Interview with Palitoy Toy Designer - Bob Brechin

[00:00:00] Speaker 1: hello and welcome to a very very special iconicon event it's my absolute pleasure to be sitting down today with someone who i've actually bob did you realize it's 10 years ago this month that we first met in person um it was yes um but i'm sitting down today with a legend of the british toy industry a toy designer who worked at palatoy uh he was on the action man line for 17 of the 18 years it was in existence he's the designer of the robo skull from action force the kraken and and just countless other amazing british toys it's my absolute honor to introduce bob breakin bob how [00:00:59] Bob: are you today i'm great there tony yeah i'm great just been on a walking tour in uh north of here up in the derbyshire peak district very nice very nice keeping up your fitness for your walking football well i've given that a bit of a knock on the head at the moment because i've got a groin strain but i didn't want to dump i didn't want to go back before i went walking you know i wanted to repair and so i might go back uh in a week you know perhaps a week or two nice nice um just [00:01:31] Speaker 1: quickly gonna bring up a chat here from jody thank you very much for the super chat he says some extra love for the final day of iconicon much appreciated jody um so bob we have um obviously known each other for actually known each other a little bit more than 10 years because we were in email communication and i spent quite a long time with you um in colville in 2011 interviewing you at length about particularly the action man toy line and that is really what you kind of worked on through the 60s and the 70s um but with this being a 1980s uh convention and the fact that i never really interviewed you for action force i really want to discuss with you over the next kind of hour hour and a half the work that you did in palatoy from kind of 1980 to 1984 and a vast majority of my audience are interested in action force so um i don't know where you would like to begin um maybe maybe uh give us a bit of an insight into kind of what where palatoy was and what it was doing at the turn of the decade well yeah because [00:02:45] Bob: action man was this sort of um uh flagship product of palatoy really um started in uh 66 when we got the license from hasbro to do gij but we called it action man and i joined in 67 and i got on to all that um uh explorer stuff you know adventure and explore exploration yeah so um that was the first sort of major outfits i was designing and then i got onto things like this scorpion tank so i designed that and and then we got on to um other things like the 105 millimeter light gun uh we actually got both those out before the british army did by the way i claimed the time there bob yeah they yeah they were very helpful the well the scorpion tank was um alvis we went down there and got drawings and photographs to do that and i saw this 105 millimeter gun in the national press so i rang up the um the royal arsenal down in woolwich in london and said can we do your 105 millimeter gun for action man of course action man was quite well known by then and a lot of regiments were sort of knocking on the door for their outfits to be done and the arsenal said the royal arsenal said come down and do it so that that was given over to either edmund who was uh a designer with me at the time he did most of the work on that but actually man was very popular became he got a 10-year award in 1976 for his 10 years of longevity and then um in in the 1980 of course going on to the period you want to talk about it got the um toy of the decade so the toy of the 70s yes but at that period um of course star wars came out didn't it in uh the film came out in 77 and kind of started designing the stuff up to 78 and they brought out that um what do you call it [00:05:00] Speaker 1: nothing in the box oh the yeah the early birth certificate package yeah the empty cardboard [00:05:08] Bob: envelope yeah the cardboard envelope of course we got the license being um a sister company of kenner as part of the general mills toy group we got the license to um distribute in this country so we did some work on star wars in 78 we did the card death star which i think is very popular with [00:05:29] Speaker 1: people isn't it very much so very much so did you what was your involvement in that [00:05:37] Bob: what was my involvement yeah uh well it was an idea that came from the um the advertising agency in in london um they were the agency that um 20th century fox went through to get things approved in this country they came out with a sort of rough mock-up of this thing but it wasn't he couldn't make it really uh so we had to redesign it and um um and uh added bits to it really we we we added the uh i think we added the trash compactor we added this the little slide thing you know we put your figure through and it falls into the trash yeah yeah we put um central column in with a with a mirror at the bottom so you could look like we're not forever um we put uh a cannon on the top with pinched a couple of cannons off the x-wing fighter for that um so we oh and we put some when we did the artwork we asked for for storm troops to be put on the artwork of the walls so if yeah if the child had a few figures but it didn't have many stormtroopers there was plenty of storm troopers running around you know yeah yeah oh and the corridor on the top is completely unworkable so we had to redesign that to make it simple because the child after all had to put this together from a flat card as you know so we had to make and brian turner worked a lot on this and now brian turner was originally the display manager so he was in charge of displaying toys at the toy fairs but he came on to design in his in the latter years and he he had the job to design most of the um the death star so he designed the clips which were very important to hold the thing together um yeah so that's how the death star came about so um i was involved as sort of manager part of it with input on design you know but brian did most of the work and the original idea came from outside so that's basically the death star but we did other things like we redesigned um some of the play sets like the cantina so yeah whereas the american camera version was all plastic ours was backing forming and uh mostly card um so that's basically what we did on star wars but after that when it goes into the 80s we didn't it was all kenner development and yeah you're just you're just [00:08:12] Speaker 1: importing stuff and putting it onto a palette or box or a card yeah we just can't distribute us and [00:08:17] Bob: then of course um in 81 the whole of the management team of palletoy bob simpson was managing director and various other directors and virtually the whole of the marketing department all up to went because they could see that kenner not kenner but the toy group which was kenner parker brothers palletoy in uk mirror mccano in france and so on that uh the toy group wanted to be to go into global branding so all products were going to be designed in the states and the companies in europe were just distributors right yeah so all the management in palletoy left we had a new management team come in but before they left um action man was having a bit of a tough time because of star wars um i could show you something here because um greg hughes you spoke to greg hughes haven't you i speak to him often on email yeah but he you know he came up with uh the space rangers yep so that was a a way of counteracting the effects that star wars is having an action man so get greg left and i i carried on his styling so [00:09:37] Speaker 1: i designed the um i think you got one on your desk haven't you i i do and i've actually i've got another camera set up and we might just put that close up there so i've got the space ranger commando there [00:09:48] Bob: oh you you you've got the special team there haven't you oh yes i've got the the missile assault which which i actually designed after greg had left i designed that because i followed his designing on special team because he did the ground assault and the underwater assault so greg had left so i got back in designing more rather than managing so i thought i'll carry on his sort of styling so that um missile assault on your desk i did which i think you got from me didn't you i did i did and [00:10:22] Speaker 1: that's that makes it extra special to me the fact that it came from the bob breaking collection so [00:10:27] Bob: yeah it did so i got this one as well tony very nice yeah which is the space ranger commando so that's what happened you know it got eventually we it disappeared it went back to hasbro basically yeah because um they didn't want um they wanted to pursue their global branding of american products and action man wasn't well it was a competitor wasn't it it was gig it was asbro yeah so they wanted to get it back give it back to hasbro so um we tried to save it and we came up with some new designs and everything but they wouldn't wouldn't pay they wouldn't they wouldn't give us the money for the developments and the tooling so action man went but before it went um and before the old management team of palito left in 81 they thought ah