UVU police officer described Charlie Kirk's death — full testimony

[00:00:00] Speaker 1: The governor of the state calls Officer Chris Bagley. [00:00:04] Speaker 2: Officer Bagley, if you'd like to come forward. It looks like he's being brought into the courtroom. All right, Officer Bagley, if you wouldn't mind coming forward, pass the lecturum and being sworn in. [00:00:22] Speaker 3: You do solemnly swear that the testimony you shall give and the case now pending before the court will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God. [00:00:31] Speaker 2: All right, Officer Bagley, if you wouldn't mind having a seat at the witness table. Mr. Grunander, your witness. Thank you, Your Honor. [00:00:39] Speaker 1: Good morning, sir. Good morning. Will you please state your name for the record and spell your last name? [00:00:45] Christopher Bagley: Christopher Bagley, last name spelling B-A-G-L-U-Y. And how are you employed? I'm employed at the Spanish War Police Department as a police officer. [00:00:54] Speaker 1: As a police officer. What is your position or your rank there? I'm just a senior officer. How long have you been with the Spanish Fork Police Department? About five months. Five months. How long have you been a police officer? 26 years. Okay. Will you briefly describe, for the court's benefit, your training, what you did to become a police officer? [00:01:18] Christopher Bagley: I did the Utah Post Academy, which is about 600 hours of training for basic things to become a police officer, report writing, arrest control, stuff to that effect. When you say Post Academy, is Post an acronym? [00:01:32] Speaker 1: It is. What does that stand for? Police Officer Standard Training. Okay. Were you certified through Post? I was. Okay. And what did that certification require? [00:01:44] Christopher Bagley: Going through that Post and graduating, all the Academy, all the credits that you could get up with hours, and then physical fitness, stuff to that effect, and then graduating from that to earn the certificate. [00:01:56] Speaker 1: Was there also testing involved? There was. At the Academy? Yes. Okay. Were you employed in September of 2025? I was. And where were you employed then? Utah Valley Police Department. And how long did you work for the Utah Valley University Police Department? Five years. Five years. Okay. And do you recall what your position or your rank was there? A senior officer there. Senior officer. Okay. Describe, if you would, just your general duties as a police officer at Utah Valley University. [00:02:33] Christopher Bagley: There at Utah Valley University, we patrol the campus. We'd walk around. We'd patrol. We would do investigations if there was crimes to that effect. We'd make sure that students or staff, if they needed something, we'd be there for them. So basic police. Kind of like a school resource officer, community-oriented policing. [00:02:49] Speaker 1: Okay. Was this a full-time position? [00:02:51] Christopher Bagley: It was. [00:02:52] Speaker 1: Okay. Did you work in law enforcement prior to UVU? I did. And where did you work? [00:02:58] Christopher Bagley: I worked at Utah Valley, or, sorry, Utah County Sheriff's Office for 13 years. Before that, I worked with Springville City Police Department for six years, and also with the Salt Lake County Sheriff's Office for a year. What were your positions with those departments? Various. [00:03:17] Speaker ?: Various. [00:03:17] Christopher Bagley: Various. I did K-9. I did SWAT. I did motors. I, senior officer, FTO officer, detectives. [00:03:27] Speaker 1: Okay. While you were at Utah Valley University, did you have access to the video surveillance system on campus? [00:03:35] Christopher Bagley: Yes, I did. [00:03:37] Speaker 1: And how so? [00:03:39] Christopher Bagley: It was at our desktop where our police station is. We have desks, and on our desktops, we'd have access to it there. Or we'd go into dispatch, and they'd have a wall full of camera systems that we could look at. [00:03:51] Speaker 1: How familiar did you become with that system? [00:03:54] Christopher Bagley: Very familiar. [00:03:55] Speaker 1: Can you describe how you became very familiar? [00:03:59] Christopher Bagley: Like I said, it was one of our daily routines that we'd go in there. If we were looking for somebody or tracking something back, we'd go in. We'd go back to that time frame. We could trace somebody to track somebody through campus. I'd also turn around and make some maps, so it was easier for dispatch or somebody to click on an area in the campuses, where the buildings were, and be able to click a little bit easier and get a faster response. So we made some maps and stuff like that. [00:04:24] Speaker 1: And how often did you use this system? [00:04:25] Christopher Bagley: Every day. [00:04:27] Speaker 1: Okay. Did you become familiar with the campus at Utah Valley University when you were working there? Yes. And explain how you became familiar with it. [00:04:38] Christopher Bagley: Like I said, we'd walk around. I would train other officers. We'd make sure that we knew all the ins and outs, the back doors. We'd make sure we knew where every classroom was, where every entrance and exit was. We'd secure the building. We'd patrol the neighborhoods. We'd patrol around campus. And then we'd also have off-site campuses that we'd drive to and make sure that they're secure also. [00:04:59] Speaker 1: Okay. You mentioned that you patrol the neighborhoods? Yes. Surrounding campus? Yes. What about the neighborhood to the north and east of campus? Yes. Okay. What was your purpose for patrolling those neighborhoods as an officer for UVU? [00:05:14] Christopher Bagley: One, it was right next to UVU, so we patrolled it. Sometimes people would run up in that area or be walking up that way. We'd have stolen bikes, stuff like that. So we'd go into the areas, look for stuff. Also, with Orem Police Department, we'd go back up them quite a bit for other calls and allow what would be in the area. [00:05:30] Speaker 1: Okay. So back up just a little bit. So Utah Valley University is located in what city? [00:05:35] Christopher Bagley: Orem, Utah. [00:05:36] Speaker 1: Orem, Utah. Okay. How familiar did you become with the buildings on campus? [00:05:43] Christopher Bagley: Very familiar. [00:05:43] Speaker 1: And the walkways? [00:05:45] Christopher Bagley: Very familiar. [00:05:46] Speaker 1: You mentioned the entrances and exits to the buildings? Yes. What about parking structures? [00:05:51] Christopher Bagley: Yes. [00:05:52] Speaker 1: Same answer for that? [00:05:54] Christopher Bagley: Yes. [00:05:55] Speaker 1: Okay. Are you familiar with the courtyard or the outdoor amphitheater on campus? [00:06:03] Christopher Bagley: I am. [00:06:04] Speaker 1: And generally speaking, where is that located on campus? [00:06:07] Christopher Bagley: It's more of the central, it's an outdoor area centered by a bunch of buildings around it. So it's in the center of the campus pretty much. [00:06:15] Speaker 1: Okay. Can you describe what it looks like, this courtyard, this amphitheater? [00:06:21] Christopher Bagley: It's kind of like an amphitheater look. So you've got some grass and a couple of steps that go up. You've got some cement on top with some bushes and flowers. You've got places where people can sit and eat. They come out and study and relax on the grass. And there's a waterfall with a little pond that comes down into a stream. Okay. [00:06:42] Speaker 1: Are you familiar with the surroundings, the buildings around the amphitheater? Yes, I am. Okay. In relationship to this amphitheater, this courtyard, where is the Hall of Flags located? [00:06:55] Christopher Bagley: It would be directly west of the courtyard. [00:06:58] Speaker 1: Okay. Is it part of the courtyard or is it just off the courtyard? [00:07:04] Christopher Bagley: It's kind of the courtyard, it like busts up right against the courtyard, so it would be the west side of the courtyard. [00:07:08] Speaker 1: Okay. So to the west of the courtyard. Is there a walkway across the Hall of Flags? [00:07:13] Christopher Bagley: There is. There's an inside one and an outside one. [00:07:16] Speaker 1: Okay. So what is the Hall of Flags then? [00:07:17] Christopher Bagley: The Hall of Flags is kind of like a bridge between two buildings that all the flags throughout the world are represented. And there are some chairs where people sit down and relax with windows so you can see through all the way to the Utah Lake. Okay. What are those two buildings that are connected by this Hall of Flags? The Fugle Building over to like the Science Building area. [00:07:39] Speaker 1: Okay. So you mentioned the Fugle Building. Yeah. Where is the Fugle Building located in relationship to this courtyard? [00:07:45] Christopher Bagley: It's to the south of the courtyard. [00:07:48] Speaker 1: Okay. Does it run up against the courtyard? It does. The building. Okay. What about the Woodbury Business Building? Where is that in relationship to the courtyard? [00:07:58] Christopher Bagley: It's kind of southeast and it runs up right against the courtyard also. [00:08:01] Speaker 1: Okay. And in relationship to the Fugle Building, where is that Sorenson? Or excuse me, that business building, the Woodbury Business Building. Woodbury Business is right directly east of the Fugle. Okay. What about the Sorenson Center? Where is that located with respect to this courtyard? [00:08:20] Christopher Bagley: The Sorenson Center is going to be kind of like a northeast of the courtyard. [00:08:27] Speaker 1: Okay. Does it, again, run up against this courtyard? Yes, it does. Okay. And where is it in relationship to the business building? The Woodbury Business Building is just directly south of the Sorenson. Directly south. Okay. The Losey Center, are you familiar with that building? I am. And where is it located on campus? [00:08:46] Christopher Bagley: Directly east of the courtyard and amphitheater area. Okay. [00:08:51] Speaker 1: Does it run up to the courtyard, the Losey Center? [00:08:55] Christopher Bagley: No, not really. Okay. It doesn't run right up against it. So the Sorenson Building is kind of like right between those two. [00:09:02] Speaker 1: Okay. In relationship to the Sorenson Building, what direction is the Losey Building? East. East. [00:09:08] Speaker ?: East. East. [00:09:08] Speaker 1: Okay. Are you familiar with the LDS Institute Building on campus? [00:09:14] Christopher Bagley: Yes, I am. [00:09:14] Speaker 1: And where is that located? [00:09:16] Christopher Bagley: That is going to be located north of the Losey Building and just kind of like northeast of the courtyard. Okay. [00:09:28] Speaker 1: And is there a parking structure next to this Institute Building? [00:09:34] Christopher Bagley: Yeah, there is. [00:09:35] Speaker 1: And where is that? [00:09:37] Christopher Bagley: It's going to be, so you mentioned the Institute Building is going to be north of the Losey Center. There is a parking structure that has several levels of parking. It's going to be directly west of the Institute Building and then they also have a parking structure, not parking structure, parking lot to the north of that across the road. [00:09:56] Speaker 1: Okay. With respect to the parking structure, can you describe for the court how one would enter this parking structure driving and even walking? How do you enter and exit that structure? [00:10:09] Christopher Bagley: So on the north end of the parking structure is campus drive. You can drive in and exit on the level one, so that's a ground level. That's where you'd enter if you're driving in or exiting back out on campus. Then it goes up to level two, and on level two, exit is what's called Heat Plant Road. In between the Institute Building and the garage is a little road, and there's an exit right there that you can drive out. You can also, if you're to park in there, you can walk out right there at that exit only where I was talking about on that southeast side. You can walk out there or on the north end of that garage, there are some stairs that go up all the levels, and it goes down to the bottom level and across the street through a tunnel to the LDS Institute Building. And then when you pop up on level two, you can walk over to the Institute Building. [00:10:55] Speaker 1: Okay. Can you describe how long of a walk it would take from that parking structure to get to the courtyard on campus, approximately? [00:11:04] Christopher Bagley: A couple of minutes, because when you go to that far southeast exit, you can walk directly almost to the courtyard. You can also walk along the south end of the LDS Institute Building up towards the low seat building. Okay. [00:11:18] Speaker 1: Officer, I'm going to turn your attention to State's Exhibit No. 1. It should come up on your monitor there. Let me know when you can see that. I can see it. [00:11:34] Speaker 2: Just for staff, let's go ahead and not publish it until it's admitted into evidence, so we're going to take it off the monitors. But for the witness, he should be able to see the exhibit. That's fine. So table monitors, witness, but not the main monitor. Thank you. All right. Mr. Grunander, thank you. [00:12:00] Speaker 1: Thank you, Judge. Do you see that plaintiff's exhibit No. 1, officer? [00:12:03] Christopher Bagley: I do. [00:12:05] Speaker 1: And do you recognize that exhibit? [00:12:07] Christopher Bagley: Yes, I do. [00:12:08] Speaker 1: And what is that? [00:12:09] Christopher Bagley: This is an area of the buildings plus the courtyard in the middle of all the grassy area. So this is an area of the campus at Utah Valley University. [00:12:17] Speaker 1: Is it a photograph? Yes, sir. Okay. Are you familiar, then, with what's depicted in this photograph? [00:12:24] Christopher Bagley: Yes, I am. [00:12:25] Speaker 1: Does it fairly and accurately portray this area of campus? [00:12:30] Christopher Bagley: Yes, it does. [00:12:31] Speaker 1: Okay. Can you tell the court what direction the camera is facing when this photograph was taken? [00:12:38] Christopher Bagley: It's kind of facing north and a