Full debate: JD Vance and Tim Walz vice presidential debate, hosted by CBS News

[0:00] Tonight, with just over a month to go until election day, the first and only meeting between [0:04] the two men who hope to become vice president of the United States, Democratic Governor Tim [0:09] Walls of Minnesota and Republican Senator J.D. Vance of Ohio. Now, this is likely the final [0:16] debate of this election cycle, and voting is already underway in 20 states. CBS News polling [0:21] shows this remains a race either presidential candidate could win. The CBS News vice presidential [0:27] debate starts now. Fight for every single vote, and we're going to take this country back. And we [0:32] are ready to continue to build the future together. We're going to turn this whole country red with [0:38] President Donald J. Trump's leadership. You know what's at the end of this little journey? Kamala [0:44] Harris as the next president of the United States. This is a CBS News special, live from CBS News [0:52] headquarters in New York. America decides the vice presidential debate. Good evening. I'm Nora O'Donnell, [1:03] and thank you for joining us for tonight's CBS News vice presidential debate. We want to welcome [1:08] our viewers on CBS, on other networks here in the U.S. and around the world. We have a consequential [1:14] night ahead, and our focus is the issues that matter to you, the voter. Let's introduce the [1:19] candidates. Minnesota's Democratic Governor Tim Walz, and Ohio's Republican Senator J.D. Vance, [1:25] tonight meeting for the first time. I'm Margaret Brennan. In order to have a thoughtful and civil [1:36] debate, these are the rules that both campaigns have agreed to. Questions will be directed at one [1:42] candidate who will have two minutes to respond. The other candidate will be allowed two minutes for [1:47] rebuttal. Then each candidate will get another minute to make further points, with an additional [1:53] one minute each at the discretion of the moderator. The primary role of the moderators is to facilitate [1:59] the debate between the candidates, enforce the rules, and provide the candidates with the opportunity [2:05] to fact-check claims made by each other. CBS News reserves the right to mute the candidates' [2:10] microphones to maintain decorum. We have not shared the questions or topics with the campaigns. [2:16] The stage is set. Governor, Senator, thank you for joining us. Let's get started. [2:22] Tonight, our country is facing several unfolding crises. The Middle East is on the brink of war. [2:27] Americans are suffering from the catastrophic impact of Hurricane Helene. And now a labor strike, [2:32] as 25,000 dock workers from Maine to Texas are picketing. We're going to begin tonight with the [2:38] Middle East. Margaret. Thank you, Nora. Earlier today, Iran launched its largest attack yet on Israel, [2:45] but that attack failed, thanks to joint U.S. and Israeli defensive action. President Biden has [2:52] deployed more than 40,000 U.S. military personnel and assets to that region over the past year to [2:59] try to prevent a regional war. Iran is weakened. But the U.S. still considers it the largest state [3:06] sponsor of terrorism in the world, and it has drastically reduced the time it would take to develop a [3:12] nuclear weapon. It is down now to one or two weeks' time. Governor Walz, if you were the final voice in [3:20] the situation room, would you support or oppose a preemptive strike by Israel on Iran? You have two [3:28] minutes. Well, thank you. And thank you for those joining at home tonight. Let's keep in mind where this [3:33] started. October 7th, Hamas terrorists massacred over 1400 Israelis and took prisoners. Iran or Israel's [3:43] ability to be able to defend itself is absolutely fundamental. Getting its hostages back, fundamental, [3:50] and ending the humanitarian crisis in Gaza. But the expansion of Israel and its proxies is an [3:58] absolute fundamental necessity for the United States to have the steady leadership there. You saw it [4:03] experience today where, along with our Israeli partners and our coalition, able to stop the incoming [4:09] attack. But what's fundamental here is that steady leadership is going to matter. [4:14] It's clear, and the world saw it on that debate stage a few weeks ago, a nearly 80-year-old Donald [4:20] Trump talking about crowd sizes is not what we need in this moment. But it's not just that. It's those that [4:26] were closest to Donald Trump that understand how dangerous he is when the world is this dangerous. [4:32] His chief of staff, John Kelly, said that he was the most flawed human being he'd ever met. [4:36] And both of his secretaries of defense and his national security advisors said he should be nowhere [4:44] near the White House. Now, the person closest to them, to Donald Trump, said he's unfit for the [4:51] highest office. That was Senator Vance. What we've seen out of Vice President Harris is we've seen [4:57] steady leadership. We've seen a calmness that is able to be able to draw on the coalitions to bring [5:02] them together. Understanding that our allies matter. When our allies see Donald Trump turn towards [5:11] Vladimir Putin, turn towards North Korea, when we start to see that type of fickleness around holding [5:18] the coalitions together, we will stay committed. And as the Vice President said today is, [5:23] we will protect our forces and our allied forces and there will be consequences. [5:28] Governor, your time is up. Senator Vance, the same question. [5:31] Would you support or oppose a preemptive strike by Israel on Iran? You have two minutes. [5:38] So, Margaret, I want to answer the question. First of all, thanks, Governor. Thanks to CBS for [5:41] hosting the debate. And thanks, most importantly, the American people who are watching this evening [5:45] and caring enough about this country to pay attention to this vice presidential debate. [5:49] I want to answer the question, but I want to actually give an introduction to myself a little [5:52] bit because I recognize a lot of Americans don't know who either one of us are. [5:56] I was raised in a working class family. My mother required food assistance for periods of her life. [6:00] My grandmother required social security help to raise me. And she raised me in part because my own [6:05] mother struggled with addiction for a big chunk of my early life. I went to college on the GI Bill after I [6:11] enlisted in the Marine Corps and served in Iraq. And so I stand here asking to be your vice president [6:16] with extraordinary gratitude for this country, for the American dream that made it possible for me [6:20] to live my dreams. And most importantly, I know that a lot of you are worried about the chaos in the [6:26] world and the feeling that the American dream is unattainable. I want to try to convince you tonight [6:30] over the next 90 minutes that if we get better leadership in the White House, if we get Donald Trump back in [6:36] the White House, the American dream is going to be attainable once again. Now to answer this particular question, [6:41] we have to remember that as much as Governor Walz just accused Donald Trump of being an agent of chaos, [6:46] Donald Trump actually delivered stability in the world and he did it by establishing effective [6:51] deterrence. People were afraid of stepping out of line. Iran, which launched this attack, [6:56] has received over $100 billion in unfrozen assets thanks to the Kamala Harris administration. [7:02] What do they use that money for? They use it to buy weapons that they're now launching against our allies [7:07] and God forbid potentially launching against the United States as well. Donald Trump recognized [7:12] that for people to fear the United States, you needed peace through strength. They needed to recognize [7:18] that if they got out of line, the United States global leadership would put stability and peace back [7:23] in the world. Now you asked about a preemptive strike, Margaret, and I want to answer the question, [7:27] look, it is up to Israel what they think they need to do to keep their country safe and we should support [7:33] our allies wherever they are when they're fighting the bad guys. I think that's the right approach to [7:37] take with the Israel question. Thank you, Senator. Governor Walz, [7:41] do you care to respond to any of the allegations? Well, look, Donald Trump was in office. We'll [7:46] sometimes hear a revisionist history, but when Donald Trump was in office, it was Donald Trump [7:50] who we had a coalition of nations that had boxed Iran's nuclear program in, the inability to advance [7:58] it. Donald Trump pulled that program and put nothing else in its place. So Iran is closer to a nuclear [8:04] weapon than they were before because of Donald Trump's fickle leadership. And when Iran shot down [8:09] an American aircraft in international airspace, Donald Trump tweeted because that's the standard [8:14] diplomacy of Donald Trump. And when Iranian missiles did fall near U.S. troops and they received traumatic [8:22] brain injuries, Donald Trump wrote it off as headaches. Look, our allies understand that Donald [8:30] Trump is fickle. He will go to whoever has the most flattery or where it makes sense to him. [8:35] Steady leadership like you witnessed today, like you witnessed in April, [8:39] both Iranian attacks were repelled. Our coalition is strong and we need the steady leadership that [8:44] Kamala Harris is providing. Senator Vance, the U.S. did have a diplomatic deal with Iran to [8:50] temporarily pause parts of its nuclear program and President Trump did exit that deal. He recently [8:58] said, just five days ago, the U.S. must now make a diplomatic deal with Iran because the consequences [9:05] are impossible. Did he make a mistake? You have one minute. Well, first of all, Margaret, [9:10] diplomacy is not a dirty word, but I think that's something that Governor Walz just said is quite [9:14] extraordinary. You yourself just said Iran is as close to a nuclear weapon today as they have ever been. [9:20] And Governor Walz, you blame Donald Trump. Who has been the vice president for the last three and a [9:24] half years? And the answer is your running mate, not mine. Donald Trump consistently made the world [9:30] more secure. Now, we talk about the sequence of events that led us to where we are right now, [9:36] and you can't ignore October the 7th, which I appreciate Governor Walz bringing up. But when did [9:41] Iran and Hamas and their proxies attack Israel? It was during the administration of Kamala Harris. [9:48] So, Governor Walz can criticize Donald Trump's tweets, but effective, smart diplomacy and peace [9:54] through strength is how you bring stability back to a very broken world. Donald Trump has [9:59] already done it once before. Ask yourself at home, when was the last time, I'm 40 years old, [10:05] when was the last time that an American president didn't have a major conflict breakout? The only answer [10:10] is during the four years that Donald Trump was president. [10:12] Governor Walz, we have a lot to get to. Nora? [10:14] Margaret, thank you. Let's turn now to Hurricane Helene. The storm could become [10:19] one of the deadliest on record. More than 160 people are dead and hundreds more are missing. [10:27] Scientists say climate change makes these hurricanes larger, stronger, [10:32] and more deadly because of the historic rainfall. Senator Vance, according to CBS News polling, [10:39] seven in 10 Americans and more than 60% of Republicans under the age of 45 favor the U.S. [10:46] taking steps to try and reduce climate change. Senator, what responsibility would the Trump [10:52] administration have to try and reduce the impact of climate change? I'll give you two minutes. [10:57] Sure. So, first of all, let's start with the hurricane because it's an unbelievable, [11:01] unspeakable human tragedy. I just saw today actually a photograph of two grandparents on a roof [11:07] with a six-year-old child and it was the last photograph ever taken of them because the roof [11:11] collapsed and those innocent people lost their lives. And I'm sure Governor Walz joins me in saying [11:15] our hearts go out to those innocent people. Our prayers go out to them. And we want as robust [11:20] and aggressive as a federal response as we can get to save as many lives as possible. And then, [11:25] of course, afterwards, to help the people in those communities rebuild. I mean, these are communities [11:29] that I love. Some of them I know very personally in Appalachia all across the southeast. They need [11:34] their government to do their job. And I commit that when Donald Trump is president again, [11:38] the government will put the citizens of this country first when they suffer from a disaster. [11:42] Now, Nora, you asked about climate change. I think this is a very important issue. Look, [11:47] a lot of people are justifiably worried about all these crazy weather patterns. I think it's important [11:51] for us, first of all, to say Donald Trump and I support clean air, clean water. We want the environment to [11:56] be cleaner and safer. But one of the things that I've noticed some of our democratic friends talking [12:00] a lot about is is a concern about carbon emissions, this idea that carbon emissions drives all of the [12:06] climate change. Well, let's just say that's true just for the sake of argument. So we're not arguing [12:10] about weird science. Let's just say that's true. Well, if you believe that, what would you what would [12:15] you want to do? The answer is that you'd want to reshore as much American manufacturing as possible, [12:19] and you'd want to produce as much energy as possible in the United States of America, [12:24] because we're the cleanest economy in the entire world. What have Kamala Harris's policies actually [12:29] led to? More energy production in China, more manufacturing overseas, more doing business in [12:35] some of the dirtiest parts of the entire world. And when I say that, I mean the amount of carbon [12:39] emissions they're doing per unit of economic output. So if we actually care about getting cleaner air [12:45] and cleaner water, the best thing to do is to double down and invest in American workers and the [12:50] American people. And unfortunately Kamala Harris has done exactly the opposite. [12:54] Governor Walz, you have two minutes to respond. [12:56] Well, we got close to an agreement because all those things are happening. Look, first of all, [13:01] it is a horrific tragedy with this hurricane. And my heart goes out to the folks that are down there [13:07] in contact with the governors. I serve as co-chair of the council of governors as we work together on [13:13] these emergency managements. Governors know no partisanship. They work together to solve the governors and [13:18] the emergency responders on the ground. Those happen on the front end. The federal government [13:23] comes in, make sure they're there to that we recover. But we're still in that phase where we [13:26] need to make sure that they're staying there, staying focused. Now look, coming back to the climate [13:30] change issue, there's no doubt this thing roared onto the scene faster and stronger than anything we've [13:35] seen. Senator Vance has said that there's a climate problem in the past. Donald Trump called it a hoax [13:40] and then joked that these things would make more beachfront property to be able to invest in. [13:45] What we've seen out of the Harris administration now, the Biden Harris administration, is we've [13:50] seen this investment. We've seen massive investments, the biggest in global history that we've seen in [13:56] the Inflation Reduction Act has created jobs all across the country. 2000 in Jeffersonville, Ohio, [14:02] taking the EV technology that we invented and making it here. 200,000 jobs across the country. The largest [14:08] solar manufacturing plant in North America sits in Minnesota. But my farmers know climate change is real. [14:14] They've seen 500-year droughts, 500-year floods back to back. But what they're doing is adapting, [14:19] and this has allowed them to tell me, look, I harvest corn, I harvest soybean, and I harvest wind. [14:25] We are producing more natural gas and more oil at any time than we ever have. We're also producing [14:30] more clean energy. So the solution for us is to continue to move forward that climate change is real. [14:37] Reducing our impact is absolutely critical. But this is not a false choice. You can do that at the [14:43] same time you're creating the jobs that we're seeing all across the country. That's exactly what [14:47] this administration has done. We are seeing us becoming an energy superpower for the future, [14:52] not just the current. And that's what absolutely makes sense. And then we start thinking about [14:58] how do we mitigate these disasters? Thank you. Senator, I want to give [15:02] you an opportunity to respond there. The governor mentioned that President Trump has called climate [15:06] change a hoax. Do you agree? Well, look, what the president has said is that if the Democrats, [15:11] in particular Kamala Harris and her leadership, if they really believe that climate change is [15:16] serious, what they would be doing is more manufacturing and more energy production in the [15:21] United States of America, and that's not what they're doing. So clearly Kamala Harris herself [15:25] doesn't believe her own rhetoric on this. If she did, she would actually agree with Donald Trump's [15:30] energy policies. Now, something Governor Walz said I think is important to touch upon because [15:34] when we talk about clean energy, I think that's a slogan that often the Democrats will use here. [15:40] I'm talking, of course, about the Democratic leadership. And the real issue is that if you're [15:44] spending hundreds of millions or even billions of dollars of American taxpayer money on solar panels [15:50] that are made in China, number one, you're going to make the economy dirtier. We should be making [15:54] more of those solar panels here in the United States of America. Some of them are, Tim, but a lot of them are [15:59] being made overseas in China, especially the components that go into those solar panels. [16:03] So if you really want to make the environment cleaner, you've got to invest in more energy [16:08] production. We haven't built a nuclear facility, I think, one in the past 40 years. Natural gas, [16:13] we got to invest more in it. Kamala Harris has done the opposite. That's raised energy prices and [16:18] also meant that we're doing more. Senator, your time is up. Governor, would you like to respond? [16:22] Well, look, we're producing more natural gas than we ever have. There's no moratorium on that. [16:26] We're producing more oil. But the folks know. And my, like I said, again, these are not liberal [16:31] folks. These are not folks that are Green New Deal folks. These are farmers that have been drought [16:36] one year, massive flooding the next year. They understand that it makes sense. Look, [16:40] our number one export cannot be topsoil from erosion from these massive storms. We saw it in Minnesota this [16:47] summer. And thinking about how do we respond to that, we're thinking ahead on this. And what Kamala Harris [16:53] has been able to do in Minnesota, we're starting to weatherproof some of these things. The [16:57] infrastructure law that was passed allows us to think about mitigation in the future. How do we make [17:02] sure that we're protecting by burying our power lines? How do we make sure that we're protecting lake [17:06] fronts and things that we're seeing more and more of? But to call it a hoax and to take the oil company [17:12] executives to Mar-a-Lago say, give me money for my campaign and I'll let you do whatever you want. [17:18] We can be smarter about that. And an all above energy policy is exactly what she's doing, [17:22] creating those jobs right here. Governor, your time is up. The overwhelming [17:26] consensus among scientists is that the Earth's climate is warming at an unprecedented rate. [17:30] Margaret. Thank you, Nora. We're going to turn now to immigration. The crisis at the U.S. [17:35] Mexico border consistently ranks as one of the top issue for American voters. Senator Vance, [17:43] your campaign is pledging to carry out the largest mass deportation plan in American history [17:49] and to use the U.S. military to do so. Could you be more specific about exactly how this will work? [17:57] For example, would you deport parents who have entered the U.S. illegally [18:01] and separate them from any of their children who were born on U.S. soil? You have two minutes. [18:06] So first of all, Margaret, before we talk about deportations, we have to stop the bleeding. [18:11] We have a historic immigration crisis because Kamala Harris started and said that she wanted to [18:17] undo all of Donald Trump's border policies. 