one of the marketing guys thought we ought to do action man in the same scale as star wars so that's what we did and uh i mean german stormtrooper [00:11:39] Speaker 1: and is that am i am i correct in thinking that that's a prototype you're holding there [00:11:45] Bob: that is a prototype that's made of that's made of resin so what happened was i did some drawings which i think i've got somewhere um can't find them i did some drawings and um i got i got out of a sculptor in london and i gave him these drawings and said look and photographs of action man of course i said um we want to do miniature action then so you know sculpt us up a few so that's how we started uh yeah there's another oh the commander yes i mean you know this guy don't you i've got quite a few of [00:12:27] Speaker 1: those bob they might have come from you as well so what's what's that one there that's that's just a sit in sas he's just he's relaxing yeah yeah but i mean i was asking is it a resin prototype or no no [00:12:44] Bob: that one's resin and that one's made of metal oh wow now they all came out the same mold so what happened yeah i mean a lot of your people don't know how it's done but it's originally written as a problem they're originally sculpted in um wax and then you take uh then you take silicon rubber molds off and then you put them all back together and then you can pour in resin into the molds so that figure would have a body mold two two arm molds a head mold two leg molds very nice you pour the whack you pour the resin in take them out and then you have to clean them up and then assemble the figure and uh decorate [00:13:31] Speaker 1: it so um if you don't mind bob we'll just take a moment to catch we've got a few questions from the audience here so um jody's asking a question on behalf of dusty toys dusty toys is a a young boy who started a youtube channel i think i shared a video with you where i sent him a birthday message oh yes um and he's asking bob what's your favorite toy that you've ever designed the robo skull i knew it i'm sure we're going to get on and talking about the robo skull in a bit uh we've got a few more questions here i'll just quickly pull up um we've got excuse me uh resolute one two three uh this this this is a guy's a friend of mine he's a veteran and he does a lot of like the comic artwork so i don't know if you've seen the logo of me kind of dressed up like an action force figure here he designed this artwork and he says um sorry tony i just woke up and late to the party um but to bob thank you for bringing joy to children around the world [00:14:45] Bob: they like tony are your legacy well yeah but it's a team effort at palitoi yeah a team of designers and a team of marketing men i mean it's the marketing men that lead you know they know what the market wants we come up with ideas and sketches and prototypes and things and present it to marketing and they're the the ones who decide which ones to go with luckily they went with the robo skull i thought i didn't [00:15:12] Speaker 1: think i'll get that one through um my friend salvador he says um no need to read this message aloud but showing support and love for tony and mr bob your work is legendary oh thanks very much and uh connor fuller um who i believe is an irish supporter of the channel i hope i didn't get that wrong oh no he says dublin there oh he says bob growing up in dublin in the 1980s i had a lot of action force thank you for the thousands of hours of fun you brought me forever grateful nice very that's very pleasing to hear lovely and we've got one more here from the audience um from daniel dorian he says question for the palitoi legend himself why and how did you manage to alter some of the ken of star wars products such as the x-wing and the land speeder so i think he's asking [00:16:07] Bob: sort of why why the electronics were removed well it's cost really um i mean the american market's that but 10 times the uk market so yeah you have to i mean when they first came out star wars we had a price for the i mean if that's a star wars thing to say that that was 99p or whatever it was but we didn't we didn't have any prices really for the vehicles that we could give to um retailers uh yeah until a bit later on so we have to go through a process of getting down to a price you know that marketing could do but um yeah i i went with roger morrison who was the tooling manager i went to kenner um has it was in november 77 we went over there together and we saw the first land speed the next wing coming off and and the guys that kind of were putting them together the moldings to make sure the mold is fitted and and so forth so um yeah and then we came back and and then roger he took out the electronics and on the land speedy he he took off the lifting bonnet hood is it uh yeah uh no i call it a bonnet bob so he made it all one one molding didn't he that was another thing yeah so um it was cost really and that's why we didn't take that uh i'm not too sure that whether we could get couldn't get sometimes we borrowed the tooling but we made our own tooling for x-wing and land speeder we borrowed the tooling for the tie fighter yeah i'm not sure whether we couldn't get the tooling for the the death star play set that kenner did or whether it was too expensive for us i think it's probably the [00:17:57] Speaker 1: latter that's why we went for card okay okay um and a question here for uh from jody but on behalf of um plotman uh because he couldn't make it to this live but he wanted to ask you would you have liked to see the zargon faction in action force perhaps as an allied force with iron blood so that's an [00:18:22] Bob: interesting thought isn't it we could have scaled him down can we yeah that was one of greg's uh come out of greg's imaginations uh captain zargon yeah that was brilliant yeah a lot a lot of people [00:18:38] Speaker 1: have asked me that over the years would i've liked to have seen captain zargon and the zargonite pirates [00:18:43] Bob: in action force but of course they had the skull and crossbones didn't they as well yes they did because they were space pirates whereas um iron blood was uh was an earth pilot but more modern sort of [00:18:56] Speaker 1: fantasy yeah so that figure just there by your right hand um that looks like a desert rat it is a [00:19:07] Bob: desert rat and um he's made of metal oh wow that's really very nice it's lasted this one that's one of the figures that went on the um the uh toy deck toys fair display in 1982 as did that one as did that one and all the they all went on that first um action force display and um the and if you look at this [00:19:45] Speaker 1: i'll just put you on the full screen again bob and show you that yeah [00:19:50] Bob: that's the very first mock-up card for the blister card for the figures that dave dave barnacle did now dave barnacle was uh he didn't work for palletoy but he worked well he worked for palletoy but he had his own company um he did a lot of the action man stuff and when action force came out he did all the action force uh packaging so that's the very first original one that he'd mocked up [00:20:15] Speaker 1: which i managed to save as well yeah yeah very nice and this would have been what 1981 you because the line came out in 82 so you would have been working on this in 81. that would have been done in [00:20:29] Bob: um sort of the autumn 81 probably yeah and then and then it was put it was probably um it was probably scanned and copied to make you know mock-ups for the toy fair because yeah yeah it may not have been ready and then we'd blank out german stormtrooper and put in you know uh doesn't wrap yeah as a matter of fact actually here we go [00:20:59] Speaker 1: this might be something else i got from you bob that's um oh you did yeah that's an actual example of the first issue card there with the sas figure that was very kindly gifted to me by by my [00:21:11] Bob: my friend bob brikins thank you so yeah you've got a production one there and the prototype [00:21:17] Speaker 1: mucker yeah they do they do look a little a little different though oh yeah yeah so on on the on the [00:21:23] Bob: production version it's actually photographs of the figures yeah yeah these are well photographs of prototypes actually well they're prototypes on that yeah yeah yeah and you can see the figures are in a different order because the desert rats down there bottom whereas you've got the pilot yeah uh yeah [00:21:41] Speaker 1: that's right yeah and the desert rats he's up at the top here so yeah slightly different yeah um but but but so it was dave barnacle was it dave barnacle who designed the color scheme and the logo and [00:21:54] Bob: everything as well dave did all that yeah yeah very nice and and that had been um directed by marketing because that wasn't part of the design function the packaging so that mike taylor i think it was mike taylor he was in charge of yeah he was in charge of action and action force at the time just and it's just before he left with all the others you know in 81 so he directed dave to do that artwork [00:22:24] Speaker 1: um thank you jamie roberts for the super chat but he didn't have a question there um but thank you i was actually i think jane i was just chatting to him