little to the east. [00:12:40] Speaker 1: Okay. Does it depict a number of the buildings that we've talked about today? [00:12:47] Christopher Bagley: Yes, it does. [00:12:48] Speaker 1: For example, the Hall of Flags, does it show the Hall of Flags? Yes, it does. The walkway of it, of the Hall of Flags? What about the Sorenson Center? Does it show that? [00:12:58] Christopher Bagley: Yes, it does. [00:13:00] Speaker 1: The Woodbury Business Building? Yes, it does. The Fugle Building? [00:13:04] Christopher Bagley: Yes. [00:13:05] Speaker 1: What about the Losey Center? Can you see that from this photograph? [00:13:09] Christopher Bagley: Yes. [00:13:10] Speaker 1: Is this photograph a fair and accurate depiction of this area of UVU campus on September 10th, 2025? Yes. The state offers States Exhibit 1. [00:13:20] Speaker 5: Your Honor, we would object to failure to lay a foundation for... Oh, I'm sorry. [00:13:25] Speaker 2: Now, it is a little bit tricky because that microphone... Sorry about that. [00:13:30] Speaker 5: Your Honor, we would object to inability to authenticate. There has not been a foundation laid that this officer took this photo, can verify when it was taken or by whom it was taken, so we would object. [00:13:43] Speaker 2: Mr. Grudenander. [00:13:44] Speaker 1: Would you like us to argue now or approach the bench? [00:13:47] Speaker 2: Well, as it relates to this, I'll hear argument. [00:13:50] Speaker 1: Okay. Judge, first of all, it's very clear, well-established law, that the person who took the photograph is not required to be present to lay the foundation for it. What's required for foundation is that the witness has knowledge knowledge of what's depicted in the photograph and can testify to its accuracy. And that's exactly what this officer has done. We laid an ample amount of foundation about this area of campus. He's confirmed that it depicts this area of campus that was previously described. He confirmed the buildings that he can see there. He also confirmed that it was an accurate depiction of us on September 10th, 2025. [00:14:30] Speaker 2: Thank you. Any further argument, Ms. Nessar? Mr. Grudenander. [00:14:36] Speaker 5: We did file a standing objection at the very beginning of the hearing. I would just refer to our standing objection as well. I know this is not a, there's no written testimony in this, but just out of an abundance of caution, I want to also refer to our standing objection. [00:14:54] Speaker 2: Thank you, Ms. Nessar. All right, having considered the arguments, I find I'm going to overrule the objection and admit exhibit one. This witness has firsthand knowledge of the location as well as the building locations that foundation has been laid. He also stated it was a fair and accurate representation of what's being depicted here. And for those reasons, the fence objection is overruled. States exhibit one is admitted into evidence and may be published to the courtroom. Okay. [00:15:27] Speaker 1: So the state would move to publish that to the courtroom. It is so granted. Officer Bagley, are you able to see the monitor that's here in the court that's pointed towards the, the gallery? [00:15:46] Christopher Bagley: Yes. [00:15:49] Speaker 1: From where you're seated, are you comfortable in describing where the courtyard is on that photograph, on that exhibit? Yes. And for the record, where is that located? [00:15:58] Christopher Bagley: So all the grass that looks like a triangle, the amphitheater look, that is going to be the courtyard amphitheater area. It's got the tent in it, the white tent that's at the bottom on the far left of the picture. That would be the courtyard area that's surrounded by buildings. It's more of the grass area. [00:16:16] Speaker 1: I'm going to approach the photo, well, I'm just going to, when you look at this exhibit, to the left of the photograph, there's a walkway there. What is that walkway? [00:16:26] Christopher Bagley: So the red brick walkway that's going north to the top of the picture. On the far left is going to be the hall of flags, the outside top of it. [00:16:33] Speaker 1: On the bottom of this photograph, there's a white-roofed building. It's the largest building, at least as far as what's depicted on this exhibit. What building is that? [00:16:45] Christopher Bagley: That would be the Fugle Building. [00:16:47] Speaker 1: Okay. And just to the right of that, so that would be to the east of the Fugle Building. What building is that? [00:16:54] Christopher Bagley: The other red brick pathway area, that is the Woodbury Business Building. [00:16:59] Speaker 1: And if I were to walk north, so left on this photograph, with respect to that red brick walkway area, there's another building, sort of triangular in shape, the rooftop. What building is that? [00:17:14] Christopher Bagley: With that white rooftop, that would be the Sorenson Building. [00:17:16] Speaker 1: That's the Sorenson Building. And what about the Low C Building? You've described that. Where is that located on this photograph? [00:17:22] Christopher Bagley: If you go to that triangle white roof, if you go directly to the right, so the right side of the picture, that is going to be the Low C Building. It's got several levels. [00:17:31] Speaker 1: Is it to the right and up a little bit as well? Okay. And that would be east on this photograph, is that correct? [00:17:37] Christopher Bagley: It's got the gravel rooftop. [00:17:39] Speaker 1: Gravel rooftop. Okay. I referred you to the LDS Institute Building. Are you able to see that in this photograph? [00:17:48] Christopher Bagley: Yes, you are. [00:17:48] Speaker 1: And where is that located? [00:17:50] Christopher Bagley: Asking you to speak directly north of the Low C Building. It's going to be that other white roofed building on the far top of the picture. [00:17:57] Speaker 1: Okay. Thank you, officer. We can take that down, your honor, as far as the publication. Officer Bagley, I'm going to take you back to the date of September 10th, 2025. Do you recall that day generally? [00:18:12] Christopher Bagley: I do. [00:18:13] Speaker 1: Were you working that day? [00:18:15] Christopher Bagley: Yes, I was. [00:18:16] Speaker 1: At UVU? [00:18:17] Christopher Bagley: I was, yes. [00:18:18] Speaker 1: Okay. Do you remember what time your shift started approximately? [00:18:24] Christopher Bagley: Yes, it started about 11 o'clock in the morning. [00:18:26] Speaker 1: 11 o'clock in the morning? Yes. Did you receive a specific assignment shortly after coming onto duty? [00:18:33] Christopher Bagley: Yes, I did. [00:18:34] Speaker 1: And what was that assignment? [00:18:36] Christopher Bagley: It was to secure the top of the Hall of Flags on the south end. So we had people that were gathering on top of that, that were looking down on top of the tent. So we wanted to secure that area. So I was put up on top of the Hall of Flags on the south end. [00:18:50] Speaker 1: Okay. My apologies, your honor. Could we have Exhibit 1 published again? [00:18:54] Speaker 2: Go ahead and republish stage Exhibit 1. Thank you. [00:19:00] Speaker 1: You mentioned that you were securing the south end of the walkway on top of the Hall of Flags. Yes. And so where do we find that in this exhibit, officer? [00:19:08] Christopher Bagley: So if you can see the tent, the white tent, there's that rooftop where the red brick is. I was on top of that and there's some, actually looks like, yellow crime scene tape. That was some of our barrier that we put up so people wouldn't go above that and walk. So I was sitting right by those flower plants that were by the fugal on the south end. [00:19:28] Speaker 1: So is the south end on the bottom of this photograph? Yes. Where that walkway kind of begins from the bottom? [00:19:34] Speaker ?: Yes. [00:19:35] Speaker 1: And you've referred to a tent. Is that the white object we see inside the courtyard? [00:19:42] Christopher Bagley: Yeah, that square white object with the tent. [00:19:44] Speaker 1: Okay. Thank you. So you were securing that area? Yes. Did you have the opportunity that morning, you mentioned you checked on about 11 o'clock. [00:19:58] Speaker ?: Yes. [00:19:59] Speaker 1: That morning and later to walk around campus that day? Yes. Did you walk along the hall of flags that day? I did. That walkway? Yes. Did you visit the courtyard that day as well? [00:20:13] Christopher Bagley: Down below, yes. On the south end I was down there. Okay. [00:20:16] Speaker 1: Officer, I'm going to turn your attention to states exhibit number two. And that should come up on your monitor there. Let me know when you see that, if you would. [00:20:44] Speaker 5: Your Honor, if we could maybe not have it on the lectern screen. We're getting reports that the documents shown on the lectern screen are being live streamed. So maybe if we could just not show that one until it's admitted. [00:21:02] Speaker 2: Mr. Grunander? [00:21:03] Speaker 1: I'll submit it to the court, Judge. I've got copies of these for myself. Okay. That I can refer to as I'm asking questions. [00:21:12] Speaker 2: All right. Well, I'll go ahead and grant the request by Ms. Nestor. We'll go ahead and pour. We'll have to turn it off. [00:21:19] Speaker ?: Just turn it off. [00:21:20] Speaker 2: Just, there should be a power button to turn it off. I'm not sure where that's at. Thank you, John. [00:21:32] Speaker ?: Go ahead. [00:21:38] Speaker 2: You're good. And if at any point, Mr. Grunander, you do need to use the monitor, let's revisit that. And obviously, Ms. Nestor, you can renew your objection if needs be. But for now, the monitor's turned off. Let's go ahead and proceed. Thank you. [00:21:53] Speaker 1: Officer, do you see state's exhibit number two on your monitor? [00:21:57] Christopher Bagley: Yes, I do. [00:21:58] Speaker 1: And do you recognize that? [00:21:59] Christopher Bagley: I do. [00:22:00] Speaker 1: And what is that? [00:22:02] Christopher Bagley: This is a picture of the, from the east side looking west of the campus. [00:22:08] Speaker 1: Okay. Are you familiar with what's depicted in this photograph? [00:22:13] Christopher Bagley: Yes, I am. [00:22:14] Speaker 1: Okay. And does it show, for example, the Losey Center that we've talked about? [00:22:20] Christopher Bagley: Yes, it does. [00:22:22] Speaker 1: Does it depict the Woodbury Business Building that we've talked about? Yes. What about the Fugle Building? Yes. Does it show the Sorenson Center? Yes. And also the Hall of Flags? [00:22:35] Christopher Bagley: Yes. [00:22:36] Speaker 1: In this particular exhibit, can you also see the courtyard? [00:22:40] Christopher Bagley: I can. A partial of it. [00:22:42] Speaker 1: A partial of it? Okay. Mm-hmm. Does it fairly and accurately depict this area of campus of UVU on September 10th, 2025? [00:22:53] Christopher Bagley: Yes. [00:22:54] Speaker 1: Okay. Your Honor, the state offers states exhibit number two. [00:22:59] Speaker 5: Your Honor, we renew our standing objection. We also argue that a foundation hasn't been laid in terms of the time this was taken or who took it and at what point in time this was created and how. So I don't think he has any personal knowledge of that, and we'd object. [00:23:15] Speaker 1: Mr. Grudenander. Same arguments, Judge. He has testified that he's familiar with it. He has personal familiarity with it. He's testified that it's fair and accurate as of the day of September 10th, 2025, and that's what was asked of him. [00:23:29] Speaker 2: All right. I will go ahead and overrule the objection by defense, noting that the witness has laid, well, he has expressed that this is a fair and accurate representation of what it purports to be, and he's familiar with it. He was there on the day on September 10th, and because that foundation has been laid, state's exhibit two is admitted and may be published. Thank you, Judge. [00:23:57] Speaker 1: State moves to publish exhibit two. [00:23:59] Speaker 2: All right. [00:24:01] Speaker 1: Officer, I'm going to direct your attention to this exhibit on the monitor facing the gallery of the court today. Okay. Can you describe, there's a large building in the middle of that photograph, slightly above the middle, but what building are we looking at there? [00:24:20] Christopher Bagley: You're looking at the rooftop of the low-sea building. It's got two different grays, like a lighter gray and a darker gray. [00:24:26] Speaker 1: Are you familiar with that rooftop then? [00:24:28] Christopher Bagley: Yes, I am. [00:24:29] Speaker 1: And what's it made of? [00:24:30] Christopher Bagley: It's made of gravel. [00:24:31] Speaker 1: Gravel. Okay. You mentioned two different grades, or did you say graze? Graze. Graze? Okay. All right. Now, you described that you could see the courtyard, but it wasn't easily visible in this photograph. Where is the courtyard located on the state's exhibit number two? [00:24:50] Christopher Bagley: So, you've got the white roof that's going to be in the middle, just to the top of the building where the low-sea is, as I described, there's a white roof there. That's the Sorensen building. And it's just below that. You can see some grass. And that's where the courtyard is. It's just to the left of that white roof. [00:25:06] Speaker 1: Your Honor, I'm going to ask if the witness could actually come down from the stand and point out where the courtyard is located in this exhibit for the court's benefit. [00:25:15] Speaker 2: All right. We have a second microphone, so it picks up his voice. Okay. Ms. Nestor, thank you for allowing us. Officer, you may step down, approach the monitor, and I would ask that you speak into the microphone when responding to a question. [00:25:39] Speaker 1: Okay. Can you hear me? [00:25:40] Speaker 2: I can. Thank you. [00:25:42] Speaker 1: So, officer, for our benefit, would you describe again where the low-sea center is in this photograph? [00:25:47] Christopher Bagley: The low-sea center is going to be this one with the gray roofs. It's got two different colors of gray. [00:25:51] Speaker 1: Two different colors of gray. Okay. I'm blind. I can't see those two different colors from