I want to call this. Good afternoon. Welcome to the May 21st, 2026 Community Redevelopment Agency meeting. I'd like to call the meeting to order, and we should start with the Pledge of Allegiance. Okay. First order of business, citizen input. Is there anyone in the audience that wishes to speak on a topic that is not on the agenda? Yeah, that was going to be another question for me. I'm going to cover that, too. Okay. Awesome. Okay. Great. Okay. All right. So, anyone else in the audience wish to speak on a topic that's not on the agenda? Seeing no one rushing forward, I will close citizen input. Business draft minutes from the May 19th, 2026 Community Redevelopment Agency. Are there any changes? Okay. Hearing none, can I have a motion? So moved. Second. Okay. All in favor? Aye. Aye. Motion passes unanimously. Okay. Okay. We're going to go to 1B, Community Redevelopment Agency Advisory Committee Chair Report. So, I will turn to Chair Allen Hale. Yeah. Excuse me, Mayor and Commission. Obviously, there was a conflict. Allen did not make it at that CRE Advisory Committee. It was similar to what we're doing today. It was an update on the capital projects. Okay. And they also, at that point in time, looked at the annual report, which has since been approved by the Community Redevelopment Agency. So, this is really the first time Allen's ever not been able to make it. So, I hope he's doing something fun. I do, too. Okay. I know he was traveling, but I don't know if that was the case today. Okay. Sounds good. Well, he does a great job. So, we will allow him to have some fun time. Okay. And so, then I'll go to Community Redevelopment Agency Director's Report. Yes, Mayor and Commissioners. Bob Ironsmith, Economic Development Director for the City of Dunedin. So, obviously, light agenda today. What I wanted to do is kind of go over the capital projects. And also, I have Martin Wade here, Engineer, Project Manager for several of the projects that we have. I'm going to go ahead and start with the first one, which is Skinner, which I believe maybe Mr. Short has a question or two. Duke, we met with Duke today, myself and Mr. Wade. Duke has gone ahead and relayed to us they're going to finish up with their undergrounding over the next two to three months. So, that's a great thing. The landscaping aspect has been bid-let by DOT. They're looking to start their landscaping probably in the late fall, winter of this year. So, we're excited to see that happen. Other than that, the undergrounding aspect, if you remember, we had one property owner that hasn't complied yet with signing an easement. We're starting to get a little bit of an audience with him. We'll know a little bit more next week if we can make that work. So, we're hoping that we can get there. So, I don't know if now's the time, if Mr. Short has a question or two on Skinner, or I can move through the next project. I'm happy to take Terry to lunch or something, too, if that helps. I understand. And just beg or whatever. I'll pay personal money. I appreciate that, Mayor. What we're looking to do is use an adjacent property owner that he seems to have some influence with that property owner. So, we think that might be the best way to go. If we tap out, I'd be happy to have you come and try to. Yeah. No, I'd like to. Okay. Cool. Is the button put down? Sorry. Is it on? Yeah. Sorry about that. Yeah. That's it. Sorry about that. Yeah. So, I'll repeat the question again. Sorry. So, it was really who has responsibility for the Skinner landscaping as it exists today, and then who will have that responsibility post-DOT work? Because definitely, I think from my perspective as a homeowner that walks that area right now, there are serious weed problems that exist today, and I'm not sure whose response was that. A city responsibility today, a DOT today. If this was a residential yard situation, they already could potentially be getting violations for weeds, you know, probably two, three feet tall along Skinner today. No, great questions. So, let's do all your questions, and then... That was really the main one. Is that the main one? Okay. So, go ahead, Bob. I'm starting all the good questions. We're going to go ahead and have Matt come up here to the podium. Matt Jackson's been working with DOT relative to the landscaping, so... Yes. Good afternoon, Matt Jackson, Economic Development Manager. I've been working with the Department of Transportation. When the project is constructed, it will be responsible for the landscaping and irrigation, including maintenance of that, them and their contractor. It'll be a two-year establishment period, and once that establishment period is over, the project has been accepted by FDOT as being complete, then we would be responsible for the maintenance of the landscaping and irrigation. Yeah, and this has been shared with the parks director, too, okay, with Tony Mulkey, and certainly something that'll be put in the budget ongoing for the maintenance of that. So, just to be clear, so when would it actually turn over to us? I mean, where are we at in a... A two-year establishment period, Matt? Yeah. Okay, so literally from when they're done till for two years? Yes. Okay. And so, we'd monitor that, and if there's issues, we'd be in touch with them. Correct. They have to guarantee survival of that. Yep. Okay. Does that answer your question, Matt? You'd have to come up. Yeah, so it's not really clear to me, then, who is responsible right now, today, for weed issues on Skinner. Are they, excuse me, Mr. Short, are they in the right-of-way or on the yards or both? They are in where the new sidewalk areas have been installed. So, basically, minimal landscaping was put down, and now you have a bunch of weed growth happening