94 executive orders, suspending deportations, [18:23] decriminalizing illegal aliens, massively increasing the asylum fraud that exists in our system. [18:29] That has opened the floodgates. And what it's meant is that a lot of fentanyl is coming into our country. [18:34] I had a mother who struggled with opioid addiction and has gotten clean. [18:38] I don't want people who are struggling with addiction to be deprived of their second chance [18:42] because Kamala Harris led in fentanyl into our communities at record levels. [18:47] So you've got to stop the bleeding. You've got to reimplement Donald Trump's border policies, [18:52] build the wall, reimplement deportations. And that gets me to your point, Margaret, [18:56] about what do we actually do? So we've got 20, 25 million illegal aliens who are here in the country. [19:02] What do we do with them? I think the first thing that we do is we start with the criminal migrants. [19:06] About a million of those people have committed some form of crime in addition to crossing the [19:11] border illegally. I think you start with deportations on those folks. And then I think you make it harder [19:16] for illegal aliens to undercut the wages of American workers. A lot of people will go home if they can't [19:21] work for less than minimum wage in our own country. And by the way, that'll be really good for our [19:25] workers who just want to earn a fair wage for doing a good day's work. And the final point, [19:30] Margaret, as you ask about family separation, right now in this country, Margaret, we have 320,000 [19:37] children that the Department of Homeland Security has effectively lost. Some of them have been sex [19:41] trafficking. Some of them hopefully are at homes with their families. Some of them have been used as drug [19:46] trafficking mules. The real family separation policy in this country is unfortunately Kamala [19:52] Harris's wide open southern border. And I'd ask my fellow Americans to remember when she came into [19:57] office, she said she was going to do this. Real leadership would be saying, you know what, [20:01] I screwed up. We're going to go back to Donald Trump's border policies. I wish that she would do that. [20:06] It would be good for all of us. Governor, do you care to respond to any of those specific [20:12] allegations, including that the vice president is, quote, letting in fentanyl and using kids as [20:19] drug mules, among other things regarding children? Yeah, well, the drug mule is not true. But I will [20:24] say about this, about the fentanyl, because this is a crisis of this, the opioid crisis. And the good [20:27] news on this is, is the last 12 months saw the largest decrease in opioid deaths in our nation's [20:32] history, 30 percent decrease in Ohio. But there's still more work to do. But let's go back to this on [20:37] immigration. Kamala Harris was the attorney general of the largest state in a border state in [20:41] California. She's the only person in this race who prosecuted transnational gangs for human [20:46] trafficking and drug interventions. But look, we all want to solve this. I, most of us want to solve [20:52] this. And that is the United States Congress. That's the Border Patrol agents. That's the Chamber [20:57] of Commerce. That's most Americans out here. That's why we had the fairest and the toughest bill [21:03] on immigration that this nation's seen. It was crafted by a conservative senator from Oklahoma, [21:09] James Langford. I know him. He's super conservative, but he's a man of principle, [21:12] wants to get it done. Democrats and Republicans worked on this piece of legislation. [21:16] The Border Patrol said, this is what we need in here. These are the experts. And the Chamber of [21:20] Commerce and the Wall Street Journal said, pass this thing. Kamala Harris helped get there. [21:24] Fifteen hundred new border agents, detection for drugs, DOJ money to speed up the adjudications on this, [21:33] just what America wants. But as soon as I was getting ready to pass and actually tackle this, [21:37] Donald Trump said no, told them to vote against it, because it gives him a campaign issue. [21:43] It gives him to what would Donald Trump talk about if we actually did some of these things. [21:47] And they need to be done by the legislature. You can't just do this through the executive branch. [21:52] So look, we have the options to do this. Donald Trump had four years. He had four years to do this. [21:57] And he promised you, America, how easy it would be. I'll build you a big, beautiful wall, [22:03] and Mexico will pay for it. Less than 2% of that wall got built and Mexico didn't pay a dime. [22:08] But here we are again, nine years after he came down that escalator, [22:12] dehumanizing people and telling them what he was going to do. As far as the deportation plan, [22:18] at one point, Senator Vance said it was so unworkable to be laughable. So that's where we're at. [22:23] Pass the bill. She'll sign it. Governor, your time is up. Senator, [22:28] the question was, will you separate parents from their children, [22:31] even if their kids are U.S. citizens? You have one minute. [22:35] Margaret, my point is that we already have massive child separations, [22:38] thanks to Kamala Harris's open border. And I didn't accuse Kamala Harris [22:41] of inviting drug mules. I said that she enabled the Mexican drug cartels [22:46] to operate freely in this country. And we know that they use children as drug mules, [22:50] and it is a disgrace and it has to stop. Look, I think what Tim said just doesn't pass the smell test. [22:56] For three years, Kamala Harris went out bragging that she was going to undo Donald Trump's border [23:01] policy. She did exactly that. We had a record number of illegal crossings. We had a record [23:06] number of fentanyl coming into our country. And now, now that she's running for president, [23:10] or a few months before, she says that somehow she got religion and cared a lot about a piece of [23:15] legislation. The only thing that she did when she became the vice president, when she became the [23:21] appointed border czar, was to undo 94 Donald Trump executive actions that opened the border. [23:28] This problem is leading to massive problems in the United States of America. [23:33] Parents who can't afford health care, schools that are overwhelmed, [23:36] it's got to stop. And it will when Donald Trump is president. [23:38] Senator, your time is up. Governor, what about our CBS News polling, [23:43] which does show that a majority of Americans, more than 50%, support mass deportations? [23:50] Look, we fixed this issue with a bill that is necessary, [23:54] but the issue on this is, this is what happens when you don't want to solve it. [23:57] You demonize it. And we saw this. And Senator Vance, and it surprises me on this, [24:02] talking about and saying, I will create stories to bring attention to this. [24:06] That vilified a large number of people who were here legally in the community of Springfield. [24:11] The Republican governor said, it's not true. Don't do it. There's consequences for this. [24:16] There's consequences. We could come together. Senator Lankford did it. We could come together [24:21] and solve this if we didn't let Donald Trump continue to make it an issue. And the consequences [24:26] in Springfield were the governor had to send state law enforcement to escort kindergartners to school. [24:32] I believe Senator Vance wants to solve this. But by standing with Donald Trump and not working [24:38] together to find a solution, it becomes a talking point. And when it becomes a talking point like this, [24:43] we dehumanize and villainize other human beings. Tim. [24:48] Governor, your time is up. Senator, I'll give you one minute, [24:50] but let me just ask you the question first. Please. [24:54] The governor has made the point. And I think as a sitting lawmaker, [24:58] you know that Congress controls the purse strings and any funding. So you have said repeatedly that [25:05] Donald Trump would, through executive action, solve this. Do you disagree that Congress controls [25:13] the purse strings and would need to support many of the changes that you would actually want to [25:18] implement? You have one minute. Look, Margaret, first of all, [25:20] the gross majority of what we need to do at the southern border is just empowering law enforcement to do [25:24] their job. I've been to the southern border more than our borders are. Kamala Harris has been. [25:28] And it's actually heartbreaking because the border patrol agents, [25:31] they just want to be empowered to do their job. Of course, additional resources would help. [25:35] But most of this is about the president and the vice president [25:38] empowering our law enforcement to say, if you try to come across the border illegally, [25:42] you've got to stay in Mexico. You've got to go back through proper channels. Now, [25:46] Governor Walz brought up the community of Springfield, [25:49] and he's very worried about the things that I've said in Springfield. Look, [25:53] in Springfield, Ohio, and in communities all across this country, you've got schools that are [25:58] overwhelmed. You've got hospitals that are overwhelmed. You have got housing that is totally [26:03] unaffordable because we brought in millions of illegal immigrants to compete with Americans [26:08] for scarce homes. The people that I'm most worried about in Springfield, Ohio, [26:12] are the American citizens who have had their lives destroyed by Kamala Harris's open border. [26:17] It is a disgrace, Tim. And I actually think, I agree with you. I think you want to solve this [26:22] problem, but I don't think that Kamala Harris does. Senator, your time is up. Governor, [26:25] you have one minute to respond. Yeah, well, it is law enforcement that asked for the bill. [26:31] They helped craft it. They're the ones that supported it. It was, [26:34] that's because they know we need to do this. Look, this issue of continuing to bring this up, [26:39] of not dealing with it, of blaming migrants for everything. On housing, [26:44] we could talk a little bit about Wall Street speculators buying up housing and making them [26:48] less affordable, but it becomes a blame. Look, this bill also gives the money necessary [26:54] to adjudicate. I agree. It should not take seven years for an asylum claim to be done. [27:00] This bill gets it done in 90 days. Then you start to make a difference in this, [27:03] and you start to adhere to what we know, American principles. I don't talk about my faith a lot, [27:09] but Matthew 2540 talks about to the least amongst us, you do unto me. I think that's true of most [27:15] Americans. They simply want order to it. This bill does it. It's funded. It's supported by the [27:21] people who do it, and it lets us keep our dignity about how we treat other people. [27:26] Thank you, Governor. And just to clarify for our viewers, Springfield, Ohio does have a large [27:32] number of Haitian migrants who have legal status, temporary protected status. [27:37] Well, Margaret, thank you. Senator, we have so much to get to. [27:40] Thank you, Margaret. I think it's important. We're going to turn out of the economy. Thank you. [27:43] Margaret, the rules were that you guys weren't going to fact check, and since you're fact-checking me, [27:48] I think it's important to say what's actually going on. So there's an application called the CBP [27:53] OneApp, where you can go on as an illegal migrant, apply for asylum or apply for parole, [27:58] and be granted legal status at the wave of a Kamala Harris open border wand. [28:05] That is not a person coming in, applying for a green card and waiting for 10 years. [28:09] Thank you, Senator. That is the facilitation of illegal immigration, [28:11] Margaret, by our own leadership. Thank you, Senator, for describing the legal process. [28:15] And Kamala Harris opened up that pathway. Those laws have been on the books since 1990. [28:21] Thank you, gentlemen. The CBP OneApp has not been on the books. [28:24] It's since 1990. It's something that Kamala Harris created, Margaret. [28:28] Gentlemen, the audience can't hear you because your mics are cut. [28:32] We have so much we want to get to. Thank you for explaining the legal process. [28:36] Nora? Thank you, Margaret. The economy is a top concern for voters. [28:41] Each of your campaigns has released an economic plan, so let's talk about the specifics. [28:46] Governor Walz, Vice President Harris unveiled a plan that includes billions in tax credits for [28:51] manufacturing, housing, and a renewed child tax credit. The Wharton School says your proposals will [28:57] increase the nation's deficit by $1.2 trillion. How would you pay for that without ballooning the [29:04] deficit? Governor, I'll give you two minutes. [29:05] Yeah, thank you. And Kamala Harris and I do believe in the middle class because that's where [29:10] we come from. We both grew up in that. We understand. So those of you out there listening [29:13] tonight, you're hearing a lot of stuff back and forth, and it's good. It's healthy. That's what this is [29:17] supposed to happen. You should be listening. How is this going to impact me? The bold forward plan [29:22] that Kamala Harris put out there is one is talking about this housing issue. The one thing is there's [29:27] three million new houses proposed under this plan with down payment assistance on the front end to [29:32] get you in a house. A house is much more than just an asset to be traded somewhere. It's foundational to [29:38] where you're at. And then making sure that the things you buy every day, whether they be prescription [29:42] drugs or other things, that there's fairness in that. Look, the $35 insulin is a good thing, [29:48] but it costs $5 to make insulin. They were charging $800 before this law went into effect. [29:53] As far as the housing goes, I've seen it in Minnesota, 12% more houses in Minneapolis, [29:58] prices went down on rent 4%. It's working. And then making sure tax cuts go to the middle class. [30:03] $6,000 child tax credit, we have one in Minnesota, reduces childhood poverty by a third. We save money [30:10] in the long run, and we do the right thing for families. And then getting businesses off the [30:14] ground. The law as it stands right now is $5,000 tax credit for small business, increasing that to [30:19] $50,000. Now, this is a philosophical difference between us. Donald Trump made a promise, and I'll [30:24] give you this, he kept it. He took folks to Mar-a-Lago, said you're rich as hell, I'm going to give you a [30:27] tax cut. He gave the tax cuts that predominantly went to the top class. What happened there was an $8 [30:33] trillion increase in the national debt, the largest ever. Now he's proposing a 20% consumption [30:39] or sales tax on everything we bring in. Everyone agrees, including businesses, [30:44] it would be destabilizing it, it would increase inflation and potentially lead to a recession. [30:49] Look, this is simple for you. Where are we going? Kamala Harris has said, [30:53] to do the things she wants to do, we'll just ask the wealthiest to pay their fair share. [30:57] When you do that, our system works best, more people are participating in it, [31:01] and folks have the things that they need. Senator, I want to give you a moment to respond on that. [31:05] But similarly, the Wharton School has done an analysis of the Trump plan and says it would [31:11] increase the nation's deficit by $5.8 trillion. My question is the same for you, [31:17] how do you pay for all that without ballooning the deficit? I'll give you two minutes. [31:21] Well, first of all, you're going to hear a lot from Tim Walz this evening, [31:25] and you just heard it in the answer. A lot of what Kamala Harris proposes to do, [31:29] and some of it, I'll be honest with you, it even sounds pretty good. Here's what you won't hear, [31:33] is that Kamala Harris has already done it, because she's been the vice president for [31:37] three and a half years. She had the opportunity to enact all of these great policies, and what [31:42] she's actually done instead is drive the cost of food higher by 25 percent, drive the cost of [31:49] housing higher by about 60 percent, open the American southern border and make middle class life [31:55] unaffordable for a large number of Americans. If Kamala Harris has such great plans for how to address [32:00] middle class problems, then she ought to do them now. Not when asking for a promotion, [32:05] but in the job the American people gave her three and a half years ago, [32:08] and the fact that she isn't tells you a lot about how much you can trust her actual plans. [32:14] Now, Donald Trump's economic plan is not just a plan, but it's also a record. [32:19] A lot of those same economists attack Donald Trump's plans, and they have PhDs, [32:23] but they don't have common sense, and they don't have wisdom, [32:25] because Donald Trump's economic policies to deliver the highest take-home pay in a generation [32:31] in this country, 1.5 percent inflation, and to boot, peace and security all over the world. [32:36] So when people say that Donald Trump's economic plan doesn't make sense, [32:40] I say look at the record. He delivered rising take-home pay for American workers. Now, Tim admirably [32:47] admits that they want to undo the Trump tax cuts, but if you look at what was so different about [32:52] Donald Trump's tax cuts, even from previous Republican tax cut plans, is that a lot of [32:56] those resources went to giving more take-home pay to middle-class and working-class Americans. [33:01] It was passed in 2017, and you saw an American economic boom unlike we've seen in a generation [33:07] in this country. That is a record that I'm proud to run on, and we're going to get back to that [33:11] common sense wisdom so that you can afford to live the American dream again. I know a lot of you are [33:17] struggling. I know a lot of you are worried about paying the bills. It's going to stop when Donald [33:21] Trump brings back common sense to this country. Governor, do you want to respond to that? [33:26] What has Kamala Harris done for the middle class? Yeah. Well, Kamala Harris' day one was [33:29] Donald Trump's failure on COVID that led to the collapse for our economy. We were already before [33:34] COVID in a manufacturing recession, but 10 million people out of work, largest percentage since the [33:39] Great Depression. Nine million jobs closed on that. That was day one. Whether it was the [33:43] Infrastructure Act or other things we moved. Now, you made a question about experts, said this. [33:48] I've made a note of this. Economists can't be trusted. Science can't be trusted. National [33:54] security folks can't be trusted. Look, if you're going to be president, you don't have all the [33:59] answers. Donald Trump believes he does. My pro tip of the day is this. If you need heart surgery, [34:04] listen to the people at the Mayo Clinic in Rochester, Minnesota, not Donald Trump. [34:08] And the same thing goes with this. And I ask you out there, teachers, nurses, truck drivers, [34:13] whatever. How is it fair that you're paying your taxes every year and Donald Trump hasn't paid any [34:18] federal tax in the last 15 years and the last year as president? That's what's wrong with the system. [34:23] There's a way around it. And he's bragged about that. We're just asking for fairness in it. [34:28] And that's all you want. You have a minute. Governor, you say trust the experts, [34:33] but those same experts for 40 years said that if we shipped our manufacturing base off to China, [34:38] we'd get cheaper goods. They lied about that. They said if we shipped our industrial base off to [34:42] other countries, to Mexico and elsewhere, it would make the middle class stronger. They were wrong [34:47] about that. They were wrong about the idea that if we made America less self-reliant, [34:52] less productive in our own nation, that it would somehow make us better off. And they were wrong [34:57] about it. And for the first time in a generation, Donald Trump had the wisdom and the courage to say to [35:03] that bipartisan consensus, we're not doing it anymore. We're bringing American manufacturing [35:08] back. We're unleashing American energy. We're going to make more of our own stuff. [35:12] And this isn't just an economic issue. And I've got three beautiful little kids at home, [35:16] seven, four and two. And I love them very much. And I hope they're in bed right now. [35:20] But look, so many of the drugs, the pharmaceuticals that we put in the bodies of our children [35:24] are manufactured by nations that hate us. This has to stop. And we're not going to stop it [35:29] by listening to experts. We're going to stop it by listening to common sense wisdom, [35:33] which is what Donald Trump governed on. Senator, you're talking about [35:36] Governor Walz, can you address that? I mean, voters say they trust Donald