here. But can you describe where the court – it looks like we went blank. There we go. Can you point to where the courtyard is located on that exhibit? [00:26:09] Christopher Bagley: The courtyard is going to be here where this grass is in this area right here. [00:26:12] Speaker 1: Okay. And what about the Fugle Building? [00:26:15] Christopher Bagley: The Fugle Building is going to be this building right here. [00:26:18] Speaker 1: And the Woodbury Business Building then? [00:26:20] Christopher Bagley: Woodbury is going to be this one right here with this red brick path. [00:26:23] Speaker 1: And the Sorenson Center. [00:26:25] Christopher Bagley: The Sorenson Center is going to be this white-roofed one that's right here. [00:26:27] Speaker 1: Okay. Now, on this exhibit, can you see the LDS Institute Building and the parking structure that we've talked about? [00:26:33] Christopher Bagley: No, not really. You've got the back side of the Institute Building, which is right here, and the parking structure is over there. Okay. So you can't see the next. [00:26:39] Speaker 2: Mr. Grinander, let me stop you just for the benefit of the record, because the record is picking up the audio. When you're pointing it to – and I know it may be a little bit laborious to do this, but as you're identifying, indicate the general location on it, the left side, right side, middle, upper, lower, just so the record knows to some degree where you're pointing. And that way – because the video isn't being captured. So if you would do that, it just creates a more complete record. Thank you. Understood. That's fair. Thank you, Judge. [00:27:11] Speaker 1: So, again, let's point to the courtyard, and if you'll describe as best you can where that is located on the photograph. [00:27:17] Christopher Bagley: On this photograph, the courtyard is going to be this grass area that's going to be towards the top of the pitcher. The baseball field is behind it. It's closer to the surrounded buildings. There's some grass in there. That would be the courtyard area. [00:27:29] Speaker 1: Okay. We've talked about the Hall of Flags and the walkway above that hall. Where is that located on this photograph? [00:27:35] Christopher Bagley: The Hall of Flags is going to be right by the courtyard just to the west out. There's a red brick towards the top of the pitcher. There's a red brick pathway that goes from the Fugle Building, which is on the left of the pitcher, towards the right of the pitcher, which is the Science Building area. [00:27:47] Speaker 1: Okay. And then the Sorensen Center, is that the building in the middle with a large white roof? [00:27:54] Christopher Bagley: Yeah. It's going to be kind of towards the upper part of the pitcher, middle of it. It's going to be a white roof. That will be the Sorensen Center. [00:28:02] Speaker 1: And just to the north and east of the courtyard? Yes, north and east. Okay. And then finally, if you would describe the Low-C Building, the location of that on this exhibit? [00:28:11] Christopher Bagley: The Low-C Building is going to be pretty much in the middle on the right side, so middle to the right. It's going to have two different colors of gray, a darker gray and a lighter gray. There's a red pathway, and that will be the Low-C Center. [00:28:23] Speaker 1: Okay. You mentioned, officer, that there were different stories on the Low-C Building. How many stories does the Low-C Building have? [00:28:32] Christopher Bagley: There's four. [00:28:33] Speaker 1: Four stories? Okay. You mentioned that you were familiar with the rooftop. Do you know how to gain access to the rooftop of the Low-C Building? [00:28:40] Christopher Bagley: Yes, there's actually an outside stairway right here that comes up. It's going to be just to the south of Low-C Building. There's a red pathway right directly in the middle of the picture. Off to the south of that, on the left side of the picture, is an outdoor staircase and stairway. [00:28:56] Speaker 1: Is that open to the public? [00:28:57] Christopher Bagley: It is. [00:28:58] Speaker 1: And how would someone access the roof from that stairway? [00:29:03] Christopher Bagley: If they came up, they would put them right here on this pathway that goes between the Low-C Center and down towards the Computer Science Building. There's a red pathway. There's actually a little handrail, like a little guardrail, probably about a couple feet high that somebody could jump over. [00:29:19] Speaker 1: Is that area restricted? Is it off limits? [00:29:22] Christopher Bagley: Yes, it is. There's kind of like a natural barrier with the guardrail. And from there on, there's no path. It's gravel roof, so it's not paved like everything else. [00:29:32] Speaker 1: But someone could hop over that railway? [00:29:33] Christopher Bagley: Yes. [00:29:34] Speaker 1: Okay. Thank you, officer. You can take your seat again. [00:29:38] Speaker ?: Thank you. [00:29:39] Speaker 1: Officer Bagley, I'm now going to refer you to your attention to States Exhibit Number 3. That's going to come up on your monitor as well. Let me know when you see that. [00:30:13] Christopher Bagley: Yes, I do see it. [00:30:15] Speaker 1: Okay. And do you recognize that? [00:30:18] Christopher Bagley: I do. [00:30:19] Speaker 1: And what is that? [00:30:21] Christopher Bagley: This is a drone picture of the campus, more of the courtyard looking eastward. [00:30:27] Speaker 1: Okay. I've asked you about several buildings on campus. I'm going to ask you about those same buildings, whether they're depicted in this exhibit, okay? Do you see where the Hall of Flags is located? [00:30:38] Christopher Bagley: Yes, I do. Yes, I do. It's down towards the bottom. It's a red brick pathway. It would be the Hall of Flags. [00:30:42] Speaker 1: Okay. What about the Fugle Building? [00:30:44] Christopher Bagley: Fugle Building is going to be to the right of the picture. It's going to be a white roof building off to the right, directly south of the courtyard. [00:30:50] Speaker 1: And the Woodbury Business Building? [00:30:53] Christopher Bagley: Or is that that? Woodbury is going to be another red path. It's going to be just to the east of the Fugle Building. It's got a gray roof and some red paths. [00:31:00] Speaker 1: The Sorenson Center? [00:31:02] Christopher Bagley: The Sorenson Center is going to be on the left of the picture. It's going to have a white roof, different levels, and that would be the Sorenson Center. [00:31:09] Speaker 1: Okay. The Losi Center, where is that located in relationship to the Sorenson Center that you've described? [00:31:16] Christopher Bagley: Of the Sorenson Center? It's going to be just directly east of the Sorenson Center, towards the top of the picture. You can see the two different colors of gray of the gravel that's on the roof. Okay. [00:31:26] Speaker 1: And can you see the courtyard in this photograph? [00:31:29] Christopher Bagley: Yes, you can. [00:31:30] Speaker 1: Okay. Is this picture a fair and accurate depiction of this area, Utah Valley University's campus, on September 10, 2025? [00:31:43] Christopher Bagley: Yes. [00:31:46] Speaker 1: State offers Exhibit 3, Your Honor. [00:31:50] Speaker 5: Honor, we renew the standing objection. We also object, again, that this individual can't identify when the picture was made, or how it was made, or by whom. [00:32:04] Speaker 1: Mr. Your Honor. Same response, Judge. And just for the record, I was also going to point the court to State v. Purcell, which is a Supreme Court case here in the state of Utah, 1985, which essentially stands for the proposition that if a competent witness with personal knowledge of the facts represented in a photograph can testify that that photograph accurately represents those facts. The exhibit's admissible. He's also spoke about the date being September 10, 2025. The showing that's required here is essentially a prima facie showing. We're not required to show proof beyond a reasonable doubt, for example, that it was accurate that day or even a preponderance of the evidence. But we'll submit it on that, Judge. [00:32:51] Speaker 2: All right. I'm just taking a brief glance at the case you cited. I can give the citation if you're on it. If you have that, I'd appreciate that. [00:33:02] Speaker 1: It's 7-1-1 Pacific Second 243, and I'm looking at page number 245. [00:33:22] Speaker 2: All right. The court finds that the witness is familiar with the scene. He testified that it is a fair and accurate representation of what State's Exhibit 3 purports to be, and the court finds that a necessary foundation has been laid and overrules the objection. State's Exhibit 3 may be admitted, is admitted, and may be published. State would move to publish State's Exhibit 3. All right. [00:34:00] Speaker 1: May I approach the witness, Your Honor? [00:34:08] Speaker 2: You may. [00:34:15] Speaker 1: Officer, if you would come down into the well of the court, I'm going to ask you a few questions about this Exhibit 3 as well. Okay. Can you point out where the Hall of Flags is located and describe that for the record? [00:34:30] Christopher Bagley: The Hall of Flags is going to be down here on the bottom of the picture. It's going to have a red brick pathway with some flowers along the top of it. [00:34:36] Speaker 1: You mentioned that you were securing an area of that walkway. Where were you stationed? [00:34:43] Christopher Bagley: I was down here by the end of the flower pots, which is down here on the south side towards the Fugo building on the far right of the picture. [00:34:49] Speaker 1: Okay. In relationship to where you were stationed, where is the Fugo building then? [00:34:55] Christopher Bagley: The Fugo building is just to the right of me. So it would be on the south end of me. [00:35:01] Speaker 1: Okay. And so it's on the right side of the photograph there? [00:35:04] Christopher Bagley: Far right side of the photograph, yes. [00:35:06] Speaker 1: What about the business building? [00:35:08] Christopher Bagley: The business building is just going to be in the middle of the picture on the far right. It's going to have some red brick pathways. It's going to be multi-level, and that would be the Woodbury building. [00:35:17] Speaker 1: Okay. The Sorensen Center, where is that located on the photograph? [00:35:21] Christopher Bagley: The Sorensen Center is going to be middle to far left of the picture. It's going to have a white roof on top of it, multi-level. [00:35:27] Speaker 1: Okay. And the Losey Center, where is that located? [00:35:30] Christopher Bagley: Losey Center is going to be towards the top of the picture. Kind of off-centered a little bit, but it's going to have the four or five floors that are sitting right there. [00:35:41] Speaker 1: Okay. Can you describe those stories, what we're looking at? Where do you find one, two, three, four, and possibly five? [00:35:51] Christopher Bagley: So this is ground level where the courtyard is. So as you go over towards the Losey building inside, there's an elevator. That would be ground one, level one. Level two would be the second one where these red ATVs are sitting on the grass right there in the middle of the picture. If you go up from that, that would be the third level. And your fourth level, which is the actual top level of the building, is that very top one with the windows that you can see. [00:36:17] Speaker 1: Okay. Is there an atrium on the top of that? [00:36:20] Christopher Bagley: There is an atrium. It's actually, it's got a little sphere on the top of it. It looks like a little square right on top of the Losey building. And that would be an atrium. [00:36:27] Speaker 1: Now you mentioned two shades of gray on the rooftop of the Losey building. [00:36:31] Christopher Bagley: Yes. [00:36:32] Speaker 1: Can you see that on this exhibit? [00:36:34] Christopher Bagley: I can. So where the atrium is, is a lighter gray gravel. And on the west side, because I'm looking east, on the west side, there's two ventilations for the Losey building. Two vents on top of that. It's in the darker gray. [00:36:49] Speaker ?: Okay. [00:36:50] Speaker 1: You mentioned you're familiar with the rooftop of the Losey Center, correct? Yes. When someone is standing on the Losey Center, can they see down into the courtyard? [00:36:59] Christopher Bagley: Yes, they can. [00:37:00] Speaker 1: And where is the courtyard located? [00:37:02] Christopher Bagley: It's going to be in the center of the picture with the grass and the atrium style steps. [00:37:07] Speaker 1: Would that be direct? Would that be west of the Losey Center then? [00:37:11] Christopher Bagley: Yes, it would be directly west of the Losey Center. [00:37:13] Speaker 1: Okay. Now, in a couple of the other exhibits, we saw a tent that was down set up in the courtyard. Can you see that tent set up in the courtyard in this photograph? [00:37:22] Christopher Bagley: You cannot. In this picture, you can't. It would be where I explained where the Hall of Flags is. It's directly underneath the Hall of Flags, like just on the grass right there. [00:37:31] Speaker 1: Okay. Can someone, is there a clear line of sight between the tent and the top of the Losey Center, the rooftop? [00:37:38] Christopher Bagley: Yes, there is. [00:37:39] Speaker 1: Okay. Is some of it obstructed? [00:37:41] Christopher Bagley: Yes. [00:37:42] Speaker 1: Obstructed by what? [00:37:43] Christopher Bagley: The Sorenson Building that's right here, this white roof that's going to be, this kind of obstructs a little bit of the view of the courtyard. [00:37:51] Speaker 1: So where would you have to be standing or perhaps lying down on the Losey Center to see into the courtyard where that tent was? [00:37:58] Christopher Bagley: On the far south side of the Losey Building, you could have a line of sight towards the courtyard. [00:38:03] Speaker 1: And that's the top roof? [00:38:04] Christopher Bagley: The top roof, yes. [00:38:05] Speaker 1: With the darker shade of gray? Yes. Okay. Thank you, officer. I am going to refer the witness now to Stace Exhibit No. 35. And officer Bagley, when you see that, go ahead and let me know. Do you recognize what