before i started this stream so all right so when we get to uh 1982 obviously we we shrink action man down to the star wars scale we have vehicles and we bring out a cardboard headquarters yeah [00:22:52] Bob: we did the vehicles weren't designed they were designed by raffo and pay an external design company that's that's the original drawing for the um yep so they did they come up with um ideas for the i was concentrating on the on the figures and and so we got them into come up with some schemes for vehicles yeah that's great and um and oh the multi-mission craft yes craft which was became a good line when we changed over in 80 um 83 yeah yeah a lot of people are taking that vehicle now and making all sorts of uh vehicles out of it [00:23:39] Speaker 1: they they are they are yes um we've got then daniel housing got a question for you bob he said and thank you daniel for the super chat he says what would have been the next innovation for action man i think he's meaning if they kept going so obviously we had the hair the hand eyes so we have the hair [00:24:01] Bob: you know which bill pews saw on tomorrow's world on tv and said that's a good idea the gripping hands which of course i sculpted um what became all the eagle eyes that came from hasbro yeah uh then we had the sharpshooter position which oh yes yeah i forgot that one yep yeah push it over [00:24:22] Speaker 1: his adam's apple yep so he could be uh in a sniper position yeah and of course that um made a lot of the [00:24:28] Bob: heads come off because it snapped but we were working at the time on um i was working with an engineer a engineer in the department to do a grimace g-r-a-m-e-g-r-a-g-r-i-m-a-c-e a grimace you know [00:24:52] Speaker 1: yeah she was she wore a face [00:24:58] Bob: so basically it was another lever on the back of his neck yeah so you've got the lever for moving the eyes but another lever as he moved it back and forward he went ah oh because we couldn't get the money to we're working on it but we're making mock-ups and things but we couldn't get the money for it actually man was sort of on its way out then this is sort of yeah early eighties you know yeah um and uh it started because of star wars we couldn't get the money to do any real development and tooling so it died to death that idea and we had another idea as well to elect um to make the talking action man the talking commander electronic oh yeah instead of having the voice box you know yeah and we were working with um we did i think we did a bit of work with um texas instruments on that so we would have a look and what we were trying to do and it was all pie in the sky because we were never going to do it because actually mine was on the way out but um we wanted to get the kid to record his own voice into the into into it with commands and things you know and then and then sort of interact and interact with action man as it were yeah yeah and that's when electronics was first coming in you know in toys late late 70s wasn't it when we had um uh merlin do you remember merlin i do remember merlin yeah that was one of the first electronic games wasn't it yeah and then of course you've got electronics in star wars and stuff and we're trying to we're trying to put electronics into action man but we couldn't get the money to really push it forward yeah yeah so that's what we were doing if that answers the question what i think so yeah yeah [00:26:56] Speaker 1: um sergeant slaughter slaughterhouse uh okay i've seen no question but thank you for the for the super chat and oh two more questions here um one from jody says can we see some tony's eagle eyes still he's joking with me bob because sometimes i've actually sat here on on youtube talking about eagle eyes and i just go like that and then and then people would chop that little bit of video footage and add it together um and i know daniel says does he do you think he could be reflocked he's uh he's bought do you think we can electrostatically flock a human being we both need a bit of reflocking don't we well i i do i've got like a little bit here but a big patch missing there and stuff um and this question this is from joseph who is um joseph is a very good friend of mine he says mr breakin it's an honor sir and i'd like to extend a kung fu grip to the gripping hand in thanks for being such a huge part of making my geo joe adventure team figure so awesome back in 1977. so he's um heaping praise on you for for giving the um the adventure team the gripping hand [00:28:20] Bob: we always thought the kung fu grip was a funny name [00:28:27] Speaker 1: yeah and with the hair it was only in the uk it was realistic hair and there it was lifelike hair that um yeah those two those two names are both you know perfectly uh perfectly acceptable but um [00:28:43] Bob: gi joe as you know um yeah ended up with alopecia because they they chose the wrong resin it was it was a rigid resin they used to hold the flock onto the head yeah if you scrape you squeeze the head the resin cracked and the hair fell off [00:29:03] Speaker 1: ah is that is that what it is because i through my almost 30 years of collecting i know i mean you still get action man figures with with hair missing but you get a few like little patches um gi joe adventure team are a lot more prevalent for having massive areas of hair missing uh they used a different [00:29:22] Bob: resin today it was a more rigid resin yeah um that's when they were first doing it because when we when we did the hair bill pew called over um don levine's guys you know his engineers to come over to see the process and they went back and started their own presses of doing it but when they first did it they used the wrong resin but nick farmer it was nick farmer who was um the marketing manager of action man at the time he was a bit worried when he heard about this so he took an action man head and put it on the on the instead of the gear knob on his on the gear stick of his um his mini he put an action man head and he drove around changing gear for miles and miles and miles to see if the head would come off [00:30:14] Speaker 1: and it and it didn't yeah that's a that's that's an ingenious way to test it isn't it so so when we get to well the toys came out in 1983 but for you it would have been the one you did in pardon action for us i'm talking about the second wave where we got to the team yeah the second way yeah so so these guys that's right that's right um so they came out first came out in 83 so you would have been working on that line in in 82. yeah so what was it like as a designer to all of a sudden be given rather than just shrinking down action man being given some creative license to introduce characters that went along with the back story was that did that appeal to your sensibilities [00:31:11] Bob: well i'm leading on from the story now about the marketing team and bob simpson managing director leaving the company in 81 because i said mike taylor was in charge of action man and action he set up action course as a marketing thing we designed it like this like mini action men and then he left and bob simpson left um peter waterman came in as managing director and there was a guy called andy lowe came in there's a action man and action force marketing manager replacing mike taylor and um it was it was he that came across and said um we want to take action action force away from action man um turn it into a fantasy concept yep right and um so that's when we started sort of coming up with ideas of what this fantasy concept should be so um i think this was an earlier one actually this was a concept before that can you see that i can yeah now that's based on greg hughes um special team styling of action man because when uh when mike taylor said we wanted to do miniature action man i thought at the time we'd need to change it from we don't want to copy action man let's let's extend greg hughes's designs and call it the assault force you know action man assault force so i came up with different ideas of different uniforms so yeah this could have this could have been the original action force instead of miniature action then but um then um as i said uh the new team came in in 80 at the end of 81 and they said oh um we want to take take it away from action man we don't want it look like action man star wars is the big thing fantasy was a big thing uh space and everything you know story lines as you said you know it's got to have a story because action man never had a story kids made up their own stories yeah so we came we're coming up with ideas and i was i was going oh i'm a bit of a i'm a bit of a science fiction um freak you know when i was younger i used to read a lot of science [00:33:35] Speaker 1: fiction i still do this is what i think what enthusiast this is one idea i came up with wow i've never seen that before bob you're holding out on me here but you haven't because [00:33:50] Bob: this is this was an idea um i'll just read what it says on the front scenario for futuristic concept for four inch figures place planet earth time listen to this time 2010 a.d it says the earth has been ravaged by the deadly germans from outer space warlords from the planet jar laid waste to all the cities on earth and made them uninhabitable ruling the planet