Trump on the economy [35:40] more. Why? If you're listening tonight and you want billionaires to get tax cuts, [35:44] you heard what the numbers were. Look, I'm a union guy on this. I'm not a guy who wanted to ship [35:51] things overseas. But I understand that, look, we produce soybeans and corn. We need to have fair [35:55] trading partners. That's something that we believe in. I think the thing that most concerns me on [36:00] this is, is Donald Trump was the guy who created the largest trade deficit in American history with [36:06] China. So the rhetoric is good. Much of what the senator said right there, I'm in agreement with him [36:11] on this. I watched it happen too. I watched it to my communities. And we talked about that. [36:15] But we had people undercutting the right to collectively bargain. We had right to work states made [36:21] it more difficult. We had companies that were willing to ship it over. And we saw people profit. [36:25] Folks that are venture capital in some cases, putting money into companies that were overseas. [36:31] We're in agreement that we bring those home. The issue is Donald Trump is talking about it. [36:35] Kamala Harris has a record 250,000 more manufacturing jobs just out of the IRA. [36:40] May I respond to that? Yes. [36:42] So I appreciate that. So if you notice what Governor Walz just did, as he said, first of all, [36:48] Donald Trump has to listen to the experts. And then when he acknowledged that the experts screwed up, [36:51] he said, well, Donald Trump didn't do nearly as good of a job as the statistics show that he did. [36:56] So what Tim Walz is doing, and I honestly, Tim, I think you've got a tough job here. [37:01] Because you've got to play whack-a-mole. You've got to pretend that Donald Trump didn't deliver [37:05] rising take-home pay, which of course he did. You've got to pretend that Donald Trump didn't deliver [37:09] lower inflation, which of course he did. And then you simultaneously got to defend Kamala Harris's [37:14] atrocious economic record, which has made gas, groceries, and housing unaffordable for American [37:20] citizens. I was raised by a woman who would sometimes go into medical debt so that she could [37:25] put food on the table in our household. I know what it's like to not be able to afford the things [37:31] that you need to afford. We can do so much better. To all of you watching, we can get back to an America [37:37] that's affordable again. We just got to get back to common sense economic principles. [37:41] I hope we have a conversation on health care then. Senator, Governor. Please. [37:44] Thank you. Margaret? We have a lot to get to ahead, [37:48] gentlemen, on many topics. But right now I want to talk about personal qualifications. [37:53] The vice president is often the last voice the president hears before making consequential [38:00] decisions. We want to ask you about your leadership qualities. Governor Walz, [38:06] you said you were in Hong Kong during the deadly Tiananmen Square protest in the spring of 1989. [38:11] But Minnesota Public Radio and other media outlets are reporting that you actually didn't [38:16] travel to Asia until August of that year. Can you explain that discrepancy? [38:23] Yeah. Well, and to the folks out there who didn't get at the top of this, look, [38:26] I grew up in small rural Nebraska, a town of 400, town that you rode your bike with your buddies till [38:33] the streetlights come on, and I'm proud of that service. I joined the National Guard at 17, [38:37] worked on family farms, and then I used the GI Bill to become a teacher, passionate about it, [38:42] a young teacher. My first year out, I got the opportunity in the summer of 89 to travel to China. [38:49] 35 years ago, be able to do that. I came back home and then started a program to take young [38:55] people there. We would take basketball teams, we would take baseball teams, we would take dancers, [38:59] and we would go back and forth to China. The issue for that was, was to try and learn. Now look, [39:04] my community knows who I am. They saw where I was at. They, look, I will be the first to tell you, [39:10] I have poured my heart into my community. I've tried to do the best I can, but I've not been perfect, [39:15] and I'm a knucklehead at times, but it's always been about that. Those same people elected me to Congress [39:21] for 12 years. And in Congress, I was one of the most bipartisan people working on things like farm [39:27] bills that we got done, working on veterans benefits, and then the people of Minnesota [39:31] were able to elect me to governor twice. So look, my commitment has been from the beginning, [39:36] to make sure that I'm there for the people, to make sure that I get this right. I will say [39:41] more than anything, many times I will talk a lot. I will get caught up in the rhetoric, [39:47] but being there, the impact it made, the difference it made in my life, I learned a lot about China. [39:52] I hear the critiques of this. I would make the case that Donald Trump should have come on one of [39:56] those trips with us. I guarantee you he wouldn't be praising Xi Jinping about COVID, and I guarantee [40:03] you he wouldn't start a trade war that he ends up losing. So this is about trying to understand the [40:08] world. It's about trying to do the best you can for your community. And then it's putting yourself [40:13] out there and letting your folks understand what it is. My commitment, whether it be through teaching, [40:17] which I was good at, or whether it was being a good soldier, or was being a good member of [40:21] Congress, those are the things that I think are the values that people care about. [40:24] Governor, just to follow up on that, the question was, [40:28] can you explain the discrepancy? No, just all I said on this was, [40:32] is I got there that summer and misspoke on this. So I will just, that's what I've said. So I was in [40:41] Hong Kong and China during the democracy protests went in. And from that, I learned a lot of what [40:48] needed to be in governance. Thank you, Governor. Senator Vance, [40:53] in 2016, you called your running mate Donald Trump unfit for the nation's highest office, [40:59] and you said he could be America's Hitler. I know you've said, you've been asked many times, [41:04] and you've said you regret those comments and explained you then voted for Donald Trump in 2020. [41:10] But the Washington Post reported new messages last week in which you also disparaged Trump's [41:15] economic record while he was president, writing to someone in 2020, quote, [41:20] Trump thoroughly failed to deliver his economic populism. You're now his running mate, [41:26] and you've shifted many of your policy stances to align with his. If you become vice president, [41:32] why should Americans trust that you will give Donald Trump the advice he needs to hear, [41:38] and not just the advice he wants to hear? You have two minutes. [41:42] Well, first of all, Margaret, because I've always been open. And sometimes, [41:45] of course, I've disagreed with the president, but I've also been extremely open about the fact [41:48] that I was wrong about Donald Trump. I was wrong, first of all, because I believed some of the media [41:53] stories that turned out to be dishonest fabrications of his record. But most importantly, [41:58] Donald Trump delivered for the American people, rising wages, rising take-home pay, [42:03] an economy that worked for normal Americans, a secure southern border, a lot of things, frankly, [42:08] that I didn't think he'd be able to deliver on. And yeah, when you screw up, when you misspeak, [42:12] when you get something wrong and you change your mind, you ought to be honest with the American [42:15] people about it. It's one of the reasons, Margaret, why I've done so many interviews is [42:19] because I think it's important to actually explain to the American people where I come down on the [42:23] issues and what changed. Now, you pointed out to messages from 2020. Margaret, I've been extremely [42:27] consistent that I think there were a lot of things that we could have done better in the Trump [42:31] administration the first round if Congress was doing its job. I strongly believe, [42:36] and I've been a United States Senator, that Congress is not just a high-class debating society. [42:40] It's not just a forum for senators and congressmen to whine about problems. It's a forum to govern. [42:46] So there were a lot of things on the border, on tariffs, for example, where I think that we could [42:50] have done so much more if the Republican Congress and the Democrats in Congress had been a little bit [42:55] better about how they governed the country. They were so obsessed with impeaching Donald Trump, [42:59] they couldn't actually govern. And I want to talk about this tariff issue in particular, [43:03] Margaret, because, you know, Tim just accused this of being a national sales tax. Look, [43:09] the one thing, and you're probably surprised to hear me praising Joe Biden, but the one thing that [43:14] Joe Biden did is he continued some of the Trump tariffs that protected American manufacturing jobs. [43:20] And it's the one issue, the most pro-worker part of the Biden administration, [43:24] it's the one issue where Kamala Harris has run away from Joe Biden's record. [43:28] Think about this. If you're trying to employ slave laborers in China at $3 a day, [43:33] you're going to do that and undercut the wages of American workers, [43:37] unless our country stands up for itself and says, [43:41] you're not accessing our markets unless you're paying middle-class Americans a fair wage. [43:45] Senator, your time is up. Nora? Thank you. Now to the issue of reproductive rights. Governor Walz, [43:51] after Roe versus Wade was overturned, you signed a bill into law that made Minnesota one of the least [43:58] restrictive states in the nation when it comes to abortion. Former President Trump said in the last [44:04] debate that you believe abortion, quote, in the ninth month is absolutely fine. Yes or no, [44:11] is that what you support? I'll give you two minutes. That's not what the bill says. But look, [44:15] this, this issue is what's on everyone's mind. Donald Trump put this all into motion. He brags [44:22] about how great it was that he put the judges in and overturned Roe versus Wade, 52 years of personal [44:28] autonomy. And then he tells us, oh, we send it to the states. It's a beautiful thing. Amanda Zaworski [44:34] would disagree with you on it's a beautiful thing. A young bride in Texas waiting for their child at 18 [44:40] weeks. She has a complication, a tear in the membrane. She needs to go in. The medical care [44:46] at that point needs to be decided by the doctor. And that would have been an abortion. But in Texas, [44:51] that would have put them in legal jeopardy. She went home, got sepsis, nearly dies, [44:56] and now she may have difficulty having children. Or in Kentucky, Hadley Duvall, a 12-year-old child [45:03] raped and impregnated by her stepfather. Those are horrific. Now, when God asked about that, [45:09] Senator Vance said two wrongs don't make a right. There is no right in this. So in Minnesota, [45:15] what we did was restore Roe versus Wade. We made sure that we put women in charge of their health [45:22] care. But look, this is not where if you don't know Amanda or Hadley, you soon will. Their project [45:29] 2025 is going to have a registry of pregnancies. It's going to make it more difficult, if not impossible, [45:35] to get contraception and limit access, if not eliminate access to infertility treatments. [45:41] For so many of you out there listening, me included, infertility treatments are why I have a child. [45:46] That's nobody else's business. But those things are being proposed. And the catch all on this is, [45:52] is, well, the states will decide what's right for Texas might not be right for Washington. [45:57] That's not how this works. This is basic human right. We have seen maternal mortality skyrocket [46:05] in Texas, outpacing many other countries in the world. This is about health care. In Minnesota, [46:10] we are ranked first in health care for a reason. We trust women. We trust doctors. [46:15] Senator, do you want to respond to the governor's claim? Will you create a federal [46:18] pregnancy monitoring agency? No, Nora, certainly we won't. And I want to talk about this issue [46:23] because I know a lot of Americans care about it. And I know a lot of Americans don't agree [46:28] with everything that I've ever said on this topic. And, you know, I grew up in a working-class [46:32] family in a neighborhood where I knew a lot of young women who had unplanned pregnancies and [46:36] decided to terminate those pregnancies because they feel like they didn't have any other options. [46:41] And, you know, one of them is actually very dear to me. And I know she's watching tonight, [46:46] and I love you. And she told me something a couple years ago that she felt like if she hadn't had that [46:51] abortion, that it would have destroyed her life because she was in an abusive relationship. [46:56] And I think that what I take from that as a Republican who proudly wants to protect [47:01] innocent life in this country, who proudly wants to protect the vulnerable, [47:05] is that my party, we've got to do so much better of a job [47:08] at earning the American people's trust back on this issue where they frankly just don't trust us. [47:14] And I think that's one of the things that Donald Trump and I are endeavoring to do. [47:17] I want us as a Republican Party to be pro-family in the fullest sense of the word. [47:23] I want us to support fertility treatments. I want us to make it easier for moms [47:27] to afford to have babies. I want it to make it easier for young families to afford a home [47:31] so they can afford a place to raise that family. And I think there's so much that we can do [47:35] on the public policy front just to give women more options. Now, of course, Donald Trump has been [47:41] very clear that on the abortion policy specifically, that we have a big country and it's diverse. [47:48] And California has a different viewpoint on this than Georgia. Georgia has a different viewpoint [47:52] from Arizona. And the proper way to handle this, as messy as democracy sometimes is, [47:58] is to let voters make these decisions, let the individual states make their abortion policy. [48:04] And I think that's what makes the most sense in a very big, a very diverse, and let's be honest, [48:09] sometimes a very, very messy and divided country. [48:12] Governor, would you like to respond and also answer the question about restrictions? [48:15] Yeah, well, the question got asked and Donald Trump made the accusation that wasn't true [48:20] about Minnesota. Well, let me tell you about this idea that there's diverse states. [48:25] There's a young woman named Amber Thurman. She happened to be in Georgia, [48:28] a restrictive state. Because of that, she had to travel a long distance to North Carolina [48:35] to try and get her care. Amber Thurman died in that journey back and forth. The fact of the matter [48:42] is, how can we as a nation say that your life and your rights, as basic as the right to control your own [48:51] body, is determined on geography? There's a very real chance had Amber Thurman lived in Minnesota, [48:58] she would be alive today. That's why the restoration of Roe versus Wade. When you listen [49:03] to Vice President Harris talk about this subject and you hear me talk about it, [49:06] you hear us talking exactly the same. Donald Trump is trying to figure out how to get the [49:11] political right of this. I agree with a lot of what Senator Vance said about what's happening. [49:15] His running mate, though, does not. And that's the problem. Governor, your time is up. Senator, [49:19] let me ask you about that. He mentioned, I think, referring to a national ban. In the past, [49:24] you have supported a federal ban on abortion after 15 weeks. In fact, you said if someone [49:30] can't support legislation like that, quote, you are making the United States the most barbaric [49:36] pro-abortion regime anywhere in the entire world. My question is, why have you changed your position? [49:42] Well, Nora, first of all, I never supported a national ban. I did, [49:46] during when I was running for Senate in 2022, talk about setting some minimum national standard. For [49:50] example, we have a partial birth abortion ban in place in this country at the federal level. [49:55] I don't think anybody's trying to get rid of that, or at least I hope not. Though I know that [49:58] Democrats have taken a very radical pro-abortion stance. But, Nora, you know, one of the things that [50:03] changed is, in the state of Ohio, we had a referendum in 2023, and the people of Ohio voted [50:09] overwhelmingly, by the way, against my position. And I think that what I learned from that, Nora, [50:14] is that we've got to do a better job at winning back people's trust. [50:17] So many young women would love to have families. So many young women also see an unplanned pregnancy [50:23] as something that's going to destroy their livelihood, destroy their education, destroy their [50:27] relationships. And we have got to earn people's trust back. And that's why Donald Trump and I are [50:32] committed to pursuing pro-family policies, making child care more accessible, making fertility treatments [50:38] more accessible, because we've got to do a better job at that. And that's what real leadership is. [50:42] Governor, your response? I'm going to respond on the pro-abortion piece of that. No, we're not. [50:48] We're pro-women. We're pro-freedom to make your own choice. We know what the implications are to [50:53] not be that. Women having miscarriages, women not getting the care, physicians feeling like they may be [51:00] prosecuted for providing that care. And as far as making sure that we're educating our children and [51:06] giving them options, Minnesota is a state with one of the lowest teen pregnancy rates. [51:10] We understand that, too. We know that the options need to be available, and we make that true. [51:15] We also make it we're a top three state for the best place to raise children. But these two things [51:20] to try and say that we're pro-children, but we don't like this, or you guys are pro-abortion, [51:25] that's not the case at all. We are pro-freedoms for women to make their choices. [51:30] And we're going, and Kamala Harris is making the case, to make options for children more affordable, [51:35] a $6,000 child tax credit. But we're not going to base that on the backs of making someone like [51:40] Amber Thurman drive 600 miles to try and get health care. Senator? [51:44] May I respond to that? First of all, Governor, I agree with you. Amber Thurman should still be alive, [51:48] and there are a lot of people who should still be alive, and I certainly wish that she was. [51:52] And maybe you're free to disagree with me on this and explain this to me, but as I read the Minnesota [51:57] law that you signed into law, the statute that you signed into law, it says that a doctor who [52:04] presides over an abortion where the baby survives, the doctor is under no obligation to provide [52:08] life-saving care to a baby who survives a botched late-term abortion. That is, I think, [52:14] whether you're pro-choice or pro-abortion, that is fundamentally barbaric. And that's why I use that [52:20] word, Nora, is because some of what we've seen, do you want to force Catholic hospitals to perform [52:24] abortions against their will? Because Kamala Harris is supported suing Catholic nuns [52:29] to violate their freedom of conscience. We can be a big and diverse country where we respect [52:34] people's freedom of conscience and make the country more pro-baby and pro-family. But please. [52:38] Yes, Governor, please respond. Look, this is one where there's always something there. This is a [52:42] very simple proposition. These are women's decisions to make about their health care decisions [52:47] and the physicians who know best when they need to do this. Trying to distort the way a law is written [52:53] to try and make a point. That's not it at all. But what was I wrong about, Governor? Please, [52:56] tell me. What was I wrong about? That is not the way the law is written. Look, [52:59] I've given this— But how? I've given this advice on a lot of things, [53:02] that getting involved, getting against—that's been misread and it was fact-checked at the last debate. [53:06] But the point on this is, is there's a continuation of these guys to try and tell women or to get [53:11] involved. I use this line on this, just mind your own business on this. Things worked best when Roe [53:16] versus Wade was in place. When we do a restoration of Roe, that works best. That doesn't preclude us [53:22] from increasing funding for children. It doesn't increase us from making sure that once that [53:27] child's born, like in Minnesota, they get meals. They get early childhood education. They get [53:33] health care. So the hiding behind we're going to do all these other things, when you're not [53:38] proposing them in your budget, Kamala Harris is proposing them. She's proposing all those things [53:42] to make life easier for families. I asked a specific question, [53:45] Governor. You gave me a slogan as a response. It's not the case. It's not true. That's not what [53:49] the law says. So he fact-checked it with President Trump. [53:53] Gentlemen, there's a lot to discuss. We have to move on. And we're going to be right back [53:56] with much more of the CBS News vice presidential debate in just a moment. [54:00] On our places. Right, shiny faces. [54:26] When you wake up in the morning, we want to be your go-to team. [54:29] Nate has one of the quickest minds I've ever seen. [54:32] Tony has a way of making people feel comfortable. [54:35] Gailey has this unbelievable knack to ask the question that you're asking at home. [54:38] I've been told I could talk to a tree, and that's pretty much true. [54:41] I don't go to work in the morning. I go for coffee with my two good friends, [54:44] and we talk about the world. Your morning routine just got better. [54:48] CBS Mornings, weekdays at 7. It didn't seem like anything could happen, [54:56] because nothing ever happens in East Palestine, but it did. [55:01] Authorities released toxic fumes from five derailed train cars. [55:10] Resident, please evacuate. [55:12] Keep bronchitis due to chemical fumes. [55:15] Did you ever have these problems before the derailment? [55:17] No, ma'am. This neighborhood's not safe no more. [55:20] We can assure the community that there's not vinyl chloride entering their communities. 