in that minimal landscaping that DOT, I would assume, put down. So, maybe somebody can meet with Mr. Short and see where he's talking about and make sure we're clear? Certainly. We'll go ahead and do that. We'll walk it with you. You know, it could be, I don't know, but I certainly understand we want it to look good. A lot of money has been spent on this. Is that, is Duke going and doing more construction out there and going to be doing some certain things in the area? Right. I know the deputy city manager brought up today, there were some areas that he was unhappy with that they needed to restore, too. Sidewalks, some street print, and things like that. But, let's... Definitely, there are plenty of sidewalk issues, and I understand until all the underground work is going to be done, those sidewalks are still going to probably be the loose gravel that's there today. I fully understand that. It's really more the landscaping weed issue. Okay. Yeah, so maybe you guys could go offline and... We'll walk it. That'd be great. Yep. Appreciate your concern, though. So, yep. Okay. I'll just continue on, if that's okay. Yeah, continue on. Then we'll have questions up here. We had a planned streetscape project on Main Street. This is from the trail to Broadway. We do have the plans, everything finalized. We, because the project took a little longer than was expected, we deferred it to next, late spring. We didn't want to impact the merchants during the prime winter season. I had gotten a few calls on that and said, gee, can you wait until next year? So, we're all ready to go, but we're going to start that project probably in late April, May for that one on streetscape. The next one, and I have Martin Wade here. Grand Oak Park has certainly been extended a longer time period than what we expected. Carolyn put up some pictures here. I have Martin here who's going to talk a little bit about the variables that have taken place. One of the big ones has been the slab that was existing. You know, we decided to keep that concrete slab because of impact to the tree, and the slab has been kind of difficult for us. But Martin is here to kind of go over some of the variables that have occurred and why Grand Oak Park is taking a little longer than we expected. Afternoon, Mayor, Vice Mayor, Commissioners, Martin Wade, I'm Engineering Department. Grand Oak Park start off, we had to file for a building permit, so we ran a couple weeks time on that, getting our building permit, and some design changes, which were minor. They were ADA items and step details. The contractor started demolition work and started doing form work and trench work for their seat walls, brick walls, and had problems with foundation subgrade compaction. So they had to pull out some of the work they had already put in the ground because their testing reports did not pass. So we asked them to restart their work. So there's a little bit of time delay there. Underground conditions we have run into is the old city hall library building has a air return vent under the slab. So all the way around the perimeter of the building, there's a two foot by one foot void, which we see that metal pan on y'all's monitors. That's the bottom of the voids or the top of the voids below the slab. So we have a perimeter area where we've got possible cracked slabs on this edge here. So we're working through that opportunity right now on what to fix that, to work on that fix. We had a little bit of delay on electrical subcontractor opportunities on routing conduit based on the old slab trying to get back to where he has to eventually power his system at the new building location. So this has all happened within two or three months. And the last opportunity is we're possibly making Grant Street a two-way street. So we've met with the contractor on site and Parks and Development on site to talk about how Grant Street will work and what impact there is possibly on the tree. So we had to redesign that plan to try to keep the sidewalk in on the east part of the site to not impact the tree. So that took another week or two to reprice it redesign it. So we worked through a lot of hurdles so far and they are right now they're back to installing underground conduit. They're coming back tomorrow to restart their re rebar and the foundation on the restroom facility. And one other item I didn't mention we we in the bid package we had a foundation designed for the restroom and about a month and a half into the end of the project we asked a question of the structural designer on the restroom and we got a revised drawing to change the foundation size. So we are now paying the contractor to redo their forms and redo the foundation work for the restroom. So that's another opportunity we've had. So we're yeah we also we're getting almost close to moving forward out of the tunnel of all the hurdles to get going but we have had opportunities. So I'm going to give everybody a chance to ask a question on this since it's an important project. I'll make sure are you done? Are you got more? I'm feeling a burn up here because it's like is there stuff we should have known about, could have known about, should have planned better for? I mean how does the foundation of a slab become bigger versus what we planned? I'm trying to understand all that. We didn't know what was underneath that slab what was built in the 60s with the little library building. She's referring to the restroom. I'm referring to the restroom. Oh okay. I was on conversation with the public restrooms company and with the superintendent of the construction side and he basically said on our project we tried to plan ahead and build a foundation with this general contractor. His statement to me was normally they're