Iran’s Infowars: Resistance, repression and control — The Listening Post

[0:00] it's been almost eight weeks now of the war on iran what is happening inside the country what [0:06] kind of messages are coming out and how are iranians coping with no internet just an intranet [0:14] israel's war on journalism has been turned to lebanon it killed another reporter there this [0:19] week and it was no accident plus pakistan its new role as a mediator in the peace talks over iran [0:27] how that story is being reported and at whose expense nearly two months into the u.s israeli [0:38] war on iran our focus this week is on what is happening inside iran the messaging the continuing [0:44] clap down on the internet there and the larger information war iran's external communication [0:50] strategy is primarily aimed at western audiences it appears coordinated disciplined the message [0:57] has been simple we are the victims the u.s and israel the oppressors and it is a narrative that [1:03] has proven to be surprisingly effective but behind the carefully curated meme-like ai videos and the [1:10] strong nationalistic rhetoric lies the brutal domestic side of the propaganda war an internal [1:16] crackdown that has led to hundreds of arrests and an internet blackout that has left a population of [1:22] 90 million people cut off from the outside world this war has iranians caught between a rock and a [1:29] hard place a repressive government and foreign powers that claim to be bombing them to a state of [1:35] liberation that the iranian state with a leadership that can be so authoritarian and repressive has proven [1:45] so adept at weaponizing humor and ai animations is an ironic feature of this propaganda war we are having [1:53] very great negotiations with iran this is an example of that if iran doesn't come to negotiate we're [2:00] going to bomb them it was posted this past week by iran's farce news agency so where are the iranians [2:08] this is from iran it provides a simple yet effective summation of the current state of negotiations between [2:16] washington and tehran all right then i will extend the ceasefire at pakistan's request [2:24] the frank to show the president of the united states who is detached from this world he he he's [2:34] just talking to himself arguing with himself coming out with his own conclusions but there's no [2:39] nobody in front of him so they're trying to stress that the president of the united states [2:45] isn't up to this job what stands out is how coordinated and disciplined that messaging has been [2:53] they've treated communication as part of the theater of war they go viral quite easily and [3:00] it allows iran to bypass the traditional media gatekeepers entirely they're not trying to convince [3:08] editors or analysts of anything they're trying to operate within a fragmented platform driven media [3:18] system abroad they most certainly have been successful in their consistent messaging but here's the big [3:25] but the millions of ordinary iranians back home are fed up with the regime propaganda and the government [3:31] of iran has once again isolated the majority of the iranian public that reference to the iranian [3:40] government's isolation of its own people pertains to one of the longest internet blackouts the world has [3:46] ever seen iran is a very wired society but it's more than 90 million citizens have been cut off [3:53] from the outside world for almost two months now since the day the war began the authorities say the [3:59] blackout is security related designed to ward off cyber attacks from the outside particularly from the [4:06] israelis it has also completely blocked any access to information and reporting from the outside world [4:13] iranians can still communicate internally via an intranet but they are doing so amidst an intense [4:20] crackdown in a climate of fear state-controlled news channels are doing their part by broadcasting [4:27] confessions that appear to be forced iranians accused of spying for foreign states or selling information to [4:35] the international media whatever access iranians had to outside information has been completely shut off [4:59] and very few people inside the country believe uh the state media over the last five six years iran has [5:10] become increasingly authoritarian now that authoritarianism has turned into a police state and so one of the [5:19] things iranians complain about their inability to access information much of which given war conditions is [5:29] quite essential when internet is caught in iran that that's the international internet however there is [5:35] another parallel internet which is the local one and that has local websites local services messaging apps [5:44] used by iranians to communicate amongst each other for us journalists we have a certain privilege which is [5:53] using a certain card to use internet that's the way most journalists communicate or use social media but [6:01] each and everyone who is using such sim cards his or her details are with the ministry of information [6:08] what history has shown the iranian people is that after any conflict the regime becomes more aggressive [6:16] and more stifling toward any form of dissent everyone's watching everyone and and people are quite frankly [6:22] intimidated to make the slightest wrong move because they fear arrest one of the greatest fears for the [6:29] iranian people in the start of this war was that they will be left with the crumbles of a regime that [6:34] is at its most