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[57:26] Let's get your popcorn and get ready. [57:28] Come on, Julia. [57:29] Oh, no. [57:29] I will if you will. [57:30] You go down. [57:31] She's the first black woman on the Supreme Court, and she's determined she won't be the last. [57:43] My parents had raised me to believe that I could do anything I wanted to do. [57:49] Justice Ketanji Brown Jackson on Person to Person. [57:53] Superstar approaching, superstar approaching. [57:55] I can stay clearly now. [57:57] That's right. [58:03] Look at his outfit. [58:04] Give me some love, baby. [58:06] Up top. [58:09] All right. [58:25] Welcome back to the CBS News vice presidential debate. [58:29] We want to turn now to America's gun violence epidemic. [58:32] The leading cause of death for children and teens in America is by firearms. [58:38] Senator Vance, you oppose most gun legislation that Democrats claim would curb gun violence. [58:44] You oppose red flag gun laws and legislation to ban certain semi-automatic rifles, including AR-15s. [58:51] So let me ask you. [58:53] Earlier this year, for the first time, the parents of a school shooter were convicted of [58:58] involuntary manslaughter and sentenced to 10 years in prison. [59:02] Do you think holding parents responsible could curb mass shootings? [59:07] I'll give you two minutes. [59:08] Yeah, well, Nora, on that particular case, I don't know the full details. [59:10] But I certainly trust local law enforcement and local authorities to make those decisions. [59:14] I think in some cases, the answer is going to be yes. [59:16] And in some cases, the answer is going to be no. [59:18] And the details really matter here, of course. [59:19] For example, if a kid steals a gun, that's going to be different than if a parent hands [59:24] over a gun knowing that their kid is potentially dangerous. [59:26] But look, I want to just sort of speak as a father of three beautiful little kids, and [59:31] our oldest is now in second grade. [59:34] And like a lot of parents, we send our kids to school with such hope and such joy and such [59:39] pride at their little faces on the first day of school. [59:41] And we know, unfortunately, that a lot of kids are going to experience this terrible epidemic [59:45] of gun violence. [59:46] And of course, our hearts go out to the families that are affected by this terrible stuff. [59:50] And we do have to do better. [59:51] And I think that Governor Walz and I actually probably agree that we need to do better on this. [59:55] The question is just how do we actually do it? [59:58] Now, here's something that really bothers me and worries me about this epidemic of violence. [1:00:03] The gross majority, close to 90 percent in some of the statistics I've seen, [1:00:07] of the gun violence in this country is committed with illegally obtained firearms. [1:00:11] And while we're on that topic, we know that thanks to Kamala Harris' open border, [1:00:15] we've seen a massive influx in the number of illegal guns run by the Mexican drug cartel. [1:00:21] So that number, the amount of illegal guns in our country is higher today than it was [1:00:25] three and a half years ago. [1:00:27] But what do we do about the schools? [1:00:28] What do we do to protect our kids? [1:00:30] And I think the answer is, and I say this not loving the answer, because I don't want my kids [1:00:35] to go to school in a school that feels unsafe or where there are visible signs of security. [1:00:40] But I unfortunately think that we have to increase security in our schools. [1:00:45] We have to make the doors lock better. [1:00:46] We have to make the doors stronger. [1:00:48] We've got to make the windows stronger. [1:00:50] And of course, we've got to increase school resource officers, because the idea [1:00:54] that we can magically wave a wand and take guns out of the hands of bad guys, [1:00:58] it just doesn't fit with recent experience. [1:01:00] So we've got to make our schools safer. [1:01:02] And I think we've got to have some common sense, bipartisan solutions for how to do that. [1:01:06] Governor, you have two minutes. [1:01:07] Well, I think all the parents watching tonight, this is your biggest nightmare. [1:01:11] Look, I got a 17-year-old, and he witnessed a shooting at a community center playing volleyball. [1:01:17] Those things don't leave you. [1:01:19] As a member of Congress, I sat in my office, surrounded by dozens of the Sandy Hook parents, [1:01:25] and they were looking at my 7-year-old picture on the wall. [1:01:28] Their 7-year-old were dead. [1:01:30] And they were asking us to do something. [1:01:31] And look, I'm a hunter. [1:01:33] I own firearms. [1:01:34] The vice president is. [1:01:36] We understand that the Second Amendment is there. [1:01:38] But our first responsibility is to our kids to figure this out. [1:01:41] In Minnesota, we've enacted enhanced red flag laws, enhanced background checks. [1:01:48] And we can start to get data. [1:01:49] But here's the problem. [1:01:50] If we really want to solve this, we've got folks that won't allow research to be even done on gun violence. [1:01:57] And this idea that we should just live with it, and here's what I do think. [1:02:01] This is a good start to the conversation. [1:02:04] I 100 percent believe that Senator Vance hates it when these kids—it's abhorrent, and it breaks your heart. [1:02:10] I agree with that. [1:02:12] But that's not far enough when we know there are things that work. [1:02:15] I've spent time in Finland and seen some Finnish schools. [1:02:19] They don't have this happen, even though they have a high gun ownership rate in the country. [1:02:24] There are reasonable things that we can do to make a difference. [1:02:28] It's not infringing on your Second Amendment. [1:02:31] And the idea to have some of these weapons out there, it just doesn't make any sense. [1:02:36] Kamala Harris, as an attorney general, worked on this issue. [1:02:39] She knows that it's there. [1:02:41] No one's trying to scaremonger and say, we're taking your guns. [1:02:44] But I ask all of you out there, do you want your schools hardened to look like a fort? [1:02:49] Is that what we have to go? [1:02:51] When we know there's countries around the world that their children aren't practicing these types of drills. [1:02:57] They're being kids. [1:02:58] We owe it to them to get a fix. These are things that shouldn't be that difficult. [1:03:03] You can still keep your firearms and we can make a difference. [1:03:06] We have to. [1:03:06] If you're listening tonight, this breaks your heart. [1:03:09] Senator? [1:03:10] Tim, first of all, I didn't know that your 17-year-old witness is shooting. [1:03:13] I'm sorry about that. [1:03:14] I appreciate you saying so. [1:03:15] Christ, have mercy. It is awful. [1:03:18] And I appreciate what Tim said, actually, about Finland. [1:03:21] Because I do think it illustrates some of the, frankly, weird differences between our own [1:03:25] country's gun violence problem and Finland is, okay, first of all, we have way higher rates [1:03:31] of mental health abuse or mental health substance abuse. We have way higher rates of depression, [1:03:37] way higher rates of anxiety. We, unfortunately, have a mental health crisis in this country that [1:03:42] I really do think that we need to get to the root causes of. Because I don't think it's the whole [1:03:46] reason why we have such a bad gun violence problem. But I do think it's a big piece of it. [1:03:50] Another driver of the gun violence epidemic, especially that affecting our kids, it doesn't [1:03:54] earn as many headlines, but is the terrible gun violence problem in a lot of our big cities. [1:04:00] And this is why we have to empower law enforcement to arrest the bad guys, [1:04:04] put them away, and take gun offenders off the streets. [1:04:07] I think there's a whole host of things that we can do here. But I do think at our schools, [1:04:11] we've got to talk about more security. [1:04:13] Senator, thank you. Governor, you previously opposed an assault weapons ban, [1:04:16] but only later in your political career did you change your position. Why? [1:04:20] Yeah, I sat in that office with those Sandy Hook parents. I've become friends [1:04:23] with school shooters. I've seen it. Look, the NRA, I was an NRA guy for a long time. They used to [1:04:27] teach gun safety. I'm of an age where my shotgun was in my car so I could pheasant hunt after football [1:04:33] practice. That's not where we live today. And several things I want to mention on this is, [1:04:38] talking about cities and where it's at, the number one where the most firearm deaths happen in [1:04:44] Minnesota are rural suicides. And we have an epidemic of children getting guns and shooting themselves. [1:04:51] And so we have and we should look at all of the issues, making sure folks have health care and all [1:04:58] that. But I want to be very careful. This idea of stigmatizing mental health, just because you have a [1:05:02] mental health issue doesn't mean you're violent. And I think what we end up doing is we start looking [1:05:07] for a scapegoat. Sometimes it just is the guns. It's just the guns. And there are things that you can do [1:05:13] about it. But I do think that this is one. And I think this is a healthy conversation. [1:05:17] I think there's a capacity to find solutions on this that work, protect Second Amendment, [1:05:22] protect our children. That's our priority. Gentlemen, thank you, Margaret. [1:05:25] Thank you, Nora. Let's turn now to the top contributor to inflation, the high cost of housing [1:05:31] and rent. There's a shortage of more than four million homes in the United States, [1:05:36] and that contributes to the high housing prices. Governor Walz, the Harris campaign promises [1:05:42] a $25,000 down payment assistance for first time home buyers and a $10,000 tax credit. [1:05:50] They also promise to build three million new homes. Where are you building these homes and won't [1:05:57] handing out that kind of money just drive up prices higher? No, it's not handing out. We have first, [1:06:02] let me say this, this issue of housing. And I think those of you listening on this, [1:06:06] the problem we've had is that we've got a lot of folks that see housing as another commodity. [1:06:11] It can be bought up. It can be shifted. It can be moved around. [1:06:15] Those are not folks living in those houses. Those of you listening tonight, that house is a big deal. [1:06:19] I bought and owned one house in my life. My mom still lives in the house where I was. And when I [1:06:24] think of a house, I'm thinking of Christmas services after midnight mass, where you go with your family. [1:06:29] We need to make it more affordable. And one of the things, as I said, this program that the vice [1:06:34] president is pushing forward and bringing a new way of approaching this is something we're doing [1:06:39] in Minnesota from that lead. We in the state invested in making sure our housing was the biggest [1:06:45] investment that we'd ever made in housing. It starts to make it easier. We cut some of the red tape. [1:06:49] Local folks, look, we can't do it at the federal level, but local folks make it easier to build those [1:06:53] homes. And then that down payment assistance. I can tell all of you out there, one of the, [1:06:58] certainly for me, using the GI Bill was one thing, but a veteran's home loan, the big thing about a [1:07:04] veteran's home loan is you don't have to pay the down payment. Those are things that make it there. [1:07:09] Now, look, you're going to pay it back and you're going to pay your mortgage. Those are things that [1:07:13] we know in the long run, the appreciated value, the generational wealth that's created from it. [1:07:18] And I will give Minneapolis an example. Minneapolis is the one city where we've seen the lowest inflation [1:07:23] rates. We've seen a 12% increase in stock because we put some of these things in and we're [1:07:28] implementing a state program to make sure we give some of that down payment assistance. [1:07:32] We get it back from people because here's what we know. People with stable housing end up with [1:07:37] stable jobs. People with stable housing have their kids able to be able to get to school. [1:07:42] All of those things in the long run end up saving our money. And that's the thing that I think we [1:07:47] should be able to find some common ground in. But we can't blame immigrants for the only reason. [1:07:53] That's not the case that's happening in many cities. The fact of the matter is, is that we don't have [1:07:57] enough naturally affording affordable housing, but we can make sure that the government's there [1:08:02] to help kickstart it, create that base. Governor, your time is up. Senator Vance, [1:08:09] as far as your campaign's position, the promise is to seize federal lands to build homes, [1:08:14] remove regulation, provide tax breaks and cut back on immigration, which you say pushes up prices. [1:08:22] Where are you going to build all the new homes you're promising? And what part of [1:08:26] any of this plan will provide immediate relief? You have two minutes. [1:08:30] Well, first of all, Tim just said something that I agree with. We don't want to blame [1:08:34] immigrants for higher housing prices, but we do want to blame Kamala Harris for letting in [1:08:39] millions of illegal aliens into this country, which does drive up costs, Tim. 25 million illegal aliens [1:08:46] competing with Americans for scarce homes is one of the most significant drivers of home prices in the [1:08:52] country. It's why we have massive increases in home prices that have happened right alongside [1:08:58] massive increases in illegal alien alien populations under Kamala Harris's leadership. [1:09:04] Now, Tim just mentioned a bunch of ideas. Now, some of those ideas I actually think are halfway decent, [1:09:08] and some of them I disagree with. But the most important thing here is Kamala Harris is not [1:09:13] running as a newcomer to politics. She is the sitting vice president. If she wants to enact all of these [1:09:19] policies to make housing more affordable, I invite her to use the office that the American people [1:09:24] already gave her, not sit around and campaign and do nothing while Americans find the American dream [1:09:30] of homeownership completely unaffordable. Now, you asked, Margaret, what would immediately [1:09:35] change the equation for American citizens if you lower energy prices? As Donald Trump says, [1:09:41] drill, baby, drill. One of the biggest drivers of housing costs aside from illegal immigration [1:09:46] is think about it. If a truck driver is paying 40% more for diesel, then the lumber he's delivering [1:09:51] to the job site to build the house is also going to become a lot more expensive. If we open up American [1:09:57] energy, you will get immediate pricing relief for American citizens, not by the way, just in housing, [1:10:04] but in a whole host of other economic goods too. Senator Vance, you still have 23 seconds there. [1:10:09] Do you want to answer? Can I have it? Governor, we will get to you in a moment. But Senator, [1:10:15] where are you going to seize the federal lands? Can you clarify? Well, what Donald Trump has said is [1:10:19] we have a lot of federal lands that aren't being used for anything. They're not being used for [1:10:22] national park. They're not being used. And they could be places where we build a lot of housing. [1:10:27] And I do think that we should be opening up building in this country. We have a lot of land [1:10:32] that could be used. We have a lot of Americans that need homes. We should be kicking out illegal [1:10:37] immigrants who are competing for those homes. And we should be building more homes for the American [1:10:41] citizens who deserve to be here. Senator, your time is up. Governor, [1:10:45] I do want to let you respond to the allegation that the vice president is letting in migrants. [1:10:51] Well, of course, that's not true. And again, you have the facts. I guess we agreed not to fact [1:10:54] check. I'll check it. Look, crossings are down compared to when Donald Trump left office. [1:10:58] But it's, again, blaming and not trying to find the solution. I was going to ask on this question, [1:11:03] are we going to drill and build houses in the same federal land? And I think when people hear [1:11:07] federal lands, these are really important pieces of land. Now, Minnesota doesn't have a lot of [1:11:11] federal lands. I know in the western part of the countries we do. There's not a lot of federal [1:11:15] lands in and around Minneapolis, for example. So the issue is, is I don't understand the federal [1:11:20] lands issue unless we see this. And I worry about this as someone who cares deeply about our national [1:11:25] parks and our federal lands. Look, Minnesota, we protect these things. We've got about 20 percent of [1:11:29] the world's freshwater. These lands protect. They're there for a reason. They belong to all of us. [1:11:34] But again, this is when you view housing and you view these things as commodities. [1:11:39] Like there's a chance to make money here. Let's take this federal land and let's sell it to people [1:11:42] for that. I think there's better ways to do this. We've seen it in Minnesota. We're able to [1:11:46] refurbish some of these houses. We're able to make some investments. That gets people in. And I'm still [1:11:51] on the fact on this, economists. Senator Vance, you said you don't like the economists. Which economists [1:11:57] are saying that it is immigrants that's adding to the cost? Governor, governor, your time is up. [1:12:02] But Senator, on that point, I'd like for you to clarify. There are many contributing factors [1:12:08] to high housing costs. What evidence do you have that migrants are part of this problem? [1:12:14] Well, there's a Federal Reserve study that we're happy to share after the debate. We'll put it up [1:12:18] on social media actually that really drills down on the connection between increased levels of migration, [1:12:23] especially illegal immigration and higher housing prices. Now, of course, Margaret, [1:12:27] that's not the entire driver of higher housing prices. It's also the regulatory regime of Kamala [1:12:33] Harris. Look, we are a country of builders. We're a country of doers. We're a country of explorers. [1:12:38] But we increasingly have a federal administration that makes it harder to develop our resources, [1:12:44] makes it harder to build things, and wants to throw people in jail for not doing everything exactly as [1:12:51] Kamala Harris says they have to do. And what that means is that you have a lot of people who would [1:12:56] love to build homes who aren't able to build homes. I actually agree with Tim Waltz. We should get out [1:13:00] of this idea of housing as a commodity. But the thing that has most turned housing into a commodity [1:13:06] is giving it away to millions upon millions of people who have no legal right to be here. [1:13:12] What are the federal regulations? I deal with this as a governor. [1:13:15] You can very quickly reply. I'm sorry. I