that is, officer? [00:38:49] Christopher Bagley: I don't have it yet. [00:38:51] Speaker 1: Okay. So we don't have this in electronic form? We do. Okay. Well, I'll refer you to the exhibit that's to your left and behind you. Do you see that? [00:39:14] Christopher Bagley: I do. [00:39:14] Speaker 1: And it's marked as states exhibit 35 with a yellow sticker, is that correct? [00:39:19] Christopher Bagley: Yes, I can see that on the top left of the photo. [00:39:23] Speaker 1: Well, for the record, if we can publish that on the witness's screen. [00:39:30] Speaker 2: Thank you, Mr. Grudenander. I was just going to mention that we shouldn't display it until it's been admitted in. [00:39:35] Speaker 1: Do you see states exhibit 35 in your monitor? [00:39:48] Christopher Bagley: Yes, I do. [00:39:48] Speaker 1: Okay. Can you, do you recognize that? [00:39:51] Christopher Bagley: Yes, I do. [00:39:52] Speaker 1: And what is that? [00:39:53] Christopher Bagley: This is an aerial view of the campus and the northeast area, just north of the campus neighborhoods of Utah Valley University in Orem. [00:40:01] Speaker 1: Okay. And how can you personally tell that this is a photograph of that, of the campus and the neighborhood to the northeast of campus? [00:40:15] Christopher Bagley: I can tell because I recognize all the buildings, the roads that are around it, the streets, the roundabouts, the neighborhood to the north or towards the top of the building, or picture also. [00:40:27] Speaker 1: Now, I've asked you about several buildings and landmarks on campus. Are you able to see the courtyard on this exhibit? [00:40:35] Christopher Bagley: Yes, you are. [00:40:37] Speaker 1: And just for the record, can you describe where this is located on the exhibit? [00:40:42] Christopher Bagley: So, right in the center, towards the bottom, there's a white triangle roof. That's white. That would be the Sorenson Building. It's the patch of grass that's just directly south of, towards the bottom of that on the picture. So, it's kind of centered, but more towards the bottom, right in the middle. [00:41:00] Speaker 1: On this exhibit, are you able to see the Fugle Building? [00:41:03] Christopher Bagley: Yes, I am. [00:41:04] Speaker 1: And in relationship to this courtyard, where is that located? [00:41:07] Christopher Bagley: That's going to be south of the courtyard with the white roof. [00:41:11] Speaker 1: What about the Woodbury Business Building? [00:41:14] Christopher Bagley: Woodbury Business Building is going to be to the east, and it's going to have a red brick path top. [00:41:21] Speaker 1: Okay. Can you see the Hall of Flags on this? [00:41:27] Christopher Bagley: Yes, you can. [00:41:29] Speaker 1: And where is that located in relationship to the courtyard again? [00:41:32] Christopher Bagley: It's directly west of the courtyard. [00:41:35] Speaker 1: And the Losi Center, can you see the Losi Center? [00:41:38] Christopher Bagley: Yes, you can see the Losi Center. Where is that at? It's going to be kind of northeast of the courtyard. The two patches of gray that's almost in the center of the picture, just to the slight right of the center. [00:41:51] Speaker 1: Okay. I've asked you previously about the LDS Institute Building. Can you see that on this exhibit? [00:41:56] Christopher Bagley: Yes, you can. [00:41:57] Speaker 1: And where is that located in relationship to the Losi Center? [00:42:00] Christopher Bagley: It's directly north of the Losi Center. It's got a white roof, and it's almost directly in the center of the photo. Okay. [00:42:06] Speaker 1: And we've talked about a parking structure that's nearby the Institute Building. Do you see that? [00:42:12] Christopher Bagley: Yes, it's just to the west or left side of the picture of the Institute Building. [00:42:17] Speaker 1: Okay. Is this a fair and accurate depiction of Utah Valley University's campus and the surrounding neighborhood to the north and east on September 10th, 2025? [00:42:33] Christopher Bagley: Yes. [00:42:34] Speaker 1: The state offers state's exhibit 35. [00:42:38] Speaker 5: Your Honor, renew the standing objection and object on the grounds that there's no indication on this photograph of when it was taken in terms of relation to the actual incident at issue here. [00:42:50] Speaker 2: Thank you, Ms. Nestor. [00:42:51] Speaker 1: Thank you, Mr. Gernander. Same response, Judge, but I would just add one more case for the court's benefit. This is State v. Wager, or WAGER, W-A-G-E-R. This is a Utah Court of Appeals case from 2016. The citation is 372 Pacific 3rd 91, and the significance of this case, Your Honor, at issue there was a photograph of the defendant there who was smoking methamphetamine, allegedly, in his bathroom. The witness that was testifying that laying the foundation at trial was not present when the photograph was taken, could not tell the date on which it was taken, but he had been in the bathroom before, was familiar with the defendant's bathroom, and familiar with the defendant. He testified to that personal knowledge, and the court found that was sufficient foundation. So that case, in addition to the other case, the Purcell case, and my previous arguments, and I'll submit it to the court. [00:43:55] Speaker 2: Ms. Nestor, anything else you wish to add? Yeah, Your Honor. All right. Given the testimony of the witness who's testified he's familiar with this location, he went in detail describing the various neighborhoods and location. He mentioned the roundabout and identified the buildings in State's Exhibit 35, and it was noted that it is a fair and accurate representation of this campus. As of September 10th, 2025, the court is going to overrule the objection, and State's Exhibit 35 is admitted into evidence and may be published. Thank you, Judge. [00:44:36] Speaker 1: The state moves to publish it, and if granted, may I approach the exhibit? [00:44:42] Speaker 2: You may. [00:44:46] Speaker 1: Officer, I've asked you about a number of the buildings located on campus. I'm just going to ask you a couple of questions about those and to help orient the court to what the judge is looking at, and then ask you about some of the streets in the neighborhood, okay? For the court's benefit, can you point out where the LDS Institute building is? [00:45:21] Christopher Bagley: Yes, I can. [00:45:22] Speaker 1: And I'm going to approach the witness again, if you could describe where it's at on that Exhibit 35. [00:45:27] Christopher Bagley: Okay. Okay, can you hear me? [00:45:36] Speaker 1: Yes. [00:45:36] Christopher Bagley: So you want the LDS Institute building? Yes, please. That is this white roof right here, is the Institute building. [00:45:43] Speaker 1: Is that in basically the center of the exhibit? [00:45:47] Christopher Bagley: It's almost exactly in the center of the exhibit. [00:45:49] Speaker 1: Okay, and where is the low C center located on that? [00:45:53] Christopher Bagley: If you were to go down towards the bottom of the photo, there's two different graves of gravel on this roof. This would be the low C building right here. [00:46:00] Speaker 1: So below the Institute building and to the right slightly? Slightly to the right. Can you point out for the court's benefit where the courtyard is? [00:46:09] Christopher Bagley: The courtyard is going to be to the west or left side of the picture. There's some grass in between two buildings. I have a white roofs. There would be a grass area right there with some steps. That is going to be the courtyard area, and that's going to be down towards the center or bottom of the photo. [00:46:25] Speaker 1: So that's to the left and down? Yes. Okay. You mentioned the parking structure. Where's the parking structure next to the Institute building? [00:46:33] Christopher Bagley: There's two Institute buildings right here in the center with the white roof. The parking structure is going to be just to the left of the Institute or west side. There's a road in between it called the Heat Plant Road, which is the road that goes between those two. [00:46:45] Speaker 1: And can you point out for the court's benefit how one would enter that or exit that parking structure by way of vehicle or walking? [00:46:55] Christopher Bagley: By entering, you can enter and exit right here on the north side of the parking structure. There's an entrance and exit right here. That's into level one. For a vehicle? For vehicles. [00:47:06] Speaker 1: And I guess someone could walk in there as well. [00:47:08] Christopher Bagley: Yes. If they were to park into this LDS Institute parking lot over here on the north side of that, there's a tunnel that goes underneath the road. That still comes out into the parking structure itself. And then they can exit out here on the second level onto Heat Plant Road, which would be, is that road between the LDS Institute building and the parking structure, as the Heat Plant. They can exit there and go back towards Campus Drive. So you could walk out either up here on the northeast side of the parking structure and cross over to the LDS Institute. Or you can come out here to the southeast side. And you can exit there and walk down to the courtyard or behind the LDS Institute building towards the Losi Center. [00:47:50] Speaker 1: Okay. Thank you. You mentioned Campus Drive. Where is Campus Drive located on that? [00:47:55] Christopher Bagley: Campus Drive starts right up here towards the top left of the picture. It's almost like a T. And it's the curb road that comes all the way down in front of the Institute building and the parking structure. And it goes all the way around Campus, comes back down to the bottom of the picture where the roundabout is, and that would be Campus Drive. [00:48:12] Speaker 1: Okay. Are you familiar with where 800 South is in Orem? [00:48:17] Christopher Bagley: Yes. [00:48:17] Speaker 1: Is that depicted on this exhibit? [00:48:19] Christopher Bagley: It is. [00:48:20] Speaker 1: Where is that at? [00:48:21] Christopher Bagley: It's at the top of this photo. It's going to be the long straight road. That's right here at the top of the photo. [00:48:25] Speaker 1: Okay. What about 850 South? Are you familiar with that street? [00:48:31] Christopher Bagley: I am. 850 South is going to be towards the right of the photo, top right of it. There's going to be a street that goes east to west. It looks like a horseshoe, kind of. It's going to be the road that goes east to west in the middle of that horseshoe. 850. [00:48:45] Speaker 1: Okay. So 850 is parallel to 800 South. [00:48:49] Christopher Bagley: Yes. [00:48:50] Speaker 1: And just below on this photograph. [00:48:52] Christopher Bagley: Yes. [00:48:53] Speaker 1: Okay. Are you familiar with 600 West? [00:48:55] Christopher Bagley: I am. [00:48:56] Speaker 1: And where is that street in relationship to 850 South? [00:49:00] Christopher Bagley: That would be on the far right side of the horseshoe, so towards the right side of the picture, and it's going to be the right side of that horseshoe. [00:49:07] Speaker 1: And that runs north and south? [00:49:09] Christopher Bagley: North and south. [00:49:10] Speaker 1: Okay. What about 720 West? Are you familiar with that street? [00:49:14] Christopher Bagley: Yes, I am. [00:49:14] Speaker 1: And where is that at? [00:49:15] Christopher Bagley: That's going to be to the left side of the horseshoe. That runs north and south, and it comes down towards the bottom. [00:49:22] Speaker 1: Okay. And finally, 925 South. 925 South. Is that depicted? [00:49:27] Christopher Bagley: It's going to be on the bottom of the horseshoe that connects those other two west. [00:49:32] Speaker 1: Okay. So just in summary, will you describe the horseshoe and what streets amount make up that horseshoe? [00:49:40] Christopher Bagley: So the horseshoe comes up off of 800 South, and directly south of that, you'll have 850 South, which is going to be running east to west. On the left side is 725 West of the horseshoe, and it comes down into 925 South, which wraps back around to 600 West on the far right side of the horseshoe, on the right side of the picture. Thank you, officer. Okay. Thank you, officer. [00:50:04] Speaker 1: You can be seated. Okay. I'm going to take you back to September 10th, 2025. You mentioned you were on campus. You had a particular assignment. [00:50:22] Speaker ?: Yes. [00:50:23] Speaker 2: Mr. Gernander, I'm sorry. We're just going to pull down the exhibits. [00:50:27] Speaker ?: Okay. [00:50:28] Speaker 2: Thank you. You may continue. Would you like me to take this exhibit down, Judge? Are you referring to it in your line of questioning right now? Not right now, I'm not. Okay. Let's go ahead and take it down. [00:50:38] Speaker 1: So you were securing the Hall of Flags walkway, correct? Yes. On the south end? Yes. What was happening that morning, that day on campus at UVU? [00:50:53] Christopher Bagley: I came in to do a shift for a special event where we had a guest speaker come in and was going to talk to the students and people around the neighborhood. [00:51:02] Speaker 1: Do you know who the guest speaker was? [00:51:04] Christopher Bagley: I do. [00:51:04] Speaker 1: And who was that? [00:51:05] Christopher Bagley: It was Charlie Kirk. [00:51:07] Speaker 1: Did you see Mr. Kirk that day? [00:51:09] Christopher Bagley: I did. [00:51:09] Speaker 1: When did you first see him? [00:51:11] Christopher Bagley: When he arrived on campus, just behind the west side of the Hall of Flags, I saw him pull up. [00:51:21] Speaker 1: And can someone access the courtyard through that area? [00:51:25] Christopher Bagley: Yes, they can. How so? Where he pulled up underneath the Hall of Flags is an opening to where you can drive a car underneath. So there's access right there. You can walk or drive underneath the Hall of Flags. [00:51:37] Speaker 1: And you saw him arrive? [00:51:39] Christopher Bagley: Yes. [00:51:39] Speaker 1: Okay. Can you describe what you were seeing? What did you observe? [00:51:47] Christopher Bagley: On that day, I observed Charlie going back, doing some meet and greet with some people, getting some photos taken. He then