three weeks prior to the building coming on site they're building the foundation and right now the public restroom company is designing this building for us and that came up during their design. So I don't I don't know the answer why he changed it but some reason he changed the he changed the width of the foundation and the depth of it. So well I'm going to let people ask questions first. I've yeah I'm not sure I get it. It just feels like somebody screwed up somewhere and at the end of the day it's just going to cost us more money. So uh vice mayor do you have questions? Yeah I just uh I'm confused. Um so we paid the contractor to redo the drawings on what sounds like their design specifications dimensions were changed at some point. Is that correct or? Well the restroom company is the designer. We asked we paid them prior to bidding the project we had a foundation drawing in our set to have the general contractor that's under contract with us build the foundation. During the interim while they are designing their building he must have found an error he changed his design criteria. So the restroom company reissued that drawing so our general contractor has to revise the foundation work. Yeah I don't see how we would be responsible for that. I can send that bill to the public restroom but I yeah I mean you know here's here's the deal I mean we um we went through essentially the design review on this. We approved that design review based on the dimensions and the specs that you had at that particular time and then because there was an error on their part or there was a change to the drawing or whatever I'm not sure how this becomes our responsibility. Please help. I mean it's going to get lambasted about this to begin with right now all of a sudden you know it's us versus no it sounds like they're scrubbed so please. I think that that we need to dig deeper into that the project is underway it's not finished yet and so there's still a lot of work to do so I think that that's something we need to move forward with the project whatever happens the foundation needs to happen and then we need to work with the contractor and the design of the restrooms to make sure that that we are made whole as a result of this issue. Okay. I mean I hear you but just make sure we've checked all the legal boxes. We will. Um other questions uh Commissioner Sandberg. Going through those pictures not I noticed it's been on a reel not that one how old are those pictures that one right right there. Those are within the week. The next it would be back one. No that right there for example is that piece of slab are we going to try and save that or is that all coming out going towards the yeah with a rebar going towards that blue wheelbarrow in the background. The slab is staying in. You know I think I heard the word that you know publicly we weren't real popular about this. Is this going to cost the city more money? Prepare to make sure we don't have voids underneath that slab. It's going to cost more money. And at this point we're so far into it is it too late to uh I hate to go back to day one but you know we you know we've went through a lot with the cost of this. Do you have any any suggestions on what we could do? Is this a local contractor? Are they out of this area? Say it again. Is the contractor local? I know they're well we we have the amount don't we isn't it from Maui what it's going to cost? We have two options. We've asked for two pricing options. One to fill the voids with a flowable fill lean concrete or to saw cut the slab and find the voids and fill it with sand soil and compact that. So they were out there prior to this I would assume they did they did they just miss this or was it our responsibility to tell them? Martin what's the amount here? Wasn't it like 15 grand or something like that which we had in contingency? I think we have a we have a contingency in the project we have 75,000. Right but the cost to do this was around what? It's about 12 12 grand. Six 12 thousand six hundred. So say that so I understand it. Give me that what does that 75 thousand dollar number mean? We have an allowance in our budget on the project for contingencies. Meaning cost more than what we anticipated? No no no. Hold on staff one second. So when we when we bid the project we add in a contingency to the total amount of the project and that's a just in case for this type of a thing. So the total amount of the project will not increase. We use that contingency. It's like a reserve built into every project. We're building on an existing building site that I wasn't around when they did the demolition. Right. I don't know what actually got finished on the demolition. And so we put money in there to try to have something. So starting on this day. Unknown conditions. Right. Going forward from this day when will we know the additional financial damage if that's a a number we can reach or obtain? When when would we know what this is going to cost us? We've got. I'm sorry to say it's like I'm talking to you. I mean I know you're coming to coming into this too. We've got two quotes from the general. Okay. We have a quote to fill it with cement mix is about $5,500. Okay. Or we have a quote to saw the slab open compact put fill in there and compact it and know that we've got all the voids taken care of. With the flow of a fill we're worried that if we if there's a blockage somewhere the materials are going to stop right there or we have to start cutting open the slab to find voids underneath it. How soon how soon what's the fastest we could have this park done? Well I think you're moving forward with it right now. I think the other consideration was the tree. So obviously when it's concrete things are poured to