get this as a governor. And I don't necessarily disagree [1:13:21] with that, that in some cases, many of those are local. Many of them are state. I don't know which ones are [1:13:25] federal, but I think whenever we talk regulations, people think they can get rid of them. I think [1:13:30] you want to be able to get out of your house in a fire. I think you want to make sure that it's [1:13:34] fireproof and those types of things. So which are the regulations? Because [1:13:38] the vice president's not responsible for those. Congress writes those. [1:13:41] Governor, thank you. Gentlemen, we have a lot to get through. You're passionate about the housing [1:13:46] crisis, I can tell. But Nora? Thank you. One of the top problems facing Americans is the high cost of [1:13:53] health care. Senator Vance, at the last presidential debate, former President Trump was asked about [1:13:59] replacing the Affordable Care Act. In response, he said, I have concepts of a plan. Since then, [1:14:06] Senator, you've talked about changing how chronically ill Americans get health insurance. [1:14:11] Can you explain how that would work? And can you guarantee that Americans with pre-existing [1:14:16] conditions won't pay more? I'll give you two minutes. Well, of course, we're going to cover Americans [1:14:22] with pre-existing conditions. In fact, a lot of my family members have gotten health care. [1:14:27] I believe, you know, members of my family actually got private health insurance, at least for the [1:14:31] first time, switched off of Medicaid onto private insurance for the first time under Donald Trump's [1:14:36] leadership. And I think that, you know, a lot of people have criticized this concepts of a plan [1:14:40] remark. It's very simple common sense. I think it's Tim Walls knows from 12 years in Congress. [1:14:45] You're not going to propose a 900-page bill standing on a debate stage. It would bore everybody to tears. [1:14:50] And it wouldn't actually mean anything because part of this is the give and take of bipartisan [1:14:54] negotiation. Now, when Donald Trump was actually president—and again, he has a record to be proud [1:14:59] of—prescription drugs fell in 2018 for the first time in a very long time. Under Kamala Harris's [1:15:05] leadership, prescription drugs are up about 7 percent. Under Donald Trump's entire four years, [1:15:10] they were up about 1.5 percent. He introduced pricing transparency. Think about health care. [1:15:16] You go into a hospital, you try to buy something, and nobody knows what it actually costs. That [1:15:21] price transparency will actually give American consumers a little bit more choice and will [1:15:25] also drive down costs. And we talked about, you know, the reinsurance regulations is what I was [1:15:31] talking about. Look, Donald Trump has said that if we allow states to experiment a little bit on how to [1:15:36] cover both the chronically ill but the non-chronically ill, it's not just a plan. He actually implemented [1:15:42] some of these regulations when he was president of the United States. And I think you can make a [1:15:47] really good argument that it salvaged Obamacare, which was doing disastrously until Donald Trump [1:15:52] came along. I think this is an important point about President Trump. Of course, [1:15:55] you don't have to agree with everything that President Trump has ever said or ever done. [1:16:00] But when Obamacare was crushing under the weight of its own regulatory burden and health care costs, [1:16:06] Donald Trump could have destroyed the program. Instead, he worked in a bipartisan way to ensure [1:16:11] that Americans had access to affordable care. It's not perfect, of course, and there's so much [1:16:16] more that we can do. But I think that Donald Trump has earned the right to put in place some better [1:16:21] health care policies. He's earned it because he did it successfully the first time. Governor. [1:16:26] All right. Here's where being an old guy gives you some history. I was there at the creation of the ACA. [1:16:33] And the reason it was so important is I come from a major health care state, home of the Mayo Clinic, [1:16:39] home to Medical Alley, 3M, Medtronic, all of those. We understand health care. It's why we're ranked [1:16:45] first on affordability and accessibility and quality of health care. And so what I know is under Kamala [1:16:51] Harris, more people are covered than they have before. Those of you listening, this is critical [1:16:56] to you. Now, Donald Trump all of a sudden wants to go back and remember this. He ran on the first thing [1:17:03] he was going to do on day one was to repeal Obamacare. On day one, he tried to sign an executive order [1:17:09] to repeal the ACA. He signed on to a lawsuit to repeal the ACA, but lost at the Supreme Court. [1:17:17] And he would have repealed the ACA had it not been for the courage of John McCain to save that bill. [1:17:24] Now, fast forward, what that means to you is you lose your pre-existing conditions. If you're sitting at [1:17:29] home and you got asthma, too bad. If you're a woman, probably not. Broke your foot during [1:17:33] football, might kick you out. Your kids get kicked out when they're 26. Kamala Harris negotiated drug [1:17:39] prices for the first time with Medicare. We have 10 drugs that will come online, [1:17:43] the most common ones that will be there. But look, this issue, and when Donald Trump said, [1:17:49] I've got a concept of a plan, it cracked me up as a fourth grade teacher because my kids would have [1:17:54] never given me that. But what Senator Vance just explained might be worse than a concept, [1:17:59] because what he explained is pre-Obamacare. And I'll make this as simple as possible, [1:18:03] because I have done this for a long time. What they're saying is, if you're healthy, [1:18:09] why should you be paying more? So what they're going to do is let insurance companies pick who [1:18:13] they insure, because guess what happens? You pay your premium, it's not much. They're figuring they're [1:18:17] not going to have to pay out to you. But those of you a little older, gray, you know, got cancer, [1:18:22] you're going to get kicked out of it. That's why the system didn't work. Kamala Harris will protect [1:18:27] and enhance the ACA. Governor, thank you. Senator, [1:18:31] you have not yet explained how you would protect people with pre-existing conditions or laid out [1:18:35] that plan. Well, look, we currently have laws and regulations in place right now that protect [1:18:41] people with pre-existing conditions. We want to keep those regulations in place, but we also want to [1:18:45] make the health insurance marketplace function a little bit better. Now, what Governor Walts just said [1:18:50] is actually not true. A lot of what happened and the reason that Obamacare was crushing under its [1:18:55] own weight is that a lot of young and healthy people were leaving the exchanges. Donald Trump [1:19:00] actually helped address that problem, and he did so in a way that preserved people's access to coverage [1:19:06] who had pre-existing conditions. But again, something that these guys do is they make a lot of claims [1:19:12] about if Donald Trump becomes president, all of these terrible consequences are going to ensue. [1:19:17] But in reality, Donald Trump was president. Inflation was low. Take-home pay was higher. [1:19:22] And he saved the very program from a Democratic administration that was collapsing and would [1:19:28] have collapsed absent his leadership. He did his job, which is govern in a bipartisan way and get [1:19:34] results, not just complain about problems, but actually solve them. Governor, did enrollment [1:19:39] under the Affordable Care Act go up under the Trump administration? [1:19:43] Governor Walts. It's higher now that we've seen it go up. Look, people are using it. The system works. [1:19:47] And the question about this, of young people or whatever, that's the individual mandate piece [1:19:51] of this. And Republicans fought tooth and nail saying, well, Americans should be free to do this. [1:19:56] Well, then what happens is— [1:19:57] So you think the individual mandate is a good idea? [1:19:58] Governor Walts. I think the idea of making sure the risk pool is broad enough to cover [1:20:02] everyone, that's the only way insurance works. When it doesn't, it collapses. You are asking pre-ACA, [1:20:08] where we get people out. Look, people know that they need to be on health care. People expect it [1:20:14] to be there. And when we are able to make it, and we are making it this way, when we incentivize people [1:20:20] to be in the market, when we help people who might not be able to afford it get there, [1:20:25] and we make sure then, when you get sick and old, it's there for you. Because I heard people say, [1:20:30] well, I don't want to buy into Medicare or whatever. Good luck buying health care once you get past 70. [1:20:35] So look, the ACA works. We can continue to do better. Kamala Harris did that. The way she made [1:20:40] everything better was negotiating those 10 drugs on Medicare for the first time in American history. [1:20:45] Thank you. Margaret. [1:20:46] Can I address that? [1:20:47] I apologize. We're out of time. We have a number of subjects to discuss. Margaret. [1:20:50] Let's talk about families in America. There is a child care crisis in this country, [1:20:57] and the United States is one of the very few developed countries in the world without a [1:21:03] national paid leave program for new parents. Governor Walz, you've said that if Democrats [1:21:09] win both the White House and Congress, this is a day one priority for you. How long should employers [1:21:15] be required to pay workers while they are home taking care of their newborns? You have two minutes. [1:21:20] Yeah. Well, that's negotiable, and that's what Congress worked. But here's what the deal is. [1:21:26] Americans sitting out there right now, you may work for a big company. Look, we're home in Minnesota to [1:21:31] some of the largest Fortune 500 companies. Kamala Harris knows that in California. Those companies [1:21:36] provide paid family medical leave. One is, I think they're moral and they think it's a good thing, [1:21:41] but it also keeps their employees healthy. We in Minnesota passed a paid family medical leave. You [1:21:46] have a child, you. And I had to go back to work five days after my kids were born. This allows you to [1:21:52] stay home a certain amount of time. What we know is that gets the child off to a better start. The family [1:21:57] works better. We stay in their employers. We get more consistency in that. So Kamala Harris has made [1:22:02] it a priority. We implemented it in Minnesota, and we see growth. That's how you become a pro-business [1:22:08] state. But the negotiations on it, and here's the issue. Those big companies are able to offer it. [1:22:13] Those of you out there who don't have it, just imagine what happens if you get cancer or your child [1:22:19] gets sick. We know what happens. You end up staying home. In some places, that means no paycheck, [1:22:25] because you've got no protection on that. This is the case of an economy that Donald Trump has set [1:22:30] for the wealthiest amongst us. He's willing to give those tax breaks to the wealthiest. He's willing [1:22:37] to say, bust those unions up, do whatever. What we're saying is the economy works best [1:22:43] when it works for all of us. And so a paid family medical leave program, and I will tell you, go to [1:22:48] the families or go to the businesses and ask them. As far as child care on this, you have to take it at [1:22:53] both the supply and the demand side. You can't expect the most important people in our lives [1:22:58] to take either our children or our parents to get paid the least amount of money. And we have to make [1:23:04] it easier for folks to be able to get into that business and then to make sure that folks are able [1:23:08] to pay for that. We were able to do it in Minnesota, and I'm still telling you this. We were listed as the [1:23:13] best state. We're still in crisis on this. A federal program of paid family medical leave and help with this [1:23:19] will enhance our workforce, enhance our families, and make it easier to have the children that you want. [1:23:23] Governor, your time is up. Senator, do you support a national paid leave program? And if so, [1:23:30] for how long should employers be mandated to pay their employees while they are home taking care [1:23:35] of their newborn? You have two minutes. Yeah, well, first of all, Margaret, [1:23:38] a number of my Republican colleagues and some Democrats, too, have worked on this issue. [1:23:41] And I think there is a bipartisan solution here because a lot of us care about this issue. [1:23:45] I mean, look, I speak from this very personally because I'm married to a beautiful woman who is [1:23:51] an incredible mother to our three beautiful kids, but is also a very, very brilliant corporate [1:23:55] litigator. And I'm so proud of her. But being a working mom, even for somebody with all of the [1:24:01] advantages of my wife, is extraordinarily difficult. And it's not just difficult from a policy perspective. [1:24:07] She actually had access to paid family leave because she worked for a bigger company. But the cultural [1:24:12] pressure on young families and especially young women, I think makes it really hard for people [1:24:18] to choose the family model they want. A lot of young women would like to go back to work immediately. [1:24:22] Some would like to spend a little time home with the kids. Some would like to spend longer at home [1:24:25] with the kids. We should have a family care model that makes choice possible. And I think this is a [1:24:31] very important substantive difference between Donald Trump and Kamala Harris's approach. I mean, look, [1:24:36] if you look at the federal programs that we have that support paid family leave right now, the community [1:24:41] development block grant, and there's another block grant program that spends a lot of money from [1:24:45] the federal government. These programs only go to one kind of child care model. Let's say you'd like your [1:24:50] church maybe to help you out with child care. Maybe you live in a rural area or an urban area and you'd like [1:24:55] to get together with families in your neighborhood to provide child care in the way that makes the most sense. [1:25:00] You don't get access to any of these federal monies. We want to promote choice in how we deliver family [1:25:06] care and how we promote child care because, look, it is unacceptable. And, you know, of course, [1:25:12] Tim and I have been on the campaign trail a lot the past seven or eight weeks. And one of the biggest [1:25:15] complaints I hear from young families is people who feel like they don't have options, like they're [1:25:21] choosing between going to work or taking care for their kids. That is an incredible burden to put on [1:25:26] American families. We're the only country that does it. I think we could do a heck of a lot better. [1:25:31] Senator, thank you. You have also said, Senator Vance, many things about the American family. [1:25:38] The Federal Reserve says parents will spend nearly as much on child care as they do on housing each [1:25:45] month. So I want to get your thoughts on this. President Trump recently said as much as child [1:25:53] care is talked about as being expensive. It's, relatively speaking, not very expensive compared [1:25:59] to the kinds of numbers we'll be taking in. Is President Trump committed to the $5,000 per [1:26:05] child tax credit that you have described? You have one minute. [1:26:09] Well, what President Trump said, Margaret, I just want to defend my running mate here a little bit, [1:26:13] is that we're going to be taking in a lot of money by penalizing companies for shipping jobs [1:26:18] overseas and penalizing countries who employ slave laborers and then ship their products back into [1:26:24] our country and undercut the wages of American workers. It's the heart of the Donald Trump economic [1:26:28] plan. Cut taxes for American workers and American families. Cut taxes for businesses that are hiring [1:26:34] and building companies in the United States of America, but penalize companies and countries that [1:26:39] are shipping jobs overseas. That's the heart of the economic proposal. And I think what President Trump [1:26:44] is saying is that when we bring in this additional revenue with higher economic growth, we're going [1:26:48] to be able to provide paid family leave, child care options that are viable and workable for a lot of [1:26:54] American families. Can you clarify how that will solve the child care shortage? Well, because as Tim [1:27:03] said, a lot of the child care shortages, we just don't have enough resources going into the multiple [1:27:08] people who could be providing family care options. And we're going to have to, unfortunately, look, [1:27:13] we're going to have to spend more money. We're going to have to induce more people to want to [1:27:17] provide child care options for American families because the reason it's so expensive right now [1:27:21] is because you've got way too few people providing this very essential service. [1:27:26] Thank you, Senator. Governor Walz, your ticket also has some child care tax credit proposals. [1:27:32] Do you think Congress will agree to the $6,000 credit for newborns and $3,000 credit for [1:27:38] children over the age of six as your campaign has promised? Is that realistic? [1:27:44] Well, if these members of Congress are listening to anybody, I can tell you. And [1:27:47] this is the biggest issue. Everybody listening tonight knows. I mean, I'm sure they were shocked [1:27:51] to hear it's not that expensive. And let's be clear, whether it's $5,000 or $6,000, that pays you [1:27:57] about three or four months. Let's be clear of where we're at on this. It's because we got out of an [1:28:01] imbalance on this. We thought we were going to get by by not paying people. I don't think Senator [1:28:05] Vance and I are that far apart. I'm not opposed to what he's talking about on options. We've done [1:28:09] scholarships types of things. I think we need to be open to making the case. But the issue here is, [1:28:14] the question you asked is, you're not going to pay for it with these tariffs. That's just adding [1:28:18] another $4,000 on the family and taking less. So not only do they not get the money to pay for that, [1:28:24] they're $4,000 in the hole. That's Wharton School. That's his alma mater. And so I think the issue here is, [1:28:30] if those members of Congress, I can't believe they're not. When I go to businesses, [1:28:34] sure, they'll talk about taxes sometime, but they will lead with child care and they will lead [1:28:38] with housing because we know the problem is, especially in a state like Minnesota, [1:28:42] we need more workers because our economy is growing, but we need the workforce. [1:28:45] Governor, thank you. We need to move on. Nora. [1:28:48] Let's talk about the state of democracy, the top issue for Americans after the economy [1:28:53] and inflation. After the 2020 election, President Trump's campaign and others [1:28:58] filed 62 lawsuits contesting the results. Judges, including those appointed by President Trump and [1:29:05] other Republican presidents, looked at the evidence and said there was no widespread fraud. [1:29:12] The governors of every state in the nation, Republicans and Democrats, certified the 2020 [1:29:18] election results and sent a legal slate of electors to Congress for January 6th. [1:29:25] Senator Vance, you have said you would not have certified the last presidential election [1:29:30] and would have asked the states to submit alternative electors. That has been called [1:29:35] unconstitutional and illegal. Would you again seek to challenge this year's election results, [1:29:41] even if every governor certifies the results? I'll give you two minutes. [1:29:46] Well, Nora, first of all, I think that we're focused on the future. We need to figure out how to solve [1:29:50] the inflation crisis caused by Kamala Harris's policies, make housing affordable, make groceries [1:29:55] affordable, and that's what we're focused on. But I want to answer your question because you did ask it. [1:30:00] Look, what President Trump has said is that there were problems in 2020, [1:30:03] and my own belief is that we should fight about those issues, debate those issues [1:30:08] peacefully in the public square. And that's all I've said, and that's all that Donald Trump has said. [1:30:13] Remember, he said that on January the 6th, the protesters ought to protest peacefully. [1:30:18] And on January the 20th, what happened? Joe Biden became the president. [1:30:22] Donald Trump left the White House. And now, of course, unfortunately, [1:30:25] we have all of the negative policies that have come