came underneath the Hall of Flags and went to his tent and he was there answering questions and talking to individuals that would ask him questions. [00:52:06] Speaker 1: The tent you're referring to, is that the tent that we see when it was set up in the courtyard? [00:52:10] Christopher Bagley: Yeah, that white square tent. [00:52:11] Speaker 1: The white top? [00:52:12] Christopher Bagley: Yes, he was under that. [00:52:15] Speaker 1: Fast forward to about 12:20 or so, so a little bit after noon, the noon hour. What happened? What did you see and what did you hear? [00:52:24] Christopher Bagley: I heard an individual talking to Charlie and I happened to kind of glance over the edge of the railing about that time. I could see the right side of Charlie's shoulder, so not his whole body because he was underneath the tent, so I could only see probably the right side of his body. He was answering a question, the kid asking him a question, and then I heard a shot fired. [00:52:46] Speaker 1: Do you know what time that was? [00:52:48] Christopher Bagley: Yes. [00:52:48] Speaker 1: What time was that? [00:52:49] Christopher Bagley: 12:23. [00:52:52] Speaker 1: What did you see? [00:52:54] Christopher Bagley: At that moment, I saw him lean to the left, so I- [00:52:57] Speaker 1: When you say him, you see- [00:52:58] Christopher Bagley: Charlie. Charlie. [00:52:59] Speaker ?: Charlie. [00:52:59] Christopher Bagley: Charlie. So I saw him go to the left because I could no longer see the right side of his body, so he went further underneath the tent to the north side of the tent, so left. [00:53:09] Speaker 1: Ok, can you describe the reaction of others that were there? [00:53:14] Christopher Bagley: Yeah, so then everybody started getting up and starting to run, and more of a chaos kind of situation. [00:53:23] Speaker 1: Before you continue, can you describe a little bit, so you mentioned Mr. Kirk was answering questions, talking to individuals. Yes. Were there others present? [00:53:32] Christopher Bagley: Yes. [00:53:33] Speaker 1: Any idea about approximately how many? How would you describe it in your terms? [00:53:37] Christopher Bagley: In my terms, I'd say, when I was up there looking down, I'd say there were several thousand people, because you had it on the grass, it was jam-packed in the amphitheater sitting on the grass. You had people standing on the back up along the cement, you had people that were on the second level, the Sorenson, and over by the Woodbury building. There was another level there where a lot of people were standing and watching, so it was pretty packed, several thousand people. [00:54:00] Speaker 1: You mentioned, so you mentioned you heard something. What did you hear again? [00:54:03] Christopher Bagley: I heard a gunshot. [00:54:04] Speaker 1: Okay, and can you describe Mr. Kirk's reaction? Was that simultaneous to hearing the gunshot? Yes, it was. When he fell to the left? [00:54:15] Christopher Bagley: Yes. [00:54:16] Speaker 1: Did you see the reaction from the crowd? [00:54:18] Christopher Bagley: Yes. [00:54:18] Speaker 1: What was that? [00:54:19] Christopher Bagley: Everybody kind of got up, they all said, a lot of people were screaming, standing up, and starting to run in all different directions, away from the center of the tent. [00:54:28] Speaker 1: Okay, you're a police officer, helping to secure the area, correct? Yes. What did you do? [00:54:34] Christopher Bagley: At that moment, I recognized it as gunfire, I left my post, which was right there on the south end of the Hall of Flags. I proceeded to, right where the fugal and the Hall of Flags meet, there's some outside stairs that I was starting to run down. As I was trying to get down to the bottom of the stairs, people were running up, people were laying down on the steps. I'm trying to jump over people to get to the bottom of the stairs, so I can help stop an individual that's probably shooting. [00:55:00] Speaker 1: What happened next? [00:55:03] Christopher Bagley: By the time I got to the bottom of the stairs, I was informed on the radio that we had a shooter in custody. So, I thought, at that moment, I was like, well, that was kind of fast, obviously it was close range probably, because we had an individual in custody. Another officer came on, said we had an individual in custody. So, I decided to, since the threat is gone, now I can assess for anybody that's injured and start looking for any medical needs that's needed at that moment. I started canvassing the area. As I canvassed the area, I was looking for anybody that was injured. I saw a kid on the ground that was on about the second or third tier in the grass, next to a wheelchair, and he was almost convulsing. I thought he'd maybe been shot. I talked to the dad as I was running over there. He said that he was just having a seizure, that he was fine, he was not injured. So, then at that moment, I observed that there was no other injuries that I could see at that moment. [00:55:57] Speaker 1: Okay. Was your attention drawn to anything else at that time? [00:56:02] Christopher Bagley: Yeah, so, after we got some people kind of cleared away a little bit, I thought I needed to start preserving the scene, because we had a crime scene. And with some of my experience and training to that effect, I decided now we need to contain the scene and help preserve as much evidence as we can. So, I started pushing people off the grass, out of the courtyard area, because I knew that's where the crime scene was. As soon as we started pushing those guys out, my chief, Chief Long, that was right next to me, I looked down and saw an empty pistol holder that was sitting just on top of the grass. And at that moment, things had died down just a split second. I realized that the shot I heard was more of a rifle shot and not a pistol shot. [00:56:45] Speaker 1: And what causes you to say that? [00:56:49] Christopher Bagley: Just from being around firearms through all my trainings, the difference is, you know, a handgun is more of a short bang pop sound. With a rifle, you have more of a longer violent crackle sound, it's more of a violent kind of sound, it's longer. So, that's why I recognized it. Okay. [00:57:11] Speaker 1: Is a rifle sound louder, typically? Yes. Okay. Going back to when you heard this gunshot, could you tell where it came from, from the direction? [00:57:26] Christopher Bagley: Yes. I knew it came from the east of me. [00:57:29] Speaker 1: From the east of you. Okay. So, you see this, this realization comes to your mind. What did you do next? [00:57:35] Christopher Bagley: At that moment, when I saw the holster, the empty holster, I turned to my chief and I said, "That was a rifle shot." And he said, "I agree." And I looked up at that moment, right in the line of sight, I could see the Losi building had a direct line of sight. So, I proceeded to go look at that and see what was going on up there. [00:57:54] Speaker 1: Okay. Can you just briefly describe your route to the Losi Center? [00:57:59] Christopher Bagley: So, from the courtyard, you can go into the Sorenson Center, and like I said earlier, there was, on level one, there's some elevators or there's stairs. I ran up four flights of stairs, got to the fourth level of the Losi building, and proceeded to the south of the Losi building. There's some stairs, which is that breezeway between the computer science building and the Losi building. There's some stairs that go up to the top of that, and so I went to the top of that. [00:58:27] Speaker 1: Is that stairway that you previously described? [00:58:30] Christopher Bagley: Yes, on the outside of the Losi building. Okay. [00:58:33] Speaker 1: And it's a public stairway? Yeah. Okay. Did you make it to the rooftop? I did. Do you know about what time you got there? [00:58:42] Christopher Bagley: I got there 12:44. Okay. What did you do when you got on top? When I got on top, I hopped over the guardrail. I noticed that there was an object which was sitting right about 10 or 15 feet in from the other side of the guardrail in the gravel. That looked out of place to me. [00:59:03] Speaker 1: And in relationship to where you hopped over the guardrail, what direction was that object? To the west of the guardrail. [00:59:10] Christopher Bagley: Okay. And did you recognize the object? [00:59:12] Speaker 1: I did. And what was it? It was a red and black screwdriver. Okay. [00:59:16] Christopher Bagley: Did you touch that object? [00:59:17] Speaker 1: I did not. [00:59:18] Christopher Bagley: Okay. [00:59:19] Speaker 1: Okay. I am going to refer the witness on your screen, Officer Bagley, to State's Exhibit 3.1. Let me know when you see that. Yes, I see it. Do you recognize what that is? I do. And what is that? [00:59:40] Christopher Bagley: It's a picture of the screwdriver that I saw that day on top of the rooftop of the Losi Building. Okay. [00:59:53] Speaker 1: And that's how it appeared on the roof that day? [00:59:56] Christopher Bagley: Yes. [00:59:57] Speaker 1: Is that a fair and accurate portrayal of the screwdriver you observed and found that day? Yes. You're on the state offers, State's Exhibit 3.1. Ms. Nestor. [01:00:07] Speaker 5: Your Honor, we renew -- excuse me -- we renew our standing objection and object on the grounds that there's no foundation laid as to when the photo was taken or by home. Thank you. [01:00:19] Speaker 1: Same response, Judge. My previous arguments. [01:00:23] Speaker 2: And did you state that this was a fair and accurate representation as of September 10th, 2021? [01:00:30] Speaker 1: I had said that day. I'll ask it again. All right. To the officer. You saw this screwdriver you're describing on September 10th, 2025. Is that correct? Yes. Is State's Exhibit 3.1 a fair and accurate depiction of that screwdriver that day, September 10th, 2025? Yes. All right. State moves to admit. I will go ahead and admit. [01:00:52] Speaker 2: I will go ahead and admit. State's Exhibit 3.1 is admitted based off of the first-hand knowledge of this -- what this image purports to be and is a fair and accurate representation as this item on that date of September 10th, 2025, and this exhibit may be published. [01:01:16] Speaker 1: Your Honor, before we continue to publish it and ask a few more questions, right now might be a good time to take a break. All right. If that's okay at the court. [01:01:25] Speaker 2: All right. Let's come back at -- it's 10:43. Let's go ahead and come back -- well, 10:44. Let's come back at 11:00 and then we'll resume direct examination. Court is in a brief recess. Please be seated. Court is back in session. Before we get started, I want to clarify on the record that pursuant to the Utah Constitution Section 1 -- I'm sorry, Article 1, Section 28, where victims and victims' representatives are entitled to be treated with dignity and respect, that if they choose to leave the courtroom, they can come back whenever they wish. They're not prohibited to coming back solely at the break. So I just wanted to clarify that in case there was any question about that. In addition, I want to talk about the exhibits as it relates to their admission and publication of the exhibit. So whenever there is an objection to an exhibit, I would ask that the attorneys are clear specifically what they're objecting to. There's basically three levels of objections that could be objected to. First, the admittance of the exhibit itself. Second is the publication of the exhibit to the gallery. And third is the publication which is electronically captured by the media. So, counsel, I'll leave it to you in regards to what you object to or what you wish to respond to. If no objection to the publication media capture of the exhibit is specifically raised, the court will presume there's no objection. So, being that the monitor was introduced today by the court, I wanted to offer that guidance to the parties in regards to your objections. With that, let's go ahead and return to the witnesses. I do note for the record that the council is present and all the parties are present. And let's go ahead and proceed. Mr. Grunander. [01:03:46] Speaker 1: Thank you, Your Honor. We left off Officer Bagley with just having admitted State's Exhibit 3.1. I believe the court also granted our motion to publish 3.1. So, we would move, we would ask the court to publish that to the gallery. All right. [01:04:03] Speaker 2: Mr. Grunander. Any, to the, Ms. Nestor, any thoughts? Mr. Grunander. All right. We'll go ahead and publish Exhibit 3.1. [01:04:10] Speaker ?: Thank you. Thank you. Mr. Grunander. [01:04:41] Speaker 2: It looks like it's just taking a second to come up on the screen. Let's go ahead and unplug and re-plug in the monitor to see if that brings it back to life. [01:05:08] Speaker ?: Mr. Grunander. [01:05:09] Speaker 2: To display. [01:05:38] Speaker ?: Mr. Grunander. All right. [01:05:39] Speaker 2: It looks like it's noticing a flicker on my screen here. Mr. Grunander. All right. Mr. Grunander. All right. [01:05:48] Speaker ?: Mr. Grunander. Yes. [01:05:49] Speaker 2: Mr. Grunander. All right. Mr. Grunander. [01:05:52] Speaker ?: Mr. Grunander. All right. Mr. Grunander. All right. Mr. Grunander. All right. Mr. Grunander. All right. Mr. Grunander. [01:06:01] Speaker 1: All right. [01:06:02] Speaker 2: Mr. Grunander. [01:06:03] Speaker ?: All right. Mr. Grunander. Thank you, Judge. Officer Bagley. [01:06:07] Speaker 1: So, you testified that this is the screwdriver as you saw it on September 10th, 2025, correct? Yes. [01:06:18] Christopher Bagley: Mr. Grunander. [01:06:19] Speaker 1: I'm going to -- and this was on top of which roof? The Low C building. [01:06:24] Christopher Bagley: Mr. Grunander. [01:06:25] Speaker 1: And in relationship to the entrance, the stairway, and when you hopped over the rail to get there, [01:06:31] Christopher Bagley: where was it located? About 10 or 15 feet in. Mr. Okay. [01:06:34] Speaker 1: If I could, Your Honor, bring up state's exhibit number two that was previously admitted. All right. I would like to have Officer Bagley come down from the witness stand and point on that exhibit where -- approximately where this