Lindsay Clancy's mother gives emotional answer about being grandmother

[00:00:00] Speaker 1: Thank you. Okay, I'm going to ask, remind you, okay, remind everybody else, just speak into the microphone, if you can keep your voice up, please. Okay. Thank you. [00:00:38] Speaker 2: Afternoon, tell us your name and spell your name, please. [00:00:40] Speaker 3: My name is Paula Musgrove, P-A-U-L-A-M-U-S-G-R-O-V-E. [00:00:48] Speaker 2: And Mrs. Musgrove, fair to say that you are Lindsay's mother? [00:00:53] Speaker 3: Yes, I am Lindsay's mother. [00:00:54] Speaker 2: And your husband is here as well in the blue shirt, correct? Yes. You've been here for every day for the trial, is that correct? [00:01:00] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:01:01] Speaker 2: I just have a few questions for you. Obviously, you, tell us about Lindsay when she was a kid. Was she a good kid, good student, that type of thing? [00:01:14] Speaker 3: She was a very good kid and an excellent student, very excellent student all through school, through high school, college. Yes, excellent. [00:01:23] Speaker 2: Have you ever been in trouble, you know, law enforcement or schools or discipline or anything? [00:01:28] Speaker 3: No. [00:01:29] Speaker 2: Were you aware of her husband, Pat? Yes. And obviously, you knew when they got married and when they were dating and things of that nature, right? Went to the wedding, obviously. Yes. Fair to say that you were close to your daughter and Pat? Yes. And you knew, obviously, the grandchildren? Yes. Tell the jury how you interacted and felt about your grandchildren. [00:01:59] Speaker 3: I loved my grandchildren with all my heart. And you never know what it's like to love a grandchild until you become a grandmother. And it was the most beautiful thing. I love them with all my heart. [00:02:15] Speaker 2: Now, did you have occasion to see how Lindsay reacted and treated her kids as a mother? [00:02:24] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:02:25] Speaker 2: And granted that you're her mother, so you're obviously biased. Tell the jury what observations you made of Lindsay as a mother through the years after Cora was born, and then Dawson, and then, of course, baby Callum. [00:02:40] Speaker 3: Lindsay was a very loving mother. She was dedicated to her children. She was a fun mother. She was always doing things for her kids. She always wanted to be a mother, have many children, and I felt it was the best thing that ever happened to her. And she would do anything for her children. She was just a loving mother. [00:03:07] Speaker 2: Now, in 2022, Callum was born, is that correct? [00:03:14] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:03:15] Speaker 2: Did you stay in touch with Lindsay and Pat during that period of time, the spring into the summer of 2022? [00:03:21] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:03:22] Speaker 2: And how often would you see them or talk to them or what would you do? You go to cookouts or you have parties or how would you socialize? [00:03:30] Speaker 3: Myself and my husband would travel from Connecticut to Duxbury at least two or three times a month, as well as them coming to Connecticut to visit us. [00:03:41] Speaker 2: And would you agree that in the summer, for example, of 2022, that Lindsay and Pat were active with the kids and were pretty happy? [00:03:52] Speaker 3: Very happy, yes. [00:03:53] Speaker 2: Did you observe in the summer of 2022 any changes at that point in her personality and the way she was acting with her friends and in society? [00:04:06] Speaker 3: In the summer, no. [00:04:08] Speaker 2: And they were having a fairly good summer? [00:04:11] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:04:12] Speaker 2: Did you notice at some point a change in Lindsay's demeanor? [00:04:17] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:04:17] Speaker 2: Tell the jury when that was. [00:04:20] Speaker 3: It was sometime probably around the second week of October. [00:04:24] Speaker 2: What happened that you noticed? [00:04:26] Speaker 3: I noticed that she had become very anxious. She told me she was anxious about going back to work because Callan was having trouble taking a bottle and she didn't feel right about leaving him. [00:04:44] Speaker 2: And as a result of that, did she tell you that she was going to put off going back to work? [00:04:49] Speaker 3: Yes. She told me she was applying for an extension. [00:04:52] Speaker 2: Now, did you know at that point that she was going through any issues involving depression or anxiety or having any suicidal ideation or anything like that? [00:05:02] Speaker 3: At that point, no. [00:05:04] Speaker 2: At what point, if any, did you become aware that your daughter was suffering from this symptomology? [00:05:10] Speaker 3: In late October. [00:05:12] Speaker 2: And how did that come about? [00:05:14] Speaker 3: She sent me a text message. [00:05:17] Speaker 2: And do you recall when that was? [00:05:19] Speaker 3: Yes, that was on October 