from the Harris Biden administration. [1:30:30] I believe that we actually do have a threat to democracy in this country. But unfortunately, [1:30:34] it's not the threat to democracy that Kamala Harris and Tim Walz want to talk about. It is the threat [1:30:40] of censorship. It's Americans casting aside lifelong friendships because of disagreements over [1:30:46] politics. It's big technology companies silencing their fellow citizens. And it's Kamala Harris [1:30:51] saying that rather than debate and persuade her fellow Americans, she'd like to censor people [1:30:56] who engage in misinformation. I think that is a much bigger threat to democracy than anything that [1:31:01] we've seen in this country in the last four years, in the last 40 years. Now, I'm really proud, [1:31:06] especially given that I was raised by two lifelong blue-collar Democrats, [1:31:10] to have the endorsement of Bobby Kennedy Jr. and Tulsi Gabbard, lifelong leaders in the Democratic [1:31:16] coalition. And of course, they don't agree with me and Donald Trump on every issue. We don't have [1:31:20] to agree on every issue. But we're united behind a basic American First Amendment principle that we [1:31:25] ought to debate our differences. We ought to argue about them. We ought to try to persuade our fellow [1:31:29] Americans. Kamala Harris is engaged in censorship at an industrial scale. She did it during COVID. [1:31:36] She's done it over a number of other issues. And that, to me, is a much bigger threat to democracy [1:31:41] than what Donald Trump said when he said that protesters should peacefully protest on January [1:31:46] the 6th. Governor? Well, I've enjoyed tonight's debate. And I think there was a lot of commonality [1:31:51] here. And I'm sympathetic to misspeaking on things. And I think I might have with the senator. [1:31:56] Me too, man. There's one. There's one, though, that this one is troubling to me. And I say that [1:32:00] because I think we need to tell the story. Donald Trump refused to acknowledge this. And the fact is, [1:32:05] is that I don't think we can be the frog in the pot and let the boiling water go up. [1:32:09] He was very clear. I mean, he lost this election and he said he didn't. [1:32:13] 140 police officers were beaten at the Capitol that day, [1:32:17] some with the American flag, several later died. And it wasn't just in there. [1:32:21] In Minnesota, a group gathered on the state Capitol grounds in St. Paul and said, [1:32:26] we're marching to the governor's residence and there may be casualties. The only person there was my son [1:32:30] and his dog who was rushed out crying by state police. That issue and Mike Pence standing there [1:32:37] as they were chanting, hang Mike Pence. Mike Pence made the right decision. So, Senator, [1:32:43] it was adjudicated over and over and over. I worked with kids long enough to know. And I said, [1:32:48] as a football coach, sometimes you really want to win. But the democracy is bigger than winning an [1:32:52] election. You shake hands and then you try and do everything you can to help the other side win. [1:32:58] That's what was at stake here. Now, the thing I'm most concerned about is the idea that imprisoning [1:33:05] your political opponents, already laying the groundwork for people not accepting this. [1:33:11] And a president's words matter. A president's words matter. People hear that. So, I think this issue [1:33:19] of settling our differences at the ballot box, shaking hands when we lose, being honest about it, [1:33:25] but to deny what happened on January 6th, the first time in American history that a president or anyone [1:33:34] tried to overturn a fair election and the peaceful transfer of power. And here we are four years later [1:33:40] in the same boat. I will tell you this, that when this is over, we need to shake hands, this election, [1:33:46] and the winner needs to be the winner. This has got to stop. It's tearing our country apart. [1:33:51] Margaret? Senator Vance, did you want to respond to that? [1:33:54] Yeah, well, look, Tim, first of all, it's really rich for democratic leaders to say that Donald [1:34:01] Trump is a unique threat to democracy when he peacefully gave over power on January the 20th, [1:34:07] as we have done for 250 years in this country. We are going to shake hands after this debate and [1:34:12] after this election. And of course, I hope that we win and I think we're going to win. But if Tim [1:34:16] Waltz is the next vice president, he'll have my prayers. He'll have my best wishes and he'll have my help [1:34:20] whenever he wants it. But we have to remember that for years in this country, Democrats protested [1:34:26] the results of elections. Hillary Clinton in 2016 said that Donald Trump had the election stolen [1:34:33] by Vladimir Putin because the Russians bought like $500,000 worth of Facebook ads. [1:34:38] This has been going on for a long time. And if we want to say that we need to respect the results of [1:34:43] the election, I'm on board. But if we want to say, as Tim Waltz is saying, that this is just a problem [1:34:48] that Republicans have had, I don't buy that. Governor. [1:34:52] Governor. January 6th was not Facebook ads. [1:34:54] And I think a revisionist history on this. Look, I don't understand how we got to this point. [1:35:01] But the issue was that happened. Donald Trump couldn't do it. And all of us say there's no place [1:35:06] for this. It has massive repercussions. This idea that there's censorship to stop people from [1:35:11] doing threatening to kill someone, threatening to do something. That's not that's not censorship. [1:35:16] Censorship is book banning. We've seen that. We've seen that brought up. [1:35:20] I just think for everyone tonight. And I'm going to thank Senator Vance. I think this is the [1:35:26] conversation they want to hear. And I think there's a lot of agreement. This is one that we are miles [1:35:31] apart on. This was a threat to our democracy in a way that we had not seen. And it manifested itself [1:35:38] because of Donald Trump's inability to say. He is still saying he didn't lose the election. [1:35:42] I would just ask that. Did he lose the 2020 election? [1:35:45] Tim, I'm focused on the future. Did Kamala Harris [1:35:48] censor Americans from speaking their mind in the wake of the 2020 COVID situation? [1:35:54] That is a damning non-answer. [1:35:56] It's a damning non-answer for you to not talk about censorship. [1:35:59] Obviously Donald Trump and I think that there were problems in 2020. [1:36:03] We've talked about it. I'm happy to talk about it further. [1:36:05] But you guys attack us for not believing in democracy. [1:36:09] The most sacred right under the United States democracy is the First Amendment. [1:36:14] You yourself have said there's no First Amendment right to misinformation. [1:36:18] Kamala Harris wants to use the power of government and big tech to silence people [1:36:23] from speaking their minds. That is a threat to democracy that will long outlive this present [1:36:27] political moment. I would like Democrats and Republicans to both reject censorship. [1:36:32] Let's persuade one another. Let's argue about ideas and then let's come together afterwards. [1:36:37] You can't yell fire in a crowded theater. That's the test. That's the Supreme Court test. [1:36:41] Tim, fire in a crowded theater. You guys wanted to kick people off of Facebook [1:36:45] for saying that toddlers shouldn't wear masks. [1:36:47] Senator, the governor does have the floor. [1:36:48] That's not fire in a crowded theater. That is criticizing the policies of the government, [1:36:54] which is the right of every American. [1:36:55] Senator, the governor does have the floor for one minute to respond to you. [1:36:58] Yeah. Well, I don't run Facebook. What I do know is, is I see a candidate out there [1:37:04] who refused. And now again, and this, I'm pretty shocked by this. He lost the election. [1:37:09] This is not a debate. It's not, it's not anything anywhere other than in Donald Trump's world. [1:37:15] Because look, when Mike Pence made that decision to certify that election, [1:37:21] that's why Mike Pence isn't on this stage. What I'm concerned about is, [1:37:25] where is the firewall with Donald Trump? Where is the firewall if he knows he could do anything, [1:37:34] including taking an election, and his vice president's not going to stand to it? [1:37:39] That's what we're asking you, America. Will you stand up? Will you keep your oath of office, [1:37:45] even if the president doesn't? And I think Kamala Harris would agree. [1:37:49] She wouldn't have picked me if she didn't think I would do that. Because of course, [1:37:52] that's what we would do. So America, I think you've got a really clear choice on this election [1:37:57] of who's going to honor that democracy and who's going to honor Donald Trump. [1:38:01] Governor, your time is up. Thank you, gentlemen. We will be right back with both of our candidates. [1:38:08] The CBS News vice presidential debate continues. [1:38:11] On our places. White, shiny faces. [1:38:41] When you wake up in the morning, we want to be your go-to team. [1:38:44] Nate has one of the quickest minds I've ever seen. [1:38:47] Tony has a way of making people feel comfortable. [1:38:50] Galey has this unbelievable knack to ask the question that you're asking at home. [1:38:54] I've been told I could talk to a tree, and that's pretty much true. [1:38:56] I don't go to work in the morning. I go for coffee with my two good friends, [1:38:59] and we talk about the world. Your morning routine just got better. [1:39:03] CBS Mornings, weekdays at 7. It didn't seem like anything could happen, [1:39:11] because nothing ever happens in East Palestine, but it did. [1:39:16] Authorities released toxic fumes from five derailed train cars. [1:39:25] Resident, please evacuate. [1:39:27] Cue bronchitis due to chemical fumes. [1:39:30] Did you ever have these problems before the derailment? [1:39:32] No, ma'am. [1:39:34] This neighborhood's not safe no more. [1:39:35] We can assure the community that there's not vinyl chloride entering their communities. [1:39:39] Then why are there so many people feeling these various symptoms of bloody noses, [1:39:44] or difficulty breathing, bronchitis? [1:39:46] That's a hard question to answer. [1:39:48] We're talking about one of the most blatant releases of a mixture of some of the most toxic chemicals [1:39:54] that we've seen in America. [1:39:56] I feel like now I have a duty to warn other communities. [1:39:59] If my daughter has to watch me die of cancer, at least it saves someone else. [1:40:03] Case. [1:40:09] It's like a screenplay, something straight out of Hollywood. [1:40:12] But it's not fiction. [1:40:14] It's 48 hours. [1:40:16] Human remains found this week. [1:40:17] Four families shattered. [1:40:19] There's no physical evidence. [1:40:22] The mystery would haunt investigators for years. [1:40:25] There are some questions that have to be asked and need to be answered. [1:40:29] Like a John Grisham novel. [1:40:31] A gripping true crime original. [1:40:34] 48 hours. [1:40:35] Now streaming on the free CBS News app. [1:40:37] Stories that inform. [1:40:40] You can be really old at 60. [1:40:43] And you can be really young at 85. [1:40:45] Inspire. [1:40:46] How do we unlock the power within ourselves to be who we want to be? [1:40:51] And brighten your day. [1:40:52] The best part of fame is making people feel good. [1:40:55] Always send the people home happy. [1:40:57] Make every day a little more like Sunday morning. [1:41:00] Here comes the sun. [1:41:01] Stream now on the free CBS News app. [1:41:04] And welcome to our Dragon capsule here in... [1:41:13] Sightseers in space. [1:41:15] The thrill of a lifetime. [1:41:16] Seeing the earth from space. [1:41:18] It was so exhilarating. [1:41:20] But the risks that come with the territory. [1:41:22] There have been four fatal accidents. [1:41:24] That's a 1% fatal accident rate. [1:41:26] Might make you look before you launch. [1:41:28] If you had one out of 100 airplanes falling out of the sky, you would have a public crisis. [1:41:33] Space tourism. [1:41:34] Now streaming on the free CBS News app. [1:41:38] She's the first black woman on the Supreme Court. [1:41:41] And she's determined she won't be the last. [1:41:43] My parents had raised me to believe that I could do anything I wanted to do. [1:41:49] Justice Ketanji Brown Jackson on person to person. [1:41:52] It's like a screenplay. [1:41:55] Something straight out of Hollywood. [1:41:56] Human remains found this week. [1:41:58] There's some questions that have to be asked and need to be answered. [1:42:01] A gripping true crime original. [1:42:03] 48 hours. [1:42:05] Now streaming on the free CBS News app. [1:42:07] Superstar approaching. [1:42:10] Superstar approaching. [1:42:11] I can stay clearly now. [1:42:13] That's right. [1:42:18] Look at his outfit. [1:42:19] Give me some love, baby. [1:42:21] Up top. [1:42:21] It's gonna be a run-shining. [1:42:27] All right. [1:42:28] Welcome back to the CBS News vice presidential debate. [1:42:37] It is now time for the closing statement. [1:42:39] Senator Vance won the virtual coin toss and elected to go last. [1:42:44] So, Governor Walz, you are first. [1:42:46] You have two minutes. [1:42:46] Well, thank you, Senator Vance. [1:42:48] Thank you to CBS News. [1:42:50] And most importantly, thank you to all of you. [1:42:52] If you're still up and the folks who miss dancing with our stars, I appreciate it. [1:42:56] But look, the support of the democracy matters. [1:42:59] It matters that you're here. [1:43:00] And I'm as surprised as anybody of this coalition that Kamala Harris has built. [1:43:05] From Bernie Sanders to Dick Cheney to Taylor Swift. [1:43:08] And a whole bunch of folks in between there. [1:43:11] And they don't all agree on everything, [1:43:13] but they are truly optimistic people. [1:43:15] They believe in a positive future of this country [1:43:18] and one where our politics can be better than it is. [1:43:22] And I have to tell you that that better than it is, [1:43:26] is the sense of optimism that there can be an opportunity economy [1:43:30] that works for everyone, not just to get by, but to get ahead. [1:43:33] And the idea that freedom really means something, [1:43:36] not the freedom of government to be in your bedroom or exam room, [1:43:39] but the freedom for you to make choices about yourself. [1:43:42] Now, look, we all know who Donald Trump is. [1:43:45] He's told us, and as Maya Angelou said, believe him when he told you that. [1:43:48] His first inaugural address talked about American carnage. [1:43:52] And then he spent four years trying to maybe do that. [1:43:55] Senator Vance tonight made it clear he will stand with Donald Trump's agenda. [1:44:00] He will continue to push down that road. Excuse me. [1:44:04] Kamala Harris gives us a different option. [1:44:07] Now I'll have to tell you, I'm going to be careful about the quotes, [1:44:09] but there's one that Senator Vance said that does resonate with me. [1:44:13] He said Donald Trump makes the people I care about afraid. [1:44:17] A lot of America feels that way. We don't need to be afraid. [1:44:20] Franklin Roosevelt was right. All we have to fear is fear itself. [1:44:24] Kamala Harris is bringing us a new way forward. She's bringing us a politics of joy. [1:44:29] She's bringing real solutions for the middle class, and she's centering you at the heart of that, [1:44:34] all the while asking everyone, join this movement, make your voices heard. [1:44:39] Let's look for a new day where everybody gets that opportunity and everybody gets a chance to thrive. [1:44:45] I humbly ask for your vote on November 5th for Kamala Harris. [1:44:49] Governor Walz, thank you. Senator Vance, your closing statement. [1:44:53] Well, I want to thank Governor Walz, you folks at CBS, and of course, [1:44:56] the American people for tuning in this evening. And one of the issues we didn't talk about was energy. [1:45:01] And I remember when I was being raised by my grandmother, when she didn't have enough money [1:45:05] to turn on the heat some nights because Ohio gets pretty cold at night and because money was often [1:45:10] very tight. And I believe, as a person who wants to be your next vice president, that we are a rich [1:45:16] and prosperous enough country where every American, whether they're rich or poor, ought to be able to [1:45:20] turn on their heat in the middle of a cold winter night. That's gotten more difficult, thanks to Kamala [1:45:25] Harris's energy policies. I believe that whether you're rich or poor, you ought to be able to afford [1:45:30] a nice meal for your family. That's gotten harder because of Kamala Harris's policies. [1:45:35] I believe that whether you're rich or poor, you ought to be able to afford to buy a house. [1:45:38] You ought to be able to live in safe neighborhoods. You ought to not have your communities flooded [1:45:42] with fentanyl. And that too has gotten harder because of Kamala Harris's policies. [1:45:47] Now, I've been in politics long enough to do what Kamala Harris does when she stands before [1:45:52] the American people and says that on day one, she's going to work on all these challenges I just [1:45:57] listed. She's been the vice president for three and a half years. Day one was 1400 days ago, [1:46:04] and her policies have made these problems worse. Now, I believe that we have the most beautiful [1:46:10] country in the world. I meet people on the campaign trail who can't afford food, but have the grace and [1:46:16] generosity to ask me how I'm doing and to tell me they're praying for my family. What that has taught me [1:46:21] is that we have the greatest country, the most beautiful country, the most incredible people [1:46:26] anywhere in the world. But they're not going to be able to achieve their full dreams with the broken [1:46:33] leadership that we have in Washington. They're not going to be able to live their American dream [1:46:37] if we do the same thing that we've been doing for the last three and a half years. [1:46:41] We need change. We need a new direction. We need a president who has already done this once before [1:46:46] and did it well. Please vote for Donald Trump. And whether you vote for me or vote for Tim Walz, [1:46:52] I just want to say I'm so proud to be doing this and I'm rooting for you. God bless you and good night. [1:46:56] Senator Vance, thank you. And thank you both for participating in the only vice presidential debate [1:47:02] of this election cycle. I'm Margaret Brennan. And I'm Nora O'Donnell. And a reminder, [1:47:07] there are just 35 days until Election Day. Please get out and vote. And for all of us here at CBS News, [1:47:14] thank you and good night. The first and only vice presidential debate. [1:47:36] This election is now complete. It was a cordial debate of the kind that people mostly say they [1:47:42] want. You notice here the two candidates lingering on the stage. That's quite a difference from the [1:47:48] presidential debate in which it was not even sure that Vice President Harris and Donald Trump would [1:47:52] shake hands. It was a debate in which the line, I appreciate what Tim said about Finland, was one of [1:47:58] the many ways in which Senator Vance agreed with the governor. The governor agreed right back. But [1:48:03] that's the tone and the and the kind of theater review of this. I'll pick out two issues. On the [1:48:10] question of the top of the news today, which is the Middle East and the kinds of foreign policy surprises [1:48:16] that hit any president. Tim Walz made the case that Donald Trump's temperament is unfit for any kind [1:48:22] of surprise. Cited the members of the Trump administration who have attested to that. [1:48:25] Vance came back and said there were no wars during the Trump administration. On the economy, [1:48:32] I'll make a political point, which is that what Vance did was something Donald Trump was incapable [1:48:38] of doing during his presidential debate, which is repeatedly saying, if Kamala Harris was going to do [1:48:42] these things, why didn't she in office? Now, whether voters buy that or not, Tim Walz mentioned the [1:48:48] Inflation Reduction Act and a variety of others, other items under Biden. But returning to that [1:48:53] political point has worked in the past for Donald Trump against Hillary Clinton. We'll see if it [1:48:57] works this time. I'd like to make a final point on tone. The J.D. Vance on that stage was very [1:49:01] different than what people may have seen in podcasts. But then there was an air of unreality [1:49:07] about it. He talked about bipartisan solutions with nuance of a kind we never saw during the Trump [1:49:13] administration. He talked about Donald Trump almost as the defender of the Affordable Care Act. [1:49:17] Donald Trump tried to kill the Affordable Care Act. And then I think at the very end of the debate, [1:49:20] we