screwdriver was located and describe it for the record. [01:06:54] Speaker 2: All right. You may step down. And if you have a microphone for him as well. Mr. I think there was one up there. Oh, here we go. [01:07:00] Speaker 1: Mr. So if you can describe where you saw that screwdriver point to that. Mr. Yeah. [01:07:15] Christopher Bagley: So this is the Low C building right here. It's light gray. Here's the guardrail in the center of the picture with the red brick. Just over that, about 10, 15 feet in, about right there. [01:07:24] Speaker 1: Mr. About right there. Okay. Now, on this exhibit, Exhibit 3.1, there's an evidence tag. The evidence tag, yellow number five, was that present when you found the screwdriver? Mr. No. Mr. Okay. So that was left there by an evidence tag? Mr. Yes. Mr. Okay. Thank you. You can take your seat again. Officer, I'm going to direct your attention to your monitor again. And have you look at States Exhibit 3.2. And if you'll let me know when you see that. [01:08:07] Christopher Bagley: Mr. Okay, I see it. Mr. Okay. [01:08:11] Speaker 1: And can you tell us what that is? [01:08:13] Christopher Bagley: Mr. Yes, that's a picture of the top of the Low C building looking west. Mr. Okay. [01:08:19] Speaker 1: And how do you know that that is, in fact, the top of the Low C center looking west? [01:08:23] Christopher Bagley: Mr. I can see the landmarks of several buildings that the Fugle buildings on the top left of it. You've got on the right is a white roof, which is the Sorenson building on the right side of the picture. Mr. This is also the gravel area on top of the Low C building. [01:08:38] Speaker 1: Mr. Okay. Mr. Can you see the courtyard from this exhibit? [01:08:42] Christopher Bagley: Mr. Yes, a little bit. [01:08:44] Speaker 1: Mr. What about the tent that was set up that Mr. Kirk was underneath? Mr. Yes. Mr. Okay, what about the Hall of Flags? [01:08:50] Christopher Bagley: Mr. Yes. [01:08:51] Speaker 1: Mr. Did you mention that this was facing west? What direction are we looking? [01:08:59] Christopher Bagley: Mr. We're looking west towards Utah Lake. [01:09:02] Speaker 1: Mr. Okay. Officer, is this a fair and accurate depiction of what you observed on September 10th, 2025 on top of the Low C building? Mr. Yes. Mr. State offers State's Exhibit 3.2, Judge. Mr. Ms. Nestor. [01:09:20] Speaker 5: Your Honor, I think that we renew our standing objection. There is an evidence tag here, which begs the question that it's not a fair and accurate representation of how he saw it. And we also don't have any indication about when this picture was taken or by whom. So we object to its admission. [01:09:39] Speaker 2: I see. Thank you. Mr. Grunandor. [01:09:42] Speaker 1: Officer, one more question, Judge. Officer Bagley, apart from the evidence tag, do you see an evidence tag on that photograph? Mr. Yes, I do. Mr. Was that present when you were on top of the Low C center and observed this? [01:09:54] Christopher Bagley: Mr. That was not. [01:09:55] Speaker 1: Mr. Okay. Otherwise, is it fair and accurate? [01:09:57] Christopher Bagley: Mr. Yes. [01:09:58] Speaker 1: Mr. State moves to admit. Anything further? [01:10:00] Speaker 2: Mr. No, Your Honor. [01:10:01] Speaker 5: Mr. All right. [01:10:02] Speaker 2: Thank you. Mr. Given that the follow up question, noting that the evidence tag, it appears to be number two on States Exhibit 3.2 was not present, but otherwise it is a fair and accurate representation as stated by the witness to States Exhibit 3.2, the court will admit it into evidence and it may be published at the discretion of or the request of counsel. [01:10:30] Speaker 1: Mr. You're on the state would move to publish it. Mr. All right. Mr. Officer Bagley, will you describe what it is that we're looking at here? [01:10:47] Christopher Bagley: Mr. Yes. Mr. Okay. Mr. On the top of the photo, you've got the mountain range on the back. Mr. That's going to be looking west. Mr. You also have Utah Lake, which is towards the top of it. Mr. As you come down towards the center on the top, you've got a pond, which is the ponds over at Utah Valley University. Mr. I've come down from that, from where the water meets that red brick part, more towards the center is the Hall of Flags. Mr. And just below that where you can see the grass and the white tent is where Charlie Kirk was sitting looking west and we're on top of the Loci building. [01:11:19] Speaker 1: Mr. And is this depicting a particular corner of the Loci rooftop? [01:11:24] Christopher Bagley: Mr. Yes, it is. [01:11:25] Speaker 1: Mr. And this is the top rooftop? Mr. Yes. Mr. Is it the same level where we observed the atrium that's to the north? [01:11:32] Christopher Bagley: Mr. The atrium is up just a little bit higher. So this is the top level of four. [01:11:37] Speaker 1: Mr. Level four, okay. And what area of the rooftop are we looking at here? [01:11:42] Christopher Bagley: Mr. As far as the gravel? Mr. Southwest side of the Loci building. [01:11:46] Speaker 1: Mr. Southwest side, okay. Is there a line of sight down into the courtyard? Mr. Yes, there is. Mr. In that area? Okay. What else do you observe on this exhibit that's significant to you, officer? [01:11:59] Christopher Bagley: Mr. There's some disturbance in the gravel right where, and around the area where the, in the area where the yellow marker is. Mr. Is there was some disturbance that caught my eye there. [01:12:10] Speaker 1: Mr. Okay. And does this photograph do it justice? Mr. No. Mr. And how so? [01:12:18] Christopher Bagley: Mr. You can't really see the impression I saw the time of when I was up there on that day. Mr. I saw a distinct impression in the gravel, and this does not show that. [01:12:29] Speaker 1: Mr. Okay, so you could see more with the naked eye? Mr. Yes. Mr. Okay. Mr. I'm going to refer the witness to States Exhibit 4 on your monitor there, and let me know when you can see that. [01:12:50] Christopher Bagley: Mr. Okay, I can see it. [01:12:53] Speaker 1: Mr. And do you recognize that exhibit? [01:12:56] Christopher Bagley: Mr. I do. [01:12:57] Speaker 1: Mr. And what is that? [01:12:58] Christopher Bagley: Mr. This is a nighttime view of that same photo. Mr. That was just last, same view, looking west, and I can see the disturbance in the gravel. [01:13:07] Speaker 1: Mr. And what tells you that this is the same photograph as the last one, as Exhibit 3.2? [01:13:15] Christopher Bagley: Mr. You can see the hall of flags that's almost the top of the photo in the middle. Mr. You've got the hall of flags. Mr. You can see the tent in the grass area, the direct line of sight with the Sorenson Building, and I'm on top of the gravel of the Loci Building southwest side. [01:13:30] Speaker 1: Mr. Is there also an LDS temple that's depicted in that photograph? Mr. There is. [01:13:34] Christopher Bagley: Mr. It's going to be on the top left of the photo. Mr. It's lit up. [01:13:37] Speaker 1: Mr. Okay. Mr. Do you know who took this photo? Mr. I do. Mr. And who took this photo? [01:13:45] Christopher Bagley: Mr. Melissa Richards. [01:13:46] Speaker 1: Mr. And who is Melissa Richards? [01:13:49] Christopher Bagley: Mr. She's the lead senior forensic forensic for the state of Utah. Mr. Okay. Mr. Examiner. [01:13:58] Speaker 1: Mr. And how do you know that she took this photograph? [01:14:02] Christopher Bagley: Mr. I spoke to her. [01:14:04] Speaker 1: Mr. Okay. [01:14:05] Speaker 5: Mr. Let's renew the objection to hear her say that's an outstanding objection. [01:14:12] Speaker 2: Mr. Thank you. Mr. Grudenander, do you want to respond to the objection about hearsay? [01:14:17] Speaker 1: Mr. Yes, Judge. Under Rule 1102, hearsay is admissible to establish the foundation for or the authenticity of any exhibit. That's found in 1102, sub B, sub 3. Mr. I would also point out for the court that under Rule 1101, which is the applicability of the rules, in subsection C1, the determination of questions of fact preliminary to admissibility of evidence, when it's determined under Rule 104, which are preliminary questions, the rules of evidence do not apply. Dr. 104 speaks directly to providing Lane foundation for an exhibit, so even at trial hearsay is admissible to establish the foundation of an exhibit. I would also just point the court to State v. Griffin. Dr. Griffin. This is a 2016 Utah Supreme Court case. The citation is 384 Pacific 3rd 186, which stands for hearsay evidence is admissible to establish the foundation of an exhibit, even at trial. And we're at a preliminary hearing today, Judge. [01:15:32] Speaker ?: All right. [01:15:33] Speaker 2: Anything further, Ms. Nestor, before I issue a ruling? [01:15:36] Speaker 5: Aye, Your Honor. All right. [01:15:38] Speaker 2: I'm going to overrule the objection to hearsay. I note the standing objection by defense. I also note that Rule 1102, and I also look to Article 1, Section 12 of the Utah Constitution, which states nothing in this Constitution shall preclude the use of reliable hearsay evidence as defined by statute. or rule in whole or in part at any preliminary examination to determine probable cause or at any pretrial proceeding with respect to release of defendant if appropriate discovery is allowed as defined by statute or rule. For those reasons, I'm going to overrule the objection, and as it relates to reliable hearsay, in this instance, you may proceed. [01:16:26] Speaker 1: Officer Bagley, did you ask Ms. Richards if this was a fair and accurate depiction of this scene on the Losey Building on the night of September 10th, 2025? [01:16:37] Christopher Bagley: Yes. [01:16:38] Speaker 1: And what did she tell you? She said it was. Okay. Your Honor, the State Offers States Exhibit 4. [01:16:44] Speaker 2: Ms. Nestor. [01:16:46] Speaker 5: Just object to relying on what Ms. Richards told him in terms of creating the foundation and refer back to our standing objection. [01:16:55] Speaker 2: The State will submit it. All right. Well, as I look at State's Exhibit 4, and again, I'm just looking at it before me, it said it was a fair and accurate representation. There's a notation, I mean, in the previous exhibits, there's a marker, exhibit marker, and I see two, but it also appears to be other artifacts on this image that I haven't heard any testimony about. And so-- I will follow up, Judge. All right. [01:17:24] Speaker 1: Officer Bagley, do you see an evidence tag in that exhibit? [01:17:28] Christopher Bagley: Yes, I do, a number two. [01:17:30] Speaker 1: A number two, and that's yellow and black? Yes. Do you see other evidence markers that are red in color? [01:17:36] Christopher Bagley: Yes. They are, to me, they're orange, but they're triangular shaped. [01:17:40] Speaker 1: Okay. Were those markers, the evidence tag two, as well as the orange or red markers, present when you observed that scene that day? [01:17:51] Christopher Bagley: No. [01:17:52] Speaker 1: Okay. Were they present, however, when Ms. Richards took this photograph? Yes. And she indicated to you that that is a fair and accurate representation of what she observed that night? Yes. State would move to admit, Exhibit 4, Judge. Ms. Nestor? [01:18:08] Speaker 2: Objections, Your Honor? Thank you, Ms. Nestor. I'm going to go ahead and overrule the objection, noting that the marker, evidence marker, as well as the red or orange markers, I can't tell which color it is, was not present originally. With those included information, State's Exhibit 4 is admitted into evidence and may be published. Thank you. [01:18:34] Speaker ?: Thank you. [01:18:35] Speaker 2: The State would move to publish that. [01:18:37] Speaker 1: All right. And I would ask for the witness to come down to explain the exhibit. [01:18:48] Speaker 2: All right, Officer, if you'd like to step down, use the microphone, and as previously noted, describe, when you're describing something on the image, where it is located on the image for the benefit of our recording. [01:19:02] Speaker 1: So, Officer, will you describe for the court what it is that you're looking at? [01:19:09] Christopher Bagley: So, what I'm looking at is, I'm on top of the Loci building, which is where the gravel is, towards the bottom center. I'm looking west towards the tent, which is in the upper center, that you have a white tent. You can see the grass down there in the amphitheater. You've got the hall of flags that's more towards the top center, and behind that you've got I-15. But what I'm looking at is in the disturbance of the gravels, what I saw that day. [01:19:36] Speaker 1: Okay, and what can you describe for the record that disturbance? [01:19:39] Christopher Bagley: To me, when I got up there and I could see the disturbance of the gravel, to me it looks like a sniper pad, a person that has been laid in a prone position, and you've got markings of elbows, knees, and feet, where somebody was in the line of sight of where Charlie's tent was. [01:19:58] Speaker 1: Thank you. And if we could, again, take the, if we could publish State's Exhibit #2. You recognize that, right, officer? Yes, I do. Where on the Loci rooftop did you observe this disturbance in the gravel? Can you point to that? [01:20:21] Christopher Bagley: If you go to the center of the picture, and the darker gray part of it, on the left side, so the south side of the Loci building, it would be right in the line of sight of the Charlie Creek tent that's straight in front of it. Okay. On the southwest side of the roof. Thank you. [01:20:38] Speaker 1: You can take your seat. And finally, I would direct the witness's attention to State's Exhibit #5 on the monitor. Let me know when that's there. It is. Is it? Yes. Do you recognize that exhibit? [01:21:15] Christopher Bagley: I do. [01:21:16] Speaker 1: And what is that? [01:21:17] Christopher Bagley: This is going to be a picture of the side profile of that last photo we looked at, with some red or orange markers, and a number two with also a tape that's there, on top of the Loci building. [01:21:31] Speaker 1: What was that tape that you said? [01:21:32] Christopher Bagley: There's a measuring tape, it looks like. [01:21:34] Speaker 1: Okay. Are you able to tell