stabilize. So I think you pretty much have the prices for Maui. I know the harvest has been out there. So I think you got pretty clear direction at this point in time. As city manager mentioned this is part of that unforeseen where we have a contingency. So it's already been bid amount. It's already been approved by the commissioner. Commission. So we're actually in decent shape other than it's taken longer than what's expected. Yeah that's all I have Martin. Thank you. Okay. But I think one of your questions actually didn't get fully answered. Is that so is that um and it you know it may be that it wasn't but was this foreseeable on behalf of the contractor or us prior to actually digging in there? I don't believe so because there's underneath the slab and there was no way to do it. They weren't open during their site visit. They they saw cut that edge off to for the building foundation work and that's when it opened up and we didn't have an idea there's an underground air duct. It's kind of kind of like doing a kitchen remodel and you're doing all the work and all of a sudden you see the plumbing is not up to speed and you got to reduce some of the plumbing electrical. You know you just don't know because you're not seeing it behind the wall. I know all about unforeseen after being flooded. Trust me. I get it. I know I know too but I mean this is unfortunate that this has occurred but this yeah okay um anyway uh questions on this side uh Commissioner Cowell. Thank you Mayor. You had mentioned it sounds like the path we're going to take is to cut the slab open and fill up the sand. We met with the arborist and um parks today to talk about options and he's not opposed for us cutting that slab and any impacts on the tree right now. Okay and it's my understanding the reason that slab is there at all is because they were afraid to take it out because of the damage it would do to the trees. Well and so what what does this now say about picking it all up or is is there a concern that if you do cut the slab it could hurt the trees? Well that's why the arborist was out there. I think now that since it's exposed they can see the roots on the tree and my understanding is the arborist is comfortable with it being uh compacted or putting some concrete or stuff in there. So that's my understanding at this point in time that he's okay with it based on what he gets to see as a visual which he didn't have before when the slab was totally there. So these are small sections that would be taken out. Okay so it sounds like we're still of the flavor of we don't want to pull up the slab because of the trees but we're comfortable enough cutting into them and filling the sand. Portions yeah. Portions. Portion yeah. No listen there's always been great concern that's a beautiful grand oak tree we all agree with that we all want to make sure that that tree stays well. This went back and forth with staff quite a few times relative to take the slab don't take the slab. There was you know a judgment call at that point in time that the best way to go was to keep the slab there and of course now since we're finding things underneath the slab that we didn't know before it's causing a little bit of change in direction where we're looking to take out some portions of the slab and then fill it in to stabilize it and that's kind of where we are today yeah. What is the impact on the timeline of completion? Our timeline this will impact she did not give me an estimate on time on the on the fill work but it'll probably be two weeks probably do that work. The timeline on the project if we we're moving forward Grant Street that'll be a three-month addition of time on their project so our schedule is dependent on Grant Grant Streets could come before commission in June which is another possible change to the project so that that will add to the time also. And the question with Grant Street is it's currently one way we want to make it two ways or at least that's what's going to come before us. Correct. How does that impact anything? It's the same contractor and they're they they have waited we have two columns to be built on Grant Street and we have sidewalk tied into the existing sidewalk out there and our Grant Street project will change the sidewalk along Grant to pavers so they have kind of held off their demolition work to see if Grant Street will move forward and we've actually reposition just reposition those columns currently in in anticipation that it will move forward. The Grant Street excuse me Commissioner as it becomes a two-way will start to encroach a little bit into Grand Nova Park we're talking several feet nothing dramatic but that way the sidewalk and the columns that he talks about also need to be uh looked at with the two-way movement on on Grant Street in order to have sufficient depth on the parking stalls. Could you say that again I don't get the moved in it's taking more of the park? It's taking a few feet of the park a couple feet in order to have the uh sidewalk area because you want to have the amount of area for the parking stall depth the depth of the parking stall so we're just talking about a couple feet but a couple feet also changed things a little bit with the Grand Oak Park. And you okay it's it's Grant Street it's a project now instead of just putting a white line down the center of the street and calling it two ways there's a whole thing now. There's the sidewalk area that needs to be considered with the two-way movement on Grand Street yes. The problem we have out there is with the 90 degree parking when people park there the two-way movement it's not wide enough so people back their trucks or vehicles into those stalls and there's not 22 feet or a travel path. Okay and we have to