saw something extraordinary. Tim Walz asked J.D. Vance if Donald Trump lost the election. He [1:49:26] was incapable of answering that simple yes, no question. J.D. Vance can only get so far from [1:49:31] the man at the top of the ticket. And that was on display in that one moment, although J.D. Vance was [1:49:36] a different kind of person than we've seen in many instances. John, I think what you're saying is so [1:49:41] important when we talk about demeanor because of the expectation that was hanging over these candidates [1:49:47] heading into tonight. J.D. Vance came to the stage with the lowest likability rating of all four [1:49:54] candidates at the top of the ticket. And I think many people came in expecting him to be Donald [1:49:58] Trump's attack dog tonight. That's not the side we saw from him. There was a couple of compassionate [1:50:03] moments even. You mentioned the word cordiality. We saw that from him very much. I also think it's worth [1:50:09] pointing out the demeanor we saw from Governor Walz, particularly when it came to his moments where he [1:50:15] was put on the defensive about his own biography and embellishments that he has made in the past, [1:50:20] particularly in this case on China. You and I have talked about this a lot coming into this evening. [1:50:25] Major, you're going to help us with fact checks over the course of the next few minutes. But it is, [1:50:29] there is a big one that we need to talk about at the top of it, which came on immigration in the [1:50:33] discussion tonight. And particularly the Trump administration's plan, a major centerpiece of [1:50:39] their campaign to undergo mass deportations for undocumented immigrants in this country. [1:50:45] J.D. Vance particularly said that migrants will be granted legal status at the wave of a Kamala [1:50:52] Harris open border wand. This was in the conversation, this ongoing conversation about [1:50:56] Haitian migrants in Springfield, Ohio. Many of them are recipients of temporary legal status, [1:51:02] and we just have to say, John, that they are in this country legally. [1:51:05] All right, we will be right back in a moment with more coverage of the vice presidential debate, [1:51:09] and we'll fact check some of the claims made by both candidates. [1:51:12] Places, bright, shiny faces. [1:51:35] When you wake up in the morning, we want to be your go-to team. [1:51:38] Nate has one of the quickest minds I've ever seen. [1:51:41] Tony has a way of making people feel comfortable. [1:51:44] Galey has this unbelievable knack to ask the question that you're asking at home. [1:51:47] I've been told I could talk to a tree, and that's pretty much true. [1:51:50] I don't go to work in the morning. I go for coffee with my two good friends, and we talk about the world. [1:51:54] Your morning routine just got better. CBS Mornings, weekdays at 7. [1:51:59] It didn't seem like anything could happen, because nothing ever happens in East Palestine, but it did. [1:52:10] Authorities released toxic fumes from five derailed train cars. [1:52:18] Resident, please evacuate. [1:52:20] Cute bronchitis due to chemical fumes. [1:52:24] Did you ever have these problems before the derailment? [1:52:26] No, ma'am. [1:52:27] This neighborhood's not safe no more. [1:52:29] We can assure the community that there's not vinyl chloride entering their communities. [1:52:33] Then why are there so many people feeling these various symptoms of bloody noses, or difficulty breathing, or bronchitis? [1:52:39] That's a hard question to answer. [1:52:42] We're talking about one of the most blatant releases of a mixture of some of the most toxic chemicals that we've seen in America. [1:52:49] I feel like now I have a duty to warn other communities. [1:52:53] If my daughter has to watch me die of cancer, at least it saves someone else. [1:53:02] This case. [1:53:03] It's like a screenplay, something straight out of Hollywood. [1:53:06] But it's not fiction. [1:53:08] It's 48 Hours. [1:53:10] Human remains found this week. [1:53:11] Four families shattered. [1:53:13] There's no physical evidence. [1:53:15] The mystery would haunt investigators for years. [1:53:19] There's some questions that have to be asked and need to be answered. [1:53:22] Like a John Grisham novel. [1:53:25] A gripping true crime original. [1:53:27] 48 Hours. [1:53:28] Now streaming on the free CBS News app. [1:53:33] Stories that inform. [1:53:34] You can be really old at 60. [1:53:37] And you can be really young at 85. [1:53:39] Inspire. [1:53:40] How do we unlock the power within ourselves to be who we want to be? [1:53:45] And brighten your day. [1:53:46] The best part of fame is making people feel good. [1:53:49] Always send the people home happy. [1:53:51] Make every day a little more like Sunday morning. [1:53:54] Here comes the song. [1:53:55] Stream now on the free CBS News app. [1:53:58] Eye on America. [1:54:13] Weeknights on the CBS Evening News with Nora O'Donnell. [1:54:17] All right, we are going to bring in our amazing political team here. [1:54:27] Major, I want to start with you and your big thoughts as you watch these 90 minutes unfold. [1:54:31] I would call this the Warren G. Harding Memorial Vice Presidential Debate. [1:54:35] In 1920, Warren G. Harding promised the country a return to normalcy. [1:54:39] That's what this debate was. [1:54:40] It was substantive, far more substantive on the facts and policy than the leading candidates, [1:54:44] the presidential nominees have been to date. [1:54:47] It was, in a way, a kind of embrace of bipartisanship on tough issues, gun violence, [1:54:53] health care, child care, even, well, this was less true, on reproductive rights. [1:54:58] And one thing that I think will be a surprise to anyone in the Republican Party, the biggest [1:55:04] secret of the entire Trump administration is that he saved Obamacare. [1:55:07] It's a big secret because he never even said that. But this debate was an example to the [1:55:12] country of how you can disagree agreeably, how you can talk about shared goals for the country. [1:55:17] And in that sense, I think it's extremely important for J.D. Vance that he did not sound [1:55:22] as he sounds on the stump. It was his biography and his appeal to bipartisanship that will be most [1:55:28] distinguishing about not only his present, but his possible future. [1:55:31] Nancy, your thoughts? [1:55:34] I think if you took a shot every time you heard the words, [1:55:37] I agree tonight, you'd be at the table right now. [1:55:41] This was a surprisingly affable debate for two men who we know from our reporting, [1:55:47] do not like each other. They said that they agreed on housing policy. They said that they [1:55:51] agreed on some aspects of immigration policy, on pro-family policy. They were clearly intent [1:55:57] on showing that they are likable, that they are agreeable for all the reasons, [1:56:00] Cecilia, that you laid out earlier. The Democrats that I'm talking to feel fine about the debate. [1:56:06] They're not doing cartwheels the way they were after the Harris and Trump debate a few weeks ago, [1:56:12] but they think that this went well for them. And I predict that that exchange between Vance and [1:56:18] Walls about whether Donald Trump lost the election is going to end up in a Harris ad by the end of the week. [1:56:23] Bob? Both of these contenders came to the stage tonight being favorites of the base [1:56:29] in their respective parties. Governor Walls was someone who went on television and called [1:56:33] Republicans weird. Senator J.D. Vance was someone who would go on podcasts with Donald Trump Jr. [1:56:38] and other favorites of the right and say the left was essentially weird. Tonight on stage, [1:56:43] you didn't hear a lot about that. You heard an approach to build on our colleagues reporting [1:56:48] and analysis here. It was about appealing to the middle. For J.D. Vance, giving reassurance to [1:56:54] traditional Republicans, conservatives, that they have a place in this Republican Party, [1:56:58] even with former President Trump. They might not like those traditional Republicans' answer on the [1:57:03] election, but they might like his answer on the economy and on border security. And for Governor [1:57:07] Walls, it wasn't about being an attack dog. It was trying to make an overture to that centrist voter [1:57:13] in a battleground state and say, hey, with Vice President Harris as a teacher and a coach. [1:57:18] Ed, Gordon, quickly before we wrap, one of the big issues, though, was immigration so much so that [1:57:22] they had to shut the mics off at one point. Yeah, but I think the civility that we saw tonight may be [1:57:28] a mistake by Democrats, quite frankly. I talked at the outset of energizing this base. I was just in Ohio [1:57:35] and many Democrats were livid about what's going on in Springfield. I think Waltz missed an opportunity [1:57:41] to really push the racial insensitivity there. There was a sense of trying to be affable, as John [1:57:48] said. And I think what we're going to see from this point on is the civility being laid aside. [1:57:54] And as we've said from this point on, gloves are off, I think. [1:57:58] Major, you've spent a lot of time thinking about Donald Trump. How might he react to his number two? [1:58:04] So what Donald Trump will take away is the first third of the debate, where J.D. Vance made a very [1:58:09] strong case that the Trump record on was the world on fire, yes or no? No, it wasn't. [1:58:15] Was the economy better? Yes, it was. Trump will be very happy with that. [1:58:18] I think he will largely ignore and forget all the bipartisan appeals because they don't [1:58:22] really fit within his orientation to politics. Thank you, Major. There is much more to talk [1:58:26] about. Our coverage will continue with instant reaction polls and fact checks. [1:58:30] That'll be on CBS News 24-7. But for now, for all of my colleagues here, good night. [1:58:34] So when you see all that green, what do you think? I see money leaving America. [1:59:02] Is this a battle of rich versus poor? In part, it is. [1:59:05] Black versus white? In part, it is. [1:59:07] If you're not willing to protect a place like this, then what are you willing to protect? [1:59:10] One, two, three, go! I want a strong America. I want a proud America. [1:59:18] CBS. Welcome back to CBS News 24-7 for continued coverage of the first and only [2:00:06] vice presidential debate between Democratic Governor Tim Walz and Republican Senator J.D. Vance. [2:00:11] I'm John Dickerson in Times Square at CBS News Election Headquarters. [2:00:15] And I'm Cecilia Vega. And I am here. We are here with the very best political team [2:00:19] in the business. We want to bring our panel back because we are joined by Chief Washington [2:00:23] Correspondent Major Garrett, Chief Election and Campaign Correspondent Robert Costa, [2:00:27] Chief White House Correspondent Nancy Cordes, and CBS News contributor Ed Gordon. [2:00:33] Major, let's start with you. I was struck by seeing Governor Walz pressed on his biographical [2:00:39] embellishments. No surprise that that came up, this question of where he was in college, [2:00:45] in China, whether he was there, whether he really wasn't. He sort of said, hey, [2:00:50] I'm a knucklehead at times that I misspoke. Is that going to fly? [2:00:54] It's flown in Minnesota, which was his point. People who know me best heard me make this knuckleheaded [2:01:00] remark and they elect to be to Congress or governor. They've gotten along with it. America, you should, [2:01:04] too. And he didn't say this, but I think many Democrats, if they feel they need to clean this [2:01:09] up in any way, will say Tim Walz will never lose an embellishment battle to Donald Trump. [2:01:16] Nancy, I was struck by something J.D. Vance said, which was in the reproductive rights section. [2:01:22] He said on abortion, after hearing about the various consequences of the Roe v. Wade being overturned, [2:01:30] he then at one point said, there are a lot of people that should be alive. [2:01:34] I wonder if that is going to be something that we might see in Harris. In other words, [2:01:39] well, yes, the consequences of Roe v. Wade being overturned are not great, [2:01:43] and then he tried to move on. But isn't that the point? [2:01:46] Yes. And I think that another challenge for him was that he tried to make the case. [2:01:50] He acknowledged that this is a difficult issue for his party. But what he described as the way out of [2:01:56] that difficult situation was to say, well, we need to be more pro-family as a party. We need to [2:02:01] make it easier for women to have children so that they don't feel like they need to have an abortion. [2:02:06] The challenge is that more than half of the country believes that women should have the right to [2:02:10] an abortion. And I don't think it's clear that the people who believe that are going to be [2:02:15] swayed by, you know, policies that are simply more pro-family. [2:02:21] Bob, what lasts here beyond the end of our conversation in terms of the man at the top [2:02:28] of the ticket and the woman at the top of the other ticket? [2:02:30] For Senator Vance, he keeps his relationship with former President Donald Trump. [2:02:35] Didn't make any major mistakes that it would draw Trump's ire. I was tracking Trump's social [2:02:39] media all night. Positive about Senator Vance. And for Governor Walz, he remains that person who [2:02:45] Vice President Harris can count on to go to battleground states and elsewhere and have a convincing [2:02:52] personal story about being someone who is a teacher and a coach and comes from an everyday [2:02:57] existence in Minnesota, ultimately became a House member and a governor, but came out of the [2:03:02] education ranks and served his country in uniform. [2:03:04] We want to go now to Ed O'Keefe, who is there at the debate site. Ed, we just heard from our friend [2:03:11] Bob Costa here saying that he's been monitoring President Trump and all signs, a go positive [2:03:16] reaction. What are you hearing from the Harris-Waltz campaign right now after this? [2:03:20] Cecilia, we're in the spin room here, just down the hall from where the debate played out [2:03:25] in the CBS Broadcast Center. This used to be a milk processing plant, and it does feel a bit like [2:03:31] cattle is being herded here behind us as Senator Vance is now in here, as other surrogates to the two [2:03:37] campaigns are now here making their case. The Harris-Waltz team suggests that they think he did [2:03:43] rather well up against Senator Vance in a few different key moments. One, quoting scripture [2:03:49] at that one point during the conversation about immigrants, talking about Matthew 25, the idea [2:03:54] that there should be empathy for all people. They say that in their internal measurements of [2:04:00] of the actual debate that the viewers that were watching liked that scene. The other part that [2:04:07] they thought worked pretty well and that voters watching with them or that they were tracking enjoyed [2:04:12] was the criticism of the Trump tax cuts for wealthier Americans. But they say, and Nancy was making [2:04:19] this point earlier, that that final exchange regarding the future of democracy on January 6th was most [2:04:25] damning. They say that that exchange and Vance's refusal to say who exactly won the election, [2:04:31] the fact that he dodged questions about it, is something that they will seize on in the coming [2:04:37] days as a reminder to skeptics, to those concerned about Trump, that once again, it appears they may be [2:04:43] preparing to question the results of the election and stoke concerns about it. You know, beyond that, [2:04:50] uh, the, uh, there were, at the beginning at least, concerns among Democrats more broadly about how [2:04:56] the governor sort of stumbled out of the gates a bit, especially uneasy on those questions about [2:05:00] Mideast policy and what exactly the United States should do in terms of Israel's response to Iran, [2:05:05] some conceding perhaps he, like Senator Vance, should be doing more interviews perhaps out on the trail. [2:05:11] In the coming days, remember, Governor Walz is headed to central Pennsylvania to campaign. [2:05:15] He was supposed to do that with Vice President Harris, who instead will be staying back in [2:05:20] Washington and attending to official duties in the coming days. She'll be visiting storm damage in [2:05:24] Georgia. And then we anticipate over the weekend heading to North Carolina. So they will not be [2:05:29] seen together on the trail as we thought they might, so that she can attend to official duties and he'll [2:05:34] continue campaigning in that key state of Pennsylvania, one where, of course, both he and Vance [2:05:39] were hoping to win over support tonight. [2:05:40] JOHN YANG, A.D., Thank you, Ed. Kaitlyn Huey-Burns is also at the CBS [2:05:44] News Broadcast Center. Kaitlyn, what are you hearing from the Trump-Vance camp? [2:05:49] KATE-LINE , Well, the Trump campaign is essentially doing a victory lap quite [2:05:52] literally. They were eager to come into the spin room and talk to reporters, senior advisors, [2:05:58] campaign manager and Donald Trump Jr., who of course is very close [2:06:02] with JD Vance and was influential in that decision to name him as VP. But notably, [2:06:08] notably we were I was talking to a campaign source who was heavily involved in this preparation and [2:06:15] they noted that there was in the prep a kind of conscious effort to focus on JD Vance's personal [2:06:23] side knowing that this was going to be an introduction of sorts to millions of Americans [2:06:30] watching and if you think about it going back to when JD Vance was announced as the running mate [2:06:35] remember he was told 20 minutes before this was announced that he would be the running mate then [2:06:42] they had the convention and the focus was very much on the top of the ticket and Donald Trump [2:06:47] and then came these interviews that were discovered that JD Vance had done these controversial [2:06:53] uh statements that he had made in podcast interviews and kind of other forms they see this as a kind of [2:07:00] reset but mostly to focus personal stories on the economy which they believe is a deciding [2:07:06] factor in this election all right Caitlin thank you so much uh Senator Vance and Governor Walz made [2:07:12] many claims tonight major Garrett has been fact checking them on the fly and in real time major [2:07:18] you're going to start with opioid deaths that's right and I just want to let everyone know the [2:07:21] CBS News confirmed team has done an entire fact check of the entire debate you can find those fact [2:07:27] on social media CBS News or on our website CBS News confirmed team I'm going to summarize three [2:07:34] of them because they all touch on immigration which was heavily debated in this process tonight and the [2:07:40] issues all run through one way or another the conversation national and otherwise about immigration let's [2:07:46] start with the first one dealing with opioid deaths it came up in the context of immigration the [2:07:52] claim this was from Governor Walz opioid crisis the good news is in the last 12 months [2:07:57] the nation saw the largest decrease in opioid deaths in our nation's history 30 percent decrease [2:08:02] in Ohio the CBS News confirmed team rates that partially true and here's why our country's only [2:08:08] been counting opioid deaths officially since 2015 and in 2024 our nation recorded sadly more than 77,000 [2:08:17] opioid deaths that was down seven percent from the year before about 3,000 deaths in 2024 slightly [2:08:23] larger larger than that in Ohio that was not a 30 percent decrease that was an 18 percent decrease [2:08:28] that's why the CBS News confirmed team rates that assertion as partially true let's go to the next [2:08:34] one and this one has been chewed over extensively in the campaign JD Vance Republican from Ohio said Vice [2:08:40] President Harris became the appointed border czar this could be a semantic issue for some people we rate [2:08:46] it the CBS News country confirmed team is false and here is why that was never Kamala Harris's title that [2:08:53] was never her designated role immigration policy flowed through the president and the Secretary of Homeland [2:09:00] Security Alejandro Mayorkas what Kamala Harris was appointed to do or asked to do was look at the root [2:09:07] causes of immigration in the so-called Northern Triangle countries Honduras El Salvador Guatemala that's why we [2:09:12] rate that as false let's go to our next one this is something that JD Vance said again in the context of [2:09:18] immigration housing that is totally unaffordable because we have brought millions of illegal immigrants to [2:09:24] compete with Americans for scarce homes CBS News confirmed team rates that is partially true clearly and [2:09:30] Senator Vance