which direction the photograph is, the photographer was facing? [01:21:40] Christopher Bagley: Yes. [01:21:41] Speaker 1: And what direction is that? [01:21:42] Christopher Bagley: It's facing south. [01:21:44] Speaker 1: This is a nighttime photograph, correct? Yes. Do you know who took this picture? [01:21:52] Christopher Bagley: I do. [01:21:53] Speaker 1: And who took the picture? [01:21:54] Christopher Bagley: It was Melissa Richards. [01:21:55] Speaker 1: The same individual that you spoke about before? Yes. Did you ask her whether this is a fair and accurate depiction of what she observed that night? Yes. What did she say? [01:22:05] Christopher Bagley: She said it was. [01:22:06] Speaker 1: With respect to what you observed that day, apart from the evidence tag, the yellow tag, as well as the orange or red markers, is this a fair and accurate depiction of what you observed? Yes. What's different about what you observed as far as what's on the photograph, the previous exhibit, compared to this? [01:22:26] Christopher Bagley: You can see more of the length of an individual. So you can see that more there's two elbows, two knee areas, plus also towards the far right of the photo is also a marker where, like, somebody laid a gun down. Okay. It's like a prone position. [01:22:43] Speaker 1: Your Honor, pursuant to Rule 1102, as well as other authority that's been cited today, the state offers States Exhibit 5 into evidence. [01:22:51] Speaker 5: Your Honor, we renew all the same objections we made to Exhibit 4. [01:22:56] Speaker 2: Thank you. Given the foundation that has been laid and that the witness has testified that this is a fair and accurate representation of the scene, noting the tape as well as the markers in that States Exhibit 5 is admitted into evidence and may be published. The State moves to publish Exhibit 5, Judge. All right. [01:23:18] Speaker 1: The State moves to publish Exhibit 5, Judge. All right. The State moves to publish Exhibit 5, Judge. [01:23:21] Speaker ?: All right. [01:23:21] Speaker 1: The State moves to publish Exhibit 5, Judge. [01:23:22] Speaker ?: All right. The State moves to publish Exhibit 5, Judge. All right. The State moves to publish Exhibit 5, Judge. All right. The State moves to publish Exhibit 5, Judge. All right. Thank you. The State moves to publish Exhibit 5, Judge. All right. The State moves to publish Exhibit 5, Judge. All right. The State moves to publish Exhibit 5, Judge. All right. [01:23:36] Speaker 1: Before turning to what you did next on that day, taking you back to the daytime of September 10, 2025, did you secure the rooftop of the Loci Building that day? Yes, I did. [01:23:50] Christopher Bagley: And how did you do that? I put yellow police crime scene tape around the portion where -- so nobody else would disturb that area. [01:23:59] Speaker 1: And when you say that area, what areas are you talking about? [01:24:01] Christopher Bagley: I'm talking about the roof where it was the southwest side of the roof where I found the disturbed gravel where it looked like somebody had been proned out in the line of sight of the tent. So right there. [01:24:13] Speaker 1: Did you secure the area as far as any of the entrance area up onto the rooftop with police tape? [01:24:20] Christopher Bagley: Yes. So then where that natural guard rail is, that was the other barrier where they were advised not to go any further from there other than police officers. [01:24:28] Speaker 1: Okay. If we could go back to State's Exhibit #2. If we were to zoom in on this photograph, are you able to see the police tape that you put up on the rooftop of the Loci Center? Yes, you would be able to. Kimberly, if we can zoom in. Officer, I'm going to have you come down and describe for the court where you put that police tape up to secure that scene, the rooftop area on the southwest corner of the rooftop. [01:25:14] Christopher Bagley: So this is the top of the Loci Building. You've got your two different grays. The southwest is towards the top, center of the picture. You can see some yellow tape that spans from over here on the far right side of the picture by these black pipes. It goes around a silver vent, comes back down to the corner of that silver to keep everybody out of that area where that prone position was at. [01:25:47] Speaker 1: Okay. On that photograph, are you able to see where you put the tape up as far as the access way to that roof near the stairway? [01:25:55] Christopher Bagley: So it was right here actually, this natural barrier where you have to climb over the guard rail. So this is the elder barrier that I had to set up. And you put police tape on that? [01:26:03] Speaker 1: Yeah. Okay. Did you eventually leave that area? [01:26:09] Christopher Bagley: I did. [01:26:10] Speaker 1: Do you recall about what time you left that area? [01:26:14] Christopher Bagley: Oh, I have it in my notes. It would be when I left that area, it was almost one o'clock, about 1:03, 1:01. [01:26:22] Speaker 1: Okay. Before leaving, did you leave the scene with anyone? [01:26:27] Christopher Bagley: I did not leave the scene. Oh, did I leave the scene to somebody? Yes, I did. [01:26:30] Speaker ?: To someone else? [01:26:30] Speaker 1: Yes. And who was that? [01:26:32] Christopher Bagley: It was a county deputy, a female. [01:26:34] Speaker 1: Did you provide instructions to her? [01:26:36] Christopher Bagley: I did. And what were those instructions? I advised her not to let anybody inside the crime scene. Okay. Without being a police officer or an investigator. Okay. [01:26:44] Speaker 1: Thank you. You can take your seat again. Officer, upon seeing this disturbance in the gravel, you've described what it looked like to you? Yes. Someone lying down in a prone position, correct? Yes. What did you do next? [01:27:09] Christopher Bagley: So, when I got to the top of the Loci building during that day, I noticed the screwdriver, kept going to the edge, found that prone position. At that moment, I realized, because it was a direct line of sight, plus the disturbance in the gravel, where I could see somebody laid down in a prone position or a sniper position, and asked dispatch to get on the vid. Then I realized that we probably didn't have our shooter in custody from that moment. I asked dispatch to get on the camera system and to see if anybody was on top of the Loci building during the time of the incident. [01:27:44] Speaker 1: Were you advised of anything? [01:27:46] Christopher Bagley: I was. Dispatch came back and advised me that there was a male individual on top of the roof that was there at the time of the shooting. [01:27:54] Speaker 1: Did they describe what his movements were? [01:27:56] Christopher Bagley: They did. They stated that he ran to the edge, dropped down, crawled, got in a prone position. I'm going to stop you right there. [01:28:04] Speaker 1: You ran to the edge. What direction and what edge? [01:28:07] Christopher Bagley: Running west and southwest of the Loci building. So, ran towards the tent, where Charlie Kirk was, so they could get a line of sight. And then the individual stood up after the shooting and ran northeast on the top of the Loci building. [01:28:25] Speaker 1: Okay. You mentioned that this individual on the video dropped off, off the edge. Did you get that point? I haven't mentioned that. What happened? What else was described to you? [01:28:37] Christopher Bagley: Then, well, at that moment, so I knew that there was possibly a shooter on the run. [01:28:43] Speaker 5: Your Honor, can we just have a continuing objection to all of the hearsay that's being testified to here? [01:28:49] Speaker 1: Thank you. And, Judge, my response to that was I'm not actually offering this for the truth of the matter asserted at this point, simply for the effect on the hearer. So, I'm not offering what's been described in the video as substantive evidence. [01:29:02] Speaker 2: Mr. Nester, with that clarification, any thoughts? [01:29:09] Speaker 5: I'll just stand on the objection. I don't think, I mean, he's clearly offering it for the truth because he's asking him to describe the route of the individual, and it's based on what other people told him. So, if he wants to circle back to it after he's put the video in, I mean, we could do that. But right now, I still think it's inappropriate hearsay, Your Honor. All right. [01:29:29] Speaker 2: Anything further, Mr. Nester? I'll submit it to the court. All right. So, as the magistrate, as this is not to a jury, it's to myself as a magistrate, I am not accepting that statement for the truth of the matter asserted, simply for what has been stated. So, I'm specifically making that finding as I'm receiving this evidence, and I'm not accepting it for the truth of the matter asserted, only as represented by Mr. Grunander. And with that, the objection is overruled. Mr. Grunander, you may proceed. Thank you, Judge. [01:30:03] Speaker 1: So, you mentioned you were provided with information that an individual is running north on the LOSI rooftop, correct? Yes. What else was described to you? [01:30:14] Christopher Bagley: At that moment, I actually knew I had responding units coming into the scene. I advised other officers that I needed the LOSI building secured, searched, because I didn't know exactly what way, other than he ran north. At that moment, I went down to the police department, which is just down the stairwell, and looked at the video myself. [01:30:36] Speaker 1: Where is the police department located? [01:30:38] Christopher Bagley: It's in the Gunther Trade Building, just directly to the south of the LOSI building. Okay. So, where I described those outside stairs, the building to the left of that, or south, would be the Gunther Trade Building. Okay. [01:30:51] Speaker 1: On what level is the police department? It's level three. [01:30:54] Christopher Bagley: Level three. [01:30:55] Speaker 1: Okay. Upon arriving at the police department, what did you do next, then? [01:30:59] Christopher Bagley: I then looked at the footage to verify for myself exactly what expired on that moment, where I could see an individual run to the edge, get up, and then run off, and then drop off the northeast side of the building, of the LOSI building. [01:31:13] Speaker 1: Okay. Having viewed that, what did you do next? [01:31:18] Christopher Bagley: At that moment, I realized I had a bigger crime scene that I needed to contain and preserve for evidence. At that moment, I went and grabbed some more crime scene tape, and I responded to the northeast side of the building, and secured an area where I saw impressions of the shoe print inside the grass, and also up above on that northeast side of the building. I could see on the cement where something had scuffed there, and then drop down to the shoe imprint, and then finish going northeast. Okay. [01:31:52] Speaker 1: If I could take the witness back to State's Exhibit 2. You mentioned seeing an individual drop down. Could you come down and point that area out to the court? Yes. [01:32:12] Speaker ?: Okay. [01:32:13] Christopher Bagley: This is the LOSI building again, on the top right center of the photo. Southwest side is where the individual was laying down prone in the line of sight. Came behind the atrium. Atrium. Came behind that on the west side of it. Came up to the north side of the LOSI building on the east, on this white square piece on the far right of the picture. And then he dropped off on the east side of the LOSI building into the grass down here below. So the northeast corner. [01:32:56] Speaker 1: Yes, northeast corner. You mentioned you observed something on the grass. I did. [01:33:00] Christopher Bagley: I saw a shoe imprint that was embedded pretty deep right there next to where he dropped off. [01:33:05] Speaker 1: And this is all footage that you personally observed? Yes. On the surveillance video? Yes. When you got to the scene, describe in as best detail as you can what you saw on the grass then. [01:33:16] Christopher Bagley: So when I got to the scene, I could see that there was a shoe imprint there. When I looked up onto the cement from the roof, I could see some scratching or rub marks from the top of the roof. That was not there. So I could see that looked abnormal. I then decided to put crime scene tape around the whole area in case there was more evidence that needed to be preserved. [01:33:40] Speaker 1: On that exhibit number two, do you see where you placed the crime scene tape? [01:33:44] Christopher Bagley: Yes, I do. [01:33:45] Speaker 1: And where is that? Can you describe that to the court? [01:33:47] Christopher Bagley: It's going to be on the far right in the center of the picture. You can see the yellow tape. I came around trees, came up further out of pictures, some more trees. I came down all the way down to the back side of the LDS Institute building where there's a sidewalk to block everybody out of coming up that way. Okay. [01:34:03] Speaker 1: Did you at one point leave the scene? I did. Did you release the scene to anyone? Yes, I did. And who was that? [01:34:09] Christopher Bagley: There was two Payson police officers that were standing there. [01:34:12] Speaker 1: Okay. Were they in uniform? They were. Did you provide them with any instructions? [01:34:17] Christopher Bagley: I advised them not to let anybody inside the crime scene other than law enforcement or investigators. [01:34:21] Speaker 1: Okay. You can take your seat again, Officer Bagley. You've talked about the disturbance in the gravel that was observed on the low C building. [01:34:44] Christopher Bagley: Yes. [01:34:45] Speaker 1: Did you walk through that disturbance in the gravel? I did not. Did you otherwise touch it in any way? No. With respect to the shoe print that you observed on the grass on the northeast lawn area below the low C building, did you walk through that? I did not. Did you otherwise disturb that? No. Officer Bagley, what did you do next? [01:35:20] Christopher Bagley: From that moment I then released the scene. I went down to the Fugle building and knew where the incident command center was at so I could relay information that I had