20th. [00:05:21] Speaker 2: Now, Your Honor, the government has introduced into evidence the entire of the phone dumps, if you will, and I think they put it on a disk and it's probably thousands of pages, but I do have the text thread that deals with that time frame in October. I'd like to offer that so that it's apparent what I'm referring to rather than having to search through thousands of pages. Okay. [00:05:45] Speaker ?: Okay. [00:05:45] Speaker 2: They may be admitted. [00:05:49] Speaker ?: So approaching when we're after this thing. Here we go. 276. [00:05:55] Speaker 3: Now, the text message that you're referring to, would that be on? [00:06:02] Speaker 2: October 20th of 2022? [00:06:07] Speaker ?: Yes. [00:06:07] Speaker 3: And do you have that on your phone right now? [00:06:11] Speaker ?: I do. Can you just pull that up for us? [00:06:13] Speaker 2: I can, just give me a moment. Okay, I have it. Because did you have a copy maybe that she could look at? Oh, I have a copy. [00:06:18] Speaker ?: Yeah. That might be easier for the witness. Okay. So, I'm going to approach you with. [00:06:20] Speaker 2: Okay. So, I'm going to approach you with. This board. And ask. if this is. Do you have that on your phone right now? I do. Can you just pull that up for us? I can, just give me a moment. [00:06:31] Speaker ?: Okay, I have it. [00:06:33] Speaker 3: Okay, I have it. [00:06:34] Speaker 1: Because did you have a copy maybe that she could look at? Oh, I have a copy. Yeah. That might, that might be. Easier for the witness. [00:06:46] Speaker 2: So, I'm going to approach you with. This. Board. And ask. If this is a copy of the text that you're referring to. [00:06:59] Speaker 3: Yes, it is. Would you read that for the jury? Mom, will you please come up and stay with me for a bit? I'm really sick. Something is wrong. I had horrible insomnia all night. And I just don't know how I'm going to get through the day. I started taking the medicine my doctor prescribed for anxiety. And I think it's made things worse. It's just really scary. And I don't want to be alone. [00:07:29] Speaker 2: You want to write about this? Objection. Sorry. [00:07:34] Speaker 1: What do we mark it for identification? Is that text within the. I'd rather have it in the board. Well, I know you would, but we already have the. They want to do the thing. Can I just stop the board? No. We're going to mark that for identification. The text that is been referred and read to is within. Exhibit 276, which was just off. I'm sorry, which is what? I think it was within exhibit 276, which was within that thread that you just offered. [00:08:08] Speaker 2: Okay. So I will then, that would be 276. Yeah. So that will be over here. As a result of receiving that text, did you then come up to. Hold on a second. [00:08:19] Speaker 1: Exhibit W for identification. [00:08:21] Speaker 2: Yeah, okay. Oh, thank you. All right, thank you. So as a result of that, did you come up to Duxbury? [00:08:29] Speaker 3: Yes, same day. [00:08:31] Speaker 2: And tell us about that. What happened that day at the end of October? [00:08:36] Speaker 3: Lindsay had been, I believe she went to the emergency room that day and she had come home. She was feeling a bit better. She told me that she couldn't sleep. She was very anxious and she was afraid. [00:08:54] Speaker 2: And how long did you stay with her? [00:08:57] Speaker 3: At that point? [00:08:59] Speaker 2: Yes. [00:09:00] Speaker 3: I believe at that point I stayed for about a week. [00:09:05] Speaker 2: And was your husband with you? [00:09:08] Speaker 3: He came later. He didn't come directly with me then because he was still working. So he came later. [00:09:13] Speaker 2: I never asked. What did you do for work? [00:09:16] Speaker 3: I worked for Weight Watchers. [00:09:18] Speaker 2: And you're retired? [00:09:19] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:09:20] Speaker 2: How about your husband? Is he working now? [00:09:22] Speaker 3: He recently retired. [00:09:24] Speaker 2: And what was the nature of his work? [00:09:26] Speaker 3: He was in photography. [00:09:28] Speaker 2: What kind of photography? [00:09:29] Speaker 3: School picture photography. [00:09:31] Speaker 2: For yearbooks and things like that? [00:09:33] Speaker 3: Yeah, and school pictures when you had your kids' pictures taken. [00:09:36] Speaker 2: And he just recently retired? Yes. Is it fair to say that during the month of October into November into the holidays in December that you and your husband would stay with Lindsay and the kids? [00:09:48] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:09:49] Speaker ?: Yes. [00:09:49] Speaker 3: I stayed more than my husband because he needed to go back home to work. [00:09:53] Speaker 2: Sure. While you were staying with Lindsay, can you tell us your opinion as to her condition? Was it decompensating? Was she getting better as time went on through November and December into the holidays? [00:10:05] Speaker 3: Through November into December, it was not getting better