make room for those cars right okay we're sorry that was that was an editorial comment. Yeah yeah nice. We're proposing diagonal parking and moving the sidewalk about four feet. No kidding um all right thank you thank you mayor. Commissioner DeGuard questions? I have the same feeling right now when I go by my mechanic for a fan belt to be replaced and he tells me I need a new transmission. That's exactly the same feeling I have right now. Um so we're first of all let's balance our priorities at least in my mind. And is this is this questions or comments? Can I do both? This is questions. Questions all right let's go to questions here. I mean people have kind of. Okay. I know it this is this is scrambled eggs and I get that. Thank you for the presentation. I I understand what you're facing. Um as far as the questions I have I think they've been pretty well covered as far as um all but one and that is the independent nature of the contractor providing us the facilities to change the plans. So how did that happen? It was the the restroom company changed the plan. On what authority? I guess the structural design signing off on that um their plans have to go through state review. They they don't come. I talk for our building department and they will be issued something similar to a um like a trailer. But they're for the mobile or modular building their review goes to the state. So that structural engineer has to meet his design has to meet our conditions and he has to sign it and stamp it and be assured of his design for the state review. We've been told that. Is that what they've advised us they had to change the plans? I don't know why it changed to be honest with you. All right. I just want to be real sure we know the source of the change. Okay. Okay. And it doesn't appear we do at this moment. So I'd like to get that cleared uh up before we start assigning any blame here. Because if it is not their fault that the plans had to be changed. If it's someone else's that's another matter. But if it's the contractor that is independently changing this. He didn't. They didn't change it. They didn't change it. No sir. Sure sounded like it earlier. Okay. Um and let's let's back away um from this because I have I have a number of comments I will make later. But um as we look at what we could have done better on this one um what is the after action report on how we could have done better? What is your what what what would we you wish we had had before we got started? Just make me that list if you would. Wish we had? Yeah. It's a hard site to fit everything we're trying to do in that area. Granted. And we're we're working next to an existing building that was a lot of things were left on that site once we started digging. So a clean site would have been perfect. And that was in the interest of the tree. We couldn't clean the slight site because the tree was of such a value. Well I that was the previous demolition condition. Condition. I got it. I got it. Okay. Yeah. So not having a clean site made us somewhat blind as what was underneath. Is that right? Correct. Okay. And right now we're looking at uh remind me the numbers we're looking at uh just to try to get back to the place we want to be. Bob which what do we got on that? I told you about 12 to 15 grand. 12 to 15 grand. Yeah. Well as ups go that's I've seen a lot worse than 12 to 15 grand. Uh thank you mayor. So just to clarify that 12 to 15 grand to put the fill under the slab. There's a change order will go out for about 6,600 to change the restroom foundation work. That's separate. The second is to fix the voids underneath the building. We have two options. We haven't decided the route. One's about 5,500 dollars for the flowable fill. It owns 12,600 or so for the cutting the slab open and filling it with soil material and compacting it. So that we hopefully know we've got all the voids underneath the slab corrected and the that metal pan span those voids underneath all those rotten rusty metal pans is what's holding that concrete up. So we're trying to no one will ever say you know they're not going to drive a vehicle on that pavers but we know there's going to be a pickup truck or a truck up there one day. Yeah. And that's what we're trying to prevent is having a crack on the slab and have a fall in on that slab. Gotcha. Um I'm just trying to understand the difference between the cost of the slab versus the cost of the change in the foundation of the bathroom. That's all. The bathroom is the the formwork wood is the restroom location. That is going to be where the new foundation. Right I get that but what's the by changing the foundation of the bathroom slab what what cost effect does that have on everything? That was 6,600. That's a 6,600 okay. All right so and it was the it was the slab or the larger so did the slab or larger foundation cause us to redesign the park in some way for the work of the contractor. Does that makes sense? The the initiation how this all happened is I asked questions about their drawings on the foundation work and it went back to the structural engineer and he that's when he he revised his drawing. Okay. So the restroom was again I'm picturing one side is the restroom and that's a 66 change in foundation size and depth and redoing all the form work is 6,600 dollars. The other is the voids underneath the existing concrete and we have two options to repair it. Either fill it with a lean concrete mix or cut the existing slab open fill it with soil material and compact it and those two numbers are middle 5,000 and middle 12,000. Okay um okay and but again I'm picturing and you guys just correct me if I'm wrong you've got somebody working on the bathroom and this foundation and then we have an overall