from a gigantic space city which hovers over the equator the inhabitants of earth are slaves to the germans but a resolute band of action men and maintain their freedom and are resisting the enemy from bases and their outfits blending with natural colors of the land etc so yeah that was one of my ideas wow sort of like sort of like robin hood in the forest you know you know yeah yeah lincoln green and these guys come from the planet um planet jar which is all purple and black and horrible yeah yeah yeah so that was one idea but i never i don't know whether i actually showed it to them but i come up with one of two ideas like that and that's the only thing i got from it but of course we sat down with marketing and um we came out with the idea of um baron iron blood and and and the red shadows as a an evil group or baron iron but was like a uh he's trying to take over the world um you know a bit like james bond you know yeah these characters are trying to take over the world in some way so we came up with baron iron i think we had a record left by then um but um i'm just looking for another drawing okay oh it is so i got correct i got great to draw up what aaron bar we tried all sorts of things we added in capes and uh other things and dressed in black dressed in red just you know but [00:35:59] Speaker 1: that was yeah i've i've seen one chodo where he's he's got like darth vader's cape on and his face is [00:36:04] Bob: green yeah yeah yeah i've got a i've got a photograph somewhere a figure with the cape on but that's what greg drew up and uh i said yeah i said to greg he's a pirate you know he's he's got he's got this band of misfits from that he's sort of recruited from different parts of the world um outsiders basically you know that got a grudge and all that sort of stuff you know so that's that was his drawing and of course he remember um what's his name in australia ned kelly ned kelly yeah with the with the helmet yeah that was um what's his name wasn't it pardon was it nick jagger was it i think so yeah yeah so that's buying that baron iron blood and of course we had to make the um the red shadows and we had to use figures from the original moldings from the tools because they wouldn't give us any money to really make new figures so all these all these figures we had to take the arms and legs and the bodies and the heads and sort of mix and match them around to make different characters yep so we took the stormtrooper and we just we sculpted his head basically [00:37:34] Speaker 1: a molded in red and he kept a red shadow it worked though it worked um it's gonna read a quick comment here from nick thank you very much he said bob uh your work is still inspiring uh your work still inspires the next generation jacks my seven-year-old son plays with your toys daily and he's hoping to meet you at am com uh action man com this month oh yeah yeah it's yeah it's the end of july isn't it [00:38:04] Bob: yeah it's in i think so i don't know it's the end of july in um the old palletoy factory nice nice [00:38:14] Speaker 1: hopefully once all this pandemic's over i'll be able to travel back to england again and uh yeah yeah [00:38:19] Bob: yeah great yeah yeah that's alan dawson he runs the action man com yeah yeah because we i managed to get in this place to in the factory but in the office block there's a big conference room and i found it uh eventually and we that's when we have the 50th anniversary in there yes yeah it's a good location isn't it for that yeah yeah plenty of parking and everything if anybody wants to come you know plenty of parking um good society it's the hallowed ground of action man and any other palletoy toys yeah and of action force of course and star wars so so that's what we do so that the german stormtrooper became the red shadows with a different head um some of these other guys i mean there was we had the sas team so the frogman became black sas frogman yeah also is is i think [00:39:18] Speaker 1: his torso and arms were used for baron iron blood yeah i think you're right yeah yeah i think he's got the the legs of the german stormtrooper and the torso and arms of the frogman yeah well you people know [00:39:30] Bob: more about this than me because i forget all this sort of stuff but it makes the match the bits around anyway so uh yeah the sas team let's say marketing one of various teams of action force to to um counter the threat of baron iron blood and the red shadows i mean the the classic one was the um [00:39:56] Speaker 1: i haven't got a mutant but the mutant wasn't it because it was yeah the indestructible death robots [00:40:05] Bob: so we were looking for a robot what can we do for a robot like i thought i thought we'd take the we'd take the uh dc diver and he's got these holes you know either side so yeah stick things in you know like antennae and bits and pieces death rays and all that sort of stuff so we turned him into the mutant and then what was that there was the um q force yeah and the z force of course the z force was the um regular sort of army with the heavy equipment you know the tanks and stuff yeah and uh sas were the covert ones to get in you know amongst uh baron iron blood and his red shadows and the q force were um uh water and underwater and then there was a space force yeah and space all these all these all these figures all the tooling for these figures was used to make the figures for the second wave as it were [00:41:08] Speaker 1: the red shadow wave yeah yeah so i'm i'm we we've been this is flown by bob we're going for we've been going for over 40 minutes already and i know that a lot of people out there want to talk about the robo skull i want to hear you talk about the robo skull and actually and something i've always wanted to i've always been curious as to whether or not you still had a robo skull in your own personal collection i haven't got i haven't got a production one you haven't got a production one so i've never kept one but i do so this is the prototype so you know i never even knew that the prototype existed and we were chatting just before the start and i instantly recognized that the front face of that toy doesn't look like the production example no and you were telling me a story that you rescued it from a skip bin [00:42:11] Bob: well this the robo skull is part of the second year of of the red shadows isn't it yeah so yeah it came out in 84. i mean the first year we were we were limited on tooling because they didn't have the money to give us because it became so successful the red shadow baron islander and the red shadows became successful um they gave us some money so we started designing some new products yeah so i designed the robo skull and i i've lost the original model because the original model is a bit smaller than this and it was i sculpted it in wax added some wings on bits and pieces and and then i this was the original pilot for the rodeo skull and wasn't he originally called robo skull he was originally caught yeah i called him robo skull because i took the robo skull and this guy to the new products meeting with marketing and the managing director sales director that's the sort of they're the ones that decide what's going on you know so um i took these two in and said uh you know how about these for you know for the for the red shadows and i said this is robo skull and this is what i call it actually skull fighter or something whatever um and um they said great we've got to do that and they said he's not the robot he's not the robo skull that's the robo skull so that got called robo skull and they said oh we'll do that we do this guy as well but we're doing as a male away so we want you to go away and um sculpt a new pilot for the robo skull so here's the here is the very first modeling i did for red wolf very nice you see it sculpted around another figure and exist yeah molding so i originally sculpted to that just to get the idea of what he should look like now i've got a drawing as well so that's your original sort of concept design drawing sculpting yeah and you know so when you [00:44:42] Speaker 1: would do those drawings would you be the one who writes the backstory on there as well well i wrote [00:44:47] Bob: a story on here of some sort because the comic when the comic people got hold of this they changed they changed a lot of the stories we come up with this is this is this is baron ironbird speaking right yeah i found red wolf leading a pack of wolves deep in the forests of northern sweden he had as a child been reared by a pale wolves after a pack killed his explorer parents that's my take on red wall the bit at the bottom is ruthless cunning and totally unpredictable during the phase of the full moon full moon red wolf was partly humanized at baronet baron's hq and trained to operate the terrible new flying machine robo skull his specially designed armored suits withstands the terrific g-forces involved when rubber skull carols out carries out its amazing maneuvers so that was my take on robo skull i don't know red wolf yeah and that's that's the original mock-up i did and this is the that's the actually the the final sculpting and you can see you can see holes in the legs where where are we yep all right what happens is um you put pins in there um through