made reference to a Federal Reserve study that says larger migration to America in the Biden [2:09:37] administration is one factor in housing stock shortage but that was a long-running issue dating back to [2:09:44] the Great Recession Americans have been creating more new home stock at a lower rate than at any time since [2:09:50] 1960 it is a complex problem that's why the CBS News confirmed team rates that assertion from Senator Vance as [2:09:56] partially true John and Cecilia back to you thank you so much major Republican Senator Tom Cotton joins us he serves on the [2:10:02] Judiciary Intelligence and Armed Services Committee Senator Cotton good evening good to have you with [2:10:08] us again I'd like to ask you a question that that your senator colleague had trouble with did not did [2:10:14] Donald Trump lose the last election look obviously Joe Biden's the president he's in the White House [2:10:19] that's why everything has gone to hell on a handbasket for the last four years but as JD said tonight [2:10:24] he's focused on the future and the future that Donald Trump can restore to America for four years we had [2:10:31] stable prices rising wages a secure border and a peaceful stable world and over the last four [2:10:38] years because Joe Biden has been president Kamala Harris has been his vice president we've had everything [2:10:43] going to hell in a handbasket Donald Trump is going to bring back the good times we had Kamala Harris will [2:10:48] extend four years of Joe Biden's presidency I realize that this is about something that's in the past [2:10:54] Senator but it is something that the Republican nominee for president brings up a lot and the reason I [2:11:00] think it's a more than just something that can be dismissed in the past is when you talk to [2:11:03] national security officials about domestic violence they say one of the things that stokes that violence [2:11:10] is the idea that the last election was fraudulent and that Donald Trump was the rightful victor and so [2:11:16] this isn't something about it the past it is a kindling of what according to national security experts [2:11:22] of a present threat of violence and that's why this is not something that's in the past why isn't it easy to [2:11:29] just say he lost and now we hope he wins well first off John I don't know who these experts are you're [2:11:35] talking about Tim Waltz tonight just like said just like Kamala Harris has said for years she wants to [2:11:39] defer to the so-called experts these are the experts maybe that told us we should shut down schools or put [2:11:44] kids in masks these are same experts that told us that Israel should be restrained every time it gets [2:11:50] attacked as opposed to letting Israel win so I don't know who the so-called experts you are you're referring to [2:11:55] here but I can tell you the real threat of violence that we see in America today is rampant crime in [2:12:02] our streets or Kamala Harris and Joe Biden having 28,000 murderers and rapists who are illegal aliens [2:12:10] released into our communities or for that matter turning the other way when there's our streets are [2:12:16] burning as they were during the BLM riots in 2020 Tim Waltz being caught flat-footed Kamala Harris trying [2:12:22] to bail out rioters and looters and arsonists those are the things that are the real threat [2:12:27] of violence in this country today Senator Cotton Cecilia Vega here one question for you before we [2:12:33] let you go on the issue of reproductive rights which created a healthy exchange on that debate stage we [2:12:38] heard Senator Vance tonight say that many Americans have lost faith in your own party and Republicans when [2:12:44] it comes to reproductive rights he said quote we've got to do so much better a job at earning Americans [2:12:49] trust back do you agree with that well I thought JD gave a very good answer on the way American [2:12:56] democracy works he said he has his personal views but the people of Ohio disagreed with them just like [2:13:02] the people of California are gonna have a different view than the people of Alabama or Ohio I think he [2:13:08] respects the American people he will level with them in a way that Tim Waltz did not tonight Tim Waltz signed [2:13:13] a law that would allow a child born in a botched abortion to die on the table to be denied life-saving [2:13:21] care Tim Waltz refused to answer a question whether he thinks any restrictions at all should be imposed [2:13:27] on abortion in the ninth month of a pregnancy JD Vance was leveling with the American people not [2:13:33] only about where he stands but about how democracy works he and President Trump respect the diversity of [2:13:38] opinion on this question and other questions in our democracy it's Tim Waltz and Kamala Harris that [2:13:44] wants a radical one-size-fits-all and for solution for the country sent Senator Cotton of air of Arkansas [2:13:51] excuse me thank you so much senator obviously the governor has a very different view of that law [2:13:57] and he said so repeatedly on the debate stage coming up we'll check back in with a group of Michigan [2:14:02] voters to find out if any minds were changed these are the stories of we the people we're trying to [2:14:27] generate our own hope it's a huge deal I'm enabling them to feel valued Eye on America weeknights on the CBS [2:14:34] Evening News with Nora O'Donnell I had progressively fallen deeper into the world of online sports betting [2:14:45] the risk is the rush what do you think is driving the spike in popularity I think it's legality if it's [2:14:50] legal I'm gonna use it there are ways to bet when you are 18 we've created an epidemic of child [2:14:55] gambling you can't walk into a male dormitory in a college campus without sports betting happening [2:15:00] it's America's most neglected problem I use sports betting as a way to escape when in reality I'm [2:15:06] choosing self-destruction whatever I had left it was gone the purpose of the industry is to get you [2:15:12] to play to extinction and that means until all your money is gone go to the ends of the earth [2:15:23] breach for the stars yeah I just took off that kind of thing that's pretty good because there's [2:15:29] always something new under the Sun on CBS Sunday morning America decides is your place for fact-based [2:15:39] unbiased reporting that the White House the Capitol on the campaign trail what do you say to those in [2:15:44] your party any cracks in the Republican Party our reporters and our anchors travel the country talking [2:15:49] to voters like you about the issues that matter most immigration is really a factor right now that [2:15:55] are going to be driving your decisions what would you say to those who say look that's just democracy [2:15:59] at work listening to you and bringing your voice into our coverage I want a strong proud America is [2:16:06] democracy on the ballot in 2024 let us help you decide America decides stream our expanded one [2:16:13] hour program Monday through Thursday at 5 p.m. Eastern exclusively on CBS news 24 7 the streaming home of CBS [2:16:20] news people with developmental disabilities were once sequestered by the hundreds of thousands in [2:16:27] institutions many of our fellow citizens are suffering tremendously because lack of attention lack of [2:16:33] that adequate manpower disability activists have since torn down barriers blocking them from living [2:16:40] at home or in the community we conclude that title two of the ad a require states to provide community [2:16:47] based treatment for persons with mental disabilities but of the sixteen thousand people who remain in [2:16:53] state-operated institutions half are in five states and Illinois is one of them I don't want to live in the [2:17:00] institution it makes me feel discriminated against do you think there are people living in institutions in [2:17:08] Illinois that don't need to be living there yeah because they're proving it as soon as they get out [2:17:13] all right we said this would be the case and here we are making good CBS's Jerika Duncan watched the [2:17:29] debate with a group of voters in Grand Rapids Michigan we want to go back to you Jerika all right [2:17:34] what are they telling you about what they just heard well I can tell you that we've all agreed that this was a [2:17:42] very civil conversation and one that they weren't necessarily expecting to hear they were expecting [2:17:48] for there to possibly be more jabs thrown but as I'm asking you guys again because we were able to talk [2:17:54] before we went to the program raise your hand if you feel like Senator JD Vance won this debate and then [2:18:04] two people feel like Governor Walz won the debate so you said that you felt like JD Vance articulated his [2:18:13] arguments the best Bill talk to us a little bit about that yeah he was a very smooth very smooth [2:18:19] talker yes he was Eric what about you I know you said yeah I also agree that JD Vance I think was a [2:18:26] smooth talker the thing that I appreciated about Governor Walz is that I felt like he did answer [2:18:30] more of the questions like with actually with data points and like with evidence so I appreciated that [2:18:36] perspective all of you here when we were talking offline said that immigration is still a big topic for [2:18:43] you and you all also seem to agree based on the conversations that you heard when you heard [2:18:49] Senator Wall of Senator Vance talking about it as well as Governor Walz start with you Max about what [2:18:56] stood out with the policies that were proposed and why you feel so strongly about it yeah on immigration I [2:19:02] feel that you know as the United States of America there are people who want to come here for a better [2:19:06] life and there's a legal and proper way to do that and that needs to be followed you should expect that if [2:19:13] you try to enter a country you know with illegally to be turned away it is a mess that we have found [2:19:20] ourselves in over the last four years with the extremely heightened immigration and families coming [2:19:26] here children being born here and then what are we going to do we've got now children United States [2:19:30] citizens and parents that are not it's very difficult very difficult topic with it brings the you know [2:19:37] criminal element here as well and people coming from other areas that you know they they're from [2:19:44] a different culture and things that were okay necessarily where they came from are not okay here [2:19:49] and it creates a a serious problem for our criminal justice system Ellie I want to turn to you about [2:19:55] reproductive rights because you said that was the top issue for you outside of gun violence because of [2:20:00] your two young children as well as the economy but what did you hear when they were talking about the [2:20:06] issue of reproductive rights that struck you and you also say you're now leaning more toward voting for [2:20:12] Trump and Vance after this debate before this debate started you said you weren't sure yeah I really [2:20:19] liked that Vance said that he was pro-family and not necessarily pro-life or poor pro-choice it was [2:20:26] pro-family which I really appreciated and I think I think you have to take a lot of considerations and [2:20:33] into account when talking about abortion and there's just there's a lot to consider a lot of medical [2:20:40] factors at no matter at what stage of your pregnancy so it's a it's a hard one to decide for me on that [2:20:48] one because I don't think that there was still a clear answer on what his opinion was or what their [2:20:54] opinion will be but I liked his view on it that is more pro-family okay well we're gonna keep talking and [2:21:01] we're gonna have more for CBS mornings tomorrow but as you can see and hear economy immigration still [2:21:08] big issues for these voters today but the biggest takeaway all of you guys said you were just surprised [2:21:14] impressed and actually feeling more hopeful after seeing two people sort of go at it but in a very [2:21:19] respectful civil way so John we'll send it back to you in the studio all right Trica thank you Arizona's [2:21:26] Democratic Senator Mark Kelly joins us now Senator I want to ask you about the economy and a point that [2:21:33] J.D. Vance made repeatedly which is Vice President Harris has a lot of thoughts and ideas about the [2:21:38] economy in the future but his essential argument was why didn't she do any of that during the Biden [2:21:43] administration what's the answer to that well she's running to be president of the United States [2:21:49] and you can compare the plan of Kamala Harris to Donald Trump's and Donald Trump's plan is just a bad deal [2:21:56] for the American people his project 2025 which as you saw in this debate J.D. Vance has to defend [2:22:03] and it's a unpopular agenda where it's going to raise costs for families $4,000 a year through this flawed [2:22:13] tariff plan that he has where Kamala Harris wants to bring down costs for American families on prescription [2:22:20] drugs health care child care education housing and let me ask on the foreign policy front senator [2:22:27] um which is obviously top of mind when you look around the world at this precise moment J.D. Vance's [2:22:34] argument was there were no new outbreaks of war under the Trump administration and that while he may [2:22:40] you know have some behaviors people don't like that he created a kind of deterrence in his presidency [2:22:48] what's your answer to that well those behaviors that people don't like is something our allies have [2:22:55] experienced during four years of Trump being in the White House and he has rather effectively shredded [2:23:02] some of our alliances and we rely on those alliances for our safety John I was over in the in the Baltics [2:23:09] and in Finland just about six weeks ago and they're really concerned about November 5th they're paying [2:23:15] close attention to our election because they feel that if things don't go well in Ukraine for the [2:23:22] Ukrainians that they could be the next target and there they are NATO countries and if they're invaded by [2:23:30] Russia and I think the American people know where Donald Trump stands on NATO and Russia that makes [2:23:39] Americans less safe you know your our kids for some people their grandkids could wind up in a conflict [2:23:46] in Europe and that isn't good for anybody it's not good for Europe our allies it's not good for not [2:23:54] not good for us tonight was about these two candidates introducing themselves to America Governor [2:24:02] Walz has now admitted to misspeaking a few times about his biography even tonight called himself a [2:24:09] knucklehead for it how should Americans interpret what he said about his past and how he is chalking [2:24:15] it up to misspeaking well I think he was talking about a date whether it was June July or August in 1989 [2:24:26] which is by my math is 35 years ago I don't think it's something the American people care about [2:24:34] Senator Mark Hailey of Arizona we thank you for your time tonight thank you for having me on our elections [2:24:42] and surveys unit got an instant reaction to the debate and so let's head over to Anthony Salvato [2:24:47] with the results hey there John we did indeed nationally representative sample of people who [2:24:52] watched the debate tonight and the tone they told us was overwhelmingly positive almost 9 and 10 said that [2:24:59] it was and then we asked of course who do you think did the better job what do you think won and [2:25:04] that was effectively even it was 42 Vance 41 walls and 17 percent a tie so look this was very even but [2:25:14] was was underpinning that was that people told us that each of the candidates they thought was reasonable [2:25:20] number one and then number two another thing I noticed John was that the favorable ratings for each of those [2:25:26] candidates went up compared to how they came into the debate was higher afterwards so all of that sort [2:25:33] of underpins this really positive tone that people came out of the debate with Anthony thank you so much [2:25:40] I want to bring back in our team for some closing thoughts major Garrett Robert Costa Nancy Cordes at [2:25:46] Gordon major I want to start with you again they tried to introduce themselves to America they tried to [2:25:54] answer as many questions as they possibly could are there still waters that are murky out there [2:26:00] questions that we did not get answered that we need to know from these two candidates sure I mean JD [2:26:05] Vance tried to find when he was struggling with the Republican record or perceptions of Republicans on [2:26:10] reproductive rights excuse me healthcare gun violence to sound bipartisan because he knew that was the [2:26:16] safest life raft to get into metaphorically those issues were down to the benefit of Democrats and Kamala Harris [2:26:24] will take those appeals for bipartisanship and say but they don't work with your record on the plus [2:26:29] side for JD Vance he very successfully did what Donald Trump did not do in the first debate talk about [2:26:35] the actual economic record contrasted with Kamala Harris and make the explanation that if you like [2:26:41] that record you might get a repeat if you bring Donald Trump back to the office and I want to ask you [2:26:46] what I asked Bob earlier which is what do you think lasts coming out of this debate now that it's happened we go [2:26:52] back to focusing on the people at the top of the ticket well I think both men did what you're [2:26:56] supposed to do as a VP that is do no harm right and that's what we walk away with but after all of [2:27:01] the spin room after tonight we're right back in the same place and so really it really goes back to the [2:27:08] idea of motivating your base to get out at the end of the day and we're down to seven states you're going [2:27:15] to have to concentrate on those and I think the black vote is still going to be crucial to Democrats [2:27:21] you're going to have to turn out in record numbers in Philly Atlanta Milwaukee if you do that I think [2:27:29] Kamala Harris has a great road to 270 if you don't it's going to be hard for her you just mentioned the [2:27:35] the black vote I want to go back to you and talk about the gender gap Nancy did you hear anything tonight [2:27:42] that narrows that gap that's been out there well I'm hearing two strains of thought from Harris allies [2:27:47] one strain of thought is that walls missed some opportunities tonight to go after J.D. Vance and Donald [2:27:54] Trump not just on issues that are important to women but also on immigration even on the childless cat [2:28:01] lady thing they felt that he left some opportunities on the table I think Ed was talking about something [2:28:05] similar earlier they feel that that that he could have been more aggressive he could have landed some [2:28:12] knockout punches he had the opportunity he didn't but the other strain that I'm hearing is look that's [2:28:17] not who he is that is not his persona he is Minnesota nice and he was never going to be that way especially [2:28:24] not face to face they feel that he got out of this unscathed and that's the best they can hope for [2:28:30] Bob how do you think this J.D. Vance was obviously benefited from all those TV appearances he's done [2:28:37] how do you think that meshes his more bipartisan as Major talked about it that tone matches with the tone [2:28:44] of the person at the top of the ticket who's been moving in the other direction rhetorically recently [2:28:49] based on my conversations briefly with Republicans tonight they see Senator Vance as someone because [2:28:55] of this performance who will be on the national stage for a long time former President Trump thought [2:29:00] he had a strong commanding performance Donald Trump Jr. has said the same and Governor Walz we [2:29:05] began the night speaking to our friend John Delano at KDKA he was speaking to that person who [2:29:10] watches John Delano every day in western Pennsylvania the working voter who's going to [2:29:15] decide potentially this election in these swing states you don't win elections from the left or [2:29:20] the right you win them from the middle right and the question is whether they did that [2:29:23] tonight that's right I mean sometimes it's a base election sometimes you got to get [2:29:27] everybody out in the base sometimes it's it is about the center base plus base plus that's [2:29:33] what you got to do base plus and both candidates tonight tried to get that plus a big thank you [2:29:39] to all of you here and our entire incredible political team on this debate night for all [2:29:43] of us at CBS News I'm Cecilia Vega and I'm John Dickerson thank you for joining us good night [2:29:48] Senator Jay Washington is the seat of power national security foreign policy global economics every story