hard line and emboldened form and in some ways that's precisely what has happened [6:43] iran's system of government is layered and as this war has shown it is resilient the u.s israeli attacks [6:50] began with the assassinations of several senior political figures necessitating changes at the [6:57] top yet the state's command structures have soldiered on at the apex of those structures is the clerical [7:04] establishment closely aligned the revolutionary guard corps the irgc a powerful branch of the iranian armed [7:12] forces independent of the regular military and with diplomacy so central to this crisis [7:19] iran's bureaucratic establishment also carries influence since the war started some hardline [7:26] elements have grown louder president trump and sections of the western media seem to have [7:32] interpreted that as a sign of imminent collapse that would be an oversimplification to put it mildly [7:39] the islamic republic has always operated through multiple sectors of power and their messaging has [7:47] never been fully uniformed i would be careful not to over read this as a clear power struggle at the [7:53] top there is always power struggles within any state and iran is not an exception i know from sources [8:01] that um the speaker of the parliament mohammad bahrir qalibaf one of his tasks is essentially to contain and [8:08] convince the hardliners why it's necessary to engage with the united states and come to some sort of a deal [8:17] the centerpiece of iran's information war remains the ai videos it keeps churning out political [8:49] messaging meme style designed to rile americans particularly donald trump's mega base over the [8:56] president's lack of a coherent strategy his irascible behavior and the epstein file [9:05] iran is portraying itself as david standing up to america's goliath [9:10] the team reportedly responsible for many of these videos is called explosive media it is based in [9:21] tehran and one of its operatives spoke with the bbc and appeared on cnn saying he was honored to work [9:28] for the homeland we are committed to the islamic republic that's our belief our point of view as an [9:35] industry ai generated political sloppaganda is in its infancy who knew that it would have such an [9:42] impact so quickly and that lego characters would be enlisted and sent to the front lines of a propaganda [9:50] war these videos the reason they're successful is that they're light and they touch on very serious [9:57] and complicated points but they simplify it and lego who doesn't like lego playful it's childish it's [10:06] innocent and the iranian regime is tapping into something so universal with their messaging that [10:15] is only there to serve their purpose for the last several decades the iranians have consistently lost [10:23] the media battle whatever soft power iran once had has been rapidly eroded by ill-conceived and [10:33] poorly articulated statements by quite archaic and deeply authoritarian and autocratic political [10:42] figures in iran and we're seeing a generational shift a tectonic shift also in the way that iranians [10:51] have presented their message what help are these ai lego videos to iranian civilians that's a very good question [11:01] these lego videos have very little value they are largely intended for international audiences because [11:10] they understand the power of public opinion in more democratically oriented nations such as the united [11:18] states and the power that plays in this war and so that's the front they're engaging in with those videos [11:26] in lebanon the ceasefire brokered by the united states has simply not held israel has ended its bombardment [11:37] of beirut but has kept up its attacks on southern lebanon claiming to target hezbollah fighters but [11:42] those attacks have also killed civilians and this past week a journalist minakshi ravi has been on this [11:49] story the killing of amal khalil in the southern lebanese town of atiri unfolded the way so many [11:55] israeli assassinations of journalists in gaza have minute by minute hour by hour in a pattern that has [12:01] become shockingly familiar the surveillance the strike the obstruction of rescue and then the denial [12:07] israel's insistence that it does not target journalists medics or rescue workers khalil a [12:13] well-known reporter for the lebanese newspaper al-akhbar said in interviews before that she has [12:18] repeatedly received threats from the israeli army and intelligence this past week khalil was dispatched [12:37] to atiri to report on airstrikes there when a car in front of her was hit by an israeli drone [12:42] she and her photojournalist zeynab faraj took shelter in a nearby house and immediately contacted [12:48] her editors and family to say they were trapped lebanon's president issued a statement calling on [12:53] the red cross to reach them soon after though the israelis bombed the house where the journalists had [12:58] taken refuge what followed were repeated israeli strikes on the red cross crew sent to find them [13:04] under continuous fire emergency workers managed to evacuate zeynab faraj but the danger forced them [13:10] to leave amal khalil behind she was declared dead hours later when rescue workers were finally able [13:15] to return khalil is one of at least 14 lebanese journalists killed by israel since october 2023 [13:22] in addition to the more than 250 palestinian journalists killed across gaza and the west bank [13:27] in the same period last month israel admitted