there and um to make an armature to sculpt on and then take them out and same in the arms but that's it and then you can see the pins now look because this is a there's a resin version oh yeah yep so that's the resin version which would which would have gone after the tool maker to make the uh molds the tooling molds for the um the body and i think what you're you told me now what what do we use for arms and legs [00:46:48] Speaker 1: because i can't remember what what do you what do you mean the material or no no because we used [00:46:55] Bob: stones and next from another figure one of the existing figures oh for um let me pull him out [00:47:02] Speaker 1: so i think the legs are from the ground assault is it yeah the legs are from the special team yeah no legs and arms are both from special team i've got it i've just pulled him out oh yeah yeah that's right yeah i remember now oh yeah so you've basically so all the torso's new all that torso's new and the legs and arms are from the special team figures either the arctic assault or the ground assault so yeah so [00:47:25] Bob: this is this is the resin model that would have well gone off to um for tools to make the tournament yeah they're there to take their own casts off to make uh beryllium copper molding moldings to go in the the tool yeah yeah the the um the inserts in the tool were made of beryllium copper so they cast those well they take that's the very process they have to go through but it eventually ends up as beryllium copper and they go into a steel bolster in the injection molding tool and then the injection injection mold the two halves of the body as a two impression tool probably yeah so that's uh so that's what in robo school that's how it got uh i was you know i was a bit sort of when i went into that meeting i [00:48:15] Speaker 1: thought they're never going to accept this and how long had you been working on it at that point when you went into that meeting roughly probably a month or something i don't know i did a lot i did a lot of [00:48:28] Bob: sketches of something with a skull on a vehicle with a skull on so there were land vehicles flying vehicles all sorts of different vehicles with some some with tracks on you know and then i eventually ended up deciding this was the one to do you know yeah so yeah so what i did i sculpted it up in clay and got bits of plastic and mocked it up you know sculpted it sculpted up this guy took it to the meeting thinking oh they're never going to accept this as two way out yeah yeah but as fate would have it we [00:49:09] Speaker 1: ended up getting yeah probably the most iconic toy to ever come out of palletoy i would say [00:49:18] Bob: but i know that's that's what that's it as i say i kept i saved this from the it was going everything was going in the skip you know at the end of toy fair so i saved all the thing i saved all the figures i've got in quick and saved all the figures and saved this but it got damaged i know i don't know it got damaged now but these but the two the two uh cannons in the eyes broke off that one's broken off um you can see the little canopy that goes on the back yeah that's damaged and um because that's that's the molded version yes yeah that's the prototype version which is damaged and it's similarly with the um with the canopy on the front there's there's the molded version and there's the prototype version which is damaged so yeah i was pleased to have been able to save that because i i spent i mean i can show you some of the drawings that led up to it um i mean this is a different this is a drawing if you can see this on the screen yeah we can see that yeah so that's a drawing i did when i was trying to work out how to get two figures in and then i had this idea of putting um another figure in which was a captured captured action force figure underneath yeah brainwashing department or something yeah but you can see um the top of it's quite different yes it is yeah um so that's an early drawing and i've got another one here which is uh show this is sort of exploded view to show how it operates inside [00:51:12] Speaker 1: and how the moldings all fit together and that so one of the one of the first ideas was like to have the whole kind of top section of the skull removable well yeah yeah well i don't know removable but [00:51:25] Bob: um it might have been hinged i don't know yeah it's going to be one piece like that instead of two little canopies oh i i see i see yeah but as i developed it i found it easier to have it in two halves like the prototype is and then two little little canopies yeah so you can see how the development works works um have i got another one um oh just a colored sort of thing when i finally i think that's when i finally decided on the um where am i on the on the campus version yeah yeah now what happened then was that um usually when you're designing a product like this you'd make a prototype um you'd take castings off probably to send to the tool making everything and um and so forth and but um we had to get it out you know the lead lead time in this is quite a few months to get it out into production and they wanted it out quick so i had to deal with a company um who could work a prototype up and draw up component drawings for tool makers at the same time so what what i ended up doing was getting somebody to sculpt the uh the face bit in clay and then i got this company to take that take a a resin vat and then they started to build it up for my drawings so okay they were they were making the prototype and drawing up components at the same time together yeah they're working along in parallel as it were instead of doing this and then doing that and then doing that and then doing that [00:53:17] Speaker 1: so they're going along in parallel to get it that's that's that's quite amazing because like the the finished product is so beautiful like it does not look like something that palatoy had in a way rushed [00:53:34] Bob: but it was rushed yeah yeah but it wasn't rushed it it wasn't rushed but we checked the system changed instead of you know doing this and doing this and doing this and doing this and going through the process we're running along in parallel making the prototype and drawing it up at the same time so i was traveling to this company about every every week really yeah telling them how i wanted this bit designed yeah yeah how i wanted that you know this bit designed and how i wanted this to do and so and they were they were sort of adding changing the drawings and sculpting it at the same time and making the prototype yeah so yeah it was quite a task and uh it was a bit of a worry really because i thought this is going to work i'm going to come out wrong at the end of all this [00:54:27] Speaker 1: quite quite quite the opposite quite the opposite and then of course it goes on to um [00:54:37] Bob: i've got some uh drawings here which are um the tool one of the tooling drawings of the uh components yeah the company was called rtd um railing technical design railing technical design so that's one of their blueprints can you see that [00:55:03] Speaker 1: yes yep [00:55:06] Bob: i can't be sure what it is now wow yeah it said it's you can see you can see here like a cross section just here yeah you know this bit is that the [00:55:21] Speaker 1: that's which joins together in the middle i think yep so that's that's back in the day when everything was hand drawn wasn't it you didn't have computers and photoshop and yeah so this is this is basically the [00:55:35] Bob: assembly drawing so each of those components that's each of the components is drawn separately yeah for the tool makers to make the tool for that particular component but this is the assembly [00:55:47] Speaker 1: drawing yeah to show how all those different components go together yeah and it's they're all [00:55:53] Bob: listed here look yeah all listed there all the different components make up the robot skull and then each component will be drawn up separately uh and the tool maker would take that drawing and you know that's how i went but as i say the prototype and the and all this drawing work was going on in [00:56:13] Speaker 1: parallel yeah um we've got a couple of questions here from the audience bob so sergeant slaughter's back again he says bob mixing and matching parts to create new characters the pioneer of what 80s kids would soon be doing themselves um i think he's talking about with us customizing later on in life um thanks bob for sharing these prototypes and images and congrats tony on the new reveal and he's talking about my some some new action figure that's coming out um and there's a lot there's a lot of comments in the chat here i'm going to scroll back up um we've got kevin mccaffrey says uh thank you bob and tony for bringing back so many amazing memories of playing with action force with my brother um thank you thank you for watching the in the interview it's um i've really been looking forward to sitting down with with bob i've known him for quite some time grace is always asking after you bob yeah i love love grace yeah and um um zen's got a couple of weeks off of football because uh school holidays so but he's gotta he's gonna get next game is not next friday the friday after is his next game so [00:57:42] Bob: is he getting up early in the morning [00:57:48] Speaker 1: i should i should get him he's not very good in the mornings bob he's a grumpy teenager no he's not great he's not grumpy at all um gojotron just wants to say uh mr breakin thank you for sharing this excellent look at toy history with us amazing work and uh jeff barker says it would be cool to have bob and bobby valor compare notes on the design process from then to now um completely different when i mean you you see the i don't know if you've seen the images you know there's all these compute of this the new figure he's putting me into the action force line yeah computer renderings it's not like the old fashion style hand drawing we used to have a massive [00:58:39] Bob: great big drawing board you know and desks around us with prototypes and models and things on now they just sit there with a couple of screens yeah yeah [00:58:52] Speaker 1: yeah i remember when i when i was interviewing you for the action man documentary you know you're talking to me about um how revolutionary the invention of the fax machine was four years and here we are in today's society like i'm i'm just sitting at home in the far north of western [00:59:11] Bob: australia and i'm having a chat with you in england on video i know because bill pew my boss he was design director he used to go to hong kong twice a year you go in the spring to take new designs over you know and then go in the autumn to check up on how things are going ready ready for production so that fax machine came really useful you know yeah yeah dead facts over dead facts over something and i'd fax back you know change this whereas yeah before the fax machine you know you have to describe it over the phone [00:59:51] Speaker 1: now um i've been talking to some of my sort of close friends in in the toy community but getting ready for this interview um so this question i'm going to ask you now is on behalf of a good friend of mine who is also an active serviceman in the united states uh he's my friend his name is sal and he has got a true fascination [01:00:15] Bob: with the kraken go to go to your right oh that's it i've got him yep cracker i've got a crack in here [01:00:28] Speaker 1: was this oh sorry wrong one i'm gonna put myself on full screen there was this your original design yes and any any insights on kind of where the the idea came from or well this was the second year of um [01:00:49] Bob: barren iron blood when they gave some money [01:00:53] Speaker 1: and so the same the same year that you're creating the robo skull yeah and the skeleton yeah you you had a hat trick that year bob you had skeleton like more than a hat trick actually yeah skeleton red [01:01:06] Bob: wolf robo skull did quite yeah i did quite well really because there's a um triad [01:01:18] Speaker 1: i i was going to talk about that in a moment i wanted to talk about the cracking first let's talk [01:01:22] Bob: about cracking yeah i'm getting a bit of feedback never mind um kraken uh there was a book by john windham now science right science fiction again yeah called the what was it called the day of the kraken was it the day of the kraken and it was about um it's about extraterrestrials have come to earth or exist they were living under the sea yeah right and they came out of the sea and i thought cracking that's a great name now the kraken is a sort of mythical is it a norse north myth norse is it um yeah well [01:02:13] Speaker 1: it's yeah it's okay you know the clash of the titans stuff release the crack and the clash of the titans yeah but it's written that book no no it's a great great ecology it's great it came to mind you know [01:02:24] Bob: that these creatures coming out of this sea these ex aliens coming out of the sea and that's what gave me the idea and i i drew up something and gave it to a sculptor and said sculpt this for me would you yeah i haven't got a crack in here sorry [01:02:44] Speaker 1: i've got i've got your back bob i've got one here so um yeah so this is um this is also a really big fan favorite figure you know the the the bright green uh scaled skin really makes him stand out from uh from from the rest of the bunch and a a lot of people is it um who's who's matt paul matt paul the the crack and wakes got he does a lot of the 3d printing stuff oh the crack and wakes that's what it's called yeah so so that's that's the action force collector who's over on instagram who um is just fascinated by the kraken and takes all these photographs and he does a lot of 3d printed stuff and yeah he's a great guy great guy in the community um we've got another question here from the audience this is from um gary morgan who's also known as gary's action man channel on youtube um he's asking you know gary morgan i [01:03:52] Bob: thought i'm thinking you do yeah i've seen his youtube stuff yeah yeah it says um how were palatois [01:03:58] Speaker 1: toys durability durability tested with kids you see what you actually did like uh like like um play testing with the with kids [01:04:14] Bob: to a certain extent yeah um i mean action man was play tested to at the beginning um yeah and it's all played it was also play tested by workers at the factory um they would get some certain workers were given uh action man to play with and of course the comments were boys playing with a doll [01:04:37] Speaker 1: yeah yeah well now there's loads of grown men who play with the holes bob it's all good [01:04:46] Bob: we didn't do much in the way of durability testing we were sort of um trusted on our own expertise and luck yeah more more luck i think [01:05:00] Speaker 1: so so we've we've talked about the robo skull and iron blood and skeletron and kraken so i've got one of my favorites down here oh yeah the triad fighter yeah that's one of my ideas so so you had quite the prolific year didn't you in 1983 between all of them because this was all the same year i made up for that time when [01:05:31] Bob: others were doing it like iver and greg hughes you know when they were doing most of the hands-on stuff and i was you know going in and out sort of thing um i mean greg hughes stuff was brilliant i mean i always thought that we should have done that from the beginning that sort of stuff yeah but um yeah because greg had left and um iver he had left he unfortunately iver left on one of the rounds of redundancy in the late 70s um greg left um went on to other things another career in design and sculpting and model making and um there was just myself and brian because brian he [01:06:13] Speaker 1: the other one you like i think is the uh sea lion isn't it i i love the sea lion yes that was brian [01:06:20] Bob: turner's original idea yeah really the only two sort of designers left and mine was the um the triad which um there you go there's a drawing of the triad yeah it's very nice so i think the idea was um i was thinking all the time that you've got figures and they need to be played with and you need vehicles which take figures you know not just anything so that's why i come up with the triad there was you could have your three figures playing in the triad but what it's not just having three figures being able to play with it it's three vehicles in one well that's the other thing yeah [01:07:11] Speaker 1: that's how my child like brain worked back then i was i remember like later on with the kind of hasbro era of action force there was a vehicle called the havoc which was kind of a very futuristic looking armored vehicle which had opening panels at the back and a small like little one-seater hoverjet that came out yeah because it was two vehicles in one that's the vehicle i wanted in 1987. yeah it's the same with this like a child like mine goes i've got this one big awesome looking spaceship yeah but then also i've got three spaceships all for all for the one toy so that was the other [01:07:49] Bob: thinking as well you know to make it into three three vehicles and also to make it configure in different ways so you can change that you could change the vehicle by twisting the wind around so you pull it sorry i can't spring loaded [01:08:08] Speaker 1: oh it breaks no it didn't break just the uh one of the canopies fell off you could turn that little [01:08:15] Bob: craft around can't you oh yeah that's right that turns around so so you can fly that way around or we could fly like it like an s yeah so now to your right that's it that's it yes you've got the pilot going forward and he's got like he's got rear gunners now that was all my thinking you know this is what to do with it yeah and then kevin heath he was still with us he was our model maker um i've got the drawings i do it i drew it up for him and said make that you know and so there's been an input from him in there probably you know when he was just when he was modeling it getting the size right and everything you know but the basic the basic the basic theme was what what i was thinking yeah uh so jeff barker's [01:09:08] Speaker 1: got a question here for you bob he says um bob what were your design inspirations growing up as well as [01:09:15] Bob: what was during your time at palatoy my design inspirations yeah i don't know uh i i i stayed on at school and did a levels and did art and stuff you know yeah