and into the holidays. [00:10:12] Speaker 2: And you knew she was on medication at that point? [00:10:14] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:10:15] Speaker 2: You knew she was seeing doctors at that point? [00:10:17] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:10:18] Speaker 2: So tell us, is there an incident that came to your mind that you recall that occurred on one evening that indicated to you how seriously she was suffering? [00:10:30] Speaker 3: There were many. One particular evening that was disturbing to me was that she was afraid, she was afraid to be alone, and she actually asked if she could sleep with me. [00:10:47] Speaker 2: When was that? [00:10:48] Speaker 3: That was late November, early December. [00:10:51] Speaker 2: And did she indeed sleep with you on that occasion? [00:10:54] Speaker 3: She did. [00:10:56] Speaker 2: Continuing on through the holidays, did you guys get together for the holidays, Christmas or Thanksgiving, if you recall? [00:11:06] Speaker 3: Yes. I was down there probably most of December through Christmas Eve, and then I left on Christmas Eve to come home to see my other daughter and her family. And then Lindsay actually came to my house later on Christmas Day. [00:11:25] Speaker 2: Was she with Pat? [00:11:26] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:11:27] Speaker 2: And the kids? [00:11:28] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:11:29] Speaker 2: During that period of time, did you make further observation as time went into January? Back it up. At some point she voluntarily went into McLean Hospital? [00:11:44] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:11:45] Speaker 2: You knew that? Yes. How did you know that? [00:11:48] Speaker 3: I was there. [00:11:49] Speaker 2: What do you mean you were there? [00:11:50] Speaker 3: I was at Lindsay's house staying with them. [00:11:53] Speaker 2: Did you take care of the kids? [00:11:54] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:11:55] Speaker 2: And it's fair to say that Pat's parents, mom and dad, also stepped up taking care of the kids, helping out during this period of time? [00:12:04] Speaker 3: They were there, I guess, when we weren't there. I didn't really see them, but. [00:12:09] Speaker 2: Right. Because you guys would be different times. [00:12:11] Speaker 3: Right. [00:12:12] Speaker 2: You all were pulling together as a family, is that correct? [00:12:15] Speaker ?: Right. [00:12:16] Speaker 2: January, leading up to January 24th, do you recall and can you tell the jurors what, if any, observations you made of Lindsay and her condition? [00:12:30] Speaker 3: Lindsay had lost a lot of weight. She had become, during this whole time, paranoid about different things that really she shouldn't have, you know, really weren't logical to become paranoid about. She would mention that this wasn't her mind. She would say to me, this isn't me. I've never been like this before. And I would agree because she wasn't. She, she was attempting to go through the motions of her day, take care of the kids as best she could. She stopped, she didn't want to drive. So, at times when Pat didn't go pick the kids up at school, I would drive Lindsay to pick the kids up at school because she didn't, she was afraid to drive. [00:13:22] Speaker 2: Did she express to you concern that, in this timeframe, that people at the school, teachers and other people would be able to know what she was thinking and would think that she wasn't a good mother because she was sick? [00:13:35] Speaker 3: Yes. She said, the school knows something's going on because I'm not driving my car to, you know, they see that I'm not driving my car to pick the kids up. [00:13:45] Speaker 2: Do you recall the end of January that she made a statement to you about the medication and her opinion, what it was doing to her mind? [00:13:54] Speaker 3: Yes. [00:13:55] Speaker 2: What did she say? [00:13:56] Speaker 3: She said that she couldn't remember anything. The medication was pretty much just destroying her mind and it wasn't her. She said, this isn't me, I just want to feel better and enjoy my kids again. [00:14:09] Speaker 2: Now, I know that this is difficult in December of 2022. Do you recall the time that you were in the kitchen with Lindsay and Patrick and she made a statement about her state of mind to her husband, Pat, and you were there? Yes. I know it's difficult. Just tell us what you remember. [00:14:36] Speaker 3: I remember her being very nervous. I remember her saying, I just have to tell you guys something. And then she told us. What did she tell you? She told us that she had thoughts of harming the children. [00:14:51] Speaker 1: Thank you very much. Why don't we take the afternoon recess at this time? We'll come back for cross-examination. All right. So, ma'am, you can step down. Thank you. All right. So, members of the jury, we're going to take the break at this time. We expect to have you back about two o'clock. Okay? All rise, please, Chair Zeksi. Thank you.