person that's done the the design. We have somebody else who's done the design that we gave and we bid out the work to the independent contractor. Yeah we had a landscape architect that did the overall plan. Right. Correct. Right. And the mayor and NPRC did the the bathroom aspect. Yes. Okay and then the bathroom coming in a larger foundation impacted that design and is that what you're saying? Not the design itself. No. It didn't have to be a larger foundation. Right. But it didn't actually change the everything else. Everything else didn't have to be moved around differently. No. Okay all right I want to make sure I was clear on that. Okay um so your your words words mean uh part of the issue is hard to fit. So I guess my question is if we're having trouble fitting it and we're already taking some of the park for the parking are we really sure that we should be changing that from a one-way street to a two-way street? City manager that might be to you. Yeah absolutely. So I think that the two-way street is uh much more efficient uh especially during uh actually just normal activity in that area. There there are people as you you've all seen it before going both ways down that street. We're that streets function pretty doggone well for as long as I've lived here for 42 years. So I you know I get it the people kind of cheat sometimes but I think in the long term mayor that the two-way on that street with the pavers for the sidewalk. We're also expanding um subject to your approval coming up um the uh the asphalt area up to the to the crosswalk uh Grant and Highland uh to address the ADA issues on those two ramps as well. So I think the project once we're complete is going to be uh the traffic is going to circulate better uh the pavers on the sidewalks are certainly going to look better. We are going to lose I think a couple of parking spaces um looking to pick those up elsewhere as well but I think it'll be better for the project in the long run. Ultimately though that two-way is going to be up to all of you. I mean we can continue with this other work. I've been convinced but I don't want to lose part of the park if we don't have to lose it right if that's not really uh I mean you know there's a little history there with that thing going to two-way and I'm not sure I've always agreed with it and again if it's going to eat more in the park and cause any additional problems you know I guess that's my thing because I guess I'm still a little bit confused. So if the timeline is delayed three months and it's because of adjustments to the two two-way. It won't be delayed just they they have more work to do so it's stretching out it's not being delayed. Completion is completion day stretched out three more months. Right I gotcha and what's causing that? Well the the work to complete the grant grant street work. Right the two-way street. Correct. So the park itself which is not changed there's no change in how we were going to do the two-way street because of the foundation or the slab or no okay okay as far as Martin can answer this as far as encroachment I think it's about three feet or four feet into the park this is not a huge chunk of the park. Okay so I just want to feel good that we needed to do that I'm still not convinced we do but anyway and I certainly think we can handle all ADA standards beautifully even if we left it at one way and change the park so but okay I won't beat that horse. God bless you. God bless you. I don't have any other questions so I'm sorry you got a follow-up yep go ahead. Sorry root cause and so did we now so I remember the slab discussion very well I mean and it was my understanding at the time and I just want to confirm this did we use ground penetrating radar to look at the thickness of that slab? I'll answer that. Well I know I'll tell you what I think I think that we did because that's how we found the slab and the roots underneath right and the roots so the next question and this this is this is painful ground penetrating radar should be able to measure the thickness of that slab and also identify voids underneath the slab there's a significant contrast between the just based on density and I'm having a hard time with whether or not how how this was determined because if we use the ground penetrating radar we should have been able to find those voids and so then the question is who is who was responsible for that survey? I mean I'm sorry I know you are. I think the city manager I think city manager yeah and and I think I think you have a very good point there and I don't think we know the answer right now for ultimately who's responsible for reading that survey and and what degree of of ground penetrating radar we did how wide it was and so on and so forth and the determination to keep that portion of the slab and so on and so forth so I think that we need to dig deeper into this if you may if you will allow us to as staff to get to the origin uh if you will of of why this happened and report back to you. I'd rather gather all these questions and be able to meet as staff and then report back. I appreciate that and I understand you're in a very difficult situation right now um opportunity is what we call them right well you know what it's a challenge every day it's just another opportunity to excel so um anyway we're trying to keep it under budget sure that's why I said we're still working off our our initial contingency on the project so we're trying to stay within the budget on the job appreciate that just and I just one just clarification here the cost of the grand street um modification if you will that was that's still and always was in the project budget right for the park it's separate grand street is separate change order okay and be a