and uh then i went to industrial design college in birmingham um i didn't really think about toys i mean when i was a kid i didn't have any toys well hardly any toys couldn't afford them back in you know late 40s and 50s yeah you're lucky you're lucky to get a toy um i did get i remember getting a bike it must have cost my parents a lot of money you know because kids always have to have a bike and i used to bike to school on it um i remember getting in a cowboy outfit yeah so like a stetson and a sheriff's badge and holsters and guns you know yeah i think i think there were some what they called they called chaps you know they were on the yeah yeah yeah yeah i remember getting that uh that was but toys i used to go around my cousins because he had loads of toys he was his family a lot richer than ours i'd play with his toys but um i had the odd toys but i can't remember being really a toy person i was very sporty yeah well i was football mad one night i mean i mean we had the 11 plus then you know where you you set this freaking exam stupid exam to see whether you could go to uh high school to the grammar school and uh i passed the 11 plus i could gone i could have gone to the grammar school but i went to the technical school because they played football the grammar school played rugby i don't want to play rugby i want to play football yeah yeah so that's me and uh i wasn't really into toys i was at i used to live on the edge of oxford um if you know the northern bypass in oxford it goes up to headington uh is it the a40 we used to live right on the edge of the north northern bypass so behind us was countryside going up to little villages called elsefield and all these places and i spent we used to spend all our time in these hills building camps climbing trees bows and arrows you know so i suppose design inspiration i could design a good bow and arrow you know from trees like robin hood yeah and we had this special tree it was a willow tree and it grew these long long sort of shoots coming up dead straight and they made fabulous arrows so yeah very nice that was my that was my early days outside playing football in the hills [01:12:28] Speaker 1: so speaking of football bob i know i run a toy channel but um and and a lot of my i mean there are a lot of british viewers but there is a a huge proportion of american viewers who may not realize that excuse me later on tonight england are playing against italy in the in the well it was actually the 2020 european cup wasn't it got postponed due to the pandemic england have got all the way to the final they've looked amazing all the way through the competition and they're not playing football for the americans they're playing soccer that's that's right i still call it football but it's um it's it's one of the biggest england games that that we've been watching for for years yeah here we go you got your shirt ready yes i've got the english shirt on now for tonight yep are you excited for the game uh [01:13:38] Bob: i'm looking forward to it uh yeah apprehensive because italy i think have been the best teams throughout this tournament even though spain should have beaten them yep have you um [01:13:51] Speaker 1: have you got a prediction that you want to share no i um i'm not much of a betting man but i might have chucked 10 quid on a bet today [01:14:06] Bob: i'm saying england 2-1 oh yeah no i think i think it'll i think it'll be a win for italy um what should i go for two nil to italy two nil to italy okay i think they're brilliant team italy yeah we haven't really come up a team against a team yet that can really test us i don't think so it's going to be a real test for england to um get through it oh they do obviously but oh yeah yeah of course everyone hopes we do [01:14:39] Speaker 1: but um um yeah i mean even even germany only really threatened them once in that game didn't they well yeah yeah yeah um scuba pete says he uh he says um thank you bob and good luck england thank you [01:14:56] Bob: very much i think i know i think scuba pete on facebook i think yes yeah he's he's been a long time [01:15:05] Speaker 1: supporter of the channel um he's been a scuba diver most of his life lives in america and he cleans massive aquariums and fish tanks and he's a huge action force fan um became an action force fan after watching my channel so um jim largo who is a big fan of the the new action force line from bobby valer says tony thanks for sharing this interview uh mr breakin which action man designs were your favorite to bring over to the action force figure line so i think he means here in 1982 of all of those which were your favorites to bring over um i don't know i i thought i like the ss guy yeah [01:15:51] Bob: i think he was cool and i like i like the frogman yes and i think this guy's not he's quite cute you know with the by the way we sculpted him up to go on the toy fair yeah all his gear um with the radio [01:16:07] Speaker 1: backpack on there you go yeah and and very british as well you know that commando with the um that's [01:16:15] Bob: right he i mean he's a sort of an every man isn't he yeah yeah but the the british commandos had that [01:16:22] Speaker 1: very traditional looking knitted cap you know it was different everyone else's the way it was shaped [01:16:27] Bob: and everything so yeah so never good um what else have i got down there uh i mean here's quite a good one [01:16:39] Speaker 1: but he was oh yes that was okay one of my favorites as a child yeah he came in i think he was an addition to the first wave yes we did yeah there was there was like an all white one that came with the little the af9 schemobile ah he's made of metal bob bob this is the figure that i see in the early trade catalogues yeah um that really looks like the action man mounting an arctic figure that's the one the one we actually got in the final product came with the little schemobile and he looked more like the special [01:17:26] Bob: team guy with the special team head yeah he looked more like this guy didn't he yes that's right that's [01:17:34] Speaker 1: right wow so you you've you've got that original mountain and arctic prototype yeah my word could you used to dress like that didn't you i i have once or twice yeah i've i've been to sweden i've done some arctic warfare training um that was one of the highlights of my military career actually that was one of the best trips i ever did with them yeah um i'm telling you bob that we've got action force fans all over the world drooling over these prototypes at the moment there's that guy [01:18:13] Bob: uh oh which one oh yes did did he get you i can't remember if he got made yes he he did but i think [01:18:24] Speaker 1: the head was changed to the helicopter pilot head was it yeah yeah no he was called the um the night assault [01:18:32] Bob: night assault you've seen how much decoration we put on these prototypes all these little bits of color which with you know price meant taking a lot of these bits off yep you know because they're all tamper print operations yeah on the arm here yeah yellow yellow bits i can yeah i mean they were they were decorated like that but when we got to production a lot of those [01:18:58] Speaker 1: bits came off i think um us power in that that's yes it is yes he didn't he didn't come he didn't come with the stars and stripes on did he um no no no no no the finished product didn't he um uh he was he was kind of like a deluxe figure came on a big car because he had the parachute with him um no he didn't actually have the the stars and stripes on there so yeah and this guy he's metal oh wow the original metal australian jungle fighter yeah oh you're you're hoarding a few of these prototypes here oh i don't i don't i don't blame you though i'd say i i'm actually very very pleased to know um that you still have the robust gold prototype um well yeah yeah i would have been such a shame if that had have ended up in the in in the skip bin in the trash it's it it it's where it belongs and i hope it stays with you for a very very long time i think i've got a question here i think it's a question from um sunny he says the mounted weapons on some af vehicles like shadow track seem to remember resemble bow fours i'm not sure what bow fours are or the qf two pounder pom-pom um eyes you know the little the little red cannons that were interchangeable and a lot of the the first action force wave yeah so all the vehicles had them um um you said was this just a coincidence or were these in were these inspired by the two pounder pom-poms well let's have a look at the um i'll get the drawing out again well that's [01:20:56] Bob: another one um that's that's another one that didn't make it the bathroom paid through oh what what it [01:21:04] Speaker 1: what's this it's a it's a plastic it's a plastic action name command base wow we couldn't afford to [01:21:13] Bob: do the tooling for that of course so that's why i designed the um the card hq for okay similar to the death star you know yeah yeah but i mean if we'd have had the money with we may have done something like [01:21:27] Speaker 1: this every you've been helping me with my youtube videos for about five years now and every time i think you've shown me everything you've got in the archive then you