to deliberately targeting and killing three lebanese [13:33] journalists its justification was that one of them ali shoeb was a hezbollah terrorist posing as a [13:39] reporter no evidence was provided israel was subsequently caught using an ai generated image of [13:45] shoeb in a hezbollah uniform in an attempt to discredit him posthumously for journalists doing their work [13:51] in countries under israeli attack the danger is not only being caught in the crossfire but being placed [13:58] in israel's crosshairs thanks mina over the years pakistan's political and military establishments [14:04] have been difficult for any journalist there to defend its army chief awesome munir was deeply unpopular [14:11] its government which was narrowly returned to power after a bitterly contested election [14:16] was widely seen as illegitimate and its most popular politician imran khan has been held in the notorious [14:22] high security audiologist jail where he remains but today pakistan's diplomats are at the center of [14:29] one of the world's most consequential stories they are hosting talks between the us and iran [14:35] brokering ceasefires earning the very public praise of donald trump and making headlines around the world [14:41] there is some self-interest at play here due to pakistan's reliance on oil from the middle east [14:47] and therefore the state of the strait of hormuz but this is a pr moment that the pakistani establishment [14:55] and its people could not have predicted and one that's obscuring a great deal to help us make sense [15:01] of how this story is being told inside pakistan and what's being left out we're joined now from [15:07] karachi by amber rahim shamsi she is the editor at a digital news platform called nukta miss shamsi from [15:15] where you're sitting in karachi how big a story is pakistan's mediation role between the us and iran [15:22] domestically how much is the pakistani public tracking it and what's the mood at home over it uh [15:29] thank you for having me this current conflict and hopefully its resolution is really purely simply in [15:35] terms of petrol prices the government has been adjusting them on a weekly basis they've gone high [15:41] inflation has risen but at the same time i i think that there's also hope that if pakistan is able [15:47] to successfully mediate a long-term ceasefire or deal or agreement of some kind it would hopefully [15:54] potentially also lead to an improvement in people's lives so i think it is a combination of where you [16:01] see that there's a pride that i see in people that pakistan has has become so prominent on the global [16:07] stage as well um that's being talked about in very positive terms but obviously at the same time um [16:14] you know there is that hope that this would lead to an improvement in people's lives if this doesn't [16:19] lead to that then i'm afraid all the gains that pakistan has made not just internationally but [16:24] but i would say that the current uh regime that has the the gains that it's made with people [16:30] you would fritter that away the last time that the pakistani media had such a significant [16:36] moment in terms of pr was last year middle of last year during that confrontation with india [16:42] pakistan held its own now its army chief asim murnir is at the center of these talks talk to us [16:49] about his role how it's being framed and what does it mean politically given that he leads the army [16:56] not the civilian government yes uh field marshal asim murnir does indeed lead the army and uh he became [17:04] field marshal after the may conflict between india and pakistan the current regime which is headed by [17:11] a civilian government um but is obviously um i i would say the supreme power or the most powerful [17:17] figure in pakistan has traditionally been the army chief we have a civilian government uh as a facade but [17:24] we do have a strong army chief who is front and center in terms of whether it's foreign policy whether [17:32] it's in terms of governance or even economic policy what the main conflict between pakistan and india [17:38] did and pakistan successfully rebranded itself the the army chief successfully rebranded itself [17:44] and we entered a new phase in pakistan's i would say domestic politics but also its international image [17:51] so here we have pakistan positioning itself as an international peacemaker meanwhile it's fighting [17:58] a war with afghanistan that barely registers on pakistani prime time television like last month [18:04] pakistani jets hit an addiction rehabilitation facility in kabul at least 143 people killed how is [18:11] that airstrike and the broader conflict being covered or not covered in the pakistani mainstream news media [18:18] it has it isn't being covered in the mainstream um the only news that we get are from security [18:24] agencies and security sources afghan taliban ka kabul may drug hospital par hamleka propaganda [18:36] nobody is really talking to reporters who are trying to dig a little deeper [18:39] um so i'd say that um the situation with afghanistan is um is just not being discussed i think the mood [18:48] in pakistan as well is a little bit of fatigue in terms of afghanistan we've also had lots of [18:54] deportations of afghan refugees or immigrants uh that's been continuing for the last two three years [19:00] so really a very hard line policy towards afghanistan very very careful and i think the pakistani public as [19:05] well i see that while there there's