budget amendment to you as a commission okay and remind me again how much that is estimated at still working on martin correct preliminary no no I'd rather report back to you that's why I asked I didn't I didn't say it over you're good you're good yeah I would much rather because you know when we when we estimate from the floor things happen items falling right right exactly so I'd much rather report back to you on that but but this is still this is still going to be growth in the contract yes sir okay and it still is just just mayor with respect to your comments it's still subject to approval by the city commission of course so moving forward yeah yeah okay yeah well we you know we got to have a great park there um commissioner to guard you had another question let's see if I understand something correctly we've tied together the grant street project with the park project because they're through the same contractor did I hear that right that was our goal we've not tied anything together yet they just but that is that is affecting all of our timeline work as we are right now is that correct correct okay trying to move forward with on-site contractor so if that's the case and we haven't approved the grant street project yet you can't really move forward on anything without that approval in june or july is that correct that was one of the items I said they've kind of delayed some of the work on grant street because we've been trying to do a two-way on grant street but we're we're still figuring out what to do on-site on the park right right and we can move forward with that regardless of what happens with grand street yeah okay my point yeah um it appears to me is our ambitions to do a couple things have led us into a time trap and that is connecting these two projects I'm not sure when we see projects coming forward we see something being connected we don't we see just that project and so if that's the case that's that's the problems we have because then when we make another decision in the future we might be affecting more than one project thank you mayor I think you did talk about the sidewalk or the two-way street when you brought it to us I'm sorry but I get what you're saying and I I think they are kind of tied because of the need for the extra parking place right which wouldn't be needed if we didn't go to two-way that's correct and and may I mayor also right it it the chain the uh grant street would be a change order to the existing contract that would come to the city commission and the reason why we wanted to use the existing contractor is that because we would save money because they're already mobilized they're already on site they're already so if we were to do the grant street project as a separate project later on which we could or not at all um then then as just you know graduate a separate project later on would be more expensive so if you were to say no then we'll just go according to the original plan uh for the park and move forward and we're done so um okay well um if anybody else has something um I'll obviously give you a chance to just two more questions um one is in that regard are we happy with the current contractor are they on top of it they're they're gaining speed right so I don't you know there you go okay so you guys can deal with that but that was my question because sense of urgency um is always important especially in these situations um and then so what is the expected end date with all this going on like worst case scenario I was kind of hoping it'd be before my two-year anniversary of my first term as mayor so what day is your two-year anniversary I'm not going to tell you so I'll let you so what is our expected timeline honestly Bob's gonna shoot me you're gonna shoot me now or later oh my restroom probably be late November early December on site but we're looking at the park completed independent of that sooner yeah right so the prop yeah so the whole item is the park electrical is fed through the restroom eventually we'll have a temporary power source possibly but really the whole site needs to be finished before we let people start moving around in there because we're going to have an open foundation waiting for a restroom to sit down on the slab I mean we have to come back and do my I guess so we're gotcha my biggest issue of course is I mean you know wines of blues what else is coming up I you know well Christmas I that's a you know I didn't even think we'd be talking about that but clearly for you know for old-fashioned Christmas and um yeah city manager I think there's some yeah yeah I'm not going to say what this project is making me think of but go ahead so um as part of a separate report which we I think I think it's important that we do that actually on the dais in the public and not be a separate cover to all of you an email um we uh we're going to put together that timeline um and we will circle back with the contractor most certainly uh Martin is being very diplomatic I am not happy with them so um this is going too slow uh they are you know they we check references they've done work for us before did a great job so um but but uh I want to circle back with them and put together the full picture for all of you as well is is the revised schedule and the completion date and report back to you on the dais say we're done you guys pack up we're going to get somebody else so um I mean obviously we're we're under contract we can't we can't dictate means and methods um they are so far behind schedule I mean we'd have to enter any liquidated damages first and that type of a thing so I would what's the penalty for being dragging out it's a certain uh number a certain uh cost per day per day and I don't think we're even close to that yet