pull something out and you blow my [01:21:46] Bob: mind again i keep digging them out i keep digging them out don't i oh you do there's some things that could have been for the underwater for the not the underwater the um deep sea diver deep sea diver in [01:22:00] Speaker 1: the first wave just wow just odd bits you know yeah because you you you designed a lot of the accessory sets for the underwater explorer in action man not the deep sea diver yeah the underwater explorer i did wolfhound says uh great respect to you both i have a 12 inch figure given to me when i was in the army thank you thank you very much wolfhound ah it's pleasure there's another one of the robo skull [01:22:36] Bob: just a sort of schematic thing yeah yep so yeah i was looking to say oh the guns on the the gun was on the um af7 or f9 um somebody was asking about the guns yeah yeah yeah that's yes that's right [01:22:59] Speaker 1: on all those first wave vehicles i think they all had it even the um even the diving platform had it i've got it somewhere and i can't find it um i've got my friend joseph here saying tony there's more than enough information here for a new documentary um i i really what i've been talking to bob about this for i really i've i really wanted to do a whole history of palatoy documentary for um for the centenary um but i think by the time i kind of got the idea and it was going to be a big undertaking like it's not going to be achievable but um i've got i've got a lot of future plans for for videos for youtube you know try and keep the legacy of palatoy alive and um long may it continue you know i i really want to do that kind of big epic um full history of palatoy i really want to actually start talking about some of the girls toys as well um yeah well palatoy was very well known for some classic girls toys so [01:24:07] Bob: they were i mean um i'm working with the um colville heritage society at the moment yeah we've just uh we got some money from the um the national lottery and uh this was for the centenary like you just mentioned yeah um we put on a centenary exhibition in the the old palatoy factory in that um room where the action man convention is held yeah um that was in nine 2019 and of course then covid came didn't it yeah so everything died off and um we just started to come back and start working on it again and so uh what we're doing we're recording um histories so we're interviewing people we've interviewed bob simpson and recorded all his memories because he's 98 now yeah wow we've recorded roger morrison they're coming over here to record me on tuesday oh yeah greg mentioned this in an email and i think they're going to be chatting with him we've got greg and brian lined up to talk about toy fairs and also greg's work on action man and brian's work on action force and so forth and um all this is going on a website eventually it'll be the whole world heritage society website so i'll let you know about that when it's up and running definitely and we're making a documentary we've done some work on that already we've been to the because palletoy started in um 1919 in leicester yeah by alfred edward pallet so we've been down to the old factories in they don't exist anymore but we've been down to the sites and we've done little bits there um we're going to do a do some interviewing around um the palletoy site as it is now because that is almost exactly the same as what it was when we left it's hard and um so that's all going together as a documentary so that's excellent right and uh we're doing a document a film for kids so um it's like a who do you have that program who do you think you are yeah yeah i'm familiar with that yep well we're doing that based on action man so looking back like how he was related to all the other toys you know yeah yeah the children so that's going to go on um we're scanning lots of work and photographing things like the robo scale and this and the other prototypes and we've been scanning a lot of roger's uh tooling drawings because roger's been involved and helping on that so um this is it's called the many faces of palletoy nice so i'll um yeah as soon [01:27:05] Speaker 1: as anything like that's on the website bob i'll i'll share it on the on youtube and social media so our [01:27:12] Bob: website will also link into other websites so if people are willing we'll you know we'll have analog [01:27:19] Speaker 1: toys link and oh i'd be honored i'd be honored if you did that link and you know so excellent but we'll [01:27:27] Bob: all link up together so the history of palletoy will be there for you know because i've scanned all the catalogs so all the catalogs will be on there so all the products going back to all palletoy products go basically going back to 1950 will be on that website excellent excellent so that's a little that's a little um uh thing for me you know what's the word as you get older you know you forget words i can't think of it look yeah yeah yeah it's a plug for me for the many faces of palletoy [01:28:08] Speaker 1: well look bob we're we're we're almost at time and there's there's another iconicon event on in in half an hour and i'm sure you want to get ready for the game later on tonight um but i want to um very very quickly um huey the young boy who's in that video he's got one final question here tony and bob do you like the bigger scale of action man or the smaller scale of action force oh huey you got me [01:28:39] Bob: i think they're equal yeah i think they're equal i mean i like action force because i was involved in a lot of the conceptual work of it yeah uh whereas action man is you know it was hasbro's original idea so we were just building it up to to make it into a british sort of concept yeah whereas yes but i like action man because it was the first thing i worked on and i did not work on action man and so they're they're about equal i think yeah i couldn't i couldn't take one or the other yeah and i i think [01:29:20] Speaker 1: they're um it's a great question hearing yeah it it is that there are there are great things about both like for me with action force it's um as a child with with the price points you could have a lot more vehicles in the range and yeah the characters but i also like the idea with an action man of being able to customize his his outfit and all that kind of thing so but with action man uh it revolved around [01:29:48] Bob: action man the figure and he was like for you guys when you're kids it's like your little friend wasn't it he was my best friend with action force you don't have a particular friend in there do you [01:30:01] Speaker 1: no you have like a favorite team so they're a team you know yeah so there's a difference there isn't there yeah um but look bob it's it's been absolutely fantastic to sit down and have a chat with you again um i've enjoyed it thanks very much for inviting me oh do you know we we've we've had like close to 200 people watching this live and i'm sure by tomorrow this will have like one or two thousand views on youtube so um i'm glad i'm glad you got the opportunity to uh to do your plug with the colville heritage society and all the amazing work you're doing to try and keep the the history of palatoi alive but but also a a sincere thank you just from me for all the help you've given me with the youtube channel over the years you know um a lot of the videos i've been able to put out there about palatois um toy designs would not have been possible without you and it gives me an upper hand over some of the competition on youtube so thank you very much and i think it's really fitting as well that um that we're sitting down here talking today you know 10 years to the month after we first met when you know i had also written you an email when we first got in contact saying action man action force inspired me to go into the army and now today is the day i found out that i'm becoming a new action [01:31:28] Bob: force speaker so when i talk to people i give uh i give little talks on the history of palatoi yeah and i talk about action man obviously because that's you know when i talk about you i hope you don't mind but talk about you and i say this guy apparently i say apparently he spent three or four days writing out this email to me because he didn't want to lose me i i did i it was at least two or three [01:32:01] Speaker 1: days writing this email um one of the most important emails i ever wrote in my life and i thought i might never hear from this guy again we might think i'm a complete crackpot and then after three days of writing an email i got an email back in like two hours and went oh that's a brilliant idea let's make [01:32:19] Bob: a documentary about that together well i can see that i can see the merit in it so you know yeah because i i i haven't got the capability of doing it or really really the inclination i suppose but uh you know you know i could see that well you you had a great love for the toy and i thought craig he's the man [01:32:39] Speaker 1: who can make a good job of this and i and i still do bob i still have a great love of the toy in all of them so well if we were a few minutes over time and i don't want to take any much more of your time um but thank you ever so much once again um for taking time out of your day