very little sympathy as well um you see that more along the [19:11] border areas where there's direct trade between afghans and pakistanis where there's a lot of sympathy [19:17] there's obviously a lot of ethnic um um you know obviously affinity as well but broadly in the rest of [19:24] pakistan might see the pakistani public as well has really moved on and would like the that you know uh [19:31] would like the afghanistan matter as well to be settled meanwhile the former prime minister imran [19:37] khan has been in jail for two and a half years now by most by many measures he remains pakistan's [19:43] most popular politician his family says it is concerned about his health the coverage of him [19:49] has been suppressed by the authorities there does a story like this one pakistan as peacemaker [19:56] reduce the prominence that imran khan is getting even further absolutely richard i do think that [20:03] this story of how pakistan has become so prominent in the international stage its role as a peacemaker [20:09] um negotiating between iran and washington i think that story has actually flipped the script so [20:15] for instance when you saw that the main conflict between india and pakistan allowed field marshal [20:22] asa munir and the current regime to rebrand itself and to use the opportunity in its contacts uh with [20:29] you know the trump administration uh leverage that for domestic consolidation uh as well as international [20:37] uh relief and connections and relationships what um this current uh negotiating or peacemaking [20:45] role what it has done for the current regime is that it has been able to flip the script a little bit [20:52] so one of imran khan's um appeals to his public to people who you know his voters his supporters has [20:59] always been that he is a respected name on the international stage so he would bring a sense of [21:06] pride to a very battered pakistani psyche international pride this moment for pakistan as peacemaker has [21:15] flipped the script it has demonstrated for some pakistanis that all right we we just this particular [21:23] role that uh shabazz sharif isaqdar and asa muni have played in terms of how they're managing their [21:29] relationships and brought pakistan a lot of pride this current regime hasn't been able to demonstrate [21:36] is that you can restore some national pride without imran khan last question for you and you've touched on the [21:44] economic angle but i just want to get back to it here for many pakistanis the reality right now is [21:49] rising energy bills they're dealing with power cuts the tightening grip of imf conditions now against [21:55] that backdrop how does the this government make the case that its role as a mediator in these peace talks [22:02] really matters does geopolitical prestige have any currency with pakistanis when the cost of living [22:11] crisis is so bad i i would say that it is um temporary this the mediation role and the benefits that we [22:21] could get from this mediation role are absolutely temporary i mean there's there's no price you can't [22:27] quantify pride um and i don't think that it will last if it does not translate into substantial economic [22:36] benefits so the current cost of living inflation petrol prices power cuts uh these are all a result [22:45] of the current conflict between iran the israel and the us and the the control over the strait of [22:54] or most of the closure of the strait of almost so some of these will go away so i would say that you [22:58] know under the current imf stabilization program you saw that inflation had been going down uh there is [23:05] some positive movement in terms of um for instance um exports obviously not enough what we need is big [23:12] investments stability especially with iran is absolutely necessary for a very key project the [23:18] mediation is not just about branding or prestige the mediation efforts are really crucial to pakistan's [23:26] stability and economic growth so that there is a trickle-down effect uh to the people who are [23:32] skeptical of this government's legitimacy amber raheem shamsi the editor at the digital news platform [23:41] nukta thank you very much for speaking with us here at the listening post today thank you richard [23:48] and finally israeli soldiers war crimes and the issue of accountability last week an image emerged [23:54] online from israeli occupied south lebanon it showed an israeli soldier taking a sledgehammer to a [24:00] statue of jesus christ then came the outrage on social media forcing prime minister netanyahu to [24:06] condemn the act and the soldiers involved have been jailed for 30 days consider for a moment what [24:13] lessons other israeli soldiers will take from this along with what they've learned since october 7th 2023 [24:20] they can slaughter countless palestinian civilians in gaza including tens of thousands of women and [24:26] children post evidence of their war crimes online with impunity they can kill hundreds of palestinian [24:33] journalists in gaza and now they are killing lebanese journalists too with zero accountability [24:39] but if they destroy a christian statue which is not a living thing and risk offending donald trump [24:46] and his evangelical base in america they might end up behind bars this is a story that informs us [24:52] of who and what really matters to israeli politicians one last point and we have no evidence of this [24:59] it's just a guess the prison conditions for those soldiers won't be overly harsh