with this project so any other questions yeah I know good well I'll give a chance for comments all right obviously we don't you know we've been talking about this a long time but in that that picture that specific picture are we talking about those sheets of metal that we can see protruding is that's what's cut is that the is that what we're talking about underneath that the way they built it they built block walls on it they poured a four inch four inch slab on the dirt built block walls and they spanned that air duct with that metal pan and then they poured four inches on top of that so that four inches it was the floor of the city hall so when they cut that side open you have that that that void underneath there is that old air duct below the pan so the flooring we're seeing now you're telling me there's four inches underneath that as well there's a four inch slab on the ground below looks like concrete metal and concrete am I am I right yeah yeah you know in the interest of time um we we got to keep moving and you you know what you got to do here so um um but anybody have just I know everybody wants to make kind of a last comment on this um so I'll just vice mayor just make quickly though uh thank you mayor um you know I just lots of red flags obviously um my my experience you know with this type of thing you know there's really and I mean the red flags are to the point where you know the way we would handle the navy is stop work hold a formal critique assign root cause identify the corrective action and in this particular case throwing money against it is not the right answer because I don't think we are responsible for a lot of these costs so those are my comments Mr. Samberg so ironic this week this week someone said to me I finally see contractors working on the park and that's really funny that goes along with that so kind of go along what city manager said those exact words that I had no idea what they were talking about until today so uh Commissioner Gao uh just I'm I'm disappointed um Commissioner Dugard thank you mayor um it appears as though we had all good intents to try to combine several projects and try to save some money in doing so uh but this now has three pieces to it the street the foundation and this and the slab in the restroom actually there's four and because of these changes and discoveries we are uh teetering on going over our costs I'm very very pleased that we're doing our best to stay under our budget thank you yeah I mean um I had gotten some heads up on you know the the you know lack of urgency um from the contractor from some of the businesses across the street and some of you can probably guess one of them um and so um so this isn't a surprise obviously to me there'd be no way I'd go into business with the same company if we you know they're not even doing this well so I'll just say that straight out but um anyway you you know what you need to do I'm not going to reiterate what I've said but um let's um let's come back to us with a a better report how's that and a a timeline that we can live with that it is going to you know not literally have this mess in the middle of our events okay right at least something okay all right um I still remember what we told the public when we first started this and somehow it hasn't really it's turned out to be what they said versus we said so um okay um go ahead you have some more I'll just go quickly I know this is taking a little time here the downtown parking garage we're going to go out with RFP here we had those three shortlisted qualified firms that you all uh approved so uh Martin is actually working on that we expect to get that RFP out probably in the next couple weeks that's happening the uh private parking garage Bill Mazas is looking to get that started here in the next several weeks you're going to see that happen also and uh we are in the process of looking to update our our master plan this was done way back in 2012 2013 it is time to update it this will be part of uh next fiscal year so you'll see this in the approval process uh we are looking to utilize forward pinellas uh they've been very um accommodating to work with us it'll save us quite a bit of money all we have to do is the economic development portion of the downtown so our contribution will be quite a bit less than what the actual plan would cost so we're kind of excited about that and uh coming up at the next CRA meeting you're going to see uh some updated bylaws for the CRA that Jen Cowan has prepared and then we're also looking to uh the Bushnell lot 715 Edgewater Park right there uh we're looking to go ahead and renew that with uh Ms. Bush Bushnell who's been very very nice to work with us to just have it paid for as far as the property tax aspect so be happy to answer your questions you might have that weren't covered okay questions for Bob starting over here Commissioner Gow no questions Commissioner Degard Vice Mayor no questions Mayor Commissioner Sandbergen no I'm good um just want to make sure I have an understanding at some point about and I don't know this is you Bob but the overall condition of all the sidewalks that are downtown and how they're being inspected I think we talked about that and I'm not sure I got a full answer to what that is I just want to make sure because you know I continue to see some spots that probably you know we can't wait until streetscapes happen but you know that Bob I mean I know that's not that's not you um okay um so I think that's it unless anybody else has something good for the order okay our next meeting is at six o'clock our regular meeting and uh thank you gentlemen appreciate it I know this wasn't the greatest meeting in that sense but I know you'll get it fixed thank you you