found to responding units and people in charge. [01:35:36] Speaker 1: If I can have just a moment, Judge. You may. [01:35:39] Speaker ?: The state will pass the witness, Judge. All rights. Ms. Nestor? Ms. Nestor, before you begin, what time would you like to break for lunch? I don't want to interrupt a line of questioning and just to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. [01:35:42] Speaker 1: I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. [01:35:45] Speaker 2: I would like to interrupt the floor. [01:35:46] Speaker ?: I would like to interrupt the floor. [01:35:47] Speaker 2: I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. [01:35:49] Speaker ?: I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. [01:36:02] Speaker 2: I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. [01:36:19] Speaker 5: I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. [01:36:22] Speaker 2: I would like to interrupt the floor. [01:36:31] Speaker 5: I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. [01:36:49] Christopher Bagley: I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. [01:36:52] Speaker 5: I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. [01:37:04] Christopher Bagley: I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. I would like to interrupt the floor. [01:37:31] Speaker 5: So you never attended any kind of, I'll just use the word, debrief or meeting to talk about what the officers on scene were going to do that day to keep everybody safe? No, not that morning. Do you know if there was such a meeting? [01:37:45] Christopher Bagley: I don't know because when I got there, it was starting to, people were throwing stuff down on the tent. [01:37:50] Speaker 5: And do you know how many UVU officers you guys employ normally? [01:37:58] Christopher Bagley: Employ, there was 15. [01:37:59] Speaker 5: And do you know how many were assigned to cover that event that day? [01:38:03] Christopher Bagley: That were assigned to cover it? There was six of us that were, there was a patrol one and then five others that were there with the chief. [01:38:09] Speaker 5: Did you all have an idea there were going to be thousands and thousands of people there? Or was that a surprise to you? [01:38:15] Christopher Bagley: I had an idea. [01:38:17] Speaker 5: And you only had five officers? Six, yes. [01:38:20] Christopher Bagley: Six, I'm sorry. [01:38:21] Speaker 5: I'm counting you. I was thinking. Okay. And of those six officers were, are you all armed? Do you carry weapons? [01:38:30] Christopher Bagley: Yes. [01:38:31] Speaker 5: What type of weapons do you carry? [01:38:33] Christopher Bagley: Glock, pistols. Okay. [01:38:35] Speaker 5: And was there any use on campus of, I think they're called magnetometers, but the machines you walk through at TSA in the airport where it checks to see if you're carrying anything metal, what we all had to go through to get in the courtroom, were there any machines like that set up or being used on campus that day? No. And as far as you know, were there any drones that were flying above campus that day? Not that I know of. And did anyone ever talk to you about covering anything near or on top of or in the low C building? Were you ever signed that area before the shooting? No. Do you know who was? I don't. [01:39:23] Christopher Bagley: I don't. [01:39:24] Speaker 5: And when you got up to the roof that afternoon, was anybody around that was law enforcement? [01:39:32] Christopher Bagley: No. [01:39:33] Speaker 5: Nobody on the roof? No. Nobody on the stairway? No. Nobody on the walkway? No. [01:39:39] Christopher Bagley: Okay. [01:39:40] Speaker 5: Okay. And in the state of Utah, is a campus a gun-free zone? Are students allowed to have guns on campus? [01:39:52] Christopher Bagley: It's an open carry state, so yes. [01:39:57] Speaker 5: And did you see anybody that was armed that day other than law enforcement? [01:40:03] Christopher Bagley: I did not see. [01:40:13] Speaker 5: Were you aware of whether Mr. Kirk had his own security team present there with him? Yes. Did you communicate with any of those people? [01:40:22] Christopher Bagley: I saw one individual that was on top of the hall flags right next to me, yes. [01:40:26] Speaker 5: Okay. And that was before the shooting? [01:40:28] Christopher Bagley: Yes. And then I saw several down in the crowds and down by him, yes. [01:40:31] Speaker 5: And were you aware of whether that person was armed either? [01:40:34] Christopher Bagley: I was aware he was armed. [01:40:36] Speaker 5: Okay. Was there any other law enforcement agency besides Mr. Kirk's private security team and your six officers, including you, that were covering that event that day? In other words, did you have any Provo police or Orem police or anyone that you knew of or federal agencies? I don't know. You never saw any that day? No. [01:40:59] Christopher Bagley: Not until the response came in. [01:41:01] Speaker 5: And you did mention, I think I heard you just a few minutes ago testify, you turned over the scene on the roof to a woman who was a deputy sheriff, right? Yes. You turned over the scene where the individual dropped off to, I believe you said, was it Orem police? Payson. Payson police, thank you. Those people weren't there until after the shooting, right? They were part of just a response of everybody in the area. Correct. Okay. Did you receive any type of briefing materials, written materials prior to the event that talked about who would be covering what or anything like that? [01:41:40] Christopher Bagley: No, not that morning. Like I said, it started getting hectic. So we were trying to get down there to secure the area and push people away from the top of the tent. [01:41:47] Speaker 5: Now, when this event was over, you prepared a report, is that right? [01:41:54] Christopher Bagley: I did. [01:41:55] Speaker 5: And in the report, it covers a lot of what you testified to with Mr. Grenander, doesn't it? Yes. And I think you said you attended, what, 600 hours of post-training? [01:42:04] Christopher Bagley: It was around 600 hours, yes. [01:42:06] Speaker 5: And I'm sure somewhere in that training, you were taught the importance of your police report? Yes. And how it will be relied on years later to recreate events like it's being done right now? Yep. And so you know it's really important to be as accurate as possible in your report? Yep. All right. Can we put up Bagley 1? Can we switch it over to the defense table, please? Thank you so much. And show it only to the witness. All right. Do you see that report in front of you? [01:42:52] Christopher Bagley: I do. [01:42:53] Speaker 5: And is that the report that you prepared? Or did you prepare this report? [01:42:57] Christopher Bagley: I didn't. I did a supplement on it. I didn't prepare the report. So like, because the incident was a big agency assist. So obviously it says, it has all the responding officers to that effect. [01:43:10] Speaker 5: Oh, we need to go to the page. Thank you for pointing that out. Can we please move to page 3 or 5 maybe? All right, now let me ask the question again. Sorry, you just had the cover sheet up. Is that your report? [01:43:43] Christopher Bagley: Yes, this is. [01:43:44] Speaker 5: All right. And did you prepare that? [01:43:46] Christopher Bagley: I did. [01:43:47] Speaker 5: When did you prepare this report? [01:43:49] Christopher Bagley: It looks like it was done the next day. Either that day or the next day. Because I wanted to make sure that I had it done. Everything was fresh on my mind. [01:44:00] Speaker 5: And do you have a copy of it in front of you? [01:44:02] Christopher Bagley: I do, as a matter of fact. [01:44:03] Speaker 5: May I just step in and just make sure that it's the same one? May I approach, Your Honor? [01:44:06] Speaker 2: You may. I hope you're good. [01:44:24] Speaker 5: We got to ask this now. Did you use AI to help you prepare your report? [01:44:28] Christopher Bagley: I did not. [01:44:29] Speaker 5: Okay, good. When you prepared your report, you referenced when you first heard the shot, don't you? [01:44:37] Christopher Bagley: Yes. [01:44:38] Speaker 5: And what is the time that you say that you heard the shot? [01:44:41] Christopher Bagley: 12:23. [01:44:42] Speaker 5: Right. And when you wrote that report, you did not state in your report the direction you heard that shot come from, did you? [01:44:51] Christopher Bagley: No, apparently not. [01:44:53] Speaker 5: And take your time and look at the whole report and see if there's anywhere in there where you ever mentioned that it came from the east or to your right. [01:45:15] Christopher Bagley: I don't see the direction. [01:45:16] Speaker 5: Okay. And you also, I believe, in your report, you also don't state whether or not, you don't mention anything about thinking it came from the low C building or anything like that, right? [01:45:30] Christopher Bagley: Later on when I recognized where the, when I saw the empty holsters, when I, I think I actually said that in there, where I see the empty holster that I realized the line of sight. [01:45:40] Speaker 5: Okay. So let's talk about that holster for a minute. So you heard the shot and did, you only heard one shot, correct? [01:45:49] Christopher Bagley: Yes. [01:45:50] Speaker 5: And then you came down from the walkway above the tent, right? Yes. And you came down to really the grassy area that we've all been looking at the courtyard. Yes. And there was kind of chaos, people running around. Yep. Yes. And while you were down there, you saw what you said was an empty holster. [01:46:13] Christopher Bagley: Yeah. As I was clearing people out and making sure that the evidence was preserved, about towards the top, after a little bit, I saw an empty holster sitting there. [01:46:21] Speaker 5: And when you say towards the top, can you be specific and tell us where you were? [01:46:26] Christopher Bagley: So on the south side in the courtyard, there's some tiers of seating where the grass is different levels. And it was towards the top, maybe just right before the cement is where everybody's standing. So there's different levels. It's towards the top on the grass. [01:46:40] Speaker 5: And when you saw the holster, can you describe to me what it looked like? [01:46:45] Christopher Bagley: An empty concealed holster. [01:46:47] Speaker 5: For what type of weapon? For a pistol. [01:46:49] Speaker ?: Okay. [01:46:50] Speaker 5: And did it have any markings on it? [01:46:52] Christopher Bagley: I didn't even, no, not that I noticed. [01:46:55] Speaker 5: And what happened to that holster? [01:46:57] Christopher Bagley: I have no idea. [01:46:58] Speaker 5: Did you ever take custody of it? [01:47:00] Christopher Bagley: No. [01:47:01] Speaker 5: Did you ever tell anyone else to take custody of it? No. You just left it on the grass? [01:47:06] Christopher Bagley: I did. [01:47:11] Speaker 5: Was it ever fingerprinted to your knowledge? [01:47:13] Christopher Bagley: I have no idea. [01:47:14] Speaker 5: Okay. At some point, there were drones in the air. Is that right? Did you become aware of that? [01:47:28] Christopher Bagley: Yes, I was made aware of that. Right. [01:47:30] Speaker 5: Do you know who put the drones in the air? [01:47:32] Christopher Bagley: Sergeant Cam Nelson with the police department. Right. [01:47:36] Speaker 5: So it wasn't UVU? No. Did you guys even have drone capability? Did you have a drone on campus that you used? No. [01:47:43] Christopher Bagley: All right. [01:47:44] Speaker 5: So someone would have had to bring one after the shooting onto campus, because you wouldn't have had one there. [01:47:51] Christopher Bagley: True. [01:47:59] Speaker 5: You mentioned that as you were coming down into the grassy area from the top above the tent, you come down the Hall of Flags, you come into the grassy area. You mentioned that you heard, I guess on your radio, that they had a suspect in custody. [01:48:17] Christopher Bagley: Yes. [01:48:18] Speaker 5: Right. And so how long do you think between the shot being fired, did you hear that? [01:48:24] Christopher Bagley: I was in, like I said, trying to get down the stairs, jumping over people, trying not to step on people as people were fighting up within 30 seconds maybe. Right. [01:48:33] Speaker 5: So they pretty much instantly had someone in custody. [01:48:36] Christopher Bagley: Yes. And that's why I was quite surprised. [01:48:39] Speaker 5: Were you aware of where the person was taken into custody? [01:48:43] Christopher Bagley: Right down where Charlie Kirk was sitting by his tent, somewhere down there. [01:48:47] Speaker 5: So in the courtyard area, the person would have been in the courtyard area at the time of the shooting? [01:48:53] Christopher Bagley: Yes. [01:48:54] Speaker 5: Was that person in or near or around the holster in any way? [01:48:58] Christopher Bagley: No. You don't know? He wasn't. Where the holster was, was up on the top level up there. And it was where the, when the incident happened, when they, when Charlie got shot, within seconds, the other officer that was down by him said that he was in custody with the prisoner of the shooter. So. So. Right there. [01:49:16] Speaker 5: So you didn't, at that time, it was your understanding, the person they took into custody was close by Mr. Kirk. Is that right? Yep. It didn't occur to you that, well, that's not where I heard the shot come from. They must have the wrong person. I should talk to somebody. [01:49:34] Christopher Bagley: During the chaos moment, no. That's, they said they had a person in custody. I figured those guys saw something I didn't see. They took the person in custody and I thought that was him. [01:49:42] Speaker 5: Okay. [01:49:43] Speaker ?: Okay. [01:49:44] Speaker 5: I, actually, I'm, this would be a good stopping place because I'm about to start another section. Okay. So maybe we could go five minutes early for lunch. [01:49:54] Speaker 2: Absolutely. All right. Thank you. [01:49:57] Speaker 5: Thank you, officer. [01:49:58] Speaker 2: We're going to go ahead and break for lunch. We'll come back at one o'clock.