. It really is just that less, less babies being born and, and potentially if the affordable housing, the ability for families to buy houses. So, you know, got to keep our eyes on that ball to the extent that we can. Um, anyway, um, I, is anybody else? Uh, Jennifer, Jen, Rebecca, Camille. Okay. All right. Then meeting is adjourned.